Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Obama's "Universal" Health Care Plan  
User currently offlineAa757first From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3347 posts, RR: 8
Posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2479 times:

First off, I did do some searches on this - sorry if its already been discussed.

After being caught unprepared at an SEIU debate on health care in March, Obama has given more details about his health care plan.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/05/....ap/index.html?eref=rss_topstories

Quote:
Democratic presidential hopeful Barack Obama on Tuesday offered a plan to provide health care to millions of Americans and more affordable medical insurance, financed in part by tax increases on the wealthy.

Obama didn't mention that his plan would cost the federal treasury an estimated $50 billion to $65 billion a year once fully implemented. That information was provided in a memo written by three outside experts and distributed by the campaign after his speech.

Obama aides said they believe that everyone would buy health insurance if it were affordable enough, achieving universal care.

What does everyone think?

70 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineQueso From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2472 times:

Quoting Aa757first (Thread starter):
What does everyone think?

Uhhh.......can you say "gimmick"?


User currently offlineNWA742 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2469 times:

"If you think health care is expensive now, wait until it's free"




-NWA742


User currently offlineMDorBust From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2465 times:

Quoting Aa757first (Thread starter):
What does everyone think?



Quoting Obama TMN (Thread starter):
financed in part by tax increases on the wealthy.

Combined with Hillary's economic equality statements earlier I'm wondering why they don't just go ahead and dump the donkey and replace it with the hammer and sickle.


User currently offlineCharlienorth From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 1119 posts, RR: 5
Reply 4, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2449 times:

How soon before we give them our pay checks and get an allowance in return??

User currently offline767Lover From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2449 times:

The rest of the $65 billion funding could come by raising taxes on inheritances worth more than $7 million. Many Democrats want to repeal Bush's elimination of taxes on estates worth more than $1 million.

God, this is one thing that really burns me up: these "inheritance taxes." Unless the inheritance comes from the deceased's IRA, tax has already been paid on those dollars. There is no reason for such a tax and it is nothing more than government money grubbing.

Quoting Aa757first (Thread starter):
Obama aides said they believe that everyone would buy health insurance if it were affordable enough, achieving universal care.

I don't believe they're going to get as many people continuing private coverage as they think they will. If someone thinks it is their right to get something for free, they'll go for it. You're not going to have too many people saying, "Nah, I'll pay my own way." (I probably would continue private coverage, but that's because I don't want the government meddling in my personal business.) Therefore they probably should increase the expected federal appropriation.


User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20394 posts, RR: 62
Reply 6, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2428 times:

Quoting 767Lover (Reply 5):
Unless the inheritance comes from the deceased's IRA, tax has already been paid on those dollars.

Not in all cases. There's the one-time exemption for the sale of a primary residence ($500,000 per couple), where a lot of wealth has been coming amongst retirees lately. Even those who used the old "over 55" exemption can use it for further tax avoidance. There's a lot of wealth going generation-to-generation that has definitely not been taxed.



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineGuitrThree From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 2042 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2421 times:

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 6):
There's a lot of wealth going generation-to-generation that has definitely not been taxed.

Oh, I bet it has....

what you meant to say was, "there's a lot of wealth going generation-to-generation that has definitely not been taxed AGAIN.



As Seen On FlightRadar24! Radar ==> F-KBNA5
User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20394 posts, RR: 62
Reply 8, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2418 times:

Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 7):
what you meant to say was, "there's a lot of wealth going generation-to-generation that has definitely not been taxed AGAIN.

I know exactly what I meant to say. Perhaps you should look up the definition of the word "capital gain" and the exemptions allowed the current generation of retirees on their primary residences.



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineHalls120 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2388 times:

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 3):
Combined with Hillary's economic equality statements earlier I'm wondering why they don't just go ahead and dump the donkey and replace it with the hammer and sickle.

I'm still waiting for someone to explain just what HRC meant when she said "We're going to have to take things away from you for the common good."

