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F1 2008, Spa-Francorchamps!  
User currently offlineSudden From Sweden, joined Jul 2001, 4169 posts, RR: 5
Posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4746 times:

F1 fans,

It's time for one of the highlights of the season (at least if you ask me).

Spa has a great history attached to it, and it's basically a great track that has all the elements combined from many other tracks.
I guess it also separates the men from the boys with O'rouge (correct my spelling if needed)

Many claims that the WDC is now between Massa and Hamilton, but this is far from the truth as Kimi can still get back and show his form, and he have clearly stated that he has not lost his motivation to win. Although lately he have shown everything but championship driving. It sure has nothing to do with the car as Massa is able to win with it, so Kimi needs to step on it! Spa is the track he likes the most, so maybe this will be the turning point so he can make the rest of season interesting in regards to the WDC.

Alonso is in serious talks with Honda for (maybe) a seat next year already. Alonso have seen what R. Brawn have done so far for the team, and he looks to be interested to go for Honda for 1 year, and then move over to Ferrari. Will be interesting to see how this all works out.

As you could see, Schumi was again attending the race, and made the stupid comment by saying that he stopped racing to not stand in Massa's way. Strange that he never said this earlier, but now when Massa happens to be on a hype. Lets see how long this hype lasts, shall we!?

Track data;
Number of Laps: 44
Circuit Length: 7.004 km
Race Distance: 308.052 km
Lap Record: 1:45.108 - K Raikkonen (2004)

There is a couple of members that don't participate in these threads anymore due to obvious reasons, and rightfully so (I didn't either in the Valencia thread), but please start posting again so we can get the quality back in these threads that ones was the case.

Aim for the sky!

When in doubt, flat out!
279 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From Monaco, joined Feb 2007, 11332 posts, RR: 34
Reply 1, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4738 times:

I, like many others on this board, am really looking forward to this GP. First of all, I hope Lew Ham will be back in perfect physical condition. It should be a great race.

There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineFlyboysp From Australia, joined Apr 2007, 740 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4736 times:

For some strange i feel that Kimi will come good again here at Spa. Yes he's been down on form, but what a better place for him to bounce back into form.

As much as it pains me to say it, i believe that if Kimi does not win the race, then Hamilton will from Massa. I just feel that Massa wont win here. Having said all that, if Kimi does not gain momentum here, Ferrari will have to IMO, make Massa the No1 driver.

I'm already thinking in my mind how they will be behaving at the La Source hairpin at the start.Imagine all the body work flying around  Wow!

Quoting Sudden (Thread starter):
As you could see, Schumi was again attending the race, and made the stupid comment by saying that he stopped racing to not stand in Massa's way

I thought that it was because he did not want Massa to be out of a job.

User currently offlineFlyboysp From Australia, joined Apr 2007, 740 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4734 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 1):
I, like many others on this board, am really looking forward to this GP. First of all, I hope Lew Ham will be back in perfect physical condition. It should be a great race.

For someone who was not feeling well for the last race, he certainly did not race bad at all. Having all drivers fit will make for an intersting race.

User currently offlineSudden From Sweden, joined Jul 2001, 4169 posts, RR: 5
Reply 4, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 4719 times:

Quoting Flyboysp (Reply 3):
Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 1):
I, like many others on this board, am really looking forward to this GP. First of all, I hope Lew Ham will be back in perfect physical condition. It should be a great race.

For someone who was not feeling well for the last race, he certainly did not race bad at all. Having all drivers fit will make for an intersting race.

No matter what, Hamilton/Mclaren was not able to challenge Massa/Ferrari, and if he was that ill as it sounds, he would not have been allowed to race at all. Still, a damn good performance!

Quoting Flyboysp (Reply 2):
I thought that it was because he did not want Massa to be out of a job

So Schumi would have made way for Massa by giving his seat to Kimi!? Nah, not likely. Massa got his butt kicked anyway by Kimi, and I don't see Massa take the title this year either. And look ahead and lets say that Kimi leaves and Alonso joins. That would not make Massa's life one bit easier.

Aim for the sky!

When in doubt, flat out!
User currently offlinePhotopilot From Canada, joined Jul 2002, 3164 posts, RR: 15
Reply 5, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4710 times:

Finally, the circus is headed back to perhaps the greatest road course in the world. To my mind, it's truly what an F1 track should be. My only hope is that the race is decided by the drivers on the track, not the weather. Either a fully wet race or a dry race, but not a race with the tire guessing game due to changing conditions.

Personally, would like to see Massa win just to bring the championship even closer.

User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17800 posts, RR: 10
Reply 6, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4709 times:

Quoting Photopilot (Reply 5):
Finally, the circus is headed back to perhaps the greatest road course in the world. To my mind, it's truly what an F1 track should be

Agree with you. This track is one of my favorites.

We have for sure a really interesting GP ahead of us. And Monza is just a week after Spa so we will have a hectic but interesting time ahead of us.
Kimi needs to win this one if he dont want to be Ferraris 2nd driver. He can get it all on track if he wins this one and Monza one week later. That would just show that he is still a contender of the WDC.

And I pray to God that we wont see any more Ferrari engines blow up this time.

Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineB747forever From Sweden, joined May 2007, 17800 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 4689 times:

Quoting Sudden (Thread starter):
and he have clearly stated that he has not lost his motivation to win.

Yes that is true. Here is a link to that article http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2008/8/8281.html

Work Hard, Fly Right
User currently offlineScrubbsYWG From Canada, joined Mar 2007, 1496 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (7 years 9 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 4686 times:

ahhh, i love the spa track. It is one i always look forward to during the f1 season.

User currently offlineBlueElephant From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2006, 1817 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (7 years 9 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 4643 times:

Wow..its been 8 replies...

Kimi's 2007 Pole....

User currently offlineSudden From Sweden, joined Jul 2001, 4169 posts, RR: 5
Reply 10, posted (7 years 9 months 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 4601 times:

The race is on in regards to take over Vettel's seat next year at STR.

Buemi and Sato are to test now, and I actually hope that Sato will be the one on the grid next year as he really drove well up until the very end for SA.
Would also like to see Sutil give this a shot as I think he deserves better. Klien also want's to get back in the action, so maybe he will try to test as well.
SIlly season has started!

Aim for the sky!

