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Scanning Photo IDs?  
User currently offlineAlnessW From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 620 posts, RR: 1
Posted (2 years 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 3037 times:

So after work on Friday I went to the 7-Eleven nearby our office for a Slurpee on my way home. When I went over to the register to pay, I noticed a decal on the counter that said something along the lines of this: "If you are buying age-restricted products, please have your photo ID ready to be checked and scanned."

I was trying to think if I had ever heard of this practice before of scanning photo IDs. I assumed that store clerks only check the date of birth on IDs before selling such products, but it seems as though some places do scan the barcode to check for authenticity. Is this fairly common, or not?

Certainly I've noticed the barcodes on the back of driver's licenses before, but I never knew what they were for, as I've never seen them scanned. What exactly does a clerk see when they scan someone's ID? The same info that's printed on the card?

Thanks!  

35 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13088 posts, RR: 12
Reply 1, posted (2 years 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 3029 times:

This is not an uncommon practice for some nightclubs to keep out minors. For stores, they need methods to make sure all sales of age restricted products (mainly tobacco, alcoholic beverages) are only to those of legal age to prevent loss of licenses and fines. I do have problems with 'scanning' policies as some may not have drivers' licenses or state issued equivalent ID, that it can trace purchases by a particular purchaser, used for marketing purposes and general invasion of privacy issues.

User currently offlineQFA380 From Australia, joined Jul 2005, 2062 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (2 years 2 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 3000 times:

A large number of places here do this, in particular clubs. I think some venues who have come to the attention of the government for underage drinking have been forced to use them. Allows them to effectively ban troublemakers too.
Many bars however won't be able to afford them and prefer to give bouncers the ability to let hot, mature looking girls in if they want to.

I've never seen them in a booze shop before though, it's easy enough to get an older person to buy alcohol and smokes for you.


User currently onlinevhqpa From Australia, joined Jul 2005, 1456 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (2 years 2 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 2964 times:

In the Northern Territory it is compulsory to have your I.D. scanned upon purchase as part of the intervention policy. wiki



Quoting QFA380 (Reply 2):
A large number of places here do this, in particular clubs.

I notice this a few months ago. In sort of in two minds about it. I'm all for making venues more safer. But in the age of identify theft I'm concerned that someone might be able to access my personal information.



"There you go ladies and gentleman we're through Mach 1 the speed of sound no bumps no bangs... CONCORDE"
User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13088 posts, RR: 12
Reply 4, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2943 times:

Quoting vhqpa (Reply 3):
Quoting QFA380 (Reply 2):A large number of places here do this, in particular clubs.
I notice this a few months ago. In sort of in two minds about it. I'm all for making venues more safer. But in the age of identify theft I'm concerned that someone might be able to access my personal information.

Potential privacy issues with such scanners including at clubs, to enter certain governemnt or private buildings as well as retailers like for cigarettes and alcohol is using the infomation to steal idenity, for attractive women to be 'stalked' by bouncers or staff of such places with their home addresses.


User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12242 posts, RR: 35
Reply 5, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2942 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting AlnessW (Thread starter):
Certainly I've noticed the barcodes on the back of driver's licenses before, but I never knew what they were for, as I've never seen them scanned. What exactly does a clerk see when they scan someone's ID? The same info that's printed on the card?

In a different venue, the barcode also makes it much easier for a cop to give you a traffic ticket   Scan the barcode/magnet stripe (depending on state), scan the barcode on the registration (if your state has it...mine does). This should (should, not will) enter all the required information about the driver and vehicle into the computer.



911, where is your emergency?
User currently offlineplaneguy727 From United States of America, joined Mar 2007, 1247 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 2931 times:

Depending on the scanner it won't be able to store information, etc. For example, I work with bars near my workplace on issues of preventing underage persons from using fake ids. We recommended a scanner that only displays the DOB as coded on the ID and verify with the listed date on the front. Combined with asking the person it's a fairly easy system to run and avoids the privacy concerns. Plus it's not connected to a database and does not store information locally to the device. Just a reader really.

This way the business can address liability concerns, prevent fines, etc while also respecting the privacy of patrons.



I want to live in an old and converted 727...
User currently offlineRedTailDTW From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 754 posts, RR: 3
Reply 7, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 2879 times:

I work at Target and we are infamous for being the only big box retailer to physically swipe/scan the barcode on your ID for purchases of alcohol, nicotine patches and gum, certain over-the-counter medications, compressed air, and mature rated (ESRB-M) video games.

Target doesn't keep any information from your ID when we swipe it, it is just a more secure and faster way to verify your age. Instead of the cashier doing the math, they just swipe it and the register automatically approves the birth date. It also eliminates the risk of losing our liquor license if someone messes up. The only time this becomes an issue is when we have an elderly guest that isn't used to showing it anymore since we have no option other than to swipe/scan an ID.

