Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Romney's Recent Controversial Comments  
User currently offline777222LR From United States of America, joined Feb 2012, 134 posts, RR: 1
Posted (2 years 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 10561 times:

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...deo-shows-candid-romney/?hpt=hp_c1

"There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what, there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent on government, who believe that, that they are victims, who believe that government has the responsibility to care for them. Who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing."

Speaking on Obama, "Had he been born of Mexican parents, I'd have a better shot of winning this."

Obviously, given some of the Republican base, I can't imagine it will hurt Romney that much there, but the one's on the fence, I'm not so sure. All-in-all, some really abrasive comments to make about half the country, which I do not believe are true in the slightest. Sure, there are people who abuse the system, but I do not believe that 47% of Americans, or the Democrats, believe this. I'm a democrat and I certainly don't feel entitled or like a victim.

What say you?

311 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7914 posts, RR: 51
Reply 1, posted (2 years 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 10544 times:

Quoting 777222LR (Thread starter):
What say you?

Very very stupid. Had he said "there is about 47% that won't vote for me no matter what, I've got X%, so we need to focus on the middle ground" I don't think it would be as bad, but really Romney, what are you thinking!?

Honestly I see the media and the usual people make a big deal about it and most people not. As dumb as this comment was, I think the determining factor for voters will be something other than this comment. He's got 1 more chance to impress me... apparently his campaign says "it's time" to release details about his plans (the economy, jobs, etc.) I don't see anything changing on my end though



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineBN747 From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 5613 posts, RR: 51
Reply 2, posted (2 years 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 10540 times:

Quoting 777222LR (Thread starter):



47% of the population doesn't mean anything to him???

Now that both feet have been shot off ..someone get the man a wheelchair, walking is outta the question and he's gotta get to the debates somehow.

BN747



"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7585 posts, RR: 18
Reply 3, posted (2 years 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 10539 times:

Quoting 777222LR (Thread starter):
given some of the Republican base, I can't imagine it will hurt Romney that much there, but the one's on the fence, I'm not so sure.

The media will overblow this for about 3 weeks or so and then they'll find something to rip on.

It's really kinda weird. He has a point though...maybe it's not 47% of the people, but it's Americans themselves who have become a real slave to the government. They rely too much on the government for handouts, and they refuse to grow themselves, become themselves by themselves. They want those who have made themselves (the so-called 1%) to be the ones who pay for THEM. It's pathetic. We have become a nation of lazy dullards.

That's why I'm voting Romeny/Ryan. Both of them are self-made men. We need more people in this country who don't rely on the government.

Romney says that 47% of the electorate feels that they are "entitled" to whatever the government hands them, when that's really a bad thing. Romney is saying that he feels these people should have their mindset changed, so they become independent Americans. After all, we fought against the British for this very reason- to become free independent people.

Why do we need the government -- a failure of one -- to hand us what we need?


That's what Romney is saying. (or has said, like, 5 months ago. Remember that's when this was filmed.)

Media bias at it's best.

I hate politics.



次は、渋谷、渋谷。出口は、右側です。電車とホームの間は広く開いておりますので、足元に注意下さい。
User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7585 posts, RR: 18
Reply 4, posted (2 years 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10533 times:

Quoting BN747 (Reply 2):
47% of the population doesn't mean anything to him???

Misinterpretation- He's saying 47% of the population will vote for people who give them anything want, and he wishes that this country's mindset will be changed.


Read into this more.



次は、渋谷、渋谷。出口は、右側です。電車とホームの間は広く開いておりますので、足元に注意下さい。
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7914 posts, RR: 51
Reply 5, posted (2 years 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10520 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
That's why I'm voting Romeny/Ryan. Both of them are self-made men.

I'm not a Romney history guru, but I'm skeptical of this comment. Did he get to where he is WITHOUT any help from his father? Not saying he hasn't worked hard, but he needs to recognize the help that he received and realize not everyone has that. I've gotten pretty far so far in life, and I believe I could have done that with no help, but having a loving and supporting family undeniably helped.

Not saying government should force a level playing field, but I think there are some barriers to the poor that could be removed (mostly our education system needs reform IMO)



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8841 posts, RR: 24
Reply 6, posted (2 years 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10519 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 1):
Very very stupid. Had he said "there is about 47% that won't vote for me no matter what, I've got X%, so we need to focus on the middle ground" I don't think it would be as bad, but really Romney, what are you thinking!?