When in doubt, flat out!
User currently offlineWaterpolodan From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1672 posts, RR: 4
Reply 11, posted (7 years 9 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 4595 times:

Quoting Sudden (Thread starter):
As you could see, Schumi was again attending the race, and made the stupid comment by saying that he stopped racing to not stand in Massa's way. Strange that he never said this earlier, but now when Massa happens to be on a hype. Lets see how long this hype lasts, shall we!?

Why would he have any reason to say anything about that at all if it wasn't true? He and Massa are very close, and it was long known that Ferrari had signed Kimi before Michael made his decision, which put him in a tough place. Go out on top and leave the seat to Massa, or remain, send his friend to a lesser team or a test role, and possibly get beaten by a younger Raikkonen. He made the right decision, IMO, as he went out on top with that exceptional comeback drive in Brazil, and Massa has matured into a better driver than Kimi even, and in my mind the 2nd best in the world, just a smidgen off of Hamilton. This isn't some stunt by Michael to gain publicity, he doens't seek it, he was just honest in an interview and it has been long enough that he can speak candidly about what happened at the end of 2006.

Quoting Flyboysp (Reply 2):
I'm already thinking in my mind how they will be behaving at the La Source hairpin at the start.Imagine all the body work flying around Wow!

They massively reprofiled the La Source section last year, so those huge pileups like the amazing start in '98 are hopefully a thing of the past with the wider entry and exit and a less tight hairpin.

User currently offlineSudden From Sweden, joined Jul 2001, 4169 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (7 years 9 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4582 times:

Quoting Waterpolodan (Reply 11):
Why would he have any reason to say anything about that at all if it wasn't true?

But why until now when Massa is doing good (for a change)? He would never had made that comment if Massa still was driving in the shadow of Kimi. If Kimi to find his form back, Massa will again have to face the facts, which are that he is not that good. If he drives in clean air he sure is fast, but in traffic he's not.
Still, I will not take anything from Massa cause he have for sure shaped up.

Quoting Waterpolodan (Reply 11):
They massively reprofiled the La Source section last year, so those huge pileups like the amazing start in '98 are hopefully a thing of the past with the wider entry and exit and a less tight hairpin.

That section of the track was made wider for the drivers to have more room to play with. Alonso used it to the max last year when pushing Hamilton way out after the start.  Smile

Aim for the sky!

When in doubt, flat out!
User currently offlineAerobalance From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 4696 posts, RR: 42
Reply 13, posted (7 years 9 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4579 times:

Massa will be on the second race of his engine, it will blowup in this race as it did in Budapest and as did Kimi's engine in Valencia (also it's second race). Ferrari's pace of development has sacrificed reliability for performance to stay ahead of McLaren, yet one can not stay ahead if they do not finish...

Kimi should win at Spa with the fresh engine but Hamilton will win the championship by racking up second place positions from here on out.

"Sing a song, play guitar, make it snappy..."
User currently offlineLarshjort From Denmark, joined Dec 2007, 1957 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (7 years 9 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4575 times:

woohoo time to watch F1 in the cinema again  highfive 

Looking forward to an interesting race hopefully without rain and a red 1-2 finish with Massa in front.


139, 306, 319, 320, 321, 332, 34A, AN2, AT4, AT5, AT7, 733, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 146, AR1, BH2, CN1, CR2, DH1, DH3, DH4,
User currently offlineHT From Germany, joined May 2005, 6526 posts, RR: 19
Reply 15, posted (7 years 9 months 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 4569 times:

The track is a real bummer. Watching cars going through Eau Rouge is among the top highlights of the year.
While I have some favourites among the drivers & teams, I hope for a very interesting race.

Carpe diem ! Life is too short to waste your time ! Keep in mind, that today is the first day of the rest of your life !
User currently offlineLTU932 From Costa Rica, joined Jan 2006, 14297 posts, RR: 46
Reply 16, posted (7 years 9 months 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 4554 times:

Quoting Larshjort (Reply 14):
Looking forward to an interesting race hopefully without rain

What? I say bring on the rain, because when it rains, F1 becomes much more exiting and unpredictable. I mean, under "optimal" conditions, nothing exiting ever happens, but when it rains, that's where the true skills of the drivers come to life. Just remember how well Sebastian Vettel did last time around when they raced in the rain.

It's sad but in F1, because of how predictable it is, lots of talent gets wasted.

User currently offlineSudden From Sweden, joined Jul 2001, 4169 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (7 years 9 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 4548 times:

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 16):
It's sad but in F1, because of how predictable it is, lots of talent gets wasted.

See your point there, but I would also add that in the rain speed is not really a major factor, but more how the cars are handling in those conditions. Teams that are usually not seen up front have a big chance to show off as well, and lets not forget the strategy applied. Just look at Honda back at Silverstone.

So rain at Spa would be a nice addition as the track is fast with high speed corners, which could let us see some nice surprises.

Aim for the sky!

When in doubt, flat out!
User currently offlineBill142 From Australia, joined Aug 2004, 8508 posts, RR: 8
Reply 18, posted (7 years 9 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 4539 times:

Kovalinen is going to storm though for his second win of the season!  wink 

Rain is always a possibility at this track and it usually comes it fast, without warning. The teams will need to make sure their meteorologists their high tech equipment are on the ball. Some teams might like to employ the lower tech 'Eddie Jordan Doppler Radar' which involves sending a man with a radio up the hill and to call in when the rain is coming.

User currently offlineStealthZ From Australia, joined Feb 2005, 5898 posts, RR: 38
Reply 19, posted (7 years 9 months 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 4533 times:
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Quoting Aerobalance (Reply 13):
Ferrari's pace of development has sacrificed reliability for performance

There it is, someone finally said it.... "Ferrari's pace of development"

Hello!!!! There is not supposed to be any development...

The evidence seems to point to one rule for the red cars and one for the rest... again!

[Edited 2008-09-03 02:27:53]

If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!
User currently offlineAerobalance From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 4696 posts, RR: 42
Reply 20, posted (7 years 9 months 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 4510 times:

Quoting StealthZ (Reply 19):
"Ferrari's pace of development"

You need to read the rules, there is some development related to the engine allowed (mainly auxillary systems and such), however, not to the point that you are thinking.

"Sing a song, play guitar, make it snappy..."
User currently offlineStealthZ From Australia, joined Feb 2005, 5898 posts, RR: 38
Reply 21, posted (7 years 9 months 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 4494 times:
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Quoting Aerobalance (Reply 20):
You need to read the rules,

Ah, but I have.


