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Rising Sea Comes At A Cost For South FL Cities  
User currently offlinecmf From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4022 times:

Climate change may be the subject of debate in some places but in South Florida it’s become a costly reality.

In Miami Beach, where prolonged flooding in low-lying neighborhoods has become the norm after heavy storms, city leaders are weighing a $206 million overhaul of an antiquated drainage system increasingly compromised by rising sea level.

The plan calls for more pumps, wells to store storm runoff, higher sea walls and “back-flow’’ preventers for drain pipes flowing into Biscayne Bay. Those devices are intended to stop the system from producing the reverse effect it often does now. During seasonal high tides, the salty bay regularly puddles up from sewer grates in dozens of spots, such as near the local westside bar Purdy Lounge. Extreme high tides — like one in October 2010 — can push in enough sea water to make streets impassable, including blocks of the prime artery of Alton Road.

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/we...h-florida-cities/nR2Qw/#cmComments

Reality is catching up with us. When I moved here 10 years ago flooding wasn't an issue. Now I fully expect the road outside my house to be under water ever so often. Another 10 years like this and it will be too deep for cars to get by when it happens.

It is time for everyone with their heads in the sand to pull them up and realize that we need to deal with global warming. It doesn't matter if it is man made or natural, it is here and it is affecting us. Time to act.

71 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineQFA380 From Australia, joined Jul 2005, 2075 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4004 times:

Quoting cmf (Thread starter):
doesn't matter if it is man made or natura
Quoting cmf (Thread starter):
Time to act.

If it's natural how are we supposed to act?

Even if it is natural I believe that cleaner alternatives to primarily coal and oil must be developed for other reason (notable pollutants such as soot) however the religious zeal with which many environmentalists champion uneconomic energy methods such as wind is incredible.

Honestly living in low-lying areas close to meteorologically active areas and then complaining about flooding is silly when you're depending on up to a century old infrastructure.

Also complaining that 'extremely high tides' that cause flooding prove climate change, would be the same as saying a plane crash proves planes are unsafe. You will always have extreme events that are hard to predict and deal with however you can't claim that a individual extreme event proves a trend.


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39887 posts, RR: 74
Reply 2, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3989 times:

Quoting cmf (Thread starter):
It is time for everyone with their heads in the sand to pull them up and realize that we need to deal with global warming. It doesn't matter if it is man made or natural, it is here and it is affecting us. Time to act.



Sounds like it's time for you to move to higher ground.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15745 posts, RR: 27
Reply 3, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3978 times:

Quoting cmf (Thread starter):
When I moved here 10 years ago flooding wasn't an issue.

Ten years. You should learn the difference between weather and climate. A warm winter or a dry summer is not climate anything.

Quoting cmf (Thread starter):
Time to act.

Pick a mountain. Any mountain.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlinecedarjet From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 8115 posts, RR: 53
Reply 4, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 3938 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 3):
Ten years. You should learn the difference between weather and climate. A warm winter or a dry summer is not climate anything.

Nice to see one of a.net's most right wing regulars on the side of logic! Yes indeed, ten years is climate not weather. Very frustrating when right wingers insist, we've had a cold winter / we've had a mild summer (these are rarely the case anyway but of course there is variations in weather, outliers) as though that disproves climate change.

I just hope the cute waitress at the Clevelander Hotel doesn't get wet. Well, maybe just a bit. Oh god.



fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
User currently offlineKFLLCFII From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 3303 posts, RR: 30
Reply 5, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3906 times:

I've always wanted beachfront property. The sooner, the better...


"About the only way to look at it, just a pity you are not POTUS KFLLCFII, seems as if we would all be better off."
User currently offlinecmf From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3897 times:

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 1):
If it's natural how are we supposed to act?

Like we have done throughout history. We are not saying cold is natural so sit there are freeze. Instead we build houses...

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 1):
Even if it is natural I believe that cleaner alternatives to primarily coal and oil must be developed for other reason (notable pollutants such as soot) however the religious zeal with which many environmentalists champion uneconomic energy methods such as wind is incredible

Glad you think we need cleaner alternatives. Why can't wind be economic?

