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"Freedom Tower' To Be Renamed WTC 1  
User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13113 posts, RR: 12
Posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 4491 times:

There are news reports today and on Thrusday that the 'Freedom Tower', the tallest building to replace in part the World Trade Center towers in NYC destroyed in the 9/11 attacks is to be renamed by the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey to World Trade Center One. In part it may be that the first commercial tenant to sign up is a China based real estate investment company. Of course in the NY Post and other media, there is a lot of complaints over this renaming. Here are some thoughts I posted on a political site:

In the immediate aftermath of 9/11, there were far too many politicans, both on the left and right, that stumbled over each other to prove their patriotism. That led to an overwhelming desire to overdo remembering those attacks like the naming of the largest tower of the new WTC to the 'Freedom Tower'.
The attacks of 9/11 were not because 'they' hated our freedom, it was that we (USA and Europe) repressed the of freedom of certain groups of persons especially as to certain practices of faith and political power with horrible dictators like the Shah in Iran and yes, Saddam Hussain. This was due to the fears of the USSR going into the middle east and controling the oil there.
The WTC is really for commerence and government agencies involved with it - it isn't about personal freedom unless you include the freedom of business to run and more recently ruin the lives of Billions throughout the world. To continue the use of a name freedom for a major part of the WTC is for all the wrong reasons.

47 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJM017 From Jamaica, joined Jun 2002, 1227 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4473 times:



Quoting LTBEWR (Thread starter):
In the immediate aftermath of 9/11, there were far too many politicans, both on the left and right, that stumbled over each other to prove their patriotism. That led to an overwhelming desire to overdo remembering those attacks like the naming of the largest tower of the new WTC to the 'Freedom Tower'.

All true.

I for one did not like the idea of 1) calling the WTC replacement "Freedom Tower" or 2) Adding Liberty to the name of EWR. The latter in particular was ridiculous. What was the point?



"It's okay to cheat, if you just really don't like to lose."
User currently offlineBirdwatching From Germany, joined Sep 2003, 3822 posts, RR: 51
Reply 2, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 4419 times:



Quoting JM017 (Reply 1):
Adding Liberty to the name of EWR. The latter in particular was ridiculous. What was the point?

I actually like it. I don't think it has anything to do with 911. I always thought the name was in reference to the Statue of Liberty, the most famous New Jersey landmark.

Soren  santahat 



All the things you probably hate about travelling are warm reminders that I'm home
User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6484 posts, RR: 3
Reply 3, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 4405 times:

I prefer Trump's idea of building the same towers, but one floor taller. Though internally, his idea for the replacements would feature improved construction techniques.


When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
User currently offlineDL021 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 11447 posts, RR: 75
Reply 4, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 4403 times:
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Quoting LTBEWR (Thread starter):
The attacks of 9/11 were not because 'they' hated our freedom, it was that we (USA and Europe) repressed the of freedom of certain groups of persons especially as to certain practices of faith and political power with horrible dictators like the Shah in Iran and yes, Saddam Hussain. This was due to the fears of the USSR going into the middle east and controling the oil there.

Wow..so now we're excusing the attacks and saying they were our own fault because we repressed someone's freedom?

The attacks of 9/11 were committed by terrorists who wanted to coerce us via terrorism into abandoning committments in the middle east and punish us for going to help in Saudi Arabia and staying in Kuwait afterwards. OBL was ok with us while we were supporting the Afghan insurgency, but when we set foot in his native country (with the intent of defending it) he got offended and when we set up permanent defences he got angry (because he's an Islamo-fascist and wants all the stuff they teach in the fanatic-run madrassahs to be law everywhere) and he decided to attack us. He was supported in this by the fascist fanatics in Afghanistan (and yes they were and are fanatics at the top levels, and they use the medievel peasantry to accomplish their goals through coercion and terrorism...because it's worked there for time immemorial). His methods are terrorism, and they've been supported by people around the world (like when Saddam sent cash to any family of Palestinean human bombers and let terrorists like Abu Nidal live in his country) who want to coerce others into abandoning practices that threaten the fascists who want to control their worlds.

9/11 was our fault as much as it was the fault of the Armenians that the Turks massacred them, or the Jews that the Germans massacred them. You can always find a reason for the mass murderers to have done what they did......



Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
User currently offline767Lover From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 4370 times:

I wouldn't worry to much about it. I'm sure by the time it opens it will be Verizon Tower or Geico Place or something of the sort.

