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Does "one China" Affect Taiwanese Ppl Negatively?  
User currently offlineZak From Greenland, joined Sep 2003, 1993 posts, RR: 8
Posted (6 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 1745 times:

i have a few questions to taiwanese users regarding the "capitalist china from the mainland with a communist veil" policy that there is one china, enforcing it across its business and other associates:

- do you feel discriminated against if companies/webpages openly embrace "one china" policy to avoid fuss with the mighty mainland?
- regardless if you feel discriminated, do you notice this pattern frequently? if so, where is it found commonly? where not so commonly?

[Edited 2007-10-28 13:44:41]


10=2
63 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDL021 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 11447 posts, RR: 75
Reply 1, posted (6 years 10 months 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1721 times:
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I don't know about the questions posed, since they're put to Taiwanese....

but the thread title seems to ask if the One China Policy impacts the Taiwanese negatively....

....I'd have to say that it certainly does....how would you feel if your democracy was replaced with a dictatorship?



Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
User currently offlineFoppishbum From Taiwan, joined Mar 2006, 826 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 1665 times:

I'm a first generation immigrant to USA and my family had been living in Taiwan for at least 5+ generations. One of my ancestors was battling the Dutch when Dutch came to Taiwan (that's how long my family had been in Taiwan). Anyway, regarding China...I feel a lot of times foreigners don't understand the history between China and Taiwan thoroughly thus causing people to misunderstand our conflict. The civil war between the two parties (KMT and CPC) was more than just a war. I can't get into too much details because 1. I, myself, don't completely know the whole details 2. people are gonna say I'm biased because I'm Taiwanese. Now, I don't hate China because my father had two factories in Mainland China and I lived in Cantong and Shanghai for a year. The thing is, how we do things in Taiwan are 60% different than how they do things in China; even the words, characters, vocabularies that we use are very different. To be honest, I think most would agree, Chinese from Mainland China is more aggressive than Taiwanese.

I don't think "one China" would work well in Taiwan though because there are just so much differences between us.




Peace,
Wes



I'm a Taiwanese-American living in NYC and LA.
User currently offlineBHXFAOTIPYYC From Portugal, joined Jun 2005, 1644 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 1659 times:

How about an extension of the Hong Kong / Macau style "one country - two systems" as guaranteed for the next 40 years (was 50, 10 down already!) ?

I can understand Taiwanese being indignant at that suggestion though, as ROC is an independent nation.



Breakfast in BHX, lunch in FAO, dinner in TIP, baggage in YYC.
User currently offlineFoppishbum From Taiwan, joined Mar 2006, 826 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 1655 times:

Quoting Zak (Thread starter):
- do you feel discriminated against if companies/webpages openly embrace "one china" policy to avoid fuss with the mighty mainland?
- regardless if you feel discriminated, do you notice this pattern frequently? if so, where is it found commonly? where not so commonly?

HAH...I just realised I didn't even answer your questions.  tongue  Sorry!

1. I feel somewhat discriminated. We have our government, constitution, President, national anthem, etc we should be seen as a country. Even Hong Kong is recognised as "Hong Kong" instead of "Hong Kong Region". I mean, even A.net put us as "Taiwan Region". I did try to contact the admins about this but they said currently they're not looking into this issue. We used to be "Taiwan" on A.net though. Another thing, it is very discriminative that when we win a gold metal in Olympic Games, we don't get to play our national anthem, we HAVE to play our "flag song". Shouldn't Olympic games be neutral and peaceful? So, although I don't feel particularly fond of this fact, I can understand why companies/webpages want to avoid fuss with Mainland China. I just blame us Taiwanese for not being strong enough...

2. Yes. I notice this pattern VERY frequently. On all the applications, we're Chinese. I guess we're technically Chinese but I mean Caucasians are separated into British and Americans, how come we don't get to be Taiwanese on application forms? There are Japanese, North Korean, South Korean on application forms. I think there should be Chinese and Taiwanese (or at least Mainland Chinese and "Island Chinese"...  tongue  ). The only place I don't see it frequently is in Taiwan.



Peace,
Wes



I'm a Taiwanese-American living in NYC and LA.
User currently offlineFoppishbum From Taiwan, joined Mar 2006, 826 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 1654 times:

Quoting BHXFAOTIPYYC (Reply 3):
How about an extension of the Hong Kong / Macau style "one country - two systems" as guaranteed for the next 40 years (was 50, 10 down already!) ?

