Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Open Carry (Weapon) A Highly Debatable Topic  
User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 11
Posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2786 times:

First off, I would like to start by saying that I do believe this is the first time creating a thread in the OT forum. Not sure how the flavor of things goes here but here goes.

I wanted to discuss OC or open carry. It means exactly what it says. Openly carrying a weapon. That could be any type of knife or gun but it is used to describe openly carrying a hand-gun about 90% of the time.

Now, the laws across the country differe so much state to state but basically you will see some that ban it all together, some require you to be a licensed to carry a handgun and for some, there is no legal requirement at as (as far as holding a license). One example being the great state of Virginia. How the law is written about handguns, it's illegal to keep a handgun from plain view from the public without a CHP (concealed handgun permit). Says nothing about open carry. What does this mean? You are not required to have a permit to openly carry. Move to the state tomorrow, but a gun with a holster and your good to go so long as it is in plain view. However comma, the only caviat is that you meet the requirments had you applied for a CHP (not been to a mental instiution, not a felon, not involved in a pending domestic violence case, etc.). Oh yeah, and the law says that you must be 21 to buy a gun and hold a CHP but says nothing about being given a gun as a gift or open carrying: You can be 18 and open carry in Virginia, and its perfectly legal; i've seen it.

I am an advocate on OC as I OC myself so I just want to clear that up first off. This may get into 2A rights etc. which is fine and what I expect.

Thoughts?






http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v53/UncleJaque/ARMS/2nd%20Amendment%20Issues/ME%20OPEN%20CARRY/OCLuncheoneers-ed.jpg




And a quick and broad view for those that don't know the laws of your state. Other things to keep in mind is preemption. Not every state has it.

[Edited 2010-03-03 21:58:57 by diamond]


What gets measured gets done.
61 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineCadet57 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 9085 posts, RR: 31
Reply 1, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2789 times:

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Thread starter):
Thoughts?

This thread will not end well. Just wait until all the anti-gun people get here with their usual rhetoric.

I for one support open and concealed carry, and will be getting my permit by summertime. Once I get all the paperwork thru.

[Edited 2010-03-02 16:09:25]


Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
User currently offlinefr8mech From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 5095 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2776 times:

I carry concealed all the time. I've only carried openly when hunting (not the rifle, but a pitol loaded with snake load). I'm a little mixed on the idea. Would I ban it? No, but I'm not sure it's for me.

That map shows KY as an Open Carry Gold State. I'll need to look at that. I believed that if I carried openly here, that it was considered brandishing the weapon. I'll have to look it up.



When seconds count...the police are minutes away. Never leave your cave without your club.
User currently offlineCadet57 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 9085 posts, RR: 31
Reply 3, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2770 times:

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 2):
Would I ban it? No, but I'm not sure it's for me.

Same here. Id rather not tell everyone I have a gun. Personally, I think you should be as inconspicuous as possible when carrying.



Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
User currently offlinesrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2757 times:

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 1):
This thread will not end well. Just wait until all the anti-gun people get here with their usual rhetoric.

That's why I'm posting this warning now.

Let's keep this discussion civil and on-topic. If users cannot, they risk having posts deleted, being banned, having this thread locked, and the possibility of gun topics being temporarily banned from the Forums.

From the Forum Rules:

1a. Please respect the opinions of others and choose your words wisely. Each user has their own point of view, and these views must be respected.

1b. Please word all criticism, whether of another user's opinion, a photograph, crew member, a political topic, etc., in a constructive manner. Criticism which serves no purpose other than to incite or insult other members will be deleted and your account possibly suspended.

1c. If a topic becomes a debate, you may debate the subject itself but not the credibility or intellect of other members.

1e. Do not post a message on how you find a topic or user irrelevant, boring, childish or stupid.

1f. Do not provoke other users or incite trouble. Do not allow others to provoke you.

