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Baby Doc JC Duvalier Back In Haiti  
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 2438 times:

I saw this on several news sites this morning. JC Duvalier Baby Doc landed in Haiti on board an Air France flight.

See the AF flight bringing the dictator back.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1b1lkFOfkQ&feature=player_embedded

BBC News story
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-11943820

Haiti Xchange forum - get the Haitians opinions
http://www.haitixchange.com/index.php/forums/viewthread/5922/P36/

He said he is going to work on rebuilding his country. How does he dare?
A press conference with the tyrant is scheduled today in Port au Prince.

Are the Haitians so forgetful? How is he ever allowed back in the country?

Poor them . I hope they haven't forgotten how he left the country in ruins when he fled. And his 3 million dollars wedding when people were starving.

 


There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
33 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinemal787 From Australia, joined Jul 2007, 687 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 2409 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Thread starter):
See the AF flight bringing the dictator back
Quoting MadameConcorde (Thread starter):

How is he ever allowed back in the country?


Well who paid for his Ticket?,Who has been watching him while living in their country?Who is a supporter? Are Hiatians forgetfull no. Vulnerable yes,
How is he allowed back in the country ? ask those that pull the strings !

mal787



Flying cant get enough of it
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Reply 2, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2398 times:

Quoting mal787 (Reply 1):
Well who paid for his Ticket?

I doubt he was sitting in the back of the plane. They may have even blocked the whole F cabin for him.
Wondering how many Tontons Macoutes were waiting for him at the airport.
They have probably all organized his return between the two countries Baby Doc free to come and go at his leisure.
Let's see how many Haitians will protest his return.
This is sick.  

Some are saying Arristide is now expected back in Port au Prince any moment.



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6601 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 2376 times:

Apparently he was greeted by 2000 supporters.

Quoting mal787 (Reply 1):
Well who paid for his Ticket?,Who has been watching him while living in their country?Who is a supporter? Are Hiatians forgetfull no. Vulnerable yes,
How is he allowed back in the country ? ask those that pull the strings !

mal787

He has some millions left. And the French authorities have no basis for arresting him (if anything, they would put him on a charter back to his country as an illegal alien !).

BTW, that plane is a local A320 plane, so he made a stop somewhere between Paris and Haïti, probably at PTP.

I just watched the video (had to download it first) and the woman journalist said "Guadeloupe" so I guessed right.

On another note, it's possible he could be arrested, last time he wanted to come Préval said he would arrest him.

Also, doesn't he look ill ?

[Edited 2011-01-17 06:29:38]


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17441 posts, RR: 46
Reply 4, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 2309 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Thread starter):
Are the Haitians so forgetful?

Peru elected a president that destroyed the country only a couple decades prior, so yes, they probably are.



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineogre727 From Spain, joined Feb 2005, 719 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 2298 times:

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 4):
Peru elected a president that destroyed the country only a couple decades prior, so yes, they probably are.

But he has done so much better this time around... so who´s to say...



Sigh
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17441 posts, RR: 46
Reply 6, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 2226 times:

Quoting ogre727 (Reply 5):
But he has done so much better this time around... so who´s to say...

Very true, but boy I can't imagine anyone wanting to take that risk



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineTransIsland From Bahamas, joined Mar 2004, 2045 posts, RR: 9
Reply 7, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 2159 times:

Looks like he's been arrested. About time.

Lock. Him. Up.



I'm an aviation expert. I have Sky Juice for breakfast.
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Reply 8, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 2151 times:

Quoting TransIsland (Reply 7):
Looks like he's been arrested. About time.

Lock. Him. Up.

I just saw this news.The police arrested him and took him to Court.
I hope there is no bail system in Haiti. I hope they keep him locked for the rest of his life this cruel dictator!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110118/...am_ca/cb_haiti_ex_dictator_returns


PORT-AU-PRINCE, Haiti – Haitian police led ex-dictator Jean-Claude Duvalier out of his hotel and took him to court Tuesday without saying whether he was being charged with crimes committed under his brutal regime.