This style is not going to work forever. If we agree to that, we're basically agreeing to eliminating our identity and Taiwanese culture within the next century slowly but surely. I doubt many would want their countries to be in that situation...



Peace,
Wes



I'm a Taiwanese-American living in NYC and LA.
User currently offlineOV735 From Estonia, joined Jan 2004, 913 posts, RR: 3
Reply 6, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 1644 times:

I cannot speak for the people in Republic of China, but in my opinion and experience generally when one country (communist or otherwise) occupies, or has a very strong suppressive influence, over another country, the majority of the population in the occupied/supressed will have strong negative feelings for their occupants, and rightly so.

User currently offlineToast From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 1617 times:

The "One China Policy" is nonsense. The PRC and the ROC are two very different countries. Taiwan is an independent nation by all measures except the fact that it's not recognized as such by the UN since the 1971 GA Resolution 2529; instead, it's officially called "Chinese Taipei" (another bureaucratic turd of a name, second only to FYROM  yuck  ). It's a shame really, and it's a shame to see "Taiwan Region" next to the Taiwanese flag here on A.net. It's been a fully independent nation for over 50 years now. Only the fact that the world plays along with the PRC's delusional claim to sovereignty permits this kind of bullshit to last so long.  yuck 

User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 14026 posts, RR: 62
Reply 8, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 1610 times:

Quoting Toast (Reply 7):
Only the fact that the world plays along with the PRC's delusional claim to sovereignty permits this kind of bullshit to last so long. yuck

Like a few weeks ago after the German chancellor Merkel received the Dalai Lama. The PRC imediately canceled several appointments and meetings, with the result that the chairman of the German industrial association critizised the chancellor for spoiling business opportunities with China.

Jan


User currently offlineSlider From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6816 posts, RR: 34
Reply 9, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1601 times:

Quoting Toast (Reply 7):
Only the fact that the world plays along with the PRC's delusional claim to sovereignty permits this kind of bullshit to last so long.

Exactly right!!


User currently offlineFoppishbum From Taiwan, joined Mar 2006, 826 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 1587 times:

Wow I thought I would offend some A.netter but apparently not. Big grin Thanks for all the support! I just wish one day before I die I can see Taiwanese flag flying in Olympic Games and our national anthem is played if we win another gold metal. Big grin

The "one China" policy has seriously taken its toll on Hong Kong. I know a couple of students from Hong Kong and they really despise this policy. I went to Hong Kong both before 1997 and after 1997 and I definitely feel the difference.

Quoting Toast (Reply 7):
It's a shame really, and it's a shame to see "Taiwan Region" next to the Taiwanese flag here on A.net.

 bigthumbsup   bigthumbsup   bigthumbsup 

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 8):
Like a few weeks ago after the German chancellor Merkel received the Dalai Lama. The PRC imediately canceled several appointments and meetings, with the result that the chairman of the German industrial association critizised the chancellor for spoiling business opportunities with China.

That's how typically PRC deals with people/country who don't do the things they want them to do. Just like the whole heavy metal incidents with toys imported to US from China. They immediately said it's not their fault.



Peace,
Wes



I'm a Taiwanese-American living in NYC and LA.
User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8544 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1574 times:

Taiwan has 1,000 times more credibility than China on this issue.

For one thing, Taiwan was first colonized by the Dutch, not the Chinese. China had never given a rip about Taiwan when the Dutch showed up and colonized. Only about 250 years later did Taiwan become a Chinese colony in the 1880s.

Since WWII, Taiwan has been its own independent country. It is a democracy just like the USA, since the end of military rule in the 1980s. Taiwan is peaceful, has a free press, and has excellent education, living standards and entertainment. Its population of Taiwanese help to design and produce some of the world's more advanced technology products.

When in doubt, China always makes wild claims about its territory / 3rd hand possessions in world history. Look at China's colonization of Tibet. Tibet was never part of China. But today, most neutral observers agree China has aggressively taken custody of Tibet by making incorrect, and ludicrous historical claims. Like Tibet was always part of China... oh really... obviously that is nonsense. Only in 1959 did Tibet fall to China.