1. A homologated engine is an engine identical in every respect to either :
(i) An engine delivered to the FIA no later than 31 March 2008*.
Other than the specific exceptions below, any such engine must include all the parts described in Article 5.4.4 of the 2008 F1 Technical Regulations and be identical to one which completed two race Events during the 2007 Championship season.
The exceptions are :
a) the homologated parts of the intake system up to and including the air filter, fuel rail and injectors, ignition coils, engine mounted sensors and wiring, alternator, coolant pumps and oil pumps need not be identical to the parts used during the 2007 Championship season ;
b) three different designs of intake trumpet may be homologated no later than 31 March 2008 and used freely during the homologation period ;
c) parts solely associated with engine installation in different makes of car and which have no direct performance benefit, which may be changed from time to time during the homologation period with the consent of the FIA.
Once homologated in accordance with the above, and subject to (iii) below, no changes may be made to the design or construction of the homologated parts for the duration of the homologation period laid out in Article 28.5 of the 2008 F1 Sporting Regulations.

There seems little in those few words to allow the Scuderia the freedom for such development that might suddenly cause the failures seen in the last couple of races.
Perhaps they have reduced the coolant or oil punps to beyond the minimum needed.


If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!
User currently offlineAerobalance From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 4696 posts, RR: 42
Reply 22, posted (7 years 9 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 4484 times:

Quoting StealthZ (Reply 21):
Perhaps they have reduced the coolant or oil pumps to beyond the minimum needed.

With the limited amount of freedom they have in developing engine related systems (because of the rules), I'm thinking the same thing, less parasitic loss due to tinkering with the engine lubrication systems and higher engine temperatures. Also, developing body work to limit the amount of airflow entering the coolant ducts (planned or not planned) could be an occurrence. Do you think Ferrari will ever tell us?! lol  Smile

Great job checking out the rules!

IF Massa's engine doesn't fail at Spa then maybe Ferrari has a handle on the problem, we'll see  Smile

"Sing a song, play guitar, make it snappy..."
User currently offlineAerobalance From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 4696 posts, RR: 42
Reply 23, posted (7 years 9 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 4475 times:

Quoting Aerobalance (Reply 22):
IF Massa's engine doesn't fail at Spa then maybe Ferrari has a handle on the problem, we'll see

Ok, I just read from Ferrari that they have isolated the problem with the engines connecting rods failing and that their con-rod supplier - Pankl - have corrected the problem. The problem was discovered before Valencia and Massa's engine has the updated pieces. Kimi's new engine has the updates - yet the team knowingly let him race in Valencia with the crap pieces, why not change the engine and take the 10 place grid penalty? Ferrari and their Italian management is so hilariously odd! Back to the 80's and 90's mentality!

"Sing a song, play guitar, make it snappy..."
User currently offlineBaroque From Australia, joined Apr 2006, 15380 posts, RR: 59
Reply 24, posted (7 years 9 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 4468 times:

Quoting StealthZ (Reply 21):
Ah, but I have.

Most illuminating. Thanks.

