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Possibility Of US Default?  
User currently offlineeinsteinboricua From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2010, 3048 posts, RR: 8
Posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2377 times:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42643641/ns/business-eye_on_the_economy/

Judging by the looks of this, it seems that the possibility of default grows larger each day. What options does the government have to avoid a default? I would assume a combination of:
1. Cutting spending (no raise in taxes)
2. Cutting spending (let the Bush tax cuts expire)
3. Cut spending and raise taxes

I don't think cutting spending and cutting taxes at the same time solves anything, so I didn't include it in the options (but I would imagine some in Capitol Hill would defend the option).

Should the US declare default, I assume the consequences would be devastating. Would anyone care to speculate on what may happen?


"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
63 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19505 posts, RR: 58
Reply 1, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2376 times:

Quoting einsteinboricua (Thread starter):

I don't think cutting spending and cutting taxes at the same time solves anything,

The GOP does.


User currently onlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39831 posts, RR: 74
Reply 2, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2361 times:

Tax cut or not, the lobbyist need to go to hell!
There are too many laws and lobbyist who's loyalty is not with the United States.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8219 posts, RR: 8
Reply 3, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2339 times:

Quoting einsteinboricua (Thread starter):
Should the US declare default, I assume the consequences would be devastating.

What we are seeing today is the word "negative" used for the first time in our lifetimes regarding the credit worthiness of the US Treasury.

One of the core foundations of our economy has been the Full Faith & Confidence in our national financial obligations.

If the US does default in any area you'll see significant increases in interest rates. Financing for consumers and small businesses will be far harder to get approval for, and larger companies will raise prices and cut staff to cover their interest increases.

Because our economy is still fragile from the Great Recession you'll see a double dip - at best.

Today it seems that some are far more concerned about their own "wealth" and their actions (like refusing to consider tax increases) will, in due course, work to shrink this wealth they prize so much, as well as the financial strength of the country in general.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 2):
Tax cut or not, the lobbyist need to go to hell!

Sadly the situation is pretty simple. The wealthiest companies and individuals in the country can afford to pour in very large amounts of money in order to "protect their interests". The Health Insurance Industry alone can afford to contribute billions to establish and protect their control of Medicare under the current Republican plan. I see the lobbyists being more active if the country's economic situation includes a default.


User currently offlinewardialer From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1183 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2312 times:

The only way that the US can gain its foot back into a positive economy is to bring back all the US jobs that were outsourced to Eastern Europe.

And its not suprising to me that Eastern Europe is well better off than the US.

The Greek debt is just a walk in the park compared to the US's debt crisis. And it will get worse.
The US is fighting two wars: Iraq and Afghanistan....Now, guess how much those two wars costs the US Government and the Tax payers?

Thats another reason why we are in this debt crisis in the first place. And then of course, outsourcing jobs to Easter Europe.....No wonder their much better off economically...

Ohhhh...just one note to add here...Gas prices are sky rocketing. Another recepie for a massive US recession.

[Edited 2011-04-18 10:32:20]

User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6591 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2295 times:

Even without the risk of defaulting (something I can't believe in at the moment), it only makes sense to lower the debt rating when the Fed is printing so much money that inflation will inevitably skyrocket, making bonds at a low interest rate a losing proposition.


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently onlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39831 posts, RR: 74
Reply 6, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2295 times:

Quoting wardialer (Reply 4):

Well said!
It's sad that we're not getting any return on any of these wars!



Bring back the Concorde
User currently onlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8825 posts, RR: 24
Reply 7, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2278 times:

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 3):
The Health Insurance Industry alone can afford to contribute billions to establish and protect their control of Medicare under the current Republican plan.
http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/totals.php?cycle=2010&ind=H

Historically that was true, however the Healthcare industry has spent $157 million in contributions to Democrats over the last 2 election cycles vs $137 to Republicans. Clearly they prefer Obamacare and expect to clean up with it.

