Acclamed Film Diector Roman Polanski was arrested at the airport in Zurich as he entered Switzerland for a film Festival there where he was to be given an award for his work and for a retrospective on his films. The long standing warrent was for feeing proscutiton due to charges of rape on a (13 age) minor in 1977 in Los Angeles, California at the then home of Jack Nicholson. He is a citizen of France and he escaped to there to under the less strict standards of travel then. France is very protective of granting extradition of their citizens to other countries so the warrent could not be served there.
Although he has been in Switzerland and other European countries a number of times (but not the UK due to the outstanding warrent) since escaping to France in 1978, one has to wonder why it was served on him and arrested at this time. Some speculation is the recent crackdown on USA Citizens evading taxes with arranged secret accounts in Swiss banks may have one reason, another is that the current Justice Dept. of Pres. Obama made a push to arrange for the Swiss to arrest him. Polanski currently is appealing the original California State warrent in the US Circuit Court (9th) on grounds of Judicial misconduct, that the Judge renegend on a plea agreement where Polanski would have served a short time in jail. Of course, his flight during the late stages of the trial meant he violated other laws too. Then there is the whole political issue of alleged drugging then raping of the then 13 year old woman.
I posted this in the context of a recent post made in the main Avition section of a Dual National Dutch-Argentine pilot arrested in Spain for his part in murders of people of Spanish citizenship during a past governance of Argentina.
LAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 24164 posts, RR: 50
Reply 3, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 3723 times:
Living it up in Europe all these years snubbing his nose an making a mockery of the US justice system.
Quoting SOBHI51 (Reply 2): But lets agree he is innocent till proven guilty. So he has to stand trial again.
He already had his time in court, and plead guilty. But he fled the country prior to his sentencing in 1978. (actualy on the day of his sentencing by going to LAX and buying a seat on BA flight to London).
[Edited 2009-09-27 16:15:17]
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
LTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 51
Reply 5, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 3716 times:
Quoting LTBEWR (Thread starter): Although he has been in Switzerland and other European countries a number of times (but not the UK due to the outstanding warrent) since escaping to France in 1978, one has to wonder why it was served on him and arrested at this time. Some speculation is the recent crackdown on USA Citizens evading taxes with arranged secret accounts in Swiss banks may have one reason, another is that the current Justice Dept. of Pres. Obama made a push to arrange for the Swiss to arrest him.
In Focus Online, they said that there was an international arrest warrant for Roman Polanski since 2005, so perhaps the Swiss simply chose to act on that arrest warrant.
Anyway, I don't care if the victim forgave him or not, he has to go to Prison for commiting this rape.
Ken777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8018 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 3704 times:
From what I read the local DA in California learned the bum was going to be in Switzerland on a certain date and put the paperwork together. Not for the first time.
As for the rape, a grown man doesn't have a meaningful sexual relationship with a 13 year old girl. A 13 year old boy might hope for one, but a grown man should be heading to prison. Maybe we'll get lucky with this guy.
Aaron747 From Japan, joined Aug 2003, 7937 posts, RR: 27
Reply 8, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 3699 times:
Personally I'm a big fan of noir films and Chinatown is one of his best works - but in the scene where Polanski plays that thug with the knife "right here kitty-cat"...he's undeniably creepy. Life imitates art, or the other way around??
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
Boeingfever777 From United States of America, joined Jul 2009, 409 posts, RR: 56
Reply 9, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 3685 times:
Quoting OA260 (Reply 4): Cant believe people didnt boycott his work . A 13 year old Girl drugged and raped and I hear people on the news defending him ?? They need to be thrown in jail also. Its sick....
StasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3280 posts, RR: 6
Reply 12, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 3596 times:
That the victim has forgiven him doesn't excuse Polanski's criminal behavior. Besides that, he makes movies. He isn't doing cancer research or developing clean water systems in the third world helping large numbers of people. How does being a filmmaker entitle someone to preferential legal treatment? Go to jail already!
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
ME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 26
Reply 13, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 3548 times:
Quoting LTU932 (Reply 5): In Focus Online, they said that there was an international arrest warrant for Roman Polanski since 2005, so perhaps the Swiss simply chose to act on that arrest warrant.
