Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Titanic II Deck Plans Released  
User currently offlineAloha717200 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4480 posts, RR: 15
Posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8630 times:

I continue to be surprised that this project is still moving forward.

Clive Palmer recently released the deck plans for the proposed Titanic II. You can see them here:

http://media.apnonline.com.au/73.2/i...tanicII_GA_12_07_2012_COLOUR_3.pdf

Midship section:

http://media.apnonline.com.au/73.2/i...II_6712_3210_1_Midship_Section.pdf

If you zoom in on the deck plans provided above, the first side view shows the layout of the original Titanic. Everything thereafter is Titanic II.

What's interesting is that the ship is going to be a meter wider than the original, and is also going to have one additional deck...a safety deck closer to the water line which wiill house lifeboats, among other things, bringing Titanic II in compliance with current regulations regarding height of lifeboats above the water line. This is similar to what was theorized would happen in the first Titanic II thread. There will also be an observation area located in the forward smoke stacks, and most impressive of all, the new deck plans reveal many of the elements of the original Titanic that will be retained. This includes the Grand Staircase, the opulent lounges, smoking and dining rooms, and even replica lifeboats in the places where the originals were housed. Take a look and see what details you can catch!

Here's an article to read about it:
http://news.yahoo.com/titanic-ii-saf...-says-aussie-tycoon-051013460.html


And the official press release:

http://www.bluestarline.com.au/media-20120717.html


Of particular note is the retention of 3rd class, as well as the retention of strict rules regarding which classes can use which facilities aboard the ship. I venture to guess that this will anger some who would like to explore every area of the ship, but we'll see if that would be enough to actually threaten the venture. Thoughts?

[Edited 2012-07-17 03:50:14]

47 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineflyingturtle From Switzerland, joined Oct 2011, 2389 posts, RR: 13
Reply 1, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8610 times:

Wait? What? Enough lifeboats? 

It would be great if they would also recreate the 1910's feeling. For example no news, except for radio-transmitted telegrams. Strict dress code. No cinema, except for silent movies. Appropriate demeanour both in- and outside of the suites.



Keeping calm is terrorism against those who want to live in fear.
User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21442 posts, RR: 53
Reply 2, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 8578 times:

Quoting flyingturtle (Reply 1):
Wait? What? Enough lifeboats?

That of course ruins the whole authentic atmosphere.   


User currently offlineAF1624 From France, joined Jul 2006, 658 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 8572 times:

Quoting flyingturtle (Reply 1):
It would be great if they would also recreate the 1910's feeling. For example no news, except for radio-transmitted telegrams. Strict dress code. No cinema, except for silent movies. Appropriate demeanour both in- and outside of the suites.

Totally agree on that. No movie theaters, no swimming pools, but instead a smoking lounge, a classic gym, etc.

The big problem is, today's rich people aren't at all prepared to pay big amounts of money for that. The guys who roll in gold-plated Porsches and Lambos don't really dig "sober".



Cheers
User currently offlinena From Germany, joined Dec 1999, 10709 posts, RR: 9
Reply 4, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 8564 times:

No flip-flops, no shorts.

This detail will look very odd, not so say ugly: replica lifeboats on the upper deck, but real, modern lifeboats down below where todays regulations require them (and likely white and orange arranged in the black hull!).

I doubt this Titanic II will happen. Bound to sink before the keel is laid.


User currently offlineeinsteinboricua From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2010, 3060 posts, RR: 8
Reply 5, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 8541 times:

I'm actually looking forward to it being built. Might be a money maker. I'd pay to travel in one of the cabins (though with my luck it may sink on its maiden voyage as well)   


"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
User currently offlinePs76 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 8540 times:

Hi!

Quoting na (Reply 4):
I doubt this Titanic II will happen. Bound to sink before the keel is laid.

I would have to agree with this. My personal opinion is that it's a terrible idea to make a recreation of a ship which went down in such a tragedy. And to make money off the publicity of people losing their lives is a bit sick (although James Cameron did it as do many Titanic book and DVD makers).