User currently offlineMoose135 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 2322 posts, RR: 10
Reply 6, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 4351 times:



Quoting JM017 (Reply 1):
dding Liberty to the name of EWR. The latter in particular was ridiculous. What was the point?

Other than on the radio traffic reports, I don't know of anyone who uses the word "Liberty" in the name of the airport. Then again, I still call that little air field on the Potomic "National Airport".

Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 2):
I don't think it has anything to do with 911. I always thought the name was in reference to the Statue of Liberty, the most famous New Jersey landmark.

It was done after 9/11, and was specifically renamed to commemorate the attacks:

http://www.allbusiness.com/operation...shipping-air-freight/244027-1.html

Quote:
The airport will now be called Newark Liberty International Airport, after a proposal by New York Gov. George Pataki and New Jersey Gov. James McGreevey to rename the airport Liberty International Airport to commemorate the 11 September terrorist attacks.




KC-135 - Passing gas and taking names!
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16865 posts, RR: 51
Reply 7, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 3 days ago) and read 4333 times:

It was a dumb idea, the former Twin Towers were known as World Trade Center One and World Trade Center Two. This "Freedom Tower" name was the idea of former New York Governor George Pataki who while having good intentions was devoid of good decisions.

The "Freedom" Tower is just too reminiscent of that whole "Freedom Fries" nonsense, I couldn't believe it when I walked into a deli near me in Colts Neck NJ and on the Menu they replaced French fries with "Freedom Fries". Stupid.

Quoting JM017 (Reply 1):
I for one did not like the idea of 1) calling the WTC replacement "Freedom Tower" or 2) Adding Liberty to the name of EWR. The latter in particular was ridiculous. What was the point?



Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 2):
I actually like it. I don't think it has anything to do with 911. I always thought the name was in reference to the Statue of Liberty, the most famous New Jersey landmark.

Both ideas for renaming One World Trade Center the "Freedom Tower" and Newark "Liberty" International airport was New York Governor George Pataki, no New Jersey politician asked that Newark airport be renamed it was George Pataki who was on the whole Republican "Freedom" kick. He directed the Port Authority to make the Change of name to both facilities, New Jersey politicians did not object but again it was not their idea. The Governor of New York is responsible for renaming EWR.

Quoting N328KF (Reply 3):
I prefer Trump's idea of building the same towers, but one floor taller.

Trump is not in the commercial end of real estate, he builds condos. He would be the last person you would want involved with the Rebuilding of the World Trade Center, he has no experience in office buildings, many of his properties are of not such high quality, and he just lost control of his casinos in Atlantic City because of poor management. But for some reason because he has a tv show (does anyone watch that anymore?) they think he's a genius.



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineCaptaink From Mexico, joined May 2001, 5109 posts, RR: 12
Reply 8, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4308 times:



Quoting STT757 (Reply 7):
Quoting N328KF (Reply 3):
I prefer Trump's idea of building the same towers, but one floor taller.

Trump is not in the commercial end of real estate, he builds condos. He would be the last person you would want involved with the Rebuilding of the World Trade Center, he has no experience in office buildings, many of his properties are of not such high quality, and he just lost control of his casinos in Atlantic City because of poor management. But for some reason because he has a tv show (does anyone watch that anymore?) they think he's a genius.

While all that may be true, I don't think he was offering technical assistance with his idea. I fancy it though. The same towers, one floor taller. How is that for "in your face." Big grin



There is something special about planes....
User currently offlineIliriBDL From Germany, joined May 2007, 1205 posts, RR: 14
Reply 9, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4295 times:

Can someone tell me when it's going to be finished?


delta.com
User currently offlineMax550 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1150 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4277 times:



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 9):
Can someone tell me when it's going to be finished?

Should be finished in 2013

Quick correction to the subject line, it will be renamed 1 World Trade Center, which is it's address I think.

I didn't really mind the name Freedom Tower, I just don't like the 19 story concrete base. It basically says that we're living in fear.


