Aaron747 From Japan, joined Aug 2003, 7626 posts, RR: 28 Posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 6295 times:
America's first dedicated high speed rail line has been approved by voters in California.
Prop 1A passed by a fairly narrow margin, but with bipartisan support and opposition mostly confined to environmental groups, the airlines, and rural voters weary of the state's relatively poor record on public works cost overruns, it is a considerable victory given the controversial nature of the proposal.
Prop 1A establishes the first $10 billion bond for public financing.
This is the proposed system in its current incarnation:
It's amazing anything like this can get done given the current level of environmental insanity in Californian regulation, but with the current governor's leadership and a smart approach to outreach in all involved communities, I believe this project can be successfully completed.
[Edited 2008-11-05 17:10:50]
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
Charles79 From Puerto Rico, joined Mar 2007, 1307 posts, RR: 5 Reply 1, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 6281 times:
Hopefully this is the first of many to come. Having lived in Los Angeles for the past 4 years I always wondered why there were no high-speed rails between LA and Frisco or LA and Vegas, two heavily transited routes. There's plenty of potential here, just hope that they don't miss the opportunity.
San747 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 4934 posts, RR: 13 Reply 2, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 6217 times:
This looks fantastic, especially the route map. This benefits not just those going between SF and LA, but if I wanted to go say from Temecula to ONT or LAX, I could take this train and save a lot of time!
I love flying, but I'll take a high-speed train on a short enough trip!
Glid4500 From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 587 posts, RR: 8 Reply 4, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 6203 times:
Im excited that Prop 1A passed. Lookin forward to the opening day, whenever that will be. A 2 hour journey from Northern CA to LA is pretty good. If High speed rail works in Japan, France, and other countries, then it can work here in the US.
Japanese high speed rail has never had a single passenger fatality and as of first quarter this year has had a grand total of only 1,134 operational delays in over 15,000 days of service since 1964. An incredible record by any standard.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
SkyyKat From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 7, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 6190 times:
Good news.... What are the environmental impacts though? I would imagine that this would be a much cleaner form of transport than busses, cars or airplanes... What are the environmentalists using as a deterrent here?
Dfwrevolution From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 9, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 6169 times:
Quoting Glid4500 (Reply 4): If High speed rail works in Japan, France, and other countries, then it can work here in the US.
Well let's not forget that Japan and France both sport a population density in excess of the most densely populated U.S. corridors. Japan is a bit smaller than California but has more than triple the population. While France is a larger in both area and population, it's density is ultimately about 25% higher than California's.
High-speed rail is very good at moving lots of people between fixed points within regional distances, but that's about it. The freight opportunities are far more limited than with highways and airports. In a nation like the U.S. that is proportionately less dense and proportionately more economically active than France or Japan, it's no wonder that highways and airports have been the preferred option for public investment. It's not just a matter of us loving cars because the same can be said for Asians and Europeans.
It will probably be another decade or two before the U.S. population (along certain corridors other than New England) reaches the "critical mass" necessary for HSR to be a success. Since it takes about that long to get a major public works program into service, I applaud California for being on the cutting edge.
Travelin man From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3311 posts, RR: 0 Reply 12, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 6127 times:
I'm also happy LA County passed a half cent sales tax for more transit projects (subways, light rail, freeway expansion, etc.). I'm pleasantly surprised it was passed by the required 2/3 majority in this economic environment, but at the end of the day the traffic is just SOOOO bad here, people finally had enough.
Date is undetermined, as so the operator. Looks like theres 2 proposals
-CA-NV Interstate Maglev ( Las Vegas-Barstow-Anaheim )
-Desert Xpress operating from Victorville-Las Vegas with a seperate rail connection from Victorville to the Los Angeles area
Quoting Dfwrevolution (Reply 9): Well let's not forget that Japan and France both sport a population density in excess of the most densely populated U.S. corridors.
That maybe so...but as u may know, the Amtrak Acela Express and Northeast Corridor trains ( Boston-NYP-Washington DC ) is a perfect example of HSR in the US. Its been sucessful for quite some time. The Amtrak California Trains ( Pacific Surfliner, San Joaquin, and Capital Corridor Trains ), have seen almost a 16% of ridership this year. The original plan was to have this proposed CA HSR to run along the I-5 corridor.
PanAm330 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 2601 posts, RR: 10 Reply 14, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 6105 times:
Wow. I'm incredibly surprised. The time/hassle saved going from SF to LA will be incredible versus a car. Of course, it won't be nearly as scenic as the PCH, but it's worth it. Even to take the high speed rail over a plane could have its advantages. Probably shorter overall too, when taking check-in, security, possible delays, etc. into account. At least they passed a good proposition, unlike the other notable one which shouldn't have been. Bravo!
NorCal From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 2383 posts, RR: 5 Reply 16, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6083 times:
This is definitely a good thing for my home state, but I must admit that as an airline pilot I was hoping this wouldn't pass....
