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Prince William Hopes It's A Girl...  
User currently offlineAirstud From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 2651 posts, RR: 3
Posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 2768 times:

or at least "In Touch" magazine reports that.

If so, I wonder why? I think it's very un-monarchy-y of him.

[Edited 2011-11-17 20:59:29]


Pancakes are delicious.
29 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinesignol From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2007, 3003 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 2756 times:

Quoting Airstud (Thread starter):

If so, I wonder why? I think it's very un-monarchy-y of him.

Did you not hear? The law has been changed to make ascension to the throne non-sexist (but it's still anti-Catholic)...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-15492607

signol



Flights booked: none :(
User currently offlineAirstud From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 2651 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 2749 times:

Yes, I knew about the change in succession laws. (I read about them with substantial amusement, at the claim that this was being done to "end discrimination." Indeed. You now have a discrimination-free....uh, hereditary monarchy...)

This is why I am concerned at the prospect of Will & Kate's first being a girl. Under the old succession laws - if I have this right - a firstborn daughter would become merely heiress presumptive (well, once Will is king; I'm not sure what the terminology is for those further down the direct descendant line) until and unless a son is born, at which point said son would become heir apparent, displacing the girl, and keeping all-encompassing power over the known world in male hands. Where it belongs.   



Pancakes are delicious.
User currently offlinesignol From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2007, 3003 posts, RR: 8
Reply 3, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 2711 times:

Whereas now, if William becomes King, he and Kate have a daugher, she then becomes 1st in line to the throne as Queen.
And I agree about the discrimination - it discriminates everyone who isn't a member of the Windsor family  

signol



Flights booked: none :(
User currently offlinePyrex From Portugal, joined Aug 2005, 3978 posts, RR: 28
Reply 4, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 7 hours ago) and read 2666 times:

Quoting signol (Reply 3):
And I agree about the discrimination - it discriminates everyone who isn't a member of the Windsor family

Heck, it even discriminates against most members of the Windsor family...

I just hope that when (if) it happens it is like one of those stories of the fat women that go to a truck-stop rest-room not even knowing they are pregnant and come out with a kid, so I don't have to see 9 months of endless magazine covers about the most stupid aspects of her pregnancy.



Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
User currently offlinesignol From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2007, 3003 posts, RR: 8
Reply 5, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 2644 times:

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 4):

At least you get half a chance to avoid the whole thing - my wife is a big fan of the Royals, and she isn't even British - or even from another state with the same monarchy!

signol



Flights booked: none :(
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Reply 6, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 4 hours ago) and read 2613 times:

I am fed up with all these Royal news. For one I hope the UK will revert to a non-Monarchy after the Queen leaves this world. Time for something new and updated.

The UK Princess is pregnant... so what? We just had Carla Bruni, now her, next will be the new Princess of Monaco and after that this or that other royal or celebrity. As if this will change anything for us the people.

I don't buy into this stuff.

 



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineandz From South Africa, joined Feb 2004, 8449 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 2540 times:
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Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 6):
I hope the UK will revert to a non-Monarchy after the Queen leaves this world.

There is more chance of the UK adopting the US Dollar than that happening.



After Monday and Tuesday even the calendar says WTF...
User currently offlineBabybus From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (2 years 9 months 6 days ago) and read 2520 times:

Quoting signol (Reply 1):
(but it's still anti-Catholic)...

Since there are no Catholics in the Royal family this shouldn't be an issue....unless there are secret Catholics in the Royal family and that's what this law change is all about.  

Regarding male/ female succession it should be first come first served. A queen is just as useful as a king.  

No presidents for the UK please.


User currently offlinedreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8824 posts, RR: 24
Reply 9, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 2484 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 6):
I am fed up with all these Royal news. For one I hope the UK will revert to a non-Monarchy after the Queen leaves this world. Time for something new and updated.

New and updated isn't always a good thing. I think the Royal Family is a great asset to the UK - it is a link to the past that can be traced over a thousand years when Britain developed from a remote island of Celtic tribesmen to the center of the world. While the Royals don't have much political power, that is largely out of the choice of the current queen, who chose to stay out of political matters. If she chose to, she could carry a lot of weight, promoting certain values or ideas. You might say that we have elected politicians for that, and that is fine, but you have to remember that politicians will say anything and do anything to be (re)elected, and are swayed by polls and public opinion. A royal can be a useful outsider to the political process, reminding his nation of where they want to go. In today's Britain, you are free to ignore his views of course, But I think they can be valuable if the Monarch is a well-grounded, educated person of integrity.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinebjcc From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 327 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 2345 times:

Something new?

We tried being a republic before the French did. It didn't work.
And having seen the mess the French made of the change over, and the current state of French politics, combined with the Americans, who can't make up their minds still that their president really is! Then I think we're better off with a non partisan Head of State.
I accept it doesn't work for others, but works just fine here.