The effects of a default would be tremendous, including on other countries. The credit ratings of other countries like Germany, Japan and China which hold a lot of our T-Bills would take a big hit. In fact, the effect on day-to-day living in the US might arguably be less than in the rest of the world.

But the worst effect will be inflation. Already it is heating up. Last Friday they announced that YoY inflation in the US is over 6% (and that doesn't include food and fuel, which we know has risen more than that). At the same time, GDP growth estimates are only between 1 and 2% - Normally a couple of years after a recession we should be growing at 5-7%, but it hasn't happened.

It all can be linked to outrageous public spending. I hope you guys are paying attention to the Inflation and GDP numbers. The last time they were so badly upside down was with Jimmy Carter in charge, and we even invented a word for it - Stagflation. That's where we are headed.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinewardialer From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1183 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2270 times:

The US dollar will collpase. We all know that for sure.

Europe is doing quite well now compared to the US. And thats whats sad about the whole thing,


User currently offlinefalstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 6087 posts, RR: 29
Reply 9, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2251 times:
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Quoting wardialer (Reply 4):
The only way that the US can gain its foot back into a positive economy is to bring back all the US jobs that were outsourced to Eastern Europe.

How many jobs was that? I would rather the massive amount of jobs we outsourced to China and Mexico come back home.



My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Reply 10, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2240 times:

Quoting wardialer (Reply 4):
The Greek debt is just a walk in the park compared to the US's debt crisis. And it will get worse.

How is the U.S. going to repay not only the debt but also the interest on the debt? The debt beast is there getting bigger by the year and devouring us.

 Wow!



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineBaroque From Australia, joined Apr 2006, 15380 posts, RR: 59
Reply 11, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2226 times:

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 3):
What we are seeing today is the word "negative" used for the first time in our lifetimes regarding the credit worthiness of the US Treasury.

Since you mention it:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-13118834
US warned on top credit rating by Standard & Poor's
The US has been warned that the credit rating on its government debt could be cut by Standard & Poor's.

S&P is concerned that Democrats and Republicans will not be able to agree a plan to reduce the growing US deficit.

It has downgraded its outlook from stable to negative, increasing the likelihood that the rating could be cut within the next two years.

The US Treasury responded that S&P had underestimated its ability to tackle the national debt.


Considerable irony if S&P cuts the rating due to indebtedness of the US when a fairish part of the recent debt comes from trying to unscramble the eggs so well messed up by ratings agencies giving high ratings to what turned out to be toxic bank debt.

With the $A nearly at $US1.06 now the market seems less than confident there will be a resolution. Tears before bedtime?

Gets closer and closer to finding what a disaster it is when the banking system goes T U. I did not want to find out about that in 2008 and I still do not now. But it is rapidly getting to be the way it is going to go.

With Greece, Ireland and Portugal the Germans moved in as bailiffs. Let me see if I can guess who would have to move in for the US?!!!


User currently offlineLAXintl From United States of America, joined May 2000, 25056 posts, RR: 46
Reply 12, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 15 hours ago) and read 2226 times:

Quoting wardialer (Reply 4):
The only way that the US can gain its foot back into a positive economy is to bring back all the US jobs that were outsourced to Eastern Europe.
Quoting falstaff (Reply 9):
How many jobs was that? I would rather the massive amount of jobs we outsourced to China and Mexico come back home.

Well then first lets roll back things like the minimum wage, union contracts, taxes, land values, etc..

If the US has become a non-competitive place to do business in some industries on a global stage you can hardly expect business to remain here as others can run circles around us simply for sake of nationalism.

Simply put cost competitiveness is paramount in today's economy where the consumers most often drive pricing power.



From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8219 posts, RR: 8
Reply 13, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2201 times:

Quoting wardialer (Reply 4):
The only way that the US can gain its foot back into a positive economy is to bring back all the US jobs that were outsourced to Eastern Europe.

We need to bring back jobs, period. And not McWages jobs.