25 Sudden : I don't see that as an option on a track as Valencia as overtaking is more or less impossible. So to take a 10 place grid penalty and try to work his
26 Post contains links BlueElephant : http://www.planetf1.com/story/0,18954,3213_4093737,00.html Weather Report for SPA.....hmmm...should make for an interesting Qualifying...and possibly
27 LTU932 : Correct. I don't dispute that. Yes, but don't forget also driver's skills.
28 MadameConcorde : Qoting the PlanetF1 site: "The wet weather poses a rather unique challenge at the Spa-Francorchamps circuit as given it's 7km length rain can often fa
29 Waterpolodan : Uh oh, Ferrari conspiracy theorists in force again! True or false- There have been other engine failures with engines from other manufacturers this y
30 Post contains links Sudden : Well said! Just to add to this whole Ferrari thing; All the teams, Ferrari included, sure tryes to find their way around the rules, and if one of the
31 StealthZ : Yes there have.. but! Ferrari have enjoyed in recent times an almost unprecedented level of mechanical reliablity. With a freeze on engine developmen
32 Baroque : Go Madame Concorde, cos if she is successful it follows!!!!!
33 Post contains links and images Bill142 : I got an email from McLaren about the new footwear range they have in their store. In it was this image of Lewis. I'm wondering if they've gotten a bo
34 Flyboysp : Here are session results for practice 1. 1 2 Felipe Massa Ferrari 1:47.284 26 2 1 Kimi Räikkönen Ferrari 1:47.623 0.339 26 3 22 Lewis Hamilton McLar
35 Waterpolodan : Looking good for another Massa pole tomorrow
36 BlueElephant : ....ANNND que the Rain....and Massa's chances at pole go away. Slippery Conditions anywhere and Massa's in trouble....I don't think I've seen him fav
37 Flyboysp : And here are practice 2 results 1 5 Fernando Alonso Renault 1:48.454 21 2 2 Felipe Massa Ferrari 1:48.504 0.050 16 3 23 Heikki Kovalainen McLaren-Merc
38 MadameConcorde : Practice session results can give some idea of the race but no more than that. Tomorrow will be more important with the qualiflying. The weather (and
39 Boeing74741R : Which means that Ferrari are hitting the right notes in terms of reliability, and is something that the other teams and anti-Ferrari fans will have t
40 Sudden : What is worth to mention here is that second session were a wet one. Although not full wet, but it came a shower where many of the toprunners made er
41 Sudden : Quali about to start now, and I say that the 4 first positions will looks as follows: 1. Massa 2. Kimi 3. Kova 4. Hamilton Lets see where we end up. A
42 MadameConcorde : Results: 1. Hamilton 2. Massa 3. Kovalainen Go Hammy! You're the Best!!!!! I know you can win this one tomorrow!!!!
43 Sudden : On a track like Spa I would really not say too much just yet. I actually think that Kimi will pull something out of the hat for this one in regards t
44 BlueElephant : Congrats to Lewis for the Pole..but something tells me the McLarens are lighter and the Ferrari's are a couple laps heavier on fuel...anyone have any
45 Sudden : I think Hamilton has a new engine as well. Engine has to do 2 races, and gearbox 5. In regards to the grid and who starts where, as far I remember wi
46 EZEIZA : Hammy is for sure having some winners luck this season. I'm so pissed off right now ... I feel so bad for Kimi ... he did a very good race, and he mig
47 Baroque : Holy heck. Lead all over the shop on lap 43. Even part way through 44 not clear. Phew. You cut it a bit fine MadameC!!
48 BlueElephant : Guys....In the United States....we call that... a ClusterF*ck I'm still trying to get over it...Mixed Emotions...I would have rather Kimi won then Mas
49 Sudden : Championship drive all the way up until he basically screwed it up and handed Hamilton the win. How embarrasing. Kimi will most likely have to play th
50 Sudden : The issue is under investigation by FIA. It starts to get pretty ennoying to see Anthony Hamilton in the garage at every damn race! I mean, can't he
51 MadameConcorde : Holy Moses! What a race!! I knew he would get Kimi in the end. The way he got him out was simply unbelievable! I was simply... mesmerized. Hamilton is
52 WithaK : Wasn't Kimi's car still causing a yellow flag on parts of the track? Does anyone think Heidfeld or Alonso could have some troubles with this after the
53 Davehammer : There was so much all over the place that it will be difficult to make sense of what happened without effectively rendering most of the race null and
54 MadameConcorde : I felt there was so much pressure on all sides. Not an easy race and it looked so incredibly fast all along especially the first 3 drivers, that and t
55 Baroque : I would never have guessed, MC! But since you obviously script these things, could you just tone down a bit on the suspense. A few races ago, it was
56 B747forever : He, he. So I am not the only one that notice that too. True. He is 23points after Hamilton now. Massa is only 7.
57 Flyboysp : I cant honestly see why Hamilton is under investigation. There were a few bumps between them, and when Hamilton cut the chicane, he gave the position
58 Scbriml : Two blown engines in two races is "hitting the right notes"?
59 Scbriml : Wow, an amazing race. All action at the start, steady middle, then chaos in the last 3 laps. I lost count how many times the lead changed in those las
60 Sudden : How would you even be able to think that he would get Kimi in the end as he was controling the race!? Everytime Hamilton set fastest lap, Kimi answer
61 Sudden : He didn't as he gave the position back right away, end of story. Kimi might just want to make it a bit more interesting then last year as at this poi
62 Post contains links Moo : From what I've read, *both* Hamilton and Raikkonen are under investigation - not just Hamilton. Here is what Ron Dennis has to say on the matter: htt
63 Baroque : You might think that the car that seemed not to have any front wings before meeting some concrete going in the opposite direction, just might have mo
64 Moo : According to BBC news Hamilton has been stripped of his win. Arse.
65 Post contains links Moo : http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7602830.stm Thats it, I've had it with F1. Thats one of the harshest penalties they have given
66 Gman94 : Absolute nonsense by the FIA, Ferrari come out on top as usual. Hamilton let Raikkonen back passed and then overtook him again. I'm sure there will be
67 MadameConcorde : Oh... this is awful... It seems so unfair! Can't McLaren appeal the decision? Where will he stand in the championship now? I guess this will take som
68 TristarAtLCA : I just heard it on the radio. Utterly ridiculous. He got a drive through penalty when he did not concede a place before and gets the equivalent in ti
69 Post contains links Scbriml : http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?id=43853 No! This is a joke, the race was decided fairly on the track. That's an appalling decision by the ste
70 Moo : The issue is that he *did* concede the place back, and the race director confirmed that that was probably all that was necessary. This penalty is off
71 TristarAtLCA : Absolutely Moo. He got a drive through in France for not conceding a place and is penalised for conceding a place? What the bloody hell did these ste
72 Mhodgson : What a joke - what has Hamilton supposed to do; follow Raikkonen round in a nice procession? Considering Raikkonen DID get the place back again when t
73 Moo : Its worth noting that that was not when Raikkonen got the place back - Hamilton gave the place back after the chicane voluntarily, and he was passed
74 Baroque : What was Kimi doing to lose his front wings. Crashing into the back of Hamilton is what as far as I could see. But that is OK. Racing incident of cour