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 1):
Honestly living in low-lying areas close to meteorologically active areas and then complaining about flooding is silly when you're depending on up to a century old infrastructure.

Land isn't sinking. Water is rising.

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 1):
Also complaining that 'extremely high tides' that cause flooding prove climate change, would be the same as saying a plane crash proves planes are unsafe. You will always have extreme events that are hard to predict and deal with however you can't claim that a individual extreme event proves a trend.

It isn't individual events.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 2):
Sounds like it's time for you to move to higher ground.

Sound like it is time to figure out how we will handle the exodus.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 3):
Ten years. You should learn the difference between weather and climate. A warm winter or a dry summer is not climate anything.

You should learn to read. It isn't single events. It is a clear increase in occurrence and size. It has taken place over long enough time to make it clear it isn't a warm winter or dry summer but it is increasing fast.


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39887 posts, RR: 74
Reply 7, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 3877 times:

Quoting KFLLCFII (Reply 5):
I've always wanted beachfront property. The sooner, the better...


     

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 3):
Pick a mountain. Any mountain.



        

Quoting cmf (Reply 6):
Sound like it is time to figure out how we will handle the exodus.


Plenty of open space on higher ground in Wyoming, Montana, Nevada, North Dakota, South Dakota, Kansas, Oklahoma, Nevada, Colorado. You have an abundance of choices.  
U-haul, Bekins, Ryder, Mayflower and other moving services will make a killing in profits.

Quoting cmf (Reply 6):
Land isn't sinking. Water is rising.


I thought Obama promised to make the sea levels recede.   
Don't believe me? Here goes....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGD5O8_Thhk

I guess Romney was right. Obama isn't working.

Florida is overdeveloped and too much overbuilding has gone westward in to the Everglades and there is less wetlands to handle flooding.
My best advice is to get out.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlinecmf From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 3866 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):

Ignorance at full speed. Combined with some Obama hate. I see how you take your kool aid.


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39887 posts, RR: 74
Reply 9, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 3855 times:

Quoting cmf (Reply 8):
I see how you take your kool aid.



Is that how you were taught to have a discussion with someone you don't agree with?
Just insult them?
That is very rude.

Quoting cmf (Reply 8):
Combined with some Obama hate.


That link was from a pro-Obama group on YouTube. How was any of that "hate"?
I just gave you a comment he made about this very subject.

Quoting cmf (Reply 8):
Ignorance at full speed.


Ignorance is sitting in a flood plain and not having a back up plan for when there is a flood.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlinecmf From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 3829 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 9):
Is that how you were taught to have a discussion with someone you don't agree with?
Just insult them?
That is very rude.

Don't dish if you can't take it.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 9):
That link was from a pro-Obama group on YouTube.

You consider pushbacknow.net a pro Obama group.....

Quoting Superfly (Reply 9):
Ignorance is sitting in a flood plain and not having a back up plan for when there is a flood.

Ignorance is seeing signs and refusing to deal with them. Calling for dealing with them is the exact opposite.


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39887 posts, RR: 74
Reply 11, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 3819 times:

Quoting cmf (Reply 10):
Don't dish if you can't take it.


Where was I insulting you?

Quoting cmf (Reply 10):
You consider pushbacknow.net a pro Obama group.....


Ooops! 
Well the speech sounded good at least.   

Quoting cmf (Reply 10):
Ignorance is seeing signs and refusing to deal with them.
Quoting cmf (Reply 10):
Calling for dealing with them is the exact opposite.



Hey I'm no scientist. Just reading your post complaining about the rising sea levels when you live in Florida.
If it bothers you that much, then leave the state and go somewhere else.
Don't expect others here to have pity for you for choosing to live in the low swamplands of Florida.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15745 posts, RR: 27
Reply 12, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 3772 times:

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 4):
Yes indeed, ten years is climate not weather.

Ten years is borderline at best, and really falls more on the side of weather rather than climate. And, there has been a major increase in tornadoes over the last several decades, but probably has nothing to do with any climate change and is mostly due to the fact that we are seeing and reporting more of them than before.

