Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Tesla Motors Unveils Electric Luxury Sedan  
User currently offlineStasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3283 posts, RR: 6
Posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2982 times:

The Aston Martin Rapide-ish looking Tesla Model S sedan is scheduled to be launched by late 2011 with a pricetag of approximately $50K USD - if Tesla can secure the funding (from both private and governmental sources) necessary to actually market the car, and secure an assembly plant in which it will be built. Here's more details from today's article on MotorAuthority.com.

Big version: Width: 630 Height: 325 File size: 35kb
2012 Tesla Motors Model "S" luxury sedan


"The prototype was unveiled today at Tesla's design studio inside CEO Elon Musk's SpaceX rocket factory in Hawthorne, California. Tesla's Elon Musk demonstrated its functionality outside the plant, confirming it is in fact drivable. The company says that the final production model will be almost identical in appearance. Just last week Tesla released official pricing info for the car, with a target of $57,400 before the $7,500 tax credit it will be eligible for, which brings the final effective price down to $49,900.

Big version: Width: 950 Height: 633 File size: 67kb
2012 Tesla Motors Model "S" luxury sedan


A quick run-down of the car's stats reveals the Model S will carry on the Roadster's mantle of green performance, while expanding considerably on its utility: a 300mi (480km) range is complemented by an expected 0-60mph (96km/h) time of 5.5-6.0 seconds. There's even work being done on an optional 600mi (960km) extended-range battery pack. Despite the range of the 300mi pack, Tesla is claiming a 45 minute quick-charge time. The battery pack itself will be warrantied for 7-10 years, while the car will be warrantied separately for a period of 3-4 years."

Source: http://www.motorauthority.com/tesla-unveils-the-model-s-sedan.html

Would you consider buying a Tesla? Oh, and don't forget about the $7500 USD tax credit!


"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
44 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFLY2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2970 times:

Quoting StasisLAX (Thread starter):
Would you consider buying a Tesla? Oh, and don't forget about the $7500 USD tax credit!

Wow this is the first "green" car you've ever posted I might consider. Not only is it easy on the eyes, but for 50k? That's not bad, assuming it at the very least matches the big 3 German luxury builders' mid range models I don't see why it couldn't work. Aside from the range issues its perfect for a CEO of some not too big or not too small company to cruise around town in to and from work.

I wonder if they're using their own platform or basing it off something else like they did with their Elise-based roadster. The article doesn't mention either way.

If I was them though, I'd make a Hydrogen fuel cell version. Heck Honda is already mass producing them.

[Edited 2009-03-26 18:15:39]

User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8840 posts, RR: 24
Reply 2, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2966 times:

I wonder if Aston Martin approved the obvious ripoff.

Quoting StasisLAX (Thread starter):
Would you consider buying a Tesla? Oh, and don't forget about the $7500 USD tax credit!

No. Not for $50K. If it got down to $25-30K, it might get interesting. I would not pay any more than that for a car that's basically only good in town.

The problem is still the range. If I suddenly need to drive someplace, I might be forced to rent a car. While they might claim 300 mile ranges, the last 150 or 100 miles of that might be extremely sluggish.

Remember when Top Gear tested the first Tesla? It ran out of juice very fast after a little spirited driving.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlineGreaser From Bahamas, joined Jan 2004, 1101 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2963 times:



Quoting StasisLAX (Thread starter):
Would you consider buying a Tesla? Oh, and don't forget about the $7500 USD tax credit!

Of course! This car has huge potential in areas like the populated west (CA, WA), and the East Coast, where cities are closer together than say the midwest. Until there is some solution to the 45min charge time, i don't think the car will be huge across the US. They need to find a extremely fast charging solution, 5 mins tops.

Quoting FLY2HMO (Reply 1):
If I was them though, I'd make a Hydrogen fuel cell version. Heck Honda is already mass producing them.