1g. Should a user antagonize, slander or intimidate you, DO NOT retaliate. All members are expected to comply with forum rules even if they have been provoked by another member. Bring this to our attention by suggesting the offending post for deletion (see below).

1h. When stating facts, statistics or newsworthy bulletins, please be sure to include an HTML link or reference to a publication. If you are merely providing an opinion, please MENTION THIS in your post. It is each member's responsibility to avoid arguments based on rumors or misinformation.

3a. If you have a problem with another user or if you dislike a thread or post and are able to show that it violates a rule, please use the "Suggest Deletion" button (see below). Just as posts have various levels of quality, so do suggestions for deletion. Take some time to explain why you feel a post should be removed.

3b. Alternatively, you may e-mail the Forum Moderators at moderators@airliners.net about the issue.

3c.Do not respond to an inflammatory post and then suggest deletion of the same post. Simply suggest its deletion using the SD button.

Please follow the Forum Rules so that this thread does not suffer the fate of many a thread on the subject of firearms. If a user tries to hijack the thread or is baiting members, do not respond to those posts and make the Moderators aware of this situation. The sooner that users alert the Moderators to posts that have the potential to escalate the situation, the less likely that the thread gets derailed to the point that it has to be locked.


User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16689 posts, RR: 51
Reply 5, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2740 times:

I'm all for carrying a concealed weapon under whatever guidelines/restrictions your State permits, I'm personally covered by LEOSA but don't excercise that right off duty. However I'm against open carry for anyone other than law enforcement, my concerns are that it would confuse people to believe the person carrying is some sort of LEO and secondly I'm concerned about the intimidation factor. If I get into a tiff with someone over a parking spot at the mall I don't need someone jumping out of their car carrying a 40 caliber on their waist giving me a dirty look.


Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlineNIKV69 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2720 times:

What I love is how the anti-gun people seem to forget how many gangbangers and criminals carry weapons. At this point you may as well pass a law so everyone could carry a gun. Even though people think it would increase crime in fact in time I bet you would see a reduction in crime.

User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 11
Reply 7, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2718 times:

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 2):
I believed that if I carried openly here, that it was considered brandishing the weapon. I'll have to look it up.

Not sure about KY but from the Virginia code (snippet) "Brandishing is displaying a firearm"-(whether in a holster or in your hand)-"in a manner to cause fear of bodily harm to another person"-(with an exception for self defense).

As it has been explained by the Commonweath's attorney to a group of us OCrs;

A weapon carried in the hand, muzzle pointed in a safe direction, incidental to simply carrying it from one place to another, or for hunting, is not brandishing. A handgun in a holster on the hip displayed to another person in order to get him to do or not do something is brandishing.

Unless you're peace officer covering multiple felons to prevent escape, or serving a search warrant in a dangerous house you have no legal excuse for showing anyone a gun or making reference to a gun or touching a gun. When you are in a situation in which you or an innocent third party is faced with the imminent threat of serious bodily injury, such that you reasonably believe, based on objective fact, that deadly force is required, then pull the gun out and shoot to kill. In all other cases, make no reference to the gun at all.

Also, emotional state is not an issue. Whether or not you "fear for your life" is not an issue. Fear plays no part in the definition of defense of self or others. The reasonable, good faith belief, based on objective fact, that you or an innocent third party is faced with the threat of an imminent serious bodily injury is the whole definition. No emotional state you may have makes the slightest bit of difference.

A few links for you, sir.
http://www.opencarry.org/ky.html
http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum25/

Quoting STT757 (Reply 5):
However I'm against open carry for anyone other than law enforcement, my concerns are that it would confuse people to believe the person carrying is some sort of LEO

That i'm a bit confused about. What exactly will happen because some thinks i'm law enforcement? Many times, when I'm shopping in Wal-Mart I get the Geico eyes and some even ask through conversation if i'm a cop. I say no and explain their rights as a law abiding citizen. Then usually hand them one of Ed's cards (a business card that simply states what OC is and cites the Virginia code on the back as well as does and don'ts.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 5):
secondly I'm concerned about the intimidation factor. If I get into a tiff with someone over a parking spot at the mall I don't need someone jumping out of their car carrying a 40 caliber on their waist giving me a dirty look.