Quoting cmf (Reply 6):
You should learn to read. It isn't single events. It is a clear increase in occurrence and size. It has taken place over long enough time to make it clear it isn't a warm winter or dry summer but it is increasing fast.

Forgive me if I don't consider the larger puddles in your neighborhood to be proof of anything. Not that I care anyway.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7914 posts, RR: 51
Reply 13, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 3739 times:

Quoting cmf (Thread starter):
It is time for everyone with their heads in the sand to pull them up and realize that we need to deal with global warming. It doesn't matter if it is man made or natural, it is here and it is affecting us. Time to act.

This makes quite a bit of difference, don't you think!? If it's man made any real change will probably take a while, and if it's natural then you're really screwed. Either way, and I'm not joking or being facetious, but move to higher ground, bro. I never understood why anyone would live so close to the water when a non-human-produced phenomenon (hurricane) can send a huge storm surge that will wipe out everything under 20 feet.

Perhaps we need to act on global warming... there are a multitude of reasons, but I'm sorry, I don't feel sorry for people building things slightly above (or even underwater, New Orleans, for example) and then complain about the ocean... just like people living in Tornado Alley shouldn't be complaining about tornadoes or people that live in SFO shouldn't complain about earthquakes...

Kinda on a related note, I love the Netherlands and the Dutch have really done great reclaiming land, but I'd NEVER live there (the underwater parts.) That's just asking for trouble, and God forbid if it ever does flood, what can you say? They took a gamble against nature and nature won



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39887 posts, RR: 74
Reply 14, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 3737 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 13):
I love the Netherlands and the Dutch have really done great reclaiming land


The Dutch have big dykes.
I'm sure it's safe and they don't have earth quakes or hurricanes.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):
Plenty of open space on higher ground in Wyoming, Montana, Nevada, North Dakota, South Dakota, Kansas, Oklahoma, Nevada, Colorado. You have an abundance of choices.



I forgot to add Nebraska.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7914 posts, RR: 51
Reply 15, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 3723 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 14):
Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 13):
I love the Netherlands and the Dutch have really done great reclaiming land


The Dutch have big dykes.
I'm sure it's safe and they don't have earth quakes or hurricanes.

I don't doubt the Dutch's engineering... that being said, I still think living underwater is asking for trouble. JMO. Choosing to live near the ocean when the water is rising... sorry, but a move is probably in order.

I think there are plenty of good reasons to combat global warming... I just don't see choosing a poor housing location as one of them. I'm really not trying to be a dick either...



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineRara From Germany, joined Jan 2007, 2093 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 3694 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):
I thought Obama promised to make the sea levels recede.   
Don't believe me? Here goes....

He doesn't say that. He says in the speech that the "rise of the oceans" would "begin to slow". That's not promising very much, is it. The oceans can still rise, only less quickly than before. He could still do that.

Ironically, if Obama has indeed caused a worse economy (as conservatives claim he did), then he has indeed done a lot against climate change, because an economic cool-down is the most effective weapon against CO2 emissions that we currently have.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 12):
Ten years is borderline at best, and really falls more on the side of weather rather than climate. And, there has been a major increase in tornadoes over the last several decades, but probably has nothing to do with any climate change and is mostly due to the fact that we are seeing and reporting more of them than before.

   That's my understanding as well.



Samson was a biblical tough guy, but his dad Samsonite was even more of a hard case.
User currently offlinewindy95 From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 2727 posts, RR: 8
Reply 17, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 3679 times:

Quoting cmf (Thread starter):
Reality is catching up with us.

Seeing how it has not warmed in 15 years I would say reality is here. No excessive hurricanes, no excessive tornadoes, it has been hotter before...etc...etc...etc....

Quoting cmf (Thread starter):
It is time for everyone with their heads in the sand to pull them up and realize that we need to deal with global warming

Yes and stop funding it and start living in reality

Quoting cmf (Reply 6):
Land isn't sinking. Water is rising.

