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Is It Wrong To Be Homophobic?  
User currently offlineFllcontinental From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 344 posts, RR: 0
Posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5580 times:

I have homophobia and am not proud of it. It's not that I think that gays are morally repugnant but I just feel uncomfortable anytime I am around a gay. Does anybody else here share my fear?

217 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineEWRCabincrew From United States of America, joined May 2006, 5523 posts, RR: 56
Reply 1, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5565 times:

Quoting Fllcontinental (Thread starter):
homophobia

You have a fear of homos? Big grin

Quoting Fllcontinental (Thread starter):
I just feel uncomfortable anytime I am around a gay

What is it that makes you feel uncomfortable? How would you know you are around "a gay"? Do you find it strange that you are uncomfortable around gays, but gays aren't uncomfortable around you?



You can't cure stupid
User currently offlineScarletHarlot From Canada, joined Jul 2003, 4673 posts, RR: 56
Reply 2, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5560 times:

Yes, it is wrong to be homophobic. Gays are people just like straights. Everybody deserves to have someone to love and to love them. So what if gays are born with the need to love people of the same sex? Why does that make them less of a person? It doesn't.

How many gay people do you actually know or have you actually talked to? Are you uncomfortable because you are just not around gay people much? I think you would find that if you are open minded in your interactions with gay people, you would find that they're just as interesting and nice as anybody else. How do you know, anyway? I am sure you've interacted with many gay people and not known it.



But that was when I ruled the world
User currently offlineFumanchewd From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5558 times:

Perhaps you are intimidated by their shoes.

User currently offlineNWA742 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5553 times:

I think the word itself is pretty useless. A "phobia" means an actual fear of something.

I have never heard of nor seen any person that actually is afraid of gay people, yet I've seen many be labeled as homophobes because they don't understand or agree with the gay lifestyle.





-NWA742


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21382 posts, RR: 54
Reply 5, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5553 times:

Quoting Fllcontinental (Thread starter):
I have homophobia and am not proud of it.

Sorry to hear that. But actual conversations with ordinary gay people can usually cure it over time.


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21382 posts, RR: 54
Reply 6, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5527 times:

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 4):
I think the word itself is pretty useless. A "phobia" means an actual fear of something.

I think it's quite adequate for many. Especially those who are scared of the idea that they somehow could not survive a gay person expressing feelings for them (which almost never happens in real life, and a simple "Sorry, I'm not interested!" isn't actually that difficult, really).

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 4):
I have never heard of nor seen any person that actually is afraid of gay people, yet I've seen many be labeled as homophobes because they don't understand or agree with the gay lifestyle.

"The" gay lifestyle? There are at least thousands of different lifestyles of different gay people, and most of them are pretty much identical to those of similar heteros.

And what exactly gives you the idea that your approval was somehow required for any of them anyway?  eyebrow 

Insisting on that weird idea is what makes you a homophobe.


User currently offlineDavestanKSAN From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 1678 posts, RR: 14
Reply 7, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5509 times:

Are you serious? I recommend talking to a Gay person and you'll get over your "fear." There's plenty of Gay people on this site if you don't know where to start.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 5):
But actual conversations with ordinary gay people can usually cure it over time.

There's lots of extraordinary gay people too  angel 

Dave



Yesterday we've sinned, today we move towards God. Touch the sky....love and respect...Safe Star!
User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21382 posts, RR: 54
Reply 8, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5493 times:

Quoting DavestanKSAN (Reply 7):
There's lots of extraordinary gay people too

Absolutely. But a few of them might in fact be a little intimidating.
Quite similar to a few "outstanding" heteros who might not be ideal for overcoming heterophobia...! Big grin


User currently offlineDavestanKSAN From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 1678 posts, RR: 14
Reply 9, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5482 times:

Quoting Klaus (Reply 8):
Absolutely. But a few of them might in fact be a little intimidating.
Quite similar to a few "outstanding" heteros who might not be ideal for overcoming heterophobia...!

 laughing  I know, I know. It's like asking JGPH1A how to be a vegetarian!!  duck   silly 

Dave



Yesterday we've sinned, today we move towards God. Touch the sky....love and respect...Safe Star!
User currently offlineEWRCabincrew From United States of America, joined May 2006, 5523 posts, RR: 56
Reply 10, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5464 times:

Quoting Klaus (Reply 8):
few of them might in fact be a little intimidating

Just like some heteros.

FllContinental, this is a great time to become a better person, let your guard down and talk with someone whom you feel makes you uncomforable, for whatever reason that may be.

Like DavestanKSAN suggested (hell, there's a thread on who is and who isn't here), talk to anyone of us. Ask us a question or two (or three).

Expand your horizons.



You can't cure stupid
User currently offlineCakentennis From United States of America, joined Oct 2007, 152 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5456 times:

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 4):
gay lifestyle

There's no such thing. The media only projects the stereotypes, why? because the majority of gay people/couples with regular boring lives like the rest of the populace aren't news worthy.

Quoting Fllcontinental (Thread starter):
I have homophobia and am not proud of it. It's not that I think that gays are morally repugnant but I just feel uncomfortable anytime I am around a gay. Does anybody else here share my fear?