I get that a lot. You will be surprised at how much people don't even notice or don't care. This is for Georgia and Virginia however. Most times I don't get a second look. If someone is offended, that's smething they should take up with their congressman, not me   . To the second part. Most professional OCrs will know how to handle situations as such. I don't want to be hauled off to jail for brandishing a weapon but at the same time, that doesn't mean that I will sit idle in my car of fear that I will be charged for the violation. It's all about how you carry yourself. Someone that uses their holstered weapon as a fear factor is breaking the law and shouldn't be allowed to carry period.

[Edited 2010-03-02 17:17:06]


What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 11
Reply 8, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2708 times:

Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 6):

Good point! I'm not even going to begin to talk gun control but I will say that the law doesn't reduce crime, period. It only serves to further restrict the rights of decent citizens that choose to arm themselves.



What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineLufthansa411 From Germany, joined Jan 2008, 692 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 2690 times:

While I personally don't agree with carrying guns (never mind shooting them) I do support a person's right to do it if they so choose, although when I am in the US seeing open carry is very unnerving for me personally. I like the way the system currently works, where each state has different laws about it. That way, I could theoretically live in NY where gun control is restricted, but someone who strongly favours it could live in Virginia. That way people could live somewhere where they are more comfortable. Plus, in NY as I understand it, laws are in place, however depending on where you are living, they may or may not be enforced. So those living upstate where the population is much less dense have de facto open carry while those downstate in densely populated areas are restricted.

I would be all for a compromise, where the "gun show" loophole is closed, but other restrictions are loosened. One of the reasons guns have such a negative reputation is because of who is allowed to buy them. If the US made sure that firearms did not fall into the wrong hands, by making gun safes mandatory, closing loopholes, better background checks, etc.I think many more people would be more comfortable with them. As it is now though, it seems to the casual observer that the old northeast joke of the store in TX that advertised "buy a 36 pack and get a free handgun" rings true, whether it is justified or not.

On a side note, what is the deal with assault weapons in the US? I can see having a pistol or rifle or something of that nature if you are so inclined, but an AR-15 or AK-47 for normal day to day pleasure? Perhaps the way to go would be to have your local gun club keep those and for you to visit any time to shoot them. Perhaps someone can (honest question) explain why those kinds of weapons are needed in one's home? I can understand how Americans are attached to guns with the culture they have, and want handguns and rifles and whatnot, but I have never understood the rationale for assault weapons. (I am asking out of curiosity, not to provoke an argument. Just want to know what the opinion is for those that carry guns)

[Edited 2010-03-02 17:56:13]


Nothing in life is to be feared; it is only to be understood.
User currently offlineSTT757 From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 16689 posts, RR: 51
Reply 10, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2670 times:

FlyASAGuy2005,

Let's use the fight over the parking spot scenario, if it gets physical what are you going to do;

A. Ask me to wait while you secure your weapon in your car
B. fight me with your gun on your side
C. shoot me.

I'm from New Jersey, we fight a lot. And while fist fighting in a Walmart parking may indeed be a crime it's something you or even a law enforcement officer do not have justification for shooting someone. Your life is not in danger if I punch you in the face, but are you able to control the urge to draw the weapon and shoot me for doing so?



Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
User currently offlinemandala499 From Indonesia, joined Aug 2001, 6590 posts, RR: 75
Reply 11, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2666 times:

Quoting srbmod (Reply 4):
That's why I'm posting this warning now.

Good to see that warning being posted early on... having the topic ending up as a pointless keyboard slug-fest ain't gonna do anyone any good...

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 1):
This thread will not end well. Just wait until all the anti-gun people get here with their usual rhetoric.

