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Sandusky Verdict Reached, What's Next?  
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7210 posts, RR: 17
Posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1781 times:

Not much to say as we don't know more,

But I'm curious to know why Matt Sandusky hadn't come out more about it sooner. Do you think this will have an effect on the verdict?


Z


One of the FB admins for PHX Spotters. "Zach the Expat!"
25 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 1, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1764 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Thread starter):
Do you think this will have an effect on the verdict?

It kept the tickle monster off the stand, but that's about it. Apparently the abuse against Matt Sandusky is outside the statute of limitations since he was over 18.

Either way, it could be that feds are literally waiting outside with handcuffs to charge him with violating the Mann Act. Even if one dirty juror lets Sandusky off now, this isn't over.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineltbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13040 posts, RR: 12
Reply 2, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1755 times:

It may take a hour or so to go through the 48 counts and the Jury to give their vote on each count and be released to the media. It is possible Sandusky may not be convicted on some charges, some of the witnesses testimony and evidence may not be enough for some charges, but even Sandusky's lawyer suspects he will be convicted at least on some.

Today could be a huge 'doubleheader' with the conviction this afternoon of a Philadelphia Roman Catholic official by a jury today for 'child endangerment' for his part in the shifting of perverted priests to other parishes without telling those new parishes the new priest was a prevert but moved for 'health reasons'. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...%7Cdl3%7Csec1_lnk2%26pLid%3D172551
Apparently a list of priests who had over the years been moved for sexual abuse was located and finally brought out as evidence for the prosecution. This is a critical step in finally going after the cover ups of the Roman Catholic church and could lead to many more trials and badly convictions of church administrators for their deeply illegal and mortality sinful actions.

Hopefully a conviction on numerous counts of Sandusky and of the Philly church leader earlier today may be a turning point as to going after sexual abusers of children. Maybe many others will finally get justice metered out to them for their assaults and/or cover-ups, for their victims to get some relief, to make all children better educated not to be a victim and hopefully discourage others from such crimes.


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7210 posts, RR: 17
Reply 3, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1740 times:

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 2):


It may take a hour or so to go through the 48

Guilty. For some of it. That was fast.
USA Today says 45 counts, Bail revoked according to Fox News.



One of the FB admins for PHX Spotters. "Zach the Expat!"
User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8189 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1740 times:

45 Guilty
3 Not Guilty

He's going to die in prison.


User currently offlinekpitrrat From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 186 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1740 times:

Whats next? They start taking a closer look at the Mrs. and I wouldn't be surprised if the former Pres. and possibly AD. This isn't over...

User currently offlinecanoecarrier From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2839 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1731 times:

double post, Mods please delete

[Edited 2012-06-22 19:23:37]


The beatings will continue until morale improves
User currently offlinecanoecarrier From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2839 posts, RR: 12
Reply 7, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1729 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 1):
It kept the tickle monster off the stand, but that's about it.

That's almost as good of a quote as "it puts the lotion in the basket", well done.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 1):
Apparently the abuse against Matt Sandusky is outside the statute of limitations since he was over 18.

Unless it was rape, what exactly would Matt Sandusky have to say to make it a crime? There wouldn't be any statute of limitations would there?

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 2):
It is possible Sandusky may not be convicted on some charges, some of the witnesses testimony and evidence may not be enough for some charges, but even Sandusky's lawyer suspects he will be convicted at least on some.

Correct me if I'm wrong, the judge threw out 3 counts out of the 50 some that were against Sandusky before the jury had a chance to decide? It wouldn't surprise me if some came back innocent for lack of proof, but the majority came back guilty.

He's not the sharpest tool in the shed, which certainly didn't help his defense. He's a defense lawyers worst nightmare.

edit: as I post this I see he's guilty on 45 of 48 counts.



The beatings will continue until morale improves
User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8189 posts, RR: 8
Reply 8, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1705 times:

Quoting canoecarrier (Reply 6):
Unless it was rape, what exactly would Matt Sandusky have to say to make it a crime?

I think his going public after the jury started deliberations was simply an effort to make it clear that Sandusky was the monster that has been presented in court. It was a confirmation of the verdict before the verdict was reached.


User currently offlinesrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1702 times:

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 4):
45 Guilty
3 Not Guilty

He's going to die in prison.

From Penn State to the State Pen......

It's not a good sign when the defense attorneys were publicly stating earlier today that they didn't expect him to be acquitted.

I don't think there will be any additional trials on this in regards to him, as he's already going to be spending the rest of what's left of his wretched life in prison and tacking on additional sentences accomplishes nothing. Why waste the time and money to pursue further charges against him?


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 10, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 1669 times:

Quoting canoecarrier (Reply 7):
Unless it was rape, what exactly would Matt Sandusky have to say to make it a crime?

