OzGlobal From France, joined Nov 2004, 2615 posts, RR: 4 Posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 3899 times:
My American fellow a.netters are going to have to help me out here. Even though I went to school in Washington DC as a kid and know something of US culture, even though I saw American voters return Bush after the cat was totally out of the bag on Iraq, this one is beyond the powers of my political imagination. How on God's earth can so many Americans with access to the internet, cable TV and any other number of communication channels arrive at the conclusion that their elected president was not born in their own country?
Tugger From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 4667 posts, RR: 7 Reply 1, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3880 times:
Remember, we have people here who believe, I mean REALLY believe that we didn't go to the moon! And there is still a large contingent that are sure there was a second shooter and conspiracy involved in JFK's assassination.
It doesn't take much to get people to believe something if that's what they want to do. There are crazies everywhere. I laugh at the idiot who didn't deploy because he didn't believe President Obama was born a citizen of the USA and so wasn't his commander in chief, I guess he thought that everyone in the chain of command was also illegitimate. Since his service was strictly voluntary he wasn't obligated to go anyway. (He just didn't want to go and was scared to say so, which makes his dodge even more dishonorable, just admit it and don't go.)
Anyway, my point is that lots of people can disbelieve what every you present as fact. Even pictures, documents, statements, anything. It's sad but its true.
Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
JakeOrion From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1247 posts, RR: 2 Reply 3, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3865 times:
Quoting Tugger (Reply 1): Remember, we have people here who believe, I mean REALLY believe that we didn't go to the moon! And there is still a large contingent that are sure there was a second shooter and conspiracy involved in JFK's assassination.
I'm going to take it up a step (by several thousand I mean):
Just show the damn paper copy already. ALL of you on A.net say the Internet is a source of manipulative information, and we should take everything with a fine grain of salt. Now, all of a sudden when it comes to Birth Certificates, its 100% OK?
OK, so no one is allowed to question the validity of anything on the Internet anymore, period.
Every problem has a simple solution; finding the simple solution is the difficult problem.
MSNDC9 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 4, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3867 times:
Quoting OzGlobal (Thread starter): How on God's earth can so many Americans with access to the internet, cable TV and any other number of communication channels arrive at the conclusion that their elected president was not born in their own country?
Not saying I agree with them, but in a nut shell - the media routinely lies to the public. They did it this weekend on the Sarah Palin divorce issue - a myth generated by a blogger for crying out loud which was gleefully regurgitated by several media outlets.
This same media is viewed majoritively as being in the tank for Obama.
End result - a large percentage of a given population won't buy it.
Just show the damn paper copy already. ALL of you on A.net say the Internet is a source of manipulative information, and we should take everything with a fine grain of salt. Now, all of a sudden when it comes to Birth Certificates, its 100% OK?
Not at all, but he had to supply this document to the electoral authorities in order to launch has candidacy. This is well known; plus here is a facsimile of said document. If it's fake, with all that is at stake, it should have been easy enough to prove by now!!!
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
N229NW From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 1854 posts, RR: 35 Reply 6, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3841 times:
Quoting OzGlobal (Thread starter): How on God's earth can so many Americans with access to the internet, cable TV and any other number of communication channels arrive at the conclusion that their elected president was not born in their own country?
Unfortunately most people in most places are pretty easy to manipulate because they don't think for themselves and don't or can't think critically.Conspiracy theories are particularly attractive to people. I remember surveys that over 50% of Turks believed 9/11 was an inside job, for example.
Or look at the number of people who believe in Astrology, homeopathy, in a huge number of countries...
Basically, I'm appalled, but I can't say I'm surprised.
Max550 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1114 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3837 times:
Quoting JakeOrion (Reply 3): Just show the damn paper copy already. ALL of you on A.net say the Internet is a source of manipulative information, and we should take everything with a fine grain of salt. Now, all of a sudden when it comes to Birth Certificates, its 100% OK?
It's been shown
Quoting MSNDC9 (Reply 4): Not saying I agree with them, but in a nut shell - the media routinely lies to the public. They did it this weekend on the Sarah Palin divorce issue - a myth generated by a blogger for crying out loud.
