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Massive Explosion Hits Norwegian PM's Office  
User currently offlineMortyman From Norway, joined Aug 2006, 4089 posts, RR: 1
Posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 9322 times:

Explosion hits Norwegian PM's office

The blast blew out most windows on the 17-story building housing Prime Minister Jens Stoltenberg's office, as well as nearby buildings including the oil ministry, which was on fire.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/43854355/ns/world_news-europe/

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14252515

Pictures:

http://www.aftenposten.no/nyheter/iriks/article4180673.ece

PM is safe. Injured people. To early to say if it is an act of terror

[Edited 2011-07-22 07:26:16]

367 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineFr8Mech From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 5657 posts, RR: 15
Reply 1, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 9301 times:

Quoting Mortyman (Thread starter):
To early to say if it is an act of terror

Of course it's an act of terror. It's too early to tell who is responsible.

Could it possibly be something else? Yes. Is it probable that it's something else? No.

So, who have the Norwegians pissed off? Any domestic issues?

Maybe it is just a minor breakdown in infrastructure (gas main break), but I doubt.



When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
User currently offlineGiancavia From Vatican City, joined Feb 2010, 1385 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 9299 times:

They are reporting it being a bomb... apparently newspaper office was hit? Looks huge.

User currently offlineGiancavia From Vatican City, joined Feb 2010, 1385 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 9296 times:

Quoting Fr8Mech (Reply 1):
So, who have the Norwegians pissed off? Any domestic issues?

They have islamic extremists in Norway, That piece of crap Mullar Krekar also threatened Norway.

One person officially Killed so far.

[Edited 2011-07-22 07:46:59]

User currently offlinepelican From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 2531 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 9263 times:

Quoting Fr8Mech (Reply 1):
So, who have the Norwegians pissed off? Any domestic issues?

Gaddafi - the Royal Norwegian Air Force bombed the command center and residence of Gaddafi in Tripoli on April 25th.

However I hope nobody was killed in Oslo.

pelican


User currently offlineMortyman From Norway, joined Aug 2006, 4089 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 9255 times:

Quoting Fr8Mech (Reply 1):
So, who have the Norwegians pissed off? Any domestic issues?

Norwegian soldiers and specialforces have been in Afganistan for over 10 years ...


User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 6, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 9245 times:

Apparently it was a car bomb that detonated in front of the headquarters of the Norwegian boulevard magazin ''VG'', and wasn't aimed at the government and oil industry complexes.

Sad day for Oslo. Thoughts are with the people there..

Edit: Apparently the bomb exploded inside the building of the paper.

[Edited 2011-07-22 07:55:39]


..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlineGiancavia From Vatican City, joined Feb 2010, 1385 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 9242 times:

Quoting pelican (Reply 4):
Gaddafi - the Royal Norwegian Air Force bombed the command center and residence of Gaddafi in Tripoli on April 25th.

However I hope nobody was killed in Oslo.

pelican

Report of 1 confirmed dead and someone who saw a woman on the floor with no legs (assume dead).

Bomb looks massive.. windows broken 5 blocks away.


User currently offlineMortyman From Norway, joined Aug 2006, 4089 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 9232 times:

Quoting something (Reply 6):
Apparently it was a car bomb that detonated in front of the headquarters of the Norwegian boulevard magazin ''VG'', and wasn't aimed at the government and oil industry complexes.

Sad day for Oslo. Thoughts are with the people there..

Considering the damage on the governmental buildings, it was DEFFINETLY aimed at the government. It is the government buildings that has gotten the most damage. Other buildings are just close to where it happend


User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 9216 times:

Quoting pelican (Reply 4):
Gaddafi - the Royal Norwegian Air Force bombed the command center and residence of Gaddafi in Tripoli on April 25th.

I would think Gaddafi wouldn't be that stupid. That would open up a world of hurt more than just airstrikes if he's responsible.

My thoughts and prayers are with the victims of this attack.

  B4e-Forever New Frontiers  


User currently offlineMortyman From Norway, joined Aug 2006, 4089 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 9202 times:

2 confirmed dead ...

User currently offlineGiancavia From Vatican City, joined Feb 2010, 1385 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 9194 times:

Apparently bomb confirmed by police on Norwegian TV and they think there are 2 other bombs? Stay safe norwegians.

User currently offlinesomething From United Kingdom, joined May 2011, 1633 posts, RR: 21
Reply 12, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 9187 times:

Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 9):
That would open up a world of hurt more than just airstrikes if he's responsible.

Even more so. If a connection between him and that could be established, that would pave the legal way to end his existence rather expeditiously.

Quoting Mortyman (Reply 8):
Considering the damage on the governmental buildings, it was DEFFINETLY aimed at the government.

I'm still getting conflicting reports here. One side reports of a car bomb, the other of a bomb inside the VG headquarter.



..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
User currently offlineMortyman From Norway, joined Aug 2006, 4089 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 9121 times:

According to BBC 3 people have been arrested ( but this is not confirmed ) Also the boss at OSL airport has confirmed that there is currently a policeaction on the premisess of the airport. A car has been surrounded

User currently offlinePoadrim From Norway, joined Oct 2008, 174 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 9115 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I'm just a few blocks away,

It's a complete war zone, smoke, fire and hurt people EVERY-where. Two confirmed dead and the police suspects there are at least two more car bombs somewhere in Oslo, they just don't know where.

Time to send Mullar Krekar far away from Norway!



Good judgment comes from experience. Good experience comes from someone else's bad judgment.
User currently offlineCPH-R From Denmark, joined May 2001, 6054 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 9100 times:

Why the hell target the Norwegians? It's usually us, their southern neighbours, who are targetted.

Quoting Poadrim (Reply 14):
Time to send Mullar Krekar far away from Norway!

Good luck with that, it's not like they haven't tried, tried, and tried again.


User currently offlinepelican From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 2531 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 9028 times:

May those killed today rest in peace and those inhured survive.

Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 9):
I would think Gaddafi wouldn't be that stupid.

Don't forget Lockerbie or La Belle - he was responsible for both terror acts.

But of course there are other monsters who are capable of committing such crimes.

pelican


User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 9017 times:

Quoting pelican (Reply 16):
Don't forget Lockerbie or La Belle - he was responsible for both terror acts.

Oh don't worry, I haven't. But seeing as how he is currently the subject of NATO intervention, you would think he wouldn't do anything that would give legal precedent to just finish his regime off without a second thought.

But there are other monsters. It could even be domestic and something as simple as someone who is disturbed and angry with his or her government. Such sociopaths unfortunately do exist.

If news reports are accurate that there are other bombs, then right now the priority is getting through this event before hunting for who's responsible for said event.

  B4e-Forever New Frontiers  


User currently onlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12965 posts, RR: 25
Reply 18, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 9011 times:

Quoting CPH-R (Reply 15):
Good luck with that, it's not like they haven't tried, tried, and tried again.