That shift in jobs flow is going to require some major changes. And it has long been an argument of mine that a core change is shifting core health care to a profit based tax for employers and an income based tax for individuals.

Take a look at the cost of US products with health care added in. Can US companies be more competitive with US based employees IF they didn't have the burden of basic health insurance? Add on private plans become a small fraction of current costs today.

I'm also a strong believer in tax incentives for real apprentice programs - and I don't mean cooking fries. I was exposed to some of the apprenticeship programs at Qantas when I was working in Australia and this country needs to learn from programs like that.

Quoting wardialer (Reply 4):
Now, guess how much those two wars costs the US Government and the Tax payers?

The Ego War in Iraq was estimated a few years ago to have a 3+ Trillion long term cost. The annual costs of waging the war is only one part. Long term care of the Veterans is expensive. Replacement of capital equipment and supplies isn't cheap.

So 3+ Trillion and counting on Iraq alone. And that war was clearly not necessary.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 7):
Historically that was true, however the Healthcare industry has spent $157 million in contributions to Democrats over the last 2 election cycles vs $137 to Republicans.

And with that $157 Million they avoided a public option. Well worth a Billion Dollars if it had been necessary. Actually when you add in all spending by the industry to avoid a public option it might be close than you think.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 7):
Clearly they prefer Obamacare and expect to clean up with it.

No, they prefer to avoid a public option and they especially prefer to avoid the single payer (tax dollars) to pay for the core care. The queer thing is that insurance companies can make a boatload of money providing supplemental programs, like in Australia and with Medicare Supplements.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 7):
It all can be linked to outrageous public spending

And a failure to tax at a level that pays for that spending. We have the lowest tax rates in generations and those rates have turned out to be a total failure.

Quoting wardialer (Reply 8):
Europe is doing quite well now compared to the US.

The fear is how other countries will do if the Dollar falls dramatically. For example, Airbus, who will have a lot of sales based on the Dollar.

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 10):
How is the U.S. going to repay not only the debt but also the interest on the debt?

Part of our needs is to cut spending, but increasing taxes and fees is an equal, or more important part. LIke it or not, we either get our economic mess cleaned up or all of the "gains" made by cutting taxes will be lost to inflation, the collapse of property and investment assets and the dramatic increase in imported products, like oil.


User currently offlineYellowstone From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 3071 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2172 times:

I'm not sure how "S&P warns that it might, in the future, lower US credit rating from AAA to AA, thus putting us on the same level of risk as Belgium, New Zealand, Spain, and Taiwan" turns into "OMG!!!!11one!!1eleven! The US might default on its debt!"

Oh, right, humans are flighty and panicky little creatures. That's how.



Hydrogen is an odorless, colorless gas which, given enough time, turns into people.
User currently offlinepar13del From Bahamas, joined Dec 2005, 7116 posts, RR: 8
Reply 15, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 2161 times:

Quoting wardialer (Reply 8):
The US dollar will collpase. We all know that for sure.

Where exactly is the US dollar right now, if you check with US tourist travelling to Europe they will tell you that the dollar has already collapsed.

Did anyone ever expect to pay the bill for all the consumer spending which has been used to drive the US economy for the last couple decades, the shift in driving appears to have been all towards the consumer.

The US is spending more than it is collecting, if you raise taxes and give them more money to spend will they then spend less, has there any been politicians who collect money and refuse to spend it, and which party is going to agree to use the revenue from increased taxation to pay off debt, when they can simply raise the ceiling again?

I have been doing more reading on entitlements and discretionary spending as it relates to the US Congress, it seems that this is the major battle ground. One thing, the rest of this session through to the end of the year will be interesting.


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15729 posts, RR: 26
Reply 16, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2127 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 6):
It's sad that we're not getting any return on any of these wars!

That's because all of the nice liberals won't take the oil, but would rather run around building schools.

Quoting falstaff (Reply 9):
I would rather the massive amount of jobs we outsourced to China and Mexico come back home.

How are you going to do that? US workers just can't, or won't, compete. It's just too expensive.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 13):
And a failure to tax at a level that pays for that spending.