They do, which is why they should back up their stories with evidence, like they have in this case. We've seen a birth certificate and announcement of birth in a newspaper, what more do you want.
There is nothing that would convince these people.
JakeOrion From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1247 posts, RR: 2 Reply 8, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3831 times:
Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 5): If it's fake, with all that is at stake, it should have been easy enough to prove by now!!!
Yes, by providing a paper copy. All of this will go away once people see the paper copy, that's all he has to do. Why is that so hard?
Every problem has a simple solution; finding the simple solution is the difficult problem.
Srbmod From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 16896 posts, RR: 51 Reply 9, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3832 times:
Quoting Dtwclipper (Reply 2): Can we have this tin foil hats an the Not this Sh%t again picture please!
While we're at it, I'll even throw in this one:
Considering the legs this matter has, it's definitely not going to go away anytime soon. Remember, there were folks questioning Sen. McCain's eligibility because he was born in the Panama Canal Zone.
My own feeling is that as long as one parent is a natural-born citizen of the United States, it should not even matter where a President was born, as to me, they are considered to be an American citizen by birth. While some countries (like the US) do consider a child born in their country to be a citizen of their country, they are not forced to take said citizenship.
Max550 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 1114 posts, RR: 0 Reply 10, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3827 times:
Quoting JakeOrion (Reply 8):
Yes, by providing a paper copy. All of this will go away once people see the paper copy, that's all he has to do. Why is that so hard?
Superfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 38599 posts, RR: 79 Reply 11, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3823 times:
Quoting OzGlobal (Thread starter): How on God's earth can so many Americans with access to the internet, cable TV and any other number of communication channels arrive at the conclusion that their elected president was not born in their own country?
There is your answer right there.
Many in the GOP are Bible-thumping religious folks that get their information from their Pastors, other church members and that feller down the street.
They ain't in to all this new fangled stuff like the enternet & cable tayvee.
JakeOrion From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 1247 posts, RR: 2 Reply 12, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3809 times:
Quoting OzGlobal (Reply 5):
If it's fake, with all that is at stake, it should have been easy enough to prove by now!!!
Yes, by providing a paper copy. All of this will go away once people see the paper copy, that's all he has to do. Why is that so hard?
Oh, and let us not foget about the birth announcements in the local papers or did he use the CIA's Atavachron to go back in time and fix that too. That goes against the prime directive too!
MSNDC9 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 14, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3794 times:
Quoting Dtwclipper (Reply 13): Oh, and let us not foget about the birth announcements in the local papers
At the time, those were automatically generated in Hawaii when a birth was reported. It didn't matter if the person was born in Hawaii or not, just that someone reported a live birth to the government. But that's beside the point.
StasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3270 posts, RR: 6 Reply 15, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 3774 times:
Quoting OzGlobal (Thread starter): How on God's earth can so many Americans with access to the internet, cable TV and any other number of communication channels arrive at the conclusion that their elected president was not born in their own country?
The answer to your question is simple. Because there are A LOT of racists in America that cannot accept the FACT that a politically progressive black man is the President of the United States.
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
Dreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 7900 posts, RR: 22 Reply 16, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 3758 times:
Nobody seems to talk about the fact that that "birth certificate" was created in the past few years, using a laserjet. Where is the original, created and dated in 1961?
Look, I understand sometimes having to get a new Birth Cirtificate issued. But can they at least explain the case? Having a BC created for a candidate with Obama's popularity would be a simple thing to do with the right connections. Why does nobody even mention this? I'll bet this certificate is less than 2 or 3 years old.
Personally, I have always thought that he was born in the US and this is a non-issue. But showing this obviously non-original document without explanations just makes matters worse.
FuturePilot16 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2018 posts, RR: 0 Reply 18, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 3747 times:
Quoting OzGlobal (Thread starter): How on God's earth can so many Americans with access to the internet, cable TV and any other number of communication channels arrive at the conclusion that their elected president was not born in their own country?