75 Alessandro : Glock lost his point as well. F1 is politics....
76 TristarAtLCA : Glock was penalised for passing under a yellow. That was a clear infraction. Hamilton was docked for doing the opposite of what he was penalised for
77 NA : I think that the penalty is too harsh. It was not all fair what Hamilton did towards the end, and luck comes to it, too, but if anything they should h
78 MadameConcorde : I still can't understand the stewards logic. Where is he at with the points after the "punishment"? Will McLaren be able to appeal the stewards decis
79 ScrubbsYWG : hamilton 76 mass 74 and of course they will appeal
80 B747forever : so the driver standings look like this now; Hamilton 76 Massa 74 Only 2pts as from the original 8pts between Hamilton/Massa I wonder if Kimi will have
81 SandroZRH : heidfeld pitting in the second last lap and getting third place with new tires sure was the "play of the day" (as they call it on CNN). But i guess wi
82 Photopilot : Excuse me, but Kimi had the "Racing Line" through the bustop chicane. It is up to Hamilton to find a way around Kimi and on the second half of the ch
83 SAS A340 : This is a big pile of crap!!! What was he supposed to do? Fly?? He did let him pas right? Ferrari always make it,one way ore another!!!
84 Moo : I don't have 'Lewis worship' - I just don't hate him... Ferrari is not gods gift to Formula One.
85 Gman94 : Er no. Hamilton letting Raikkonen back past meant that he would of had to of slowed his place. The reason that Hamilton overtook Raikkonen at the nex
86 TristarAtLCA : Thats funny, it really is. What happened after Hamilton let Raikkonen pass is not the issue of the penalty. Oddly enough, if Raikkonen had maintained
87 Sudden : Forcing!? That's racing right there, and you can be sure that Hamilton, Alonso, Kova, Rosberg etc. etc. would have done just the same thing! Kimi did
88 Post contains links Scbriml : McLaren have announced they intend to appeal the decision. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7602830.stm
89 LTU932 : This somehow proves what F1 has become. It has become not only politics, but also boring. Unless there is rain, a race is decided by the time the thi
90 B747forever : " target=_blank>http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/moto...0.stm Of course they will appeal this. They will never just let this go. But I doubt that any
91 Mhodgson : But Hamilton still lost momentum as he would have had to let off the accelerator - Kimi could have just steamed on. But because of the conditions he
92 Astuteman : They certainly will given the subsequent decision.. Me too. It's a bloody circus. Driver skill? Who gives 2 f**ks? Ah, but does it add to the circus?
93 Codeshare : That was a fantastic final laps of the race with everything changing like on a roulette. When it looked like finally Kimi was going to get a win... ba
94 Post contains links Boeing74741R : Pleased to read that the Hamilton Hype is prevalent outside of the UK, saved me from going insane. I was referring to Ferrari's otherwise excellent r
95 Post contains links SlamClick : This is just getting embarassing. Why doesn't the FIA just declare Ferrari to be the all-time grand champion of the universe at all sports including t
96 Moo : From MacLaren -
97 NA : I guess it can well be said that if Ferrari withdraws from F1, that sport is dead, or at least, worth only half as much. That said, I still think all
98 Gman94 : Numerous incidents over the years that Ferrari don't get punished for but the other teams do. Don't let the evidence get in the way of your pro Ferra
99 StealthZ : Me in fact.. but you misinterpreted My comment about their impressive reliability in recent times, which I admire them for, was used to illustrate ho
100 Bill142 : Again, the FIA is engineering a result. Why do all these things happen towards the end of the season? Nothing ever gets penalised at the beginning of
101 BlueElephant : Mosley is English, but has been Quoted as saying that he would act in Ferrari's favor. I am absolutely convinced...that Hamilton gave back the positi
102 Legoguy : Sorry to wade into this topic late (I missed the Grandprix due to Airshow) however, if the above is true then the penalty is bullshit. There is absol
103 Post contains links BlueElephant : My Friend...Please Allow me to quote from the following Article. http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/241020...errari-most-important-team-f1.html (Please ta
104 DavestanKSAN : It's his bloody son for God's sakes. He is also his manager. I suppose you don't mind when they show Felipe Massa's father at almost every race as we
105 Post contains links BlueElephant : To all F1 Fans...who understand the Truth of the Stupidity in this Decision... I present to you... http://www.petitiononline.com/belgp08/petition.html
106 Waterpolodan : I'm as big a Massa and Ferrari fan as anyone out there, and I think this penalty is quite simply UTTER BS. I enjoyed every second of that race, and I
107 EZEIZA : That's a fact. It's the only team with true fans, regardless of who is driving for the team also true, but I don0t think Ferrari fans think that who
108 Post contains links Baroque : Thanks. #5825 FYI. to you Blue and to you know who! From the BBC: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7603179.stm Returning to the
109 Scbriml : Anyone with eyes (or even a single one!) could see he did. Sadly, In fact, Raikkonen was behind Hamilton when he had the argument with the wall. Raik
110 StealthZ : I don't get this part... Ron Dennis claims he was told by race director Charlie Whiting that he deemed Lewis's move as legal. If that is so how does o
111 Madameconcorde : Thanks BlueElephant for posting the petition on line. I will pass it around. Now I must catch up with all unread postings. What they have done to Hami
112 Astuteman : Perfectly summarising the difference in approach in the wet.. Anyone who thinks that Hamilton staying behind Rakonnen into turn 1 would have changed
113 MadameConcorde : Good video of the events here:
114 Baroque : Close AND alongside! However are you sure who will end up having the red eyes? Weeping does that to us blue eyed folk.
115 Post contains links Scbriml : To be fair, having asked race director Charlie Whiting for clarification, Ron Dennis did say that Whiting could only "express an opinion". Even so, t
116 StealthZ : If it is his role to request an investigation or other action then he does not have an opinion, he should either say definitively or say nothing. Not
117 Oly720man : As an impartial observer who missed the race and had to watch the highlights to see what all the fuss was about I can't see that LH did anything wrong
118 Bill142 : The race stewards. Do you really think Mosley makes these calls? Of course not. It wouldn't be the first time the race stewards have changed a decisi
119 Scbriml : Ferrari claim they did not ask the stewards to investigate this incident. Given that they, and one of their drivers, benefited from the ruling, I'd e
120 Springbok747 : Hamilton clearly had no intention of backing down. I still think he gained by cutting across (granted, he did not have anywhere else to go with Kimi
121 MadameConcorde : More so than ridiculous. It's totally biased and a scandal. Looks like all of them do not like Hamilton and are bugged to see him doing so well again
122 Gman94 : That little trick as you put meant that he had to back off and allow Kimi back through, how else would Kimi of got passed him? The reason that Hamilt
123 Post contains links Sudden : To make the WDC evenmore interesting!? As a lot of you have said already, it's biased what have happened, and I see this as a follow up on what happe
124 StealthZ : I trust not, If the authorities are carrying on a vendetta based on the events of 2007 they need to be fired NOW and not allowed back to any race cir
