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Young American Grads Forced To Juggle Jobs  
User currently offlineAaron747 From Japan, joined Aug 2003, 8035 posts, RR: 26
Posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2033 times:

Something I've been hearing a lot about recently, encapsulated by this NY Times article over the weekend:

"Young college graduates working multiple jobs is a natural consequence of a bad labor market and having, on average, $20,000 worth of student loans to pay off," said Carl E. Van Horn, director of the John J. Heldrich Center for Workforce Development at Rutgers.

Or maybe it's a consequence of having worthless degrees like Latin American studies or journalism. Universities seem to be setting unrealistic expectations for students by offering all kinds of crap that will lead to purported jobs in the future.

An entry-level salary often doesn't go very far these days. According to a study by the Heldrich Center, the median starting salary for those who graduated from four-year degree programs in 2009 and 2010 was $27,000, down from $30,000 for those who graduated in 2006 to 2008, before the recession. (Try living on $27,000 a year - before taxes - in a city like New York, Washington or Chicago.)

Maybe these folks shouldn't be living in places like that? I wonder if that has occurred to anyone. To solve the problem of poor employment prospects, young people need to be prepared to move, period. A friend of my brother's recently returned from four years in the Peace Corps in Mozambique and comes from a good family with excellent connections in the SF Bay Area. Though some of these connections helped him get interviews, his degree was in English and he had no job offers after more than 100 job interviews. He expanded his search nationwide and wound up taking a decent job in DC. Recent grads who want to stay put are in for a rude awakening.

So a couple problems here - shouldn't universities be offering only degree programs that will actually lead to real jobs? And shouldn't young people be taught by someone that hobbies like website creation are only going to lead to money if the work they do provide something that is in real need? The reason the woman in the article can get extra income from babysitting is that its a service actually in need.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...i?f=/c/a/2011/07/02/BU091K2MTO.DTL


If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
66 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinetz757300 From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 2867 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2025 times:

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
shouldn't universities be offering only degree programs that will actually lead to real jobs?

No, not at all. There will always be a market for every major, more so a market for people who generally got a higher education. Example, you mentioned journalism. Do you not think there isn't a "real job" for people who get those types of degrees? What about people you hear doing the local/national news or a newspaper? No journalism = no news.

I do realize that certain majors will have a much smaller job market, such as aforementioned Latin American studies, but if it makes someone happy by learning about what they love to learn about and trying to work with it, why blame them and why blame the institution by offering a major that people want to learn more about?

By the way, what is your definition of a real job?



LETS GO MOUNTAINEERS!
User currently offlineweebie From Australia, joined Dec 2009, 202 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2019 times:

The US economy is a sh*tbox that is the real problem here. As for Americans they are not sophisticated enough to become expats overseas hence why very few move abroad. It doesn't matter what degree you do having a degree is all about showing that you can committ and complete something and at the very least have reasonable intelligence.

America will go the way in which degree professionals will be even with skilled professionals....perhaps American kids should take up a trade? It's not the universities fault that so many people want to go to school (whether it's worth it or not) they need to find suitable places for the demand (isn't that how America's capitalism system works?)


User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 9805 posts, RR: 26
Reply 3, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2005 times:
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Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
Or maybe it's a consequence of having worthless degrees like Latin American studies or journalism.

There is nothing worthless about those degrees.

What IS worthless is the expectation of earning $100,000/year after graduating with a degree in, say, Music Industry.

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
So a couple problems here - shouldn't universities be offering only degree programs that will actually lead to real jobs?

Absolutely not, and I'm honestly a bit amazed you asked that question.

It's not universities' responsibility to determine what a student should major in, nor is it their responsibility to ensure said student gets a good-paying job straight out of college.

If you want to do something badly enough, you'll find a way.

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
And shouldn't young people be taught by someone that hobbies like website creation are only going to lead to money if the work they do provide something that is in real need?

