kiwiinoz From New Zealand, joined Oct 2005, 2165 posts, RR: 5
Reply 1, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2113 times:
I have massive love for my home country. The relationship and reasons are very personal as it relates to subtle nuances of the people, culture, history, and land that have a specific appeal to me. As this love is exclusive to me, I do not expect others to feel the same way. I don't even expect others to love it at all, (or at least don't really care). This is at odds with many of my countrymen, who seem to be on a lifelong mission to try and prove to the world that NZ is really something special. Personally I would prefer that it's kept secret!!
Is this patriotism? I'm not sure. Probably no. Patriotism to me implies a more collectivist psyche, rallying around things like the declaration of independance or shared experiences. I think I only experience this when watching our rugby team play, (or our Cricket team.....but this usually erodes our sense of patriotism)
ajd1992 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2060 times:
I'm not patriotic. Well, not much - I'm glad of my political freedom and I live in a first world country. I'm not a fan of some of the people in the country though, especially the moron running it. I do consider myself English - not British.
At risk of opening a massive can of worms here - it seems some people in the UK take patriotism as racism against immigrants. Maybe it's just me, but that's my thought on it.
speedbird217 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2012, 337 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2005 times:
Quoting ajd1992 (Reply 2): it seems some people in the UK take patriotism as racism against immigrants
It's the same in Germany. Probably even worse. The World Cup 2006 changed things a little, but there are still Germans that are offended if they see a German flag. That's just stupid. Aside from the fact that patriotism in Germany is virtually non-existent, I have nothing really to identify with in Germany. I feel a stranger in my own country and get along way better with people from the UK and the US.
I lived in the US for a while and I would say that I was patriotic there. I felt home there from day one, have loads of American friends, had a traditional American Thanksgiving in a family and so on...
My plan is to go back anyway, and stay for good. So I would say that I am patriotic - but only for America, even though I wasn't born there. Love the country, the people and their identity, and I felt like I belong there for the first time in my life.
na From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10751 posts, RR: 9
Reply 5, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2001 times:
I am somewhat proud, or better said, glad to be German, but patriotic in an oldfashioned sense, no. Patriotism is often close to chauvinism, and many so-called patriots are not very tolerant to foreigners and think they are a better kind of people. I put a little german flag on top of my TV during football world cups, but thats it.
moo From Falkland Islands, joined May 2007, 3970 posts, RR: 4
Reply 6, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 1974 times:
Quoting ajd1992 (Reply 2): it seems some people in the UK take patriotism as racism against immigrants.
My personal issue with it (the concept of modern patriotism) is that you can see it routinely being used as a weapon to silence dissenters and those who don't agree with someones opinion.
For example, in the US if you don't support the troops, you are unpatriotic - and a lot of people are easily cast as not supporting the troops when infact its the wars the troops are fighting that they don't support. So the cries of patriotism are being used to try to force people to either support a particular opinion or silence them from the debate.
NoUFO From Germany, joined Apr 2001, 7958 posts, RR: 12
Reply 8, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 1955 times:
I am pleased to be European, pleased to be German.
My 'patriotism' can be seen in the fact that I wish those who moved from e.g. Spain to Germany during the recent economic crisis well. I hope they get along well with customs and habits, the language, the cuisine and the weather.
At the same time I hope Spain and other countries recover quickly.
I want Europe to be (at least one of) the best place(s) to live in which is probably already the case, but there is certainly room for improvements. I want Europe to be an engine for science, freedom, human rights, protection of the environment, and - not to forget - savoir-vivre.
And if Canada, Australia or the U.S. scores better: Cheers to you and a tip at the hat.
rfields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7607 posts, RR: 32
Reply 9, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 1910 times:
My father and two of his brothers served in combat in WWII.
My mother's brother was killed in Belgium in Feb 1945 while in the US Army.
Most of my older male cousins served in either the Army or National Guard, though one was a USMC F-4 B/N for five years.
I joined the US Navy in 1972, and served until I retired in 1992. I had the pleasure of serving ashore with the Marines in Lebanon for much of the later half of 1983.
My son was in the US Army from 1997-2003 and has a combat disability after coming home from Iraq. My daughter married a US Army vet.
My grandsons and granddaughters have been raised to respect the US military and two want to serve when they are old enough.
I don't know if that makes us patriotic, but I've seen violent changes of government, countries where people starving is normal, supposedly free major nations where different political views are suppressed and people are shunned.
The United States is not a perfect nation - and in my opinion the increasing polarization of the people trying to exclude others from our nation is a dangerous trend.
But it is still the best in the world in my opinion, and I and my family stand by this nation, our president - whether or not we voted for him - and our people.