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21624 posts, RR: 55
Reply 11, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4273 times:

On the one hand, the whole "symbolic Freedom Tower stretching 1,776 feet high" idea that Pataki was wedded to was, and still is, ridiculous. But on the other, I'm not sure how I feel about the name World Trade Center One being used again, out of respect for those who lost their lives in a building of the same name. I'd be fine with calling it the World Trade Tower or something along those lines, or even the World Trade Center, but calling it WTC1 just seems kind of wrong.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineN328KF From United States of America, joined May 2004, 6484 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 4263 times:



Quoting STT757 (Reply 7):
Trump is not in the commercial end of real estate, he builds condos. He would be the last person you would want involved with the Rebuilding of the World Trade Center, he has no experience in office buildings, many of his properties are of not such high quality, and he just lost control of his casinos in Atlantic City because of poor management. But for some reason because he has a tv show (does anyone watch that anymore?) they think he's a genius.



Quoting Captaink (Reply 8):
While all that may be true, I don't think he was offering technical assistance with his idea. I fancy it though. The same towers, one floor taller. How is that for "in your face." 

This is exactly right. I think Trump was proposing as an American, not as a businessman.



When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' T.Roosevelt
User currently offlineLincoln From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 3887 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 4241 times:

Quoting Moose135 (Reply 6):
Other than on the radio traffic reports, I don't know of anyone who uses the word "Liberty" in the name of the airport. Then again, I still call that little air field on the Potomic "National Airport".

CO flight announcements frequently include "with service to Newark Liberty..." and the gate FIDS usually (at least in the airports I've paid attention to) identify the destination city as "Newark-Liberty". It actually wasn't until this thread that I found out that the "Liberty" was added post-9/11

Quoting LTBEWR (Thread starter):
The WTC is really for commerence and government agencies involved with it - it isn't about personal freedom unless

In our country the Government represents the people, and corporations are instruments of the people behind them -- be it a sole proprietor, a SBE, or a multinational. You have the freedom to start a company and to grow it to whatever proportions you desire, to be successful (or not), to take obscene risks (or not), to choose to work for a particular company or not, do do business with a particular orginization or not -- commerce is entirely about personal freedom.

That little rant aside, I think the "Freedom Tower" name isn't the best fit anyway -- kind of like the "American Flag" pin on politician's lapels, it just kind of screems "pandering".

Lincoln

[Edited 2009-03-27 09:01:05]


CO Is My Airline of Choice || Baggage Claim is an airline's last chance to disappoint a customer || Next flts in profile
User currently offlineIliriBDL From Germany, joined May 2007, 1205 posts, RR: 14
Reply 14, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 4236 times:



Quoting Max550 (Reply 10):
Should be finished in 2013

Thanks Max. Was that the intended date from the beginning or has it been pushed? (I thought it was supposed to be done much earlier?)



delta.com
User currently offlineCgnnrw From Germany, joined May 2005, 1156 posts, RR: 2
Reply 15, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 4218 times:

I agree the constant use of the words "freedom" or "liberty" is just nonsense. The exceptions being the Liberty Bell in Philadelpia and the Statue of Liberty itself. My freedom or liberty is not being uphead by some high rise building or an airport. I also still refer to EWR as Newark Airport and as alreday mentioned I just can't bring myself to refer to DCA as anything other than "National Airport".

All this "liberty" this and "freedom" that was nothing but total BS by people/polictians from both sides and made most American sound foolish.



A330 man.
User currently offlineMax550 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1150 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 4205 times:



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 14):
Was that the intended date from the beginning or has it been pushed? (I thought it was supposed to be done much earlier?)

It was supposed to be done in 2009, then 1st quarter of 2011, then 2012, and now it should open to tenants in 2013. I think construction will be completed in 2012 though.


User currently offlineSantosdumont From Brazil, joined Dec 2003, 1201 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 4113 times:



Quoting Mir (Reply 11):
I'm not sure how I feel about the name World Trade Center One being used again, out of respect for those who lost their lives in a building of the same name

I can think of no better tribute to the fallen than to rebuild both towers exactly as they were (with appropriate modifications to update the structure, etc)...heck, even with that extra floor that the Donald proposes.



"Pursuit Of Truth No Matter Where It Lies" -- Metallica
User currently offline2707200X From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 8515 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 4082 times:

What ever the name it is the plans for the new building look terrible, a hotchpotch of scaffolding that looks like it was put together sloppily and designed with little thought or imagination. I like plans to rebuild the World Trade Center like a lot of other people but the Port Authority of NY/NJ is opposed to rebuilding the twin towers.


