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Hybrid Chevy SUV Developed By College Students  
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9592 posts, RR: 52
Posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 1803 times:

It apparently has taken 4 years, but a group of college students have turned a Chevrolet Equionox (small SUV in the United States) into a hybrid vehicle. They went from 24 to 32 miles per gallon. They seem to be doing a better job than Chevrolet engineers. The students have competed against 17 universities in order to produce the best overall vehicle using all the tools that the real developers get.

http://www.rose-hulman.edu/challengex

General Motors is really trying to catch up to Toyota to develop its hybrid program. I think that is a lofty goal, but is really good overall. Hybrids are moving more and more into mainstream American life. It is good to see American manufacturers being proactive and trying to catch up and be innovators in vehicle technology.

Anyone here own a hybrid?



[Edited 2007-11-14 06:37:02]


If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
56 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineN231YE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 1772 times:

Actually, I think this is older news. I recall a PBS thing on how GM donated several Equinox SUVs, that would be modified by competing schools for the best mileage, in a variety of conditions and driving styles. The school that won was supposed to get a prize.

Quoting RoseFlyer (Thread starter):
Anyone here own a hybrid?

I do...04 Honda Civic Hybrid CVT. I absolutely love the car, but would rather drive an American car. If the Chevy Volt actually makes it to production in 2010 (and not just PR hot air, which GM and Ford seem to be good at doing), I will buy one.


User currently offlineAsuflyer05 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2371 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 1732 times:

It's all about clean diesels.

User currently offlineAirfoilsguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 1728 times:



Quoting RoseFlyer (Thread starter):
They seem to be doing a better job than Chevrolet engineers

Anyone can turn an suv into a hybrid. The hard part is doing it with materials that can be used in a production line that also don't double the cost of the suv.


User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12241 posts, RR: 35
Reply 4, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 1725 times:
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Quoting RoseFlyer (Thread starter):
It apparently has taken 4 years, but a group of college students have turned a Chevrolet Equionox (small SUV in the United States) into a hybrid vehicle. They went from 24 to 32 miles per gallon. They seem to be doing a better job than Chevrolet engineers. The students have competed against 17 universities in order to produce the best overall vehicle using all the tools that the real developers get.

Well, Chevy engineers aren't too dumb either.

2008 Chevy Tahoe Hybrid

Now that's a real SUV. Equinox is a supersized station wagon  Silly




911, where is your emergency?
User currently offlineMattRB From Canada, joined Apr 2005, 1624 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1686 times:

Get a load of this guy and what he does..

http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/120/motorhead-messiah.html



Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible.
User currently offlineRoseFlyer From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 9592 posts, RR: 52
Reply 6, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1678 times:



Quoting Airfoilsguy (Reply 3):
Anyone can turn an suv into a hybrid. The hard part is doing it with materials that can be used in a production line that also don't double the cost of the suv.

While I don't agree that anyone can turn an SUV into a power-split hybrid, it is very true that implmenting it into production is very difficult.

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 4):
Now that's a real SUV. Equinox is a supersized station wagon

The Chevy Tahoe coming out is worth being excited about. However it is almost easier to turn a large vehicle like that into a hybrid because there is a whole lot more space for components like the batteries and motors.



If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
User currently offlineFalstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 6088 posts, RR: 29
Reply 7, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1670 times:
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Ford was doing that a few years ago. I visited with the team from the University of Wisconsin in 2003 and 2004 at the SAE World Congress in Detroit. The Ford was an Explorer and they were using a small diesel engine and a traction motor.


My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
User currently offlineMD-90 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 8506 posts, RR: 12
Reply 8, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 1646 times:

Mississippi State University's team placed third overall in the 2006 Challenge X competition and first in several subcategories.



User currently offlineAndrewUber From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2528 posts, RR: 40
Reply 9, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 1615 times:

I own two hybrids, both made by Toyota Corp. I have a 2007 Prius that is a work vehicle (and can be seen on the ramp at Oakland airport), and the other is my personal vehicle - the Lexus RX 400h. The Prius sips fuel, and is a lot of fun to drive. There is a kit available that will make it reach 100 mpg, but I don't think I'll do it.

