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Media Hypocrisy On Fuel Prices  
User currently offlinefr8mech From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 5658 posts, RR: 15
Posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2021 times:

A video from a friend on Facebook:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=qKdScVerrBU

I've never heard of Don Smith, and quite simply, I'll probably never see another thing from him, but he does raise an interesting point. Why isn't the media attacking Obama? In fact, they seem to be rationalizing that high gas prices are good for the country.

Of course, some of this stuff is more than likely taken out of context, but really, have you heard and/or seen the mainstream attack this administration over the price of gas at the same level that the media attack the Bush Administration?

Oh, by the way...if these prices are supposed to be good for the country, do we still need to keep our tires inflated to the proper pressure?

Feel free to bash away.

Oh, by the way $4.15 a gallon here. Up $0.37 in a day. (that happened yesterday)


When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
64 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinegatorfan From United States of America, joined Oct 2009, 331 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2013 times:

I think we should still blame Dick Cheney, Halliburton and the vast right wing conspiracy.  

User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8965 posts, RR: 24
Reply 2, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2005 times:

Quoting fr8mech (Thread starter):
I've never heard of Don Smith, and quite simply, I'll probably never see another thing from him, but he does raise an interesting point. Why isn't the media attacking Obama? In fact, they seem to be rationalizing that high gas prices are good for the country.

It is pretty hilarious - The conspiracy theorists (in this case the entire mains tream media) made all these claims about Bush/Cheney intentionally driving up oil prices after Katrina and other supply disturbances. But with Obama, who clearly said during his campaign he wanted to make the price of oil "necessarily skyrocket", they are all silent.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8977 posts, RR: 39
Reply 3, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 1979 times:

They didn't really care about higher gas prices back then anyway. It furthers their agenda in other ways.

The rhetoric today and back then is about pandering to populism.

[Edited 2011-05-11 13:43:01]


"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineCargolex From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1278 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1966 times:

Quote:
But with Obama, who clearly said during his campaign he wanted to make the price of oil "necessarily skyrocket"

Source?

Quote:
Why isn't the media attacking Obama?

Perhaps because there's not much he can do to change the price of gas. Similarly, I don't recall a media pile-on of President Bush when gas prices shot up in 2008. There wasn't much he could've done either.

But I'd like to hear what you think Obama could do to lower the price of gas?

[Edited 2011-05-11 13:51:38]

User currently offlinecanoecarrier From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2843 posts, RR: 12
Reply 5, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1939 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
But with Obama, who clearly said during his campaign he wanted to make the price of oil "necessarily skyrocket", they are all silent.

He said that in '09 in regard to Cap and Trade and the effect on electricity costs to consumers. But, no less damaging nonetheless.

Quoting fr8mech (Thread starter):
Oh, by the way...if these prices are supposed to be good for the country, do we still need to keep our tires inflated to the proper pressure?

Our country is far different then European countries when it comes to the effect of fuel prices on consumer goods. Food travels a long distance to get to market here so it's more influenced by fluctuations in fuel costs. Beef I buy here in Seattle may come from Texas, oranges from Florida, rice from Arkansas. Most transported by truck.

I'm less affected by gas prices since I use mass transit and the wife works close to where we live, but the typical American family is much more affected than I am.



The beatings will continue until morale improves
User currently offlinerfields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7607 posts, RR: 32
Reply 6, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1923 times:

Quoting Cargolex (Reply 4):
Similarly, I don't recall a media pile-on of President Bush when gas prices shot up in 2008. There wasn't much he could've done either.

There was a bit on President Bush, but not much. Most was focused on VP Cheyney and and some other Bush appointees who came from the oil industry.

President Bush had long been perceived by both the Democrats and the Republicans as a 'friend' of the oil industry. Perhaps because he said so on several occasions.

But the key part is this:

Quoting Cargolex (Reply 4):
because there's not much he can do to change the price of gas.