Well, Oz, Americans, are idiots in a lot of cases. I heard people say the real reason is that the U.S. wants to complete the new world order, and Obama is a lot better to convince than McCain. I think a lot of these same Americans believe every U.S. presidential election in history has been rigged, they've come up with all kinds of excuses, now it's Obama's turn. My hope to you people in other countries is not to take most Americans too seriously. We actually have an ammunition shortage in this country right now because people are arming themselves in order to protect themselves from the gov't. They are morons, and should be ignored. This issue doesn't even anger me anymore, i've been hearing about it since a few days after 9/11 when people claimed the gov't planned it and still remains the biggest conspiracy theory in this country.
"The brave don't live forever, but the cautious don't live at all."
GDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 12737 posts, RR: 79 Reply 19, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 3734 times:
As stated, the basic lack of a reasonably intelligent adult person's power of reasoning is what strikes you.
These types are basically still young kids and not very bright ones.
The phrase 'cannot see the wood from the trees' comes to mind, the idea that someone who, from the early stages of his public life, up the political ladder, would have more and more of his background scrutinized, until getting to the place where, as in all cases, extremely detailed background checks are carried out for a Presidential Candidate.
Some might think this does not happen, it does, think about it, the person who has the authority to destroy much of human civilization by the fact that they and no one else, can authorize the release of the most destructive power in the world, the US nuclear weapons inventory.
Any Presidential candidate will probably be the most scrutinized person alive, but not just in public.
However, in many of the people who actually give any credence to this idea, could it be that they don't actually full believe, but that they want to believe their President is some kind of Islamic Manchurian Candidate .
The ones who believe or want to believe this stuff, are the ones who were most viscerally opposed to him, not just along party lines, policy, or any aspects of his public personality.
Just the idea of him , for some it's part of his background being so cosmopolitan for a US President, others his colour.
Add in the paranoia and fear, which it is, of anything not very familiar to them.
Never mind not traveling abroad, I bet quite a few never crossed their State Line.
I understood at least one GOP lawmaker, while not fully endorsing this stuff in public, brings it up in a sly way, thinks 'it should be looked at'.
(Like it hasn't been!)
Obama might well benefit from that, having some of his political opponents make such fools of themselves, which will only gain the approval of those who would never vote for Obama in a million years anyway.
Let's face it, Mrs Palin's sly comments at rallies last year, extolling the virtues of real Americans did not do her any good.
Neither did the images of some shouting 'kill him' or 'he's a terrorist' in the crowds, McCain of course had no time for such nonsense and said so, Palin however.......
Michlis From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 737 posts, RR: 2 Reply 20, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 3708 times:
EA772LR From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2836 posts, RR: 10 Reply 21, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 3695 times:
IMHO, it's interesting that Obama has spent nearly $1,000,000.00 in litigation trying to "dodge" the release of personal records. Records that every other U.S. President has released. I like to think of Obama as the Affirmative Action President.
Quoting N229NW (Reply 6): Unfortunately most people in most places are pretty easy to manipulate because they don't think for themselves and don't or can't think critically.
Yeah no kidding. Just look at who won the 2008 U.S. Presidential election. I was inline voting with a bunch of yahoos wearing Obama shirts who could barely speak plain English...but sure they know who they're voting for. You, as a citizen of this country, should have to take an exam to show that you are informed about the issues at hand and what's at stake.
We often judge others by their actions, but ourselves by our intentions.
KiwiRob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 5425 posts, RR: 3 Reply 22, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 3685 times:
Quoting Tugger (Reply 1): And there is still a large contingent that are sure there was a second shooter and conspiracy involved in JFK's assassination.
Well this is probably one theory that could be true.
N229NW From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 1854 posts, RR: 35 Reply 23, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 3677 times:
Quoting JakeOrion (Reply 3): I'm going to take it up a step (by several thousand I mean):
Sweeet. This is my favorite quote, showing their "scientific evidence" for why the earth is flat:
Once again, picture in your mind a round world. Now imagine that there are two people on this world, one at each pole. For the person at the top of the world, (the North Pole), gravity is pulling him down, towards the South Pole. But for the person at the South Pole, shouldn't gravity pull him down as well? What keeps our person at the South Pole from falling completely off the face of the "globe"?
GDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 12737 posts, RR: 79 Reply 24, posted (3 years 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 3659 times:
Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 23): Well this is probably one theory that could be true.
Why? 18 years after JFK, Reagan was shot by a lone nut.
Thought it could get him into Jodie Foster's knickers, if only he knew....!