The Lexus is also fun to drive, and is surprisingly fast. Most people (myself included - before I bought hybrids) think hybrids are slow, and tradeoff performance for fuel economy. Nothing could be further from the truth - at least in the Lexus RX line. My 400h is all-wheel-drive, and it will easily outrun the gas version (the RX 350). Instead of a tachometer in the dash, we have a power meter which shows what the engine is generating - and it peaks at 200kw. Putting 200 kw to a pair of electric motors at full speed will make that car climb trees, and jump off the line like a sports car. It's a hell of a lot of fun.

Another bonus is "stealth mode". Getting in the car, pushing the start button, and leaving without the engine even starting is quite fun!

I wonder what hybrids will be like in 10 years....

Drew  wave 



I'd rather shoot BAD_MOTIVE
User currently offlineLOT767-300ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 1605 times:



Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 9):
My 400h is all-wheel-drive, and it will easily outrun the gas version (the RX 350). Instead of a tachometer in the dash, we have a power meter which shows what the engine is generating - and it peaks at 200kw. Putting 200 kw to a pair of electric motors at full speed will make that car climb trees, and jump off the line like a sports car. It's a hell of a lot of fun.

Thats one of the funniest things Ive ever read in a car thread on this forum yet.

100mpg? ROFL you mean this?

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2007/09...lug-in-prius-on-display-in-boston/

Bunch of BS.


User currently offlineAerobalance From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 4681 posts, RR: 47
Reply 11, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 1599 times:



Quoting Asuflyer05 (Reply 2):
It's all about clean diesels.

Fuel cells for me



"Sing a song, play guitar, make it snappy..."
User currently offlineAsuflyer05 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2371 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1597 times:

Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 9):
The Prius sips fuel, and is a lot of fun to drive.

The only time I've seen 'Prius' and 'fun to drive' in the same sentence was with a 'not' in between. I found it to be the most anemic driving experience. No pick up, firm ride, and horrible reward vision.

Quoting Aerobalance (Reply 11):

Fuel cells for me

Ask and ye shall receive.

Honda Debuts All-New FCX Clarity Advanced Fuel Cell Vehicle

Mass production of fuel cells are still a while off and the technology is expensive. People are still hesitant about buying hybrids because of the cost of the battery replacement. I cannot imagine what the cost of a fuel cell replacement would be. Though this new Honda FCX is a pretty good deal. A three year lease will run you about $600 a month including insurance which isn't a bad deal because it includes insurance. It would actually be cheaper for me to lease an FCX than my current Accord.

In the mean time, clean burning diesels will begin to hit the market soon and will begin to eat away at the popularity of hybrids.

[Edited 2007-11-14 23:30:18]

User currently offlineLAXspotter From India, joined Jan 2007, 3650 posts, RR: 5
Reply 13, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1588 times:



Quoting Asuflyer05 (Reply 12):
I've seen 'Prius' and 'fun to drive' in the same sentence was with a 'not' in between

no one should buy a Hybrid to have "fun". Most people who probably buy Hybrid's want to save money on gas in the long-term or probably have long commutes, they're not looking to have "fun" anyhow.

Quoting Asuflyer05 (Reply 12):
hybrids because of the cost of the battery replacement. I cannot imagine what the cost of a fuel cell replacement would be.

Toyota Warranty extends to 100,000 miles my friend's mom and dad both have Hybrids; a prius and a Camry Hybrid.



"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" Samuel Johnson
User currently offlineLOT767-300ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1587 times:



Quoting LAXspotter (Reply 13):
no one should buy a Hybrid to have "fun". Most people who probably buy Hybrid's want to save money on gas in the long-term or probably have long commutes, they're not looking to have "fun" anyhow.

Buy a diesel then and get more mpg instead on some expensive slow worthless POS.


User currently offlineLAXspotter From India, joined Jan 2007, 3650 posts, RR: 5
Reply 15, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1587 times:



Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 14):
expensive slow worthless POS.

such as?  scratchchin 



"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" Samuel Johnson
User currently offlineLOT767-300ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1585 times:



Quoting LAXspotter (Reply 15):
such as?