He often profited from the fact that police (including passport controls) is strictly a matter of the Cantons, and so entering in the Canton of Zurich or Geneva, getting to the Canton of Berne, he many times simply slipped through, as he was/is not a criminal high up on the lists. This time, somebody (???) gave a hint to the Cantonal Police at Zurich Airport. The rest was routine.
ME AVN FAN From Switzerland, joined May 2002, 13920 posts, RR: 26
Reply 15, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 3523 times:
Quoting OHLHD (Reply 14): So he has not been in the US since 30 years?
According to all reports he kept out of the USA ever since.
Quoting OHLHD (Reply 14): If guilty he should sit in for a long time.
First of all I cannot tell you whether his crime by Swiss law has "expired". If so, he will get released. Resulting in some USsers jumping up and down for a while. If not, he will in the end BE extradited and will then have to sit for a long time indeed. If however, France demands a "repatriation" he may get "extradited" to France and in such a case will not be in prison. So that the whole matter is business for the lawyers.
Falstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 5949 posts, RR: 28
Reply 19, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 3450 times:
Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 15): First of all I cannot tell you whether his crime by Swiss law has "expired". If so, he will get released
Quoting Offloaded (Reply 18): I can see that the statute of limitations may apply if he was never charged with the crime, but under Swiss law does the same apply to someone who was charged and convicted?
The statute of limitations stopped when he was convicted of the crime. He never served jail time because he fled the country. As far as US courts go he is still awaiting sentence. This would be similar if he was an escaped prisoner. We had a case here in Michigan recently where a woman who escaped from a Michigan prison in 1975 was found in California living a normal life. She was brought back to Michigan and sent back to prison for a while. She didn't serve her entire sentence, but that was up to the courts in Michigan to decide. Statute of Limitations also stop if a person is serving time in another state for another crime. When that person is released in the other state they can be charged with previous crimes in other states.
I don't see the Swiss doing much about it, the crime was not committed in their country. If they release him I guess we can count on the Swiss ignoring warrants for other criminals from other places too.
Slz396 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 3437 times:
According to the French Secretary of Foreign Affairs Bernard Kouchner, Switzerland is seriously contemplating releasing R.P. on bail.
If indeed the case, it offers a way out to the Swiss, who now have a diplomatic problem at hands thanks to some overly zealous officers at ZRH, since both France and Poland are firmly demanding his immediate release, whereas the US demands his extradition.
Since Switzerland is part of the Schengen zone a release on bail means R.P. could in fact return to France, which obviously won't extradite him to the US and the Swiss can then look like they merely followed the legal procedures only to find he ran off before it came to a decision on his extradition...
Slz396 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 3432 times:
On a side note, it might come as a shock to most Americans, but as an adult in Switzerland, you may have full sexual relations with a minor as of the age of 16 (even prostitution!), so the Swiss legal system may look at this case a bid differently then the average US citizen does...
Combine it with the fact it is a case from over 30 years ago and the strong diplomatic pressure from France and I think they are working very hard to find a face-saving way out, so the above scenario seems very plausible indeed.
PanHAM From Germany, joined May 2005, 8629 posts, RR: 26
Reply 22, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 3420 times:
From what I read in he link in the above, he pleaded guilty under a plea bargain arrangement which the judge did not accept. Polanski was never sentenced to a specified jail term, which would have been 2 or 3 years at the most of which he might have served 1 or 2 years. He fled the country when he learned that he might eventually have to serve an unreasonable long term.
I really doubt that Polanski will stay in extradition jail and it is unlikely that he will be extradited. His lawyers will fight this aöll the way through and this will take years. Switzerland has just made another diplomatic, they simply cannot keep him in prison for such a long time.
Falstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 5949 posts, RR: 28
Reply 23, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 3414 times:
Quoting Slz396 (Reply 20): thanks to some overly zealous officers at ZRH
Policemen doing their job isn't over zealous.
Quoting Slz396 (Reply 21): but as an adult in Switzerland, you may have full sexual relations with a minor as of the age (even prostitution!),
16 is different than 13. There are states in the US where 16 is the age of consent. A grown man having sex with a 13 year old is rather creepy!
Quoting Slz396 (Reply 20): since both France and Poland are firmly demanding his immediate release, whereas the US demands his extradition.
What does Poland have to do with this? The guy lives in France, flew to Zurich, was picked up by police there. His crime was commited in the USA. Those are all those people who should have a say in this. If I commited a serious crime in another country I doubt the USA would bother with me. I would have to do my time there like anyone else.