Wrong mentality. It is failure to spend at a level taxes can pay for.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlinewindy95 From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 2719 posts, RR: 8
Reply 17, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2114 times:

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 13):
And a failure to tax at a level that pays for that spending. We have the lowest tax rates in generations and those rates have turned out to be a total failure.

No the excessive spending has been a total failure.



OMG-Obama Must Go
User currently offlineEaa3 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 1003 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 2116 times:

Quoting einsteinboricua (Thread starter):
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42643641/ns/business-eye_on_the_economy/

Judging by the looks of this, it seems that the possibility of default grows larger each day. What options does the government have to avoid a default? I would assume a combination of:
1. Cutting spending (no raise in taxes)
2. Cutting spending (let the Bush tax cuts expire)
3. Cut spending and raise taxes

I don't think cutting spending and cutting taxes at the same time solves anything, so I didn't include it in the options (but I would imagine some in Capitol Hill would defend the option).

Should the US declare default, I assume the consequences would be devastating. Would anyone care to speculate on what may happen?

The US will never default in US dollars. This is basically just by definition. The government can't default in it's own currency i.e. not be able to pay dollars to creditors. After all they can print them and have been shown to be perfectly willing to do this. I mean why do people think that the governments financing rate and interest rates are so low today. It's because the US government has been buying government bonds of the market i.e. printing money. It's flooding the market with liquidity.

However I think that this Standard and Poors downgrade of US government debt is not a statement saying that the US government will actually default but rather that in order to lower government debt levels the government will induce inflation and therefore will inflate away a large part of the debt. This is the last resort but Standard and Poors is saying that this is not inconceivable and that if that happens then holding US government debt may not be ideal. Although I don't know what is ideal in that case. Some people say that deflating away debt is a sort of "soft" default.

I think that this is a much bigger problem than just a US government problem. Many governments around the world have an unsustainable debt level and eventually there may be a consensus that inflating away debt is the right course of action. No matter how much the markets and other may dislike it.

Note though that this is just my guess. Also I doubt that a policy of "inflating away debt" would ever be explicit.


User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8219 posts, RR: 8
Reply 19, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2083 times:

Quoting Baroque (Reply 11):
Let me see if I can guess who would have to move in for the US?!!!

If the Republicans & Tea Party have their way: the poor, the sick & the elderly.

The top 10% certainly won't agree to man up and the right wing politicians will do what ever they are told.

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 12):
Well then first lets roll back things like the minimum wage

Having too low a minimum wage is one of the major problems holding us back. As long as the middle class is pushed down then the "upper classes" are putting their US based assets at risk - as well as the economy.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 16):
Wrong mentality.

Nope. This country performed far better when taxes were higher for the top earners (or "lucky sperms") and the middle class was larger and stronger.

The Bush Tax Cuts (as well as other Bush/Cheney decisions) have shown to be a total failure IMO.

Quoting par13del (Reply 15):
I have been doing more reading on entitlements

Some entitlements (like Social Security) has been paid for all of our lives. Others, like Medicare has been funded by most of us all of our lives.

Others, like health care for the poor is such a basic human right - equal to public education for the poor - that it is an embarrassment that people are pushing to see that program deteriorate.


User currently onlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8825 posts, RR: 24
Reply 20, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2066 times:

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 19):
If the Republicans & Tea Party have their way: the poor, the sick & the elderly.

I got it! I knew you reminded me of someone:




Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinewindy95 From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 2719 posts, RR: 8
Reply 21, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 2040 times:

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 19):
Having too low a minimum wage is one of the major problems holding us back

So you agree that illegals are artifilially lowering our wages and prices?

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 19):
If the Republicans & Tea Party have their way: the poor, the sick & the elderly.

The top 10% certainly won't agree to man up and the right wing politicians will do what ever they are told

Have to love Moveon.org talking points. Of course you have nothing to back it up with but you will kep tossing it around.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 19):
The top 10% certainly won't agree to man up and the right wing politicians will do what ever they are told.