I consider myself a political conservative - and some folks one issue folks don't.
I don't care because I believe in the oath I took to defend this nation and its constitution.
Dreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8847 posts, RR: 24
Reply 10, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 1908 times:
Quoting ajd1992 (Reply 2): At risk of opening a massive can of worms here - it seems some people in the UK take patriotism as racism against immigrants. Maybe it's just me, but that's my thought on it.
There is a big difference between patriotism and nationalism.
I know that but unfortunately, a lot of people (especially immigrants) don't.
There were immigrants who burned poppies on Remembrance Sunday a few years ago. Completely distasteful yet because they were immigrants it was "ok" because it's a sin to lay the law down if they're an immigrant because it's automatically racist
I'm not a racist in anyway shape or form, but if you are going to disrespect my country because you don't like it, you know where Dover is. I hate it.
I once remember GWB saying that he'd never apologize for the United States. My answer is: "What if we did something wrong?"
There is something I call fundamentalist patriotism. That's the view that your country can do no wrong and that it is a priori the best country in the world. There is a LOT of fundamentalist patriotism in the USA and that general sentiment really hampers our international relations.
2707200X From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 8546 posts, RR: 1
Reply 16, posted (2 years 5 months 20 hours ago) and read 1752 times:
I am patriotic and I love the United States of America and all good that she stands for.
My patriotism is more within. My stand with this country is not jingoistic, not political, not religious, not for product advertising not about assimilation for the sake of assimilation and is not about draping everything with Old Glory or supporting anti flag burning measurements though I am the last guy who would ever want to burn one.
It is (in my view) about to freedom to associate peaceably, freedom of religion and from religion, freedom of responsible speech whether I like it or not and freedom of the individual person to own, to do, to like or dislike and be who you are and be what you want to be.
"And all I ask is a tall ship and a star to steer her by." John Masefield Sea-Fever
kiwiandrew From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 8572 posts, RR: 13
Reply 17, posted (2 years 5 months 20 hours ago) and read 1732 times:
Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 14): Lets say I'm patriotic, because I love my country but Im also realistic to know its limitations.
That sums up my feelings as well. I get very disturbed by the 'My country, right or wrong' attitude that some people seem to see patriotism as ( usually conveniently forgetting that the full quote is "my country, right or wrong, if right, to be kept right, if wrong , to be set right' ) . One of the great things about being in my country is that I have the right ( perhaps even a duty) to speak up if I think we are doing something wrong.
Flag waving , under the guise of patriotism, always makes me feel a bit uncomfortable, it just seems a lazy knee jerk action .
Moderation in all things ... including moderation ;-)
Dreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8847 posts, RR: 24
Reply 19, posted (2 years 5 months 19 hours ago) and read 1706 times:
Quoting DocLightning (Reply 15): There is something I call fundamentalist patriotism. That's the view that your country can do no wrong and that it is a priori the best country in the world. There is a LOT of fundamentalist patriotism in the USA and that general sentiment really hampers our international relations.
That's more along the lines of nationalism. There is some of that, but there is also the other kind too.
Let's say your daughter gets into trouble. It's her own fault - she got careless, did something stupid, but by God she is your daughter and you would do anything you possibly can to help her out, in spite of the fact that you know perfectly well that she deserved it. That's patriotism. It's not blind, but it's love.
Stratofish From Germany, joined Sep 2001, 1051 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (2 years 5 months 19 hours ago) and read 1706 times:
Not patriotic at all, Patriotism is a strange concept to me that I just cannot grasp. I don't know but I am just not proud of "my country" not because I despise where I live but because this country is not my own accomplishment, if you understand what I mean.
A flag to me is just that, a piece of cloth. I have never ever felt something or shivered at the sight of a flag. I do not think it is right to burn flags as a sign of disapproval but if you want to go burn the German flag go right ahead, I am really not bothered at all.
That said I feel strangely well, saying I am European and don't say anything against my hometown.
Ken777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8305 posts, RR: 8
Reply 21, posted (2 years 5 months 19 hours ago) and read 1698 times:
I'm patriotic, but in a quiet way.
I served in the Navy for 4 years and consider it to be as important as anything I have done in life.
I also believe we are one Nation. I served in the US Navy, not the Texas Navy (I was born in Texas), nor the Oklahoma Navy (where I entered the service from).
I'm not a excited flag waver, and I tend to get rather angry at those who wrap themselves in the Flag to push there political demands. (You can read Tea Party into that if you want.)
I do, however, wish to have a Flag on my coffin when I go. Nothing fancy, but a reminder for all ho come to my funeral that I did love this country. Maybe it will help renew their sense of patriotism a bit.
Quoting ajd1992 (Reply 2): I do consider myself English - not British.