Prius. Costs a ton for no reason, slow and gets abysmal MPG compared to a VW TDI.

Jeremy Clarkson put it in better words that I ever could:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDNdH9pVdsE

When I praise a VW next to another car, that car really has to be a worthless piece of crap.


User currently offlineLAXspotter From India, joined Jan 2007, 3650 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1584 times:



Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 16):
slow and gets abysmal MPG compared to a VW TDI

most people who buy the Prius dont give a damn about speed, all you talk is speed and speeding  Big grin What do you drive like 95 on the highway? But youre right, there are many other cars than can get equal gas mileage to the Prius



"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" Samuel Johnson
User currently offlineAndrewUber From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2528 posts, RR: 40
Reply 18, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 1573 times:



Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 10):
Thats one of the funniest things Ive ever read in a car thread on this forum yet.

100mpg? ROFL you mean this?

Did you even bother to read that article? Did you even bother to check your facts before acting like an idiot?

OH wait . . . you're probably not acting

Quoting Asuflyer05 (Reply 12):
The only time I've seen 'Prius' and 'fun to drive' in the same sentence was with a 'not' in between. I found it to be the most anemic driving experience. No pick up, firm ride, and horrible reward vision.

They must have different Prius's in Poland than they do here in America. Or perhaps you're a Formula One driver and used to a bit of speed. Your fuel economy at 95 mph must be fantastic  sarcastic 

Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 16):
Prius. Costs a ton for no reason, slow and gets abysmal MPG compared to a VW TDI.

Oh really? Costs a ton for no reason? Mine was reasonable, and fulfils the mission I purchased it for with flying colors. I am happy with mine, so I really don't give a flying rats ass if you like the car or not!

Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 16):
When I praise a VW next to another car, that car really has to be a worthless piece of crap.

I've not heard much good about VW, in fact most people I know who have one say they are pigs. One friends's Toureg is in the shop more than he drives it, and another just had an engine block crack in a new Jetta. Sounds like worthless pieces of crap to me - but whatever floats your boat I guess. You too are entitled to your opinion, so let me be entitled to mine.



I'd rather shoot BAD_MOTIVE
User currently offlineFlight152 From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 3393 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 1561 times:

The worst hybrid? Easily the Lexus LS600hl. The car that was supposed to compete with high end V12 models is slower then V8 sedans and gets worse gas mileage then the LS460! It really does over promise and under deliver.

User currently offlineDougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 1547 times:



Quoting LAXspotter (Reply 17):
most people who buy the Prius dont give a damn about speed, all you talk is speed and speeding What do you drive like 95 on the highway? But youre right, there are many other cars than can get equal gas mileage to the Prius

This has all been done before, people. My 1957 Morris Minor sedan with the 1098 cc AH Sprite engine would get 45 mpg at a steady 60 mph and nobody'd ever heard of hybrids at the time.

My friend's brother built an all electric Austin A40 that coule be seen on the streets of Bridgeport Connecticut in the early sixties. Gulton Industries used an electric Rambler station wagon to pick up people at the train station in my home town in the middle sixties.

And yes. The Prius is a tinny pisspot, which has a few more bells and whistles than my Morris Minor which was also a tinny pisspot.


User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26415 posts, RR: 75
Reply 21, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 1529 times:



Quoting RoseFlyer (Thread starter):
It apparently has taken 4 years, but a group of college students have turned a Chevrolet Equionox (small SUV in the United States) into a hybrid vehicle. They went from 24 to 32 miles per gallon. They seem to be doing a better job than Chevrolet engineers.



Quoting MattRB (Reply 5):
Get a load of this guy and what he does..

Exactly. Johnathan Goodwin puts everyone else to shame, and he does it using a 6.6 liter truck engine.

Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 18):
Costs a ton for no reason?

