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My Clutch Is Done.  
User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1466 posts, RR: 3
Posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 7 hours ago) and read 2350 times:

After 7 years since brand new and 198,000 miles on my 2002 Honda Accord the clutch is about done. I knew it was wearing out slowly about a month ago and was going to replace it but not this quick.

The car took a turn for the worse all the sudden yesterday as the clutch was slipping bad enough where I could barley get over 55-60 without over revving the engine, but anytime before that even Friday it was fine with a little slippage. After Parking the car finally you could smell a faint smell of burnt metal after I parked the car in my garage. I can still drive the car but it barely goes uphill although i=t can slowly get up to a speed once you build momentum or go downhill. I decided to park it since yesterday. In fact I might have it towed to the dealership.

When I first got a quote about a month ago one guy said 1,600.00 and change which was why i waited. I called the same dealer yesterday another sales rep told me 1,600.00 sounds steep unless you need more extensive work done actually starting price according to him is around 1200-1300.

One question I have is this what I should expect with parts and labor? It sucks though as this is my only car right now.

Mike

52 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 14011 posts, RR: 62
Reply 1, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 6 hours ago) and read 2314 times:

A clutch change is a pretty straightforward job. Don´t you have independent garages around? Little father and son outfits not attached to any brand? They can probably do the job much cheaper and even loan you a car while they fix your own (even if it is an old clunker, at least it will get you to work and back).
Or, see if you can rent a lift in some place for a day plus a gearbox jack, get the parts and change the clutch yourself.

Jan


User currently offlineFLY2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 5 hours ago) and read 2298 times:

Clutch changes aren't really that complicated as Jan said. The hard part is getting to the clutch. Once you get to it you pretty much just slap a new one in.

User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26449 posts, RR: 75
Reply 3, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 4 hours ago) and read 2263 times:



Quoting Mike89406 (Thread starter):

When I first got a quote about a month ago one guy said 1,600.00 and change which was why i waited.

Complete and total rip. Going to the dealer will always be so. You should not hesitate to take it to a cheaper local mechanic, especially since clutch jobs are really easy.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1466 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 3 hours ago) and read 2216 times:

Mike

Quoting FLY2HMO (Reply 2):
Clutch changes aren't really that complicated as Jan said. The hard part is getting to the clutch. Once you get to it you pretty much just slap a new one in.



Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 1):
clutch change is a pretty straightforward job. Don´t you have independent garages around? Little father and son outfits not attached to any brand? They can probably do the job much cheaper and even loan you a car while they fix your own (even if it is an old clunker, at least it will get you to work and back).
Or, see if you can rent a lift in some place for a day plus a gearbox jack, get the parts and change the clutch yourself

Another thing is should I worry about the flywheel?


User currently offlineATCtower From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 542 posts, RR: 3
Reply 5, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 1 hour ago) and read 2168 times:

It all depends on if your Accord is a manual or auto.

If its a manual and youre close to Colorado, a buddy and I can do it for lunch and a six pack. If you are dealing with an automatic tranny, the price he quoted you (albeit high) is probably about what you will be looking for.

You can find the parts online including a new clutch, flywheel, pressure plate, and throw-out bearing (manual tranny) for about 500 for something you will never have to replace and find a friend who knows how to do it.

Long story short, a manual transmission is far easier to work on with Japanese cars than an automatic. I have been shopping around for some time now as I will be replacing my clutch (et. al) on my WRX and even being AWD, I do not plan to spend more than about 800 all inclusive and we are doing the work ourselves in a garage over a weekend.



By reading the above post you waive all rights to be offended. If you do not like what you read, forget it.
User currently offlineAfterburner From Indonesia, joined Jun 2005, 1210 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week 1 hour ago) and read 2156 times:



Quoting ATCtower (Reply 5):
It all depends on if your Accord is a manual or auto.

I thought Americans can't drive stick shift cars.  Silly


User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1466 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (4 years 9 months 1 week ago) and read 2147 times:



Quoting Afterburner (Reply 6):
Quoting ATCtower (Reply 5):
It all depends on if your Accord is a manual or auto.

I thought Americans can't drive stick shift cars.

 laughing  But seriously thats all I prefer to drive. Well at least for the last 15 years all the cars I've owned are standard. It can be a hassle driving in the big city streets though.

