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Sen. Robert Byrd Dies At Age 92  
User currently offlinedragon-wings From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 3966 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2259 times:

The longest-serving member of Congress in U.S. history died early Monday at age 92.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37959947/ns/politics-capitol_hill


Don't give up don't ever give up - Jim Valvano
13 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineJBirdAV8r From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 4482 posts, RR: 22
Reply 1, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 2241 times:

Prayers for his family.

However, Robert Byrd exemplified everything wrong with Washington politics. No one should have been in politics as long as he has, and he was truly a champion of the pork barrel.

In addition to that, he was a lousy person--an avowed racist.



I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
User currently offlineLtbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 12883 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 2227 times:

Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 1):
However, Robert Byrd exemplified everything wrong with Washington politics. No one should have been in politics as long as he has, and he was truly a champion of the pork barrel.

In addition to that, he was a lousy person--an avowed racist.

There is no doubt that he will be missed for his important counsel, his support of the needs of many millions of Americans, one of the last of the politicans in the USA who lived during our Great Depression. He was involved in some of the most critical issues of the last 60 years, often supporting the 'liberal' view.

Yes he was probably one of the greatest masters of getting 'pork' spending in his state, one of the poorest in the USA but the price was encouraging limited enviromental regulation of the coal mining industry in his state.

Did he serve too long? Perhaps yes, I think the USA should have an upper age limit - perhaps age 75 for all Federal elected and appointed offices, including all Judges. While quite lucid and still a great contributor to the many issues even in our day, there have been too many of these elderly men who got elected more as voters feared change, having a very senior position person to gain them 'pork' and who gave old-fashion service to voters. He was also quite outspoken as to going to war in Iraq and Afganistan.

As to the issue of racism, yes, he was a member of a KKK chapter in WV for a short period up until he became a Congressmember more out of the practical reality of the 1940's and 1950's where many White male voters were challanging the changes in society and policy toward Black Americans. He has express regret for decades as to his membership in the KKK and became a leading Senator as to Civil Rights.

I would presume he will get a funeral of great attention and honor as he deserves.


User currently offlinetz757300 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 2866 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 2204 times:

Quoting Ltbewr (Reply 2):


Yes he was probably one of the greatest masters of getting 'pork' spending in his state, one of the poorest in the USA

No kidding. Probably most famous for his "Highway to nowhere," which really is a highway to nowhere. Everything he had some sort of involvement in getting money for, his name is plastered on it. RCB Highway, RCB High School(s), RCB water treatment plant, RCB this, RCB that. I remember asking a group from my friends from school, who is this guy anyway, and everyone got so uptight and pissed with me. He is a patron saint here.

Quoting Ltbewr (Reply 2):

I would presume he will get a funeral of great attention and honor as he deserves.

Might mean I get a day off from work, as the state will probably close its offices for remembrance. This will be a big deal when the funeral happens.



LETS GO MOUNTAINEERS!
User currently offlinedxing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 2190 times:

Quoting Ltbewr (Reply 2):
There is no doubt that he will be missed for his important counsel

I think he will be missed by those of us who believe that the Constitution trumps all. He was one of the few politicians that actually carried a pocket copy around with him.

Quoting Ltbewr (Reply 2):
Yes he was probably one of the greatest masters of getting 'pork' spending in his state, one of the poorest in the USA but the price was encouraging limited enviromental regulation of the coal mining industry in his state.

He was the undisputed master at getting pork for his State. That is what being the chairman of the appropriations committee gets you.

Quoting Ltbewr (Reply 2):
Did he serve too long? Perhaps yes, I think the USA should have an upper age limit - perhaps age 75 for all Federal elected and appointed offices, including all Judges

Agreed. We limit a number of jobs and priviliges to certain age limits. No reason that politicians and judges should not be subject to the same type of reasoning.

Quoting Ltbewr (Reply 2):
As to the issue of racism, yes, he was a member of a KKK chapter in WV for a short period up until he became a Congressmember more out of the practical reality of the 1940's and 1950's where many White male voters were challanging the changes in society and policy toward Black Americans. He has express regret for decades as to his membership in the KKK and became a leading Senator as to Civil Rights.

He voted against the 1964 civil rights act as was always against bussing so his views went on long after his KKK days.


Regardless no one can claim he wasn't a substantial figure in the Senate for decades. With his passing and Ted Kennedy's last year, that about does it for the "old guard" politicans of the day when they may have argued heatedly for their various causes but did not begrudge the oppoisition just for "being" as is the case today.

RIP Senator Byrd.


User currently offlineSlider From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6661 posts, RR: 35
Reply 5, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 2156 times:

Quoting dxing (Reply 4):
I think he will be missed by those of us who believe that the Constitution trumps all. He was one of the few politicians that actually carried a pocket copy around with him.

Did he carry a Constitution on him so he knew how NOT to follow it?

AMF Byrd.


User currently offlinedxing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 2142 times:

Quoting Slider (Reply 5):
Did he carry a Constitution on him so he knew how NOT to follow it?

Actually, he probably did a better job of following it than many so-called "originalist" conservatives.

[Edited 2010-06-28 07:37:27]

User currently offlineSlider From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6661 posts, RR: 35
Reply 7, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 2082 times:

Quoting dxing (Reply 6):
Actually, he probably did a better job of following it than many so-called "originalist" conservatives.

Really? Maybe you can clarify that. I'd like to know how his stealing pork for WV and decades of big government voting and tracking is constitutional.


And then there's his lovely past:

Byrd: "I shall never fight in the armed forces with a Negro by my side… Rather I should die a thousand times, and see Old Glory trampled in the dirt never to rise again, than to see this beloved land of ours become degraded by race mongrels, a throwback to the blackest specimen from the wilds."

Adios, Byrd.