Nothing I think, the statute of limitations is expired, but I remembered it wrong in my earlier post.

Here's where I learned it:
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/06/...use-beyond-statute-of-limitations/

Quote:
Several questions were tweeted and emailed to me today about why the prosecution did not use these two witnesses. First, if I am reading Pennsylvania law correctly, both of these men are beyond the statute of limitations. Abuse that occurred under the age of 18 can only be prosecuted 10 years after the victim turns 18.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19411 posts, RR: 58
Reply 11, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1652 times:

What happens next? He goes to prison. And the other prisoners will likely not be kind. My guess is that those wishing for him to get a taste of his own medicine will get their wish.

User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 12, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1623 times:

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 11):
What happens next?

There should be a lot of what happens next. Sandusky is just the low hanging fruit of this scandal.

What should happen next is a systematic witch hunt to find and deal with every person, corporation and institution that ignored, allowed, or covered up Sandusky's crimes. And considering what we know already about the web of ties, financial or otherwise, among Penn State, its athletic department, Second Mile, various business ventures and donors, and perhaps even government itself the list of offenders and the process could be very, very long. I would say that a RICO case is not out of the question here, having been used against the Catholic Church.

Don't let anyone try and tell you that this isn't a Penn State scandal because it is. One man got convicted, but there are a lot of others responsible as well.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineltbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13040 posts, RR: 12
Reply 13, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1621 times:

What is next for Sandusky is he is in jail until the official sentencing in about 90 days. While he could get 60 years on all the counts, it may be reduced but still he will die in jail. He could also appeal the convictions on various factors and he probably has a few months to consider that or not.

What is also next:
Criminal prosecutions, already partially underway, as to Penn State officials and employees who didn't do their jobs.

Massive civil trials with victims and their lawyers seeing obscene millions, with too much to the lawyers that should go to the victims or to help other victims.

I suspect states will put in more substantial laws to reduce the opportunities of sexual predators in youth organizations and on the organizations themselves. Penn State and all other colleges in PA and elsewhere will probably put in stricter rules as to former employees access to facilities and mandate reporting of any sexual abuse or other crimes to police and no or only highly supervised youth programs on campus.

Hopefully more victims of sexual abuse will come out seeing that justice can happen.


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7210 posts, RR: 17
Reply 14, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1609 times:

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 13):
Criminal prosecutions, already partially underway, as to Penn State officials and employees who didn't do their jobs.
Quoting ltbewr (Reply 13):
Penn State and all other colleges in PA and elsewhere will probably put in stricter rules as to former employees access to facilities and mandate reporting of any sexual abuse or other crimes to police and no or only highly supervised youth programs on campus.
Quoting BMI727 (Reply 12):
And considering what we know already about the web of ties, financial or otherwise, among Penn State, its athletic department, Second Mile, various business ventures and donors, and perhaps even government itself the list of offenders and the process could be very, very long.

What about the athletic department? People were speculating that it could be shut down.



One of the FB admins for PHX Spotters. "Zach the Expat!"
User currently offlinekpitrrat From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 186 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1605 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 14):
What about the athletic department? People were speculating that it could be shut down.

They will not shut down the athletic department as a whole. Men's Volleyball had nothing to do with this. At least I think.

If there is still, somehow, some people that are still there from when these events occurred they will go after the individual.

2 things....

It is still Penn State.

They are still in the NCAA.


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 16, posted (2 years 1 month 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 1597 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 14):
What about the athletic department? People were speculating that it could be shut down.

I don't think they'll shut down the athletic department. A lot of people who worked there should lose their jobs and possibly face criminal charges.

The football team, however, should face the death penalty. I'd give them four years of no competition.

It is the extreme pride, value of tradition, and prestige that allowed the creation and maintenance of a culture that tacitly endorses child molestation for over a decade. These people cared more about their football team than about the fact that it was being used as a front for rape. Even still you have boosters and others who swear up and down that Paterno did nothing wrong and is a saint.

That culture needs to be completely and utterly obliterated. Total extermination. Remove all of that prestige and pride that justified child rape. I think in an earlier post I said that there needs to be something like denazification at Penn State. Every person associated with the university, team, Second Mile, Sandusky, or Paterno should have to account for everything they did or did not do during Sandusky's reign of terror. Proximity to this abuse and cover up cannot be stigmatized highly enough.

By the way, kudos to Piers Morgan for lighting Paterno on fire.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17351 posts, RR: 46
Reply 17, posted (2 years 1 month 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 1351 times:

What's the psychiatric take on people like Sandusky? I, perhaps naively, like to think that normally-functioning people don't molest children. Does someone that fits the mold of Sandusky know right from wrong? Know what they're doing is wrong? How much of this behavior is nature vs nurture so to speak?