Some of the fall out from the infamous 'Manson Family' tried to get President Ford in the mid 70's.
So it seems that US Presidents are, always have been, most at risk from home grown nuts, not from some dark conspiracies domestic or foreign.
25 Garnetpalmetto: You know I often see that number bandied about on the 'net but I've yet to see a hard source that isn't the likes of WND, Free Republic, Right Wing B
26 Tugger: My understanding is that Hawaii digitized their birth records and destroyed the originals. If this is the case (and I have seen nothing disputing tha
27 MadameConcorde: This whole thing should have been investigated before BHO was elected, not after. There are more urgent matters that have to be taken care of it seems
28 AGM100: Its not underhanded ..its about all they have to defend the President and his policies. I believe Orielly has it right .... they want the issue to co
29 DocLightning: Do you have yours? I sure don't have mine. I have my passport as my ultimate proof that I am a U.S. Citizen. I suppose that when I go back to Michiga
30 StasisLAX: Me and the editorial board of the Los Angeles Times (I know, the Times editors are communists, weak, unAmerican, blah, blah, blah).... but the point
31 Superfly: It has been brought up MANY times before he was elected President. Time and time again, it has been debunked. Hawaii's Republican governor Linda Ling
32 Racko: I doubt that Barack Obama is male. He might have been misleading the public the whole time. Has anybody seen proof that he is? What is he hiding?
33 AirframeAS: You don't need it. All you need is the birth certificate number.
34 DocLightning: In fact, they have. He released medical records. Admittedly, I doubt he has a karyotype sitting around.
35 AGM100: Of course I dont hate the man ... I kind of feel sorry for him . He has been shot to the top by a small group of DNC operators who met in that office
36 DocLightning: We agree there. I also agree that his spending was way overboard, although in many ways, I am glad to see that there is at least stability occurring.
37 StarAC17: I would say so but as this clip puts it, this will never go away unless everyone rational says to these nuts this is and to STFU this will never go a
38 AGM100: OK I give it to you .. he is right in what he is saying. The problem is that he never shut his yapper about President Bush... so basically he has no
39 Gemuser: Don't know specifically about US states but in 1961, generally, in the English speaking world there is NO such thing as an "orginal" birth certificat
40 StarAC17: Not so fast on that one, Maher has been tough on Obama and taken heat from the left as well on his remarks. Clip Below (starting at 2:05) I think he
41 EA772LR: Correct, and we were at the Hermitage Library, and when we got just inside the door where the voting booths were, they were told to take their shirts
42 Sv7887: Hi All, For pete's sakes Obama is the President. He won fair and square, people need to get over that. As a conservative Republican I am embarrassed a
43 L-188: Oz did you happen to see who did the poll. That alone explains the results. My personal feelings are that the lefties are trying to distract attentio
44 FlyDeltaJets87: Just to play devil's advocate in all this and have some fun on a couple posts: Well using Microsoft Word to edit documents from the 1970s is not above
45 7324ever: Oh well that's inconclusive! Prove gods real with a birth certificate than ill believe Obama was not born in Kenya!
46 Seb146: Oh, for pete's sake. Let's look at this from a different angle: Obama was not even the front-runner when he submitted to run for president! He did no
47 Baroque: Although to be fair what is even funnier is that the Birthers forged a Keyan birth cert using the information from a late middle aged guy in Adelaide
48 Dtwclipper: "The fake Kenyan birth document has been circulated by political opponents of Obama's, called the Birthers, who are out to unseat him. A growing onli
49 Dtwclipper: I see, so Mrs O. called in from Kenya to some insider in Hawaii (because she knew her son would grow up and run for President some day) and had this
50 Baroque: I just hope that America is as amazed ast the good Mr Bomford was - VERY!! Alas we only know part of the story, as Google says: PM - Adelaide man cau
51 MSNDC9: If you had a kid in London and weren't going to be back to the US for a couple of years and wanted your child to have dual citizenship, then yes you
52 MadameConcorde: I knew Linda Lingle very well from my multi-numerous travels to Oahu, Maui, etc. through friends in Hawaii. I was in Honolulu when she had her gubern
53 Seb146: Knowing full well her boy would become president someday. Right. Hawaii is the first place I would call. I was born in Kansas. I contacted the state
54 MadameConcorde: What is the difference between the "certificate of live birth" and "birth certificate"? They are saying it is two different things but how?