The media is learning slowly that the President does not have a magic wand he can wave and 'fix' economic problems. They are also learning that oil prices are not controlled by the oil companies, but by the speculators and traders. Everything from individual large investors to pension funds want the price to be high so they can make profits or make payments to the old folks.

Another point is that fuel prices have to be high to make exploration and production of additional US oil reserves feasible. We don't have billions of barrels of untapped oil at cheap prices. We do have billions of barrels of untapped reserves which will take about $80 to $100 per barrel prices, or $4 gallon gas at the pump, to make viable.

And no I don't have any oil company stock, and really hate paying $90 to fill up my truck so I can earn a little money.


User currently offlinegatorfan From United States of America, joined Oct 2009, 331 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1917 times:

Quoting Cargolex (Reply 4):
Source?

Let me try. Obama's Secretary of Energy (Steven Chu) has said:

"Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe."

December 12, 2008 WSJ (I'd post a link but it's subscription only).


User currently offlineseb146 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 11806 posts, RR: 15
Reply 8, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1897 times:

Quoting canoecarrier (Reply 5):
He said that in '09 in regard to Cap and Trade and the effect on electricity costs to consumers. But, no less damaging nonetheless.

But, that is not about the price of gas, is it?

Quoting gatorfan (Reply 7):
Let me try. Obama's Secretary of Energy (Steven Chu) has said:

"Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe."

December 12, 2008 WSJ (I'd post a link but it's subscription only).

So, the Secretary of Energy said something so that translates to:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
But with Obama, who clearly said during his campaign he wanted to make the price of oil "necessarily skyrocket",

Uhhhh.. huh? Explain, please.

The previous administration had a lot of oil and energy people working in it. So, it would be in their best interests to raise the price of such things as gasoline and electricity.

Besides, all I hear in the media is how high the price of gas is and how it directly effects us. Just like before. However, unlike before, there is not a back drop of energy people running the administraion. That is probably why the difference.



Life in the wall is a drag.
User currently offlineCargolex From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 1278 posts, RR: 8
Reply 9, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1875 times:

Quote:
there is not a back drop of energy people running the administraion.

Another good point. In the Bush Administration, many former Oil industry people were in very high places, including both the President and Vice President. Personally, I don't think they could've done much to change the course of gas prices in 2008, just like I don't think President Obama can do that much right now. But in their case, they were people who at least, on paper, knew a great deal about the oil industry and how it works.

If a car mechanic's car breaks down, it's more attention grabbing than if a carpenter's car breaks down. But neither of them have control over what part might break at some point in the future.

There was a good thread on here a couple of weeks ago that mysteriously disappeared about energy prices and commodities, too bad that one has been deleted.


User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8774 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1874 times:

What is wrong with paying whatever oil actually costs? If you don't like buying gas, don't buy it. It is hypocrisy to complain about gas prices.

User currently offlineajd1992 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 1838 times:

Quoting fr8mech (Thread starter):

Oh, by the way $4.15 a gallon here. Up $0.37 in a day. (that happened yesterday)

Try $11 a Gallon here. Even with the UK/US Gal problem, it's still over $10 a gallon. Americans honestly don't know how cheap they have fuel.


User currently offlinefr8mech From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 5658 posts, RR: 15
Reply 12, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 1832 times:

Quoting Cargolex (Reply 4):
President Bush when gas prices shot up in 2008. There wasn't much he could've done either.

Links to links to links. The media and the Left (one in the same) repeatedly attacked Bush for gas prices.
http://www.mrc.org/bmi/articles/2011...Prices__Times_More_Than_Obama.html
http://www.democrats.com/gas
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2011/...gas-prices-bush-didnt-catch-break/
http://giv.to/y7vJwE

Quoting Cargolex (Reply 4):
But I'd like to hear what you think Obama could do to lower the price of gas?