I'd blame that on lack of exposure. As someone pointed out, you'll soften up the more you converse with them and realise gay people aren't any different from straight people as much as your religious institution would like you to think otherwise.


User currently offlineSQuared From Canada, joined May 2005, 387 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5444 times:

Admitting that you are homophobic is probably the first step in the right direction. Once you've had a few conversations with gay people, like Klaus has suggested, you'll soon realize that gay men and women are just as diverse as straight men and women.

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 4):

I have never heard of nor seen any person that actually is afraid of gay people, yet I've seen many be labeled as homophobes because they don't understand or agree with the gay lifestyle.

I always snicker at the thought that there is such a thing as "the" gay lifestyle.


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21382 posts, RR: 54
Reply 13, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5440 times:

Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 10):
Just like some heteros.

Indeed:

Quoting Klaus (Reply 8):
Quite similar to a few "outstanding" heteros who might not be ideal for overcoming heterophobia...!



Quoting Cakentennis (Reply 11):
As someone pointed out, you'll soften up the more you converse with them and realise gay people aren't any different from straight people as much as your religious institution would like you to think otherwise.

And whatever some people say, you can't "change" in whatever direction, especially not by "exposure" to gay people. If you're straight, then that's what you are and it won't change anyway. So no need to fear anything, really.

I find it extremely peculiar that some of the most homophobic people are so adamant that it was all about "rejecting the choice" - if they were truly straight themselves, they would know that there was no choice involved, really...!  mischievous 


User currently offlineNWA742 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5431 times:

Quoting Klaus (Reply 6):
I think it's quite adequate for many. Especially those who are scared of the idea that they somehow could not survive a gay person expressing feelings for them.

I see where you're coming from, but I still think the "phobia" is rarely applicable in the case of a person who either doesn't support and/or doesn't understand the concept of homosexuality.

My point is that ignorance or lack of support or understanding of an idea, lifestyle, or concept, doesn't equal phobia - it's more a matter of ignorance or simply being anti-something.

And before you carry on with more personal attacks such as those that I'm about to respond to in this post, let me clarify that I'm not talking about myself here.....

Quoting Klaus (Reply 6):
"The" gay lifestyle? There are at least thousands of different lifestyles of different gay people, and most of them are pretty much identical to those of similar heteros.

Ok well, forget the "lifestyle" then. Concept, idea, whatever word suits you. That's beyond the point anyway.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 6):
And what exactly gives you the idea that your approval was somehow required for any of them anyway?

And what exactly gives you the idea that I think my approval is required for anything even remotely related to homosexuality? Stop making things out to be more than they are, Klaus.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 6):
Insisting on that weird idea is what makes you a homophobe.

I insisted on no such idea - don't toss words into my mouth. I'm not gay, I hold nothing against gays, I'm not afraid of them, and the entire subject is highly irrelevant and meaningless to me.

And remember, tossing words into someone's mouth is what makes you unable to carry on a conversation without namecalling or pulling your arguments straight out of your ass.




-NWA742


User currently offlineNWA742 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 5429 times:

Quoting Cakentennis (Reply 11):
There's no such thing. The media only projects the stereotypes, why? because the majority of gay people/couples with regular boring lives like the rest of the populace aren't news worthy.



Quoting SQuared (Reply 12):
I always snicker at the thought that there is such a thing as "the" gay lifestyle.

I guess "lifestyle" was the wrong word to use........by lifestyle I simply mean't the concept of being sexuality active with the same sex, nothing more.




-NWA742


User currently offlineDeltaAVL From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1893 posts, RR: 6
Reply 16, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 5409 times:

My best friend is gay; I'm straight. I hang out with him all the time, and often forget that he is gay, because he acts just like any other person.

Unless you're trying to get romantically involved with the person, it doesn't make a lick of difference whether he/she is gay or straight. I've been told that many people who claim they have "homophobia" are insecure with their sexual orientation, but I would hope that you would have figured yourself out by the 36-45 age.  Wink



"We break, We bend, With hand in hand, When hope is gone, Just hang on." -Guster
User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12090 posts, RR: 49
Reply 17, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 5399 times:

I'm sure a member from the Cleveland area has an opinion on this subject she will share with you if you ask.


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21382 posts, RR: 54
Reply 18, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 5374 times:

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 14):
My point is that ignorance or lack of support or understanding of an idea, lifestyle, or concept, doesn't equal phobia - it's more a matter of ignorance or simply being anti-something.

Different issue. I wasn't talking about that in the statement you quoted.

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 14):
And what exactly gives you the idea that I think my approval is required for anything even remotely related to homosexuality? Stop making things out to be more than they are, Klaus.

Your post #4:

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 4):
yet I've seen many be labeled as homophobes because they don't understand or agree with the gay lifestyle.

You complained bitterly about people being unfairly labeled "homophobe" for "not agreeing" with an imaginary but clearly dismissed "gay lifestyle".

That sentence is brimming with so many well-known misunderstandings, claims, qualifications and implications that it's not that difficult to decipher.