55 Dtwclipper: And with that ladies and gentleman, the case is closed. Done, move on. There is no "IF" or "WHEN". See above.
56 Max550: I think it depends on the state more than anything. The information on them varies as well. My "certification of birth" doesn't even have my parents
57 AGM100: Only tough because he has not gone totally off the chart left wing as Maher would want it. Nothing short of federal coin operated Abortion booths , A
58 Michlis: Nice stereotype and quite offensive actually. Have you ever met or got to know some of these "Bible-thumpers"? Believe it or not there are a lot of D
60 MSNDC9: That's not really germaine to the issue. This is simply the action people take when they have a child born outside the US. John McCain was born in Pa
61 Planespotting: I also see this number posted on conservative blogs and newspaper comment boards, but have never actually seen any hard proof to back this up. Care t
62 GDB: 'Affirmate Action President?' Translation - Uppity. Sv7887, you represent the future of the Republican Party, these 'birthers', their nudge and wink f
63 D L X: I want everyone on here to watch this video - this person is the person behind the Birther Movement. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMUaca8wP9w Now as
64 AverageUser: Ok, here we have yet another brilliant way Internet reshapes (American) politics. It's now official that everyone can cut, paste and photoshop, not ju
65 EMBQA: Well... I have no real opinion on either side, but what really got all this started was the inital resistance to provide the information. Many took t
66 D L X: Here's a question: if Obama's birth certificate that he has produced is fake, who did the faking? And what motivation did they have?
67 EMBQA: Well... IF...... to get a popular canadate ellected to push through a parties policies.
68 MSNDC9: No one cares man. Don't get all spun up. Oh, and I don't like him because he's a typical Chicago politician that thinks he knows whats better for me
69 Garnetpalmetto: It's never been claimed that the certified copy of President Obama's birth certificate is original to his birth, rather it's a certified copy dated J
70 GDB: Usual pattern here, de-bunk it totally, so another spurious claim is made. And I await any of you who give even tiniest credence to any of this, or sa
71 Michlis: That's a great question. Do you have an answer? Like Lyndon Larouche?
72 EA772LR: Affirmative Action is reverse racism in itself. Depriving someone of a job based solely on skin color is the same thing as not hiring someone because
73 Max550: That would depend who gets to make the test. And why, after making the fake birth certificate and getting all the Hawaiian officials to go along with
74 EMBQA: We did have a way...just stand back and listen..... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mm1KOBMg1Y8
75 EA772LR: " target=_blank>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mm1KO...Mg1Y8 That's unbelievable. This further proves my point:
76 D L X: So, you're saying that McCain lost because he was white? Because I fail to see how affirmative action had anything to do with Obama's election. Your
77 Mt99: Maybe we should appoint you as the person who "approves" every single voter... Would that still be a democracy?
78 Michlis: I asked you if you have an answer to this question and since you used it to bait someone else don't you think it's fair that you answer it too? I'll
79 Max550: I don't think that anyone really doubts that most people who vote are uninformed on a lot of issues. They could do the same poll with McCain voters,
80 EA772LR: Well with no release of his college records to see his grades, and such a big deal made to prevent the release of his records, what is he hiding othe
81 EMBQA: ..and that my friend is the scary part of todays world..............
82 Max550: It's scary that we allow everyone to vote? I know it's not a perfect system but I don't think it's been done better anywhere else.
83 EMBQA: No.. it's just scary just how ill informed many voters are as shown in the video I provided.
84 D L X: I'm sorry, but did YOU answer the question? I don't think you did. You know what my answer is. The answer is in the question. Hell, it's in the threa
85 Baroque: Presumably you get to vote on the suitability of the test before it is applied? Or are you just going to leave test compilation to D L X and me? We a
86 Seb146: And....? My mother's state of legal residince was Kansas, when I was born. Does that mean if I had been born in Jefferson City, that would change any
87 EA772LR: I'm not racist at all. I'm a professional jazz musician who spends plenty of time sharing music with blacks. Hell, I'd have voted in a heart beat for
88 7324ever: Thank you that is a great way to show that now-a-days people get their info more from CNN and TMZ than from watching debates. If people spent half as
89 OzGlobal: The democratic system, as Churchill said, is "the worst form of government in the world, except for every other form of government." Obviously, it's