Mike


User currently offlineSovietjet From Bulgaria, joined Mar 2003, 2604 posts, RR: 17
Reply 8, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 2126 times:
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Quoting ATCtower (Reply 5):
It all depends on if your Accord is a manual or auto.

 Confused  Confused There's no clutch on an auto car...


User currently offlineLrockeagle From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 82 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 2123 times:



Quoting Sovietjet (Reply 8):

Quoting ATCtower (Reply 5):
It all depends on if your Accord is a manual or auto.

Confused Confused There's no clutch on an auto car...

Totally just made my night! I read it and read it and never caught that!  silly 


User currently offlineAfterburner From Indonesia, joined Jun 2005, 1210 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 2106 times:

From Wikipedia

Quote:
A clutch is a mechanism for transmitting rotation, which can be engaged and disengaged. Clutches are useful in devices that have two rotating shafts.

Clutches exist in cars with automatic transmission. The different is that they are engaged and disengaged automatically, not by the drivers.


User currently offlineSovietjet From Bulgaria, joined Mar 2003, 2604 posts, RR: 17
Reply 11, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 2094 times:
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Quoting Afterburner (Reply 10):
Clutches exist in cars with automatic transmission. The different is that they are engaged and disengaged automatically, not by the drivers.

Well sure, but in an auto transmission it is known as a torque converter. No mechanic or auto shop would call it a clutch. For one thing, a clutch in the traditional and popular meaning of the word works differently than a torque converter.


User currently offlineVikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 9953 posts, RR: 26
Reply 12, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 2085 times:
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Quoting Sovietjet (Reply 11):

Quoting Afterburner (Reply 10):
Clutches exist in cars with automatic transmission. The different is that they are engaged and disengaged automatically, not by the drivers.

Well sure, but in an auto transmission it is known as a torque converter. No mechanic or auto shop would call it a clutch. For one thing, a clutch in the traditional and popular meaning of the word works differently than a torque converter.

Indeed. Torque converters work through a fluid medium, if I remember correctly. Suppose you could call it a "fluid clutch" or something, but it's not the regular flat-plate clutch found in manual transmissions.

Although, these days, there are automatic transmission cars being built with clutches. I keep hearing about cars that have a dual-clutch automatic transmission.



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26449 posts, RR: 75
Reply 13, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 2084 times:



Quoting ATCtower (Reply 5):
It all depends on if your Accord is a manual or auto.

It is certainly a manual.

Quoting Afterburner (Reply 6):

I thought Americans can't drive stick shift cars.

 Silly

Sad, but true. That said, I refuse to own a car without 3 pedals.

Quoting Afterburner (Reply 10):
Clutches exist in cars with automatic transmission. The different is that they are engaged and disengaged automatically, not by the drivers.

True clutches only exist on true manuals and a small minority of high end sequential transmissions. Otherwise, they are very different animals.



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineMolykote From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 1340 posts, RR: 29
Reply 14, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 2068 times:
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Quoting Mike89406 (Thread starter):
When I first got a quote about a month ago one guy said 1,600.00 and change which was why i waited. I called the same dealer yesterday another sales rep told me 1,600.00 sounds steep unless you need more extensive work done actually starting price according to him is around 1200-1300.

One question I have is this what I should expect with parts and labor? It sucks though as this is my only car right now.

A quick look at an OEM clutch "kit" lists parts at $160 delivered from an internet vendor vs. $260 MSRP. If you're going to a shop, I'd expect parts costs to be closer to $260 MSRP + consumables.

People often look at parts and overlook the cost of skilled labor. Here's my objective take.

My last dealer labor rate experiences are noted below:
$95/hr at a BMW dealer (330Ci)
$85/hr at a Toyota dealer (Camry)
$65/hr at a Mazda dealer (MX-5)

Assuming ~$300 for parts (MSRP for clutch + consumables and tax) and Toyota-like labor rates, this leaves 15+ hours of labor to replace a clutch. Way too much.



Speedtape - The asprin of aviation!
User currently offlineAfterburner From Indonesia, joined Jun 2005, 1210 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2024 times:



Quoting N1120A (Reply 13):
I refuse to own a car without 3 pedals.