I had to smile at that. My wife was born in Dundee and considers herself a Scot far more than a Brit.
NASCARAirforce From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3184 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (2 years 5 months 11 hours ago) and read 1627 times:
Quoting zrs70 (Thread starter): What's odd is that many think I am a Republican because I am patriotic (as if the definition of democrat is to be cynical and against the government).
Depends who is in charger - right now its the Republicans cynical and against the government.
Quoting moo (Reply 6): For example, in the US if you don't support the troops, you are unpatriotic - and a lot of people are easily cast as not supporting the troops when infact its the wars the troops are fighting that they don't support. So the cries of patriotism are being used to try to force people to either support a particular opinion or silence them from the debate.
I believe that being a patriot is wanting what is best for your country - but we all have a difference of opinion. Some would say that OWS is patriotic while others being a pro war hawk is patriotic.
I don't believe that what the Fox News media tries to tell you as being a patriot - wrapping yourself in a flag, supporting wars and throwing the term unAmerican around at anyone who thinks differently.
I don't support my government, I don't support its wars, I don't support its methods of taxation, I don't support its bailouts of the banks and Wallstreet or its stimulus packages. I don't support its "Patriot Act" or its so called War on Terror or its Department of Homeland Security - everything has strayed way too far from the Constitution and what the founding fathers envisioned. Am I more patriotic than that chickenhawk that never put on a uniform but cheers about every Middle Eastern Country we bomb? Am I more patriotic than Sean Hannity who thinks we should waterboard everybody? Am I more patriotic than an Occupy Wallstreet Protester?
No - everyone has their own idea what they think is best for their country.
Try explaning that to some of my fellow countrymen... I am a patriotic Austrian, however, I've been looked upon as if I were a Nazi because I know all three stanzas of our national anthem. I am in no way a nationalist, national socialist, or racist - in fact, I am very pro EU (yes, still) and cannot stand the "foreigners out" campaigns of the far right political wing.
WARNING! The post above should be taken with a grain of salt! Furthermore, it may be slightly biased towards A.
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: I think there has been a concerted effort in Europe to eliminate nationalistic tendencies through the education system and media since WWII, with the
: "Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel." --Samuel Johnson
: "Patriotism is when love of your own people comes first; nationalism, when hate for people other than your own comes first." --Charles de Gaulle
: For myself, I have to agree with this. I am glad I live in an organized (sort of) nation, in which we have freedom of expression, religion and color.
: That still raises the question of what is meant by 'your own people'? Who are my "own people" ? I am not sure. Are they the people, who, by accident
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: Patriotism comes from being proud of the environment you are part of which in many ways represents what you are as part of a collective environment. A
: I know I'll get branded for being jingoistic or worse, but hell yeah, I'm uber-patriotic. I love this country, warts and all, I love the ideals that w
: I don't own anything remotely looking like a French flag, but I like seeing the colors on an Air France airliner or during a Patrouille de France show
: Not particularly, except when the Olympic Hockey Tournament (the real one: Men's) is on. I'm honest enough with myself that I do not feel inhibited i
: I love my country - I (unfortunately) strongly dislike my government. No longer patriotic, now severely pragmatic. Why? NDAA and the so-called "Patrio
: I actually go for Team Sweden because they have the most Redwings playing for them usually. Although all that will change since Olympic hockey won't
: I love my country and people, full stop. But that does not extend to dying for it -- or even flying the flag. I have no problem with quiet patrtiotism
: That's a real shame; I often worry what, if any, long term consequences will exist as a result of subjugating people's natural national pride. In Eur
: If you want to know what patriotism is and love for country, watch the John Adams HBO mini series. Yes I am patriotic.
: Absolutely! One of the best clips from the series... I love this one...gives me chills. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2FAAVPX-jg
: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E6caJ...eature=BFa&list=PL29E1EC9C3B28DB2E that one is especially good, when Adams meets Washington..."not generosi
: Wow with my spelling error (distruct) meant to say distrust - I am surprised I didn't have homeland security knocking on my door thinking I meant to
: Do you get a warm feeling in your chest when you hear the National Anthem play or watch the National wave. If you do.....thats a part of hidden patrio
: I actually can't remember all the lyrics ((in English) to "O Canada". French, no problem. But "O Canada"'s lyrics have been changed within the past 2
: Damn straight I do and its not hidden
: No, but I was quite proud of my fellow countrymen and women a number of years ago when they played the national anthem at an outdoor event, and they
: Everyone understands your point here of course. But patriotism is just one of the many emotional red herrings used to masquerade political agendas of
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: We as a country, are very patriotic! We sing the National Anthem on: Every Monday in the morning. Children from Kindergarten, and teens in high school