90 Michlis: That's fair enough, but do you believe the theories launched by the Democrats?
91 Kiwiandrew: I find this story very hard to take seriously . Are we really meant to believe that 58% of GOP supporters are actually aware of the existence of life
92 Sbworcs: But where is the proof of the cost? I think that some people just don't want him to be President and are trying anything to discredit him - regardles
93 Michlis: The same can be said of people who disagreed with the former President.
94 Max550: What makes you think that the majority voted based on skin color? Gore got 95% of the black vote in 2000 and Kerry got 93% in 2004. 97% sounds high u
95 Baroque: In a roundabout way you support what I am saying, possibly you may not realise it. Have you experience of setting tests? And have you looked at discr
96 Seb146: Such as? Possibly no WMDs in Iraq? Could it be the vote counting fraud in Florida in 2000 (Gore actually had more votes after the US Supreme Court in
97 Michlis: Forged memorandums concerning his military career. That's one that comes to immediate mind. Listened to bad intelligence...let's not go down this pat
98 Santosdumont: One of the most intriguing parts of Joe Klein's Primary Colors is the claim that Clinton fathered a child by an African-American woman and then moved
99 D L X: Ahh, the "some of my best friends are black" retort. That has utterly nothing to do with your accusation that Obama is an "affirmative action preside
100 Michlis: It's not about the equality of the behavior. It's about whether it's right or wrong and I would most certainly say it's wrong no matter who does it.
101 GDB: Still waiting for a proper explanation of how any questions, irregularities, on Obama's birth escaped the attentions of the Secret Service and any oth
102 D L X: If we're talking about within a court of law, then yes, all perjury is perjury. But we're not talking about courts of law. (I mean, let's think about
103 Thebatman: Yeah, Obama got a lot of information from that nutjob Jeremiah Wright by attending his church for 20+ years, but that's OK because he says he wasn't
104 Superfly: So what does this have to do with President Obama's birth certificate?
105 Michlis: I'm talking about lying in general. I believe lying is wrong period no matter what the circumstances. But that is just me. Great, we can call it the
106 EA772LR: Once again, pay attention D L X. It's not what I feel is important. That's why I said there needs to be a standards test to prove you are aware of wh
107 Thebatman: Read through the various replies, they've touched on subjects other than the birth certificate. He refuses to present the paper copy for a reason. Wh
108 Superfly: You've ignored my post which were on topic. President Obama was born here in the United States. You post in reply #103 just looks like an incoherent
109 Thebatman: Hmmm...I'm ignoring your post, huh? This IS your post, correct? I was adressing specifically the point of getting information from your church. Like
110 Superfly: Can you please point out any legislation by President Obama that comes out of Trinity United Church of Christ?
111 DLPMMM: This has got to be one of the stupidist thread ever concieved. The initial premise is based on a poll published by the Daily Kos. It has no credibilit
112 Yellowstone: Daily Kos doesn't run their own polls; they contract with the polling firm Research 2000, which is quite reputable. Nate Silver over at fivethirtyeig
113 Santosdumont: There's a difference between being skeptical and dialing the screech-o-meter to 11 by irresponsibly tossing around words like "socialist" -- followin
114 AustinAirport: Wow. I, just today, had an hour long argument with one of my friends, about this subject. Wish I had had those links then.