Hydrogen is of course the main competitor, but I just think it's the betamax of the two. From molecule to fuel, it's an expensive and complex process. The fuel cell technology is still insufficient for mass use, and the infrastructure changes will be huge. I like it because you go to a pump, fill it up, and go...just like a petrol car. Beyond that, i think batteries have it. The public is more comfortable and aware of hybrid electric vehicles. Valid or not, people like the idea of being able to sell their electricity back to the grid. Honda and BMW are the only two major car companies at the forefront of hydrogen technology, with honda playing both cards to make sure whatever happens it doesnt lose.



Now you're really flying
User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39873 posts, RR: 74
Reply 4, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2962 times:

Best of luck to Tesla and just about any brand that wants to open a plant in the United States and create jobs.

Why are they naming themselves after a 1980s glam-metal band?



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineGreaser From Bahamas, joined Jan 2004, 1101 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2959 times:



Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
Remember when Top Gear tested the first Tesla? It ran out of juice very fast after a little spirited driving.

Top Gear has been criticized for falsifying the road test. The car still had ample range. Google top gear tesla. Tesla had data proof of this.



Now you're really flying
User currently offlineDw747400 From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 1260 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2956 times:



Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):

Why are they naming themselves after a 1980s glam-metal band?

Nikola Tesla

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikola_Tesla



CFI--Certfied Freakin Idiot
User currently offlineStasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3283 posts, RR: 6
Reply 7, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2956 times:



Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
Why are they naming themselves after a 1980s glam-metal band?

Tesla was a turn of the century scientist - along the lines of Edison and Einstein  wink 



"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39873 posts, RR: 74
Reply 8, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2951 times:



Quoting Dw747400 (Reply 6):
Nikola Tesla



Quoting StasisLAX (Reply 7):
Tesla was a turn of the century scientist - along the lines of Edison and Einstein

Oh yeah I forgot about him.


I am sure this car will do very well among the Hollywood-types that like to make a fashionable political statements.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineMham001 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3642 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2938 times:

Expect it to be vaporware unless they get huge funding from the government. They had a production facility planned for this car in San Jose that was meant to break ground some months ago and very surreptitiously canceled it because they have no money and no investors. Their dreams pretty much crashed with the price of oil.

User currently offlineStasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3283 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 2920 times:



Quoting Mham001 (Reply 9):
Their dreams pretty much crashed with the price of oil.

Not necessarily. Tesla Motors is to receive $350M USD in federal government funding by the middle of this year.

Source: http://www.kcbs.com/Tesla-Expects--3...illion-in-Government-Loans/3834091



"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
User currently offlineCorocks From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 1215 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2810 times:



Quoting Greaser (Reply 3):
They need to find a extremely fast charging solution, 5 mins tops.

I think this is the key to electric cars ever being mainstream. You could never take a road-trip in one of these cars until fast charging stations are common.

I have always heard the key to longer battery life for any rechargable battery is to let it run down almost completely before you charge it up again. I wonder if it would hurt the batteries in these cars if you plugged it in every night after only driving 50-100 miles each day?


User currently offlineFLY2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 2760 times:



Quoting Corocks (Reply 11):

I have always heard the key to longer battery life for any rechargable battery is to let it run down almost completely before you charge it up again.

 checkmark  That's especially true for the older NiCd batteries. NiMh and Li-ion are not so prone to battery "memory" caused by not fully discharging them but it is still wise to do so. I never recharge my cell until it goes under 1bar. I hear my friends replacing their cell batteries all the time. I've always had good life from the original ones the phone came with due to my good charging habits.


User currently offlineDavid L From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 9524 posts, RR: 41
Reply 13, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 2751 times:



Quoting FLY2HMO (Reply 12):
That's especially true for the older NiCd batteries. NiMh and Li-ion are not so prone to battery "memory" caused by not fully discharging them but it is still wise to do so. I never recharge my cell until it goes under 1bar.