Far as I know, that's exactly what "hobby" is. Something you enjoy doing that doesn't necessarily make you money - or rather that you don't do specifically for money.

Most of what you asked about would fall under parents' and students' responsibilities, not universities'.



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 4, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 1993 times:

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
So a couple problems here - shouldn't universities be offering only degree programs that will actually lead to real jobs?

No for the simple reason that universities get paid good money to give out those worthless degrees.

Quoting tz757300 (Reply 1):
but if it makes someone happy by learning about what they love to learn about and trying to work with it, why blame them and why blame the institution by offering a major that people want to learn more about?

Because they are throwing away an awful lot of money so they can work at Macy's alongside college dropouts. It's a dumb thing to do from a financial standpoint, so I don't especially sympathize with people who will pay that much and go into that much debt for what is, in essence, a hobby.

Quoting weebie (Reply 2):
(isn't that how America's capitalism system works?)

Precisely. If you are among many people with a skill that is not in demand this is what happens. And they put themselves in that position.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineAaron747 From Japan, joined Aug 2003, 8035 posts, RR: 26
Reply 5, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 1989 times:

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 3):
Something you enjoy doing that doesn't necessarily make you money - or rather that you don't do specifically for money.

Trouble is at least three of the four gigs mentioned in the article for the first example are at best hobbies. Stringing together an income as such doesn't seem to be a very bright move.

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 3):

Absolutely not, and I'm honestly a bit amazed you asked that question.

It's a relevant question in times like these, especially where my home state is cutting university budgets to the tune of billions of dollars per annum and trying to determine what is worth saving.

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 3):
What IS worthless is the expectation of earning $100,000/year after graduating with a degree in, say, Music Industry.

Nobody is going to earn money like that off the bat in anything unless they have exceptional skills, qualifications, connections or likely a combination of all three.

Quoting tz757300 (Reply 1):

By the way, what is your definition of a real job?

A job that pays enough to cover expenses, pay down student debt, and save.

Quoting weebie (Reply 2):
As for Americans they are not sophisticated enough to become expats overseas hence why very few move abroad.

Wow, ouch. I would tend to agree that very few move abroad however. The only Americans I know locally in Japan are either academics who came for like jobs here, or people with specialized skills who work for Japanese corporations and have been transferred for further OJT. The remainder are simply here because of Japanese spouses. The majority of expats here by choice are from the UK, Canada, and Australia. It's also easier for them to get visas.

Quoting tz757300 (Reply 1):
I do realize that certain majors will have a much smaller job market, such as aforementioned Latin American studies, but if it makes someone happy by learning about what they love to learn about and trying to work with it, why blame them and why blame the institution by offering a major that people want to learn more about?

Because they can pretty much get the same education by reading the same material on their own time, while doing work that has discernible economic value. Makes sense to me. There are a lot of people out there with university equivalent educations in things that they love that have come from self study.



If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
User currently offlinesw733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6306 posts, RR: 9
Reply 6, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 1972 times:

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
Or maybe it's a consequence of having worthless degrees like Latin American studies or journalism.

Oh jeez. Yeah, lets not have any experts on Latin America, which dominates the immediate area around the US. Smart...

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 3):

What IS worthless is the expectation of earning $100,000/year after graduating with a degree in, say, Music Industry.

I would agree with this. Look at teachers...most people go to school for Education knowing that teachers don't get paid well for the most part. People who major in things like History, Classics, etc. need to realize that they won't start out (or may never at all) making $100k/year. That doesn't mean they should not be able to study those things...the expectations just need to be more realistic.

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
shouldn't universities be offering only degree programs that will actually lead to real jobs?

Who in the heck are you to determine what a "real job" is? I know people who majored in Engineering who are unemployed, and people who majored in History making $75,000 per year (and I am 27...so we haven't been out of college too long). It takes more than just a piece of paper to be successful, thus you can be successful with any degree (or none at all).


