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What Do You Call The "Third World"?  
User currently offlinePacNWjet From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 919 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Recently in another forum I was scolded for using the term "Third World" (in quotation marks). Leaving aside the fact that there is no shortage of scholarly journals that have the term "Third World" in their title (e.g., Third World Affairs, Third World Law Journals, Third World Legal Studies, Third World Quarterly, Third World Resurgence) it is a fact that scholars (e.g., economists, political scientists, historians, sociologists, etc.) who study the unequal distribution of economic resources around the world have struggled to come up with terms to categorize regions of the world on the basis of their relative economic resources. Among the terms that have been used among scholars are "First World" & "Third World," "Core" & "Periphery," "Developed World" & "Developing" or "Less Developed World," and "North" & "South." None of these are perfect, and all are potentially misleading, inaccurate, oversimplified, or offensive, as the scolding I received on the other forum would seem to indicate (despite the fact that I did not intend to give any offense).

What terminology do you find the most useful when describing the global unequal distribution of economic resources and why do you find this terminology useful? The unequal distribution of resources is a fact, as lamentable as it is, so what words do you use to describe this fact and why?

[Edited 2007-10-04 09:35:27]

[Edited 2007-10-04 09:36:44]

62 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePlymSpotter From Spain, joined Jun 2004, 11572 posts, RR: 61
Reply 1, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting PacNWjet (Thread starter):
What Do You Call The "Third World"?

Scotland

 duck 



...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
User currently offlineSBBRTech From Brazil, joined Jul 2007, 722 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting PacNWjet (Thread starter):
What terminology do you find the most useful when describing the global unequal distribution of economic resources?

Any of those:

Brasil, Brazil, República Federativa do Brasil....



"I'm beginning to get the hang of this flying business" - C3PO
User currently offlineAirfoilsguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Less developed countries

User currently offlineCarmenlu15 From Guatemala, joined Dec 2004, 4748 posts, RR: 32
Reply 4, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting PacNWjet (Thread starter):
What Do You Call The "Third World"?

Home sweet home  Wow!

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 1):
Scotland

You got it wrong, that is the Fourth World...



Being a pioneer in any field is not by itself a guarantee of continued success - Pan Am, anyone?
User currently offlineME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 25
Reply 5, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting PacNWjet (Thread starter):
What terminology

-
the term is a result of pre1990 realities, when "the West" was the First World, the Eastern Block was the Second World and most of Africa and much of Asia and Latin America was the Third World. In fact, Yugoslavia was a member of some "Third World Organisation" and Tito, along with President Nasr, Premier Nehru one of the leaders.


User currently offlineBananaBoY From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2004, 1570 posts, RR: 23
Reply 6, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

I was always taught that "Developing Country" had replaced the term "Third World."


Mark



All my life, I've been kissing, your top lip 'cause your bottom one's missing
User currently offlineAsstChiefMark From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Countries that can't provide enough resources for its people.

http://www.damnthatsamazing.com/images/train1.jpg

http://dusteye.files.wordpress.com/2006/12/delhi_slum.jpg


User currently offlineAirTranTUS From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting BananaBoY (Reply 6):
I was always taught that "Developing Country" had replaced the term "Third World."

What if the country is not taking steps to becoming more developed?

I would say a Third World country is one with low economic development, based on a scale with the rest of the world, not any one nation.


User currently offlineType-Rated From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 4845 posts, RR: 19
Reply 9, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

In no particular order....

Most of Central America including Mexico, Nigera (Africa for that matter), some South American Countries, Viet Nam.

Usually places where the people can't make a decent living and has to deal with a corrupt government.



Fly North Central Airlines..The route of the Northliners!
User currently offlineAsstChiefMark From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting BananaBoY (Reply 6):
I was always taught that "Developing Country" had replaced the term "Third World."

I refer to a developing country as a "Second World" country.


User currently offlineRIHNOSAUR From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 362 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

hi,

honestly, IMO, you should have not gotten flamed for using third world. In principle I believe it is just a term for reference and is not intended to make fun of or degrade the country it is being applied to. However I am not taking into account the context under which you used it.

On the other hand I do understand why some people take offense with this particular terminology....you have to admit that it does "sound" not very uplifting from the perspective of those living in these nations
I guess i do think personally that third world is beginning to be sort of an "outdated" term, thus, I think a more appropriate term is just (as you pointed out) "developing country".