China has low credibility among neutral observers when it comes to territorial claims, and in particular its distortions of regional history. China stretches its coastline claims to the breaking point. It claims nearby islands that appear vulnerable. China conquered Tibet, encroached on India, claims undersea resources, effectively took half of Korea, and claims Taiwan. Even today, China continues to expand by financially buying world resources in Africa, Central Asia and Latin America.

If any colonial power is to claim Taiwan, it should first be Japan (who was granted custody of Taiwan in 1895, forever). This had nothing to do with WWII. There is no treaty saying Japan gave Taiwan back to China in 1945. It just didn't happen. So, the 1895 treaty may still stand today. Japan won't press the issue. Japan lost WWII, but again Taiwan was not conquered during WWII. That was a separate era, during which China willingly gave Taiwan to the Japanese, forever. Japan lost Taiwan in 1945, but to whom? It was never really said.

In 1949, KMT troops invaded Taiwan, which was not necessarily part of China. They just set up command and militarily ruled the island for over 40 years. This does not make Taiwan part of China per se. That conquest in 1949 did not really carry any validity. Taiwan was uncolonized then, and remains uncolonized today. The Chinese colony ended in 1895. The Japanese colony ended in 1945. Since then, Taiwan has not been part of any other nation. Its status is not as a part of any country. It is similar to Antarctica -- a land where no country has successfully claimed ownership.

In this way, the one-China policy of the USA is unfortunate. The USA does not dictate what islands belong to what country. That is done internationally, or it is not done at all. In this case, it was never done at all.

Taiwan has a good-faith record of peaceful world citizenship and high value of production. Taiwan is a good place that has become an advanced modern democracy. For China to exert its will over Taiwan now, is just a domination thing that is compelled by the CPC's historical themes. To admit their enemy, the KMT, survived and created the entity Taiwan, is to create a bunch of uncomfortable comparisons between the CPC and its enemies. If the CPC's enemies created such a nice country, why can't there be opposition parties today? Such questions must be avoided at all costs, even if innocent people must die, or so goes the Chinese policy.


User currently offlineDL021 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 11447 posts, RR: 75
Reply 12, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 1549 times:
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Quoting BHXFAOTIPYYC (Reply 3):
How about an extension of the Hong Kong / Macau style "one country - two systems" as guaranteed for the next 40 years (was 50, 10 down already!) ?

Yeah....you can have your little democracy until the deadline and then you are S.O.L. So...it's like committing delayed suicide. They'd still lose their democracy.

Quoting Foppishbum (Reply 4):
I mean, even A.net put us as "Taiwan Region

Which is cowardly. The cowtowing of the internet search engines to the PRC is shameful and duplicitous. No better than Quislings. Some things, like freedom of speech, should mean something.... I understand the policy of engagement and the theory that exposure to the internet will democratize that place, but I don't necessarily agree with it. Starving the engine of fuel and exposure will do the same, while supporting actual democracies who could use our patronage and won't take our profits and turn them into weapons pointed at us, or buy up the resources around the world (such as Sudanese or Venezuelan oil) to our detriment.

Quoting Foppishbum (Reply 4):
did try to contact the admins about this but they said currently they're not looking into this issue.

Because it's easier to go along and get along.

Quoting Foppishbum (Reply 4):
We used to be "Taiwan" on A.net though

Used to be the Republic of China in alot of areas. Getting harder to get around the PRC's big stick on the issue for people who are afraid of losing Chinese patronage.

Quoting Foppishbum (Reply 4):
I can understand why companies/webpages want to avoid fuss with Mainland China.

I can too.....I just don't like it

Quoting Foppishbum (Reply 4):
I just blame us Taiwanese for not being strong enough...

Dude...the ROC has been squared off with the PRC since 1948 and faced them down ever since. The only reason they never succumbed was their strength and willingness to stand up to the PRC and grow their democracy. The Taiwanese did not start with democracy, but they have it now, and a society that is progressing freely.

Quoting Toast (Reply 7):
It's been a fully independent nation for over 50 years now. Only the fact that the world plays along with the PRC's delusional claim to sovereignty permits this kind of bullshit to last so long.

Quite true.

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 8):
Like a few weeks ago after the German chancellor Merkel received the Dalai Lama. The PRC imediately canceled several appointments and meetings, with the result that the chairman of the German industrial association critizised the chancellor for spoiling business opportunities with China.

