Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Joke On A Beggar Becomes A Media Scandal In Spain  
User currently offlineLTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 50
Posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2996 times:

http://www.mopo.de/2010/20100515/ham...tv_star_verhoehnt_obdachlosen.html (German only)
http://www.abc.es/20100515/medios-re...o-lama-indigente-201005151718.html (Spanish only)

I couldn't find a link in English, but in short, Spanish TV and radio reporter Manolo Lama was reporting on the final hours prior to the Europaleague final, when he and a few other Spanish fans made a joke on a homeless person named Kalle, who goes begging on the Reesedammbrücke near our Town Hall, on the Jungfernstieg. In front of the camera the reporter and the fans throw not just a few coins, but also mobile phones, credit cards, scarves and other objects on the beggar. He can only watch confused, but realises that their intentions were NOT sincere. He was left with just 5 Euros, a major humiliation, and anger towards the people responsible. Kalle also said that they never even asked him for his consent to be filmed.

The whole incident, which was broadcast on Spanish television, sparked a major wave of outrage in all of Spain. Mr Lama had to apologise for the incident recently, claiming that he never meant to hurt him and claiming that he was respect for homeless people. On Facebook, anti-Manolo Lama pages were created, demanding his immediate resignation, and some dailies in Spain even call this a one of the biggest scandals in TV history. Here's a video of the incident: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sqi5bH_7Lb8

When I read the Mopo this morning, I was left speachless over this. It's bad enough that we have homeless people begging in the streets in the first place, but that people humiliate one live on television? That shows the true (bad) character of these people. If that guy has a shred of decency left, he would not just apologise to Kalle in person, in front of the camera and in German, but also resign from his post not only at his TV station, but also at his radio station.

13 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineBirdwatching From Germany, joined Sep 2003, 3823 posts, RR: 51
Reply 1, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2964 times:

What I don't understand is why there are beggars and homeless people in Germany. If you're unemployed you get welfare which is enough to afford a cheap apartment and food. This is one thing I have never understood about Germany, why some people continue to choose the "homeless lifestyle".

Soren   



All the things you probably hate about travelling are warm reminders that I'm home
User currently offlineLTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 50
Reply 2, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2921 times:

Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 1):
What I don't understand is why there are beggars and homeless people in Germany. If you're unemployed you get welfare which is enough to afford a cheap apartment and food.

Not everyone is "fortunate" enough to get Hartz IV. Plus there have been beggars and homeless people way before politicians ever came up with the concept of Hartz IV.


User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 14030 posts, RR: 62
Reply 3, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 2900 times:

Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 1):
What I don't understand is why there are beggars and homeless people in Germany. If you're unemployed you get welfare which is enough to afford a cheap apartment and food. This is one thing I have never understood about Germany, why some people continue to choose the "homeless lifestyle".

Soren

Actually, what I´ve heard from a person who has worked with homeless people, many have psychological issues and/or are drug addicts (mainly alcohol), who are not really able to take care of themselves. Also quite a few refuse e.g. to sleep in a dormitory, because they say that there they are in a danger of having their few possessions stolen by other homeless people.
Others suffer from extreme claustrophobia and don´t like to be indoors.
Then the other problem is that you can´t get social welfare without a fixed adress, but on the other hand it is almost impossible today to get even a cheap flat without being able to show a regular income.

Years ago, when I was still in university, I used to have a parttime job as assistant librarian in the library of the physics department of this university in Berlin. There was a homeless woman, somewhere in her 40s back then, who would come to the physics department every day. She would get herself washed in the lady´s room and then she would often sit in the library reading books on physics or mathematics. She kept her belongings in a shopping trolley and slept somewhere on the campus. She was defintely not stupid, though quite a bit excentric, and kept herself clean.
Since she didn´t cause any trouble, she was tolerated by the university staff.

Jan

[Edited 2010-05-15 14:45:31]

User currently offlineOA412 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 5295 posts, RR: 25
Reply 4, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 2860 times:

Quoting LTU932 (Thread starter):
When I read the Mopo this morning, I was left speachless over this. It's bad enough that we have homeless people begging in the streets in the first place, but that people humiliate one live on television? That shows the true (bad) character of these people. If that guy has a shred of decency left, he would not just apologise to Kalle in person, in front of the camera and in German, but also resign from his post not only at his TV station, but also at his radio station.

What a douchebag. Perhaps he should spend a day or two as a homeless person and see how fun it would be to have this idiotic stunt done to him.



Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
User currently offlineMaverick623 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 5653 posts, RR: 6
Reply 5, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 2771 times:

Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 1):
why some people continue to choose the "homeless lifestyle".

99% of them don't "choose":

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 3):
many have psychological issues and/or are drug addicts

That's what makes this "stunt" more disgusting. Pick on the willing, but leave the ill out of it.