User currently offlineToast From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 5367 times:

It's all in your upbringing, and that in itself is heavily influenced by the terrible legacy of centuries of religiously-determined societal "norms".

There is no such thing as a rational argument against homosexuality. Its strong association with "sin", and our atavistic fear and mistrust of people who are different is really all there is to homophobia. I've also heard people expressing fear at the idea that a gay could make a pass at them. That is totally unfounded. I have studied and work in a profession that for some reason seems to attract many gay men, so I've been around them quite a lot. Rest assured that a gay man interested in you will always try to determine your orientation first via other people who know you better, and will leave you alone if you're straight. That reduces very significantly the probability of anyone actually approaching you. And even if that happened (never happened to me), what makes you so uncomfortable about the idea? Have women who you'd never look twice at never made a pass at you? In the unlikely event of that happening with a guy, just be nice and simply say why it couldn't work, and voilà. Don't for a second imagine that the typical gay is a Republican senator cornering you in a public restroom, or leather-clad biker with a handlebar mustache inviting you to a steamy tango.

I know it only sounds easy to change one's attitude. I for myself have had the privilege of a liberal upbringing, and I live in a society that is extraordinarily tolerant toward homosexuality. Unfortunately, a comfortable majority of people on this planet still haven't, sorry for the image, untightened their asses about certain ancient "moral values" that should have no relevance whatsoever in today's world. Homosexuality is still legally punishable, sometimes by death, in a sickening number of countries. This double religious-legal stigma will take a long time to wear off, and will continue to influence people's mentality for probably centuries to come.

Gay people are just as valuable and good citizens as everybody else, and they have a variety of lifestyles as rich as everybody else. Even to begin generalizing about such an enormous amount of people - possibly up to 20% of all humans - solely on the base of their sexual preferences is absurd. As more of them dare to come out of a closet, people will begin to realize just how overwhelmingly "normal" gay people are. Come to Brussels or Amsterdam and have a look around. Count the rainbow flag stickers on cars and shop windows. My newsagent is gay, my landlord is gay, my grocer is gay, my neighbors - pre-school teachers - are a lesbian couple, several fellow lecturers at my college are openly gay, maybe half of the guys I work with, highly qualified people without a hint of drag queen campness, are gay as well. Chances are - no, it's certain - that a significant portion of your own friends and acquaintances are gay as well, however "manly" your job may be. So do them and yourself a favor and let people know it's OK to you. Don't help perpetrate the stupid myth that gays are sleazy perverts. The self-sustaining mechanism of prejudice and ignorance has to be stopped.

[Edited 2007-11-05 19:03:59]

User currently offlineBoeing744 From Canada, joined Jun 2005, 1827 posts, RR: 23
Reply 20, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 5330 times:

Quoting Toast (Reply 19):

Along with your informative and intelligent posts about linguistics (an area that greatly interests me), that post gained you entry to my Respected User list! I agree with everything you've said!


User currently offlineEWRCabincrew From United States of America, joined May 2006, 5523 posts, RR: 56
Reply 21, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 5323 times:

Another point: Heteros aren't normal. Just common.

A lot of people here have given great advice. It's up to you at this point. You won't be disappointed.



You can't cure stupid
User currently offlineNeilYYZ From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 1 day ago) and read 5305 times:

Quoting Fllcontinental (Thread starter):
Does anybody else here share my fear?

Not I. I'm straight, but I've got quite a few gay friends. I play on a hockey team with two gay men, there's never any tension in the locker room (which is a question that people seem to like to ask). I don't see any difference between my gay friends and my straight friends.

Quoting Fumanchewd (Reply 3):
Perhaps you are intimidated by their shoes.

I've queried a few of my gay friends as to the appropriate shoes, they told me that Dockers a collared shirt and runners just did not go. One of the men I queried pointed out a few nice pairs for me, and I'll admit, they do go better than runners.


User currently offlineNWA742 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 5253 times:

Quoting Klaus (Reply 18):
You complained bitterly about people being unfairly labeled "homophobe" for "not agreeing" with an imaginary but clearly dismissed "gay lifestyle".

 rotfl 

Complained bitterly?

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 4):
I have never heard of nor seen any person that actually is afraid of gay people, yet I've seen many be labeled as homophobes because they don't understand or agree with the gay lifestyle.

Seems more like a simple observation to me, Klaus. Oh, and where did I say they were being unfairly labeled? I'm sure that special little contraption in your head divulged to you an implication that it's unfair, but in reality it's just an example of what I perceive as misuse of a word - fairness has no implication regarding the issue.

Also, did you miss the whole segment regarding throwing words into peoples' mouths? How about making things out to be more than they are? Seems to me you are further proving my point about people who toss words, call people names, and pull their arguments out of that particular place I mentioned before.

Oh, and thank you for telling me and everyone else the way I feel. I appreciate it.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 18):
imaginary but clearly dismissed "gay lifestyle".

Eh,  redflag 

Already corrected the use of the word "lifestyle". Further proof of your ability or lack there of to have a logical debate.




-NWA742


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21382 posts, RR: 54
Reply 24, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 5230 times:

Quoting Toast (Reply 19):
Don't for a second imagine that the typical gay is a Republican senator cornering you in a public restroom, or leather-clad biker with a handlebar mustache inviting you to a steamy tango.