Just like when President Bush did the same and people were afraid the Chinese would buy Airbus instead of Boeing. I'd like to see what the Chinese would do if we took our business elsewhere......there's a billion and a half or so people in India/Malaysia/Indonesia, the Phillippines and Thailand who are all living in democracies and would like the work. Hell, the Vietnamese are making more progress than the PRC in the area of personal freedom and democratization.

Quoting Flighty (Reply 11):
It is a democracy just like the USA

well...only with more fistfights in their legislative gatherings.....

Quoting Flighty (Reply 11):
When in doubt, China always makes wild claims about its territory / 3rd hand possessions in world history. Look at China's colonization of Tibet.

Look at what they're trying with the Spratleys and Paracels...

Quoting Flighty (Reply 11):
If the CPC's enemies created such a nice country, why can't there be opposition parties today? Such questions must be avoided at all costs, even if innocent people must die, or so goes the Chinese policy.

Welcome to the world of lie/deny/and counteraccuse!



Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
User currently offlineFoppishbum From Taiwan, joined Mar 2006, 826 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 1542 times:

Quoting DL021 (Reply 12):
Dude...the ROC has been squared off with the PRC since 1948 and faced them down ever since. The only reason they never succumbed was their strength and willingness to stand up to the PRC and grow their democracy. The Taiwanese did not start with democracy, but they have it now, and a society that is progressing freely.

I said that because some Taiwanese don't want to officially declare independence and change our maps. People are afraid of war and rightfully so. War is ugly...It's just a shame that there's no peaceful way for us to declare independence. PRC has us in a difficult situation. Right now, technically Mainland China, (outer) Mongolia, and Taiwan are part of ROC's "official government map". But then, if we change out map, then that means we declare our independence...chances are PRC are gonna fire their missiles at us at that instant.

But yea, this thing has been going on for decades. Maybe in the future the new generation PRC leaders will just leave us alone. =|



Peace,
Wes



I'm a Taiwanese-American living in NYC and LA.
User currently offlineZak From Greenland, joined Sep 2003, 1993 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days 2 hours ago) and read 1530 times:

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 8):
The PRC imediately canceled several appointments and meetings, with the result that the chairman of the German industrial association critizised the chancellor for spoiling business opportunities with China.

indeed, such immediate, omnipresent discrimination is why i was curious about this experience. i noticed that due to fear of such chinese reactions, alot of sublte discrimination against taiwan is going on, not only on a political level, such as countries not accepting the independence, but also as subtle as airliners.net now calling taiwan only a region, to explicitly embrace a one china policy. i do assume that such issues are an everyday thing for people from taiwan and wonder where else it exists.



10=2
User currently offlineBritjap From Japan, joined Aug 2006, 280 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days ago) and read 1523 times:

I have a question I hope you can answer.
It has been said in many of the posts above that Taiwan is an independent nation. Personally I also strongly support this notion but the fact remains that Taiwan hasn't yet actually claimed independence.

What I have wondered for quite a while now is why does Taiwan not do so?

Fairly obviously there would be a fierce reaction from China. China is pouring money into developing its military muscle and expanding its capabilities and influence. It could be argued that this makes a good reason for Taiwan not to aggravate its larger neighbour. However China is still currently in absolutely no state to be able to launch any kind of invasion of Taiwan.

I greatly fear however, that this state of affairs will not continue. Within perhaps as little as a decade, China will probably have developed enough strength to be able to carry out a major military campaign against Taiwan. When this happens surely all hope of a truly independent Taiwan will be lost.

So I can't help but think that perhaps Taiwan should declare independence and the sooner the better. Should they summon up the courage do so I am sure many countries, perhaps not immediately, but sooner or later would abandon their One China policies in support of the new country. This situation need only be in effect for a short while for it to become the new international status quo, after which any actions by China against Taiwan could only be considered an act of war by one nation upon another, and the usual Chinese mantra of "other nations have no right to get involved as it is an internal affair", rubbish would no longer stand.

I am sure the above is no doubt full of naivety so tell me, why can it not happen??

On a side note does anyone know if the UK has a One China policy? I am guessing it probably does but I dont know.


User currently offlineZak From Greenland, joined Sep 2003, 1993 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days ago) and read 1519 times:

Quoting Britjap (Reply 15):
What I have wondered for quite a while now is why does Taiwan not do so?

as far as i understand the situation, taiwan prefers to be factually independent but not legally over declaring legal independence and triggering a war with china for something that is something mostly on paper versus a war where people really die.