But honestly cruise ships of today are much more comfortable. And maybe some people would be interested but being in a successor/replica to a ship with so many dead would freak me out.

Many thanks.

Pierre


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21571 posts, RR: 55
Reply 7, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8475 times:

Will the deck chairs be fixed in place, or will it be possible to move them around and change their configuration?

Quoting AF1624 (Reply 3):
no swimming pools

Didn't the original Titanic have a pool? Not an outdoor one like current cruise liners, but one tucked away down in the bowels of the ship.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlinetxjim From United States of America, joined May 2008, 241 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 8463 times:

I must be missing something but I don't understand their customer base. If you have ample cash, there are plenty of high-end liners with better ammenities and low passanger counts. If you need to pay for a third class ticket you are most likely going to be on a Carnival cruise participating in belly-flop competitions.

I can see a certain segment trying this once but the current breed of cruise ships, both small luxiory and mega-ships for the masses, have evolved to meet vastly different customer demands.


User currently offlineoldeuropean From Germany, joined May 2005, 2090 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 8450 times:

Quoting txjim (Reply 8):
I must be missing something but I don't understand their customer base. If you have ample cash, there are plenty of high-end liners with better ammenities and low passanger counts. If you need to pay for a third class ticket you are most likely going to be on a Carnival cruise participating in belly-flop competitions.

I can see a certain segment trying this once but the current breed of cruise ships, both small luxiory and mega-ships for the masses, have evolved to meet vastly different customer demands.

  

Yep, exactly my thoughts. If ever realised, this project will be a big flop.



Wer nichts weiss muss alles glauben
User currently offlinezkojq From New Zealand, joined Sep 2011, 1187 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 8413 times:

I fail to see a business case. Who really wants to spend days at sea in a cruise ship whose interior is not much better than one from the 1910s, named after an ocean liner that sunk killing most of its passengers? And why would anyone want to be a steerage passenger? Sure Titanic's first class interior would be very elegant (i'm thinking of the grand stairway in particular), but I think passengers would get sick of a lack of modern amenities pretty quickly. In my view is that the only possible way this ship will ever get built is if some eccentric billionaire takes over the project and turns it into their private yacht.

Quoting Mir (Reply 7):
Didn't the original Titanic have a pool? Not an outdoor one like current cruise liners, but one tucked away down in the bowels of the ship.

Yes:
http://dianaoverbey.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/pool.jpg

Quoting oldeuropean (Reply 9):
Yep, exactly my thoughts. If ever realised, this project will be a big flop.

  



Air New Zealand; first to commercially fly the Boeing 787-9. ZK-NZE, NZ103 AKL-SYD, 2014/08/09. I was 83rd to board.
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Reply 11, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 8387 times:

Quoting Aloha717200 (Thread starter):
I continue to be surprised that this project is still moving forward.

I would not go sailing on that thing for the life of me.
Who would want to go sailing on a Chinese built Titanic 2?

The money would be much better spent refitting the QE2 to present standards maybe in a joint ownership with the Dubai company and sailing her around the world for the joy of all her fans and former passengers.

     



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7293 posts, RR: 5
Reply 12, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 13 hours ago) and read 8363 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 11):
Who would want to go sailing on a Chinese built Titanic 2?

I'm guessing a hell of a lot more people than would want to sail on

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 11):
the QE2

You just don't appear to understand the QE2's time was well and truly up, if Carnival thought that they could still make money on her they would have refitted QE2 themselves and used her as a running mate for Queen Mary, instead they built Queen Victoria and Queen Elizabeth, ships which are much cheaper to operate and offer what people want today.

Carnival is not a not for profit organisation running museum ships for older folks who want to remember days past.


User currently offlineLarshjort From Denmark, joined Dec 2007, 1454 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 8362 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 11):
Who would want to go sailing on a Chinese built Titanic 2?