Which is a scary thought from either side of the aisle...! Big grin

Quoting NWA742 (Reply 24):
Seems more like a simple observation to me, Klaus.

I see. So you didn't imply anything at all. Okay.


25 NWA742 : Learning to recede from knee-jerk reactions based on your emotions is a lesson worth learning. -NWA742
26 EWRCabincrew : Instead of sidetracking here, an A.netter has posted a very valid feeling and wants to know what to do. We've done a good job so far, let's continue.
27 Jafa39 : As long as you don't go around hurting them it is up to you who you like and don't like...I am uncomfortable around loud, fat women. If the thought o
28 Post contains images AeroWesty : ... focus on the blowjobs.
29 Post contains images NWA742 :    Thank you. Reading some intellectual text here is quite refreshing at this point. -NWA742[Edited 2007-11-05 20:20:28]
30 Post contains images Jafa39 : Westy!!! Go to your room at once!!!
31 Post contains images DC10extender : Well, I don't understand why those who are gay are what they are but that doesn't mean I look down on them or hate them or anything. It is just someth
32 Post contains images EWRCabincrew : Or Republican.
33 Tsaord : Well, A lot of gay/bi men are just regular men. Nothing to fear there. Now when you see the flaming queens, mean acting like women, the drag queens, t
34 AeroWesty : Why would it? They're people too.
35 Post contains images EA CO AS : Why not just hate everyone equally?
36 Fumanchewd : It really is a sad thing when a citizen is so afraid of congress and daytime television hosts. Seriously though. I am not impressed in general with t
37 Post contains images Vikkyvik : It's just human nature (at least, for a lot of people). You're bound to be uncomfortable around something you've never experienced before. I know I a
38 AeroWesty : I'm usually intrigued and curious, not uncomfortable.
39 ScarletHarlot : Some of us take longer to get to that point than others, Westy. If you grew up pretty sheltered it may take a bit longer to be comfortable with new s
40 Post contains images Frontiercpt : There is one comment I'd like to make in regard to the "gay lifestyle." It's not related to anyone or any comments in particular, it just sort of occ
41 AeroWesty : But then that would validate any phobia for simply never having been exposed to something new. We experience new, different, and sometimes interestin
42 Post contains images TSS : Hah! We should all be so lucky! Seriously though, you've probably met and befriended a number of gay people without realizing it. As Toast pointed ou
43 Post contains images Jafa39 : Yeah but we all choose the people we like to hang out with.....same old same old, you can not like smokers, you can not like republicans, you can des
44 Post contains images AeroWesty : "Fear or hatred of homosexuals, or fear of becoming one." Let's start there as a definition for homophobia. If you despise Volvo drivers, wouldn't yo
45 Post contains images Doona : I bet some of that actually is fear, the same way as xenophobia. On the other hand, I'd pay money to see someone be as scared of me as I am of spider
46 CaptOveur : Being aware of it is the first step. Is it ok to be scared of gay people? not really. Would I hold it against you? not really. It is like any other ir
47 Jafa39 : Often people who despise Volvo drivers do it because they don't like their lifestyle or percieved attitudes and behaviour, some people really hate As
48 Post contains images Trav110 : Well first off, I think that being uncomfortable around gays isn't necessarily homophobia. Like others have said, it's a lot of PC bullshit that peopl
49 Kmh1956 : I'm not sure I'd say it was 'wrong' per se, but perhaps ignorant instead. A little education goes a long way towards understanding and the folks on A.
50 Doona : Well said. It's perfectly natural to feel this way around new things. After all, we are creatures of habit and community, and if something or someone
51 Post contains images MauriceB : mmmm although im straight (100%) i don't feel any threatened by gay people, because i know alot of them, and they are actually the most kind people on
52 Post contains images Klaus : As long as you're not beating up vegetarians who've never hurt you...!
53 Post contains images MauriceB : lol no worry's, because i don't like the idea's of most of them, doesn't mean ill hit one lol
54 Post contains images Shawn Patrick : If you're homophobic, why are you not afraid of this forum?
55 Post contains images Mt99 : I think it was an editorial i read about JK Rowling outing one of her characters, that said something along the lines of: "If all homosexuals would s
56 BigOrange : In general I don't have a problem with gays, and have had some friends in the past who are gay. My problem is when these people flaunt their sexuality
57 Dtwclipper : Well, it had to come up sometime...what about all the straights who do the same on the streets...that bugs me too. Geez breeders...get a room I don't
58 Post contains images Doona : Straight people make out in public, and very few people seem to be complaining about that... Now, if actually some people don't go out drinking with
59 Post contains images AeroWesty : My analogy was based on that I've been told here that it's okay to be afraid of gays (or harbor whatever feelings people do) only because of the unkn
60 ATCT : Playing Devils advocate (and at the same time voicing some of my own opinion) It is not wrong to feel offended by someones sexual preference. It is no
61 Post contains images AGM100 : Their are a few things I fear in life: My kids getting hurt or making bad life choices , my little brother not coming home , getting a disease , going