E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlinekpitrrat From United States of America, joined Oct 2011, 186 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (2 years 1 month 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 1344 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 16):
The football team, however, should face the death penalty. I'd give them four years of no competition.

Ah yes, its the student athlete football players now that deserve to pay the price for others. This makes no sense whatsoever. If you want to erase the legacy of a school I am sorry but giving the football team the death penalty will not do what Sandusky has already accomplished. Im sure there recruiting is already in shambles because who wants to play for the team with such a stigma. I would even go as far to say that potential students may have changed their minds about going there as well. Contrary to what many believe, the University, its students, and alum are also victims in the sense that this guy tarnished something that they were always proud to be a part of. Any alum of any school are proud of their degree and their association with that institution. Now honest people who had nothing to do with this are suffering the consequences.

Obviously, this pain is nothing in comparison with what he did to the young men who have to live with that the rest of their lives, but I really do not see how giving the football team the death penalty makes any significant difference in the big scheme of things.


User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8189 posts, RR: 8
Reply 19, posted (2 years 1 month 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1319 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 12):
Don't let anyone try and tell you that this isn't a Penn State scandal because it is. One man got convicted, but there are a lot of others responsible as well.

WHile there may be more than one person involved it is not the entire school. The prosecutors are taking care of others that may have been in a cover-up and Penn State Juries have shown that they can take care of business.

For those not involved it is time to let them rebuild the school. Including athletic programs.

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 13):
Massive civil trials with victims and their lawyers seeing obscene millions, with too much to the lawyers that should go to the victims or to help other victims.

Lawyers get paid a percentage if they win, and nothing if they loose. That sound pretty bad until you realize that it is the only way most people can afford a lawyer.

Quoting kpitrrat (Reply 15):
It is still Penn State.

They are still in the NCAA.

And the NCAA needs to stay out of this mess. There are criminal and civil issues going on and the last thing we need is for a bunch of mis-guided do-gooders getting involved.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 16):
The football team, however, should face the death penalty. I'd give them four years of no competition.


I don't think the school itself (and the students and faculty who are not involved) should take any hits from the NCAA. The NCAA is famous for making the innocent pay while the rule breakers go without punishment.

One critical factor that the NCAA needs to remember - THEIR school could end up being in the same position that Penn State is in. The simply needs to be grateful that, this time, their schools have escaped the nightmare. So far.

Quoting kpitrrat (Reply 18):
Contrary to what many believe, the University, its students, and alum are also victims in the sense that this guy tarnished something that they were always proud to be a part of.

And this is where we need to be careful, not only for Penn State, but also for other schools who encounter a nightmare like Penn State saw.

I believe that the firings and the expanded prosecutions related to the Sandusky situation is more than sufficient for he students, employees and alum of the school to endure.

Now is the time to allow the leadership at Penn State to bring the school back to the standards that the state needs. From academics to sports the school needs to move back to excellence without further hinderance.


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 20, posted (2 years 1 month 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 1303 times:

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 19):
WHile there may be more than one person involved it is not the entire school.

The football team and a lot of the administrative staff certainly is.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 19):
The prosecutors are taking care of others that may have been in a cover-up and Penn State Juries have shown that they can take care of business.

For those not involved it is time to let them rebuild the school. Including athletic programs.

But there is the culture behind this that let this happen. People valued football over children. That needs to be burned to the ground.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 19):
I don't think the school itself (and the students and faculty who are not involved) should take any hits from the NCAA.

The football team was used as a front for child molestation and staff and administration knew about it and covered it up. That deserves the death penalty.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 19):
One critical factor that the NCAA needs to remember - THEIR school could end up being in the same position that Penn State is in.

They won't be if coaches and administrators do their jobs.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 19):
Now is the time to allow the leadership at Penn State to bring the school back to the standards that the state needs.

Good. They can get their house in order and start playing football again in four years.

Quoting kpitrrat (Reply 18):
I am sorry but giving the football team the death penalty will not do what Sandusky has already accomplished.

No it won't, but those involved need to be punished. And that includes the fans who stood on Paterno's lawn. All of them allowed it to happen and created a culture where football matters more than rape.

Quoting kpitrrat (Reply 18):
Contrary to what many believe, the University, its students, and alum are also victims in the sense that this guy tarnished something that they were always proud to be a part of. Any alum of any school are proud of their degree and their association with that institution. Now honest people who had nothing to do with this are suffering the consequences.

The honest ones would agree with me. But many, or maybe even most, are still wondering how covering up rape warrants firing a football coach.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlinestarbuk7 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 599 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (2 years 1 month 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 1266 times:

I just love the "lynch mob" mentality here.