115 Thebatman: #1- I don't believe I have to tell you that taking my guns is certainly part of their agenda. #2- The government is repossessing lots of gas-guzzlers
116 Yellowstone: *sigh* #1 - No, the administration is not going to come take your guns. That lie has been told about countless Democratic politicians, and how many h
117 Seb146: About the fact that Gore carried Florida? Well, after the votes were actually counted and after the SCOTUS installed Bush as the president because of
118 Pellegrine: Well obviously 58% of the GOP who responded to this poll are ignorant or bitter or racists or just plain stupid (JPS.). There is really nothing more t
119 Baroque: Mmmmm. A number of assertions and a "guess". As they say, evidence?????? I would be fascinated to know where the dissection of the work habits, tax p
120 Babybus: I hope you counted me in on that too. Isn't that the attraction of Obama? No one knows anything about him. He is everything to everybody; he's black,
121 Santosdumont: So the answer to questions 1-5 is "no."
122 Jcs17: Nice. That's a very thoughtful and considerate post. I think there are numerous questions that haven't been answered, not just about where Obama was
123 Aaron747: The federal government, Supreme Court and Electoral College have all confirmed him to be the President. What higher measure of definitiveness do you
124 Thebatman: Yeah, keep looking the other way. Keep sticking up for a guy that wants government to control every aspect of our lives. Wow. I can't believe you wou
125 Santosdumont: Have they told you what cable company you can choose? Have they dictated what cell phone and Internet provide you must use? Have they said you must t
126 Thebatman: Like the government owning GM and Chrysler, the financial companies....yeah, this kind of stuff will NEVER happen. I never said this would happen tom
127 Pellegrine: Forgetting political alliances, would you rather have no GM and Chrysler? Would you rather have the American financial dominance decimated? What is w
128 JBirdAV8r: You know, for someone who claims to be an expert in finance and trading, you don't seem to have a good grasp on this. Those aren't the only two choic
129 Seb146: I find it very interesting these same supporters of the GOP (in general, NOT these two posters) are so willing to defend to the death one president w
130 Pellegrine: My specialty for sure is not old, bankrupt companies, I cannot be bothered. Sure I think they'd be t-o-a-s-t, who'd finance them? Who in this economy
131 Thebatman: I'm a conservative first, republican second. Bush was not financially conservative. I never said I would defend him to the death. Because he's not ho
132 Santosdumont: Re-adjust your lens. We're talking about two totally different things. Partial government ownership of a company -- while not exactly jibing with fre
133 Dreadnought: Tell that to Ford, who last month had to start competing against ridiculous cash rebates offered by Chrysler (financed with OUR money). Last month, w
134 Mt99: How come Ford has the #1 car bought with the program? http://money.cnn.com/2009/08/04/auto...s/index.htm?postversion=2009080515[Edited 2009-08-07 13:
135 Thebatman: Not according to what I read. 6 out of 10 cars are imports. Top 10 New Vehicles Purchased 1. Toyota Corolla 2. Ford Focus 3. Honda Civic 4. Toyota Pr
136 JCS17: I actually got about six paragraphs into a response before I realized this is a completely incoherent post. ACORN, the Roman Catholic Church, the War
137 Dreadnought: I think you are seeing the effects of the GM and Chrysler bail outs. People (including me) are refusing to buy a Chrysler or GM product because of th
138 Aaron747: Pssssh who needs that when you can buy into one of these? I hope when my midlife crisis rolls round I'll be putting 100K into a share of a Mooney rat
139 AustinAirport: Well Said! They look for the tiniest little things to criticize because they are prejudice. Cannot STAND PREJUDICES.
140 Ha763: Actually, that is incorrect. The automatic birth announcements in the Hawaii newspapers at the time were gathered directly from the records the hospi
141 T prop: Of the top ten C4C cars 4 are Fords including #1 & 2. http://money.cnn.com/2009/08/07/auto...s/index.htm?postversion=2009080709 As for Chrysler rebat
142 Baroque: Do the cars come with birth certificates and what is Obama doing to stop the rebirthing of cars? Perhaps he needs a coalition with the birthers? Oh,
143 JCS17: Tiniest things? Like the Constitution? Again, I'm not trying to be a birfer, but God, I just hate Obama because he's a black man in the White House.
144 Seb146: Actually, ACORN was signing up voters. Not Democratic voters, but voters. Those signing up voters forged documents. ACORN helped with housing and foo
145 EA772LR: They didn't have to, the Black Panthers accomplished that all by themselves. How else will Obama pay for all of his spending? It's quite simple math.
146 Seb146: How about unemployment continues to rise because people are buying fewer things because they have less money to spend because they are being laid off
147 EA772LR: Simple...are you ready to catch this? People are continuing to be laid off because employers can't afford to keep them, because sales, supply and dem
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