Actually, he could do very little to affect prices in the short term. With policy changes and by urging Congress to enact (or repeal) legislation to allow drilling, he can easily affect long term prices. That's not the point. The point is that Bush, Cheney and gang were to blame in 2008 & 2009. In 2011, it's a good thing that prices have gone up, according to the hacks in the media.

Quoting Flighty (Reply 10):
What is wrong with paying whatever oil actually costs? If you don't like buying gas, don't buy it. It is hypocrisy to complain about gas prices.

That's fine and dandy when the price of oil and gas is the market price, but these prices are shaped by politically and partisan discourse.

Quoting ajd1992 (Reply 11):
Try $11 a Gallon here. Even with the UK/US Gal problem, it's still over $10 a gallon. Americans honestly don't know how cheap they have fuel.

Ask yourself how much of that price is governmental (tax) interference and how much is the actual cost of the fuel.

This discussion is not supposed to be about the price of oil, it's supposed to be about the manipulation and disingenuous machinations of the media when it comes to increasing gas prices and the cause of the increases:

2009: Bush and Cheney
2011: Don't know, but its not Obama.

And for Christ's sake...someone add Obama to the spell-check.

[Edited 2011-05-11 16:19:28]

[Edited 2011-05-11 16:20:06]


When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
User currently offlinePHLBOS From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 7558 posts, RR: 23
Reply 13, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 1719 times:

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 12):
The point is that Bush, Cheney and gang were to blame in 2008 & 2009.

I think you meant 2007 & 2008. When Bush left office, the price was hovering around $2/gallon (in some places, it was still below that).

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 12):
2009: Bush and Cheney

Correction, 2008.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 12):
With policy changes and by urging Congress to enact (or repeal) legislation to allow drilling, he can easily affect long term prices.

IIRC, gas (& oil prices) in 2008 dropped shortly after President Bush finally allowed more domestic drilling (off-shore and ANWR). Yes, the economic recession played a major role as well but the timing of the drilling initiative and the price dropping CAN NOT be ignored.

Within his first month of coming into office, President Obama (along with his Interior Secretary Kenneth Salazar) basically voided that initiative and the prices, as a whole, have been going up since.

Does allowing more drilling increase supplies here and now? No, but it does influence long-term futures; something that market speculators look fairly close at.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 12):
The media and the Left (one in the same) repeatedly attacked Bush for gas prices.

  

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 12):
it's a good thing that prices have gone up, according to the hacks in the media.

   That's because it (in their twisted view) fuels (though artificially) the need for Green Initiatives and so forth.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 12):
these prices are shaped by politically and partisan discourse.

  

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 12):
This discussion is not supposed to be about the price of oil, it's supposed to be about the manipulation and disingenuous machinations of the media when it comes to increasing gas prices and the cause of the increases:

I agree, but unfortunately it's all inter-connected.

The bottom line here is; you're right, the media (as a whole) has tried its best to ignore the whole gas price spike because it makes their endorsed President look bad. They didn't start chiming or even talking about it until the consumer complaints basically got too loud for them to ignore and the economy was starting to show signs of it taking a hit as a result of increased inflation beyond just gas prices.

One has to wonder whether Obama and company will institute an October Surprise next year and have the prices drop significantly until his 2nd inauguration if re-elected? If that were to happen, the media would go absolutely Ga-Ga over it.



"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
User currently offlinegatorfan From United States of America, joined Oct 2009, 331 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 1710 times:

Quoting seb146 (Reply 8):
Uhhhh.. huh? Explain, please.

Let's see. According to our UK friends here, petrol is the equivalent of $11/gallon. At the time the man the President nominated to be SecEnergy made his statement, oil was ~$2.80/gallon.

Quoting ajd1992 (Reply 11):
Try $11 a Gallon here. Even with the UK/US Gal problem, it's still over $10 a gallon. Americans honestly don't know how cheap they have fuel.