If this was your school, or say it was LSU, Alabama, Florida State, Etc, Etc, would you be asking for the same types of things as "shut down the athletic dept." and other suggestions that have been made above.

Most of the people that went to school there have nothing to do with the athletic department but would cheer their teams as students at any other school.

Let the staff and alumni rebuild the reputation of the school, keep the NCAA morons out of the process.

This kind of situation could have happened at any school, and god forbid that it is happening at some other college. Let the judicial system put away the "bad apples" and let the rest of the staff and students move on and create a better environment at Penn State for all involved.


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 22, posted (2 years 1 month 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 1239 times:

Quoting starbuk7 (Reply 21):
If this was your school, or say it was LSU, Alabama, Florida State, Etc, Etc, would you be asking for the same types of things as "shut down the athletic dept." and other suggestions that have been made above.

I never said to shut down the athletic program, although they probably would be somewhat crippled while the conspirators are cleaned out.

But the answer to your question is yes, the same should have happen to any school with such a wide ranging conspiracy to protect a rapist. That said, I think a relatively small number of schools have the sort of culture, almost a cult really, that would allow such a thing.

Quoting starbuk7 (Reply 21):
Most of the people that went to school there have nothing to do with the athletic department but would cheer their teams as students at any other school.

They can start again in four years. Or transfer somewhere else.

Quoting starbuk7 (Reply 21):
Let the staff and alumni rebuild the reputation of the school, keep the NCAA morons out of the process.

If they wanted the NCAA morons out of the process they would have stopped Sandusky years ago. They didn't, and now they get to pay the price.

Of course, many of the alumni seem to still be trying to figure out why raping kids is bad.

Quoting starbuk7 (Reply 21):
Let the judicial system put away the "bad apples" and let the rest of the staff and students move on and create a better environment at Penn State for all involved.

The first four years of moving on can be without football. The culture that created an environment for Sandusky to operate unhindered has to be ended, period.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineltbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13040 posts, RR: 12
Reply 23, posted (2 years 1 month 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 1184 times:

As to the Penn State football program, almost all of the people in the upper level of the program are gone. Paterno died and replaced with a guy from the NFL's Patriots. I am quite sure most assistant and support persons are gone quitting or retiring or will be replaced by the new HC. I would presume the Athletic Director is gone or soon to be gone. Placing more penalties on the program would be counterproductive as well as unfair to the athletes themselves.

The NCAA should put in a strong policy on school sports programs mandating procedures as to reporting improper behaviors by student-athletes, sports programs and schools officials to do the right thing including mandating reporting to campus and local police as well as local prosecutors as necessary. 'Whistle blower' protections should be in place for those that report wrongdoing on campus. Cut the pay and excessive power of academic administrators and coaches. There needs to be strict rules on visitors, especially minors and former employees on campus facilities.


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 24, posted (2 years 1 month 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 1174 times:

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 23):
Placing more penalties on the program would be counterproductive as well as unfair to the athletes themselves.

Counterproductive to what? Preventing rape? Athletes can transfer, and I would hope they do to avoid the stigma that should be forever attached with Penn State football of this era.

There seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding here. Penn State as an institution is not a victim. They are not an innocent actor caught up in a bad situation. The university is a perpetrator that actively covered up and protected a rapist.

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 23):
The NCAA should put in a strong policy on school sports programs mandating procedures as to reporting improper behaviors by student-athletes, sports programs and schools officials to do the right thing including mandating reporting to campus and local police as well as local prosecutors as necessary.

There shouldn't have to be a policy. There are a lot of gray areas, but boys getting raped in the football building's showers is not one of them. They protected a predator and should be punished.

And here's another reason why they need the death penalty: it stops the healing narrative. You know exactly what is being set up by fans and the media. If Penn State wins football games it brings healing and helps everyone move on, as if winning games will somehow unrape permanently scarred men the way New Orleans was unflooded by the Saints winning. You can't allow the scandal and Paterno to become some sort of inspirational rallying cry, which is exactly what would happen when you listen to what some of their cretinous fans have said. There are still people who think Paterno did nothing wrong for God's sake! They think he's a martyr.

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 23):
excessive power of academic administrators and coaches.

That's why you enact the death penalty. It ends the culture of pride and prestige that allows football to be placed over children. Take the tradition and burn it to the ground and they can start from zero in a few years.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlinebristolflyer From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 2290 posts, RR: 0
Reply 25, posted (2 years 1 month 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 1150 times:

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 4):
He's going to die in prison

Hopefully sooner rather than later. This person has abused the trust put in him, he is of no use to society. He is a burden to the tax payer at this point.



Fortune favours the brave
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