It can't be worse than the original from Belfast.

/Lars



139, 306, 319, 320, 321, 332, 34A, AN2, AT4, AT5, AT7, 733, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 146, AR1, BH2, CN1, CR2, DH1, DH3, DH4,
User currently offlineeinsteinboricua From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2010, 3060 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 8352 times:

Let's look at it this way: why would I spend thousands of dollars crossing the Atlantic on the Queen Mary 2 and spend days at sea when for loads less I can have the same crossing in less than 8 hours?

Why listen to 60s, 70s, and 80s music when today there are dozens of radio stations with modern music?

Why sail on the Mississippi River in a river boat when you can sail in a yacht?

Why fly with Southwest when you can travel first class with a legacy?

I like seeing how people think that because THEY don't like it it means no one else will. I would be willing to pay and go across the Atlantic (assuming its withing reach) recreating the 1910s atmosphere. That's the whole focus of this ship: recreating an old era. Those who purchase a ticket know they will be away from modern technology (and if people like to camp, go hiking, etc, then this shouldn't be much of a problem). I think some people might like to go on a fantasy cruise like this. The question is whether the ship will be profitable enough to continue the themed voyage.

Quoting zkojq (Reply 10):
And why would anyone want to be a steerage passenger?

This is perhaps the only thing they should have to change...eliminate many (if not all) of the third class accommodations and increase the number of 1st/2nd class staterooms. Modern day staterooms resemble mostly 2nd class staterooms anyway while suites resemble the 1st class ones.

Also, I think the segregation might be a bit too much and I don't see that rule lasting too long.



"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6609 posts, RR: 9
Reply 15, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 8340 times:

Yeah, especially the 3rd class and segregation seem a bad idea. They could have bigger salons to compensate for more people, and of course a strict dress code.


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlinePellegrine From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2437 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 8320 times:

I'd like a ride in one of the huge suites on B deck with the private promenade with maybe 3 friends...

I don't like the separate class structure; that part of this idea is a nonstarter. Why would anyone want to travel in 3rd class...that was for emigrants back in the day...not holiday travelers. I think they'll quickly revisit this idea, and eliminate separate classes.

Quoting Larshjort (Reply 13):

It can't be worse than the original from Belfast.

   +The Chinese make excellent ships.



oh boy!!!
User currently offlinenonrevman From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1297 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 8274 times:

Third class does seem more like a prison than a vacation in today's environment. In order to sell these accommodations, I think the price would have to be very low. It would have to be a price that allows someone who could not afford a modern day ship or coach class on an airplane to be able to cross the Atlantic. Those people would not be paying for the Titanic historical steerage experience, they are there because that is the only way they could afford to travel.

I figure even 1st and 2nd class would have to be discounted in order to sell. You cannot compare the luxury of the original Titanic to that of the modern day cruise experience. First and second classes are going to have to be affordable to the middle class.

I agree that separating the classes is not a good idea. Why would you buy a ticket on this thing and not be able to see the grand stairway and other areas that would appeal to a Titanic buff?

This whole thing could work, but price is the key.


User currently offlineAloha717200 From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 4480 posts, RR: 15
Reply 18, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 8265 times:

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 14):
I like seeing how people think that because THEY don't like it it means no one else will. I would be willing to pay and go across the Atlantic (assuming its withing reach) recreating the 1910s atmosphere. That's the whole focus of this ship: recreating an old era.

  

Exactly. Those who are wondering why anyone would bother going on this ship forget the massive amount of interest, worldwide, in the Titanic story. It's not just about people dying...it's much deeper than that. Titanic is a legend in people's minds..you have this elegant, beautiful ship, that represents a bygone era of extravagance and innovation that time has truly passed by.