125 BlueElephant : I have a question here for some of you Ferrari Fans out there (Mainly those defending the Stewards decision...EZEIZA) Had the situation been reversed.
126 Legoguy : Hungary 2006; No penalty for Schumacher as he retired. So why a penalty for Hamilton whose supposed advantage was whipped out when Kimi went nose firs
127 Baroque : Interesting "intervention" went back again to ponder and "we are sorry, video no longer available". Damn, why did I kill my perfectly good recording?
128 Post contains links BlueElephant : http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/70421 "Random" Engine Check for Massa. I bet the FIA is doing these "random" checks to make everyone feel
129 Scbriml : Yes, it seems all the recent GP vids are being taken down "for copyright violations".
130 Baroque : I can hear a band playing in the distance. Now what IS that tune? Sounds like "Believe it if you like" If only I had not ditched my copy. At least I
131 Post contains links Scbriml : You could try watching the "Spa Controversy" video on ITV's website: http://www.itv-f1.com/VideoHighlights.aspx I don't know if you can view these ou
132 MadameConcorde : Oh crap... they took it down. I should have downloaded it... my bad!
133 EZEIZA : Ok Bill, it's that you said "corrupt Italians" and that's no appreciated. If you would even care to read my post, I DID say that Hammy had some sort
134 Post contains links MadameConcorde : Was this posted? From The Times September 8, 2008 Lewis Hamilton must not let the Spa stewards get him down Briton produced one of his most daring per
135 Post contains links Gman94 : Niki Lauda someone who knows a little bit a Formula 1 has said that the penalty against Hamilton is completely wrong. Full interview can be heard here
136 Post contains links Rockson : And you can base this on seeing two drivers driving two different cars in wet conditions on dries? And how can some people here blame Kimi? He just h
137 Astuteman : Silverstone would seem to support the theorem...... Rgds
138 Scbriml : I don't recall anyone saying it's Raikkonen's fault that Hamilton was penalised! Raikkonen held a reasonable racing line in to the chicane (given tha
139 Rockson : Well, not directly. But comments like the one below are just silly. I'ts goddamn racing we are talking about. I recall some calling Hamilton hitting
140 StealthZ : Fourth player-- The decision to penalise a driver is made by the stewards one from the host country and 2 others. There is however a fourth player, a
141 Sudden : Well, don't pay too much attention to what Moo types as he obviously don't know much about racing seeing his earlier posts in other F1 threads. In an
142 Moo : Yeah, obviously I don't know anything about racing If you don't like someone elses opinion, stfu.
143 Boeing74741R : Myth. I've seen more shots of Hamilton Snr than Massa Snr, so to me it suggests there is more bias and media attention towards the Hamilton's than th
144 EZEIZA : He's been unlucky this season. Either the engine blew up, or rain came at the worst moment, or he gets crashed into in the pit lane ... it's just not
145 Springbok747 : Actually, after watching this 'incident' again, I have changed my mind. Hamilton could have slipped in behind Kimi at the chicane. Instead (probably
146 BlueElephant : If that had been Gravel he'd have gotten stuck Because ...Kimi and Hamilton actually touched wheels in that corner, thats part of the reason why he w
147 Gman94 : Er no, Massa nearly takes out Sutil in the pits at Valencia and gets a fine for something that is downright dangerous, Kimi injures one of his pit cr
148 Legoguy : You're judging Moo by one incorrect post. With all due respect, everybody is entitled to their own opinions. If you don't like their opinions, don't
149 EZEIZA : Ok, seriously, what part don't you get?? I said he got an advantage but that the penalty is harsh. Did I write in Spanish or you0re just not getting
150 Springbok747 : Yes. Yeah, for a nanosecond. The very fact that he got back on Kimi's slipstream so quickly was because he was carrying momentum gained from that lit
151 Post contains links Legoguy : Sorry I don't quite understand. Hamilton lifted his foot off the accelerator after the corner thus loosing any momentum gained by cutting the corner.
152 Post contains links BlueElephant : Hmm...really?...just a one word response?...I'm glad you said yes...but seeing as you did....Schumi outright cheated and he wasn't penalized...and wh
153 StealthZ : You might want to start a new thread if you want to start discussing the injustices and shear travesty of that situation. An employee of Ferrari stea
154 BlueElephant : Here's a nice Metaphorical Story to explain all of what happened last year. There' a Professor, a TA and a Student... the TA goes to the Student and
155 EZEIZA : I will. Yes, he should have. But is that the only time F1 officials have screwed up? You can post all the videos you want, but officials have made ba
156 BlueElephant : No boss...I got that mate...I knew that the first time...but then you said he should have been Fined...because he did something wrong...Thats what i'
157 EZEIZA : There's where I'm not 100% sure it was 100% right. I don't know exactly how to explain, but it didn't look right the first time. I STILL think that t
158 LTU932 : From what I've seen in the video: The gain Hamilton had from having involuntarily cut through the chicane was minimal at best. He gave that mininal a
159 BlueElephant : Hamilton would have been up by 8 points on Massa and...23 pts ahead of Kimi...instead he is only 2 points ahead on Massa....6 points is HUGE when eve
160 BlueElephant : He's good friends with Max Mosely...who's been quoted as saying that he'll make decision "in the best interest" of Ferrari. Its quoted in an article
161 LTU932 : True. Maybe that's also how Max stayed in power after the Nazi-Scandal, because he never lost the backing of Luca di Montezemolo, and he maybe helped
162 StealthZ : What is funny is that despite this being the accepted practise, I can't find where it actually says that. From the FIA F1 Sporting code 2008- I would
163 Baroque : That is hilarious. "Only the track" that presumably could mean just about all the finishers could be disqualified, although of course we don't actual
164 EZEIZA : Why? It's a somewhat similar case ... Hammilton let Kimi pass in front again and Massa did the same. Yeah, but like someone posted earlier, maybe a b
165 Rockson : Wouldn't it be better if he took som lessons from Hamilton instead? I mean, Hamilton recently said "- I'm no No 2, whoever you put me next to - even
166 Sudden : Everybody is indeed entitled to their opinion, me included, and I didn't base my comment upon that specific post only. I'm not going to take up websp
167 Scbriml : There's a huge difference between a 2-point lead and an 8-point lead with just 5 races to go! If left as-is, the result also represents a 2-win swing
168 BlueElephant : Massa was released by his team very dangerously....Massa's Team should have WAITED to release Him until after Sutil passed....This is why everyone el
169 Rockson : Really? I thought it was because they spyed on Ferrari...
170 Post contains links BlueElephant : For that Particular Race...they got all their Constructor Points taken away. In other News...all three Stewarts for this race are going to be Italian
171 Gman94 : Massa also used the run off at La Source on the opening lap but no penalty for him either.
172 StealthZ : Certainly one of them will be, possibly two. I doubt that the FIA is stupid enough* to allow all three to be Italian. One Steward represents the loca
173 Baroque : Keep up the information flow BlueE, but one bit I would like is when is the appeal to be heard? I would love to see a count back for five years elimi