User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 9805 posts, RR: 26
Reply 7, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 1974 times:
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Quoting BMI727 (Reply 4):
Because they are throwing away an awful lot of money so they can work at Macy's alongside college dropouts.

So what? If they want to do that, who cares?

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 4):
so I don't especially sympathize with people who will pay that much and go into that much debt for what is, in essence, a hobby.

Personally, I don't judge what is and isn't a hobby for other people. Hell, photography's a hobby for me, but if I were to go over to the Av Photo forum and state categorically that photography is not a profession, you can imagine how that would go over....

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 5):
Because they can pretty much get the same education by reading the same material on their own time, while doing work that has discernible economic value. Makes sense to me. There are a lot of people out there with university equivalent educations in things that they love that have come from self study.

I could have learned everything I know about aerospace engineering from reading stuff on my own time, too.

Basically, that's saying that kids just shouldn't go to college.



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlineAaron747 From Japan, joined Aug 2003, 8035 posts, RR: 26
Reply 8, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1946 times:

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 7):
I could have learned everything I know about aerospace engineering from reading stuff on my own time, too.

Basically, that's saying that kids just shouldn't go to college.

Aerospace engineering is a marketable field. Nobody's saying completing a college degree doesn't serve a larger purpose - I just don't want to hear all this griping about "I can't make enough to live in a hip area" when they chose what they got a degree in.

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 7):
So what? If they want to do that, who cares?

That's right, but they don't need to bitch about it for the same reason.

Quoting sw733 (Reply 6):
Who in the heck are you to determine what a "real job" is?

The folks in the article are the ones complaining about not being able to make a living. I'd say they've yet to find a "real job" if they can't cover their expenses and debt.



If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 9805 posts, RR: 26
Reply 9, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1935 times:
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Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 8):
I just don't want to hear all this griping about "I can't make enough to live in a hip area" when they chose what they got a degree in.

There's a pretty simple solution to that - don't listen.

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 8):
That's right, but they don't need to bitch about it for the same reason.

No one needs to bitch about anything at all.

I look at it this way - everyone complains about something that no one else wants to hear about.

I know I do....



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 10, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1934 times:

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 7):
So what? If they want to do that, who cares?

They can do it, but I'm not going to have much sympathy when they find no jobs in that field.

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 8):
I just don't want to hear all this griping about "I can't make enough to live in a hip area" when they chose what they got a degree in.

  



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently onlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21530 posts, RR: 55
Reply 11, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1932 times:

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
Or maybe it's a consequence of having worthless degrees like Latin American studies or journalism.

Neither of those degrees are worthless.

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
So a couple problems here - shouldn't universities be offering only degree programs that will actually lead to real jobs?

The real jobs aren't out there - that's the real cause of the problem. Or rather, they're not out there in the quantity required to accept all the people coming out of university. That might be more true in certain fields than in others, but overall, the jobs just aren't there anymore. That's due to a number of factors: fewer jobs in the first place because of automation, outsourcing, or companies cutting back, people staying in their jobs longer because they can't afford to retire yet, jobs being available but at lower wages than they used to be, etc. And if there aren't enough jobs and there's not enough turnover, young people are going to find themselves unable to get work in their field (or any field). That's primarily a result of the economy, not of some failing of the educational system.

There are jobs available in every profession, including those that some might think are worthless like English or music - there might not be that many of them, but they're out there. And as long as they're out there, I won't begrudge any institution for offering a good program. What they could do is cap the number of degrees they'll put out in certain fields, so that the number of graduates more closely matches what the market is expected to require down the road.

The problem is that it's difficult to know with certainty what's going to be required. When I started my degree in aviation, the industry was looking bright. Two years in, it was looking really bright. And then we had the double whammy of a recession to kill off demand and an extension of the retirement age to kill off turnover (and even if you could see the recession coming, there was no reasonable way to see that rule change coming). And so my generation of pilots got screwed - stuff happens. I would say, though, that the market does correct itself, since the number of pilots going into training is WAY down, even as the industry is starting to pick up again. It'll probably go up eventually as people see being a pilot as something worth pursuing. The same will be true for other professions.