We have a Navy SEAL team we could lend them...



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlinemham001 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3726 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 9006 times:

Quoting something (Reply 12):

Even more so. If a connection between him and that could be established, that would pave the legal way to end his existence rather expeditiously.

I don't know, since the west started bombing him on kangaroo legal grounds, I wouldn't be surprised if he were to retaliate. I know I would if somebody decided I shouldn't exist.


User currently offlineGiancavia From Vatican City, joined Feb 2010, 1385 posts, RR: 0
Reply 20, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 8998 times:

Hearing now that People have been shot or there is gunfire on an Island where the priministers party youth group is having an event? Anyone else see this... This is crazy.

User currently offlinewashingtonian From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 8977 times:

RIP to all those who lost their lives....

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 3):
That piece of crap Mullar Krekar also threatened Norway.

Could you elaborate on this a little bit? Who is he, etc? I've read a bit about the problems that Scandinavian countries (and European countries more generally) are having with local Islamists, I wonder if this is related.


User currently offlineMortyman From Norway, joined Aug 2006, 4089 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 8962 times:

Quoting Revelation (Reply 18):
We have a Navy SEAL team we could lend them...

We have navy seals of our own ...


User currently offlineBoeing4ever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 8940 times:

Quoting mham001 (Reply 19):
I don't know, since the west started bombing him on kangaroo legal grounds, I wouldn't be surprised if he were to retaliate. I know I would if somebody decided I shouldn't exist.

Wow, I hope you're not claiming that this is in any way justified...assuming it was Gadhafi.

Moammar brought his current troubles on himself. There was nothing "kangaroo legal" about it. And if he is responsible for this attack (still a big if), then he needs to be dealt with severely.

  B4e-Forever New Frontiers  


User currently offlineMortyman From Norway, joined Aug 2006, 4089 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (3 years 5 months 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 8866 times:

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 20):
Hearing now that People have been shot or there is gunfire on an Island where the priministers party youth group is having an event? Anyone else see this... This is crazy.

Confirmed. By one or more persons dressed as police . Several persons have jumped in the water, trying to get away