62 AA777 : Well the upside of this is that you arent proud of it...so perhaps you'd like to try to change this?? I'm sure a lot of people feel 'uncomfortable' a
63 Post contains images Klaus : The offense is taken in view of the fact that attitudes like yours have historically led to violent persecution of gay people - and to this very day
64 Post contains images Dougloid : Klaus there is a most interesting dialectic on this subject going on that has potentially significant implications. A recent study performed in the s
65 Searpqx : Its not a preference. Period. Until you can point to the point in your life where you chose to be straight you'll have to accept the fact that I didn
66 Klaus : There are plenty of cases where all kinds of animals in the wild or in zoos have been and are observed to be obviously gay, birds, mammals, all kinds
67 777236ER : NWA742 implies that it's OK to disagree with the 'gay lifestyle' as he calls it. It's OK in the same way as it is to disagree with the 'black lifestyl
68 EWRCabincrew : And the 'hetero lifestyle'.
69 JGPH1A : I eat vegetables. Donuts are vegetables, right ? They have fruit in, anyway - well, pink goop which deep down in it's genetic components contains som
70 N1120A : Oh really? These are mutually exclusive statements.
71 Ajd1992 : Personally, I don't care for people who are homophobic, but then again, i used to be homophobic (I guess because at the time i thought i was gay, and
72 Post contains images Pawsleykat : I would say it is wrong to be homophobic... but not wrong to disagree with it. For example, I came out in February this year...; a lot of my friends s
73 Post contains images Jafa39 : Why, why, why do people keep trawling up this BS...you can understand gays completely and still not like them, I hate this idea that to not like some
74 NWA742 : 777236ER proves that he lacks the ability to read. -NWA742
75 N1120A : It is not about controlling an internal dialog, rather about those views being spread into society and causing discrimination to happen. Not really.
76 Post contains images LAXspotter : This is a stupid point, but Homosexuality exists in other species in the Animal Kingdom.
77 Vikkyvik : Really? I don't see them as mutually exclusive at all. There can be a huge difference between a person's thoughts and their actions. Ok...but that's
78 Post contains images Bwest : Great post, thanks. I should charge you for copying my sig [Edited 2007-11-06 12:57:34]
79 Post contains images Cgnnrw :
80 Jafa39 : Wow! Some really badly-thought out assumptions and generalisations being made here and this is because.... Vik....you are spot on there and you have
81 777236ER : Nothing I said was wrong. Maybe you need to learn the skill of reading thoroughly
82 Post contains images Doona : I wouldn't mind, but the whole affair is bound to be very, very boring. Cheers Mats
83 EWRCabincrew : 82 posts and the original poster has yet to respond, acknowledge or get back with us. In the mean time, a lot of hot air blown (pun intended, too).
84 NWA742 : Ok....... I didn't imply that it was okay to disagree with anything. I was merely pointing out what I see as the common misuse of a word. Wrong. And
85 777236ER : OK, let me ask a simple question then. Do you think there's anything wrong with being gay, being attracted to your own sex or having sex with the same
86 NWA742 : Anything? Yes. -NWA742
87 Ajd1992 : One word question: Why? Well, i think being attracted to the opposite gender is wrong (how ludicrous does that sound?!?) Ok...I'm not straight, bi, or
88 Post contains images JGPH1A : Oooh careful - naughty racism ! Joni will get you - and your little dog too, EEhehehehee !!
89 N1120A : There is nothing poorly thought out there at all, nor a generalization. I agreed that thought alone isn't something we can or should have a say in, o
90 Post contains images LAXspotter : being a Priest is also considered straight
91 Post contains images Jafa39 : Says who??? Some people claim gays are morally bankrupt...how do you decide which is right? Why? And why in this case? Are you trying to portray gay
92 Braybuddy : A refreshingly honest and upfront admission. Have you ever tried to figure out WHY? Is it because you're afraid they'll make a pass at you and you wo
93 Jafa39 : Hey Bray....if his answer to the above was "Because the things they do to each other disgust me" or "I just feel sick to think of two men kissing and
94 EWRCabincrew : Jumping in here, my reaction would be that you are allowed to feel that way. Just as some gay people find the thought of heteros kissing or the thing
95 AeroWesty : My innate fight or flight instinct would most likely kick in, and seeing a band of hungry tigers, I'd probably flee if I was unarmed. But I don't bel
96 Post contains images LAXspotter : , I'm trying to imagine that I dont see why anyone has to be homophobic, being afraid of Homosexuals, it is an irrational fear. I think if you wish y
97 Post contains images Jafa39 : !!!!!!!!!! Never thought about THAT angle! ??? I knew I could rely on you for a sensible answer (the free leg-humping voucher can be download from th
98 Post contains images AeroWesty : Oooh! Oooh! I'll let Buzz know he may put the checkbook away.
99 N1120A : Well, if one values equality in society, then it is obvious what is right. Um, gay people are victims. No, by teaching future generations such though
100 Post contains images FlyDeltaJets87 : To finish this sentence: Then the United States Navy is not for you! Well, if I can offer some insight that might help, since I've gone 180 on this i
101 AeroWesty : I am only a victim of good taste, and nothing else.
102 EWRCabincrew : Like having an irrational fear of straights based on the portrayal of not-so normal heteros, but I understand what you are saying.