Yes. It isn't luxurious, it isn't fast and it has yet to be proven reliable in the long term. It costs a ton for no reason compared to what you get.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineAndrewUber From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2528 posts, RR: 40
Reply 22, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1512 times:



Quoting Flight152 (Reply 19):
The worst hybrid? Easily the Lexus LS600hl. The car that was supposed to compete with high end V12 models is slower then V8 sedans and gets worse gas mileage then the LS460! It really does over promise and under deliver.

It's a common misconception that fuel mileage is the only figure to look at when determining if a vehicle is truly "green". While fuel burn is important, what is far more important is emissions. The LS 600Lh is a SULEV, the LS 460 is only a ULEV. And, for the record, the 600h does get better mileage than the 460. Have a look at the EPA's website and you will find the following details:

LS 460 -
City - 17 / Highway - 25
MPG Combined - 20 mpg
Fuel to drive 25 miles - 1.25 Gal
Annual Greenhouse Gas Emissions - 9.20 tons

LS 600h L -
City - 20 / Highway - 22
MPG Combined - 21 mpg
Fuel to drive 25 miles - 1.19 Gal
Annual Greenhouse Gas Emissions - 8.70 tons (by far the best in its class)

The Lexus Synergy Drive system uses regenerative braking to recharge the batteries during deceleration and braking. Depending on how you drive the vehicle, you can often get much better mileage than the EPA estimates. For example, my RX 400h stats look like this:

RX 400h -
City - 27 / Highway 25
MPG Combined - 26 mpg
Fuel to drive 25 miles - .96 Gal
Annual Greenhouse Gas Emissions - 7.10 tons

Even though they say 27 in the city, the car has a mileage tracking system that computes your exact mileage in real time, averaged out over 5 minute blocks. I've seen averages of 66 mpg in the city over sequential blocks, and seen a tank average 41 mpg.

Check out the Prius:

2007 Prius -
City - 48 / Highway 45
MPG Combined - 46 mpg
Fuel to drive 25 miles - .54 Gal
Annual Greenhouse Gas Emissions - 3.50 tons

Quoting N1120A (Reply 21):
Yes. It isn't luxurious, it isn't fast and it has yet to be proven reliable in the long term. It costs a ton for no reason compared to what you get.

My Prius is very nicely equipped and cost me around $24k. Given the mission I have for the vehicle (driving around the city and the airport ramp, long periods at idle, occaisional short trips, etc), it performs exceptionally well. I personally find it fun to drive as well - it has great visibility (especially out the back, which was a big concern of mine until I actually drove one), it has plenty of get-up for what I need (I'm not trying to drag-race any Labroghinis), and the hybrid is fun to drive. It's almost like a game, you go out, turn on the energy monitor, and try to beat your high mileage score! My personal best is a 30 minute block of 100mpg + while driving west out of Flagstaff, AZ.

Seriously - before you bash hybrids, go out a drive one! See for yourself! I was of the opinion that hybrids were for Grandma's who were tree-huggers, but then I tried it - and I'm hooked.

Just test drive one before you make your comments on how crappy they are.

Drew  wave 



I'd rather shoot BAD_MOTIVE
User currently offlineFlight152 From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 3393 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1507 times:



Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 23):
LS 460 -
MPG Combined - 20 mpg



Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 23):
LS 600h L -
MPG Combined - 21 mpg

This is supposed to justify the $30,000 price difference? Face it, the LS600hl is an unjustifiable purchase.


User currently offlineLAXspotter From India, joined Jan 2007, 3650 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (6 years 9 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1505 times:



Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 18):
Your fuel economy at 95 mph must be fantastic

 rotfl 

Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 18):
Costs a ton for no reason?

 rotfl , last I checked Priuses didnt exceed over 25K

Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 23):
monitor, and try to beat your high mileage score! My personal best is a 30 minute block of 100mpg + while driving west out of Flagstaff, AZ.

That's what people do with Hybrid's, not check the high speed, but the best fuel economy  Big grin .