25 mham001 : So what do you expect when governments arbitrarily decide a ruler of another country should be eliminated? You are parroting the incredible hypocrisy
26 Post contains images Boeing4ever : Still haven't seen anything in either BBC or CNN. This is awful though. B4e-Forever New Frontiers
27 Post contains links Giancavia : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mullah_Krekar That will sum it up for you better then I can. Yes I see they have sent anti terro police to the island ..
28 Post contains images Boeing4ever : Those "rebels" wouldn't have been rebels had Gadhafi not started pulverizing his own protesting civilians in the first place...or have you forgotten?
29 oldeuropean : With the shootings at the Labour Party youth camp, does there is a possibility that Neo-Nazis or far right groups are behind the bombs?
30 mham001 : Which the governments now bombing him officially forgave him for. In fact, 2 of the current major leaders leading this charge went to embrace him. Ho
31 Post contains images AirPacific747 : Very shocking.. didn't see that coming You almost sound like you're jealous I guess it could be because of Norways involvement in Afghanistan, Libya o
32 CPH-R : Not really, I'm just scratching my head. Though a friend of mine, who works in one of the office buildings (he was working from home today), pointed
33 L410Turbolet : What about the right of people to rise against their own tyrrannical government?
34 canoecarrier : Has this been updated? I was trying to read Aftenposten through Google translate which appears to report 4 were shot on Utoya. Very sad, shooting chi
35 Post contains images Boeing4ever : Also a possibility, but how many right wing groups in Norway are this well coordinated? B4e-Forever New Frontiers
36 Post contains images Boeing4ever : So because of that, we should then look the other way when Gadhafi starts slaughtering his own people when they exercise their right to peacefully as
37 something : Norway has no involvement in Libya.. When I heard the bombs aimed at the headquarter of a Scandinavian magazine, this was my first thought. I then go
38 agill : Apparently a blond guy arrested for the shooting outside of Oslo.
39 Mortyman : Say what ! Norway is one of the countries that has bombed Libya the most. Some 500 bombs. Around 15 % of all bombs dropped ...
40 OA260 : Very sad to hear this news didnt expect to have this happen in Norway. Thoughts with the dead and injured.
41 Post contains links bjorn14 : http://www.swedishwire.com/nordic/10...r-mullah-krekar-over-death-threats For awhile they were the leading NATO bomb dropper in Libya. But a group cal
42 something : Sorry, I missed to say ''anymore''. They're the first nation to withdraw from the mission and will effectively cease all operations until August 1st.
43 Post contains images MadameConcorde : RIP victims in Norway attacks. It is tragic to see how some decide to take other people's lives at their own whim. I hope Karma will strike any and al
44 Giancavia : 7 killed in bombing so far and several killed on the island that were shot. Still a gunman firing on the island. Norwegian Army soldiers have taken up
45 bjorn14 : Police confirm 7 dead and the bombing and shooting are related.
46 474218 : So you think that he be sent to another country, where he can continue to spread hate and discontent? It is people like him that led to US to establi
47 Giancavia : The gunman arrested is apparently a white blonde man but lets not forget muslims can be white and converts. This is surely to professional and large
48 racko : o How many members of Neo-Nazi or far-right groups are 1,85m-1,90m tall blonde Nordic men? o How many members of Muslim extremist groups are 1,85m-1,
49 oldeuropean : At least some have killed the Swedish Premier Palme in 1986. And be sure that there are some far right groups in Scandinavia.
50 agill : What???
51 AirPacific747 : In any case, I guess this could seem like a better explanation: If this is the case, then the terrorists are only confirming the point with the carto
52 KiwiRob : I think if it's proven that this was done by Islamic terrorists his removal will happen, or he'll be detained indefinitally. Sure do I work with a gu
53 Mortyman : Armed police has now taken over the security control at OSL Gardermoen airport in Oslo. The outer and inner Schengen border are now put under control.
54 bjorn14 : NRK reports some group called 'Helpers of the Global Jihad' have but who knows. Could be like the lil ol' lady who claims to be the Boston Strangler.
55 canoecarrier : It's too early to know if this claim is real, but the NY Times is reporting that: "A terror group, Ansar al-Jihad al-Alami (the Helpers of the Global
56 Post contains links and images DocLightning : Confirmed: http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/07/22...pital-injuries-reported/?hpt=hp_t1 Horrible.
57 pelican : But then the Norwegian Air Force nearly got Gaddafi when they bombed his residence and command center in Tripoli in April. So the idea that Gaddafi i
58 bjorn14 : NRK just showed video from a helicopter that showed about 20 bodies floating in the water off Utsøya. They were trying to escape. Gruesome sight.
59 KiwiRob : Missed that, glad I didn't see it, however they did say people were trying to swim away from the island, they might have drowned trying to swim in clo
60 bjorn14 : It looked like they were all in their swim suits..pasty white Norwegians.
61 MadameConcorde : I would not be surprised that the attack was done by neo-nazi groups. The bombs in the building were prepared ahead of time. Accusing "al quaeda" or
62 bjorn14 : Mullah Krekar's group has already claimed responsibility.
63 OEH68 : This is awful news. My thoughts and prayers goes out to the people affected by this horrific incident!
64 KiwiRob : Krekars group is Ansar al-Islam, the group that people have said has claimed responsibility is Ansar al-Jihad al-Alami, not the same group.
65 speedygonzales : Google translation of eyewitness reports:
66 Mortyman : This is to early to say. Various groups can claims things just because they want to be in the spotlight.
67 Mortyman : 10 confirmed killed on the island ... so far
68 KiwiRob : I can't help but think this is home grown, it really does look to me like an attack on AP, rather than an attack on Norway as a whole. I hope I'm wron
69 Post contains images dreadnought : When was the last time neo-nazis either threatened terrorist action or actually did it? This might be very inconvenient for your multicultural belief
70 KiwiRob : It doesn't have to be a neo-nazi just someone who is pissed with the govt. Something more like the Oklahoma City bombing.
71 mham001 : If you were to dig a little deeper than what our various governments feed the media, you would see that there was much more to the background, but by
72 Mortyman : Rumours of even more killed at this island ...
73 Post contains images Boeing4ever : Oh lovely, conspiracy theories. We don't know who did it yet, so any finger pointing at Libyans, radical Islam, right wing extremists, etc is just pu
74 Post contains links thomil13FRA : German News outlets are now reporting that the Oslo Police is ruling out international terrorist connections to the attacks. Tagesschau.de is quoting
75 NIKV69 : What would Neo Nazis want to get involved in Norway? This makes no sense whatsoever.
76 Post contains links thomil13FRA : They are already involved. Neo Nazi activity has been a problem in Scandinavia for decades. The first groups sprang up in the 1940s and 1950s and hav
77 speedygonzales : The police has confirmed that the person arrested for the shooting is Norwegian. There's also reports of a man in police uniform getting leaving in a
78 mham001 : ummm, no. You might want to research who was behind the initial uprising and their history in Libya. But I know that won't happen because you didn't
79 kaitak : Unfortunately, anywhere there are large ethnic communities - as there are in Norway, there will be neo Nazi groups; they feed on discontent, stir it
80 Post contains links KiwiRob : Here's a photo from the Utøya, you can clearly see the shooter wearing a Norwegian police uniform. http://pub.tv2.no/multimedia/TV2/drf...11-07/22/11
81 thomil13FRA : Don't confuse right wing populists with Neo Nazis. People like Geert Wilders, as much as I despise them, generally don't condone violence, which is a
82 KiwiRob : We don't even know that's he's a neo-nazi, we shouldn't jump the gun. Timothy McVeigh wasn't a neo-nazi. It's going to be very hard for Norwegians to
83 Giancavia : As you say we cant know for now, I remember hearing al quaeda mentioning it was training white men in europe for attacks etc etc blah blah so nothing