"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
User currently offlineDerico From Argentina, joined Dec 1999, 4307 posts, RR: 11
Reply 6, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2674 times:

Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 1):
What I don't understand is why there are beggars and homeless people in Germany. If you're unemployed you get welfare which is enough to afford a cheap apartment and food. This is one thing I have never understood about Germany, why some people continue to choose the "homeless lifestyle".

It's funny you mention that because when I was on a tour of Europe once with my family (I was a kid like pre high school), we were all in central Munich having the ''very expected of tourists'' sausage and beer rounds (I had a coke)... Long story short, no sooner we got up from our table this homeless guy sits right down and starts munching on the leftovers, then he did the same with the next table.

Needless to say, all of us Argentines and Brazilians (90% of the tour), were like in shock since the image of Europe is that there is no poverty or homelesness.

It is strange because I didn't see beggars as evidently anywhere else in W. Europe that time around. In that same trip, they tried to steal my mother and friend's purse at the Madrid Metro, and a Taxi cab in Paris ripped off a Brazilian couple.

Lesson for South Americans on that trip: Yes, we are light years away from European or North American living standards, but not THAT many light years.  



My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
User currently offlineRabenschlag From Germany, joined Oct 2000, 1007 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 2541 times:

Quoting Birdwatching (Reply 1):
What I don't understand is why there are beggars and homeless people in Germany. If you're unemployed you get welfare which is enough to afford a cheap apartment and food. This is one thing I have never understood about Germany, why some people continue to choose the "homeless lifestyle".

There are many reasons. One important one is that welfare in Germany is conditional. If you do not comply with the requirements of the welfare office, they can cut your benefits down to 0 €. Requirements can be to write so and so many job applications or to show up at the office at a particular time etc. There was a not so funny story of a guy on welfare who lost his benefits because he failed to write applications. He was way over 50 and thus without a chance on the job market anyways. He was dyslexic so he could not read or write. Losing his benefits caused him to be kicked out of his apartment, so he became homeless.

Another issue is that if you are on your own, you really need to organize your life very well to live on the welfare money. You need to buy the cheapest stuff available and to spare any luxurious items (such as cigarettes or anything from another source than Aldi). So, it your self-regulation is a bit off, you are out of money mid of the month. And what then? You have to beg for money.

Anyways - it's not that the money is thrown at you in Germany. Depending on where you live and the mindset of the welfare agencies, you have to fight for it. Too much for some.

[Edited 2010-05-16 01:04:33]

User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 14030 posts, RR: 62
Reply 8, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 2448 times:

Quoting Rabenschlag (Reply 7):
Anyways - it's not that the money is thrown at you in Germany. Depending on where you live and the mindset of the welfare agencies, you have to fight for it. Too much for some.

This also a problem. many of the civil servants in the welfare departments have their phantasies of power to the disadvantage of the needy (I´m not saying that they shouldn´t check applications to keep out freeloaders, such "smart" people, who know how to play the system exist as well, my ex was one of them), but many of these civil servants expect a welfare applicant to crawl in front of them before they will grant them anything, even if by law they should.

Derico,

There still exists another type of beggars in Europe: Mainly gypsies from Eastern Europe (mostly women and children). In many cases they have debts with mafia-like loan sharks in their own country and get forced to go begging in a big scam by their creditors (the problem iks that the gypsies get heavily discriminated against in their own countries, so that it very difficult for them to get a proper job or even a loan with some respectable bank under usual conditions, so that they have to resort to go to criminal loan sharks to get a loan).

Jan


User currently offlineL410Turbolet From Czech Republic, joined May 2004, 5718 posts, RR: 18
Reply 9, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 2422 times:

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 3):
Also quite a few refuse e.g. to sleep in a dormitory, because they say that there they are in a danger of having their few possessions stolen by other homeless people.

.. or simply not willing to adhere to the minimal house rules dorms have i.e. arrive sober (means "not obviously drunk") and no alcohol allowed on premises. This is the usual story every winter in Prague: dorms are half empty for most of the winter unless the freezing gets really dangerous and shelters then usually waive the sobriety rule.


User currently offlineRabenschlag From Germany, joined Oct 2000, 1007 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 2398 times:

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 9):
.. or simply not willing to adhere to the minimal house rules dorms have i.e. arrive sober (means "not obviously drunk") and no alcohol allowed on premises. This is the usual story every winter in Prague: dorms are half empty for most of the winter unless the freezing gets really dangerous and shelters then usually waive the sobriety rule.

And for obvious reasons, they break the rules. Many homeless people are alcohol dependent, so they cant simply stop. For many, this would even create medical problems, they would need a qualified withdrawal.