However, any returns that we process using your ID (in the case you lost your receipt and we are unable to locate it on your payment card) do stay in our systems just to keep track of how much you return because we have a $70 limit on returns using ID's every 12 months so it is a way to keep track of that, nothing more.


- Mason



Northwest Airlines. Now you're flying smart! (RIP 1926-2009)
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6616 posts, RR: 9
Reply 8, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 2857 times:

I guess an advantage to having a national ID system is that if you wanted to add a barcode/magnetic strip/chip (probably the latter since it's a French invention) on it everyone in the country would be concerned. On the other hand our IDs are quite hard to fake and only criminals/spies would have fake ones.


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineGEEZER From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 1479 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 2853 times:

[quote=RedTailDTW,reply=7 The only time this becomes an issue is when we have an elderly guest that isn't used to showing it anymore since we have no option other than to swipe/scan an ID.
[/quote]


The next time you have this happen, just say "look you old goat, just "suck it up" and give me your damned drivers license..........there are other people waiting to pay" !

Charley



Stupidity: Doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result; Albert Einstein
User currently offlineeurowings From UK - England, joined Sep 2011, 298 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 2837 times:

That's interesting, I am sure clubs/shops in the UK would love to be able to scan IDs since, unlike a lot of European countries, the penalties are very severe for underage sales and "testers" are routinely used. The actual cashier/bartender gets a fine as well as the holder of the alcohol license.

However, they physically can't. Our driving licenses simply aren't machine readable, in fact some older drivers only have pieces of paper! No national ID card, so the only other Government ID is a passport, which virtually no one carries around since they are expensive and difficult to replace. Basically the only form of 'proper' ID is a full or provisional driving license, since most places won't accept student ID due to forgeries.


User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12242 posts, RR: 35
Reply 11, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 2836 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting RedTailDTW (Reply 7):
The only time this becomes an issue is when we have an elderly guest that isn't used to showing it anymore since we have no option other than to swipe/scan an ID.

Does it have the option to both scan or swipe? Since some states have one and some have the other...

How about foreigners? How is that handled since I have never seen a "smart" drivers license outside the US.

Quoting GEEZER (Reply 9):
The next time you have this happen, just say "look you old goat, just "suck it up" and give me your damned drivers license..........there are other people waiting to pay" !

  



911, where is your emergency?
User currently offlineRedTailDTW From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 754 posts, RR: 3
Reply 12, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 2789 times:

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 11):
How about foreigners? How is that handled since I have never seen a "smart" drivers license outside the US.

I get ID's from places in Mexico and Canada rather frequently. We still have the option to enter the birth date in manually but it takes a few moments since the supervisor needs to come verify the ID and override the prompt.

We just don't do it if we don't have to since the main way is so much faster and more precise.


- Mason



Northwest Airlines. Now you're flying smart! (RIP 1926-2009)
User currently offlineMaverick623 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 5601 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 2778 times:

Quoting eurowings (Reply 10):
the penalties are very severe for underage sales and "testers" are routinely used. The actual cashier/bartender gets a fine as well as the holder of the alcohol license.

Arizona started going crazy about that stuff a few years ago. For a while at some places, not only was my ID swiped, but I had to sign a receipt saying that I was 21 or older, to try to limit the liability of both the server and the establishment.



"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12242 posts, RR: 35
Reply 14, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 2755 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting RedTailDTW (Reply 12):
I get ID's from places in Mexico and Canada rather frequently. We still have the option to enter the birth date in manually but it takes a few moments since the supervisor needs to come verify the ID and override the prompt.

Ah gotcha, so there is a way, albeit a harder one. Makes sense  



911, where is your emergency?
User currently offlinefr8mech From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 5400 posts, RR: 14
Reply 15, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2729 times:

I've been trying, off and on, to get information on exactly what information is encoded on the back of my drivers' license. I really haven't tried too hard, it should be public knowledge.

I was taken a bit by surprise a month or so ago when my doctor's office asked for my ID and scanned it (they just got some new patient tracking software). I asked the receptionist what data it transferred over: name, address, DOB.

I wonder what else is there?



When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
User currently offlinealoha73g From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2362 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2683 times:

Many of these issues with ID scanning & what data is in the barcode on your driver's license were recently addressed in the "Kokua Line" (consumer advocate) section of the Honolulu Star-Advertiser. This information is obviously specific to Hawai'i, but I'm sure other states are similar:

http://www.staradvertiser.com/newspr..._already_visible.html?id=165108196

Quote:
Question: What data is embedded in our driver's licenses? When renewing a license, the clerk is inputting a great deal of data into the computer. Our license has a "hidden" box which lets electronic data screeners identify individuals (and heaven knows what else). In this day and age of ID theft, it's important for the public to know what personal data they are carrying in their wallets/purses.