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
And shouldn't young people be taught by someone that hobbies like website creation are only going to lead to money if the work they do provide something that is in real need?

Are you saying that website creation isn't going to be a skill that will be required in the internet age?   

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlinesw733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6306 posts, RR: 9
Reply 12, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1918 times:

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 8):
The folks in the article

But YOU are the one questioning whether or not colleges should only offer programs that can get people "real jobs". So, who are you to decide what a real job is? Like I said, plenty of people have degrees that should get them "real jobs" but don't, and vice versa.


User currently offlinefxramper From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 7197 posts, RR: 85
Reply 13, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1916 times:
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One extremely liberal article is the answer to the economies woes and graduate problems with finding jobs. It's comical to continue to see how you love to hide behind your flag from Japan and so favorable alienate yourself from the trying times of America. Well done again.

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
So a couple problems here - shouldn't universities be offering only degree programs that will actually lead to real jobs?

We live in America, the land of free and the home of the brave.

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
And shouldn't young people be taught by someone that hobbies like website creation are only going to lead to money if the work they do provide something that is in real need?

I can't make sense of this sentence.

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
The reason the woman in the article can get extra income from babysitting is that its a service actually in need.

Why can't males make extra income babysitting? Is the article bias?


User currently offlineCadet985 From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 1551 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1901 times:

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
"Young college graduates working multiple jobs is a natural consequence of a bad labor market and having, on average, $20,000 worth of student loans to pay off,"



I am rolling on the floor laughing as I read this. I am 25 years old. I have a Bachelors Degree in Journalism, and cannot find ANY jobs that I can medically handle. I say that because I cannot work retail unless I can get a guarantee that I will not have to do any heavy lifting. I have a bad back.

Also...$20,000 in debt - I WISH. I owe over 100k in loans that I can't even afford to start paying or even make the minimum payments on.


User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 9805 posts, RR: 26
Reply 15, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1903 times:
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Quoting fxramper (Reply 13):
One extremely liberal article is the answer to the economies woes and graduate problems with finding jobs.

I agree with the rest of your post, but what about the article is "liberal"? It just interviews 4 people who work multiple jobs, live in probably expensive areas, and don't have much money. I didn't get any sort of overriding editorial viewpoint out of it.

Quoting sw733 (Reply 12):
But YOU are the one questioning whether or not colleges should only offer programs that can get people "real jobs". So, who are you to decide what a real job is? Like I said, plenty of people have degrees that should get them "real jobs" but don't, and vice versa.

  

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 10):
They can do it, but I'm not going to have much sympathy when they find no jobs in that field.

Cool. I'm sure that will keep them awake at night....  

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
And shouldn't young people be taught by someone that hobbies like website creation are only going to lead to money if the work they do provide something that is in real need?

Also, FYI, my roommate is a web designer who worked for himself for years, and made WAY more than I did as a full-time engineer.



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7832 posts, RR: 52
Reply 16, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1882 times:

There are plenty of worthless degrees if you don't know what to do with them. Like psychology, you can make $200,000 a year or minimum wage, depends if you have the drive to get a good job. I've seen people graduate with degrees having to work at restaurants. That's a problem I have observed, the jobs are there, for the most part, many people just lack the skills to get them.


Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlinecpd From Australia, joined Jun 2008, 4879 posts, RR: 38
Reply 17, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1869 times:

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
And shouldn't young people be taught by someone that hobbies like website creation are only going to lead to money if the work they do provide something that is in real need?

There is plenty of money in it if you've got the skills and the expertise in the right areas. Everyone can do front-end development, but it's the heavy duty programming, that's where the dollars still exist in short-term contracts.

Quoting Mir (Reply 11):
Are you saying that website creation isn't going to be a skill that will be required in the internet age?