Here's an unusual rhetoric from an anti-gun person:

The US being the US, there's already enough heat on the firearms debate... my personal opinion as a non-US citizen who's probably not going to live in the US:
Concealed or Open... license it. Not sure if there's a federal gun-registry, but I think there should be, albeit the distribution, usage and carrying rights control rules should remain within the state.

But then, if the law of the state allows you to open carry without a permit... so be it... no big deal for me, I just avoid people who, regardless of age, are in no mental maturity stage to carry even a bb gun (believe me, those people exist allover the world, whilst there are underaged people who can use it responsibly).

But an open cyber-brawl on a.net with regards to firearms rights, is like watching a shootout... where many rounds are spent, but nothing gets hit... just fun to watch   

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 7):
What exactly will happen because some thinks i'm law enforcement? Many times, when I'm shopping in Wal-Mart I get the Geico eyes and some even ask through conversation if i'm a cop. I say no and explain their rights as a law abiding citizen. Then usually hand them one of Ed's cards (a business card that simply states what OC is and cites the Virginia code on the back as well as does and don'ts.

Good on ya! The so-called "gun-mentality" image, needs more people who go about it the way you do when OC-ing.

Whilst I may disagree with this:

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 8):
It only serves to further restrict the rights of decent citizens that choose to arm themselves.

Change "professional OCrs" to "responsible OCrs" and I'd definitely agree with:

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 7):
To the second part. Most professional OCrs will know how to handle situations as such. I don't want to be hauled off to jail for brandishing a weapon but at the same time, that doesn't mean that I will sit idle in my car of fear that I will be charged for the violation. It's all about how you carry yourself. Someone that uses their holstered weapon as a fear factor is breaking the law and shouldn't be allowed to carry period.

The bolded part, is the common ground between pro-gun and anti-gun with the right mind...

Sorry, but the guy in blue in the second row pic facing away, needs to get a proper "open view" holster! I'd put that as a half concealed handgun!    Dunno which handgun he has, but doing it that way (even though it looks uncocked), in my opinion is a no no.

Quoting Lufthansa411 (Reply 9):
I can see having a pistol or rifle or something of that nature if you are so inclined, but an AR-15 or AK-47 for normal day to day pleasure?

Although deadlier, to me, an assault rifle is safer than a pistol!    You're less likely to accidentally point it at someone's head... but again that's just my personal opinion... coz whilst I can snipe at distant things with a rifle, I'm useless with the handgun for anything smaller than an orange at more than 10ft!   

Quoting STT757 (Reply 10):
Your life is not in danger if I punch you in the face, but are you able to control the urge to draw the weapon and shoot me for doing so?

I think I'd be more worried about the guy without the gun taking the gun!



When losing situational awareness, pray Cumulus Granitus isn't nearby !
User currently offlineAGM100 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 5407 posts, RR: 16
Reply 12, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2658 times:

Open carry should be legal .... but training says that it is ill advised. In a hostile situation you become the target ... you may be overpowered at close range your gun taken away and or just shot immedialty before you can gain situational awareness.

Carrying concealed gives you more advantage to calm a situation down or to gain tactical advantage . We should all hope that we never ever have to pull a firearm.... bad things are going to happen when the guns come out. I personaly dread the day I would ever have to use mine in a defensive situation ...its not like the movies its terrifying and very dangerous.



You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
User currently offlinefr8mech From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 5095 posts, RR: 12
Reply 13, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2648 times:

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 7):
A few links for you, sir.
http://www.opencarry.org/ky.html
http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum25/

Thanks for the links. I'll do a little more research. I've always been very concerned about how I carry so as the weapon doesn't accidently come into view, simply because I thought that could be considered brandishing.

Quoting Lufthansa411 (Reply 9):
Perhaps someone can (honest question) explain why those kinds of weapons are needed in one's home?

There are a couple of reasons that I could suggest. I like firearms in general. Any type. I own 1 'assault weapon' (I really don't like the term), an AR15 and I'm in the process of building another.