103 Post contains images LH423 : Yes, because H&M was such a great contribution to global fashion! North American gays tend to dress much better than the average citizen. Not opinion
104 Post contains links and images Foppishbum : I personally believe everyone is discriminative to a certain level...and that's fine unless the person cross the line and become actively hating someo
105 Post contains images Jafa39 : Is it? Can one side say the other is morally bankrupt and be right with any certainty? you're just fogging the issue here....what if the majority in
106 Post contains images AeroWesty :
107 Post contains images Jafa39 : Well, well, well......yup....you're Gay
108 Post contains images Gkirk : Just think of it this way, if people want to be gay, then let them be. Just leaves more women for us straight people
109 Post contains images Foppishbum : Let's not forget the lesbian population hahaha
110 Post contains images LAXspotter : survival of the fittest, competition of the species
111 Post contains images Jafa39 : There...and i thought you were a sheep man!
112 Bwest : If only it was a free choice... at leat then you could blame gays for something, yet how do you blame somebody for how he is born? Maybe we should go
113 Kmh1956 : Nowhere in my post did I say that understanding gays is going to make this guy like them, but perhaps understand them better, and in understanding he
114 Post contains images Helvknight : Making yourself a bit of a hostage to fortune there, Kirkie
115 ATCT : Thank you. ATCT
116 SBBRTech : What is that about gays and shoes?
117 Post contains images Ajd1992 : I'm not a priest, i'm an atheist! I'm asexual, it seems to be. Basically i don't have any sexual attraction to anybody, and i don't find people physi
118 Braybuddy : Oh I have NO problem with this whatsoever: everyone's morals are different and I wouldn't want to inflict mine on others, any more than I would want
119 Kmh1956 : Maybe it's just because you're so young, and haven't quite reached that stage yet.
120 Ajd1992 : Relatively speaking, i am quite young but i'm half way through my teens. I'm 15, and not having a sex drive at 15 isn't exactly considered normal. I'
121 777236ER : Well then. You are homophobic, and all your petty attempts to semantically argue with the thread-starter is some strange attempt to justify your bigo
122 NWA742 : Oh I see.......because you didn't get the answer you wanted, you can only sit there and continue on with the namecalling. And you have the nerve to c
123 Kmh1956 : Honey, I'm 51...and I never had one in my teens either.....but later? Watch out!!! You may just be a slow developer, as I was.
124 777236ER : Why did you not come out (so to speak) and admit that you were a homophobe before going on a strange quest to try and prove that homophobia was a sema
125 TS-IOR : It's not a pride, and it shouldn't be a shame too ! There is nothing wrong in being homophobic, just keep it for your self, for your belief... and don
126 Post contains images NWA742 : Never admitted I am a homophobe. Learn to read: Both of which you have none of with regards to people who's opinions differ than yours. Then why are
127 Dtwclipper : This is what I really don't understand. Just because someone is gay, why should you keep distance and avoid contact. You could be missing out on good
128 Post contains images 777236ER : At least the thread starter admitted he was a homophobe in his first post, without spending a dozen posts trying to defend himself then admitting he's
129 Express1 : yep i share your fear,i feel sick when they start talking in the way gays do and i don't hang about,so i move,or just leave. dave
130 Dtwclipper : That is such a gernerlization, that sickens me!
131 NWA742 : And where did I call myself a homophobe? I mean, did all of the following just fly right past you? Guess so. Seems like I was spot on with this one,
132 Post contains images Jafa39 : Because they'll be running the country when I'm too old to fight back....someone's gotta invest in our youth to preserve what little is left of our f
133 Post contains images Ajd1992 : "In the way gays do"? I know people you would assume were straight at first glance. You can't talk gay, you can't talk straight. I've been told (reme
134 777236ER : What in God's name are you on about? I tollerate you, I'm not asking for your homophobic posts to be deleted, I'm not asking for you to be locked up,
135 1stfl94 : Speaking as a gay man I do find homophobia reprenhensible because it presents another form of bullying. I was lucky in that parents and friends were a
136 Doona : The "West" wasn't founded on the traditions of freedom and liberty, for crying out loud. The US might have been, but England, Sweden, Germany etc wer
137 AlexEU : I am straight, but i have question for gays. When did you discover that you are gay?
138 Post contains images NWA742 : Oh really? Repeatedly insulting me and calling me names simply because I don't share your own views is tolerant?    No, but that's censorship you'r
139 Doona : I was 19 when I "discovered" it. Before that I'd not really picked up on anything indicating that I might be gay, I'd been with girls before that, an
140 777236ER : Speaking for the UK, the liberties and freedoms modern Britain was founded upon come straight from the Magna Carta of 1215, and even earlier from Hen
141 Post contains images Foppishbum : Hrm, I've known that I'm gay since I was a little boy like 5 or 6. Don't ask me how...I just knew. I never, like really, never, found girls sexually
142 KiwiinOz : I think it depends by what you mean by, "wrong" when asking your question. If you mean victimising, hateful, rash, malicious, then no. I think to be h