174 Post contains links Flyboysp : It's appearing to be doubtful that McLaren will appeal at all.. http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/080909103423.shtml It looks like th
175 Scbriml : Why would they do that? That's the FIA, not you!
176 Post contains links and images Scbriml : McLaren may not be able to appeal. http://www.setantasports.com/en/Spor...in-locale/sport-space/motorsports/ Massa thinks Hamilton's penalty was justi
177 EZEIZA : But there lies the biggest difference with this incident. Let's assume Hammilton did make an illegal move (not saying he did!), it's 100% driver faul
178 Scbriml : Yes, but it's not as though that punishment meant anything - it was the last race of the season and he'd already lost the championship. We'll never k
179 Baroque : " target=_blank>http://www.setantasports.com/en/Spor...orts/ So what part of going behind KR from the RHS to the LHS and then passing him was not giv
180 Post contains links BlueElephant : http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/70442 McLaren to Appeal Good Luck! And I think with that shall we move on to a new thread for Monza?
181 Post contains links BlueElephant : http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/70443 How about some more interesting News...THE FIA TOLD McLAREN...that the Move was ok...DURING THE RACE
182 Legoguy : Not only once, but twice. Contradiction between FIA members at it's best.
183 Scbriml : In fact, it's all coming back now, the punishment was even less meaningful than I earlier indicated. Although he was disqualified from the completed
184 Post contains links Rockson : Sorry if posted before, but here's the situation from Hamilton's car: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x6o...wwformulamagcom-hamiltonkimi_sport
185 Astuteman : Says it all, really.............
186 Moo : Wow, how long was Raikkonen on that high grip escape area for? From 2.15 to 2.23, ample opportunity to come back to the racing surface well before an
187 BlueElephant : Yeah and in the rain...its a lot easier to pickup speed on a unused part of a track...Which has a bigger radius... And take a look how much distance
188 Boeing74741R : I thought I'd explained it more clearly in my first post, let me explain it again... MYTH!
189 StealthZ : No you hadn't, you had only espoused your one sided and somewhat blinkered view of the world. Check the history, hell even only 10-12 years or so, ev
190 Ncfc99 : I have seen this said a few times in this thread. KR had no right to the racing line, no driver has a right to the racing line. LH went around the ou
191 EZEIZA : Agreed, and that question is valid. However, for what its worth, it created a precedent. Correct me if I'm wrong (honestly don't know), but afaik Sen
192 StealthZ : Here is an idea, a hindsight one at that!! Maybe the stewards should have decided on a drive through for Lewis before the end of the race and he could
193 BlueElephant : At this point...its going to VERY VERY hard for Massa to win by a 12 point Advantage....Thats asking Hamilton to score at least 2 or 3 places below M
194 DavestanKSAN : I think this says it all about your posts to be honest.... Dave
195 EZEIZA : Why? At this point in the season I think the only way LH won't take the championship is if the team starts screwing up. As a driver I see him much st
196 Gman94 : Appeal or no appeal I hope on Sunday that Hamilton destroys Ferrari at the their hometrack and has the Ferrari fans crying, note I said Ferrari fans
197 EZEIZA : based on ... ?
198 BlueElephant : You know what...It's people like you that have Tarnished the reputation of Ferrari... You do realize that you're wishing ill of another driver just s
199 BlueElephant : You know a friend of mine and I had a conversation about that today. It was quite interesting...seeing as IF Ferrari really had a problem with Hamilt
200 EZEIZA : Sorry my friend but you're getting the wrong idea. Of course I'm a Ferrari fan, but I must have not been clear enough. I mentioned over and over agai
201 Rockson : Well he could have hit the breaks to get in behind Kimi. That is what he would have done had it been gravel instead of asphalt on the run-off area. I
202 Baroque : Well if it did not have a history before this last race, it certainly does now!! Not perhaps the one it would have liked. Certainly not for this spec
203 MadameConcorde : Oh no! Not at all. You're 100¨% mistaken. I don't like to see any drivers crashing. This can kill them or injure them to the max. I am not like that
204 Scbriml : Schumacher's punishment was meaningless and, some would argue, the only precedent it set was for handing Ferrari and its drivers meaningless penaltie
205 Bill142 : You're an idiot.
206 MadameConcorde : what an awful thing to say. I wonder what the "or something" means... Hamilton is a brilliant successful black kid. It sure seems to bother many in t
207 T1210s : Well they certinly didnt have a gold pass in 1989 when they had the WDC stolen off them by Senna and Mclaren at suzuka
208 Scbriml : It's entirely possible that the joy of the McLaren mechanics was in response to Hamilton overtaking Raikkonen. We are at the mercy of the TV director
209 EZEIZA : Despite crashing has been a part of racing, and it will always happen, just to make myself clear, I mentioned LH's engine, I never said I wanted him
210 EZEIZA : what deep thoughts ....
211 EZEIZA : Excuse be but do not pull the race card here. Wha do you have to specify he's a "successful BLACK kid"? What difference does it make???? He's a succe
212 Post contains links Scbriml : McLaren lodge appeal. http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2008/9/8344.html http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7603179.stm *****
213 Bill142 : I don't think race is a motivator in EZEIZA's comments, or any one here's anti-Hamilton comments for that matter. Max Mosley took over in 1993.
214 Bill142 : I wouldn't waste valuable time on childish thoughts. I thought we had moved on from the comments such as "I hope Driver x Crashes or their engine blo
215 MadameConcorde : Oh, allright.
216 Sudden : Me too thought we agreed on not posting these kind of things as we, what I assume, are fans of the F1 sport, and want to see good fights on the track
217 EZEIZA : Ok, since you're not getting my point, I hope LH scores the less amount of points possible in order for the team I support to have a chance of winnin
218 Moo : Your team can be better at their jobs than Hamilton and McLaren....
219 Scbriml : The only reason?
220 Gman94 : Oh I see the reason Hamilton is leading the championship is because Ferrari have messed up and not McLaren or Hamilton outperforming them, interestin
221 EZEIZA : It's the same thing! If one outperforms the other its because the other is doing something wrong. I think we're all saying the same thing and I'm pro
222 Boeing74741R : I wouldn't say he is currently the best F1 driver. I'd say he's within the mix of the best current drivers. If he wins the WDC on the other hand, the
223 Bill142 : Perhaps Kimi or Felipe could out drive Lewis? If Ferrari fans are needing to cling onto the hope that Lewis needs to DNF for their drivers to have an
224 Baroque : You are right in assuming I did miss that video and yes it is an amazing video. How did they manage to remain near the track in those conditions. Nea
225 EZEIZA : On dry conditions, and assuming you don't have a Ferrari engine blowing up, I think both Kimi or Massa are more than capable of beating Lewis, but if
226 NA : These are two out of three reasons why Lewis is leading. Ferraris 2008 engine is less reliable than its forerunners (in recent years the Ferrari engi
227 BlueElephant : Not at all...I thought he drove that race brilliantly...and he really deserved to win...It was a Shame....As it was a Shame for Kimi because he drove