I see no reason why I should keep my property in someone else's facility where I don't have unfettered access.

And, to tell you the truth, in the home, whether it's a handgun, a rifle or a shotgun, it's just as effective if used correctly and within its limitations.



When seconds count...the police are minutes away. Never leave your cave without your club.
User currently offlineJetsGo From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 3067 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2645 times:

I carry concealed all the time as well. It's gotten to the point where I feel naked without it. The only time I'm not carrying is when I'm at work. I'm not sure about open carry though. There's just too many idiots out there who wouldn't be able to comprehend the idea if they saw someone doing so, likely resulting in a wasteful call to 911. I believe concealed is all around safer for everyone involved.

Weapon of choice...Springfield XD .40 sub-compact.

This is me on a typical day a couple months ago minus the coat...before I bought my Forbus paddle holster. The stock holster is rather shitty if you ask me.




Marine Corps Aviation, The Last To Let You Down!
User currently offlineCadet57 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 9085 posts, RR: 31
Reply 15, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2631 times:

Quoting mandala499 (Reply 11):
Concealed or Open... license it.

It IS. And difficult to attain in some states, such as mine.



Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
User currently offlineSpringbok747 From Australia, joined Nov 2004, 4387 posts, RR: 11
Reply 16, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2586 times:

Nope..there is no need to advertise the fact that you are carrying a firearm..in many cases you may become the target simply because of that fact. Also..open carry is illegal in this country.
I am not anti-gun, very pro-gun in fact, but IMO there is no need to show people you are carrying a weapon



אני תומך בישראל
User currently offlineCadet57 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 9085 posts, RR: 31
Reply 17, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2580 times:

Quoting JetsGo (Reply 14):
Weapon of choice...Springfield XD .40 sub-compact.

I looked at one of those. I'm partial to S&W as I live one town over from their factory. But someone suggested the Springfield. How do you like it?



Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
User currently onlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21083 posts, RR: 56
Reply 18, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2562 times:

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 3):
Personally, I think you should be as inconspicuous as possible when carrying.

   I'm okay with concealed carry (licensed, of course), but I don't think open carry is a good idea. A gun makes a statement, whether its carrier intends it to or not, and we don't need that sort of thing in public.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineFlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 7004 posts, RR: 11
Reply 19, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2539 times:

Quoting Lufthansa411 (Reply 9):
Plus, in NY as I understand it, laws are in place, however depending on where you are living, they may or may not be enforced. So those living upstate where the population is much less dense have de facto open carry while those downstate in densely populated areas are restricted.

Although NY has state preemption, the laws are so strict on w whole, there's not reason for cities, counties, etc. to have their "own" set of rules.

Quoting Lufthansa411 (Reply 9):
I would be all for a compromise, where the "gun show" loophole is closed,

Something I would have to disagree with. There is no "loophole". Private sales is just that, private sales. If you buy a gun from a dealer at a gun show, you have to do the appropriate paperwork. If it is a private seller, you exchange cash and you are on your way. It's no different that buying your weapon off a gun auction website. You would have to change gun laws to get that one passed which will not happen; and the Virginia House gets it. The bill was shot down yet again earlier this year.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 10):
B. fight me with your gun on your side

If it comes to blows, I will go with the above. But, that's why I don't live in NY or NJ   . Let's say the guy was CC. What's the difference? He has on a jacket over his holstered handgun, you start to scap, his gun is revealed. Again, I don't see the difference.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 10):
I'm from New Jersey, we fight a lot. And while fist fighting in a Walmart parking may indeed be a crime it's something you or even a law enforcement officer do not have justification for shooting someone. Your life is not in danger if I punch you in the face, but are you able to control the urge to draw the weapon and shoot me for doing so?

Yes, I will be able to control myself because there will be no urge. The law on deadly force is pretty clear in VA and GA. You punching me in the face doesn't make me feel like my life is in danger.