You're right about Ni-Cds being particularly bad for that but there's a significant difference with Li-ion batteries, for example. The performance may be degraded to a certain extent by partial recharging but each one I've had has shown no noticeable difference by the time I ditched the device they powered. In any case, there are Ni-Cd chargers that fully discharge the battery before recharging. Conventional car batteries don't even give you the option of letting them run down before recharging. In fact, I'm reasonably sure it's recommended not to let car batteries discharge too much before recharging.


User currently offlineChase From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 1054 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 2727 times:

Me wantee!

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
If it got down to $25-30K, it might get interesting

Their plan is for sales of the Roadster to finance development of this, and for sales of this to finance development of the third model, currently codenamed "Bluestar". Bluestar is currently projected to go on sale in 2012, in the $2x,xxx range. As we all know, schedules slip, but I'm seriously eyeing Bluestar as a replacement for my current car. I'd get the Model S, but it's out of my price range.

Quoting Corocks (Reply 11):
I think this is the key to electric cars ever being mainstream. You could never take a road-trip in one of these cars until fast charging stations are common.

I'm not sure if the optional 600-mile battery pack means "600 more miles" or "600 total miles", i.e. if the total with it would be 600 or 900. But either way, that's about the limit to how far you can drive in a day without being worn out. So really all they'd need to do is put outlets in motel parking lots, and problem solved. Heck, you could just bring an extension cord with you, park near your ground-floor motel room, and run the cord to an outlet inside the room.
For other electric cars with lower ranges, such as 50 or 100 miles, maybe employers could even let their employees plug in during the work day. I work for a fairly progressive company...I can see it now: a sign reading "electric vehicle parking only" with an outlet on the sign post. That would be sweet.


User currently offlineFlybyguy From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1801 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 2686 times:



Quoting StasisLAX (Thread starter):
A quick run-down of the car's stats reveals the Model S will carry on the Roadster's mantle of green performance, while expanding considerably on its utility: a 300mi (480km) range is complemented by an expected 0-60mph (96km/h) time of 5.5-6.0 seconds. There's even work being done on an optional 600mi (960km) extended-range battery pack. Despite the range of the 300mi pack, Tesla is claiming a 45 minute quick-charge time. The battery pack itself will be warrantied for 7-10 years, while the car will be warrantied separately for a period of 3-4 years."

Source: http://www.motorauthority.com/tesla-unveils-the-model-s-sedan.html

Would you consider buying a Tesla? Oh, and don't forget about the $7500 USD tax credit!

Those specs are amazing for an electic car. I think if Tesla can pull this off then they will assert their dominance over the pretenders of the green revolution... i.e. Smart and New Mini. I mean who's going to pay 18K for a car that tiny? Daimler and BMW have perverted the green revolution into a novelty for the rich rather than something accessible to the mainstream. If Tesla ends up being successful look for some kind of buyout by one of the big auto manufacturers in the next few years. I think now that the mainstream auto industry is hurting Tesla has a chance of introducing something completely revolutionary just in time for economic recovery.


Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
I wonder if Aston Martin approved the obvious ripoff.

That's exactly what I was thinking. Though I think Tesla has given green a new image. Toyota and Honda for too long have made specialty green cars look like geeky golfcarts. I would never buy a Prius for the simple fact that it looks like a cheese wedge on tires.



"Are you a pretender... or a thoroughbred?!" - Professor Matt Miller
User currently offlineNoworries From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 539 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 2646 times:

Interesting that they claim a 45 minute quick charge -- must be ideal conditions.

I couldn't find a capacity rating for the battery on their website -- wikipedia has it at 53KWh.
A convential 120V 15A outlet would allow 18KW, so about 3 hours for a full charge - assuming it could be driven close to 100%. If you can find a clothes-drier outlet you could knock it down to an hour to an hour and a half (again assuming 100% charge rate).


User currently offlineAlessandro From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 2615 times:

I still think a three seater like the Matra Bagheera would be a better choice after the roadster.