User currently offlineAGM100 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 5407 posts, RR: 16
Reply 8, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 2079 times:

I heard a commentator mention that the Senator bringing home the bacon for Virginia was unprecedented ... and of course was good at naming the projects after himself. The" Robert C. Byrd" , highway's , bridge's , Dam's , libraries , youth centers , parks , business parks , court houses , government buildings , scenic routes , rest areas , elementary schools , high schools , college grants , university buildings , hospital wings , clinics , technology centers , reclamation centers ....on and on. A fair argument is that these projects served the people of Virginia and I am sure that they do .... but a little modesty anyone ?


Maybe he could have named something after one of these heroes of the great state of Virginia ....

http://www.homeofheroes.com/moh/states/va.html


Rest in Peace .... Robert .



You dig the hole .. I fill the hole . 100% employment !
User currently offlineSulley From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 524 posts, RR: 3
Reply 9, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 2077 times:

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 8):

AGM, he represented WEST Virginia... not Virginia.

I can only wonder how bad off WV would be without his "pork."

RIP Senator.

[Edited 2010-06-28 09:24:00]


In thrust we trust!
User currently offlineTugger From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 5254 posts, RR: 8
Reply 10, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 2055 times:

A long life, and he served his constituency well (even if we dislike it).

RIP Sen. Byrd.

Tugg

[Edited 2010-06-28 09:44:03]


I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
User currently offlineexFATboy From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2974 posts, RR: 9
Reply 11, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 2027 times:

Quoting dxing (Reply 4):
He voted against the 1964 civil rights act as was always against bussing so his views went on long after his KKK days.

Many Congressmen voted against the CRA 1964 without being racist, mostly on the grounds that the provisions of Title 2 was an unconstitutional expansion of Federal power by expanding the definitions of "public accommodation" and "interstate commerce". Barry Goldwater, who had supported previous attempts to pass a Civil Rights Act voted against the CRA 1964 on just these grounds, that it constituted an attempt to "legislate morality" and thus violated both personal liberty and the 10th Amendment.

Whether Byrd's vote against the bill came from these principles or racism is debatable - he joined the Klan in 1942 and later claimed to have become "disinterested" in it a year later, yet wrote his "I shall never fight..." letter in 1944 and letters supporting the Klan have been found from 1946-47.

Had his views moderated somewhere between then and 1964? Publically, they had, for no other reason than he wanted to play a role in the Party leadership. It's debatable whether, by the early '60s, Byrd was really an out-and-out white supremacist, or opposed desegregation on the basis of "states' rights." Most recent writers seem willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, but I tend to think he was at least still a segregationist of the "separate but equal" school...the sheer vehemence of his opposition to the CRA 1964 as reflected in the filibuster, when compared to opponents like Goldwater, leads me to think there was more to his opposition than constitutional grounds.

Quoting Sulley (Reply 9):
I can only wonder how bad off WV would be without his "pork."

Without the "pork", perhaps West Virginia would have had to work harder on developing a viable private-sector economy, instead of mooching off the rest of the country.

Quoting Slider (Reply 7):
I'd like to know how his stealing pork for WV and decades of big government voting and tracking is constitutional.

The Constitution just creates the framework of the government, not what the government does within that framework. "Pork" isn't illegal, and over the decades the Supreme Court has effectively nullified the 10th Amendment by stretching the Interstate Commerce Clause and the "promote the general welfare" wording of the Preamble to allow the Federal government to pretty much do whatever it wants.


User currently offlinedxing From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 1901 times:

Quoting Slider (Reply 7):

Really? Maybe you can clarify that. I'd like to know how his stealing pork for WV and decades of big government voting and tracking is constitutional.

exFATboy described it pretty acurately. The Constitution does not say "politicians shall refrain from promoting and spending on their constituents". When it came to Constitutional matters, such as how the Senate operated, or seperation of powers, Senator Byrd was a pretty strict Constitutionalist and resisted any side of the triangle gaining powers over the other two. I give him credit on that just as I villify him for:

Quoting Slider (Reply 7):
And then there's his lovely past:

in which the willing press excluded or played down any real examination of his past. He gave an interview not too man years ago in which he used the N word several times. Had he had an "R" after his name the press would have simply demanded that he resign and kept up the pressure until he did. Since he had a "D" behind his name, he was given the usual free pass.

Quoting exFATboy (Reply 11):
Many Congressmen voted against the CRA 1964 without being racist,

But not Senator Byrd.

Quoting exFATboy (Reply 11):
Whether Byrd's vote against the bill came from these principles or racism is debatable - he joined the Klan in 1942 and later claimed to have become "disinterested" in it a year later, yet wrote his "I shall never fight..." letter in 1944 and letters supporting the Klan have been found from 1946-47.

No one gets to be the Grand Cyclops because they joined the KKK on a lark and then became disinterested. At the very least the Grand Cyclops is a low level director of operations which at that time would have meant deciding where to burn crosses and such. Again, for anyone with an "R" after their name, the fact that they had been a Grand Cyclops in the KKK would have been in the first paragraph instead of buried towards the bottom and being reduced to "he was in the KKK for a brief time".


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39478 posts, RR: 75
Reply 13, posted (3 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 1875 times:

Quoting Ltbewr (Reply 2):
I think the USA should have an upper age limit - perhaps age 75 for all Federal elected and appointed offices, including all Judges. While quite lucid and still a great contributor to the many issues even in our day, there have been too many of these elderly men who got elected more as voters feared change, having a very senior position person to gain them 'pork' and who gave old-fashion service to voters.

I have no problem with the age of elected officials. I tend to respect them more because they have endured much tougher times. Especially those that lived through the Great Depression, WW2 and the Civil Rights Era.
I respect their judgment much more than the spoiled chickenhawks that have led us to war in Iraq.



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