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Large Hadron Collider To Shut Down Safety Concerns  
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10898 posts, RR: 37
Posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 7990 times:

The damage that occurred in 2008 took 14 months to repair

A director at the Large Hadron Collider in Geneva has told BBC News that some mistakes were made in construction.
Dr Steve Myers said these faults will delay the machine reaching its full potential for two years.

The atom smasher will reach world record power later this month at 7 trillion electron volts (TeV) but the machine must close at the end of 2011 for up to a year for work to make the tunnel safe for proton collisions planned at twice that level.

The machine only recently restarted after being out of action for 14 months following an accident in September 2008.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8556621.stm

 


There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
48 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinefrancoflier From France, joined Oct 2001, 3766 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 7925 times:

Frustrating.

But then this IS the most complex machine in the world.



Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit posting...
User currently offlineNoWorries From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 539 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 22 hours ago) and read 7813 times:

Every colider is a unique machine -- there's a certain amount of learning and tweaking. The second largest colider (Tevatron at Fermilab) had quite a few problems when it first started.

Operating only at half-power will still give scientests a chance to test the "other half" of the machine -- all of the detctors which is where all of the discoveries will occur.

Also, there is a bit of race between the Tevatron and the LHC to discover the Higgs boson first -- running at half power is still quite a bit more energetic than the Tevatron and might give the LHC bragging rights if they happen to find it.


User currently offlinebhill From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 972 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 7722 times:

Hubble anyone.....................?


Carpe Pices
User currently offlinesw733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6324 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 7697 times:

Quoting bhill (Reply 3):
Hubble anyone.....................?

Hubble seemed like more of a "nice job, dumb ass" scenario than this...at least to me.


User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29800 posts, RR: 58
Reply 5, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 7594 times:

Quoting francoflier (Reply 1):

But then this IS the most complex machine in the world.

Is this the same machine that got shut down because some bird dropped an old bagel into it?



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineMD-90 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 8507 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 7564 times:

Quoting francoflier (Reply 1):
But then this IS the most complex machine in the world.

I dunno, is it more complex than the Space Shuttle?


User currently offlineMudboy From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 1167 posts, RR: 5
Reply 7, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 7487 times:

Isn't this the machine that creates a black hole, and could potentially destroy the world, if it malfuntioned?

User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21467 posts, RR: 53
Reply 8, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 7484 times:

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 6):
I dunno, is it more complex than the Space Shuttle?

By very, very far.

Quoting Mudboy (Reply 7):
Isn't this the machine that creates a black hole, and could potentially destroy the world, if it malfuntioned?

No. It does that when it's functioning properly!


User currently offlineAverageUser From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 7474 times:

Quoting Klaus (Reply 8):

No. It does that when it's functioning properly!

Let's hope it will some day for the face of European science partnership to be saved.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...%27s_most_expensive_single_objects

[Edited 2010-03-11 04:41:12]

User currently offlinesw733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6324 posts, RR: 9
Reply 10, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 1 day ago) and read 7417 times:

Quoting MD-90 (Reply 6):
is it more complex than the Space Shuttle?

The Space Shuttle is so old that it's not as complex by todays standards as if it were, say, 1987. Could you or I build one? Hell no...but, first flight of Columbia was 1981...even the newest, Endeavour, first flew in 1992. Even with upgrades (specifically to glass cockpit, which isn't all that impressive these days), they're pretty old and worn out.


User currently offlineaerobalance From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 4682 posts, RR: 46
Reply 11, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 7375 times:

Pure money pit - throw some more at it!


"Sing a song, play guitar, make it snappy..."
User currently offlinestarac17 From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 3380 posts, RR: 9
Reply 12, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7333 times:

This is necessarily a funny matter but I think I can fix this thing.