It is pretty accurate. The modern day Democratic Party is centered on bribing people to vote for them - people who will get more sh&t from the government than they pay in (if they pay anything). The day that number crosses 50%, there will be champagne corks popping all through the DNC - they see this as a great political goal.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlineiFlyLOTs From United States of America, joined Apr 2012, 485 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (2 years 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10519 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
It's pathetic. We have become a nation of lazy dullards.

I tend to disagree with comment seeing as how we still work the most among most western nations.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
Both of them are self-made men

Using their parents money. And Obama isn't? He was born in a worse situation than Romney and Ryan financially.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
Romney says that 47% of the electorate feels that they are "entitled" to whatever the government hands them

I'm part of that 47% that will be voting Obama and I don't feel entitled to anything. I work my butt off and I go to school every day so that I can be in a better situation in the future.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
Why do we need the government -- a failure of one -- to hand us what we need?

the last thing the government handed me was a piece of paper saying I hadn't payed enough in my taxes, which I promptly paid.



"...stay hungry, stay foolish" -Steve Jobs
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7914 posts, RR: 51
Reply 8, posted (2 years 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10509 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 6):
Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 1):
Very very stupid. Had he said "there is about 47% that won't vote for me no matter what, I've got X%, so we need to focus on the middle ground" I don't think it would be as bad, but really Romney, what are you thinking!?

It is pretty accurate.

I was saying, whether he thinks that or not, it was pretty dumb of him to say



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlinePyrex From Portugal, joined Aug 2005, 4022 posts, RR: 28
Reply 9, posted (2 years 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10509 times:

Well, the U.S. is dangerously close to the point of no return, so the man has a point.


Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13116 posts, RR: 12
Reply 10, posted (2 years 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10485 times:

How many of those 47% who don't pay Federal Income Tax include those on Government Social Security or on a small pension too low to be taxed? How many of those are on a Government or private disability or lawsuit proceeds not subject to taxation or the amounts too low to be taxed? How many are just not making enough to pay Federal Income taxes? Out of that 47%, how many will vote for Romney - probably 20% of them, especially older, suburban and rural males, Christian fundies and some racists who hate Obama.

Yes, about 47% of Americans won't vote for Romney-Ryan, but is is a much broader group than those he id's by only that number who get some government subsidies.


User currently offline777222LR From United States of America, joined Feb 2012, 134 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (2 years 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10483 times:

I do not think ANYONE is successful from the ground up without some sort of government assistance. I worked for the government of Oklahoma in the Oklahoma State Senate during college and the self-made millionaires would be nowhere if it weren't for their friends in the government, and their businesses would fail if it weren't for government assistance and what you term, "handouts." No doubt Romney has gotten some sweet and favorable things from the government. And while it may not be foodstamps or free healthcare or legal services, he surely has benefitted more from his government than a person hoping to eat and get a tetanus shot. Let's just term it, a white collar handout vs. a poor man's handout. A handout given over a nice glass of Scotch with friends at the Ritz-Carlton. It's still a handout. It's how big business is done. Fortunately for them, they have the money and damage control to term it something else, for those less fortunate, it's a "disgraceful thing" to get assistance, at least to some. While no one supports lazy people freeloading, this percentage is a HUGE minority in America, and an almost negligable force in the voting world.

I don't understand this "handout" rhetoric either. Most of the democrats I know are self-made, educated, and work their tail ends off. There are a LOT of Republicans who have nothing who rely on government assistance. I live in one of the most Red-States in the US, and there are people here who are dirt poor living on foodstamps who love Romney, but will take their healthcare and "handouts" privately and say the government should pay for things.

Let's be honest, not everyone in the US can be a hugely successful self-made person, it wouldn't work out. In theory, perhaps, but society has never, in the history of man, allowed this, due to man's on selfish reasons and desires. Everyone being self-made and hugely successful would spread the wealth out so everyone would basically have the same, which seems a little too "socialist" for those who are so against it.

Either way, I think the Romney comments, whether he meant them or not, were offensive. Some of the most successful, wealthy, educated, and hardworking people in the US are democrats. In fact, I'd say more of them are probably socially liberal and fiscally conservative, but comments like this will probably push them over to the liberal side. It doesn't help Romney, and shows a bit of arrogance towards his fellow man.

[Edited 2012-09-17 20:00:19]

User currently offlineflyguy89 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 1926 posts, RR: 20
Reply 12, posted (2 years 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 10458 times:

Quoting 777222LR (Thread starter):
What say you?