143 NWA742 : Yep, and it's quite evident I understand them better than you. No, I am not. Prejudice involves unfavorable and unreasonable opinions that stem from
144 Post contains images Jafa39 : You, technically speaking, he may have a point there....
145 Post contains images NWA742 : Eh.........he would have a point if "bigot" was defined as disagreeing with something, but it isn't and therefore he not only lacks a point, he doesn
146 Post contains images DavestanKSAN : Can I ask you honestly what you see wrong with it? If it's too personal, I totally understand. And I respect your answer even though I probably won't
147 Post contains images Jafa39 : Yeah..... someone who hates gays is a bigot....someone who hates racists is a bigot...the word isn't a value judgement, its a descriptor
148 Post contains images Bwest : Can't really say it's a discovery... I always, as long as I can remember, was more interested in boys then in girls. At first I didn't ofcourse reali
149 NWA742 : Well I tend to see it as morally questionable, and I can't help but find the concept of a man being sexually active with another man disgusting. I do
150 LH423 : Like Bwest, I always felt a certain feeling toward boys from a young age. Of course, when you're young it's not sexual attraction and you don't reall
151 DavestanKSAN : Thanks for the answer, I appreciate it, helps me understand your position better. Dave
152 Post contains images Doona : That goes for my mom too, after I came out to her, she spent like two hours on the phone calling all her friends (gay and otherwise), boasting that h
153 Ajd1992 : Slightly different situation, but for me i just find personalities attractive. Boobs, legs, penises, whatnot don't interest me in the slightest. I'll
154 Post contains images NWA742 : Well that depends on how good looking they are. -NWA742
155 Ajd1992 : So basically, you're selectively homophobic towards guys. In a nutshell. What the fuck?
156 777236ER : Exactly. Just as someone who finds the concept of a black man using the same water fountain as white men disgusting is an intolerant, hate-filled big
157 Post contains images Pawsleykat : Although you can't talk gay or straight... people can tell it from one's voice... for example; I speak with a camp accent.. 90% of the time I don't d
158 Post contains images Ajd1992 : People can't tell it from my voice.... Deep as the pacific, is mine I hate that.... Somebody talking about how "dykes are so great" then i asked him
159 Post contains images Klaus : No. I just didn't invest any further time in that particular exchange after you proved oblivious to even explicit irony. And yet you'd probably eager
160 Post contains images Toast : I can very well understand that someone can be disgusted by the idea of two men having sex. Nothing wrong with that. A friend of mine once showed me a
161 NWA742 : Sorry I skipped over your post. Your very much welcome for the answer. Now I've got one question for you too: Now that you understand my position bet
162 Post contains images Foppishbum : Dudes...everyone is entitle to their feelings toward things. I mean, I'm gay, I know lots of people who are uncomfortable with that and I don't mind..
163 Post contains images LAXspotter : That's because they didnt have D%#D@S back then
164 777236ER : You are 'disgusted' by homosexuals, which by the definition you posted is an 'aversion' to them, which by the definition posted is 'homophobia'. QED.
165 Post contains images DavestanKSAN : OF course you damn conservative APE!!!! only kidding. No I don't think it's fair you're labeled a "bigot." A view of a bigot would be one that hates
166 Post contains images Jafa39 : Do you speak from experience? I never get invited to parties like that!
167 Post contains images Foppishbum : You don't wanna know . Peace, foppish bum
168 TSS : A. Sure they did. Hand-carved wood ones, ivory ones, and stuffed leather ones for starters. B. According to a lesbian friend of mine, REAL lesbians d
169 Post contains images NWA742 : Well a few of my posts got deleted because numerous posts I responded to were deleted for flamebait (not surprising), so here we go again: No, that do
170 Post contains images CF188A : I love these topics Well I dont understand why you straight people are the way that you are. I dont understand why snakes CHOSE to slither or why you
171 Post contains images FlyDeltaJets87 : Without going into too much detail, as you stated you already understand what I was saying, I personally think that "not-so-normal" hetero behavior i
172 Post contains images BNE : Ahh but those women have got to like you back, that could be the problem.
173 UAL777 : Depends who is interviewing. Whether it is right or not, gay pilots are a pariah to their peers.
174 CF188A : there are insane straight radicals out there telling me if i do not repent im going to hell. There are many straight idiots out there who just spite
175 Post contains images Dougloid : Nothing wrong with eating pussy. It's goooooooooood.
176 Pope : Sorry, never seen it. Forward it to me and I'll take a look. Send me the $10 as well.
177 Braybuddy : NWA742 is quite entitled to find something "disgusting". His life, his morals. Personally, I find Coca-Cola disgusting, and I can't imagine anyone per
178 Seb146 : In reading through some of his posts, I would venture to guess he finds the act of two men having intercourse disgusting but the actual men in genera
179 FlyDeltaJets87 : I know, which I covered both before and after the part of my post that you quotedt:
180 Klaus : It might be, if he hadn't expressed his view that he saw being gay as morally questionable. That leaves no ambiguity really.
181 Searpqx : I don't think its fair to label anyone homophobic solely because they find the sex between two men disgusting, no matter what their reasons. As was p