84 KiwiRob : The PM confirmed a few minutes ago that the gunman was ethnic Norwegian.
85 Post contains links KiwiRob : don't open if you are squemish http://www.abcnyheter.no/files/imagecache/wide/2011-29/utoya980_0.jpg
86 Mortyman : Then the German press knows more about this than us Norwegians ...[Edited 2011-07-22 14:34:19]
87 NoUFO : Tagesschau bases its report on the Norwegian news agency NTB.
88 JJJ : The fact that they're attacking a center-left party youth meeting smacks of far-right activism. The shooting alone could be the work of a single nutj
89 NIKV69 : Maybe so but something on this scale doesn't suggest them.
90 Mortyman : Police confirm that they have found several undetonated bombs on Utøya island and that the deathtoll may well increase.
91 keesje : Seems he talking to the guy sitting in the water, shot people around him. Absolutely Sickening. Norway is a wealthy, stable and sensible country. The
92 Post contains images Boeing4ever : ummmmmmmm, yeah. The same nonesense the right wingers seized on with the Muslim Brotherhood when they wanted us to continue supporting that thug Hosn
93 Mortyman : 17 people confirmed killed. 7 in the city and 10 at the isloand. Numbers may very well increase
94 jcs17 : I think if it was international terrorism, the second target wouldn't have been this Labor Party camp, and instead would've hit something more high-pr
95 JoKeR : Sad day for Oslo and Norway. People of Serbia pray for all those affected. Complete and utter disgust and sorrow in local public here. Wishing you str
96 Post contains links speedygonzales : A 23 year old neo-nazi was arrested with explosives, guns and police uniforms in November 2001, which would make him 32 or 33 now. Might be the same g
97 Mortyman : Norwegian swat police is now searching the perpetrators apartment
98 Post contains links Giancavia : The face of evil. http://www.facebook.com/people/Anders-Behring-Breivik/100002651290254 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...sacre-linked-Oslo-bomb-
99 mham001 : You might want to look up the difference between ''surprised'' and ''pleased''. Once again, don't put words in my mouth.
100 HELyes : And the face is blond Nordic... Islamic terrrorism would had been the easy answer, who expected this.[Edited 2011-07-22 18:56:28]
101 Post contains images Boeing4ever : Don't push an agenda and then whine when someone calls you out on it. Well, well, a right wing extremist. It's been a long time since attacks by righ
102 canoecarrier : Can't say any of us did. Given the mass influx of people from the Middle East to the Scandinavian countries with open immigration policies I won't li
103 dreadnought : I have to admit I was fooled. The main reason I was fooled was that I thought that this was more than one person involved, that someone set off the b
104 Post contains images DanVS : So you think Norwegians aren't capable of violence... that they are superior to other humans? May be... a race apart? You know, your post #82 reminde
105 HELyes : Finnish radio news a moment ago: at least 80 died in the island, according to the Norwegian police. This is terrible, young people executed.. I'm so s
106 Post contains images Boeing4ever : Carried on BBC and CNN as well. This is awful. May they all RIP. I hope the scum that did this spends the rest of his days in prison. I think he want
107 imiakhtar : Not the first time and certainly won't be the last. My condolences to those who have lost friends and family. Norway is a beautiful country and Norwe
108 jcs17 : Holy shit! 80? Criticism needs to be applied to the Norwegian Police who tried to downplay even the death of 10 people on the island. Although I don'
109 canoecarrier : I haven't heard what kind of weapon he used, but from the aerial photos I've seen of the island and the number of children/teenagers that were there,
110 TheCommodore : This was very early on, as the whole drama was unfolding. I don't think anyone was trying to "downplay " anything. Oh yes of course, the death penalt
111 jcs17 : Life in prison is easy. Like life on the outside, you have good days, you have bad days. If you're a murderer, no one has access to you.
112 Post contains images HELyes : The gunman is reported to have been armed with a handgun, an automatic weapon and a shotgun. It's different in the Nordic countries, no military weap
113 Post contains images something : Honestly, after seeing what went down on that island, I'm not so sure I would have wanted to survive. This is literally making me sick to my stomach.
114 Post contains images Boeing4ever : Forget the death penalty debate. Death is too merciful for this scum. Life in prison. Oh and here's one...carve the name of every one of his victims i
115 canoecarrier : I'm not trying to get into a gun control or death penalty debate but even here in the US access to a fully automatic weapon is very limited. A sad da
116 KPDX : Wow.. I am horrified and disgusted at this. May all those who were robbed of their lives rest peacefully... Stay strong Norway!
117 something : I don't know. I have no thirst of revenge whatsoever. Probably because there is simply nothing in the universe that would even get anywhere close to b
118 JetBlue777 : I agree. He needs to suffer for the rest of his life! I just can't imagine the horror.....
119 AirPacific747 : Honestly, I don't believe this story. Sounds more like propaganda.
120 DanVS : Sadly, it's true. We filed a complaint at the tour operator. I've traveled a lot, and that was the only occasion I saw a tour guide express his/her x
121 AirPacific747 : Anyway, I hope you don't suddenly think that everyone in Scandinavia is like that. There are idiots everywhere. What "KiwiRob" tried to say I think,
122 Post contains images KiwiRob : Norways most prolific series killer Arfin Nesset was convicted of killing 22 patients in rest homes (he admitted killing 138 people) got 21 years in
123 kaitak : Well, it won't happen in Norway. However, I do think we should know what drove him to do this; was he a closet islamist, or just an extreme neo-nazi?
124 something : Death penalty= showing people killing is wrong by killing someone. Also, giving the government total power of the life of their citizens. There are pr
125 NoUFO : Excellent post, thank you.
126 Mortyman : The police had to spend alot of time checking out the island for explosives and had to move carefully when thewy entered the island. The police found
127 TheCommodore : No. Two wrongs don't make a right. I know it's old fashioned to say that, but in this case it really is appropriate. If we take his life, we are NO b
128 Post contains links KiwiRob : But he won't he'll get 21 years then be set free if he's been a good boy. Prision in Norway isn't about punishment it's about rehabilitation, he will
129 PanHAM : Another important point is, a country cannot change its laws retroactively. There was no death penalty yesterday in Norway and a life sentence did not
130 TheCommodore : There are always these stories about prisons, and the "easy" life the inmates have once incarcerated. You hear similar stories here in Australia. Sou
131 Post contains links TripleDelta : One internet portal here in Croatia reports that the Facebook profile of the shooter lists him as a "Christian and conservative", and that the Norwegi
132 KiwiRob : And why can't a country change it's laws retroactively? There are always circumstances where laws can be changed if necessary. I think it would be ou
133 Mortyman : 84 is now confirmed killed at Utøya island in adittion to the 7 in the city
134 Baroque : Very sad. Competing in the sad stakes have been some of the posts in this thread. But there have been some excellent posts too, most of the posts from
135 SAS A340 : This is beyond words to me.......
136 Baroque : I hope you are both correct.
137 AirPacific747 : Unbelievable that such an event could take place. It's a very very sad day for all human beings. My thoughts and prayers goes to the Norwegian people.
138 sebolino : I fully agree. This guy must be deeply "posessed" by hatred and anger. The problem is to know what should be done with him to protect the society ...
139 Post contains images solnabo : My heart and prayers goes to Norge and the people affected by this horrible act. //Mike
140 Mortyman : I beleave that in adittion to the 21 years he can get so called after security, meaning that the police can hold him under control indeffinetly. Poss
141 KiwiRob : And I'll say it again Arnfinn Nesset was convicted of killing 22 people, was arrested for killing 27 and admitted to killing 138 people spent 21 year