Actually the sea levels have fallen the last few years so your little story above would be jsut that. A story...

Quoting cmf (Reply 10):
Ignorance is seeing signs and refusing to deal with them

Ignorance is seeing signs where there are none all in the name of ideology. All of this is happened before and will happen again. Except this time we have the enviromental left green agenda driving it.



OMG-Obama Must Go
User currently offlinecanoecarrier From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2839 posts, RR: 12
Reply 18, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 3663 times:

Quoting cmf (Thread starter):
It doesn't matter if it is man made or natural, it is here and it is affecting us. Time to act.

By doing what? In my line of work its not uncommon to have an archeologist find evidence of a native american beach camp several miles inland from what is today's beach front.

We can debate the causes of climate change, but what we can't debate is that it has happened before and the fact that it did is one reason people where here when Columbus showed up. People forget that at one point a mile of ice was over Seattle and that there were times when ocean levels were much higher and lower. Its one of the reasons they find ancient ruins well out to sea.

So? what do you suggest we do? Other than prepare for an inevitable change in sea levels that will flood a significantly populated part of our planet by moving people.



The beatings will continue until morale improves
User currently offlinecasinterest From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4626 posts, RR: 2
Reply 19, posted (2 years 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 3644 times:

Quoting cmf (Thread starter):
Extreme high tides — like one in October 2010 — can push in enough sea water to make streets impassable, including blocks of the prime artery of Alton Road.

A lot of cities on the coasts will have issues. Also a lot of cities have destroyed the natural dune barriers that used to protect and build the beaches up. If you can't stand the rise, it will be time to move. Lousiana this week is a good example that all the levees and pumps down's matter if they get breached , and you are below sea/river level.

Quoting windy95 (Reply 17):
Actually the sea levels have fallen the last few years so your little story above would be jsut that. A story...
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...-us-science-nature-climate-change/

Nope, they are rising over a long average. Whether Natural or human induced, the levels are rising.

Quoting windy95 (Reply 17):
Ignorance is seeing signs where there are none all in the name of ideology. All of this is happened before and will happen again. Except this time we have the enviromental left green agenda driving it.

Ignorance is standing around and doing nothing, especially if this does turn out to be human induced. Rising sea levels are not the only consequence. Higher temperatures will lead to more droughts, (how's that rain fall in the US Plains and west)? More poweful storms where cold and warm air does meat. . Hurricanes with warmer waters will get much more intense. Species may die off , or invade into unfamiliar zones.
To debate the man made, vs natural causes is fine until we have an answer, but investment still needs to be made to understand the full consequences.



Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21637 posts, RR: 55
Reply 20, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3604 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 13):
I never understood why anyone would live so close to the water when a non-human-produced phenomenon (hurricane) can send a huge storm surge that will wipe out everything under 20 feet.

Because of trade. Because most of our goods travel by ocean, and because companies exist at ports to make money off that. And thus, that's where the most prosperous cites in the world are.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 14):
The Dutch have big dykes.


-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7914 posts, RR: 51
Reply 21, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3588 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 20):
Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 13):
I never understood why anyone would live so close to the water when a non-human-produced phenomenon (hurricane) can send a huge storm surge that will wipe out everything under 20 feet.

Because of trade. Because most of our goods travel by ocean, and because companies exist at ports to make money off that. And thus, that's where the most prosperous cites in the world are.

I realize that, I just never personally would build my house that low and it baffles me when someone else does. I feel sorry for them when they lose their house but I look at them with a "well what did you think would happen?" look



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21637 posts, RR: 55
Reply 22, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 3581 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 21):
I just never personally would build my house that low and it baffles me when someone else does. I feel sorry for them when they lose their house but I look at them with a "well what did you think would happen?" look

Somebody's got to do it. The nation's economy would not be nearly what it is without the ports of LA, NYC, New Orleans, Miami, Seattle, etc. The nation's military wouldn't be nearly what it is without San Diego and Norfolk. And you need people to staff those ports and run the businesses that make money catering to the needs that those ports have. Those people deserve support when things go bad as a result of living someplace that the nation needs them to live, not blame.