EMBQA From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 9363 posts, RR: 12
Reply 24, posted (4 years 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 3396 times:
People.. listen.. here is the deal.. There is no bond, there is no bail, there is no trail. He has already had is time in court and was found guilty. Between the time he pled guilty and he was due to show up to go to prison he took off to Europe. To with hold extradition is just spitting in the face of our court system. He has already had his trial and was found GUILTY.
[Edited 2009-09-28 06:18:37]
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
: Had this been a regular guy being arrested at ZRH while entering Switzerland, the whole world would be applauding the policemen, for having arrested
: I guess this means the French people wouldn't have a problem with the US harboring someone who committed child rape in France?
: I would agree. If this was just some run of the mill slob nobody would care. If this crime would have happened more recently he would probably not be
: Good that he is arrested. He raped/misused a thirteen year old girl, said its true - and ran away before he could be sentenced. He used his prominence
: Overzealous? Sheesh, what a cad you are! Polanski should be taking a dirt nap somewhere...
: Too true. I detest criminals wherever they are. I think we have to be careful not to diss his work though. We have to separate the artist from the pe
: Oh yeah, they'd be okay with it I am amazed at people coming out in defense of Polanski. One person even commented that the sex was "consensual." As
: Regardless of the soft tone some people here wish to take against the crime committed in 1977, this bum has been a international fugitive for 30 years
: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090928/...p_on_en_mo/eu_switzerland_polanski has some answers to some of the questions in this thread. A fair use exerpt:
34 ME AVN FAN
: There, as I saw in the meantime, is no time-limitation in either the USA or in Switzerland, the crime however has expired long ago in the view of the
: He deserves to be arrested for his selfish behavior. Even if he is innocent, who does he think he is that he can bail out of the country right before
: In the case of being prosecuted for it or in the case of serving a sentence? He was convicted already. He just didn't do his time. I didn't think tim
: France protecting a convicted child rapist is disgusting. Because they love that stuff and don't see anything wrong with an abberant immoral lifestyl
: Totally agree with you. The police in Zürich did what their duty is, and well done to him. I'm just amazed it's taken 30 years for him to be arreste
: Who put up the bail money for him back in '77? They would have forfeited that money when he didn't show up for sentencing. Continuation of bail while
: Yes, but... It'll be interesting to see if Polanski gets special treatment. If so, the Russian guy hired the wrong lawyers! Given he is 76 years of a
41 ME AVN FAN
: on CNN, an expert said that according to French law, a "minor" is less than 12 years old, just to give one example. I today saw a comment of one law-
: He pled guilty to the crime, so the statute of limitations point is moot. He is a fugitive from justice. Yeah, they seem to have much lower standards
: I agree. We can see once again the fine example Hollywood and their types set morally. To defend and reward this man is sickening and an outrage.
: [quote=WarRI1,reply=43]I agree. We can see once again the fine example Hollywood and their types set morally. To defend and reward this man is sickeni
: I did say "and their types", meaning any entertainment types who are defending and rewarding this guy. European and US. or any others. I do not remem
: To all that wonder...the guy drugged and raped a 13 year old girl, anally. He has skated by on some sort of elitist excuse that "he's an artist" and o
: Not that I care if he goes to jail or not, my personal opinion is that the LA Prosecutor must be running out of things to do in this case but I must m
: Dude that was the idea but he skipped the country before the sentencing. If he had just cowboy'd up and did the 45 days that he was sentenced do nobo
49 ME AVN FAN
: The statute of limitations is moot in so far as the Extradition Treaty apparently has an article saying that this is irrelevant. That he pled guilty
: Fully agree with you there. I can partly understand the princle of a country not wishing to extradite its own nationals, but this is precisely the ki
: Just because he's an artist, doesn't mean he is above the law. It's sickening that politicians are insisting that he should be freed because of his "c
: Why, pray tell, do you put the phrase convicted child rapist in quotes so as to undermine its importance and meaning??
: Let's review what this "honourable" French citizen did. Even in France, it would be rape. Polanski instructed the 13 year-old to get into a jacuzzi n
: Apparently it was to entertainment types in the '70s who took alcohol and drug-induced sexual escapades to a disturbing level of normality. Long gone
: I would not call raping a 13 year old little girl and then running when you're convicted and it's time to pay your dues for your actions honorable...