142 racko : Hes gonna get "Forvaring" I would guess, if I understand the articles on the Norwegian justice system correctly, which seems to be what Mortyman just
143 Post contains images oldeuropean : Especially since the moron from Oslo seems to be a right wing fundamental christian known for his hateful Anti-Muslim rhetoric. These hateful right w
144 iakobos : Thousands of people die every single day from unnatural causes and we have become accustomed to it, though the Western world is horrified when the sce
145 Giancavia : Reports there could have been a second gunman from the campsites.
146 LN-KGL : We in Norway now got our own Timothy McVeigh. The Norwegian police has pointed out Anders Behring Breivik, 32 year old, Christan right wing fundamenta
147 n229nw : My thoughts are with everyone affected by this terrible tragedy. This might be inconvenient to your beliefs that all the evil the world must come from
148 GDB : Shocking beyond words. What started out as a seemingly Al-Queda style attack on the Norwegian state, morphs into the very worst kind of mass shooting.
149 jpetekYXMD80 : " They would not identify him nor say whether he had a criminal record, although the website for newspaper VG identified him as Anders Behring Breivi
150 LTBEWR : The knee-jerk first reaction to these horrible acts of terror in Norway was to blame it on 'Islamic Terrorists'. That is understandable due to past ac
151 PanHAM : One of the basic legal principles. The law rules and no one, not even the state can break the law. Bad comparison. The Germany between 1933 and 1945
152 Post contains links LN-KGL : The suspect has according to NRK bought 6 tonnes of fertilizer in May for his farm at Rena, and on the Internet there are a lot of information about h
153 bjorn14 : The only information we have about this guy is what was on his Facebook page which is of dubious origin. When Loughner shot Giffords that was the MSM
154 LTBEWR : This is indeed a critical point, even McVeigh in his OKC terror attack had at least one found co-participant but questions were raised for years as t
155 HELyes : Yes... In Finland I have seen some comments showing discomfort and disappointment almost he wasn't a terrorist from Pakistan but a local Nordic guy,
156 bjorn14 : It's possible but I just don't believe he pulled this off by himself. He seemed to have no visible means of support. He lived with his mother. Where
157 Post contains links bjorn14 : and then there is this...it could be related or not. http://af.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idAFTRE7671YR20110708
158 Post contains links and images CALTECH : Agreed, a coward he be. Shooting unarmed innocents, especially kids, children. He has broken a covenant with humanity. A horrible tragedy by a coward
159 Post contains images PC12Fan : Saw this update on the news this morning - My God. My thoughts are with you Norway.
160 KiwiRob : But the state makes the laws and the police and courts enforce the laws, so it would appear to me that the state can change or amend laws however the
161 Post contains links and images MadameConcorde : So the 32 year old suspect for these atrocities is a Mason and a Christian (??) and a neo-Nazi. Anders Behring Breivik - the suspect arrested for the
162 bjorn14 : NRK and CNN have reported that police have arrested a second suspect.
163 comorin : +1 I worked at 1WTC and lived across the street. It was a horrific act and peoples of all religions and nationalities were killed. I then saw the hij
164 MadameConcorde : How can one be an official Mason, a Christian and a NeoNazi at the same time? These beliefs all seem most contradictory. The mass murderer is somewher
165 Post contains links Doona : Just saw this, it seems to be the front page of The Sun from this morning: http://twitpic.com/5u81ig Is this real? If it is, I suppose it's yet anothe
166 Mortyman : 92 is now confirmed killed
167 Post contains links and images MadameConcorde : What kind of special forces stone cold killer was this guy?? I find it very hard to believe that one man shot 92 people. Norway attacks: 'I played de
168 KiwiRob : Nobody official has said he's a neo-nazi, being far right politically doesn't automatically make you one.
169 Post contains links zephyrus : Between 2009 and 2010 Anders Behring Breivik was active on Document.no, a Norwegian political talk forum. Document.no has compiled all his postings on
170 something : As it should be. I once read an interview with some convicted felons and they all said after 3-4 years in prison, your brain will sort of ''switch of
171 Post contains images NIKV69 :
172 canoecarrier : He'd be 53 not 60. However rare this type of crime is in Scandinavia maybe it would be a good idea to have a charge of domestic terrorism that would
173 Post contains links FoxTwo : People can commit acts of terror regardless of their religion, race , etc. We are so accustomed to hearing about "Islamic Terror' over the past 10-15
174 jcs17 : 21 years for killing 92 people and he goes free, I hope you're joking. Even with a weak European justice system, I don't think this man will see free
175 speedygonzales : Please tell what murdering one more person would solve?
176 FoxTwo : I would have rather seen the police shoot taser's at his eyes - so he is blind the rest of his life, sitting in his prison cell. That way he literall
177 racko : And I would like to see Norway stay Norway and not changed by terrorism.
178 Post contains images Baroque : but also alas Side question. Why is terrorism worse than killing 90+ folk. 1 Murder is bad, 2 much worse, but I don't see why anyone has to invent ne
179 Post contains links and images MadameConcorde : Freemason Grand Master in Norway confirms that the suspect Anders Behring Breivik is a Freemason. (It appears the Freemasons have come out of the bush
180 something : With your understanding of law and justice, you should feel right at home in Iran.
181 bjorn14 : He shot 84 (could be up to 89) and blew up the rest. Nope, that's the law in Norway.
182 KiwiRob : no he doesn't he looks like an average person, no different from most people. Norway is very lax when it comes to security, it will need to change, h
183 KPDX : Then that is a shame.. As far as I'm concerned, only giving this scumbag 21 years would be a slap in the face to all these children who lost their li
184 AGM100 : Incredibly horrific scene , how the heck does this happen in such a beautiful place. ? 92 Dead ? ...walking around shooting unarmed kids at a summer c
185 KiwiRob : Same guy did both, it would appear that the bomb was a diversion to get all the authourities looking the wrong way, the attack on Utøya was the main
186 BrouAviation : Not 24hrs ago this tragedy meant death for >80 teenagers, and now our frontpages are already covered with Amy Winehouse. Crazy world..
187 L410Turbolet : With 21 years max for a premeditated mass murder I am not sure whose understanding of justice is more perverted and who completely lost the bearing o
188 FoxTwo : I suppose we should give him your version of justice? 100 hours of community service with pay? You come up with a punishment which suits this crime.
189 KiwiRob : Pull the other one he's killed over 90 people, there is no doubt about it that he did it, this is as clear cut as you can get, in this instance the d
190 Post contains links Mortyman : The Swat team that made the arrest: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beredskapstroppen
191 LN-KGL : Why is religion the root to all this? Didn't a wise man say: Let him who is without sin among you be the first to throw a stone at her? I would say it
192 FoxTwo : And Norway will remain Norway. My point is, if they made him permanently blind , he would have something to carry with him the rest of his miserable
193 TheCol : What a tragedy. It's absolutely horrifying that an individual can become so evil. My thoughts and prayers are with the Norwegians. As for Mr. Brevick,
194 canoecarrier : I do think there is a difference. I'm willing to accept the cultural differences between the US and another sovereign country like Norway where the d
195 Post contains images MadameConcorde : Was this a mind control operation? Just wondering... I doubt just one man can produce a tragedy of this scale in two places almost simultaneously. I
196 racko : For crying out loud, Mortyman debunked the "they can't jail him for more than 21 years" myth half a day ago.
197 Post contains images Mortyman :
198 AirPacific747 : Howdy, partners! Sorry but in Norway and the rest of Scandinavia, we live in a civilized community with legislation to follow. This is not cowboy lan
199 something : This has nothing to do with what the Norwegian law says; it's emotion versus reason. Arguments don't get you anywhere there.