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 3):
How soon before we give them our pay checks and get an allowance in return??

 rotfl  Oh come on, now where's your sense of shared responsibility with your fellow citizen? Why aren't you happily getting ready to hand over more and more of your pay check to the government?


User currently offlineCba From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4531 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2371 times:

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 3):

Combined with Hillary's economic equality statements earlier I'm wondering why they don't just go ahead and dump the donkey and replace it with the hammer and sickle.



Quoting Charlienorth (Reply 4):
How soon before we give them our pay checks and get an allowance in return??

Oh please, this is alarmism! A candidate poses any plan with a slight deviation from unfettered laissez-faire capitalism and the usuals drop the c word! Look at the UK, they have national health care and last time I checked when walking around London, it wasn't a communist country.

The billions of dollars required to fund will obviously have to come from somewhere, but if we are to fund important programs then difficult choices must be made.

Let's also not forget that every uninsured person in the US will get there health care, so we wind up paying for it anyway. Public hospitals are a prime example. A lot of uninsured come to the county ER for basic services that could be provided much more efficiently at the doctor's office or a clinic. However when these people come to the hospital, someone has to foot the bill and it's our tax money. The way I look at it, we're already paying for it.


User currently offlineAa757first From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3347 posts, RR: 8
Reply 11, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 2361 times:

Quoting Cba (Reply 10):
Let's also not forget that every uninsured person in the US will get there health care, so we wind up paying for it anyway.



Quoting Aa757first (Thread starter):
Obama aides said they believe that everyone would buy health insurance if it were affordable enough, achieving universal care.

I wonder if they're kidding when they say that. Walk into a major company with great health benefits. I guarantee you there is at least one employee that doesn't have insurance when they can easily afford to do so.

Quoting Cba (Reply 10):
A lot of uninsured come to the county ER for basic services that could be provided much more efficiently at the doctor's office or a clinic. However when these people come to the hospital, someone has to foot the bill and it's our tax money. The way I look at it, we're already paying for it.

I agree, but remember , as care becomes more convenient, people make more use of it. I agree, however, we should make things like routine physicals, Pap smears, mammograms, etc. more easily accessible. I would not want to see a system that has the public paying for visits to the doctor when someone has a cold.


User currently offlineMdsh00 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4124 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 2349 times:

Quoting Cba (Reply 10):
Let's also not forget that every uninsured person in the US will get there health care, so we wind up paying for it anyway.

This is key and a lot of people don't understand that.

Quoting Aa757first (Reply 11):
I wonder if they're kidding when they say that. Walk into a major company with great health benefits. I guarantee you there is at least one employee that doesn't have insurance when they can easily afford to do so.

Not every company has great benefits, or even any semblance of proper benefits (Walmart anyone?)

I don't understand why the right is getting so worked up over HRC and Obama. This is the usual thing on both sides before the primaries; go a little bit to the extreme of each side until the primary, and then move towards the center. Politics, that's all it is. The US will never have universal health care unless all the companies are forced to provide it. In medical school we learned about some health care systems and every system has its ups and downs. I for one would hate to lose the speed and efficiency of medical care in the US if it all went universal (like Canada or the UK). I actually think Germany has a decent system.



"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
User currently offlineMDorBust From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2327 times:

Quoting Cba (Reply 10):
Oh please, this is alarmism! A candidate poses any plan with a slight deviation from unfettered laissez-faire capitalism and the usuals drop the c word! Look at the UK, they have national health care and last time I checked when walking around London, it wasn't a communist country.

There's a difference between socialized health care provided by equally distributing the burden and socialized health care which is provided by punishing the producers.


User currently offlineScorpio From Belgium, joined Oct 2001, 5018 posts, RR: 44
Reply 14, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2303 times:

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 2):
"If you think health care is expensive now, wait until it's free"

Ah yes, that explains perfectly why health care in the US is far more expensive than it is in those countries where it IS what you would call 'free', i.e. universal.

Empty slogans. You have to love them.