If you use developing country, you are being "more" clear as to what you mean and to me it is more of a relative term rather than an absolute one, that says "compared to other countries...X is "still" "developing" without the need to explicitly say at what stage it is along its developments...

I'm no expert ....but hope this helps.



particles and waves are the same thing, but who knows what that thing is...
User currently offlineLHRjc From Netherlands, joined Apr 2006, 1964 posts, RR: 20
Reply 12, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting Type-Rated (Reply 9):
Usually places where the people can't make a decent living and has to deal with a corrupt government.

That's called Britain where I come from.



"Our 319's are very reliable. They get fixed very quickly."
User currently offlineAndesSMF From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

FYI:

The term "Second World" is a phrase that was used to describe the Communist states within the Soviet Union's sphere of influence. Along with "First World" and "Third World", the term has been used to divide the nations of Earth into three broad categories. The term has largely fallen out of use since the end of the Cold War. The other two 'worlds' are still widely talked about, although "First World" is now deprecated for the more politically correct "developed country" and "Third World" has been replaced with "developing country".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_world


User currently offlineRIHNOSAUR From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 362 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting LHRjc (Reply 12):
That's called Britain where I come from.

some how I got a slight impression that you were not joking (which I hope I am wrong). If you aren't, then you should travel some more....not to say that there are no difficulties in Britain, but in relative terms... hmmm



particles and waves are the same thing, but who knows what that thing is...
User currently offlineMyt332 From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 9112 posts, RR: 71
Reply 15, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting RIHNOSAUR (Reply 14):
some how I got a slight impression that you were not joking (which I hope I am wrong).

He wasn't joking. You should see the social deprivation where he lives; Yorkshire.



One Life, Live it.
User currently offlineKROC From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting PacNWjet (Thread starter):
What Do You Call The "Third World"?

Buffalo


User currently offlineLHRjc From Netherlands, joined Apr 2006, 1964 posts, RR: 20
Reply 17, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting Myt332 (Reply 15):
lives; Yorkshire.

Don't tell everyone... it's only a temporary solution until I get my passport back so I can escape back to London  biggrin 

Quoting RIHNOSAUR (Reply 14):
not to say that there are no difficulties in Britain

That's an understatement  biggrin 



"Our 319's are very reliable. They get fixed very quickly."
User currently onlineDerico From Argentina, joined Dec 1999, 4277 posts, RR: 12
Reply 18, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Depends the time, place and people's perception of a place.



the original terminology



map based on a survey of people's opinions after visiting particular country

http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/378/68792fqy5.gif

Composite map from studies such as IMF Annual Report, UN Human Development Report, and World Bank



My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
User currently offlineFr8mech From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 5098 posts, RR: 12
Reply 19, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Back when I was in school, during the scandalous, non-PC decades of the 70's & 80's, the First World was also the Old World: Europe. The Second World was the New World: basically the Western Hemisphere. The Third World was Africa. Of course, Asia and Australia don't fit easily into any of the categories.

I still think along those lines when those terms are tossed about.



When seconds count...the police are minutes away. Never leave your cave without your club.
User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting PacNWjet (Thread starter):
it is a fact that scholars (e.g., economists, political scientists, historians, sociologists, etc.) who study the unequal distribution of economic resources around the world have struggled to come up with terms to categorize regions of the world on the basis of their relative economic resources.



Quoting PacNWjet (Thread starter):
What terminology do you find the most useful when describing the global unequal distribution of economic resources

"Third World has absolutely NOTHING TO DO with "unequal resources". It has nothing to do with resources, period. Sure, you'll have some nutty professors who will try to link the two, but they have an economic agenda.

Look at Singapore - the only resource they have is swampland. But they are decidedly not "third world". Switzerland, Luxembourg, Netherlands, Japan, all do not have very much in terms of space or resources, but are very successful.

Look at Nigeria and half the other countries in Africa. They are third world in spite of sitting on mountains of oil, gems and other resources.

What makes a country third world is not what resources they have, but rather their ability to use those resources effictively. This requires the Rule of Law, a low tolerance for corruption, a culture of self-improvement and of enlightened self-interest, as Smith called it.


User currently offlineLAXspotter From India, joined Jan 2007, 3650 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting AsstChiefMark (Reply 7):

my former home, India lol



"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" Samuel Johnson
User currently offlinePacNWJet From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 919 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 20):
Third World has absolutely NOTHING TO DO with "unequal resources". It has nothing to do with resources, period. Sure, you'll have some nutty professors who will try to link the two, but they have an economic agenda.