I can't be too upset though because this will benefit a lot of people, I just hope it doesn't kill off my industry in the state. If it does destroy California aviation then I'll just have to look into getting a job as a train engineer. The railroads probably have better pay and work rules anyways. Do you need type ratings for high speed trains?
Glid4500 From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 587 posts, RR: 8 Reply 17, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6077 times:
Quoting Travelin man (Reply 12): I'm also happy LA County passed a half cent sales tax for more transit projects (subways, light rail, freeway expansion, etc.). I'm pleasantly surprised it was passed by the required 2/3 majority in this economic environment, but at the end of the day the traffic is just SOOOO bad here, people finally had enough
That itself is great news for Angelinos like myself...although I do have a car, i take public transportation when Im not working.
Measure M has worked in nearby Orange County for almost 20 years ( since 1990 ). The half-cent sales tax was used wisely to help widen SR22 ( Garden Grove Freeway ), especially the Orange Crush where the I-5, SR22, & SR57 meets. Its also improved bus service in the OC that has little or no service in the past. Its also helped fixed up potholes & widen streets, repave roads, and add additional weekday, and new weekend + holiday service on the Metrolink Orange County Lines, not to mention the construction of new Metrolink Stations in the OC ( Buena Park just opened this year, and Placentia Station is being built ). That measure is up for renewal in 2011 and has seen near 4 billion dollars in transportation improvements.
DiamondFlyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1294 posts, RR: 3 Reply 18, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6070 times:
Quoting FlyMIA (Reply 11): WOW! Great news for California. Hopefully Florida can see something like this one day but i doubt it. A MIA-FLL-PBI-MCO-DAB-TPA-GVN-JAX-TLH type of thing.
It was tried and passed a referendum back in 2000. However, the same referendum was repealed in 2004. However, the inital plan was a short line, up the I-4 corridor from Tampa to Orlando. I believe they had future plans to expand more, but that didn't happen. They had a website, but it appears to be down right now. For some basic background the best I can do for you is the dreaded wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_High_Speed_Rail
StasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3266 posts, RR: 6 Reply 19, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6063 times:
Proposition 1A is a complete waste of California taxpayer's monies. The proponets of this measure provided the public with bad information, stating that the cost of fares would be $50 for the 2 1/2 hour trip from L.A. to San Francisco, when numerous transportation analysts/engineers have stated the fare would need to be at least $175 and the trip would be 3.5 hours in duration. Supporters of Prop 1A also claim a potential ridership of 100 million people, yet the popular AMTRAK route (the Northeast Corridor route Washington-Philadelphia -New York-Providence-Boston) traveled by high-speed Metroliner and Acela trains get fewer than 3 million passengers in a much bigger, more populous market. AMTRAK's total ridership last year was 25.8 million passengers - and that was a all time record for AMTRAK, by the way. So where the hell are the supporters of Prop 1A getting the insane 100 million passenger figure from?
Nothing about this plan makes ANY economic sense except to the promoters, many of whom will profit from building it - after California taxpayers cough up the billions of dollars to build it.
The monies should have be spent to provide updated/enhanced municipal surface transportation and to support regional light rail projects that provide service to the citizens that most need public transportation, and not a luxury long-distance bullet train that will only be used by the most affluent Californians.
[Edited 2008-11-05 20:09:30]
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
TUNisia From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 1834 posts, RR: 5 Reply 20, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6032 times:
The US is finally waking up to the face that rail is the logical way to go for the future (convenience and environmental reasons).I feel we need more and more of these high-speed corridors across the US and long-distance high-speed rail lines. Imagine being able to board a high-speed Amtrak train (complete with hot meals, beds, nice seats, lounge, no turbulence, no TSA, etc...) and go from the east coast to the west coast in under 12 or so hours!
Someday the sun will shine down on me in some faraway place - Mahalia Jackson
Steeler83 From United States of America, joined Feb 2006, 8802 posts, RR: 19 Reply 22, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6006 times:
Yes!!! Another step in the right direction for rail!! Now, we need the Ohio Hub to come together, and for someone to actually turn the entire Keystone Corridor into a HSR corridor, providing a HSR network from the Northeast and Midatlantic all the way out to Chicago and other parts of the Midwest...
I heard that the 2 finalists for the MAGLEV project were the Pittsburgh one as well as Vegas. I wonder if there's anything new on that...
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
Superfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 38485 posts, RR: 80 Reply 23, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 6006 times:
Glad it passed and I hope this becomes a reality.
I voted yes on prop 1A.
Glad to see this rail network actually link to important points of interest that generate lots of foot traffic.
Who in their right mind thought of building a multi-million dollar rail network to Daly City instead of SFSU/Stonestown, Fremont instead of San Jose, El Segundo instead of LAX.