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Antiwar.com: Rachel Maddow, McCarthyite  
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8976 posts, RR: 39
Posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 1992 times:

Quite an eye opener for both the left and the right. Piece from Justin Raimondo, one of my favorite bloggers.

Rachel Maddow, McCarthyite: The FBI, the left, and the war on "extremism"

Interested to see some of your comments on the above, from any and all political affiliations.


"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
14 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 10338 posts, RR: 26
Reply 1, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 1915 times:

I don't see anything wrong with what she said. She asked a question. Big deal.

However, the writer of the article said:

"Grouped together in one intellectual package deal are:

* "antigovernment" activists"


But in the text quoted from Maddow, I don't see those words. Instead I see:

"violent, militant, anti-government extremism"

So yeah, it's just more back-and-forth left-vs-right bickering for the sake of bickering.



How can I be an admiral without my cap??!
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8976 posts, RR: 39
Reply 2, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 days ago) and read 1904 times:

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 1):

It's not a direct quote, but his other bullet points cover the violent part pretty well.



"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 10338 posts, RR: 26
Reply 3, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 1838 times:

Quoting PPVRA (Reply 2):
It's not a direct quote, but his other bullet points cover the violent part pretty well.

I know that.

Right after listing his bullet points (which he says Maddow grouped together), he says:

"One of these things is not like the others, and Maddow - no dummy - knows it.

That's why the plaintive tone is taken - "Is it helpful?" - when posing the question of whether this is a unitary movement that needs to be infiltrated by law enforcement and its members arrested and jailed. The whole idea is to discredit "antigovernment" (i.e. pro-liberty) movements and politicians in the mainstream by associating them with hate and - most importantly - violence, or the threat of it. "


So he's saying that Maddow illegitimately grouped ""antigovernment" (i.e. pro-liberty) movements and politicians" with violent offenders.

However, in the text from Maddow's show that he quoted, she never mentions peaceful anti-government protesters. Instead, she says:

"violent, militant, anti-government extremism"

Which refers to, obviously, violent anti-government activists. Not peaceful anti-government activists.

So like I said, bickering for the sake of bickering.



How can I be an admiral without my cap??!
User currently offlineEA772LR From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2836 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 1794 times:

Excellent read. Maddow unfortunately represents the mindset of the majority of those still supporting Obama and what the Democrats have done the last 15 months in power. The media has by and large stopped reporting the news, and started creating news to defend their poster loser B.H.O. Great blogger. I'll definitely be reading much more of his work. Thanks PPVRA   

It's interesting that those of us against Obama are considered either one or two things: racist or extremist. Hell, if we're lucky, we're both! I guess Liberals suffer from short term memory loss, because groups like moveon.org were likening Bush to Hitler. Groups like Code Pink were disrupting church services. Liberals all across the country were making signs saying either outright 'Kill Bush' or in some way insinuating Bush die. Michael Savage is right on with his diagnosis of Liberals.

I suppose if this was Obama's face, we'd be racist:


I suppose if a Conservative held up this sign with Obama's name, we'd be extremist:


Again, Conservatives are the 'extremist' in the country...??


The hypocrisy is enough to make any logical animal's blood boil...



We often judge others by their actions, but ourselves by our intentions.
User currently offlineEA772LR From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2836 posts, RR: 10
Reply 5, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 1784 times:

This one didn't show up.




We often judge others by their actions, but ourselves by our intentions.
User currently offlineAGM100 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 5407 posts, RR: 17
Reply 6, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 1767 times:

Leftwing, corrupt psycho Maxine Waters exposed ... a real train wreck... and a cozy nutshell for all of the democrats . My the good old days when it was patriotic to protest ....

http://www.thefoxnation.com/rep-maxi...atch-maxine-waters-total-hypocrite

And my all time favourite ... Hillary, angry Hillary .... love it

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4CzteDucRHo&NR=1



You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8976 posts, RR: 39
Reply 7, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1656 times:

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 3):
Which refers to, obviously, violent anti-government activists. Not peaceful anti-government activists.

He brings up government infiltration into leftist groups in the 1960s, including violent groups, and points how many of these were actually set up by the FBI. This is the main crux of the article. Maddow never says she wants to bring back these specific practices, but despite the history of abuse of these types of infiltration (even for political gain), she wants these infiltrations back. The contributor to her show is pretty explicit about this, too.