User currently offline767Lover From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2284 times:

Quoting Aa757first (Reply 11):
I would not want to see a system that has the public paying for visits to the doctor when someone has a cold.

Therein lies the problem.

We need a system that allows for the coverage of illnesses and injuries where healing won't occur naturally and the person must be treated to get well -- or where there is an illness suspected (i.e, a mole or breast cyst) and testing is required.

For example -- and I'm talking about those of us who have jobs -- we should accept that there are certain "costs of life" that we have to bear. This includes paying for running water, electricity, and the $90 visit to the dermatologist to get the Rx to treat the contact dermatitis on our hands.

I incurred a sunburn in Mexico. Really bad one to the point where I couldn't walk. I wanted to get something stronger than aloe. So I went to the doctor. I paid $60US and he gave me a receipt for my insurance. I have no intention of turning it in to my insurance company because if I can afford a Mexican vacation, I can certainly afford a $60 doctor visit. If I turn the $60 claim into my insurance, that incurs an untold cost from someone having to process it, etc etc etc. and that will just add to the cost of the system and its little things like that that increase the cost of insurance.

How do we provide "universal coverage" without making the costs/claims spiral out of control?

[Edited 2007-05-30 14:02:47]

User currently offlineScorpio From Belgium, joined Oct 2001, 5018 posts, RR: 44
Reply 16, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2265 times:

Quoting Aa757first (Reply 11):
but remember , as care becomes more convenient, people make more use of it.

Allow me to rephrase that:

"as care becomes more convenient, people make use of it sooner"

Sooner, as in, at a time when whatever it is they have is in an early stage, and often easier, and cheaper to cure. In order to prevent people from going to a doctor for every little cough, however, you can still charge them a small part of the total cost directly, the way it's done over here in Belgium and, if I'm not mistaken, similar to what you already have in the U.S. now, for those who are insured. The term for that over here is 'remgeld', literally translated 'brake money', and its sole purpose is to stop people from going to the doctor every time they cough.

Quoting Cba (Reply 10):
Oh please, this is alarmism! A candidate poses any plan with a slight deviation from unfettered laissez-faire capitalism and the usuals drop the c word!

 checkmark  Well said! I must say that it is kind of funny, in a sad way, to see these people go completely into overdrive anytime anyone even mentions universal healthcare or anything of the like. It seems that the 'remedy' to this for some on the right is "Just call it communism, and it'll go away!" Most of this from people who wouldn't recognise a communist if one stood before them and smacked them up the head...


User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8699 posts, RR: 43
Reply 17, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2254 times:

Isn't it funny how easily you can adapt George Carlin's rant on NIMBYs to this issue?

"People don't want anything, any kind of social help, located anywhere near 'em. You try to open up a halfway house, try to open up a drug-rehab or an alcohol-rehab centre, try to do a homeless shelter somewhere, try to open up a little home for some retarded people who want to work their way into the community, people say 'NOT IN MY BACKYARD!' People don't want anything near 'em especially if it might help somebody else! Part of that great American spirit of generosity we hear about! (...) People don't want anything near 'em... except military bases... "

turns into

People don't want anything, any kind of social help, to cost 'em so much as a nickel. You try to set up a national re-integration scheme for drug offenders, try to finance extra language classes for Latino kids, try to introduce healthcare for those who really can't afford anything, try to increase welfare to the truly underprivileged, people say 'NOT ON MY PAYCHEQUE!' People don't want anything to cost 'em, especially if it might help somebody else! Part of that great American spirit of generosity we hear about! (...) People don't want anything to cost 'em... except the military budget...

So we have not only NIMBYs, but also NOMPies.  flamed  away...  sarcastic 



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17365 posts, RR: 46
Reply 18, posted (7 years 2 months 5 days ago) and read 2226 times:

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 2):
"If you think health care is expensive now, wait until it's free"

Amen....BUT I still don't understand how we can pay more for healthcare (per capita) than just about any socialized country on this planet. Somethin' ain't right.