I don't see what all is so controversial about it. Most people already know who they're voting for, and recent polling suggests that a similar percentage of the population sees government as the answer (39%), the vision which Obama champions, so where's the issue?

Quoting 777222LR (Thread starter):
Speaking on Obama, "Had he been born of Mexican parents, I'd have a better shot of winning this."

Well when you have practically 100% of African Americans voting for Obama (according to certain polls) and the race card often being played so errantly by his surrogates, I would agree with him.

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 5):
but having a loving and supporting family undeniably helped.

Where has he not given credit to the love and support from his wife and family? That was pretty much the theme of the whole RNC.

Quoting iFlyLOTs (Reply 7):
Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
It's pathetic. We have become a nation of lazy dullards.

I tend to disagree with comment seeing as how we still work the most among most western nations.

That's rapidly changing with the smallest labor force in 30+ years.

Quoting iFlyLOTs (Reply 7):
Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
Both of them are self-made men

Using their parents money.

Yeah I'm sure Ryan was living the lush life off his single working mom's money.

Quoting iFlyLOTs (Reply 7):
the last thing the government handed me was a piece of paper saying I hadn't payed enough in my taxes, which I promptly paid.

...so you're voting for a guy who wants to raise taxes even more, in addition to the ones he's already created with Obamacare?


User currently offline777222LR From United States of America, joined Feb 2012, 134 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (2 years 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 10442 times:

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
That's rapidly changing with the smallest labor force in 30+ years.

Considering those who are the 1% running American companies have been outsourcing labor like crazy in the past 25 years, it's no wonder.

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
I don't see what all is so controversial about it. Most people already know who they're voting for, and recent polling suggests that a similar percentage of the population sees government as the answer (39%), the vision which Obama champions, so where's the issue?

Let's say Obama said this: "I'm going to just concentrate on those 8-10% who are on the fence because the rest of them are Conservative Religious people who feel entitled to injest their religious vitrol into politics. They think they deserve to be a nation of white Christians only, and lets face it folks, if you don't walk, talk, act, and worship the same God as us all, it's not worth trying to get their vote."

-Is it true, absolutely not, is it a stereotype, absolutely. And Romney just stereotyped the entire Democratic Party, with a pretty much baseless stereotype as it is. Had Obama said the above, you'd be screaming and yelling that it was offensive as well. Why? Because it is, either way.


User currently offlineiFlyLOTs From United States of America, joined Apr 2012, 485 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (2 years 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 10439 times:

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
That's rapidly changing with the smallest labor force in 30+ years.

We can't blame the economy on only Obama, a lot of the problems that we had with it were already well in motion when he came into power, he was trying to save a sinking supertanker with a bucket.

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
Yeah I'm sure Ryan was living the lush life off his single working mom's money.

I will give credit where it is due, and I mistakenly wrapped Ryan into that. So you have me there. Romney on the other hand had wealthy parents to fall back on.

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
...so you're voting for a guy who wants to raise taxes even more, in addition to the ones he's already created with Obamacare?

Yes. I don't see how lowering taxes for the upper class is going to do anything when most of the country falls in the middle class demographic.



"...stay hungry, stay foolish" -Steve Jobs
User currently offlineflyguy89 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 1926 posts, RR: 20
Reply 15, posted (2 years 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 10417 times:

Quoting 777222LR (Reply 13):
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
That's rapidly changing with the smallest labor force in 30+ years.

Considering those who are the 1% running American companies have been outsourcing labor like crazy in the past 25 years, it's no wonder.

Then how is it possible that we've had such vast swaths of 4% unemployment in the past 25 years (the lowest it can statistically go)? Furthermore, you honestly think Obama's going to bring those manufacturing jobs back with his stellar economic policies and 6,000 EPA regulations under review...oh and don't forget that auto plant in Finland he loaned money to, or the Brazilian oil companies to develop their oil sector while he comes home and vetoes the Keystone Pipeline.

Quoting 777222LR (Reply 13):
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
I don't see what all is so controversial about it. Most people already know who they're voting for, and recent polling suggests that a similar percentage of the population sees government as the answer (39%), the vision which Obama champions, so where's the issue?

Let's say Obama said this: "I'm going to just concentrate on those 8-10% who are on the fence because the rest of them are Conservative Religious people who feel entitled to injest their religious vitrol into politics. They think they deserve to be a nation of white Christians only, and lets face it folks, if you don't walk, talk, act, and worship the same God as us all, it's not worth trying to get their vote."