Obama and his rich friends from the left can start donating to the fed anytime they want. be a leader and man up and donate to the treasury.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 19):
Some entitlements (like Social Security) has been paid for all of our lives


But if you die six months after you start collecting your family gets nothing..Ponzi scheme. And since congress has already spent what was in the lockbox the Ponzi scheme will come tumbling down.



OMG-Obama Must Go
User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8219 posts, RR: 8
Reply 22, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 2015 times:

Quoting windy95 (Reply 21):
So you agree that illegals are artifilially lowering our wages and prices?

Minimum wage is too low for someone on that level to work ful time and NOT qualify for government assistance - like food stamps.

Unless you are talking about a true apprenticeship program for young people I believe the minimum wage should be above the poverty level. Better think about that if your want to level the income tax brackets.

Quoting windy95 (Reply 21):
Of course you have nothing to back it up with

I don't go to moveon.org - but thanks for the link.  

If you are looking for anything to back up my statement then look no further than the fight the right made to keep the tax cuts for the top tax rate in December. And Ryan's efforts to LOWER that top rate again for the super rich to 25%.

Quoting windy95 (Reply 21):
But if you die six months after you start collecting your family gets nothing..

And if you die, say, 10 years after your START working and leave a family then Social Security will start paying your wife each month. That is the death & disability insurance in Social Security that the Financial Sector won't tell you about as they lobby (and contribute to campaigns) in order to get your SS Dollars.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 20):
I knew you reminded me of someone:

Bit of bad judgement (taste?) on your part there.

I wore the uniform of the U.S. Navy in case you are actually interested.


User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7867 posts, RR: 52
Reply 23, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 2012 times:

Lowering minimum wage is out of the question. In most parts of the county it's simply unlivable. I can see having no minimum wage for high schoolers or guest workers, though I can see how that can cause problems too...


Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineeinsteinboricua From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2010, 3048 posts, RR: 8
Reply 24, posted (3 years 4 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 1957 times:

Quoting Yellowstone (Reply 14):
I'm not sure how "S&P warns that it might, in the future, lower US credit rating from AAA to AA

For starters, S&P has not announced just how many notches it will downgrade US credit. It just said it will cut it from AAA. Unlike those in AA which are still able to meet their debt, the US can and may go down further. I wouldn't be surprised if it went all the way to junk status, though the odds of that happening are still very slim.

Quoting par13del (Reply 15):
Where exactly is the US dollar right now, if you check with US tourist travelling to Europe they will tell you that the dollar has already collapsed.

I would say the dollar is crumbling, but it's still stable. When the euro reaches $2/Euro with daily changes of over 1 cent, be worried.