And that will always be the case. Access to, and control of, the oceans will never go out of style, no matter where the oceans actually end up.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlinepetertenthije From Netherlands, joined Jul 2001, 3369 posts, RR: 11
Reply 23, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 3567 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 13):
Kinda on a related note, I love the Netherlands and the Dutch have really done great reclaiming land, but I'd NEVER live there (the underwater parts.) That's just asking for trouble,

When proper precautions are taken it is just as safe as anywhere. But you need a combination of long term and short term precautions. Long term by building flood defences, pumps and a strict inspection and maintenance regime. Short term by evacuating people, putting in sandbags or mobilising the army in case a storm surge is expected (or in New Orleans's case a hurricane). Both the long term and the short term precautions where done on the cheap in New Orleans, and New Orleans paid a terrible price.

Same for those living in earthquake teritory, hurricane alley or areas where forest fires are common.

Short of a meteor strikes or tsunamis there is little that nature can throw at humanity that is not surivivable with proper preparations. Whether it is economically justifiable is entirely debatable. In the Netherlands there ain't a debate on it for the simple reason that half the country is at or below sea level. We don't have a choise.

[Edited 2012-09-03 22:47:44]


Attamottamotta!
User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39887 posts, RR: 74
Reply 24, posted (2 years 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 3559 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 20):
Quoting Superfly (Reply 14):
The Dutch have big dykes.


-Not sure if using innuendo-
-Mir


Thanks for catching that. I was thinking of a different kind of dyke.  
The Dutch have big dikes.

Quoting Rara (Reply 16):
He doesn't say that. He says in the speech that the "rise of the oceans" would "begin to slow". That's not promising very much, is it. The oceans can still rise, only less quickly than before. He could still do that.

Sorry but he ain't Moses.



