KaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12254 posts, RR: 35 Posted (6 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 1558 times:
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So it's not only in Florida they have to do recounts. Reason I even know of this is because Raila is a friend of my dad, and my brother's godmother's brother
ODM leader Raila Odinga today declared that Kenyans had elected him the fourth President of Kenya and asked President Kibaki to concede defeat.
He told an international news conference at ODMÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s Pentagon offices: Ã¢â‚¬Å“The people know that they voted to eject the incumbent and put in a place a President and a Government they have faith in. That is why they have elected me President.Ã¢â‚¬Â
[. . .]
Tentative results released by the commission yesterday at 2.30pm gave Mr Odinga a thin lead with 3,880,053 votes against President KibakiÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s 3,842,051. The results had results from more than 20 constituencies outstanding.
Yeah, but the controversy is over votes being counted. Many districts had over 100% voter turnout. That's what Odinga is fighting. Remember, Bush was also elected, but that didn't stop Gore from going after him.
Recounts happen all the time, especially in local races. For instance in my state, its automatic if the difference between the winner and loser is 1% or less.
Kenya's defeated presidential candidate has called for nationwide protests against last week's disputed election.
Raila Odinga failed to beat the incumbent President Mwai Kibaki. But, his supporters claimed vote-rigging and fraud, and launched angry demonstrations which have left at least 120 people dead.
From the western border with Uganda, to the capital Nairobi, and Mombasa on the Indian Ocean, protesters vented their anger at what they see as a stolen victory, and were met by an equally-determined police response.
Despite international alarm, President Kibaki vowed to step up security even further, and deal decisively with the rioters. His beaten opponent, Raila Odinga, promised to fight on: "Democracy is expensive," he said. "But we are prepared to pay the ultimate price to liberate this country from the shackles of a cabal of dictators who have no respect or regard for the rights of the people of this country."
So in short, in the third world, whom has the guns is the winner..
Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 2): Remember, Bush was also elected, but that didn't stop Gore from going after him.
Please, why bring this up? If you are at least be accurate, since it was the Bush people that first file suit in Florida to stop the recount and not Gore. Besides the differences in the elections in the two nations are as different as apples and oranges.
AirCop From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (6 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1495 times:
Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 4): Not really, in both elections there were allegations of voter fraud and very close results.
Not even close to begin the same; in the United States the elections are usually consider fair (even though someone might disagree with the results).
The differences between the 2000 USA election and what is happening in Kenya now
1. There was no incumbent running for re-election in 2000.
2. No candidate in 2000 controlled the armed forces.
3. For the most part the United States isn't divided up in tribal groups.
4. No one (aside from a heart attack) died protesting the results in the US in 2000.
In some national elections during the 20th Century in the United States there are whispers of voters fraud (Chicago 1960 comes to mind) but nothing has ever been proven to overturn the results.
The mess in Kenya is a real disappointment as Kenya is seen as the most prosperous and stable democracy in East Africa. The governments on the continent of Africa basically has done little to improve the life of it's citizens, and I'm hoping that Kenya also doesn't fall into that cell pool of waste, murder, dictatorships.
KaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12254 posts, RR: 35
Reply 7, posted (6 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1493 times:
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Quoting AirCop (Reply 6): The mess in Kenya is a real disappointment as Kenya is seen as the most prosperous and stable democracy in East Africa. The governments on the continent of Africa basically has done little to improve the life of it's citizens, and I'm hoping that Kenya also doesn't fall into that cell pool of waste, murder, dictatorships.
I agree with this. Kenya was moving in the right direction after 5 years of Kibaki as a democratically chosen president. Although I wish Odinga would win (hey, how else can I say I know the president? lol), I hope they get the problems solved fast. I am likely visiting Kenya and Tanzania next summer and I hope it will be back to normal by then.
Overlander From Ireland, joined Aug 2005, 150 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (6 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 1477 times:
Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 7): Although I wish Odinga would win (hey, how else can I say I know the president? lol),
I know you said this jokingly, but I can assure you that the Kikuyus will not let this happen easily.
They waited a long time for a Kikuyu to be President again and they believe Kenya suffered during the Moi years and to see another non Kikuyu in charge once more would put the country back further again.
I was in Kenya up until the 20th December and there was a definite tension about the elections and it was obvious that most people were going to vote along tribal lines.
As far as the Kikuyus are concerned, Kibaki has done a wonderful job in trying to sort out the economy and also introduced free Primary Education for all as well as promising free Secondary Education. Unfortunately they have forgotten he had not addressed the issue of corruption and people who have stolen billions (and now seem to be supporting him) have not been called to justice.
It is such a shame how the elections have turned into a shambles, as it had been three years since I had been to Kenya and there really seemed to be a lot of good changes in the country.
All the best,
It is better to travel hopefully.............but, always be prepared for the worst!