Quoting Aa757first (Thread starter):
What does everyone think?

Reminds me a lot of Ségolène Royal's promises....sounds great but...uh...how you gon' pay for all that?



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineMdsh00 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4124 posts, RR: 8
Reply 19, posted (7 years 2 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2203 times:

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 18):
Amen....BUT I still don't understand how we can pay more for healthcare (per capita) than just about any socialized country on this planet. Somethin' ain't right.

Simple; we pay more for drugs, we prescribe more drugs, many times do unnecessary procedures out of fear of being sued, Medicare and Medicaid fraud, and yes paying for the uninsured.

Back in the debates during 2004 elections when someone raised a question to the President about buying prescription drugs from Canada. W fed them some  redflag  about them "not being the same" or "we can't control the quality of the drugs."  redflag  redflag  Why should the exact same drug be cheaper for them and not for us? It's because of collective bargaining by their government, while our politicians here are pimped by the drug companies. Why is it that the US is one of the few, mabye the only country in the world where prescription drugs are advertised on TV?



"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8699 posts, RR: 43
Reply 20, posted (7 years 2 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2193 times:

Quoting Mdsh00 (Reply 19):
prescription drugs are advertised on TV?

WHAT?!?  Wow! Are there any limitations on that sort of advertisement?



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20394 posts, RR: 62
Reply 21, posted (7 years 2 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2185 times:

Quoting Aloges (Reply 20):
Are there any limitations on that sort of advertisement?

No. A major complaint from doctors around the era when they began was that patients would come into the exam room with a self-diagnosis, then demand the latest drug they saw advertised. It's the "Retin-A Effect"--once that became known to prevent wrinkles, those who it was intended for, patients with rosacea, went under a far greater scrutiny as a result, since every other sundry baby boomer concerned about wrinkles wanted their health plan to cover the cost at $75/tube. (The smart ones simply bought a few OTC in Mexico for $5 and avoided the hassle.)

Prescription drugs have, for the past dozen years or so, been the cause of most of the increase in health care cost/premiums. Several years ago I read a report that said around 20-25% of Portlanders were on some type of anti-depressant at $300/month, covered by their insurance.

It's a huge cost, and a huge problem that we need to corral somehow.

Quoting Aa757first (Reply 11):
I would not want to see a system that has the public paying for visits to the doctor when someone has a cold.

That can easily be controlled with a schedule of covered services. Oregon does Medicaid differently than other states. Instead of covering everything for every covered individual, the state draws up a list of what it will cover, and if your ailment isn't on the list, you're out of luck.



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineMdsh00 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4124 posts, RR: 8
Reply 22, posted (7 years 2 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2163 times:

Quoting Aloges (Reply 20):
WHAT?!? Are there any limitations on that sort of advertisement?

Few, other than having to rattle off the side effects. Like AeroWesty said, the companies promote it as a way to "educate" patients, but in reality all it does is make them think so, and then they go in an demand their doctor that they only get that drug. For example, everyone here knows of the Nexium ads (NEW and IMPROVED, when it is just esomeprazole vs. omeprazole). For mild cases of heartburn, the cheaper omeprazole is just fine, but these ads make patients feel like they MUST have the "new and improved," and obviously much more expensive drug. Since this process started in the early 90s, patients today feel like they know better than their doctor.

Along with that, the drug companies routinely send out young and attractive representatives to come and give free samples, pamphlets, and "gifts." Not explicitly influencing doctors but you get the point. This last part is on the decline as a lot of hospital ethics codes, etc. discourage and sometimes ban it.

Drug companies defend their high priced drugs as making up for high costs of development, but it still doesn't explain the sometimes ridiculous prices of some medications in the US.

Controlling the drug companies would go a long way in bringing down the cost of health care. But as long as lawmakers are in the pocket of the pharmaceutical lobby, it isn't going to happen.