So Seb146, if you don't think that advocating a 4 fold increase in the price of gas at the pump is the equivalent of making fuel skyrocket, then what is? Obviously the President endorses the SecEnergy's thoughts as he nominated him AFTER the made these comments which were widely reported and said right before the nomination.


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21876 posts, RR: 55
Reply 15, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 1704 times:

Quoting fr8mech (Thread starter):
In fact, they seem to be rationalizing that high gas prices are good for the country.

Not exactly good for the country, but there is the silver lining that nothing spurs new energy technology development like high gas prices. I doubt you'd be seeing the move toward fuel economy in the auto industry, particularly among US manufacturers, that you're seeing now had the big spike in 2008 not happened.

Since people don't appear to want the government to spend money to invest in such development, it's not a bad thing for the market to do it.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineseb146 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 11806 posts, RR: 15
Reply 16, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 1695 times:

Quoting gatorfan (Reply 14):
So Seb146, if you don't think that advocating a 4 fold increase in the price of gas at the pump is the equivalent of making fuel skyrocket, then what is? Obviously the President endorses the SecEnergy's thoughts as he nominated him AFTER the made these comments which were widely reported and said right before the nomination.

I still don't see the connection. Energy Secretary makes a statement. 2 1/2 years later, the price shoots up. Please connect the dots for me. I do not see the connection. I really don't see the connection between "the price of fuel is X Dollars per gallon in the USA but Y Euros per liter in England." England had a different tax system than the United States, IIRC. So, help me out. What do apples and dolphins have in common?



Life in the wall is a drag.
User currently offlineajd1992 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 1684 times:

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 12):
Ask yourself how much of that price is governmental (tax) interference and how much is the actual cost of the fuel.

From a quick google search (I will add, I might be totally wrong on this - I don't drive a car, so I have no knowledge of actual real life costs of fuel, only what it says on the pump)

Unleaded (which I assume would be what you call "Gas" and all the derivatives of that, such as premium and the like) the tax is 60%.

Diesel & LPG (Liquid Petroleum Gas) is taxed at 58%.

I think it works out at the moment we pay just under 60p per LITRE (which is just a tad under a dollar), obviously in a gallon there are 4.5 litres so that's nearly $4 a gallon just in tax. Even if that was for a US gallon, it'd be over $3.50 in tax.

Honestly - if you think fuel in the US is expensive, try living here. It's insane the amount we pay for fuel. I remember in Florida in 2001 when it was something like $1.50 for a gallon of fuel....


User currently offlinedfwrevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 1001 posts, RR: 51
Reply 18, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 1676 times:

Quoting ajd1992 (Reply 17):
Honestly - if you think fuel in the US is expensive, try living here. It's insane the amount we pay for fuel. I remember in Florida in 2001 when it was something like $1.50 for a gallon of fuel....

And honestly, what it cost in the UK is irrelevant. Americans have their cost of living baselined against a different price.

Quoting seb146 (Reply 16):
I still don't see the connection. Energy Secretary makes a statement. 2 1/2 years later, the price shoots up. Please connect the dots for me. I do not see the connection.

I won't speak on behalf of gatorfan, but given that the Obama administration along with nearly the entire Democratic party called for legislation that would knowingly increase the cost of energy by several multiples, it's hard to believe they are now sympathetic to the price increases driven by market conditions.

And yet, we will soon be treated to a repeat of the political theater whereby Democrats subpoena oil executives to Congress so that they can be grilled on their business practices.

Quoting PHLBOS (Reply 13):
Does allowing more drilling increase supplies here and now? No, but it does influence long-term futures; something that market speculators look fairly close at.

It is an unending source of frustration how Democrats block expanded drilling by crying that it won't affect market prices for, say, 3-5 years. Yes. And? We just keep ending up 3-5 years down the road in the same position as before. Do they not want more affordable energy and American jobs?