On it's own - it's a saturated market. But tied with some other areas of expertise such as service-design, then you are doing better already.

It's not up to the university to provide courses that are relevant, but up to the candidates to select courses that are relevant - research will determine what is worthwhile and what isn't, especially if you are taking out huge loans and putting a lot of time into that learning.

[Edited 2011-07-03 19:04:34]

User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8795 posts, RR: 24
Reply 18, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1870 times:

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):
his degree was in English and he had no job offers after more than 100 job interviews.

An English degree will get you a job as an English teacher, and that's just about it. Did he want to be something other than an English teacher?

I have little sympathy for people who get degrees in something they figure will be easy or interesting, because "Hell, I speak English - how hard can it be", or "Music is my hobby, so I'll major in that" without thinking about the job prospects. I nearly fell into that trap myself, and fought hard to avoid my daughter and my niece from taking useless degrees. I won with my daughter and was only partially successful with my niece.

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 3):

It's not universities' responsibility to determine what a student should major in, nor is it their responsibility to ensure said student gets a good-paying job straight out of college.

No problem, if a university wants to offer courses in basket-weaving, and students (or their parents) are willing to pay for it, why not?

BUT not if it is a publicly funded university. We are living in times when government must learn to fund things selectively. Public-funded universities should be used to subsidize engineering, economics, business skills, computer programming, and so forth.

And I know that someone will say, "Well who is the government to select which ones should be funded or not". Well, that's their job! We supposedly elect our government to make choices for us. Choosing everything is the cowardly but wasteful choice.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlineAaron747 From Japan, joined Aug 2003, 8035 posts, RR: 26
Reply 19, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1857 times:

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 15):
Also, FYI, my roommate is a web designer who worked for himself for years, and made WAY more than I did as a full-time engineer.

Well that was my point, just not well elucidated in the three minutes I spent posting. Making a website for a pinata salesman probably isn't going to pay what making a website for an accountant or other productive individual in need of a web designer would. I thought the example in the article was ridiculous.

Quoting fxramper (Reply 13):

We live in America, the land of free and the home of the brave.

Yeah well guess what buddy? Nothing is free. As we continue to point out, lots of degrees that don't lead to much are being provided at your expense in public universities. I'm suggesting it may be time in these lean budget times to rethink that. Instead of going to college for such things, people ought to learn something useful like plumbing or the electrician's trade.

Quoting fxramper (Reply 13):
It's comical to continue to see how you love to hide behind your flag from Japan and so favorable alienate yourself from the trying times of America. Well done again.

I use the flag because it's where I make my home, so what? I'm not alienated from anything. Times are tough here too but people tend to take responsibility for themselves to a far greater degree. I have a useless degree in city planning but have made up for it by partnering in a consulting business. It's called hard work.

Quoting sw733 (Reply 12):
Like I said, plenty of people have degrees that should get them "real jobs" but don't, and vice versa.

As I said, mobility would help on that score.

Quoting Mir (Reply 11):
The real jobs aren't out there - that's the real cause of the problem. Or rather, they're not out there in the quantity required to accept all the people coming out of university.

This is certainly a problem. All the more reason to be focusing on becoming marketable.



If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
User currently onlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21530 posts, RR: 55
Reply 20, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1826 times:

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 19):
All the more reason to be focusing on becoming marketable.

Problem with that is that what's marketable when one is looking at colleges might not be five or six years down the road when one graduates.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlinethegreatRDU From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2310 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1817 times:

Quoting Aaron747 (Thread starter):

Your spot on my friend

Attention college students...
The jobs are in the math, science, and IT fields.....



Our Returning Champion
User currently offlineokie From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2989 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1817 times:

Last week I couldn't spell Inginear now I are one.  

Okie


User currently offlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 9805 posts, RR: 26
Reply 23, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1786 times:
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Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 18):
BUT not if it is a publicly funded university.

That's a different story, but I didn't see that specified anywhere in the article or in the thread starter's post.