"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" Samuel Johnson
25 AndrewUber : Whoa - I should have specified - I still think $115,000 is frickin OUTRAGEOUS for the car!!! I wouldn't pay it!
26 N1120A : Which is overpriced for what it is, particularly if you get a dealer who goes crazy with the markup. I would much rather have the upcoming MINI D, wh
27 LAXspotter : that seems more than the competitors is it not?
28 Post contains images N231YE : My Civic Hybrid's price premium (over the comparably equipped LX model) was $1500. Considering the fact that I have owned it almost 4 years now, and p
29 LAXspotter : everyone seems to forget the warranty.
30 L-188 : Wasn't Chevy test marketing a Hybrid C1500 Pickup a few years back? I think I remember seeing brochure the local dealer. No but they loose MPG rapidl
31 Asuflyer05 : Jeep doubled it's sales expectations when it released the Liberty CRD back in 2006. They canned it because of stricter environmental laws. Most peopl
32 Post contains images N231YE : They did. It was an ultra-mild hybrid, dropped last year. GM is going to bring it back next year or 2009, to be replaced by a version powered by thei
33 N1120A : Only if it gets into the stratosphere. And how about if you take out the outliers and look at the biggest car markets?
34 CaptOveur : Great. Let's go from gasoline that really only has application as a motor fuel for cars and light trucks and switch to a fuel that is used for home h
35 Flight152 : Compared with its V12 competitors, it's cheaper by at least $10-$20,000.
36 Post contains links N1120A : There are already enough refineries. They are currently operating significantly under capacity, particularly as compares to the early 2000s and 1990s
37 CaptOveur : Funny, Valero Energy, one of the biggest refiners in the US says both externally and internally they are nearly maxed out. Nearly meaning they have t
38 N1120A : And I quoted an actual, accessible US government source Well, the US DOE says they aren't. Oh really? GM also said that it would be impossible to put
39 CaptOveur : When has the US government ever attempted something like this and not screwed it up? Any private company willing to take the risk probably doesn't ha
40 Alessandro : Back OT, do the students have to consider the patents Toyota got?
41 N1120A : The Interstate Highway System. Besides, who said the government would have to do it. Who says that would hurt profits? They said it was impossible fr
42 CaptOveur : So the last time the government did something right was 50 years ago. I can agree with that. Nothing is impossible, they just didn't want to re-engin
43 AirTranTUS : You won't have as much interior space though. If you only have 2 people, fine, but if you are a small family, no joy. That is the best way to do it.
44 LAXspotter : ha, N1120A is going to say how much legroom in the back there is in the Mini D, sadly I've never seen more than 2 people in that car. yep, I saw a li
45 AirTranTUS : I've been in the back of a Mini S, and there isn't much room at all. And forget taking anything with you if there are 4 people in the car. At least t
46 N1120A : A small family will fit. Kids don't need nearly the legroom of their parents. And they keep building roads at an astounding pace. Unfortunately, road
47 AirTranTUS : So they will just buy a new car when their kids pass 10? Why not spend a bit more at the beginning and not have to spend any later?
48 RoseFlyer : Are you claiming that water vapor is bad for the environment? If you are, then that is probably the most ridiculous statement I've read in a long tim
49 N231YE : I don't think you understand. Just like CO2, H2O (vapor) is needed for life. It also happens to be one of the biggest greenhouse gasses. It is due to
50 Post contains images L-188 : That's age discrimination! Exactly. Exactly. Actually there are Ethanol plants shutting down because there isn't enough demmand for the product. A nu
51 Post contains links Mham001 : Oh crap. If it were that easy, it would be happening. There is too much money involved for it to be ignored. Instead, we are still searching for the
52 Post contains links N1120A : Actually, this has nothing to do with a conspiracy theory. I don't particularly favor a cane solution either, rather an integrated solution, one that
53 Post contains links Halls120 : A recent National Geographic article illustrates why corn isn't the best solution for our energy needs. http://magma.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/2007-
54 RoseFlyer : Well Brazil has proven that ethanol works. 77% of the vehicles in Brazil are flexible fuel vehicles capable of running on E85, which is a combination
55 Mham001 : Understood. And Brazilian sugarcane does it at nearly 10 times the efficiency of corn. The point is that the Brazilian model with sugarcane simply wi
56 N1120A : I believe they have a significant number of cars that can run on E100 as well. And will likely be a major exporter after the recent find. There have
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