A related concern is their insistence in calling this "domestic terrorism" when taken in conjunction with the Patriot Act and what that could mean, something Justin addressed, and she did not even while seemingly agreeing with the idea of infiltrating these groups.

It's one thing to investigate violent threats, its quite another to set up a program to actively spy on citizens, even the most minute fringe groups, yet something else that has been a source of abuse in the past.

[Edited 2010-04-06 20:28:08]


"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8976 posts, RR: 39
Reply 8, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 1624 times:

Quoting PPVRA (Reply 7):
even the most minute fringe groups, yet something else that has been a source of abuse in the past.

I was referring to his JBS comments on that last part. Sorry did some re-editing and mixed things up a bit.



"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineAirStairs From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 487 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 1613 times:

Quoting EA772LR (Reply 4):
It's interesting that those of us against Obama are considered either one or two things: racist or extremist.

My favorite is when a gay, quasi-environmentalist, anti-war, pro-legalization, legal conservative, civil liberties athiest like myself is labeled a lock-step, purity tested, far right, selfish, extremist, ignorant, uneducated, teabagging, obstructionist bent on killing cancer patients because I disagree with a specific piece of legislation that is so expansive it is basically impossible to support in its entirety anyway.


User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8976 posts, RR: 39
Reply 10, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 1569 times:

Quoting AirStairs (Reply 9):
My favorite is when a gay, quasi-environmentalist, anti-war, pro-legalization, legal conservative, civil liberties athiest like myself

Wow, for a second there I thought you were the author of the blog I posted. . . but then I checked your profile and noticed you are a little too young  



"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineDXing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 1552 times:

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 1):
However, the writer of the article said:

"Grouped together in one intellectual package deal are:

* "antigovernment" activists"

But in the text quoted from Maddow, I don't see those words. Instead I see:

"violent, militant, anti-government extremism"

2 out of the five listed are not "antigovernment". The abortion doctor killer and the anti-semite had issues with those particular things (abortion and Jews) not the government. Seems like Maddow was just lumping anything she could to make the problem seem larger than it is. Of course we already know with this President, everything is "unprecedented"!


User currently offlineAirStairs From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 487 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 1489 times:

Quoting DXing (Reply 11):
The abortion doctor killer and the anti-semite had issues with those particular things (abortion and Jews) not the government.

I noticed this as well. I actually watch Maddow frequently, and given how smart I'm sure she must be with the Rhodes and all, I am consistently surprised at how many logical sleights-of-hand and misleading premises she uses on her show. She has done some good investigative stuff, but her framing of issues is so disingenuous and presumptuous it actually does a disservice to the discourse.


User currently offlineseb146 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 11798 posts, RR: 15
Reply 13, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1436 times:

Quoting EA772LR (Reply 4):
Maddow unfortunately represents the mindset of the majority of those still supporting Obama and what the Democrats have done the last 15 months in power.

What? Like try to help those within our own borders instead of bombing other nations into submission based on half-truths and outright lies
?

Quoting EA772LR (Reply 4):
The media has by and large stopped reporting the news, and started creating news to defend their poster loser

Ummmmm.... actually, you are a bit late on that. The media stopped reporting the news way back about 15 years ago.

Quoting EA772LR (Reply 4):
It's interesting that those of us against Obama are considered either one or two things: racist or extremist.

It's interesting those of us that speak out against "tea partiers" and right-wingers are all marxist, communits, socialist, and only want to bring down the government and strip everyone of liberties and destroy the Constitution. Interesting how if anyone to the left has an opinion different than "tea partiers" they are not worth listening to because they are only out to destroy the Republic and our Constitution.

Remember that opposition is to be celebrated? Isn't that what the right is all about? Freedom to express oneself? Or, does that only apply to right-wingers? That is a retorical question as I know the answer coming from right-wingers.



Life in the wall is a drag.
User currently offlineAirStairs From United States of America, joined Jul 2008, 487 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (4 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1428 times:

Quoting seb146 (Reply 13):
Remember that opposition is to be celebrated? Isn't that what the right is all about? Freedom to express oneself? Or, does that only apply to right-wingers? That is a retorical question as I know the answer coming from right-wingers.

You made a good point and then completely invalidated it. I am almost thinking of de-registering so I don't have to deal with party identification as it is SO obvious that most members of either party are completely incapable of understanding the nuances of individuals' views and have no interest in a solution other than the party platform. I would also point that attacking one policy or another as a matter of debate is not "silencing" the opposition...it is debate. Entertain other ideas and defend yours or don't play the game.


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