"And all I ask is a tall ship and a star to steer her by." John Masefield Sea-Fever
User currently offlineFlybyguy From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 1801 posts, RR: 1
Reply 19, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 4068 times:



Quoting N328KF (Reply 3):
I prefer Trump's idea of building the same towers, but one floor taller. Though internally, his idea for the replacements would feature improved construction techniques.



Quoting Captaink (Reply 8):
While all that may be true, I don't think he was offering technical assistance with his idea. I fancy it though. The same towers, one floor taller. How is that for "in your face."

As much as I like the idea of rebuilding the towers as two middle fingers to cowardly, hole dwelling Osama Bin Laden I think the towers should take on a form that makes business sense today. The original towers were built in the 1970s and that was a different time economically for NYC than today.



"Are you a pretender... or a thoroughbred?!" - Professor Matt Miller
User currently onlineNIKV69 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 4031 times:



Quoting LTBEWR (Thread starter):
The attacks of 9/11 were not because 'they' hated our freedom, it was that we (USA and Europe) repressed the of freedom of certain groups of persons especially as to certain practices of faith and political power with horrible dictators like the Shah in Iran and yes, Saddam Hussain. This was due to the fears of the USSR going into the middle east and controling the oil there.

What?  confused 

Both WTC attacks were a result of our support and aid of Isreal and our stance with Isreal against AQ and any other radical Islamic organaztion. Can we dispense with the propaganda just once in this forum?

Quoting N328KF (Reply 3):
I prefer Trump's idea of building the same towers, but one floor taller. Though internally, his idea for the replacements would feature improved construction techniques

I said from the beginning we should have rebuilt them exactly as they were. Then once the last brick, bolt and slab of paint was thrown on it would have been the best symbol of this countries determination. Sure wish someone ran with it.


User currently offlineBohica From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2699 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 4005 times:

It's about time someone had some common sense. The official address of the building is One World Trade Center. The building sits on the site of the World Trade Center. The only suitable name for the building is the World Trade Center.

Failure to call the building the World Trade Center is considered giving in to terrorists.

No matter what they name the new building it would still be the World Trade Center as far as I am concerned. I'm sure a lot of people would agree with me. Even though the Sears Tower in Chicago has been renamed, I will always call it the Sears Tower. I also refer to DCA as "National" not Reagan.


User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19688 posts, RR: 58
Reply 22, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 3950 times:



Quoting DL021 (Reply 4):

The attacks of 9/11 were committed by terrorists who wanted to coerce us via terrorism into abandoning committments in the middle east and punish us for going to help in Saudi Arabia and staying in Kuwait afterwards.

I don't know what their agenda was. Nobody does and if you claim that you do, then I'm very curious to know how you know. I think when you get to the point where you're flying planes into buildings, you probably don't have much of a rational agenda.

You can't even listen to what OBL says. He speaks in nonsense. From what I've heard of his statements, I think he wants everyone who doesn't believe in pure shariah law to curl up and die a horrible death. I don't think there's anything he really wants the West to do or not do other than die horribly and burn in hell.

Either way, I was disgusted at the wave of patriotism that erupted after 9/11. People waving flags and bandying around "freedom" and "liberty" while giving up their rights, beating up little old ladies in head shawls, and invading small countries. "Freedom" and "Liberty" are words and nothing more. China's army is the "People's Liberation Army." Well, is it the "People's"? Who is it "Liberating"? You can't talk to me about "Freedom" and "Liberty" when the government can snoop my E-mails and phone calls or arrest me and detain me forever without charging me with a crime.

In Christianity there is this concept of "words without works." In common English, the phrase is, "You can talk the talk but can you walk the walk?" I refused to fly an American flag for years after 9/11 because I was so ashamed that our country's reaction to that event was to do the most un-American things imaginable.

So I'm glad to hear that this is happening. On the day that this country can live up to its ideals, I'll be glad to talk about freedom and liberty.


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21624 posts, RR: 55
Reply 23, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 3944 times:



Quoting Santosdumont (Reply 17):
I can think of no better tribute to the fallen than to rebuild both towers exactly as they were (with appropriate modifications to update the structure, etc)...

Nor can I. And if they had done that, then I'd be fine with calling it the World Trade Center.

But, unfortunately, that's not what they're doing.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineStasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3283 posts, RR: 6
Reply 24, posted (5 years 5 months 3 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 3942 times:

Quoting Max550 (Reply 16):
It was supposed to be done in 2009, then 1st quarter of 2011, then

If the "Freedom" tower is done in 2013, it will truly be a miracle.