10=2
User currently offlineBritJap From Japan, joined Aug 2006, 280 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 6 days ago) and read 1513 times:

Quoting Zak (Reply 16):
triggering a war with china for something that is something mostly on paper versus a war where people really die.

I understand that obviously it is no small thing to risk such a thing for something that may not make much actual difference to the daily lives of the people living in Taiwan, but I guess the point of my above question is precisely that, is China currently capable of really taking a war to Taiwan?? Especially with the US backing Taiwan.

Once China becomes really powerful in the next few decades even the US will not be able to prevent aggressive Chinese actions toward Taiwan. Meaning that if they want to declare independence the time to do so it would seem would be now. no?


User currently offlineDavid L From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 9524 posts, RR: 41
Reply 18, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 1505 times:

Quoting BritJap (Reply 17):
is China currently capable of really taking a war to Taiwan?? Especially with the US backing Taiwan.

But can China be sure the US would provide full military support? Does the US even know what it would do if China marched into Taiwan?

Quoting BritJap (Reply 17):
Once China becomes really powerful in the next few decades even the US will not be able to prevent aggressive Chinese actions toward Taiwan. Meaning that if they want to declare independence the time to do so it would seem would be now. no?

That seems like a huge gamble to me. Suppose Taiwan declares independence now and China builds the capability to take it within the next few decades... then what?

Quoting Foppishbum (Reply 10):
I went to Hong Kong both before 1997 and after 1997 and I definitely feel the difference.

Pre-1997 Hong Kong played a huge role in my childhood and I always wanted to go back. Because of what I've heard since then, I don't anymore. The Hong Kong I knew no longer exists.


User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 14026 posts, RR: 62
Reply 19, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 1503 times:

Quoting Britjap (Reply 15):
What I have wondered for quite a while now is why does Taiwan not do so?

One reason is that over the last 20 or so years Taiwanese businesses have invested a lot of money in China and a declaration of independence would mean that their property in China would most likely be confiscated.

Jan


User currently offlineWingnut767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1489 times:

Quoting Toast (Reply 7):
The "One China Policy" is nonsense. The PRC and the ROC are two very different countries. Taiwan is an independent nation by all measures except the fact that it's not recognized as such by the UN since the 1971 GA Resolution 2529; instead, it's officially called "Chinese Taipei" (another bureaucratic turd of a name, second only to FYROM ). It's a shame really, and it's a shame to see "Taiwan Region" next to the Taiwanese flag here on A.net. It's been a fully independent nation for over 50 years now. Only the fact that the world plays along with the PRC's delusional claim to sovereignty permits this kind of bullshit to last so long.

Right on toast. Nice post


User currently offlineViaggiare From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2007, 2122 posts, RR: 7
Reply 21, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 1479 times:

Quoting Britjap (Reply 15):
the fact remains that Taiwan hasn't yet actually claimed independence.

What I have wondered for quite a while now is why does Taiwan not do so?

Fairly obviously there would be a fierce reaction from China. China is pouring money into developing its military muscle and expanding its capabilities and influence. It could be argued that this makes a good reason for Taiwan not to aggravate its larger neighbour. However China is still currently in absolutely no state to be able to launch any kind of invasion of Taiwan.

I greatly fear however, that this state of affairs will not continue. Within perhaps as little as a decade, China will probably have developed enough strength to be able to carry out a major military campaign against Taiwan. When this happens surely all hope of a truly independent Taiwan will be lost.

So I can't help but think that perhaps Taiwan should declare independence and the sooner the better.

Exactly. Taiwan's international isolation is increasing exponentially, as they're currently down to only 24 diplomatic allies, half of those being in Latin America. And the recent move by Costa Rica (one of the most respected democracies in the region) to recognize China could have a domino effect on the island's few remaining friends in this part of the world. President Arias described China as a "reality that we could no longer ignore."

China's military might is also increasing exponentially. In other words, Taiwan is getting crushed on the diplomatic front right now, and in a few years the mainland will also be in a position to pummel the island into submission militarily.

So, get busy declaring your independence (now) or get busy preparing for assimilation.