The state of drilling permits in the GOM is approaching downright fraud. We are nowhere close to pre-Macondo permitting rates. I'm not talking about expanded drilling, just maintaining the baseline production rate. This is going to have a substantial effect on supplies coming online from 2013 and beyond. The time can't be made up. We will have no other choice than to increase imports, likely from Brazil. If you take Obama at his gaffs, he would rather become Brazil's "number one customer" than drill ourselves.


User currently offlinerfields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7607 posts, RR: 32
Reply 19, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 1639 times:

Quoting PHLBOS (Reply 13):
IIRC, gas (& oil prices) in 2008 dropped shortly after President Bush finally allowed more domestic drilling (off-shore and ANWR). Yes, the economic recession played a major role as well but the timing of the drilling initiative and the price dropping CAN NOT be ignored.

The timing of the drilling initiative and the price drop are NOT RELATED.

At the time, oil futures were bid up to the point that speculators were stretched to the maximum trying to cover all their manipulative plans. Prices dropped because the speculators had to find cash to cover their bids.

While speculators will bid the price at $100 per barrel or higher for million barrel lots, the refineries will not pay those prices. Even today speculators are find trouble selling the oil they 'purchased' at high prices. Refineries are taking only the minimum amount they need to meet demand. The last I saw on Fox News is that US refineries are working below 87% capacity at this time. (About 2 weeks ago.)

The only good thing about the current prices is the speculator capacity is close to reaching the breaking point again.


User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8774 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 1635 times:

Quoting dfwrevolution (Reply 18):
Do they not want more affordable energy and American jobs

American oil production (which is small) has very little to do with "affordable energy." Oil prices have much more to do with China, India, and the US Dollar.

China wants oil, therefore it is expensive. There is no way we can have $2 gas prices unless we totally over-build the Dollar. That's the last thing we want to do.

The price of oil has gone up for good reasons and it's fine. I hope it goes to $7.50.


User currently offlinePHLBOS From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 7558 posts, RR: 23
Reply 21, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 1613 times:

Quoting Flighty (Reply 20):
I hope it goes to $7.50.

Assuming your age-range listed in your profile is true and current; you're obviously too young to remember the double-digit inflation we had during much of the 1970s (particularly 1973-1974 and 1979-1980), the vast majority of it was the result of skyrocketing fuel costs. While I wasn't old enough to drive back then, I was old enough to remember the cost of EVERYTHING going up.

Higher fuel costs translates into higher shipping and delivery costs of goods and services; which, in turn, translates into higher prices for just about EVERYTHING across the board!

Let's not forget, especially since this is an aviation web-site, that the last time fuel prices went this high; several airlines either shut down or got absorbed in mergers and many people LOST their jobs as a result of such.

So if you want to support something that WILL ultimately increase inflation and cause more people to lose jobs; be my guest.



"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
User currently offlinePPVRA From Brazil, joined Nov 2004, 8977 posts, RR: 39
Reply 22, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 1608 times:

Quoting dfwrevolution (Reply 18):
The state of drilling permits in the GOM is approaching downright fraud.

Not related to oil drilling, but I was talking to a metallurgist at the end of last year trying to get permits to open a new mine somewhere out west. He said they were on the "fourth year of a three year process"!

This type of shenanigan costs millions of dollars and destroy new investments and job creation. And this game is being played at a time of very high unemployment. Height of irresponsibility.



"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8965 posts, RR: 24
Reply 23, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 1599 times:

Quoting seb146 (Reply 8):

The previous administration had a lot of oil and energy people working in it. So, it would be in their best interests to raise the price of such things as gasoline and electricity.

That's a kindergarten-level understanding of business and economics talking.

Quoting seb146 (Reply 8):

Besides, all I hear in the media is how high the price of gas is and how it directly effects us. Just like before. However, unlike before, there is not a back drop of energy people running the administraion. That is probably why the difference.

But the core problem is the fact that 99% of the recoverable oil in the US is off-limits to extraction, due to government regulation, and it's gotten worse since Obama arrived (not that it was that much better before).