182 Klaus : That's not an excuse - just an explanation-
183 Post contains images Jafa39 : I don't even like to see my own naked body, let alone two skinny-arsed blokes going at it....never did understand what men find attractive about othe
184 Vikkyvik : Sure it does. Just because you find something morally wrong doesn't mean you have an irrational fear of it, or discriminate against it. He shouldn't
185 Post contains images ScarletHarlot : I take it, Andy dear, that your taste in ladies runs more toward the Zaftig ladies Superfly loves than the skinny little things EmiratesA345 is (or a
186 Post contains images Klaus : Discrimination has always been based on what people found to be "wrong". That's always been the starting point. No problem - unless they include mora
187 Vikkyvik : Sure it does, and I really couldn't care less if gay people find the idea of sex with a woman repulsive. Sure, but then we get back to this... which
188 Klaus : Thoughts and actions can be different, but the latter are almost always born out of the former. The issue is not really sexual attraction at this poi
189 NWA742 : Finding homosexuality morally questionable is not reminiscent of homophobia. Homophobia by pure definition deals with irrational fear of, aversion to
190 Vikkyvik : I'll simply paraphrase what I said in the other thread: To take a well-known example, many women (and, I assume, gay men) find Brad Pitt extremely at
191 Post contains images CF188A : Well nor should you understand or even care about what two "blokes" find attractive about one another. It does NOT CONCERN YOU . I don't care if you
192 777236ER : But something based on blind faith, which separates religion from other beliefs, is by its very nature irrational. We've been through this: You've de
193 Vikkyvik : Where did he say he had tunnel vision? Just because you don't UNDERSTAND something doesn't mean you DISAPPROVE of it. Dude - I don't understand being
194 Ajd1992 : Well, you answered "Yes" to finding something wrong about homosexuality. By definition, that would make you a homophobe.
195 Post contains images NWA742 : Blind faith? That depends on the person, 777 - it doesn't define the concept of religion. Blind faith means believing in something without ever quest
196 Post contains images Cf188a : Your attempt to be the top dog : = failed You can do your best to turn crap around on me, but I know that those who have their heads screwed tightly
197 Post contains images Seb146 : IMO, being repulsed by two men going at it is completely different than some guy hanging out at a pub. I don't think NWA IS homophobic so much as dis
198 Post contains images Toast : To lighten the mood a bit (and stir the pot ever so slightly ), here's a video on religion and homosexuality by the British comedian Pat Condell:
199 AA7295 : Back on topic. No it is not alright to be homophobic. Someone's sexual orientation is their own business. Who are we to deny homosexuals the right to
200 777236ER : Faith is the main concept behind all religions. You, yourself, defined it in that way: You should stop posting in anger and sit down and read what yo
201 Santosdumont : One interesting point that has been brought up is how the issue of morality seems to tinge the entire homosexuality issue, yet at the same time segme
202 NWA742 : I didn't turn anything around on you. You said what you said, and it shows the incredibly obvious yet total fallacy of your argument. Correct.......n
203 Seb146 : That is true to a point. My friends where I grew up were afraid of gays simply because they didn't know any. After I came out, they were still a bit
204 JGPH1A : What other kind is there ?
205 Ajd1992 : Hear Hear. NWA742, you yourself admitted to finding homosexuality wrong, so you are a homophobic person. Ok, i will admit, gay sex makes an awful lot
206 Post contains images NWA742 : Kind? What are you talking about? Blind faith as I understand it means believing something without ever questioning it - that concept does not define
207 Searpqx : NO NO NO - Its simple black and white statements like this that give ammunition to those that claim Gays are demanding special rights or that we want
208 Post contains images Jafa39 : Mrs Jafa is somewhere in between Piss off and get a life dude.......I was just expressing an opinion and like so many GTR's on here you can only hand
209 Post contains images CF188A : This just proves your ignorance and how pathetic you are. The sound of my own? LOL, such an ignorant statement. I have a problem with trash like your
210 Post contains images NWA742 : Remember I said morally questionable, not wrong, questionable.   You're spot on with your point anyway. I really do appreciate you understanding whe
211 Checkraiser : So you're narrow minded if you don't "get it?" I accept the homosexual lifestyle; I don't like it rubbed in my face, but I accept that it's out there
212 Post contains images Searpqx : That's a whole other thread there , but point taken.
213 Post contains images NWA742 : Don't forget bigoted, homophobic, and racist as well! -NWA742
214 Post contains images AeroWesty : Bloody hell, where did this come from? It's quite alright for someone to say they don't understand the mechanisms at work for why two men (or two wom
215 LAXspotter : Me neither, now does that make me Homophobic, I think not.
216 JGPH1A : Yes it does. It entirely and completely does. Faith HAS to be blind, otherwise it's not faith. You aren't ALLOWED to question it. If you do, it's not
217 Post contains images ANCFlyer : Too much to clean up here. Too many people being disresectful, rather than having an adult conversation. Thread is locked. Any post hitting after this
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