Titanic was unique, in size and features, cutting edge for her time. Her replacement, Britannic, never saw passenger service, and was sunk during WWI. Olympic was the last of this class of ship to remain, and was broken up in the 1930s to provide jobs to Newcastle-area poor. People, to this day, travel to Newcastle to see the salvaged fittings of Olympic, which exist in several establishments in the area. People travel tto Belfast to see the Titanic museum built next to Titanic's original slipway. You have the movies, of course, the books, the widespread public fascination with Titanic survivor stories and new discoveries made on dives to the wreck. In a way, the legend of Titanic has far surpassed the idea of it merely being a ship...it goes beyond fittings and furnishings and comparison to competing ships...it's about reclaiming Atlantis...people. Titanic is the nautical equivalent to the lost city of Atlantis, and while I believe Atlantis is purely fiction, it's the idea of reclaiming something that seemed to be lost forever that captivates people the most.

We want what we can't have...and that legendary ship has been on the bottom of the sea for 100 years...lost to all but those who have the equipment to dive there. This ship gives people a chance to experience the legend first hand...beyond a 50% scale replica, beyond a movie, this time people get to walk Titanic's decks...and THAT is why tickets will sell.

The question is...once the novelty wears off, how long will people tolerate 3rd class cabins? And I expect that class segregation wouldn't go over well at all. Because for most people, being aboard Titanic would be akin to being in a museum...and you'd want to see all of the artifacts, especially the ones that are roped off and restricted.


My guess is, this venture is highly successful for about 10 years. After which time, the ship will either need a retrofit to reduce the number of 3rd class cabins, or will be moored somewhere as a floating tourist attraction, with all access permitted at that time.

That said, according to the diagrams, all cabins and staterooms are going to be modernized...this means your Titanic voyage will probably include wifi and a flat screen TV. I'm okay with that, as long as they keep the carpeting, furniture, upholstery, and architectural workings true to the original. It's about the "theme".


User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7293 posts, RR: 5
Reply 19, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 8258 times:

Quoting Pellegrine (Reply 16):
+The Chinese make excellent ships.

There I have to disagree with you, the Chinese make cheap ships, they don't build them with anywhere near the same level of quality as the Koreans or Japanese. The Chinese have never built a large passenger vessel, these are very complex vessels, which are difficult to build, it takes experience to build them correctly, look at the mess Linton Ingalls made of Pride of America, she had to be towed to Lloyd Verft in Germany to fix all the mistakes.

I like the idea behind this project, but it has to be built cheaply (I guess) to make it viable, hence the reason why none of the 4 major cruise/ferry yards in Europe haven't been selected to build her.


User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7293 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 8248 times:

Quoting Aloha717200 (Reply 18):
Her replacement, Britannic, never saw passenger service, and was sunk during WWI.

Britanic wasn't her replacement, White Star always planned to build three ships.


User currently offlinekasimir From Netherlands Antilles, joined Jun 2011, 123 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 8236 times:

Don't like the idea either and if they gonna keep it as original as possible, lots of people will realize how unromantic the Titanic really was/is and this will flop in the end.

The only interesting business case I can think off, is to have it operate on 1-3 day coastal cruises for some nostalgic people as a floating museum. But operate this on transatlantic cruises or other 7+ day cruises will be the death penalty for this ship, because most passengers will get bored to death at some point.

Crossing the transatlantic on a modern cruise ship is already very very boring, I know that from experience!


User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19574 posts, RR: 58
Reply 22, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 8202 times:

Quoting Aloha717200 (Thread starter):
Of particular note is the retention of 3rd class, as well as the retention of strict rules regarding which classes can use which facilities aboard the ship. I venture to guess that this will anger some who would like to explore every area of the ship, but we'll see if that would be enough to actually threaten the venture. Thoughts?

Now THAT is unexpected.

Quoting zkojq (Reply 10):
And why would anyone want to be a steerage passenger?

Yeah, that's the big question. Even aboard modern Cunard ships, there is a sort of First Class and Second Class ("Grills" vs. regular) but even then, it really only has to do with dinner seating and cabin luxury. Both classes otherwise have the run of the passenger areas of the ship.