Signed

http://images2.fanpop.com/images/photos/8000000/Dr-Sheldon-Cooper-The-Guy-the-big-bang-theory-8053333-750-600.jpg



Engineers Rule The World!!!!!
User currently offlinecomorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4896 posts, RR: 16
Reply 13, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 7330 times:

Even unrepaired, at 7TeV the LHC is an impressive machine and a remarkable achievement. It's now the world's most powerful accelerator by a factor of 2. There's good science coming out of it already, and even at 7TeV there's a chance to spot the Higgs Boson.

The money was well spent and diverted from other forms of useless spending. Look at the brilliant payoff from Hubble, for example.

Folks, 2 years is just an instant in terms of Man's history. Physics has come to a stop until we find out about Dark Matter. If you want a future in which we can wear anti-gravity suits and traipse across the Universe, support this effort!

Be patient, and all will be revealed...


User currently offlineAKiss20 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 609 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 7276 times:

Quoting aerobalance (Reply 11):
Pure money pit - throw some more at it!

Its total cost is around 6 billion dollars. Considering it is a multi-national effort between some of the richest western nations and considering how much we waste on defense, I think the tiny fraction it is getting is more than justifiable.



Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other time. We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are
User currently offlineNoWorries From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 539 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7254 times:

It's a lot of money to spend -- but there are unaswered questions that can only be answered with higher amounts of energy. Ironically, the answers might be negative -- for example, the Higgs might never be found, or some other flaw is found in the Standard Model. Sure, it's a high price to pay for additional information (negative or positive) -- but the alternative is to stop asking questions.

User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8544 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 7241 times:

What was the movie when the villain uses gouged-out eyes to get around the LHC? It was funny... in a morbid way.

User currently offlinesw733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6324 posts, RR: 9
Reply 17, posted (4 years 6 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 7209 times:

Quoting Flighty (Reply 16):
What was the movie when the villain uses gouged-out eyes to get around the LHC?

Angels and Demons, I think


User currently offlineYYZALA From Canada, joined Nov 2009, 155 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (4 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 7046 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Thread starter):
but the machine must close at the end of 2011 for up to a year

So we are looking at December 21, 2012 for it to reopen?  


User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19724 posts, RR: 58
Reply 19, posted (4 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 7014 times:

Quoting YYZALA (Reply 18):
So we are looking at December 21, 2012 for it to reopen?

How many universe-ending black holes are safe?


User currently offlineSilver1SWA From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 4815 posts, RR: 25
Reply 20, posted (4 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 6998 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting YYZALA (Reply 18):
Quoting MadameConcorde (Thread starter):
but the machine must close at the end of 2011 for up to a year

So we are looking at December 21, 2012 for it to reopen?  

lol You beat me to it!



ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
User currently offlinesw733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6324 posts, RR: 9
Reply 21, posted (4 years 6 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6935 times:

Quoting YYZALA (Reply 18):
So we are looking at December 21, 2012 for it to reopen?

With all these earthquakes, we'll be lucky if the planet makes it to December 21, 2010!


User currently offlinekaitak From Ireland, joined Aug 1999, 12476 posts, RR: 37
Reply 22, posted (4 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 6851 times:

Quoting comorin (Reply 13):
Dark Matter

Is this the same as anti-matter?

Quoting NoWorries (Reply 2):
the Higgs boson first

What's this?

Sorry, physics wasn't ever my strong suit at school, but I do have some appreciation of the beauty of all of this kind of sciency stuff (stop me if I'm getting too technical).


User currently offlinecomorin From United States of America, joined May 2005, 4896 posts, RR: 16
Reply 23, posted (4 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 6824 times:

Quoting kaitak (Reply 22):
Quoting comorin (Reply 13):
Dark Matter

Is this the same as anti-matter?

No. Nobody knows what it is except that it is there. It's existence is postulated based on the rate of expansion of the Universe. There is a huge amount of it but we can't see or detect it. Physicists are saying that if we have no clue about this stuff, which is 96% of the known Universe, then how much do we really understand anything?