Answer: Hawaii does not have an embedded chip in its driver's licenses.

Instead, Hawaii driver's licenses have a bi-dimensional bar code on the back, and what you see on the front is what you get when you scan the bar code.

"The 2-D bar code on the back of the card contains the same information that is printed on the front of the card," said Dennis Kamimura, administrator of the city Motor Vehicle and Licensing Division. Nothing more, he said.

Other states might have additional information — such as emergency medical and contact information that is not found on the front of the card — embedded in a microchip.

"Hawaii's card does not have a chip, and the only information in the bi-dimensional bar code is the information printed on the front of the card," Kamimura said.

The smaller, linear bar code on the back contains the driver's license number.

Protections Against Scanning

Gov. Neil Abercrombie has signed into law Senate Bill 2419, which allows businesses to scan personal information on driver's licenses and state ID cards "for limited purposes only." See is.gd/l2vAD3.

The ACLU of Hawaii has posted information on its website — is.gd/b0T7Kq — explaining the law, saying it "better protects your privacy by banning private businesses from scanning your driver's license and collecting, storing, using and/or sharing the personal information contained in the barcode, except in limited circumstances."

Before the law was passed, there were no such restrictions.

According to the ACLU, "When permitted, a business may collect ONLY your name, address, date of birth, and license number or ID card number."

It says a local business may scan driver's license bar codes only in certain circumstances:

» To verify a customer's age when there is a reasonable doubt that he/she is 18 or older when buying age-restricted goods or services, including alcohol, cigarettes, Nicorette gum, mature video games or cold medicines.

» To verify identity and authenticity of the identification when a customer pays for something with a credit or debit card, returns an item or requests a refund or an exchange.

» To prevent fraud when a customer seeks a refund or exchange and the business uses a fraud prevention service.

» When the business is establishing or maintaining a contract with you, such as a cellphone plan contract.

The ACLU says it knows of nine stores/companies in Hawaii currently affected by the law: Famous Footwear, Victoria's Secret, Finish Line, 7-Eleven, Best Buy, Target, Walmart, Verizon and AT&T. If you know of others, contact the ACLU at 522-5900 or at www.acluhawaii.org.

If you think your license is being scanned illegally, contact the state Office of Consumer Protection at hawaii.gov/dcca/ocp; and/or the state Office of Information Practices, www.state.hi.us/oip; or the ACLU.

-Aloha!



Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
User currently offlinemke717spotter From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 2454 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 2660 times:

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 2):
I think some venues who have come to the attention of the government for underage drinking have been forced to use them.

Nowadays most fake IDs for underage kids scan anyways so I'm not sure if this helps much.



Will you watch the Cleveland Browns and the Detroit Lions on Sunday? Only if coach Eric Mangini resigned after a loss.
User currently offlineAlnessW From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 620 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2634 times:

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 1):
I do have problems with 'scanning' policies as some may not have drivers' licenses or state issued equivalent ID, that it can trace purchases by a particular purchaser, used for marketing purposes and general invasion of privacy issues.
Quoting vhqpa (Reply 3):
But in the age of identify theft I'm concerned that someone might be able to access my personal information.
Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 4):
Potential privacy issues with such scanners including at clubs, to enter certain governemnt or private buildings as well as retailers like for cigarettes and alcohol is using the infomation to steal idenity, for attractive women to be 'stalked' by bouncers or staff of such places with their home addresses.

You all make very good points there.

Quoting vhqpa (Reply 3):
In the Northern Territory it is compulsory to have your I.D. scanned upon purchase as part of the intervention policy.

Varies country to country, I assume.

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 5):
In a different venue, the barcode also makes it much easier for a cop to give you a traffic ticket Scan the barcode/magnet stripe (depending on state), scan the barcode on the registration (if your state has it...mine does). This should (should, not will) enter all the required information about the driver and vehicle into the computer.

Oh boy.  
Quoting planeguy727 (Reply 6):
Depending on the scanner it won't be able to store information, etc. For example, I work with bars near my workplace on issues of preventing underage persons from using fake ids. We recommended a scanner that only displays the DOB as coded on the ID and verify with the listed date on the front. Combined with asking the person it's a fairly easy system to run and avoids the privacy concerns. Plus it's not connected to a database and does not store information locally to the device. Just a reader really.

Interesting to know, thanks for sharing!

Quoting RedTailDTW (Reply 7):
I work at Target and we are infamous for being the only big box retailer to physically swipe/scan the barcode on your ID for purchases of alcohol, nicotine patches and gum, certain over-the-counter medications, compressed air, and mature rated (ESRB-M) video games.