User currently offlineStasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3283 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2601 times:

Here's a link to autoblog.com that has at least 40 pics of the new Tesla Model S fully dressed prototypes undergoing road testing! I know it's a Rapide rip-off, but damn does it look AMAZING!

Source:http://www.autoblog.com/2009/03/26/tesla-model-s-50-000-ev-sedan-seats-seven-300-mile-range-0-6/



"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
User currently offlineNoWorries From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 539 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 2563 times:



Quoting Noworries (Reply 16):
A conventional 120V 15A outlet would allow 18KW, so about 3 hours for a full charge

Looks like I made a math error -- 1.8KW -- so it would take at least 30 hours to recharge a depleted battery. A 20A 240V outlet would be 4.8KW, so it would take at least 11 hours to recharge a depleted battery. Even if an owner only typically runs it down to half charge, it still sounds like maybe an overnight recharge -- not sure where they get their optimistic times.


User currently offlineGoldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 6027 posts, RR: 14
Reply 20, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2544 times:



Quoting Dw747400 (Reply 6):
Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):

Why are they naming themselves after a 1980s glam-metal band?

Nikola Tesla

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikola_Tesla

If it wasn't for Tesla and Westinghouse, the world would be using Edison's power grid, using only DC power, which is worthless for long-distance transportation, as it can't be stepped up as AC can.



Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
User currently offlineSeb146 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 11646 posts, RR: 15
Reply 21, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2526 times:

I don't understand something: If an upstart company can produce a battery powered car this easily, why can't an established company do it for less? Why are we still accepting gasoline powered cars when it is obvious that we do not need gasoline anymore?


Life in the wall is a drag.
User currently offlineGrowly150 From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 158 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 2499 times:

Could somebody explain to me how these electric cars are "green" cars? Where do we get the power to charge them and how? Our sources for energy are still very dirty, especially at the large-scale "filling" stations you are yearning for. If you had a wind turbine in your yard that you hooked up to it would be different, but this is a stop-gap.

User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 12 hours ago) and read 2496 times:



Quoting Seb146 (Reply 21):
I don't understand something: If an upstart company can produce a battery powered car this easily, why can't an established company do it for less? Why are we still accepting gasoline powered cars when it is obvious that we do not need gasoline anymore?

Uhhh, wrong. We need gasoline power. Tesla is my absolute LAST choice if I want to drive any long distance. These cars are only good for commuter trips and would need a while night to recharge.

It's called practicality. These cars just don't meet the need of a lot of drivers out there. And car companies would be stupid to only cater to the 9-5 commuter crowd.

I would also point out to all those fawning over this thing that electricity prices will skyrocket with the obvious demand increase from widespread use of these vehicles.

Also, how "green" is this thing anyway? Increased demand for electricity increases fossil fuel consumption at generating stations. Battery manufacture involves lots of toxic chemicals that make CO2 seem all nice and friendly. Not to mention battery leaks in car accidents, and of course disposal of use up vehicles will be quite expensive. This can be remedied by working the projected cost of disposal/salvage into the purchase price of the vehicle, but for Tesla it will mean higher prices.

Not saying this is a bad idea. I applaud Tesla and wish them success. But they can't walk on water here...to suggest current car manufacturers are suddenly "inferior" and "useless" is a massive flying leap.

 airplane B4e-Forever New Frontiers airplane 


User currently offlineStasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3283 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 7 hours ago) and read 2459 times:



Quoting Growly150 (Reply 22):
Could somebody explain to me how these electric cars are "green" cars? Where do we get the power to charge them and how? Our sources for energy are still very dirty, especially at the large-scale "filling" stations you are yearning for.

Especially since just over 50 percent of all electricity generated in the U.S. is generated from coal-fuel powerplants. In the rest of the world, coal-generated electricity is about 40 percent with China and India being other massive coal using nations.