Entre le fort et le faible c’est la liberté qui opprime et la loi qui affranchit.
User currently offlineFoppishbum From Taiwan, joined Mar 2006, 826 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 1465 times:

Quoting Viaggiare (Reply 21):
So, get busy declaring your independence (now) or get busy preparing for assimilation.

I personally gave up on declaring independence. If you've been to Taiwan, you'll see lots of people are still in the delusion of "one China but separate systems" policy. I don't know why but many Taiwanese are just not...brave enough.  Sad We're taking baby steps to put Taiwan on our passports, our post office is renamed to Taiwan Post, there are several other things but then the minority party in Taiwan (currently KMT) is having a hard time dealing with these baby steps. Anyway, I hope I can do something about this situation but, frankly, I'm too powerless to influence anything. Blah...politics, I can never fully understand it.

P.S. MY first step would be convincing A.net admins to change "Taiwan Region" to "Taiwan"!!! Big grin Although I asked, they're not doing anything about it.  cry 


Peace,
Wes



I'm a Taiwanese-American living in NYC and LA.
User currently offlineBarfBag From India, joined Mar 2001, 2231 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1457 times:

An interesting anecdote - a member of my family is a senior bureaucrat in India's finance/trade ministry. There have been recent overtures toward increasing trade and security ties between the countries, that have been conducted without much publicity until recently, like we do with our significant ties to Israel.

This is because the Chinese have been extremely miffed at us for about half a century, primarily because we've hosted the Dalai Lama ever since he and his entourage fled Lhasa in the 1950s, and essentially told the Chinese to go take a hike when they demanded his return and otherwise end any co-operation to the Tibetans. Oh yes, there have been border disputes and general strategic rivalries etc, but that's off topic.

So this person went to Taiwan as part of a team to discuss trade and security ties at the invitation of the Taiwanese. The trip went very well, the Taiwanese were very gracious hosts and other than the fact that most of the Indian delegation was terrified of the exotic food, and generally incompetent at using chopsticks, which the Taiwanese didn't appear to have been aware of in advance.

However, both on arrival and departure at the airport and elsewhere, the Indian delegation were hurriedly whisked through by dark-suited official escorts, and their identities were kept quiet. There seemed to be a premium on ensuring everything was conducted with a minimum of publicity of any kind. Rather interesting. Does it happen to delegations from other nations ? It's rather sad that general diplomatic ties have to be conducted in this manner.



India, cricket junior and senior world champions
User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 14026 posts, RR: 62
Reply 24, posted (6 years 10 months 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 1430 times:

Taiwan and India would be an interesting strategic partnership. India is big enough to be able to stand up against China and doesn't have too much money tied down in China. Also India and Taiwan are both democracies. If India would recognise Taiwan's independence, it would probably start a domino effect of other countries not bending over for China anymore and would create a strategic balance in Asia. On the other hand lots of Taiwanese capital would find it's way into India. IMO a win-win situation for both.