User currently offlineKiwiRob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7247 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 2341 times:

Quoting bjcc (Reply 10):
I accept it doesn't work for others, but works just fine here.

It works pretty well in NZ as well, if it ain't broke why waste time, money and effort trying to fix it.


User currently offlineTheCommodore From Australia, joined Dec 2007, 2827 posts, RR: 8
Reply 12, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 2313 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 6):
I don't buy into this stuff.

Well Madame, you just have, by bothering to reply !

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 11):
It works pretty well in NZ as well,

Yes, and don't forget OZ. Works fine here too.



Flown 905,468 kms or 2.356 times to the moon, 1296 hrs, Longest flight 10,524 kms
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Reply 13, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2290 times:

Quoting TheCommodore (Reply 12):
Well Madame, you just have, by bothering to reply !

True in a way and I wish them well. Still, not really interested.
They belong to a totally separate world. It is the same with the Royals in Monaco.

The trouble is if the monarch is not intelligent and has no good sense you have to deal with them for so many years whether you like it or not and then it's even worse when the monarch is not smart and surrounds himself/herself with the wrong advisors. It can happen.



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7867 posts, RR: 52
Reply 14, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2174 times:

What's the point in removing the sexist barrier if you still have discrimination against the younger members and I guess all of society that isn't royal?


Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineEDICHC From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 2163 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 13):
The trouble is if the monarch is not intelligent and has no good sense you have to deal with them for so many years whether you like it or not and then it's even worse when the monarch is not smart and surrounds himself/herself with the wrong advisors. It can happen.

  

In other words the institution of Monarchy amounts to having the head of state appointed permanently, by an accident of birth. A policy that belongs to the middle ages. Furthermore in the UK, the Monarch may not be of the Catholic faith nor marry someone of the Catholic faith. This is the only religion specified to be excluded from the succession.


Quoting TheCommodore (Reply 12):
Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 11):
It works pretty well in NZ as well,

Yes, and don't forget OZ. Works fine here too.

For how much longer? I think the republic issue may well surface again once Charles ascends to the throne.

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 4):
it even discriminates against most members of the Windsor family...

In reality there is no such thing as the Windsor family. The name was adopted as the dynastic name by King George V during WWI as the family name (Saxe-Coburg-Gotha) was considered too Germanic. Since the current Queen married Prince Phillip the real family name of the Royals, if following normal conventions is Mountbatten-Saxe-Coburg-Gotha or just plain Mountbatten.


User currently offlineKiwiRob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7247 posts, RR: 5
Reply 16, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 2150 times:

Quoting EDICHC (Reply 15):
In reality there is no such thing as the Windsor family.

Rubbish if you change your last name you are no longer what you once were but who you are now, pretty simple concept to grasp isn't it.


User currently offlinesignol From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2007, 3003 posts, RR: 8
Reply 17, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2137 times:

Quoting EDICHC (Reply 15):

According to the BBC article I quoted, a monarch can now marry a catholic - they just can't be one themselves. I can see a future issue if someone marries a catholic, has a child who becomes heir to the throne, and OS brought up catholic by the other parent. I say, remove all reference to religion at all.

signol



Flights booked: none :(
User currently offlinegarpd From UK - Scotland, joined Aug 2005, 2644 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 2133 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 13):
Still, not really interested.

Yet you still clicked in the thread to read it  



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User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13985 posts, RR: 62
Reply 19, posted (2 years 9 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2105 times:

Quoting EDICHC (Reply 15):
Furthermore in the UK, the Monarch may not be of the Catholic faith nor marry someone of the Catholic faith. This is the only religion specified to be excluded from the succession.

I think, that if the matter should become acute (e.g. the successor to the throne would fall in serious love with a catholic person, this law would be dropped very fast. It is a leftover from the the days of the fights between protestants and catholics and mainly due to Queen Mary (aka Bloody Mary) having tried violently to stop the spread of protestantism in England. Additionally she had married the Spanish king (whom she might have genuinely loved, but who saw the marriage mainly as a political tool to get the English rival under his control).


Quoting EDICHC (Reply 15):
Since the current Queen married Prince Phillip the real family name of the Royals, if following normal conventions is Mountbatten-Saxe-Coburg-Gotha or just plain Mountbatten.

Actually they should be called von Battenberg-Saxen-Coburg-Gotha. At the same time, when the Saxe-Coburg-Gotha branch changed their name to Windsor, the von Battenberg branch directly translated their name into English (Berg = Mountain).
Face it, you Brits: Your royal family are all Krauts!