Quoting Cfalk (Reply 20):
What makes a country third world is not what resources they have, but rather their ability to use those resources effictively. This requires the Rule of Law, a low tolerance for corruption, a culture of self-improvement and of enlightened self-interest, as Smith called it.

These points are relevant to the discussion of terminology. When people use any of the problematic terms available to describe the concept in question (First World-Third World; Core-Periphery; Developed-Developing-Less Developed World; North-South), part of the problem is that the gap between rich and poor does not overlap with the division of the world into territorial states (countries) since one can have within the same country and even within a few miles of each other pockets of wealth and poverty.

However, as Cfalk points out, when explanations for economic gaps are brought to bear, they confront the unpleasant and un-politically correct point at which terms that might be more descriptive such as "countries with corrupt governments" or "cultures that have not embraced market economies" start to sound just as much like a blunt instrument as "First World" or "Third World."

Hence the impetus for posting this thread (which has been quite illuminating - thanks to everyone for posting!). I am a professor, although hopefully not of the nutty variety Cfalk mentions, and charting this territory in academia, let alone in the other airliners.net forum in which I was flamed, tyipcally leads one into a minefield. I would just a soon not tread this ground, but often it cannot be avoided when the subject matter calls for it.


User currently offlinePacNWJet From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 919 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 20):
Third World has absolutely NOTHING TO DO with "unequal resources". It has nothing to do with resources, period. Sure, you'll have some nutty professors who will try to link the two, but they have an economic agenda.



Quoting Cfalk (Reply 20):
What makes a country third world is not what resources they have, but rather their ability to use those resources effictively. This requires the Rule of Law, a low tolerance for corruption, a culture of self-improvement and of enlightened self-interest, as Smith called it.

These points are relevant to the discussion of terminology. When people use any of the problematic terms available to describe the concept in question (First World-Third World; Core-Periphery; Developed-Developing-Less Developed World; North-South), part of the problem is that the gap between rich and poor does not overlap with the division of the world into territorial states (countries) since one can have within the same country and even within a few miles of each other pockets of wealth and poverty.

However, as Cfalk points out, when explanations for economic gaps are brought to bear, they confront the unpleasant and un-politically correct point at which terms that might be more descriptive such as "countries with corrupt governments" or "cultures that have not embraced market economies" start to sound just as much like a blunt instrument as "First World" or "Third World."

Hence the impetus for posting this thread (which has been quite illuminating - thanks to everyone for posting!). I am a professor, although hopefully not of the nutty variety Cfalk mentions, and charting this territory in academia, let alone in the other airliners.net forum in which I was flamed, tyipcally leads one into a minefield. I would just a soon not tread this ground, but often it cannot be avoided when the subject matter calls for it.


User currently offlinePacNWJet From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 919 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (6 years 6 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 2699 times:

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 20):
Third World has absolutely NOTHING TO DO with "unequal resources". It has nothing to do with resources, period. Sure, you'll have some nutty professors who will try to link the two, but they have an economic agenda.



Quoting Cfalk (Reply 20):
What makes a country third world is not what resources they have, but rather their ability to use those resources effictively. This requires the Rule of Law, a low tolerance for corruption, a culture of self-improvement and of enlightened self-interest, as Smith called it.

These points are relevant to the discussion of terminology. When people use any of the problematic terms available to describe the concept in question (First World-Third World; Core-Periphery; Developed-Developing-Less Developed World; North-South), part of the problem is that the gap between rich and poor does not overlap with the division of the world into territorial states (countries) since one can have within the same country and even within a few miles of each other pockets of wealth and poverty.

However, as Cfalk points out, when explanations for economic gaps are brought to bear, they confront the unpleasant and un-politically correct point at which terms that might be more descriptive such as "countries with corrupt governments" or "cultures that have not embraced market economies" start to sound just as much like a blunt instrument as "First World" or "Third World."

Hence the impetus for posting this thread (which has been quite illuminating - thanks to everyone for posting!). I am a professor, although hopefully not of the nutty variety Cfalk mentions, and charting this territory in academia, let alone in the other airliners.net forum in which I was flamed, tyipcally leads one into a minefield. I would just a soon not tread this ground, but often it cannot be avoided when the subject matter calls for it.