Jan


25 Rara : Slowly, slowly... even though Taiwan is factually independent, the claim to an own Taiwanese nation is far from uncontested in Taiwan. While many peo
26 Viaggiare : With China busy preparing itself to host the Olympics, the next few months might provide the best chance for Taiwan to irritate the mainland with som
27 MD11Engineer : AFAIK, Taiwanese society is split (sociologically and politically) between the native Taiwanese (who are largely for independence) and the people who
28 Flighty : The culture of Taiwan is not the same as China. China is a large developing country that has a Communist cultural system. And yes, a partial free mark
29 MD11Engineer : Makes sense as Taiwan was for several decades a Japanese colony, and unlike in other colonies of theirs, they used Taiwan as a model colony and set t
30 Post contains images BritJap : I tried to counter this point in my first post (reply 15). There is of course nothing to stop China building its strength in order to take Taiwan by
31 Post contains images Foppishbum : I doubt that a civil war would erupt. Currently the DPP has control over the military since the President is a member of DPP. The military is suppose
32 ACFA : I'm quite used to it, I don't really care. There is no need for independence, the current system (of no chinese control, but no formal independence) w
33 Post contains images Foppishbum : If you've been living outside of Taiwan for 5 years, even if you were born in Taiwan, you don't need to serve in the military as long as you have the
34 ACFA : I have Taiwanese citizenship by accident, without getting into details, I am obligated to serve in the military. I've confirmed this with TECO themse
35 Post contains images Foppishbum : I'm sorry to hear that... You're supposed to go to this government agency to get a stamp that permits you to go out of Taiwan. It is an easy process
36 Viaggiare : With all due respect, I still think you're both at a loss on this one. In other words, (1) the Indo-Chinese border is an extremely difficult battlegr
37 LAXspotter : we all agree, expect for probably Chinese nationalists BTW, thanks to your politicians, we get good laughs from the fights that break out within your
38 Post contains images Foppishbum : When I see those on CNN or on those "funny video" shows, I get very embarrassed. . . It's times like when I wish I wasn't Taiwanese. Peace, foppish b
39 LAXspotter : no kidding, BTW what are they usually fighting about, is it controversial topics about relations with China?
40 Post contains images Foppishbum : Nope...not really. Just disagreements about bills and stuff. KMT hates DPP, DPP hates KMT...and other smaller parties are just there to side with who
41 Post contains images BritJap : I'm glad you took this light heartedly, after I wrote it I got worried I might cause offense. I didn't mean to imply that Taiwan doesn't have its own
42 Post contains images Foppishbum : I can never get the ga and ka sound right when I listen to my grand parents speak...hahaha. Sorry! Peace, foppish bum
43 Foppishbum : I want to add a little bit of history behind this whole (practically) native Taiwanese vs. "new" Taiwanese who's family moved to Taiwan with Chiang Ka
44 Post contains images Foppishbum : If we get enough support, I would like that to happen! We're minority on A.net...only 14 people chose "Taiwan Region" flag :| And I think about 4 are
45 Post contains images David L : But China already has enough clout to make other nations nervous about recognising Taiwan's independence. Sure, if push came to shove, it might backf
46 Par13del : Assimilation, accurate word used by a previous poster. Taiwan has two choices, agree to be ruled by China, or declare independence and face the conseq
47 Post contains images Foppishbum : Because 10-20 years ago Taiwan was still under KMT's ruling and Taiwan independence was a topic that was frowned upon and Taiwanese citizens couldn't
48 Post contains links and images David L : I think the most legitimate way would to be to ask here: Why No EU Flag? (by Sukhoi Jul 13 2007 in Site Related) I'll be branded a traitor for saying
49 Post contains links LTU932 : I'm not Taiwanese, but I can tell you that in Costa Rica, a country which previously fully recognised Taiwan as an independent and sovereign state, t
50 Post contains images Foppishbum : I think more people will be in favor of Taiwan or Republic of Taiwan. We're putting "Taiwan" on more and more of our official documents like passport
51 Post contains images Viaggiare : That happened to be my initial reaction, until I came to terms with the fact that Taiwan has deliberately been playing the checkbook diplomacy game f
52 Flighty : Wow, that is a juvenile attitude. How about some respect for Taiwan's democracy vs a Communist dictatorship? Or does Costa Rica take so little pride
53 Post contains images Viaggiare :
54 Post contains images LTU932 : Actually it's Mr Chen (the first name is always the surname in both Chinese and Japanese).
55 Viaggiare : Thanks for the correction, Richie. I just also learned that Chen is in fact the most popular surname in Taiwan.
56 LTU932 : Ah yes, that reminds me of the political scandal of early this decade, which involved ICE (the state monopoly for telecommunications and electric uti
57 Viaggiare : That's right. US$1.4 million to be exact. Part of the money was allegedly siphoned through the former Taiwanese embassy in San José, some more was a
58 BarfBag : I'm not sure what sort of interaction you're implying. There are several mountain passes, some of which have been recently reopened to trade with PRC
59 Post contains links Viaggiare : The context was military engagement. 2006 was named China-India Friendship Year, you know. Prime Minister Singh said at the time that "India paid gre
60 Post contains images Viaggiare : Well, being that we're at the crossroads for Spanish flotas, we do get the occasional galleon bringing along some precious contraband commodities -su
61 BarfBag : Well, why on earth would China go to war with every nation that interacted with Taiwan, and particularly with us ? I certainly never implied India go
62 Viaggiare : I didn't say you had. An earlier reply suggested if Taiwan could get India on its side to join the United States (who has pledged to defend Taiwan if
63 BarfBag : Well, there's no need for us to go all the way to the Taiwan Straits if such an eventuality did come about. The prospect of tensions on two fronts is
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