Jan


User currently offlinePyrex From Portugal, joined Aug 2005, 3978 posts, RR: 28
Reply 20, posted (2 years 9 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 1925 times:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8bqQ-C1PSE

ARTHUR: The Lady of the Lake, ...her arm clad in the purest shimmering samite, held aloft Excalibur from the bosom of the water signifying by Divine Providence that I, Arthur, was to carry Excalibur. That is why I am your king!
DENNIS: Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.
ARTHUR: Be quiet!
DENNIS: Well, but you can't expect to wield supreme executive power just 'cause some watery tart threw a sword at you!
ARTHUR: Shut up!
DENNIS: I mean, if I went 'round saying I was an emperor just because some moistened bint had lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away!



Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
User currently offlinebjcc From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 327 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (2 years 9 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 1756 times:

MD11
Its not actually the reason.
The Monarch in the UK is also Head of the Church of England, and he/she cannot be that, and a Catholic.
The Catholic Church demands that if you marry a Catholic, you take the Catholic communion, hence the issue.
In modern times, the Catholic church has become more lax on the demand, and thats why I doubt in reality it would ever really be an issue except too the hardest nosed CofE Clergy. Religion plays very little real part in British Society now.

As for a Monarch making themselves unpopular, yes, its possible, but I would think that any Crown Head of State is more than aware than they only rule while they have the publics support. That obviously influences behavior. It's also interesting to note that almost no Monarchy's have become Republics in recent times, and yet Spain re instated it's Monarchy by popular vote. So it obviously has some favour outside the UK and Commonwealth Realms.


User currently offlineCPH-R From Denmark, joined May 2001, 5986 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (2 years 9 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1685 times:

Quoting bjcc (Reply 21):
That obviously influences behavior. It's also interesting to note that almost no Monarchy's have become Republics in recent times, and yet Spain re instated it's Monarchy by popular vote.

The only ones that spring to mind is Greece in the late 60's (for the umpteenth time in a very short timespan) and Nepal a few years ago. And the latter was probably as much a case of much of the Royal family being wiped out by one of its members!

However, it will be interesting to see what happens once the current generation of Monarchs dies out and the new 'younger' generation taking over. Will the public take to the succesors, who for the vast majority have had their entire lives covered by the tabloid press? Our Crown Prince is a bit of a favourite target for the tabloids, who apparently like to see how much they can get away with, knowing full well that the royals can't really take any action. I mean, who cares that the guy is a trained Navy frogman, took part in a Sirius patrol (look up if you don't know what it is), has run a number of marathons, is working to implement some change in the IOC, is promoting a healthier lifestyle for kids of today, etc. - the man made a funny face, what a disgrace!  

Incidently, the Danish Royal family have a bit of the same 'Must marry a person of x faith', where x is Lutheran. The current Prince Consort Henri converted from Catholicism, and Crown Princess Mary converted from Presbyterianism.


User currently offlinePyrex From Portugal, joined Aug 2005, 3978 posts, RR: 28
Reply 23, posted (2 years 9 months 2 days ago) and read 1643 times:

Quoting CPH-R (Reply 22):
And the latter was probably as much a case of much of the Royal family being wiped out by one of its members!

Regicide is just a family tradition in most royal families - you have to remember most of the times that is how they got to power. It is so called royal darwinism - survival of the evilest, whoever can manage an environment of intrigue better. They just get pissed off when someone else does it (e.g., start World War I).

Quoting CPH-R (Reply 22):
The current Prince Consort Henri converted from Catholicism, and Crown Princess Mary converted from Presbyterianism.

If I were Danish I would feel much happier in knowing that my enlightened leaders actually took time to think through this whole religion thing and their conclusion was not "this whole story of an imaginary figure in the sky dictating everything is crap" but "this makes total sense, it is just that it is not this imaginary figure here, but that one on that cloud over there".



Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
User currently offlineKiwiRob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7247 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (2 years 9 months 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 1636 times:

Quoting bjcc (Reply 21):
In modern times, the Catholic church has become more lax on the demand, and thats why I doubt in reality it would ever really be an issue except too the hardest nosed CofE Clergy. Religion plays very little real part in British Society now.

But then why should the head of the CoE be Catholic, there is now way in head the Pope would ever be CoE.

Quoting CPH-R (Reply 22):
The only ones that spring to mind is Greece in the late 60's

It also looks like the former Greek Royal Family are pretty popular in Greece as are the former Italian Royal Family.

I would like to see the twit who is the King of Tonga deposed as well as the Maori King, both are a waste of time and completely unnecessary.


25 JoeCanuck : Still the best reasoned argument against a monarchy ever presented.
26 EDICHC : Incorrect I was raised in the catholic faith and married a girl who was Church of Scotland, she was never required to take communion, even during the
27 yyz717 : While I am pro-monarchy, I do agree there is far too much royal news. I also dont give a rats ass what Prince William wants -- boy, girl or hermaphro
28 Aeroflot001 : So how did Queen Elizabeth become queen? Was it because George only had 2 daughters?
29 yyz717 : Yes, and because George's elder brother abdicated the throne without having heirs.
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