"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
User currently offlineCba From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 4531 posts, RR: 3
Reply 23, posted (7 years 2 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2160 times:

The current prescription drug system makes no sense. In just about every other modern country, the government handles purchasing the drugs and thus can buy them in bulk and negotiate better prices. This can even be done without introducing universal health care.

In a case like this, efficiency can be gained by allowing the government to intervene.


User currently offlineYOWza From Canada, joined Jul 2005, 4865 posts, RR: 15
Reply 24, posted (7 years 2 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 2156 times:

Quoting Aa757first (Thread starter):
$50 billion to $65 billion

What a stupid way to spend 65 Billion dollars. Here's a much more effective use of taxpayer money.

YOWza



12A whenever possible.
25 Post contains images DrDeke : You know what burns me up a great deal more than that? I'll tell you: The fact that income from capital gains are taxed at a much LOWER rate in this
26 Post contains links 767Lover : The reason capital gains are taxed at a lower rate than income is 1) it rewards people for taking the risk of investing in property and companies, an
27 Post contains images Aloges : What risk? If a millionnaire puts his, say, $20 mill in various forms of financial investment as every "risk manager" will advise him, there is hardl
28 767Lover : Well, the definition applies to more than banks/funds. If I and a couple of other people buy houses in a struggling part of the city, we are taking a
29 Halls120 : Presumably. But if she just meant government needed to raise taxes in order to provide for needed services, why didn't she just say that? Why the arr
30 Post contains images DrDeke : Probably because she's an idiot who actually does think she knows better what's good for us! Or at least she thinks that certain voters will like the
31 Aloges : Then again, doing that you wouldn't be spreading your risk on various forms of investment but betting on one card. Some people like to gamble with th
32 Halls120 : Since I am fairly liberal on some issues, and equally conservative on others, I'm not surprised that others might be just as immune to the typical st
33 767Lover : Fair enough. I misunderstood you. I read a stunning figure a while back about the sheer billions of $ the US lost in tax revenue in the 1990s due to
34 Aa757first : I agree. That's why I said walk into a company with good benefits. My point is that no matter how cheap health care is, there will always be at least
35 Yellowstone : Solution for that - do what they did in Massachusetts. Make it a legal requirement for everyone to have health insurance. Then let people choose betw
36 Halls120 : Question. Where is it written in the Constitution that government ought to have the power to mandate health insurance be purchased by an individual c
37 DrDeke : Hmm. From reading his website, he does also sound more-or-less ok. I bet he would suffer from the same problem as Obama, though, if he ever actually
38 Scorpio : Strongly disagree. It's more a case of "chances are you're going to make use of the services at some point anyway (even if just in case of an emergen
39 GuitrThree : Oh, you're right. I don't know what a "capital gain" is. Perhaps you can tell me how one buys a house in 1970 for $50,000 and in 2007 it's sold by th
40 Post contains links AeroWesty : Uhhhh, because that's what the federal government calls it? http://www.irs.gov/faqs/faq-kw140.html Is this a trick question?
41 GuitrThree : Of course it is... You said: based on: And you seem to have a problem with people selling their primary residence for a "profit" and not paying taxes
42 AeroWesty : It's a capital gain because, 1) the interest they paid was tax-deductible, and 2) there is no provision in the tax code for you to live for free, whi
43 GuitrThree : True. But it ONLY deducts from the income they made during that calendar year. Just because they paid $100K in interest over the life of the loan, do
44 AeroWesty : Man, if I ever go on ranting like this, please, someone, shoot me.
45 Halls120 : I'm not saying users should get a free ride. If you decide to seek health care, you should pay for it. If you choose not to buy insurance, you will h
46 767Lover : You are already paying your share of the cost of public hospitals through taxes.