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 19):
As we continue to point out, lots of degrees that don't lead to much are being provided at your expense in public universities.

Aaah, see now you're specifying, and this whole thing starts to make more sense.

Quoting thegreatRDU (Reply 21):
Your spot on my friend

Attention college students...
The jobs are in the math, science, and IT fields.....

Clearly some English classes would be useful, however...... 



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlinesw733 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 6306 posts, RR: 9
Reply 24, posted (3 years 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1784 times:

Quoting fxramper (Reply 13):
It's comical to continue to see how you love to hide behind your flag from Japan

  ...a simple anti-Japan retailer thread won't erase all of the threads that clearly point out you're not the biggest fan of America...native or not.

Quoting fxramper (Reply 13):
Why can't males make extra income babysitting?

Unfortunately, it throws a "pervert" vibe...equal rights my ass.

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 16):
Like psychology, you can make $200,000 a year or minimum wage, depends if you have the drive to get a good job

Good point. I have two friends with MS degrees in Psych. One has been unemployed sine she graduated 2 years ago, and the other works for the Mayo Clinic making $125k per year.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 18):
An English degree will get you a job as an English teacher, and that's just about it.

Not even close to being true

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 19):
As we continue to point out, lots of degrees that don't lead to much are being provided at your expense in public universities.

Honestly, as a US tax payer and a tax payer in the State of Kansas...that's fine by me. That I slightly, barely subsidize people who choose to major in stuff like History, Classics, Literature and the like...doesn't bother me. We need experts in that stuff too, lest they die out. I am scared to see a day when everyone knows everything about math, science, engineering and the like, and nobody knows anything about the great writers of our time, the history of our country or the history of the world for that matter. As a dual citizen and tax payer of Namibia too, I have no problem subsidizing the people going to public university there too, for the same reason.

Quoting thegreatRDU (Reply 21):
Attention college students...
The jobs are in the math, science, and IT fields.....

Funny...my fiance has a BS and MS in economics and makes a bit more money working for the Federal Reserve Bank of Kansas City than I do with a double bachelors in Engineering and Mathematics, and an MS in Aerospace Engineering. Sure, there are jobs in those fields...but they aren't the only jobs out there. Not everyone is cut out to do math, science and IT...and there is absolutely nothing wrong with having no desire or passion to work in those relatively boring fields.