200 canoecarrier : To be fair, it may be lost in translation but this: Could mean he would live in a half-way house or outside of prison after 21 years if:
201 Airport : I say shame on all those who pin the blame on a person or a group of people without any evidence, but rather assumption or prejudice based on mistrust
202 KiwiRob : Yeah but this is Norway and judging from past cases as long as he's a good boy they will let him out; I'll say it again Arnfinn Nesset convicted of 2
203 Post contains links FoxTwo : And I say shame on those who take the politically correct avenue around every single terrorist act as if they are running for office. The man has adm
204 LTBEWR : One thing I am concerned with as to the mass shooting. I suspect that Norway has strong laws as to guns, especially to the military grade weapons it i
205 KiwiRob : This is correct, and you wonder why people feel justice in Norway is a joke, as I said it's all about the criminals rehab with very little (read none
206 racko : Apparently the guy has written 1,500 pages manifest detailing his plan to take over Europe for De-Islamification.
207 wolbo : Breivik's manifest: 2083 - A European Declaration of Independence Edit: decided to remove the link as the document describes in detail the process of
208 KiwiRob : Here is an exert.
209 HELyes : Unfortunately now he gets what he wanted, attention to his ideas....
210 DanVS : In Brazil it happens the same thing: murderers can't legally stay in prison for more than 30 years. We Brazilians feel this is outrageous, and there's
211 wolbo : Just read (on page 1447) that he published this 'manifesto' immediately before his crimes on Friday. He describes in meticulous detail the whole proce
212 HELyes : It's rather similar in all the Nordic countries, relatively short prison sentences and low prisoner numbers. In Finland "life sentence" can be first
213 bjorn14 : Hmm...wonder who is in cell 8b and 8c? and I don't think they are prison cells.
214 racko : Prototype of a Neo-Nazi. - Conspirancy for the Islamification of Europe? check - Islamic / Marxist alliance? check - "Political correctness is a propa
215 zalemam : This dude is a freaking nut job! Is there a death penalty in Norway? I hope there is. Its also kinda sad to see the knee-jerk reactions some a.net use
216 Dreadnought : Well, they do tend to cause these sort of attacks the most. In the past 10 years, we've had 17,000+ terrorist attacks by Muslims, and how many "Chris
217 FoxTwo : I'm sorry . Are you referring to Geert Wilders as a Neo Nazi ? He is still very popular to this day . What is wrong with his beliefs? If he not one o
218 FoxTwo : Also keep in mind right wing fanatical "Jihadists" were taking responsibility instantly via the internet claiming this is only the beginning as Norwa
219 Post contains links HELyes : No death penalty in Norway, anywhere in EU, not even in Russia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_of_capital_punishment_by_country[Edited 2011-07-23 1
220 TheCol : After reading .1% of that manifesto that is posted, it doesn't take one long to figure out that Mr. Brevick is a complete madman. Hopefully he'll be d
221 Post contains links racko : No, I referred to him as an ideological inspiration for Neo-Nazis. That's a very flowery description for "I hate Islam". That's Wilders verbatim. And
222 Post contains links HELyes : His totally chocked ex colleagues from customer service say he was a friendly guy, who seemed to get along with everybody from different cultures and
223 johnboy : Check out the Free Republic website sometime and see how closely his views coincide with an unhealthy number of folks on THAT cluster-f*ck of a forum
224 KiwiRob : Interesting you should mention Fjordman, apparently he is Fjordman.
225 Post contains links Doona : NRK will broadcast the memorial service scheduled to begin in about 1 hour (10:00 CET), and it will be featured in NRK:s continuing coverage here: htt
226 Mortyman : According to the manifesto, he has planned this attack for over 9 years ... He sees a trial to be a chance to advertise for his beleafs ...
227 Post contains images MadameConcorde : RIP victims. I am not one who believes everything that's being said. I still don't see how one man can produce a tragedy of this scale in two places a
228 AirPacific747 : The former Danish prime minister, Anders Fogh Rasmussen is the only European leader that is getting positive remarks in the 1500 page manifest.
229 RobertNL070 : Mange styrke Norge It is well known that Anders Breivik admired Geet Wilders' PVV party, calling it "the only real conservative party that exists". Ge
230 racko : All that is different is that in the 20th century, it was Jewish Bolsheviks that Europe needed to be liberated from, in the 21st century it's Muslim M
231 LN-KGL : Now the most important souce of the Manifest on the Internet has been indenfied. Big parts of his manifest is copied from Ted Kaczynski's manifest (th
232 FoxTwo : This topic is branching off on some other very interesting points. Because as time goes on, people are going to be looking for answers- linking toget
233 Post contains images bjorn14 : He'll possibly only serve 21 years (max. sentence in Norway) in prison too. Well he did try to cut the head off the serpent by bombing the government
234 petertenthije : Shame he tends to cherry pick between the values that suit him and the ones that don't. Dutch values are more then having a Dutch passport, a Dutch n
235 Mortyman : The latest confirmed numbers are 93 dead and 96 wounded ...
236 racko : There's a quite a difference between "disagreeing with their values" and wanting to deport them, ban their holy book and strip Muslim criminals of th
237 AirPacific747 : Religion and racism are not directly related. Therefore this statement makes no sense.
238 Mortyman : The perpetrator still had alot of ammunition left, when he was arrested by the swat team...
239 KiwiRob : They weren't all Norwegians, a New Zealand teenager is missing presumed dead, she was on Utøya.
240 Doona : A minute of silence was held in Norway and across the Nordic countries at 12:00 CET. Cheers Mats
241 BrouAviation : Considering the amount of fatalities and their different nationalities, when exactly is a crime qualified as crime against humanity? Furthermore, a N
242 Post contains links HELyes : Join the virtual human chain to support Norway: http://www.vg.no/nyheter/innenriks/oslobomben/lenke.php
243 HELyes : The 21y rule doesn't mean he would automatically be free after that. But the sentence hardly is the main worry right now. At this point it's more imp
244 Mortyman : The number of dead is now downsized from 93 to 76
245 bjorn14 : I am watching the police news conference on NRK and they have revised the death toll at Utøya down to 68 and in the city up to 8. So some good news
246 AirPacific747 : There's also still a Danish woman missing. Presumed dead.
247 Mika : I want to add to all the others here who managed to refrain from fighting over issues and simply express my condolences and thoughts to everyone affec
248 Post contains links Acheron : http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...ead-teenagers-to-Hitler-youth.html Aren't a few a.net members, fan of Glenn Beck?.
249 Post contains images propilot83 : When I first heard about the explosion, I quickly concluded that it was "Al Qaeda." But not this time, it was a Christian fore-say, mmmm they only cal
250 Doona : The murder of 68 people is what's disturbing. Glenn Beck, who is also quite disturbing, needs some perspective.
251 Rara : Terrorism implies some degree of organization. In this case, we don't know yet whether there was a group of people or whether he is just one deranged
252 canoecarrier : It's being reported in the US as he's been charged with "terrorism" although the quote I found from the Oslo Police Chief is he's been charged with t
253 Mortyman : This is correct. he has been charged under the terrorism act § paragraph However the court also have another option wich is to charge him with a new
254 prebennorholm : Well, born in Denmark, merried to a Norwegian man, lived in Norway for 20+ years. She served as a voluntary samaritan at the camp. Her 20 years old d
255 flymia : First what a terrible tradgey, really makes no sense why this happened. If this man does not spend the rest of his life in prison it will be disgustin
256 Post contains links Quokka : My heart goes out to all those who have lost someone in this dreadful and hateful attack. In the immediate aftermath of this devastating event in Norw
257 canoecarrier : I took the time to read this guy's diary. Not the whole 1,500 pages but the last 200 that had his diary. If you haven't you should. This wasn't the ac