Wow, I never knew Target scanned IDs. Then again, what do I know!  
Quoting RedTailDTW (Reply 7):
Target doesn't keep any information from your ID when we swipe it, it is just a more secure and faster way to verify your age. Instead of the cashier doing the math, they just swipe it and the register automatically approves the birth date. It also eliminates the risk of losing our liquor license if someone messes up.

Cool, thanks.

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 11):
Does it have the option to both scan or swipe? Since some states have one and some have the other...

Good question. Here in Oregon we have two barcodes (no mag stripe) one "standard" and the other "3D." (Or "QR," whatever the things are called.)

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 13):
Arizona started going crazy about that stuff a few years ago. For a while at some places, not only was my ID swiped, but I had to sign a receipt saying that I was 21 or older, to try to limit the liability of both the server and the establishment.

Sounds like overkill to me.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 15):
I've been trying, off and on, to get information on exactly what information is encoded on the back of my drivers' license. I really haven't tried too hard, it should be public knowledge.

You would think, right?

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 15):
I asked the receptionist what data it transferred over: name, address, DOB.

I wonder what else is there?

It does make you wonder!

Quoting mke717spotter (Reply 17):
Nowadays most fake IDs for underage kids scan anyways so I'm not sure if this helps much.

 Wow! Wow!


User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26444 posts, RR: 75
Reply 19, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2619 times:

They have been doing this for years. I remember buzz about this when I was in high school, many years ago now. Then, it was new and people were having issues with getting their fake IDs to work.


Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlinefr8mech From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 5400 posts, RR: 14
Reply 20, posted (2 years 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 2584 times:

Found a website that will read a high quality scanned image of your license and decode it. Also has an interactive map that tells you what inforamtion is on your license. Not a government source, but I guess it's a start. Not sure I really want to scan my license...

http://turbulence.org/Works/swipe/barcode.html



When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
User currently offlineAirframeAS From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 14150 posts, RR: 24
Reply 21, posted (2 years 2 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 2567 times:

Someone once told me back in 2004 that the bar code actually contains your signature behind it. Not sure how much truth to that really is.


A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12242 posts, RR: 35
Reply 22, posted (2 years 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2543 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting AlnessW (Reply 18):
Oh boy.

What's wrong with that?



911, where is your emergency?
User currently offlinefr8mech From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 5400 posts, RR: 14
Reply 23, posted (2 years 2 weeks 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2538 times:

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 5):
In a different venue, the barcode also makes it much easier for a cop to give you a traffic ticket Scan the barcode/magnet stripe (depending on state), scan the barcode on the registration (if your state has it...mine does). This should (should, not will) enter all the required information about the driver and vehicle into the computer.

Missed that earlier. I have no problem with that. Streamlines the process and makes the police officer more efficient and more accurate. Gets him back on the street faster.

Speaking of police officers, maybe I'll ask one of my buddies to scan my license so I can see what it says. Assuming they don't have to log it.



When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12242 posts, RR: 35
Reply 24, posted (2 years 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2506 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 23):
Missed that earlier. I have no problem with that. Streamlines the process and makes the police officer more efficient and more accurate. Gets him back on the street faster.

Exactly. Why spend several minutes entering all the info (or handwriting...yuck) if you can scan and have everything entered in one second.

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 23):
Speaking of police officers, maybe I'll ask one of my buddies to scan my license so I can see what it says. Assuming they don't have to log it.

Ours will enter drivers license number, name, address, DOB, sex, height and weight into the ticket



911, where is your emergency?
25 greasespot : A DL scan for police shows the persons name and DOB and DL Number. This is then sent to the MTO( or who ever issues the DL) and the persons address an
26 N1120A : What some did/do is de-magnetize.
27 Post contains images AlnessW : Good to know, thanks for sharing that link. Hmm... If a cop can "quickly" and "efficiently" issue you a ticket, how is that good news? But I wonder w
28 Post contains images KaiGywer : It'll get you on your way faster
29 fr8mech : I would much rather have the officer out on the street than "writing" me a ticket. If I'm going to get a ticket, I'd rather get it over with and get
30 AirframeAS : That would be a nice feature! I'd like that! That way the cop knows I have a CCW and no reason for alarm.
31 KaiGywer : Some states will show that when you run the driver's license. Mine as an example will show both active and expired permits, but only as part of a war
32 Post contains images AlnessW : Ha, like that makes a difference!
33 mad99 : Here in Madrid the shops have signs stating that they cannot sell alcohol/fags to people under 18. If you look about 18 then you can buy what you like
34 Post contains images greasespot : I am a cop. To cops the dl does not reveal much. It just prefills the various requests and sends it off from the computer. Most of what we see is not
35 AlnessW : Cool, thanks for the explanation! If fake ID cards are scannable then how does one tell the difference?
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