User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 14030 posts, RR: 62
Reply 11, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 2394 times:

Also, not all homeless drink. The woman I mentioned earlier never smelled of alcohol and I never saw her with a bottle (but I think she had some psychological issues). Similarly you´ll have a range of temporarely homeless, who lost their residence temporarely due to divorce, loss of job or other circumstances and want to get back into mainstream life. These are the ones who e.g. sell the homeless magazines in the Berlin underground trains and who keep themselves clean and shaved. They might drink every now and then, but are not obviously drunk.

Jan


User currently offlineStratofish From Germany, joined Sep 2001, 1051 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 2356 times:

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 8):
There still exists another type of beggars in Europe: Mainly gypsies from Eastern Europe (mostly women and children). In many cases they have debts with mafia-like loan sharks in their own country and get forced to go begging in a big scam by their creditors (the problem iks that the gypsies get heavily discriminated against in their own countries, so that it very difficult for them to get a proper job or even a loan with some respectable bank under usual conditions, so that they have to resort to go to criminal loan sharks to get a loan).

And worst type: those (mainly south asians) that get mutilated by the mafia scumbags to generate more "revenue" here. Puts you in the really perverse situation where you have to tell yourself that they are lost anyway and you better not give them any money so their bosses don't get income and hopefully stop sending more unfortunated souls here.

Back to the topic at hand: while it was a disgusting stunt, he apologized really quick and I think that should be enough. I mean other tv people have done worse, don't you think?
The biggest scandal still is (or shall be) the chaos at HAM caused by piss poor planning, bad execution of the few things that actually were planned, a small feud between HAM airport and LH Technik, etc.
And seeing HAM management in a complete state of denial to all criticism, THAT'S where heads should roll!



The Metro might be the Sub(optimal)way
User currently offlineLTU932 From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 13864 posts, RR: 50
Reply 13, posted (4 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2215 times:

Quoting Rabenschlag (Reply 7):
There was a not so funny story of a guy on welfare who lost his benefits because he failed to write applications. He was way over 50 and thus without a chance on the job market anyways. He was dyslexic so he could not read or write. Losing his benefits caused him to be kicked out of his apartment, so he became homeless.

Let me guess: The Arbeitsamt simply did not believe that he was a dyslexic, so they cut Hartz IV. That's just sick. At the very least, the Arbeitsamt could have ordered him to a test, to confirm that he was dyslexic and when his dyslexia was confirmed, they could have helped him with the applications.

All these stories remind me of how damn lucky I got. When I returned to Germany in February, after having lived 12 years in Costa Rica, I had some money left and when I reported myself at the Arbeitsamt, I refused to get Hartz IV just yet, but time was ticking away. However in March, I got lucky that I got a decently paid job on my own (and they even recognised my previous work experience in Costa Rica), and the Arbeitsamt did not even get the mails I constantly returned, where I told them that I refused the offers they sent me because I already signed a labour contract with another employer, and it wasn't until they called me to postpone an appointment I had when I could finally confirm this fact. I'm now a month and a half into that job, and I vowed to myself to do everything to earn a contract extension and stay employed, hence when I make mistakes, I get very hard with myself, because I don't want to fall into the vicious circle which is the German welfare system and with that, Hartz IV.

Quoting Stratofish (Reply 12):
Back to the topic at hand: while it was a disgusting stunt, he apologized really quick and I think that should be enough.

Many people, myself included, believe that his apology wasn't sincere at all. It was just a "formality". On one of those anti-Manolo websites, I recall reading about a reporter from BBC's Radio Manchester, who was sacked for making a comment during a football march, where he made a comparison with an incident in Madrid-Barajas, at the Airport. I even proposed that Manolo come back to Germany, meet with Kalle and, in front of the camera, make a formal apology to Kalle, in German. It's a longshot, but only in this way he can truely show to Kalle that he's genuinely sorry.


Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Ideas On Meeting Girls When Living In The "sticks" posted Fri Mar 14 2008 17:50:11 by KLM672
Car Hire In Spain/Portugal For 18 Year Olds? posted Mon Feb 11 2008 05:49:44 by B742
JibJab Takes On The News Media... posted Thu Mar 29 2007 06:01:47 by OPNLguy
Oiltanker On Collsion Course With Rig In North Sea posted Thu Jan 11 2007 21:11:06 by Thom@s
Yet Another Football Scandal In Italy Brewing posted Wed Dec 6 2006 05:54:03 by LTU932
What To See In Spain/Morocco? posted Mon Jun 12 2006 21:23:29 by BCAInfoSys
5K Run On New ATL Runway...Who's In? posted Wed Mar 29 2006 18:32:01 by 767Lover
Driving In Spain posted Fri Jan 20 2006 06:12:57 by Acho
On This Day (Dec 16) In 1998 posted Sat Dec 17 2005 05:25:10 by 767Lover
Favorite Place(s) To Visit In Spain. Suggestions? posted Sun Dec 4 2005 21:42:14 by Jake056