Quoting zkojq (Reply 10):
I fail to see a business case. Who really wants to spend days at sea in a cruise ship whose interior is not much better than one from the 1910s, named after an ocean liner that sunk killing most of its passengers?

I can actually think of a lot of people. Titanic is nothing short of legendary. How much money did Robert Ballard and friends spend finding her wreck? Why? I can imagine quite a few people who would love to experience what it would have been like to walk her decks.

What I can't imagine, as you pointed out, is why anyone would pay for a third-class ticket that would restrict their movements around the ship. Given that ships are no longer simply a means of transportation (that's what planes are for), the idea of a "Steerage" class makes no sense at all. What's the point of booking a ticket aboard this ship and not being able to ascend the Grand Staircase?

Quoting zkojq (Reply 10):
Sure Titanic's first class interior would be very elegant (i'm thinking of the grand stairway in particular), but I think passengers would get sick of a lack of modern amenities pretty quickly.

AFAIK, she will have modern amenities (toilets, showers, etc.) at least in first and second class. Not sure if Third Class would have shared facilities.

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 12):
You just don't appear to understand the QE2's time was well and truly up, if Carnival thought that they could still make money on her they would have refitted QE2 themselves and used her as a running mate for Queen Mary, instead they built Queen Victoria and Queen Elizabeth, ships which are much cheaper to operate and offer what people want today.

   In fact, Carnival (and their subsidiary Cunard) saw a market for one and only one transatlantic ocean liner, and that is Queen Mary 2, the only true ocean liner left in service. The rest of their vessels are cruise ships. Is it sad? I suppose. So was the retirement of the L-1011 from passenger service. But ocean liners, once the only way to get across an ocean, have been supplanted by jet aircraft. There is simply no need for more ocean liners.


User currently offlinePellegrine From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 2437 posts, RR: 8
Reply 23, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 8187 times:

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 19):

There I have to disagree with you, the Chinese make cheap ships, they don't build them with anywhere near the same level of quality as the Koreans or Japanese. The Chinese have never built a large passenger vessel, these are very complex vessels, which are difficult to build, it takes experience to build them correctly, look at the mess Linton Ingalls made of Pride of America, she had to be towed to Lloyd Verft in Germany to fix all the mistakes.

Hmm well, most of the world's cargo ships are Chinese-built nowadays. Few have problems such as you have described. Ask the Koreans and especially the Japanese how their shipbuilding business is going.  

Of course the Blue Star Line could very well choose to build it with Chantiers d'Atlantique or Odense Shipyard, but they'd pay $$$$ more.

At any rate, this ship couldn't easily suffer the same fate as it will be welded, instead of riveted, and have sealed bulkheads.



oh boy!!!
User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7293 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (2 years 1 month 1 week 6 days 8 hours ago) and read 8153 times:

Quoting Pellegrine (Reply 23):

Hmm well, most of the world's cargo ships are Chinese-built nowadays. Few have problems such as you have described. Ask the Koreans and especially the Japanese how their shipbuilding business is going.

Boy are you wrong, the Chinese yards at the moment aren't doing so well, many yards are in trouble, the Koreans are picking up all the high value orders like drill ships, fpso's, lng carriers, by value the Koreans take over 40% of the market, the Japanese are making inroads into the cruise business and still build nearly all the ships required by Japanese owners. The Chinese build basic ships like bulkers, tankers and box carriers.