47 GuitrThree : Yep.. typical. If you can't back up your reasoning, only thing left to do is to resort to insults. I'll stay above the gutter, thank you, and stand b
48 AeroWesty : I didn't offer any insults, I was talking solely about myself. I know how to calculate a cost basis, I know what a capital gain is, and I know that o
49 GuitrThree : Really? Seems to me that mandatory purchase of car insurance works pretty darn well in the states that have it. Far from perfect, but my cost of unin
50 Halls120 : Wow. it's amazing how people can't seem to read. I support mandatory auto insurance. If you choose to buy and operate a motor vehicle, it is a reason
51 767Lover : Only because your premiums go up when you file a claim. Besides, most people aren't bothered by a few minor scratches and dings, unless it's a high-e
52 Scorpio : What if you can't? Are you going to refuse to treat people in an emergency because they can't pay the bill? Are you going to check people's bank acco
53 Halls120 : Of course not. If you choose not to purchase health insurance, and end up in the emergency room, then you will be required to pay the whole bill. And
54 Scorpio : So if I get this straight, the problem is not you being against universal health care, but rather an inherent mistrust of your own elected politician
55 767Lover : Mmmm, not really. We would either be paying "out the nose" in the form of healthcare costs or in taxes, depending on which scheme were applied. Healt
56 Scorpio : Yes, but we're paying FAR less per capita than you are.
57 GuitrThree : Which is exactly the same system we have now... you claim bankruptcy, everyone else pays higher fees to cover what the Hospital loses on you not payi
58 MCOflyer : Too much money. Hunter
59 Cba : Hospitals by law must give health care to critical patients regardless of their ability to pay. Public hospitals must also treat any patient that com
60 Post contains images Halls120 : I am against the forms of universal health care that have been put forth up to this point by American politicians. I see you haven't bothered to read
61 Aa757first : Illegal. EMTLA requires hospitals to treat patients regardless of their ability to pay in emergent situations. I think you'll agree what works in one
62 Post contains links Scorpio : And just how many times has she been called a 'communist', 'socialist' etc.? Exactly. Hell, people are already trying to lynch her in another thread
63 Post contains links Lijnden : Very populist talk here from Obama and he knows it. Wasn't it also a pledge for Bill Clinton to do this in the early 90's? I don't think the US can af
64 Jaysit : Well put.
65 Halls120 : What does that have to do with this discussion? Actually, I believe she will be elected President if she wins the democratic nomination. Which is not
66 GuitrThree : No.. I'm saying the deadbeats who declare bankruptcy add to our costs as consumers. If everyone who could afford some insurance would HAVE to pay for
67 Scorpio : Sorry, I thought your previous post simply mentioned Hillary's proposal as an example of someone proposing a radical change, and not it not being the
68 Cfalk : This is a falacy, and proves to anyone who had any doubts that Obama is a twit. Most of the uninsured in the US are uninsured because they don't want
69 Aa757first : From what I can tell, the US and Belgium have basically the same system, except you have to purchase care in Belgium. Do they have anything like mana
70 Scorpio : Not at all, the main difference is that in Belgium, the sector is far more regulated as far as pricing is concerned. Prices for visits to the doctor
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Not-so-universal Health Care In Canada? posted Sat Jun 11 2005 00:38:17 by SQuared
Say No To Universal Health Care posted Mon Dec 1 2003 18:01:52 by Matt D
Dangers Of Government Health Care posted Wed Mar 28 2007 13:42:10 by Cfalk
Your Health Care Costs? posted Wed Mar 21 2007 23:27:13 by AA787823
Baby Boomers.. Most "F"-ed Up Generation? posted Wed Feb 28 2007 07:56:45 by Boeing7E7
Explain The Logic: W's Health Insurance Plan posted Tue Jan 23 2007 14:55:05 by Pope
Businesses May Move Health Care Overseas posted Fri Nov 3 2006 07:27:39 by NWDC10
Balance Between Private And Public Health Care? posted Sun May 21 2006 05:16:56 by AerospaceFan
Will Canada Phase Out Public Health Care? posted Tue Jan 24 2006 20:47:32 by AerospaceFan
Is Health Care A Civil Right? posted Thu Apr 28 2005 20:52:04 by ConcordeBoy