Quoting mandala499 (Reply 11):
Change "professional OCrs" to "responsible OCrs" and I'd definitely agree with:

I totally agree with you, thanks! It was a poor choice of words. Responsible is more of what I was looking for.

Quoting mandala499 (Reply 11):
Sorry, but the guy in blue in the second row pic facing away, needs to get a proper "open view" holster! I'd put that as a half concealed handgun! Dunno which handgun he has, but doing it that way (even though it looks uncocked), in my opinion is a no no.

Every state is different but it's what you know and I consider myself we versed in gun laws. At least for the states that I frequent and choose to OC and CC. There is nothing on the books (in VA at least) that says "how much" of the gun needs to be in plain sight. It just says basically "in plain public view as others will know what it is; and you're not trying to obstruct or mask its identity. The 1/3 thing that people say a lot is untrue. That holdster would be perfectly legal in most OC states. There's also the VA "tuck" that is also perfectly legal.



Let's say this guys shirt was not tucked in. If he walked into a restaurant that serves alcohol, he would be in violation of CC laws as it is illegal in Virginia to CC in an establishment that has an ABC and authorized to serve alcohol as well. So, he would tuck his shirt//jacket in behind the gun to comply. I've done it a couple times on colder days when I'm wearing a non waistband jacket.



What gets measured gets done.
User currently offlineMudboy From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1167 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2526 times:

First off I want to say, that I support the 2nd Amendment, and I own a gun, but I disagree with OC, and think people that show up at Presidential Town Hall Meetings carrying a weapon, make us Americans look like a bunch of idiots.

If you feel the need to walk around with a weapon on your side, join the military or your local Police force. What are you going to do when someone comes up and takes that gun from you? Have you been trained in how to maintain or disable your weapon, if someone does just that? If you are in Wal-Mart with your gun strapped to your side, for everyone to see, people are going to think you are a LEO, which may be what some of these supporters want? Some people need to feel important and intimidating. I think our world image as a bunch of cowboys, is reinforced with these type of laws.

I live in Mississippi, where you can carry a gun in your vehicle, because it is an extension of your home. You also may obtain a CC permit if you pass a background check. But I see absolutely no need for people to be running around with guns strapped to their side. Are we a modern civilization, or are we regressing back to the 1800s?


User currently offlineAlias1024 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 2715 posts, RR: 2
Reply 21, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2507 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 18):
I'm okay with concealed carry (licensed, of course), but I don't think open carry is a good idea. A gun makes a statement, whether its carrier intends it to or not, and we don't need that sort of thing in public.

I've got to agree with this. Why advertise that you are armed? Open carry is for people that want to make a statement, and unless you are law enforcement or military, I have to worry about you if you feel the need to make a statement by showing off your firearm to everyone at Starbucks.

Quoting JetsGo (Reply 14):
Weapon of choice...Springfield XD .40 sub-compact.

Nice choice. My brother just bought the .45 version. Great concealed carry weapon. Plenty of power, but compact enough to easily keep concealed even with a 13 round magazine.



It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 25
Reply 22, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 2497 times:

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 1):
I for one support open and concealed carry

I am the same, too. I wonder if we have to have permits to open carry. I know to conceal carry, one is required to have a permit. I know that Colorado's CCW is recognized and honored in 18 states.

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 3):
Id rather not tell everyone I have a gun.

I agree. Guns are not toys and should never be treated as such. I am very lip tight when it comes to discussing guns, and will only discuss them with specific people who I trust.

Quoting mandala499 (Reply 11):
Not sure if there's a federal gun-registry, but I think there should be...

There is one. And AFAIK, its only accessible to LEO's and the FBI and not to the average U.S. Citizen.

Quoting JetsGo (Reply 14):
Springfield XD .40 sub-compact.

Springfield Armory makes great XDM firearms. I like how the grips are inter-changeable.

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 17):
How do you like it?

The are great firearms and very fun to shoot. Easy to clean and maintain. I like how Springfield Armory designed these firearms, they are not even complicated guns at all.