You'll change your mind if you live in Jakarta. Big grin


User currently offlineCadet57 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 9085 posts, RR: 30
Reply 16, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2018 times:



Quoting Vikkyvik (Reply 12):
Although, these days, there are automatic transmission cars being built with clutches. I keep hearing about cars that have a dual-clutch automatic transmission.

Like the VW DSG gearbox. the 1st, 3rd and 5th gears have their own "clutch" and the 2nd 4th and 6th gears have their own "clutch" so the next gear is always engaged to shift. Its amazing.



Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
User currently offlineFLY2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 1995 times:

Technically, automatic transmissions have "clutch packs", and there can be up to 30 or more clutches within those packs, but they serve a different purpose.

But yes basically the torque converter is to an auto what a clutch is to a manual.


User currently offlineIMissPiedmont From United States of America, joined May 2001, 6287 posts, RR: 33
Reply 18, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1923 times:

Perhaps if you didn't ride the clutch you'd have made another 200 miles out of it.  crazy . But even at 1600.00 it's better than a car payment and the beast should last another 200,000 miles.


Damn, this website is getting worse daily.
User currently offlineAM744 From Mexico, joined Jun 2001, 1776 posts, RR: 0
Reply 19, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1922 times:



Quoting Mike89406 (Thread starter):
I knew it was wearing out slowly about a month ago and was going to replace it but not this quick.

How did you know it was wearing out? I'm concerned about my own 6 year old car. How can I determine if my clutch is about to be done without having it dissassembled (and ripped while having a preventive check done)?


User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1466 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1919 times:



Quoting IMissPiedmont (Reply 18):
Perhaps if you didn't ride the clutch you'd have made another 200 miles out of it. . But even at 1600.00 it's better than a car payment and the beast should last another 200,000 miles.

I don't ride the clutch. My wife did in the beginning til I got on her about it. But yeah it should last another 200,000 miles with a new clutch system. Everyone even the dealer seemed suprised it has lasted so long.


User currently offlineDesertJets From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7776 posts, RR: 16
Reply 21, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1911 times:



Quoting Mike89406 (Reply 20):
Everyone even the dealer seemed suprised it has lasted so long.

But nearly 200k miles on a 7 year old car indicates to me that you are not doing a lot of short distance, stop n go driving, so getting that much life out of a clutch seems reasonable. With the insane resale that a Honda commands... even an '02 Accord with a fried clutch, you probably end up ahead replacing the clutch vs. buying new.



Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
User currently offlineMike89406 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1466 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1899 times:



Quoting AM744 (Reply 19):
Quoting Mike89406 (Thread starter):
I knew it was wearing out slowly about a month ago and was going to replace it but not this quick.

How did you know it was wearing out? I'm concerned about my own 6 year old car. How can I determine if my clutch is about to be done without having it dissassembled (and ripped while having a preventive check done)?

The first ominous sign was several months ago when I would accelerate after shifting there was a literal slipping once in a while right after shifting in to gear. FOR EXAMPLE- (like holding the brake and accelerating but not hard enough to hold the wheel completely and it moves or jitters as you move in to speed)

I let that go for a while because it was only occasionally that would happen and it worked fine most of the time.

1 1/2 months ago or less all of the sudden the tachometer would rev up really fast and was squirrley but the speed didn't go as quick as it used to. When I was driving normal and put a little gas to speed up the tach would quickly jump up until I slowed down.

On Saturday it was so bad I could hardly accelerate past a certain speed without the tach jumping over 4,000 RPM. You will notice that because the engine has to work too hard to do its normal job. Believe me it's something you'll never forget.

Mike


User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 14011 posts, RR: 62
Reply 23, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 1892 times:



Quoting Molykote (Reply 14):
People often look at parts and overlook the cost of skilled labor. Here's my objective take.

My last dealer labor rate experiences are noted below:
$95/hr at a BMW dealer (330Ci)
$85/hr at a Toyota dealer (Camry)
$65/hr at a Mazda dealer (MX-5)

This is very expensive. Hourly rates around here are around $ 50-60 with a non-branded shop and a little more with a dealership.

In Berlin we used to have a chain of shops called Nippon parts, They sold wear parts for Japanese cars, if you wanted without the brand name printed on them, but from the same supplier and same quality as OEM parts, but a LOT cheaper.