Bring back the Concorde
25 Rara : No need to. In the grand scheme of things it's not very hard, we'd "only" have to stop burning fossil fuels. I realize we're not going to, for variou
26 Post contains images cmf : The stupidity of your suggestions. Exemplified by this: Two thirds of the worlds large cities are by the ocean. There is no consensus on how many peo
27 flymia : I have not noticed anything unusual in the Miami area. If anything I have noticed less flooding than years ago. South Florida is not flood prone becau
28 cmf : There is much less flooding after rain storms because - they are much more active in lowering canals - they have installed pumps allowing canals to b
29 Post contains links canoecarrier : I don't think building levies or trying to change the environment will solve the problem. Feel free to simulate a sea level rise yourself and see jus
30 NoUFO : I have not heard of any scientist who said that the number of tornadoes had increased. The argument of the skeptics that climate change had not led t
31 BMI727 : Ten years is not climate anything. That's weather. I really don't care at all if the climate is changing or if the climate is not changing. What I do
32 windy95 : No according to many scientist that think CAGW is crap. CO2 and man is not the driver of the ever changing climate. No we do what we have been doing
33 ALTF4 : Now I remember why I haven't posted here in weeks. Its because crazy people who can't stand people they think are crazy post crazy things they'd be cr
34 cmf : I don't think levies is the solution but I do think it is part of the solution. I do think there is plenty we can do to affect the environment, The o
35 Aesma : Wine makers here are considering irrigation. That has never been needed before and wine making isn't exactly new. The Sahel is becoming the Sahara. Is
36 BMI727 : You said you moved there ten years ago. That's the data you're working with and that's not enough time to make any determination about climate. I car
37 cmf : I said it has crossed the line from not being a problem to being a common problem in that period. Take responsibility for what you create and there i
38 Rara : As long as your actions negatively affect other people, those other people will have a say in how you lead your life. You may not like it, but that's
39 BMI727 : Nobody gets a say except me. It's my life, my car, my credit card going in the gas pump. If driving a hybrid or buying carbon credits makes you sleep
40 DeltaMD90 : That argument can be used for just about anything... it's where you draw the line. Some value more personal freedom even if it costs society a little
41 Post contains images Rara : Incorrect. For instance, you can't live at a river and routinely dump toxic garbage into it which then kill a farmer's sheep downstream. You may cons
42 DeltaMD90 : Well like I said, just about everything one does "affects" society. I ate fast food today instead of cooking my own meal because I was running late..
43 Post contains images Rara : That's sophistry, and you know it. The key is "affect" - people have always been living by the sea, so they're affected; but they don't affect the pe
44 Superfly : Suggesting that someone move to higher ground if they're concerned about floods is considered "stupidity" in your eyes? Wow! So much for a civil disc
45 BMI727 : They aren't. Time to cut a check to the cops and lawmakers. What gives you any more right to swing your fist at my life than me to drive whatever I w
46 Post contains images DeltaMD90 : It sounds like you've never filled up a Hummer (I haven't either but I thought it was pretty witty)
47 Mir : Isn't corruption great? -Mir
48 BMI727 : It's not necessarily corruption. Just making a deal. More people benefiting from a factory or whatever is a good thing. Maybe it isn't necessary to w
49 cmf : Stop pretending you're a victim. earn up to what you did.
50 Mir : How is writing a check to the cops not corruption? -Mir
51 Superfly : What did I do?
52 Post contains images Rara : Sometimes I'm tempted to add you to my Respected Users list. Haha, no, I haven't. In fact I rarely fill up any car, because I don't drive. So in a wa
53 Post contains images PlanesNTrains : We can't all live in Wyoming. People are going to live everywhere. To say that people who are injured by tornados shouldn't complain is insulting. An
54 Aesma : I'm always surprised to see that every time a US tornado makes the news here, a lot of homes and even malls are reduced to nothing because they were m
55 Post contains images zckls04 : Good luck with that. There might still be plenty of oil, and the seas may not rise, but the chances of your Hummer still working in 2040 are negligib
56 canoecarrier : I'm not sure I understand what you're trying to propose. Levies only hold back surface water they do nothing against groundwater. The groundwater tab
57 rampart : I could swear that the same camp suggests that desolate, open places don't deserve infrastructure support. "They choose to live there, don't expect t
58 Superfly : So what's upsetting you? 58 replies and no suggestions from you. Just you insulting and calling on everyone to "act". Can you be more specific? Can't
59 cmf : I'm proposing levies for areas that will experience flooding at times of high tides combined with storms. I'm sure large land areas can be protected
60 NoUFO : The fact that climate has changed before is just another strawman. It is like saying that there have been forest fires all the time when you know ver
61 windy95 : That would be water vapor that is the most important green house gas. CO2 is down the list a bit. But that would not fit with the anti oil and coal l
62 NoUFO : *Sigh* That would be the main greenhouse gas for the natural cycle, limited to low altitudes. Besides, water vapor resides in the atmosphere for only
63 canoecarrier : I really don't think you realize the massive project that would entail. A 5' sea level change is not a high tide combined with a storm. Did you run t
64 ALTF4 : The Sahel is becoming the Sahara? Wow. In the unlikely event that statement is true, have you ever considered the origins of the Saraha desert?
65 PlanesNTrains : That is patently false in the sense that certain aspects of global warming come from greenhouse gases that are produced from manmade activities. To s
66 cmf : I think you're missing where they would be built. The idea isn't to keep existing areas. They would be built to protect areas that would on occasion
67 canoecarrier : In that case they wouldn't be necessary. Did you bother to simulate a 5' sea level rise on the link I posted? I suppose if we just replicated the sam
68 Post contains images cmf : Glad to see you come around in one paragraph. Sure we have. Not climate but certainly environment. Plenty of planes flying around spraying poison to
69 canoecarrier : I should be more clear. When I'm saying "why would we want to manipulate our environment" I'm fully aware that we have dammed rivers, filled wetlands
70 cmf : I have not suggested we can't. I have stated we need to prepare for it. But it will however take incredible capital (monetary, material, manpower and
71 Mir : However, we have only been releasing pollutants into the atmosphere on a large scale for a little over 200 years. So the relevance of drawing conclus
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