Ongoing lawsuits between design firms, construction companies, insurers, the city of New York, and the families of those murdered on 9/11 are likely to cause numerous starts and stops to the construction.

Furthermore, over 750 bones or bone fragments have been removed in the past year from a vacant skyscraper that the WTC south tower collapsed into because cleanup still has not been fully completed at damaged building on the site's outskirts. In all, some 20,000 pieces of human remains have been found since the collapse of the original towers , but the DNA in most of these bone fragments was too damaged to yield matches to victims. Everytime more bones are discovered, construction must be stopped while the authorities move in for a lengthy examination of the location of the discovery.

Also, the renamed Freedom tower will indeed be called "World Trade Center One", NOT "One World Trade Center". Personally, the site is a hallowed ground and outside of a memorial to those killed, nothing should be built on their bones IMO. I say that the authorities build new towers (with state of the art infrastructure) in the image of the old towers along the edge of the site where other WTC buildings have been torn down.

[Edited 2009-03-27 15:38:53]


"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
25 Af773atmsp : Even if the Freedom Tower will be called the World Trade Center New York City still doesn't look the same without the original towers. The World Trade
26 Post contains links Lufthansa411 : It was never officially named the freedom tower. It was only given that moniker by former NY governor Pataki and a couple of NY politicians to be "pa
27 ER757 : That is exactly what I thought when I saw the title of this thread. It's unfortunate that the word "freedom" was attached to so many things in the af
28 Steeler83 : Damn right! I still want the Twin Towers to be rebuilt, and I am all in favor of them being taller to symbolize our defiance and resilience towards t
29 DocLightning : And change happens. Embrace it. This is why I believe that New York stands to lose its position as a major center of culture. The place has gotten to
30 Us330 : Well, on a lighter note, I guess Braveheart was wrong. They can indeed take our "Freedom"
31 StasisLAX : Doc, I look at the WTC site through the same filter as I look at Valley Forge National Battlefield or Gettysburg or the USS Arizona memorial. It shou
32 Post contains links STT757 : All the Buildings at the World Trade Center have the numbers as they did before, in fact the first building to have been rebuilt at the World Trade C
33 Af773atmsp : Since Tom Burnett used to live in Minnesota it would be a great idea if MSP was changed to Minneapolis/St. Paul Tom Burnett International Airport. A
34 Post contains links STT757 : To honor the passengers of UA flt # 93 I would have renamed EWR "Todd Beamer International AIrport" (New Jersey resident) and SFO "Mark Bingham Inter
35 LTBEWR : Adding Liberty to the formal name may be in part to recognize the loss of New Jersey resident Todd Beemer and others from the region who were murdered
36 Par13del : My open question to the US as a nation would be why has it take so long, should the Federal govt. have been involved in ensuring that all remain focu
37 Steeler83 : How about the question: Suppose UA93 wasn't taken over and it had crashed into the Capitol (as it has been suggested that THAT very building was that
38 LTBEWR : If the USA Capital had been successfully hit by UA93, it would have been rebuilt very quickly, to exactly the same appearance inside and out due to i
39 JFKMan : Freedom Tower was perhaps not the best name...but WTC 1 is a lot worse.
40 Post contains links StasisLAX : Here's the name announcement of the WTC.com website. Source: http://www.wtc.com/news/freedom-tower-has-a-new-preferred-name
41 STT757 : One World Trade Center is the original name.
42 ExFATboy : I believe the timetable is for external construction to be completed in late 2012, with internal completion and occupancy mid-2013. Of course, occupa
43 Post contains links STT757 : 2011 for the memorial 2012 One World Trade Center ready for first tenant 2013 for the Transportation hub ???? for World Trade Center Towers 2,3,4,5 C
44 Steeler83 : I agree whole-heartedly with you there. They really should just dub this whole monstrosity as Pataki center... I guess this is a lesson we will never
45 ANCFlyer : Criminal. Absolute BS. The PC crowd wins again, so they rent the space to the Chinese. Paid in blood, repaid in $$$. Shameful.
46 STT757 : It was always called One World Trade Center, this "Freedom Tower" thing was from Pataki trying to show how patriotic he was for a possible Presidenti
47 DocLightning : That's the exact same horsehonkey that's been delaying this project in the first place. Who cares why it's being built or whose ego is carrying the w
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