Jan


User currently offlineFLY2HMO From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (4 years 9 months 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 1876 times:



Quoting Mike89406 (Reply 22):

You will notice that because the engine has to work too hard to do its normal job.

Also, overworked, overheated or dying clutches put out a very distinctive smell. If you've ever roasted your own brakes after autocrossing/agressive mountain driving or have seen a semitruck with stuck breaks its a very similar smell.


25 N1120A : I already live in Los Angeles. I do not fear traffic. At that point, you should have started looking to repalace I remember driving my car from New O
26 Sovietjet : On my car the first signs I noticed that the clutch is done is that it slipped when the car is cold(Chicago winters hehe). For example I would start t
27 FLY2HMO : As you said yourself, because of the "longer" ratios. It takes more "effort" for the engine to lug the car around on 5th than on 3rd.
28 FXramper : 6 yrs, and 56,000+ mi on my beamer - priceless new clutch that the BMW tech said outlasted M3 quality - $3,300 I'm buying an Acura in January.
29 Vikkyvik : Haha, I feel the same way, having driven a manual transmission in Boston and Los Angeles. I'm probably the only person I know who doesn't mind drivin
30 Cadet57 : I drove a GTi with one, it was spectacular. Getting on the highway was almost effortless for that car.
31 N1120A : I don't mind or notice it either. Its all about getting used to something and being smart about how you shift. Someone needs to be easier on his clut
32 FLY2HMO : I test drove a VW R32 with the DSG tranny (no manual option in the US ). It is an AMAZING transmission. Smoother than, I dare say, a CVT and with lig
33 Post contains links Molykote : I know those are high labor rates, but not out of character for a dealer in the US. $95/hr is actually the lowest of my 3 closest BMW dealers. Incide
34 Molykote : Excusing my posting lag time, meet "that guy" Seriously though N1120A's allusions are spot on. A dead clutch at 53k is definitely more likely to be c
35 Post contains images Mike89406 : Your right, I know I should have. This is the first time I've fried a clutch so it was a lesson learned. Me either. I've lived in New York once where
36 LTU932 : We were already fearing that when we got our Spectra almost 2 years ago, we would have to do a major clutch job as well. The gear would simply not ent
37 MD11Engineer : One of the best shops I´ve ever been to was a shop owned by a Russian father and son team, both qualified car mechanics, AFAIK the dad having a univ
38 Aero145 : Yep, that’s the problem. DSG shifts fast like a blister but the car is sloppier than a manual. Just my opinion on one of the most common versions o
39 N1120A : A key example I remember is the road tests of the aforementioned E46 M3, where the manual and the SMG were tested. The SMG was supposed to shift in h
40 Cadet57 : Which is a shame, because you can get them in europe. When I was buying my VW, the dealership "misplaced" my car, they unloaded it and it got lose in
41 Aero145 : That’s fine - I’d rather drive an Audi with a very good Porsche auto tranny than an Audi with a bit worse Audi auto tranny. Hear hear! Although t
42 LTU932 : I used the term "clutch job" very loosely. What you propose is exactly what my father wants, but like I said, I'm talking him out of it because IMO t
43 N1120A : I agree. Most people don't set their car's seat right, and that is where the problems start. It is amazing how a simple change can make all the diffe
44 Molykote : Such great vehicles (as illustrated by ebay resale values). I did an off road tour with my now fiance in 2006. This was my only opportunity to drive
45 N1120A : Telescoping wheels are great, but not really necessary if you have a seat with more than the standard movement. For example, my E36 M3's wheel doesn'
46 Cadet57 : My VW, and all current ones as well have a tilt/telescopic wheel. Its awesome.
47 Post contains images Molykote : I love the E36 seating position and seats (I'm looking for a used E36 pax seat in good condition to make an office chair). In that car I found that t
48 N1120A : I can. They don't expect you to be resting your feet often.
49 LTU932 : In our Spectra, I've asked my father many times to raise the steering wheel (which makes it easier for him, as he lost some mobility because of his h
50 N1120A : You actually have the better habit. Even having your foot on the pedal is going to cause premature wear.
51 LTU932 : Indeed, though I've never seen any of our cars having clutch problems with my father's habit. He simply holds the foot in front of the clutch, and I'
52 Molykote : Though I understand your point, the car does have a dead pedal and (optional) cruise control. I certainly won't argue that idle driving or highway cr
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