25 einsteinboricua : And even the Queen Mary 2 is occasionally taken out from transatlantic voyages into round the world cruises or destination (Caribbean, Mediterranean,
26 Post contains images Braybuddy : I would say fixed. Heaven forbid that they'd be able to rearrange the deckchairs on the Titanic 2 . . . Pity the ship is a metre wider. It looks noti
27 Post contains images flyingturtle : It's the anti-ice armor.
28 DocLightning : And radar and enough lifeboats. The primary failure with the Titanic disaster was that they were violating one of the basic rules of navigation: Proc
29 einsteinboricua : Ah, but evasive action could have been taken very early in the day. Plenty of warnings were relayed to Titanic. Even a couple of hours before, the SS
30 Post contains links DocLightning : To be more precise, proper precautions could have been taken earlier in the day. Titanic is said to have cruised at around 21kt, and she was proceedi
31 type-rated : They are making so many modifications to the planned ship will it be anything at all like the original? After spending a ton of money in the planning
32 Pellegrine : I'm talking sheer numbers not final value. The Koreans build a majority of ships for the petroleum industry yes. However, you will find that a lot of
33 einsteinboricua : It can't be an exact replica. By today's' standards, the first and most important modification is the addition of enough lifeboats for the passengers
34 prebennorholm : Odense Shipyard closed down on 26th November last year. 3000 specially invited guests attended the big "close down party" as the last new-built ship
35 DocLightning : Lots, actually. The majority of ships in service don't have azipods. Most freighters/tankers still use fixed screws, for example. Not only that, but
36 kiwirob : Not true, for example the Stena Drill MAX's and Drill MAX ICE were all built and fitted out in Korea. But not all of it, and according to Clarkson's
37 DocLightning : On modern cruise ships, aren't most of the rooms and fixtures done remotely and then installed as modules?
38 DarkSnowyNight : I don't know about that... A meter wider makes it less proportionally different to the original than the 707/27/37/57 was to the KC-135 series. And I
39 Pellegrine : Too bad for Denmark. I had no idea... Moeller was a good man.
40 Aloha717200 : I doubt you'll be able to see the difference when the ship's at the dock...we're only talking 3 feet of difference here. I'm actually liking the idea
41 kiwirob : Rooms yes, that's pretty easy they just plug in, but that's for a modern ship, this one is being built as a Titanic replica, I don't think they will
42 Aloha717200 : Maybe, though. The plans do say that the rooms will be enlarged and modernized, so perhaps they can accommodate this kind of construction method. I g
43 MD11Engineer : Also, where would you get the 300+ stokers and coal trimmewrs to do the back breaking and dangerous job of firing the boilers? Jan
44 Post contains images DocLightning : China, duh! Not sure. The key word is "replica." In other words, if it looks legit to the passengers, that's what matters in the end. I don't think m
45 ghifty : This is silly. Cool, but silly. Gives me hope that someone will take on an L-1011 and fly it around (at much cheaper cost!)! Hm.. also, the original T
46 Post contains links and images DocLightning : It's worse than that. The center propeller was mounted on the midline so that the rudder was built around that prop with a central aperture for the p
47 DocLightning : BTW, nitpicking, but the 'berg struck them on the starboard bow. They were trying to turn to port.
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
WTC Plans Released! posted Tue Jul 16 2002 19:41:57 by Rai
Prepaid Cell Plans, Part II posted Tue Jan 11 2005 22:20:00 by RNOcommctr
Titanic II Gets Closer To Reality posted Tue Jun 19 2012 09:30:12 by Aloha717200
Land Rover Discovery II - Should I Buy? posted Sun Dec 5 2010 17:23:00 by richm
Tax Break For Employer Health Plans A Target Again posted Sun Nov 28 2010 13:03:03 by Ken777
Titanic, Shuttle And 9-11. Only Time Will Tell. posted Wed Sep 15 2010 17:56:34 by mirrodie
Lohan Released From Jail; Checks Into Rehab posted Mon Aug 2 2010 08:00:38 by einsteinboricua
Bundesliga Playing Schedule 2010/2011 Released posted Mon Jul 5 2010 05:41:58 by Sabena332
Movie 'Airplane' Released 30 Years Ago posted Sun Jul 4 2010 07:20:28 by Ltbewr
Queen Elizabeth II Likely To Visit Ireland In 2011 posted Wed Jun 23 2010 10:48:19 by EISHN