: Kinda feel sorry for Mr. Polanski. Had he been involved in a modelling industry instead of film he would be bonking underage girls as part of his "job
: I don't see how France can justify harboring an admitted, convicted child rapist. Polanski, if you can't do the time, don't do the crime!
: Actually, it's a fact - he did plead guilty. He admitted the crime. Obviously not irrelevant, judging by the actions we now witness by the Swiss. He
: I dont understand those hypocrits who are shocked and are protesting that this great artist has been arested. No matter if the girl he raped, now a mo
: No kidding... I just heard a great piece on John Gibbson on FoxNews Radio. He had someone on.. forgot her name and they talked about the facts of thi
: Actually, the principal thing that he is guilty of now is flight. The point of this exercise, at this point, appears to be to prove to celebrities an
62 ME AVN FAN
: The "crime" in question at that time would have been a minor offence in France as the age limit in France then was 12 years old I have no doubt that
: No need for the punctuation around the word - it was and is nothing less than an actual crime. Well, what a shame he wasn't in France at the time. In
: I have to wonder what the French reaction would have been if the US had treated thier request to extradite Noriega in a similar manner. If French citi
65 ME AVN FAN
: A) As he arrived in France, the French law was the only relevant one and not irrelevant at all B) In French law it would have been seen as just an of
: IMO there are two different perspectives in this case: 1) Polanski had sex with a young person. Since age of consent varies widely between countries,
: So a woman over the age of 11 who is sexually assualted has no legal recourse? This is astonishing if true.
: Age of consent in France was 15 at the time. Please note that 13 is still less than 15. Interesting to note that there was a sharp movement in France
: Ok, my mistake. I was following ME AV FAN´s posts, where he stated that at this time the age of consent in France was 12 without doublechecking it.
: The crime did not occur on French soil, so French law has NO bearing on ANYTHING.
: It does in the sense that extradition is usually done only if the committed crime is also a crime in the country where the person is captured. We wou
: First, oI want to make one thing clear: What Polansky did back in 1977 was clearly rape of a minor. Polanski had dual French-Polish citizenship, so th
: This may sound heartless, but I disagree. The attitude of the victim should not be taken into consideration. That is antithetical to rule of law. If
: The funny thing is that from a certain side you´ll usually hear that it is fine that the victim´s will should be taken into account to increase a p
: Keep in mind, the victim Samantha Geimer received an undisclosed civil settlement from Polanski. Interestingly she also filed court papers asking the
: That may, at times, have a certain emotional appeal, but it is not in keeping with the rule of law. If part of the social contract is that we are all
: This sounds logical. His artistic achievements should play no role in this case, else you could argue that an athlete who rapes a woman, should go fr
: Being a fugitive from justice for 30+ years is not keeping clean..... Deserves it for running from the law.......he probably has less than 30 years l
: I prefer to keep in mind the fact that nobody should be able to buy their way out of a criminal offence. What does 'arriving in France' have to do wi
80 ME AVN FAN
: French experts on TV say it at that time was not yet 15 but 12. But I heard contradictory statements from experts (lawyers, NOT journalists ! ) withi
: I know, it is pretty sad IMHO. The funny part about that is that Woody Allen is married to his daughter.
: Question - what was a 13 year old girl doing at a party hosted by Jack Nicholson, where given his own reputation there would have been drugs as well a
: First i want to make it very clear. I am not defending nor saying that Polanski is innocent. But He pleaded guilty as part of an agreement. That agre
: Adopted daughter. Big difference. Morally wrong but not illegal.
: I believe that if Polanski had accepted the plea agreement's term in jail, that after it, he would have been been forced to leave the USA no longer ab
: It's not. I think there's a confusion here between rape and sexual relation with a minor. The last is illegal also, but is less serious. The legal se
: So hypothetically speaking, of course, if someone were to go over to France and murder Polanski, what would the punishment be? People, you've heard m
: I don't see the link with the story, but the punishment would be probably 20 or 25 years in jail (theorical time - normally about half of it in case
: That's funny. I would regard putting Polanski into the ground as good behavior.
: So it is illegal then. So how can the arguement be made that a crime as not committed in the eyes of French law?