258 Centre : I guess you need a reality check!!! Since you said "In the past many years" WWI WWII Korean War Vietnam war more recent history Bosnia! Rawnda! Bush-
259 BrouAviation : No, he doesn't. He is talking about ideology, that is something different than what happened in Rwanda or Bosnia which was ethnical. WWI is another e
260 Doona : I would like to ask posters to please refrain from filling this thread with rants about the dangers of Islam. The only connection between the deaths o
261 BrouAviation : Dutch news-site just reporting that Norwegian department of Justice is considering to make this indeed a case of crime against humanity, therewith ra
262 LN-KGL : Acheron, many thanks for that particular link. Mr. Beck is one of many that inspires people like Breivik. If we follow the Beck logic, it's OK for a 1
263 iakobos : Just for the sake of correctness, four decades, as demonstrated by the European Convention for the Suppression of Terrorism of January 1977, consecut
264 LTBEWR : There is no doubt that the bombing in Oslo was seen initially as an act of 'Islamic' based terrorism, but with the mass shootings on the island, and a
265 MD11Engineer : AFAIK, the pre-1980s Arabic terrorism came mostly from secular, nationalist-socialist groups. Jan
266 Centre : You must be kidding, right? The war in Bosnia was more of a crusade against Muslims. Mass Genocide by all means. Muslims were mascaraed because of th
267 Post contains images Baroque : Apparently not Centre!! Makes one wonder, as opposed to watching and suffering, the only other party I can recall was those actually doing it. Hmmmmm
268 Post contains images Mortyman : From Mona Sahlin (Swedish politician) blog: New York 2001: - Smoke cloud still over over Manhattan. President Bush takes the word: " Let's Hunt Them D
269 AirPacific747 : This doesn't mean that Norway won't try to hunt more potential terrorists in the future. Therefore those words by Mr. Stoltenberg don't mean that muc
270 Baroque : I do not know very much about Mr S, but I will be willing to bet that a ten year assessment of the results of his approach will score well compared w
271 Mortyman : Yes, but the difference between the two is how they voice themselves in a setting
272 AirPacific747 : I say, that there is in no way that you can compare the two scenarios. The threat is different even though both kinds of enemies are called terrorist
273 Post contains links CPH-R : Oh, I don't know, how about the 912 Project, Glenn? http://www.meetup.com/tampa912/events/22130491/
274 fca767 : Will the Prisoners that he gets put with know about this? Do they have TV? I think he should get alot more bad things happening to him than just 30 ye
275 iakobos : PLO, Abu Nidal, Black September, FPLP et al had some common basics, and it is not secularity, they were all promised an afterlife. Though I understan
276 Post contains links canoecarrier : Time magazine did an interesting article on the Norwegian prison system last year. With the Norwegian philosophy of rehabilitation vs. punishment pri
277 fca767 : Hopefully prisoners will know then...thanks
278 GDB : Essentially, isn't this deluded creep a Nordic Tim McVeigh? Same paranoia, same massive and lethal narcissism, even both being into fertiliser based b
279 prebennorholm : Stoltenberg said that AFTER the Utøya killer had been "hunted down". Would Mrs Mona Sahlin imagine that Stoltenberg would meet a free running mass k
280 zalemam : PLO doesn't really operate anymore. Abu Nidal founder of Fatah, which is a Nationalist group that is currently funded by the US of A . PFLP (not FPLP
281 Centre : WRONG Check your facts again. I will correct you on one: Abu NIdal is not the founder of Fatah,He was the leader of a small group called ( Fatah, the
282 Baroque : And Osama might be dead, but essentially he won his war with Bush. He caused the US to change and arguably helped it go broke. So Osama plenty, Bush
283 ME AVN FAN : - You can regard McVeigh as a "deluded creep", but that terrorist in Norway was a politically motivated terrorist - to investigate, to try/judge and
284 Post contains links speedygonzales : The car with the bomb was parked over an underground passage, which caused the ground to absorb a lot of the energy from the blast instead of reflecti
285 ME AVN FAN : Press reports today say that without that underground parking, the government building would have collapsed. A building where some 2000 people were w
286 HELyes : Luckily July is the main holiday month up here in North, probably not that many employees there on Friday in July.
287 Mortyman : Luckily it was in a holiday month with less people working and it was also after hours. Most people had gone home for the day.
288 Post contains links oldeuropean : http://www.colbertnation.com/the-col...-islam-esque-atrocity?xrs=share_fb nuf said.
289 Baroque : When he is good he is superb. Liked the Murdoch section. They do indeed have their ways of obtaining "the news".
290 ME AVN FAN : even if not "that many" it might still have been quite many after hours ? ok, that might have reduced it, but nevertheless
291 HELyes : If the government building had been his actual target, he would had chosen a different time and month to cause a maximum destruction. Instead in his
292 Mortyman : 77 is now the confirmed number of people killed
293 Quokka : Or the easiest target with the maximum "horror" factor. Let us be brutally honest: if this sick bastard - to adopt the approved terminology of those
294 Post contains links Baroque : You been listening to Alan Jones by any chance. You might like Mike Carlton's description of this incident. Glenn Beck, the large lump of talking wha
295 HELyes : It seems his target was the governing Labour Party, he didn't choose just any kids, but the next generation of the political party he hated.
296 Post contains images Quokka : Who? Sadly, I try and avoid (unsuccessfully) popular media because of the appalling lack of standards. In this instance I can claim to have not liste
297 ME AVN FAN : I fear you are right. THIS is the most shocking aspect. He quite clearly targetted the Social-Democrats. I never realized that the Nordic countries w
298 LTBEWR : I noticed that in the pictures released by the media and we have seen here in the USA at to the murdered island victims, including of some of their fu
299 Post contains links Mortyman : Only 6 of 77 people killed were of African / Middle Eastern ethnicity http://www.vg.no/nyheter/innenriks/oslobomben/ofre/
300 HELyes : You are right, the political climate has turned more tensed up here in many ways, the populistic political forces have been pretty loud lately. It se
301 Post contains images canoecarrier : I gave up on trying to make any sense out of what he was thinking by reading the US media reports. So, I did read some of his 1500+ page "manifesto"
302 HELyes : It sounds he is an intelligent, narcissistic psychopath, a very dangerous type of a disturbed personality.[Edited 2011-07-29 20:41:04]
303 canoecarrier : I don't disagree, he was deliberate, knowledgable enough to know how to circumvent the laws of the country he lived in, and also planned to make his
304 canoecarrier : I don't disagree, he was deliberate, knowledgable enough to know how to circumvent the laws of the country he lived in, and also planned to make his
305 KiwiRob : And one girl was maori.
306 Mortyman : He also had further plans of an attack on the Royal Palace amongs other targets ... This is true and also one from Denmark and one from Georgia in Eur
307 Post contains images Baroque : I only know about them from TV and press reports and that is enough to make me think that rocks at the radio would be the reaction. And you can imagi
308 kiwiandrew : Has it been established how he managed to get hold of a police uniform?
309 Mika : I dont believe it has...it's one thing i've been thinking of as well. It's been a week now...it is still unreal to me...all those life less teenage bo
310 Mortyman : Apparently it was not a real uniform, but something that he has gotten made abroad ... Further news ... The man is totally in his own buble. Apparent
311 Mika : Ok, it is now obvious that he's a psychopath...and if there's any trait of a psychopath that he gathered more than any else it's the one of being a to
312 kiwiandrew : Thanks for that, it is a small thing given the scale of this obscenity, but I feel better knowing that there isn't another body out there somewhere o
313 Post contains images Mika : This is the picture of the beauty of democracy on Utoya...
314 canoecarrier : He speaks of it in his manuscript. He had them made in eastern Europe when he was traveling abroad. I agree that he probably didn't have an accurate