25 WestJetYQQ : Earth.
26 BritJap : I thought that first world meant those countries which were decidedly capitalist democracies. The second world was made up of those countries that esp
27 Redngold : It's hard to tell now because the world has become so fractured - not just by secession and civil war, but also by socioeconomic disparities within se
28 PacNWJet : Excellent point, and part of what I was getting at in posting this thread. Part of human cognition is to create categories and put labels on things.
29 Post contains images Mbj-11 : Any country that places third in the world race. . or .......any country whose resources have been bled by past colonial or imperial masters who then
30 Post contains images ME AVN FAN : you were taught wrongly. Many "Third World" countries cannot or no longer be regarded as "developing country". - No, a Third World country can be flo
31 AM744 : I think we can safely assume that the Second World (Socialist states) no longer exist. If you are not in the First World, you are in the Third World w
32 Post contains images Theredbaron : You can live in the third world even in Sweden if you want, then again you can live in the first world even in Haiti, it depends on a lot of things, l
33 LAXspotter : very true, quite true. Just go to the "Slums of DC" or "East LA/Downtown" and that place is shitty compared to many places Ive been to in "3rd world
34 AndesSMF : You DARE to compare East LA with a 3rd world country?! The sheer arrogance of that statement, not to say ignorance about what you are saying is incre
35 LAXspotter : I know what the third world is, but I wrote it wrong, I have lived in the third world, but I did not live a life of a "3rd world person" what I am tr
36 AndesSMF : Yes, indeed they do. At the same town, the fishermen don't work every day, and all have plenty of leisure time. Their food is always fresh, and taste
37 LAXspotter : yeah, that was my whole statement there. I dont mean to say that I would rather live in a 3rd world housing in a 3rd world country that in the Ghetto
38 Post contains links TACAA320 : " The term Third World was originally coined in times of the Cold War to distinguish those nations that are neither aligned with the West (NATO) nor w
39 ME AVN FAN : Cyprus was (is) part of the Third World and the long-time President Arch-Bishop Makarios III was one of the leaders of the Third World Slovenia was o
40 Comorin : I live in the Third World. My neighbors worship dog feces as it's all over the sidewalk. My shoes stick to the chewing gum on a warm day as spitting g
41 Post contains images SW733 : I use the term Third World...too often it is found offensive by people who have never been and have no interaction to it...people who just have a bug
42 Redngold : I get it!
43 Post contains images Alfa75 : South of the Mason-Dixon Line!
44 AirTranTUS : Sometimes South Tucson reminds me of the third world.[Edited 2007-10-08 18:49:23]
45 Post contains images AndesSMF : The insult you have just give 3rd world countries...you know, there are places where you could be shot for saying such terrible, terrible things!!
46 AirTranTUS : Or banned for 90 days. I edited that post about 4 minutes after I made it into its current form, but the time stamp says you posted more than 3 hours
47 Post contains images AndesSMF : Not exactly sure, but next time, don't insult the 3rd world like that, m'Kay?
48 Post contains images AirTranTUS : Sure thing.
49 ExFATboy : I remember seeing the term "Fourth World" to differentiate between less-developed countries that were on the path to economic development ("Third Worl
50 Iowaman : Sad thing is, in rural Iowa, there are still houses with out A/C, multiple TV's and VCRs. and even without microwaves in some cases.
51 KSYR : I was brought up calling it the "third world" but now I'm being taught to call it the "global south" instead.
52 ME AVN FAN : - I mean, such things are exercises in political correctness etc. The main point is that "Third World" has nothing to do with economic or political s
53 SW733 : And rural parts of every state...and some parts of major cities too, like Chicago, NYC, LA, Houston, Detroit...
54 PA110 : Countries such as Russia, China and Eastern Europe (all previously referred to as Second World) are now mostly referred to as "emerging economies" in
55 ME AVN FAN : Much of the Third World is now listed under the "treshold countries", countries with a positive economic development as such and up on European stand
56 AM744 : While that is true, Slovenia was one of the most developed regions of ex-Yugoslavia and its indicators as a smaller, more manageable country puts the
57 ME AVN FAN :
58 Cedars747 : THE VIRGIN WORLD Alex!!!
59 BananaBoY : How things change at school! I was told that the term "second world" was used to describe communist states, and during the time I was at school, had
60 ME AVN FAN : As the "Second World" has vanished, the terms have become obsolute alltogether in fact
61 Post contains images SW733 : ...I feel like a lot of people use the "second world" term to not offend some third world countries, mine included. I've heard the whole "Namibia isn
62 ME AVN FAN : NO, because it has nothing to do with the term THIRD WORLD. You might of course say that former Yugoslavia was neither in Africa nor in Asia and this
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