"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
25 JBirdAV8r : Inflating away debt won't work this time anyway. It worked in the Great Depression and to an extent in the 1970s. Most of our problems come from mass
26 Dreadnought : So did John Walker. The point is that we hear little from you than the dem party line. The facts are that within a generation, if we keep going the w
27 Confuscius : Can the Chinese repossess the Statue of Liberty or San Francisco's Chinatown?
28 einsteinboricua : A joke we tell here is that in order for the US to get rid of its debt is to sell its possessions. We often joke that we will end up as a China posse
29 Post contains links and images Confuscius : Like these? [Edited 2011-04-18 18:23:13]
30 wingman : This whole debate defines the United States and what it has become, a nation of individuals so consumed about their personal agendas that they would s
31 okie : I would ask your source, while I did not ace econ 101, I do remember a correlation. Okie
32 Ken777 : I deliver my own opinions, regardless of what party line is or isn't. First opinion? We have to maintain the Full Faith & Confidence is the US Tr
33 sna752 : How about setting an example and donating 5% more of your income to help the cause? Then you can tell them "see, it's not that painful to get taxed 5
34 Dreadnought : May I remind you that already last year, US Treasury yields went higher than those on a number of blue-chip corporate bonds, such as Berkshire Hathaw
35 Superfly : School in Iraq and Afghanistan that end up being destroyed once finished only to rebuild again. It's crazy! I wish China would take over ALL of San F
36 sna752 : Minimum wage causes a price floor that is above the equilibrium wage. Essentially, there are people willing to work for less than the minimum wage, y
37 Confuscius : Yeah but the MUNI passengers will be cutting in line and the bus drivers will ignore all traffic rules!
38 Post contains links and images Superfly : That happens already. I assume you're being sarcastic. The current economic crisis has nothing to do with minimum wage. Going after minimum wage is l
39 wardialer : All I have to say, saldy enough, is that Europe esp. the Eastern European regions, are doing quite great compared to the US. They have no debt crisis
40 einsteinboricua : Unfortunately, people on this side of the pond have come fear that since that is termed socialism. I never realized that the government helping peopl
41 BMI727 : Why? They are doing their jobs.
42 RayChuang : If we're going to fix the US economy and avoid a possible default, we need to do the following: 1. Aggressively audit every Federal, state and local g
43 DocLightning : And if we do what you want, we will live in a polluted, overpopulated hellhole with people literally dying and rotting on the streets from treatable
44 sna752 : Well, for starters, when the column name is "get political," I think that there is almost certainly going to be a ton of bias and it's quite difficul
45 stasisLAX : One critical point - the U.S. dollar is currently the recognized "reserve currency" of the world's commerce. Thus the term "petro dollars" where oil i
46 DocLightning : And this is likely to lead to the most stable, long-term recovery, rather than having another boom. All booms end in bust.
47 Ralphski : I know what the problem is...the rent is too damn high!
48 Post contains links and images TheCommodore : Maybe not for much longer.... perhaps ? You make some good points, however the Chinese have to take some BIG steps before that can happen and I'm not
49 StarAC17 : I'll add a few more. - Get out of both Iraq and Afghanistan asap and bring home at least some troops from countries like Germany, South Korea, and Ja
50 wingman : You guys insist on only cutting spending, You're simply part of the problem, not the solution. Stop being extreme radicals spouting party line rhetori
51 Flighty : The US would not default because it can "monetize" the debt (create money). The debt can go to 400 trillion and still not default. The problem is, our
52 Post contains images caliatenza : sadly you are right about much of India . Damn that TB!
53 Baroque : I have to sort of disagree, in that you don't actually need a downgrade, just the possibility of one is enough to start the hares running. Example, S
54 Flighty : Don't you love how we claim to care about the developing world... then we debase their farmers and take away their livelihood so our "farmers" can "m
55 Post contains links and images Confuscius : Who? me? Never in my 2,500 years of existence. That would be great for the black residents because they totally love Bruce Lee! While most cultures a
56 Derico : I could speculate about what would happen but I don't have the time. However this thread prompted me to check currency rates and I was completely asto
57 sna752 : Don't forget that some are pegged to the dollar, so they tend stay in an acceptable window. The Federal Reserve is also trying to avoid deflation -wh
58 Post contains links zhiao : Euro and Pound are well below their highs. Doesn't mean the dollar has fallen as a reserve currency. And yes, it has happened before: http://news.gol
59 Post contains links Superfly : You do have a point. The love for Bruce Lee is evident in this short clip. Bruce Lee comes in at 1:49. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3J2r3vjf4Ks
60 Derico : None of those are pegged to the Dollar, they are free floating. I know some currencies like the Hong Kong Dollar and I think some middle eastern curr
61 Post contains images Baroque : It certainly is for the Little Aussie battler since the early 80s. As there was not a Euro then, your statement has a pretty good chance of being cor
62 sna752 : Hence "some are pegged" rather than "some of those are pegged." Currencies pegged formally include: Florin Bahamian Dollar Bahraini dinar Barbadian d
63 Flighty : Informally, Japan, South Korea both depress their currency. Taiwan may as well, but that is more volatile. China is essentially a peg. Its movement da
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