315 Mika : I'm with you in your principle here...the thing is that no one is going to restrict free speech MORE after this....what is going to happen and what i
316 canoecarrier : I hope you're right. I've said before, I'm not from Norway and this is something that they have to deal with on their own. I'll just say that after 9
317 Dreadnought : You seem to be under the impression that this guy represents some kind of movement - specifically the far-right. There are a lot of far-left folks wh
318 Post contains links HELyes : Unfortunately there have been applauding, even from the European Parliament. An Italian MEP has described the ideas of the Norwegian mass killer as "
319 Dreadnought : Wait a second - you are equating the ideas he supposedly supported to his action. Yes or no - did the Italian MEP applaud the bombing and the mass mu
320 kiwiandrew : I guess I might be completely blind, but what Islamisation of Europe? I lived in Europe twice for several years and I didn't notice it. ( On the othe
321 Post contains links Dreadnought : This for example, going on in England. A parallel legal system... http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ed-Muslim-leaders-close-ranks.html More on t
322 HELyes : I know Norway is far from Georgia but could you wait until the murdered kids are buried before showing understanding for the killer's motives.[Edited
323 Dreadnought : If a man kills his wife and her lover, I can sympathize and agree with his motives, but that does not mean I approve of his actions or that the victi
324 canoecarrier : I think that you need to understand that this guy was a cultural conservative, in all other ways he was liberal. Take a few minutes and read what he
325 Dreadnought : The point being is that you condemn people for the actions they take, not for their beliefs.
326 KiwiRob : I don't believe he is, he's a very clever man, personally I think most of what he is apparently saying is misleading bulls.hit, most of this informat
327 Mika : Dreadnought, there is no one out in the streets supporting this guy, for obvious reasons, but what HELyes says above is equally dangerous and vivid.
328 Mika : So, according to your logic, Europe will one day be under sharia law and under islamistic rule?
329 ME AVN FAN : - there is no Islamization of Europe going on - if the English judiciary fails to push through its basics, it is bad, as there should not be parallel
330 Post contains links Mika : I can add to that that the in history (i believe) two worst serial rapists in Sweden are both born and bred Swedes. Niklas Lindgren aka "Hagamannen"
331 Post contains links MD11Engineer : Concerning the Christianity angle: AFAIK the Norwegians had some regions in the past with an almost puritan attitude towards protestantism. E.g. music
332 Post contains images n229nw : You know, out of curiosity, I took a look at the Stormfront white-supremacist website after the attacks. I saw pretty much exactly what you would see
333 JJJ : That's the problem. That that's usually the only section of muslims that the news talk about. They don't generally mention the honest, hard-working p
334 Post contains images Mika : I agree with this, and it is just unfortunate. In contrast; imagine if the picture of Breivik and his like minded shmucks would be the prevailing pic
335 Post contains images AirPacific747 : I agree with you as well. As opposed to other people, Muslims are first of all Muslims, then either Iraqis, Iranians, Saudis, etc. Christians identif
336 Mika : Define "many". I know quite a few muslims personally, both european and middle eastern, and i do not agree with this picture at all. I can point out
337 canoecarrier : On this we can agree. I may or may not agree with what you or someone else thinks and/or believes but as long as they don't hurt me or others in the
338 Mika : You certainly do have a point here. The other problem as i see it is that for some it's far too easy to start scape goating immigrants for their own
339 Post contains links Dreadnought : You just contradicted yourself. Muslims are the ones that seem to have the biggest problem treating others as equals (Women's rights in Muslim countr
340 tugger : So the fact that a MINORITY of a religion wants to live under that religion's law is supposed to demonstrate extremism? And what percentage of Christ
341 Dreadnought : When that religion's law reduces women to the status of property, non-muslims to a fraction of the value of a muslim (literally), permits slavery (in
342 tugger : Well your first two points were enshrined in our constitution when we were first established. Women could not vote and did not count and slavery was
343 Post contains images canoecarrier : Since you're both in the US, and I apologize to our European friends for dragging our disfunctionality into this, Tugger polygamist leader Warren Jef
344 Dreadnought : Why do you equate behavior today with behavior centuries ago? Isn't the whole point of learning history to show how humanity learns from its mistakes
345 Baroque : Obviously you need to meet a few Indonesians. Merah putih (colours of the Indonesian flag, red and white, not green) first I think you will find. Goo
346 Mika : I never said or even tried to make it appear that the only ones treating others as equals were ehtnic christian swedes (in this case for example). It
347 LTBEWR : One of the biggest problems of both 'Christian' and 'Islam' faiths is that they are prothlizing faiths, that is encourage the seeking of converts for
348 Post contains links Centre : Christian Terrorist!! http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Globa...-Was-Breivik-a-Christian-terrorist His actions were inspired by those across the Atlanti
349 ME AVN FAN : - Some maybe, but most Saudis, Iraqi, Lebanese, Syrians, Egyptians, Tunisians, Algerians etc are first of all Arabs (particularily the Christians fro
350 Dreadnought : Whatever. Here is what Breivik says about Christianity. “If you have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ and God then you are a religious Chr
351 Centre : Isn't this the case of all extremists and terrorists? I fail to see ONE untrue statement in there!!! It's all true. The tea party along with the GOP
352 Centre : deleted deleted double post[Edited 2011-08-02 13:47:50]
353 Post contains images Dreadnought : No. Were Wehrmacht soldiers extremists? The vast majority not, they were simply brought up in a culture that led them to inhuman acts. The culture th
354 Post contains links Mika : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MTGPGS2T-Q&skipcontrinter=1 Watch that and tell me that his views are not that of christian supremacy.
355 Mika : I'm unsure and divided if i really should have shared that link, but i figured that by this time most of us who debate this have already seen it. I ho
356 Dreadnought : I see nothing in that film - NOTHING, that indicates that he seeks to impose Christianity on anyone, or blast anyone in the name of God. In some thin
357 Mika : Rough excerpt from that video, around 09:00: "Onwards christian soldiers! Because by 2025 a majority of our european capitals will be muslim cities, j
358 Dreadnought : He answered that. “If you have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ and God then you are a religious Christian. Myself and many more like me d
359 Mika : No he didn't as i asked you how you interpreted it. What he says is that he is a christian and that he encourages other christians to take up the fig
360 tugger : I don't disagree. I wasn't comparing them, not directly. That is why I stated: I was noting the comparison for why someone of a certain religion woul
361 Mika : Extremely well put.
362 Dreadnought : No. I support universal healthcare through an individual mandate, but apart from an enforcement role and basic regulation (which might take up 4-5 pa
363 Post contains links and images Centre : Do you listen to the GOP self acclaimed leaders from the talk show hosts?? Rush, Glen...etc The man admittedly got all of his ideas from the US Chris
364 Mika : I chose to stay out of the discussion of the founding of america from this point onwards, as in all honesty i know too little about it. It's really a
365 Dreadnought : And which of them, pray tell, advocated violence? You called us terrorists - or at least approved of our being called terrorists (and hostage takers)
366 SKYSERVICE_330 : Canada has a parallel legal system, based on religion?
367 SA7700 : This thread will be locked for further contributions as it has run its course and is now being steered into an off-topic debate. Rgds SA7700
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