: There was mention made of the age of consent in France being 12 back then, but it kind of overlooked the fact that Polanski didn't just sleep with th
: Another thing is that France (like Germany) never extradites her own citizens. I don´t know how a case would be processed in France, but in Germany,
: As far as I know, this argument is not valid. I think it's more about the fact that it happened 30 years ago.
: The age of consent has actually been 15 since 1945 in France. Anyway, I don't really get your point here. Age of consent is one thing, and rape in an
: Well well, the French change their public tone. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/8283707.stm
: Well maybe there is some common sense there. I was starting to get worried John Walsh could do a two hour special about them.
: He has dual Polish and French citizenship and he lived in Poland for approximately 30 years from the age of 3.
: Sorry, misunderstanding, what I meant was they sholuld have tried harder to pursue getting him back into the country after his flight. No, im not bla
: So these want a sentenced, proven rapist on the run to be protected from the law. How stupid are those people? And who else do those artists, who now
: Shame on them, they could have just said how sad they are that Polanski got arrested and that it was a pitty he could not attend the event, but to be
: I see. Just what I suspected. A Polish last name who happens to be goot at making movies. I think Poland should worry about other things instead of t
: So, by putting the word "crime" in punctuation marks, are you saying it wasn't a crime? Polanski was in the US at the time, and he raped a 12 year ol
: These vainglorious Hollywood people, who obviously think they are of a better breed should better sign a petition for people like James Woodard, who s
104 ME AVN FAN
: Well, I regard what he did as RAPE even if the victim is 22 years old. It was never "excusable". French laws of the time then would have classed it a
: Woody Allen? I am positively stunned he placed the "weight" of his moral capital in this matter.
: The way the law works in the US is the age of consent is set by the state government, and varies from 14 to 18, with 16 the most common. In most stat
: Agreed, and if the original plea bargin is followed chances are (unfortunately IMHO) that he will face more time for fleeing the court hearing then h
: One thing I wonder about: The American authorities knew since 20+ years that Polansky was residing in France. They also knew that the French will not
: Actually it is the California prosecuters, not American prosecuters. In this case the charges are state no federal. But since international relations
: Germany doesn´t extradite German citizens either, but if a foreign country makes a reasonable request because a German citizen, who escaped to Germa
: Its really the local County of Los Angeles district attorney. According to a LA Times piece, in recent years the district attorney on two other occas
: Isn't this probably also one of the reasons why the Schengen-Treaty is always suspended during those events?
: I stand corrected. Still it does illustrate the point that the federal and local officals are two different bodies.
: It is mostly because sports events like this attract know criminals (hooligans), but also terrorists, and temporarely re-instaing border controls mak
: It has been said that Polanski owns a home in Gstaad, Switzerland and travels there 2-3 times a year. I wonder why he was never served when in Gstaad
: I kinda of see the logic here, it's like the beat-up French will launch a preemptive air strike at the major German football stadia, or something? Or
117 ME AVN FAN
: the Schengen Treaty is NOT suspended during those events but put into full effect. As exactly the Schengen Treaty has a clear clause which stipulates
: I believe that another problem in that case was that Mr. Einhorn could have got the death penalty. Until the proscutitor agreed not to request the de
: No he had life in prison. His lawyers in France claimed he faced it despite the fact that the murder predated PA's death penalty and therefore wouldn
120 ME AVN FAN
: The topic in Switzerland no longer is the legal side but the political and tactical one. It is seen as extremely strange that the Ministry of the Inte
: I certainly hope the Swiss will be able to resist pressure from their French neighbours and deport this paedophile's ass back to the US. But then agai
122 ME AVN FAN
: There are pressures from various sides. The Justice Minister yielded to US pressure. The Foreign Minister is from Geneva and very French minded and o
123 ME AVN FAN
: And while you speak about the pressure from France, you ignore the more severe pressure from the USA. Even rightwingers like Mr Blocher now speak abo
: Looks like Polanski will be waiting it out from prison: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,..._ow=t0:s0:a4:g4:r2:c0.000000:b0:z5 And: And: Seems like
: I suggest that Polanski's holdings (including film rights) be seized and liquidated, with the funds given to a support organization for victims of mol
126 ME AVN FAN
: He should get other lawyers. The lawyer applied to a Federal Office which is part of the Justice Ministry who arranged his arrest. I am not a lawyer