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineluv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12099 posts, RR: 49
Reply 9, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2139 times:
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CNN is reporting that he could be back at his hotel later today.


You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Reply 10, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 2098 times:

Quoting luv2fly (Reply 9):
CNN is reporting that he could be back at his hotel later today.

If that's true then the Haitians are a joke.
Just think... this big murderer and his tonton macoutes had so many people killed and he stole so much money from the people!  Wow!



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7443 posts, RR: 62
Reply 11, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2083 times:
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First, for many of the youngin's here:

Baby Doc JC is not a rapper. This is one of those times you can use the internet to search about who Baby Doc is and actually learn something.

Second,

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 10):
If that's true then the Haitians are a joke.

To be fair, Marie, that is wrong. He appeals to one crowd but is hated by another. His involvement there is a cause of much polarization, not quite unlike what we are seeing here with Sarah Palin (some love her and some hate her)

We're all wondering what he is doing there. But considering what the elections have been going through, I think his presence there might sway some.



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlinerfields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7607 posts, RR: 32
Reply 12, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2078 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 10):
If that's true then the Haitians are a joke.

Come on - even for an infamous dictator they have to develop a valid legal case before he can be detained. If that work was already done and supportable charges had been filed, he would probably have been deported from France years ago, or at least have an Interpol warrant active.

Though I have no personal doubt he is guilty of many crimes, it is important that things be done in a legal manner which leaves no doubt of his guilt.


User currently offlineTransIsland From Bahamas, joined Mar 2004, 2045 posts, RR: 9
Reply 13, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2059 times:

Quoting mirrodie (Reply 11):
not quite unlike what we are seeing here with Sarah Palin (some love her and some hate her)

Now, this is a first... I shall rush to the defense of Sarah Palin. As little as I know about her term as governor in Alaaaska, I doubt that she had death squadrons going through the streets at night to rid the state of Democrats.

Yes, she "polarises," but so do all politicians to a degree. I guess Hitler also "polarises," at least I have met a few idiots who still think this whole Aryan race garbage was a good idea.

I would still not vote for Palin, and would like for her to spend the rest of her life in Wasilla's obscurity, however, for Baby Doc Duvalier I have something else in mind, and that would be a very small room with an obstructed view - obstructed by big fat metal bars.

Now, I agree with you that even Duvalier deserves a trial, as otherwise the rule of law becomes arbitrary. (Also "deserving" of trials IMHO are war criminals, terrorists, etc.) I would think it a shame if Haiti missed this opportunity, though it would not necessarily surprise me, as I fear that "justice" in Haiti is bought much cheaper than in many other countries. Should this turn out to be the scenario, then I would kinda concur with Madam Concorde...



I'm an aviation expert. I have Sky Juice for breakfast.
User currently offlineImperialEagle From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2530 posts, RR: 22
Reply 14, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2049 times:
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The scent of money is a powerful magnet for the likes of Duvalier. The corrupt are like flies on ------well, you know. His little plan may damned well back-fire on him though. While he is out for the power-grab, some people with a good memory may do him in. I have empathy for the Hatian people. Generation after generation of hopelessness. Birth-control and education would do much for them. Hopefully some of the money promised to them will begin to make a change.


"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough!"
User currently onlineoly720man From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 6702 posts, RR: 11
Reply 15, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 1991 times:

Well, he's now been charged with corruption, etc, etc, etc

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-12219608

Haiti's former leader Jean-Claude "Baby Doc" Duvalier has been charged with corruption and embezzlement during his 1971-1986 rule, prosecutors say.

Mr Duvalier was allowed to go free after questioning, but a judge will decide whether his case goes to trial.

The ex-leader, who denies wrongdoing, made a surprise return to Haiti on Sunday after 24 years in exile.