Source: http://www.pbs.org/now/science/coal.html



"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
25 DL021 : Hell yes....I'm all in. I'll have one car for road trips and give the wife this one for local trips. If the recharge is really at 45 minutes then thi
26 UAL747 : That's the thing, only now are we starting to see good looking cars that are energy effecient. Though, I do question the Lexus LS600h's energy effeci
27 StasisLAX : The instrument panel is supposed to be a touch-screen (aka glass cockpit) high-tech with all the gadgets. Tesla hasn't released an official photo of
28 Post contains links and images UAL747 : Well, here's the start of it.... UAL
29 Post contains images KiwiRob : I'd rather have a Fisker Karma, Valmet (same company that builds Boxter and Caymen for Porsche) starts production this year.
30 StasisLAX : Very nice looking car, but I like the styling of the Tesla sedan better.
31 Chase : I'll be glad to try 1) A gasoline-powered car *must* run on gasoline, for its entire lifespan (assuming you don't swap out the engine). If you buy an
32 DfwRevolution : 1. Telsa is producing a very limited number of vehicles targeting a specific group of buyers. It's physically impossible for the industry as a whole
33 Post contains images Cadet57 : Oh dear god. Is that vista on the screen? Poor bugger wont even leave the driveway without depleting half the battery just loading all the bloatware
34 UAL747 : LOL, I know I saw that window, and thought, OH GOD not Microsoft based, PLEASE! GOD NO! Nothing like your car getting the "NO START" Virus Or even wo
35 SCCutler : They deliver this car, at the stated price, with the stated performance goals substantially matched, they'll sell the pee out of 'em. I think it looks
36 Alessandro : Difference between the two companies is that Tesla has already delivered cars, Fisker is still on the prototype stage.
37 Metroliner : I hate it. Signed, Klaus
38 Flighty : They probably could, but they do not have adequate leadership. GM is only producing the Volt because Tesla put out its roadster, invalidating all cla
39 Boeing4ever : You're still shifting the pollution from automobiles to power plants that much not increase their output to cope with rising demand. Electricity pric
40 Flighty : Absolutely, they are a curiosity, nothing more. I wouldn't say totally unrealistic. Electricity prices have never gone very high long term. They are
41 Boeing4ever : Indeed, one big issue with that...the cheap price of oil. If oil is so cheap to burn for electricity, a lot of people will argue to cut that middle m
42 KingairTA : GM never said it was impossible. How people forget the EV1. Problem is practicality. How usefull is a full charge? Is the range including running thin
43 Prebennorholm : Some numbers simply don't add up. If we assume a small car with a milage of 35 mpg going 60 mph, then it will need a power of 25 HP or 18 kW to sustai
44 NoWorries : My thermo course was 35 years ago -- discounting senility, my vague recollection is that a good power plant will run close to 40%, a good IC engine a
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Are There 1000HP Electric Motors? posted Wed Oct 29 2003 23:34:30 by Lehpron
Sarkozy Provokes Anger With Luxury Holiday In Mexi posted Tue Mar 10 2009 02:14:29 by MadameConcorde
Buick Sedan Built In Germany By Opel For US Market posted Sun Feb 1 2009 16:40:27 by StasisLAX
General Motors To Downsize To 4 Car Brands posted Wed Jan 21 2009 16:26:49 by StasisLAX
Jaguar Introduces Twin-Turbo XF Diesel S Sedan posted Mon Dec 29 2008 23:01:23 by StasisLAX
Which German Luxury Flagship Car You Pick? posted Sat Nov 29 2008 11:50:21 by 747400sp
Ugly! New 2010 Porsche Panamera Sedan Unveiled! posted Wed Nov 26 2008 20:56:11 by StasisLAX
Cop Car Of The Future - Carbon Motors E7 posted Thu Nov 13 2008 11:24:58 by KaiGywer
New BMW 335d Diesel Sedan Is EPA Rated At 36mpg! posted Tue Nov 11 2008 21:55:13 by StasisLAX
General Motors Nearly Finished Chrysler Takeover! posted Thu Oct 30 2008 15:06:22 by StasisLAX