Interesting to note that Vermont does not require a license to carry. Anyone know why?



A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlinemrocktor From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 1668 posts, RR: 50
Reply 23, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 2448 times:

Quoting STT757 (Reply 10):
Your life is not in danger if I punch you in the face, but are you able to control the urge to draw the weapon and shoot me for doing so?

Ah yes, the constitutional right to punch another in the face without fear of consequences... wait, what?


User currently offlinefr8mech From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 5095 posts, RR: 12
Reply 24, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2418 times:

Quoting JetsGo (Reply 14):
my Forbus paddle holster

Do you like the Fobus? I had one for my Glock, but didn't use it much.

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 17):
But someone suggested the Springfield

I bought the .40 sub-compact and sold my Glock 6 months later. The trigger is a little different, but easy to get used to. Love the sub-compact.

Quoting Mudboy (Reply 20):
But I see absolutely no need for people to be running around with guns strapped to their side.

I don't think it is so much a 'need' as a desire for some to wear a firearm in the open. Not everything we do in this world is derived from a need. Sometimes you just want to do something. But, if that something is open carry, you need to be prepared for the possible consequences (not really the right word, but it's early). Life is full of choices.



Quoting STT757 (Reply 10):
Your life is not in danger if I punch you in the face, but are you able to control the urge to draw the weapon and shoot me for doing so?

This gets into a different topic, but how do I know my life isn't in danger with a punch to the face? If you're willing to assault me, do I know how far you are willing to go?