We huge reserves offshore - and apart from very limited GOM fields it's all off-limits. We have over 2 trillion barrels in oil sands and shale - enough for more than 300 years - it's all off limits. Think of all the jobs that could be created, and think of the hundreds of billions of dollars that would stay in this country rather than to fund Saudi mile-high skyscrapers, gold-plated Bentleys and donations to Wahabi and other Islamist nutcases.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinecanoecarrier From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2843 posts, RR: 12
Reply 24, posted (3 years 7 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 1596 times:

Quoting seb146 (Reply 8):
But, that is not about the price of gas, is it?

I was just pointing out that the quote was incorrectly attributed to gas prices.

Quoting Mir (Reply 15):
Not exactly good for the country, but there is the silver lining that nothing spurs new energy technology development like high gas prices.

What? Like the auto industry's all over the place approach to alternative fuel vehicles? There's hydrogen cell cars, electric cars, biofuel cars, hybrid cars. Personally, I'd like them to just pick one or two technologies and develop them. And, electric cars don't do anything to reduce our reliance on energy as a whole, plus there's diminishing returns because you have to get rid of batteries.

Quoting Mir (Reply 15):
I doubt you'd be seeing the move toward fuel economy in the auto industry, particularly among US manufacturers, that you're seeing now had the big spike in 2008 not happened.

Fuel efficiency has been mandated under the Corporate Average Fuel Economy (CAFE) regulations since 1978. Remember that in '07 GWB signed the Energy Independence and Security Act that set a goal of national fuel economy standard of 35 mpg by 2020. The price spike in '08 had nothing to do with technological advances in fuel economy.

Quoting fr8mech (Thread starter):
Oh, by the way...if these prices are supposed to be good for the country, do we still need to keep our tires inflated to the proper pressure?

Personally I think fuel economy is good for our country, increased fuel prices are not. We should start by re-evaluating US emission regulations so we can start having European diesel engines in our cars.