He was regarded as a playboy during his time in office, when he used a brutal militia to control the country.

He said he had "come to help" after last year's devastating earthquake.

Port-au-Prince's chief prosecutor Aristidas Auguste told Reuters that charges of corruption, theft, misappropriation of funds and other alleged crimes had been brought against him.


Now the power plays start.



wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Reply 16, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1984 times:

Allowed to go free? How shocking!!

The Duvalier dynasty 1957-1986

Papa Doc the tather
Despite a 1957 prohibition against presidential reelection, Duvalier ran for office and won with an official tally of 1,320,748 votes to zero. Not content with this sham display of democracy, he went on in 1964 to declare himself president for life. For Duvalier, the move was a matter of political tradition; seven heads of state before him had claimed the same title.

Baby Doc the son
By neglecting his role in government, Jean-Claude squandered a considerable amount of domestic and foreign goodwill and facilitated the dominance of Haitian affairs by a clique of hard- line Duvalierist cronies who later became known as the dinosaurs.

More here
http://www.latinamericanstudies.org/haiti/duvalier-dynasty.htm

 



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7443 posts, RR: 62
Reply 17, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 1978 times:
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Quoting TransIsland (Reply 13):
As little as I know about her term as governor in Alaaaska, I doubt that she had death squadrons going through the streets at night to rid the state of Democrats.

Many movements in history start small and only build from there.

Palin's remarks could be perceived by some as firestarters. Wait a minute!

Just look at the Arizona shootings and how many were quick to cast blame on Palin and the Far right within hours of the melee! Honestly that serves as a PRIME example of how things can be percieved as starting. If that is not a Prime and Fresh in your mind example of how people can distort perception to their own causes, then I do not know what is!


On topic, Duvalier was a bad man IMHO and yet there are some that support him. I personally think he, and more so his WIFE (ex), ought to be jailed and all finances returned to Haiti. No government should harbor such sociopaths from justice.


But one lingering thought that is very odd for me:

First, put yourself in this guys shoes, better yet, in his head....

-I dictated and killed many, fled my country and have been living the high life in France for over 20 years. Hmmm....let's head to Haiti where they will likely serve me justice.

I, and I dont think most of the world can even fathom, why he would leave the security of France and return to Haiti. He had to have known he would have been arrested and possibly jailed or tried for crimes. No man in their right man would return to that.

UNLESS you consider the following causes(taken from the mindset of someone who has never dictated a country)....

a) they have friends in the current administration who could coordinate a media circus and yet guarantee him (behind closed doors) his safe return OR

b) he is truly contrite and willing to concede his wrongdoings.


OR

c) Not for nothing.....he looked a LOT like Muhammed Ali(with Parkinson's, did anyone else notice that?) in his recent videos and photos, with a wide eye glare to boot. He looks like Mohammed Ali's twin, no joke.

Perhaps he has Alzheimers and Parkinson's and may truly not be all there.



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlinehka098 From United States of America, joined Oct 2010, 556 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 5 days ago) and read 1972 times:

This dude has an amazing ego to just walk back into a country that exiled him a quarter of a century ago.

User currently offlineTransIsland From Bahamas, joined Mar 2004, 2045 posts, RR: 9
Reply 19, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 1950 times:

Quoting mirrodie (Reply 17):
Just look at the Arizona shootings and how many were quick to cast blame on Palin and the Far right within hours of the melee! Honestly that serves as a PRIME example of how things can be percieved as starting. If that is not a Prime and Fresh in your mind example of how people can distort perception to their own causes, then I do not know what is!

As much as I dislike the American Right, I still do not think that the Arizona shooting is what they had in mind... and yes, I am aware of Sharron Angle's "Second Amendment Remedies" statement.

Quoting mirrodie (Reply 17):
On topic, Duvalier was a bad man IMHO and yet there are some that support him. I personally think he, and more so his WIFE (ex), ought to be jailed and all finances returned to Haiti. No government should harbor such sociopaths from justice.