When seconds count...the police are minutes away. Never leave your cave without your club.
25 Mudboy : One could also make the argument, the aggressor was going for his gun, and then a struggle ensues, which then justifies deadly force, you see where I
26 Mir : Serious question: why would you want to wear a firearm in the open as opposed to concealed? -Mir
27 Post contains images Aaron747 : Concealed weapons get the job done. There's no need for open carry unless one is an off-duty LEO. I don't see the need for confusing between the two,
28 fr8mech : I don't know. I have no desire to carry open, but some do. Maybe one of them will chirp up. I absolutely disagree. If you are in a situation in which
29 Mudboy : I hate to tell you, but in real time, it is not always so easy. I love when all the big talk starts about how easy it would be to pull on someone. Wh
30 MD11Engineer : I could imagine one exception: When working, hunting or hiking outdoors in remote bear country, where even people, who don´t fancy guns like to carr
31 Post contains images FlyDeltaJets87 : Agreed. I'm all for concealed carry and should probably get my CCP before leaving Florida for Ohio this summer (especially since I believe Florida an
32 MD11Engineer : We had a guy in here from Alaska (not ANCFlyer), who told us about a chance encounter with a mama grizzly and her cub in the bush. Fortunately for hi
33 STT757 : Because I don't have a weapon, Law enforcement and the courts will only accept equal responses for equal threats. If you are verbally abuse by an ind
34 Cadet57 : I don't know that. Who's to say that after you hit me you draw a knife or a gun? I'm not saying as soon as you get punched to shoot someone, but id s
35 Aesma : I have a question for anetters who carry a gun : did you live for a while in a country (not an American state) where it is not allowed, and what did y
36 fr8mech : Again, this is not supposed to be about gun control or responses to attacks, but since you state: No, the standard is if a reasonable person was in fe
37 Post contains images AirframeAS : You do not take your gun out unless you really, really have to and is warranted. See below.... BTW, I have to ask.... are you an experienced shooter
38 RussianJet : That goes for anti-gun views as much as it does for pro-gun views. I trust everyone will remember that. On what would you base such an assumption? Kn
39 Cadet57 : Last thread was going great until people decided to take it off topic. it'd make me sure make me feel better about more good guys having guns knowing
40 RussianJet : And what does your scenario have to do with the topic - openly carrying weapons on the street? Keeping a weapon in the house for self-defence is abou
41 Springbok747 : Yes..drawing a gun (unprovoked) is threatening behaviour. But how is openly carrying a gun threatening? I'm actually against open carry because it ad
42 RussianJet : Because if you are a civilian going about your business, having a deadly weapon on display is an unnecessary display of potential violence. Tell me t
43 AirframeAS : So are you saying that people are not allowed to protect themselves any longer?? Am I correct on that assumption?
44 evomutant : Why would you want to. It's an ego stroke, nothing more. Look at me, I'm a tough guy carrying my gun around for everybody to see. Whatever floats your
45 Post contains images RussianJet : Mm no, you are not. Namely because I haven't said that. Exactly so. It invites attention and by extension trouble.
46 AirframeAS : You have not, I know.... but you are going that direction. So tell me, RussianJet....what should citizens use for self-protecton? What is your soluti
47 Springbok747 : I think its just an ego issue...my uncle in the US carries his gun, but he has a valid CCP. In fact, till recently I had no idea he even carried! I d
48 RussianJet : Conflict avoidance and where strictly necessary the police. Carrying weapons is illegal in the UK and I am very glad for that. Again, there is a diff
49 Post contains images KaiGywer : I still need to get my permit...I keep procrastinating. Although I probably wouldn't open carry normally, I'd probably do a "sloppy conceal" I've hear
50 fr8mech : No, what is being said, is that I am prepared to defend myself if attackked. Or maybe, I like carrying a gun. I do believe though, that if more folks
51 AirframeAS : After thinking about it, that is the best way to go. Why not have a conceal carry permits issued by the U.S. Government as a whole rather than having
52 RussianJet : Yes, it does. It's a tool for killing and wounding. It is not necessary to be flashing it around on the street.
53 Post contains images AirframeAS : No, it is not. That is a pretty screwed up logic. People who are NOT responsible with firearms use it for the reason you said. However....there are p
54 evomutant : But the main argument advanced for open carry is self-protection and deterrence. In that context, it very clearly is a weapon designed for killing or
55 AirframeAS : I'm sorry I respectfully disagree.
56 RussianJet : So why would you carry it on the street then? Fashion? Target practice? Scratching your nose with?
57 AirframeAS : Because our U.S. Constitution says we can. That is about clear as I can get. And again, off-topic. That is for another thread that will also get off-
58 Cadet57 : BECAUSE WE CAN. And because it gets some people in such a lather because they have such a crybaby "guns are bad" attitude. Tell you what take all law
59 RussianJet : I know you can. I am aware of the fact that your constitution allows you to. However, to respond only in those terms is to utterly dodge the question
60 Cadet57 : So if I'm attacked with violence I cant retaliate in the same manor? That basically what you are saying. So why can't I be prepared for the chance th
61 moderators : Since some of you have chosen to ignore the warning that was issued earlier in this thread, it is now being locked, as the Moderators have received a
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Needed: Carry-on Bag For Laptop And Cpap posted Fri Feb 12 2010 20:11:45 by SmithAir747
Sunday Stupid Topic: New Orlians Or New Orleens. posted Sun Feb 7 2010 14:39:11 by FuturePilot16
Australian Open 2010 posted Thu Jan 28 2010 05:21:49 by Elite
Chavez Blames Haiti On US "Earthquake Weapon" posted Mon Jan 25 2010 19:21:45 by FriendlySkies
Yemen President: Open To Talks With Al-Qaeda posted Sun Jan 10 2010 11:56:06 by FuturePilot16
Elevators - Do You Ever Use The Door Open Button? posted Fri Dec 18 2009 16:50:53 by 1337Delta764
US-Canada Border: Why No Open Border? posted Fri Jul 31 2009 16:14:48 by F.pier
Hot Dogs Lawsuit To Carry Warning Label posted Thu Jul 23 2009 07:45:41 by 7324ever
The 2009 Open Championship. posted Thu Jul 16 2009 08:07:12 by Fxramper
2009 US Open At Bethpage Black posted Sat Jun 20 2009 08:43:59 by FlyDeltaJets87