The beatings will continue until morale improves
25 Post contains images PHLBOS : IIRC, President Obama in his first year in office ammended the above to have the CAFE standard of 35 mpg set by 2016. You are right in stating that t
26 fr8mech : I hope you're ready to pay more for evrything that you buy. Everything. Businesses will pass the increased cost of production and transportation on t
27 canoecarrier : CAFE Standards have risen dramatically and at lower rates even when the Democratic Party wasn't in control of both the House and Senate. Although, ty
28 Post contains links fr8mech : Today HR1229 passed, which appears (I say appears, because we have all learned that nothing Congress puts out can be taken at face value) to clean up
29 Post contains links PHLBOS : Incorrect, the CAFE standard for cars was held steady at 27.5 mpg from 1990 through 2010 with only slight increases for trucks (from 20 mpg to 23.5 m
30 AGM100 : Their is know way the main stream is going to attack the green mystic over oil prices ... no way. Obama and the left want oil prices to go up ... the
31 Post contains images PHLBOS : Minor homonym and compound word corrections to the above: There is no way the mainstream is going to attack the green mystic over oil prices. That sa
32 dfwrevolution : The United States is the 3rd largest oil producing nation in the world, champ. We are not that far behind Russia and Saudi (#1 and #2) and twice as l
33 canoecarrier : Look at the numbers from the '80s then the statement I made is right. In the early 80's passenger car efficiency requirements went up and that was a
34 Post contains images ajd1992 : I was making a statement - I know you can't directly compare the 2, but the difference is pathetic. The living costs in the US are lower, I grant you
35 Flighty : You are right that the 1970s inflation was nasty of course and I wasn't old enough then to care. But high oil prices are a sign of world prosperity.
36 fr8mech : Wow, those are some of the most naive statements I've ever read. My God man, don't you realize that higher fuel prices impact the poor more than anyo
37 zweiBierebitte : Not so much different. I live in Paris and at the grocery store yesterday I bought garlic and apples from Argentina, green beans from Kenya and banan
38 fr8mech : I'll cautiously say that I don't have a problem with that, so long as the price increase is through natural market forces and not through government
39 zweiBierebitte : IMO the aspect of rising oil prices that hurts the U.S is the volatility of prices. One year gas is $150 a barrel, 2 years later it's $70. We saw thi
40 canoecarrier : Well that's more a factor of the Big 3 being drunk on the profit margin they got selling a SUV over an economy car. That's market corrected to some e
41 fr8mech : Neither is acceptable. Price controls do not work. A minimum price, that may well be set below the market rate will force suppliers to flee the marke
42 dfwrevolution : They are a sign that we are artificially constraining the feedback mechanism of the free market, which is to add supply. Insufficient supply hampers
43 Post contains links Flighty : I think it is glib to call the world's wealthiest people "economically destroyed" or "poor" or whatever. If people are saying we are doomed unless we
44 PHLBOS : With all due respect, did you even read or even skim through ANY of the link I posted earlier prior to writing your post? Granted, it's from Wiki; bu
45 gatorfan : The Secretary of Energy says that he wishes US gas prices would quadruple. And the price heads up. As Obama himself has said, it take a while to turn
46 Post contains images PHLBOS : Thanks for the info. and correction/clarification. My bad. Although personally, any initiative to reduce/repeal CAFE would likely be attached to a mu
47 dfwrevolution : You should step back and do some significant "re-thinking" because you are consistently wrong about matters of fact and the conclusions you draw from
48 seb146 : The problem with that line of thinking is: OPEC and speculators set prices, not us. Remember this: When there is nothing going on in the world, oil p
49 AGM100 : SEB .. I would love to see us off oil !!! . But a replacement for oil on the scale to run our economy like it is today is literally 50+ year away. Ou
50 Dreadnought : They also pay the highest agregate rate of taxes of any industry - 40% of operating profits on average, far higher than usual. People like to point a
51 Post contains links canoecarrier : I don’t need to read the Wikipedia entry for CAFÉ standards. I’m not trying to argue which party is responsible for enacting CAFÉ standards. Pe
52 PPVRA : Politically speaking, figuring out a substitute for oil (say, electricity or even algae fuels) would be a major benefit for small government types. T
53 FlyPNS1 : Except you ignore the millions who will LOSE their jobs due to all this drilling. To drill at the level you want, means massive amounts of pollution
54 Post contains links PPVRA : Spills like the BP spill are not common. The Gulf coast has always had lots and lots of tourism AND oil drilling. And btw, decommissioning of drillin
55 FlyPNS1 : If we aggressively expand drilling, those types of spills will become common. Even if they only happen once a decade, it would eventually destroy the
56 Post contains images PHLBOS : And I completely agree with you on that. Democrats would be the ones predominatly in opposition to such for 2 reasons: 1. Many are still brainwashed
57 Post contains images AGM100 : For me the answer is pretty simple at this point. Either the conspiracy theorists who say the oil companies or the government suppresses innovation t
58 Post contains links fr8mech : The more reason to expand drilling in the US and elsewhere. First to increase the supply and to diversify the source of the oil. Second, to mitigate
59 Flighty : LOL, so what exactly is your estimate of US oil reserves? Apparently the usual sources are wrong. Please contribute the right figure, or your estimat
60 fr8mech : The US does not set the world price of oil, and yes, there are consumers that are increasing their consumption almost exponenetially. The US can infl
61 bestwestern : As long as they dont bring the banking system with them.
62 seb146 : But, as I stated before, take away the welfare for big oil and there will still be profit. They are reporting profits AFTER everyone is paid and AFTE
63 sccutler : Welfare for big oil?
64 Dreadnought : Alarmist BS. We aren't talking about hundred year-old strip mining technology. But still 100% of the money would stay right here, and you won't have
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