25 KaiGywer : Ironically enough, Airliners.net doesn't really provide anything in real need. Yeah, it keeps us occupied and has great photos, but, even without Air
26 Post contains images sw733 :
27 jetblast : Here's my take on it. I am currently finishing my associate's degree in Aviation Management at my school, and I am not sure if I will be continuing on
28 Aaron747 : Not sure how that's relevant. All citizens have a right to comment on their nation and its state of affairs. If I never paid taxes or lived there, or
29 Mir : Not to mention that you can't have a nation of math, science and IT people. You need a certain number of English teachers, or historians, or musician
30 TheCol : The big problem with North American grads these days is that they are out of touch with the global economy of the 21st century. The unfortunate realit
31 san747 : Relocation is the name of the game today. I fully expect no more than 2 or 3 of my long-time friends since HS who have graduated to be here in SoCal
32 deltaownsall : Lol. I love how this somehow passes as a legitimate comment here. Btw, do I have to change my flag in order to post ignorant generalizations with no
33 thegreatRDU : Evidenced by America's test scores in the math and science field....your right
34 ltbewr : This is nothing new. Back when I graduated in 1977, another slow time for jobs for collage grads, I too had to juggle several part time jobs to surviv
35 sw733 : The State of Kansas is doing just as bad financially, as a percentage of state budget, as any other state in the country. Cuts are being made left an
36 Revelation : Agree 100%. The decline in the economy mirrors the decline in the middle class which mirrors the decline in parenting. Many children either have no r
37 weebie : This.
38 KaiGywer : Have her look west.. A friend of my fiancee got a teaching job offer after a phone interview (she lives in MI, so in person interview was out of the
39 Post contains images OA412 : For a variety of reasons, people will be drawn to those places for the foreseeable future. Obviously, people should be doing their homework with resp
40 Aaron747 : This depends on how you look at public university education I suppose. In my view it is basically a contract with society. Everyone has paid for your
41 shamrock137 : This being an aviation site, consider this scenario. Daniel Webster College in New Hampshire was formally one of the best aviation schools in the cou
42 steeler83 : Please... got my MA in geography and planning last year, and I make FAR less than $27k before taxes. For the record, I really do not think I'm in a us
43 Aaron747 : This is a good example of what can happen, but clearly that decision was made not because of the field itself but because the new owners thought thos
44 sw733 : I guess I still fail to see what a "real service" might be. What about those people who majored in Economics and ran banks? They bare some (more than
45 Revelation : 1) Given that most student loans in the US are federally guaranteed, all of us US taxpayers should be concerned. 2) How many decisions involving tens
46 mham001 : It's pretty well known in my trade that the ones going overseas are the ones who aren't really qualified to work at home. The only difference between
47 us330 : Journalism/communications is pretty darn close to being worthless, considering that not having a degree in journalism is not a barrier from entering t
48 Dreadnought : First of all, the idea of student loans is repugnant to me. I think anyone who does it is a fool. I worked my way through my BA (and yes, that restri
49 san747 : As long as 18 years old is the age of legal adulthood, ALL of them. An adult is an adult. I was forced to sign up for Selective Service, I vote, I dr
50 Post contains images KaiGywer : No idea what a NEPA planner is, but it showed up under "Urban and Regional Planners" on the ND Job Service site 07/01/2011 NEPA Planner USFS Dickinso
51 Aaron747 : I have posted on numerous occasions that investment banking provides little if any service to the economy or society at large other than inflating ri
52 Revelation : I'm a KASH local and have followed this situation. The part you are leaving out is that DWC was failing financially under its previous owners, and in
53 AM744 : I agree on that. At the same time, perhaps not everyone is cut for college. Good tradesman beats lousy college graduate. I'd also like to add that ba
54 EDICHC : In the truest of senses probably not, but prospective and well paying employers may differ in their opinion. Sorry but I have to challenge that, huge
55 Revelation : Yes, I agree. In my part of the US there are good programs at vocational high schools as well as in technical colleges. I just have to wonder if ther
56 steeler83 : Yep, it did. I really don't know what the heck I'm going to do. I have roughly $20,000 in debt and I am NOT going back to school for anymore educatio
57 jcs17 : Realistically, I'd be surprised if Johan made six-figures when he sold a.net. In fact, I'm sure he was more than happy just to have someone take it o
58 Post contains links and images DeltaMD90 :
59 AviRaider : My advice is look at an internship. I'm a Transportation Planner for NCTCOG and I started as an intern. I've seen many with Master's degrees. I think
60 steeler83 : Yeah, I would have joined either the Navy or Coast Guard, but there is one huge reason why I can't do that: Type I diabetes... I will have had it 27
61 DeltaMD90 : I'm sorry... One of my good friends was set to join up when he got it. Sorry to hear
62 Cadet985 : Tell me about it lol...that's my degree. And I'm noticing that all of the new talent on the news around here has long hair, breasts, and is of the fe
63 steeler83 : Yeah it sucks. It seems that what ever can work against me in this market... well, does... Sure, it means you get to stay home when we go to war, but
64 Mir : Some people like redundancies. I'd list the same qualifications (i.e. skills you'd bring to the job, not your work history) that you put on your resu
65 vikkyvik : Just to be absolutely clear, I was not saying that at all. My point was simply that it's the parents' and students' responsibilities. How they choose
66 Post contains images Revelation : Part of me wants to suggest since you are in deep debt already, it'd just be a bit more for wigs, falsies, hair remover, etc... Oops, did I just post
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