228 EZEIZA : I agree with everything you posted He's won 4 races, so he must be doing something right, but no, so far Lewis is outperforming Massa and Kimi by a s
229 Post contains links Scbriml : On some tracks yes, on other tracks Hamilton is more than capable of beating Massa and Raikkonen. I'm not sure what your point is. My personal opinio
230 Post contains images Scbriml : Dear B Wildered, As you can see from these images, I think I still had my front wing. Chasing Hamilton: Chasing Hamiton after we nearly crashed with
231 EZEIZA : Well, what i was trying to say was, but you put the right word yeah, they are all capable of winning, with however an advantage under rain conditions
232 Scbriml :
233 Baroque : Dear Kimi Thanks for the nice pics. I am sure they have a treasured place in your very nice photo album. Struggling through my red:green colour blind
234 Scbriml : Dear B Wildered, I think the problems with the on-board shots are caused by the cheap Chinese cameras the FIA uses on the cars. Plus you're looking "
235 EZEIZA :
236 Baroque : Dear Kimi Sorry to hear that globalization has made such a mess of photography. Now mit ein good Zeiss lens such a thing it would never ever be happen
237 Flyboysp : Why do i have the feeling that the outcome of the appeal, will be effected by the race results from Monza
238 Post contains links Boeing74741R : All I've started a new thread for this weekend's Italian Grand Prix at Monza: http://www.airliners.net/aviation-fo...ms/non_aviation/read.main/1972664
239 Moo : It will be interestingly convenient if the FIA find they don't have to allow the appeal, as then they can side step the entire issue altogther - which
240 BlueElephant : I was thinking about this also....I find it really interesting that at the time of the incident, The FIA said it was ok...And then an hour after the
241 StealthZ : 1989 Suzuka, Mansell(Ferrari) DNF Engine failure, Berger(Ferrari)DNF Transmission, Hardly blame either of those on McLaren or the FIA, Senna (McLaren
242 Baroque : Concession: From Monza thread I can see the wings - at last. But they are really difficult to see on the F. With Spa, the poor light probably made the
243 T1210s : Your right i got the year wrong but the point i was trying to make was Senna went unpunished for his actions against Prost even after he admited a ye
244 Sudden : What also needs to be taken in to count here is that some tracks suit this or that car better, so it's not all down to driver performance, but how th
245 Rockson : Here's what Jarno Trulli said about the situation. Remember this is from a person that drives F1 cars for a living and knows it way better than we do.
246 Gman94 : Nonsense from Jarno, you can clearly hear from the engine tone on the onboard video of Hamilton that missing the chicance resulted in him having to ba
247 Moo : There is no way you can say that, at all. The possibility was not allowed.
248 EZEIZA : It can be argued that he would have never had that momentum if there would have been gravel in the chicane and he would have hit the breaks.
249 Gman94 : The same could be said for both Ferraris at the start who used the run off to at La Source to great advantage with no penalty. Also how much ground d
250 Scbriml : Exactly. Which is why I said "Every race is different."
251 BlueElephant : I watched this part like 8 times...and it was CLEARLY obvious...that Kimi used the entire thing to his advantage...he was going slow enough that he c
252 SlamClick : He had NO momentum. Lewis Hamilton had NO 'extra' momentum as a result of cutting the chicane. There is no such thing other than in the form of engin
253 Baroque : You might have to mention that if a car goes from being in front to being behind another, it is known as being passed by the car that is in front! Th
254 Post contains links Rockson : More opinions from F1 drivers: http://www.planetf1.com/story/0,18954,3213_4131585,00.html
255 Post contains images EZEIZA : I said it "can be argued", I'm not arguing   Honestly and just in case I wasn't clear enough, LH should NOT have had that penalty, because let's say
256 Sudden : You bet I can! Care to even try to understand why instead crying like a baby saying "The possibility was not allowed"!? If you were tuned in you woul
257 BlueElephant : Thats the best thing you've said in the entire thread...I just hope your different outcome is Lewis hamilton's engine blowing up..or him crashing.
258 Post contains links EZEIZA : Him finishing 12th would be ok ... By the way, according to this report, LH today said that Kimi "doesn't have the balls to break later" can't find a
259 Post contains links and images T1210s : Q. But he was braking much earlier than you? LH: Well, that's his driving, that's all. That is how he drives. If you don't have the balls to brake lat
260 StealthZ : They have no clue either.. Bourdais Trulli They both cannot read.. or have not bothered to read the rules, There is NOT a rule that says you have to
261 Gman94 : Sorry but it's not arrogance it's a fact. Both Kimi and Massa have proved that they can't match Hamilton when it comes to driving in the wet. Also th
262 EZEIZA : But there are different ways of saying this. At the end of the day, the one with "no balls" is so far the world champion Schumi, especially at the be
263 StealthZ : This may sound repetitive but. At the Thusday Press conference at Monza both drivers and journalists made reference to the rules that say if you gain
264 Scbriml : Don't hold your breath. It must be one of those "unwritten rules" that everyone is just supposed to know. It comes immediately before the very last r
265 Post contains links BlueElephant : " target=_blank>http://www.planetf1.com/story/0,1895....html Alright lets take a look. Compiling a small list of hte drivers who have commented... F.
266 Gman94 : It's quite funny as well that Kimi and other drivers are having a go at Hamilton because he broke the rules, but there is no rule about having to give
267 EZEIZA : And they ammended it with "No silver car will be kicked out for copying the red car" Alonso always complains about everything so I really don't even
268 Post contains links Gman94 : Sorry forgot the link. http://www.planetf1.com/story/0,18954,3213_4133675,00.html
269 EZEIZA : " target=_blank>http://www.planetf1.com/story/0,1895....html thanks mate is it just me or does this seem more of a response to what Lewis said about
270 Boeing74741R : I do detect a sense of cockiness in Lewis's quotation. He's digging himself into a hole, perhaps he should stop digging, ignore the others and say no
271 Post contains links BlueElephant : http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/70526 The Official Rule on Cutting the Chicane that FIA just made up. http://www.autosport.com/news/report
272 StealthZ : That's the thing about the little fascist enclave that the FIA has become, there is a rule book with more holes than a swiss cheese and a whole bunch
273 Post contains links Scbriml : McLaren's appeal against Hamilton's Spa penalty will be heard on 22nd September. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/7603179.stm
274 BlueElephant : Hmm...I just realized that that is the same week as the Singapore Grand Prix...how is that going to effect Hamilton being there, and in Singapore....I
275 EZEIZA : At what time is that race btw?
276 StealthZ : 20:00 Singapore time, you will have to do the math for your local time Cheers
277 EZEIZA : Thanks I have two weeks to figure out what time that is in Argentina
278 Boeing74741R : The appeal date is on a Monday, so he'll have plenty of time to make it to Singapore in time for Friday practice.
279 Post contains links Rockson : Interesting video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7obMezuPBvI
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