Agreed. And shame on France for harbouring him. It's one thing if places such as North Korea or Zimbabwe grant refuge to dictators... but a a key member of the European Union? I have always been disgusted.



I'm an aviation expert. I have Sky Juice for breakfast.
User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7443 posts, RR: 62
Reply 20, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 1913 times:
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Quoting TransIsland (Reply 19):
I still do not think that the Arizona shooting is what they had in mind...

No one had in mind, no, yet the media fed hungry minds that Palin was the cause. That is my point. People used it to cast political blame. its wrong but minds are that easily wavered.



As of this morning, I read this imbecile may consider a return to politics! WTF?!



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlineluv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12099 posts, RR: 49
Reply 21, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 1909 times:
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All the chickens are coming home to roost!

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2011/01/20/haiti-aristide-return.html


Aristide: 'I am ready' to return to Haiti


Read more: http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2011/0...aristide-return.html#ixzz1BaihHJj4



You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6601 posts, RR: 9
Reply 22, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1894 times:

Quoting mirrodie (Reply 17):
c) Not for nothing.....he looked a LOT like Muhammed Ali(with Parkinson's, did anyone else notice that?) in his recent videos and photos, with a wide eye glare to boot. He looks like Mohammed Ali's twin, no joke.

Perhaps he has Alzheimers and Parkinson's and may truly not be all there.

Yes I did say that he looked ill.



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineNIKV69 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1888 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 10):
If that's true then the Haitians are a joke.

Not the people, the government.

Quoting mirrodie (Reply 11):
not quite unlike what we are seeing here with Sarah Palin (some love her and some hate her)

Imagine how Palin would be recieved if she actually tortured and killed people like he did.

Quoting mirrodie (Reply 17):
Many movements in history start small and only build from there.

Yea his really took off didn't they?



Look Haiti had a great chance after the earthquake and had the money to rebuild. Something is amiss and this blast from the past are not helping matters and is only sinister. I can only hope there is an indvidual there that starts the real revolution and as much as I hate to say it that country needs a violent rebellion of the people to start to improve. The leaders are corrupt and not going to change unless forced out.


User currently offlineokie From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 3008 posts, RR: 3
Reply 24, posted (3 years 7 months 1 week 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 1882 times:

Quoting ImperialEagle (Reply 14):
The scent of money is a powerful magnet for the likes of Duvalier. The corrupt are like flies on ------well, you know.


  
There is hundreds of millions of dollars to be appropriated.
Just look at the list of "known suspects" that seem to be flocking to Haiti.
Somehow Okie does not get the idea that they are all coming with the welfare of the Haitians in the forefront, I am seriously skeptical.

Okie


25 NIKV69 : Spot on. Someone needs to do something. That country could be so much further along and better off now.
26 mirrodie : Exactly, Nick. The people there are pawns, the gov't is corrupt. Please.....as if he voice isn't torture enough??!!! You betcha. I'll say it straight
27 NIKV69 : Oh she is so sexy when she says that! Good, at this point Haiti needs a hostile takover. That money is too valuable to them and the people in charge
28 francoflier : The Haitians are , unfortunately, extremely bad at deciding who should lead their country. There are large groups of Haitians who implore the return
29 NIKV69 : I didn't mean from the outside. It's their country, they should take it back.
30 francoflier : That's also not really a possibility. Every last dictator and overbearing megalomaniatical looting president they've had in the last decades was a hu
31 TransIsland : Nah, I still don't quite get your point, sorry. Not good at all this comparison business. You mean the educated and philanthropic elite of the countr
32 rfields5421 : Very true. All the best and brightest people of Haiti left the country long ago. I believe this is true of many nations to a certain extent. If you l
33 NIKV69 : That paint a very frim picture then. If the people don't revolt what you are seeing now is what you are going to have.
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