Ken777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8325 posts, RR: 9 Posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1816 times:
Quote: House Republicans suffered an embarrassing setback Tuesday when they fell seven votes short of extending provisions of the Patriot Act, a vote that served as the first small uprising of the party's tea-party bloc.
The bill to reauthorize key parts of the counter-terrorism surveillance law, which expire at the end of the month, required a super-majority to pass under special rules reserved for non-controversial measures.
. . .
The vote was the latest signal, though, that on certain matters House leaders could face a sizable resistance to compromise from within their own ranks, both from the 87 GOP freshmen and from conservative veterans who have been emboldened by the newcomers.
It is embarrassing for the Republican Leadership for the failure, but more interesting is going to be the freshman class and the power they now know they have. I don't see them joining the Democrats in a lot of areas, but it will be really interesting to see if there is a split on the Right and that might push some Conservatives closer to the middle - and others into the Tea Party camp.
rfields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7607 posts, RR: 32
Reply 1, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1724 times:
The measure had plenty of votes to pass during the normal process, which it will in a couple weeks.
The House leadership just decided to push this through on a fast track which requires a 2/3 majority vote. They came up 8 votes short.
I agree they should have been smarter about counting their votes before they brought up the bill - because as you said the Tea Party folks have been against the type of procedures the Patriot Act legalizes.
There is no doubt this extension will be passed. Even President Obama is pushing for passage, so many Democrats will vote when the bill comes up for the real approval vote.
You jumped the gun on this one..Nothing embarrassing about losing the 2/3 majority. but nice try. What you should be bitching about is the fact that just like Bush, Obama will sign this again and there is even a group of Dems looking to make this permanent.
IMissPiedmont From United States of America, joined May 2001, 6305 posts, RR: 33
Reply 3, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1710 times:
Why are the proponents of the "Patriot Act" the furthest thing from partiots this country has ever seen ? I wish it hand that abusrdity known as the Department of Homeland Security (It would be laughable if the ramifications were not so severe) would just go away.
Quoting windy95 (Reply 2): the fact that just like Bush, Obama will sign this again and there is even a group of Dems looking to make this permanent.
Now that Obama is president and is "in the know" he may have realized how important this stuff is. With Obama being a less than one term senator I doubt he really knew a lot of details about things like the PATRIOT act and Gitmo before he got into office. If a lefty like Obama is pushing for renewal of the PATRIOT act it must doing what it was designed to do and Obama likes the results.
windy95 From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 2739 posts, RR: 8
Reply 5, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 1646 times:
Quoting falstaff (Reply 4): Now that Obama is president and is "in the know" he may have realized how important this stuff is. With Obama being a less than one term senator I doubt he really knew a lot of details about things like the PATRIOT act and Gitmo before he got into office. If a lefty like Obama is pushing for renewal of the PATRIOT act it must doing what it was designed to do and Obama likes the results.
Do you not find it odd that Bush was beten over the head with this for years but with Obama the mainstream media is quiet. Double standard or did the media also finally realize it is working? Maybe an apology from them to Bush is in the future?
mbmbos From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2598 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 1595 times:
Quoting falstaff (Reply 4): Now that Obama is president and is "in the know" he may have realized how important this stuff is.
I don't subscribe to this particular flavor of paternalism whether it is a Democrat or a Republican in power. There is no credible reason for me to cede basic civil liberties because I have to trust the big cheese - that the president "knows" something.
There has been untold - and documented - abuses of Patriot Act powers. And there's no good reason for having such a law enacted. Prior to the Patriot Act members of law enforcement were able to run to a judge in the middle of the night and get a warrant signed if need be. There's never been any incident of terrorism having gone forward because law enforcement couldn't get a warrant when the situation demanded it.
And there's no need for government intelligence to be reading my emails, monitoring my phone calls without a very good reason and without me knowing.
We have given over a fundamental right to the government and they've already proven to misuse it.
TWFirst From Vatican City, joined Apr 2000, 6346 posts, RR: 52
Reply 17, posted (3 years 8 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1493 times:
Quoting falstaff (Reply 16): I call it taking the words for what they actualy mean, not bending things around to fit a belief.
I call it invasion of privacy. Here, let me demonstrate...
"Hey there Falstaff. Uncle Sam here. Boy, you sure seem to like guns a lot and you live in the Detroit area. We're concerned you're a terrorist, especially since you work around teens. We know you've recently communicated with several of these people. We're gonna monitor their communications as well...
Aaron Josef Walker
Amanda Goff McGill
Caitlin Wild Kreienkamp
Cher Silvius Hewitt
Chris B. Crews
Cynthia Hardin Heisner
Gina Bianchi Lustig
Jacqueline Quinn Martinez
Joey J Fais
Lisa Riddle Bowen
Melinda Daniels Korzaan
Melissa McHenry Cabauatan
M Richard Frye
Nichole Rennie Hesselgrave
Patty Clem Kious
Stacey Kaleniecki Nordini
Steven J. Kelly
Wade P. Streeter
Westley C. Brooks
No problem, right? Your civil liberties haven't been violated at all.