Getting back to the LHC, the quest is on for the Holy Grail - the Higgs Boson. This is the particle that gives other particles the property of Mass.

All this is extremely hard to understand, even for PhDs. Our human existence is a macro level experience, and most of particle physics is just bits of equations or kluges necessary to fit a theory.

My interest in this is the application of this knowledge - exciting, even if not within my lifetime.


User currently offlinewolbo From Netherlands, joined Mar 2007, 488 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (4 years 6 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 6725 times:

Here's a great photo gallery on the LHC which gives a good impression of the complexity and scale of the project. Amazing they get it to work at all.

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/200...arge_hadron_collider_ready_to.html


25 NoWorries : Special relativity tells us that mass and energy are just two expressions of the same thing -- mass has an energy equivalence and energy has a mass e
26 Post contains links wolbo : Large Hadron Collider smashes energy record again. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8576545.stm
27 Post contains images MadameConcorde : I love the Large Hadron Collider. LHC Concorde SR-71 Space Shuttle McLaren MP4-25 The QE2 The fastest each one in their own category.
28 Post contains links Jacobin777 : ...of interest, even the Higgs Boson might not be the "Holy Grail".. "The Higgs boson mass is subject to large quantum corrections, which makes it di
29 NoWorries : Appears to be someone's dissertation -- the quoted text is a teaser and the payoff immediately follows: "One of the best studied candidates for an ex
30 Post contains images comorin : That is an excellent explanation - you sure know your stuff Jacobin777, I will defer to NoWorries as this thread is going above my pay grade! Like th
31 NoWorries : A true master. For anyone looking for a basic introduction to the Standard Model, his most notable book for the layman, "QED The Strange Theory of Li
32 Post contains images Jacobin777 : True, true indeed. Its been about 20 years since I studied quantum mechanics/quantum chemistry. ...that's for sure, it would certainly throw a bit of
33 comorin : I've been looking for a good read on the subject so thanks for the suggestion. I hope I have few gray cells left! Also looking for a good intro to Pa
34 Post contains links wolbo : Not a book but this is a nice introduction on the LHC and particle physics.
35 NoWorries : I'm convinced that if I don't keep using them, I will lose them. Hawking's book -- A Brief History of Time -- is a great read -- but it is very basic
36 Yellowstone : Darn, I was about to post that. Elaborating on this a bit... Dark matter is actually fairly easy to "discover," in the sense that you can easily show
37 Post contains images comorin : Thank you wolbo and Yellowstone! I wil definitely read that. I found it a little difficult to read without the background Math. I will put your other
38 AKiss20 : A classic higher level text for quantum mechanics and string theory is "Road to Reality" by Roger Penrose. It does require a good background in multi-
39 theredbaron : I think we will need Dr. Gordon Freeman to fix the LHC. .....off to get a crowbar, just in case....
40 NoWorries : Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I thought it was the other way around, dark energy was one way (among many theories) that provides the needed cosmological
41 Post contains images comorin : Looks like a new day for Physics! The LHC smashed its first protons this morning at 3.5 TeV (each).
42 Post contains images NoWorries : Cool -- and we're still here -- no black holes ... but for some strange reason all of the right-hand gloves have disappeared
43 Post contains links MadameConcorde : The scientists at CERN think the Big Machine is performing much better than they expected. The live cast is still going at this time. Party time is ov
44 Post contains images comorin : Ha Ha! The collision has also led to a new thread emerging on the LHC....
45 Post contains links and images MadameConcorde : Brian Cox: What really goes on at the Large Hadron Collider http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6uKZWnJLCM&feature=player_embedded "We’ll address so
46 theredbaron : Excelent Links Thanks..!
47 Post contains images Klaus : Crap! They must have fried the improbability compensator again! [Edited 2010-03-30 14:32:00]
48 Post contains links and images MadameConcorde : Man arrested at Large Hadron Collider claims he's from the future Eloi Cole, a strangely dressed young man, said that he had travelled back in time to
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