-Is it true, absolutely not, is it a stereotype, absolutely. And Romney just stereotyped the entire Democratic Party, with a pretty much baseless stereotype as it is. Had Obama said the above, you'd be screaming and yelling that it was offensive as well. Why? Because it is, either way.
http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmi...ging_religion_guns_xenophobia.html

Quote:
Obama: And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy toward people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.
Quoting iFlyLOTs (Reply 14):
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
That's rapidly changing with the smallest labor force in 30+ years.

We can't blame the economy on only Obama, a lot of the problems that we had with it were already well in motion when he came into power, he was trying to save a sinking supertanker with a bucket.

Not according to Obama's own estimations. Obama told us that if we passed his stimulus that unemployment wouldn't go about 8%, that a lot the mess would be greatly improving at the end of his first term...well? I wouldn't have expected this whole economic disaster to be cleaned up in just four years, but we should be seeing at least SOME indications that his policies are working by now instead of joblessness increasing and being on the brink of yet another recession.

Quoting iFlyLOTs (Reply 14):
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
...so you're voting for a guy who wants to raise taxes even more, in addition to the ones he's already created with Obamacare?

Yes. I don't see how lowering taxes for the upper class is going to do anything when most of the country falls in the middle class demographic.

Romney wants to lower marginal tax rates in ALL income tax brackets while closing loopholes for the "upper class".

[Edited 2012-09-17 20:38:32]

Quoting iFlyLOTs (Reply 7):
And Obama isn't? He was born in a worse situation than Romney and Ryan financially.

This whole narrative that Obama lived such an underprivileged, tough upbringing is ridiculous. From both of his books we know he lived in the mostly upscale neighborhoods in Honolulu and Indonesia, went to one of the most elite preparatory academies in Hawaii, regularly went on extravagant family vacations including a month-long junket to the mainland traveling all over the West Coast (and this being a.net, I think we all know how expensive it was for a whole family to fly Hawaii-mainland in the late 60's early 70's). He most certainly did not have the "hard knock life" many people seem to think.


[Edited 2012-09-17 20:48:44]

User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21637 posts, RR: 55
Reply 16, posted (2 years 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 10415 times:

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 1):
Very very stupid. Had he said "there is about 47% that won't vote for me no matter what, I've got X%, so we need to focus on the middle ground" I don't think it would be as bad, but really Romney, what are you thinking!?

It's incredibly stupid. This is Romney's "they cling to guns and religion" moment - alienating a whole section of the population who might have voted for him by lumping them all in with a stereotype.

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 5):
I'm not a Romney history guru, but I'm skeptical of this comment. Did he get to where he is WITHOUT any help from his father?

Of course not. He had a much easier road of it. When he suggests that young people borrow money from their parents to go to school or start a business, it shows how he just doesn't understand the financial reality of a lot of people in the country. He had a privileged background, and to his credit he didn't piss it all away, but let's not pretend he's a self-made man.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 6):
The modern day Democratic Party is centered on bribing people to vote for them

And the GOP isn't?

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlinecmf From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (2 years 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 10410 times:

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
That's rapidly changing with the smallest labor force in 30+ years.

Sure, when facts don't matter.

http://www.dlt.ri.gov/lmi/laus/us/usadj.htm


User currently offlineflymia From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 7175 posts, RR: 9
Reply 18, posted (2 years 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 10374 times:

Quoting 777222LR (Thread starter):
Speaking on Obama, "Had he been born of Mexican parents, I'd have a better shot of winning this."


Don't put that in quotes if you can't quote it correctly!! He was talking about himself not President Obama and his statement is 100% true. If Mitt was of Mexican descent and Hispanic he would have an easier time winning this election no doubt about it. You quote of it is something I except from CNN or MSNBC.
""My dad, as you probably, know was the governor of Michigan and was the head of a car company. But he was born in Mexico ... and, uh, had he been born of, uh, Mexican parents, I'd have a better shot at winning this," Romney said. "But he was unfortunately born to Americans living in Mexico.... I mean I say that jokingly, but it would be helpful to be Latino.""

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 4):
Misinterpretation- He's saying 47% of the population will vote for people who give them anything want, and he wishes that this country's mindset will be changed.


Exactly. Honestly what do I have to say about this? He is basically telling the truth. There is about 3-5% of Americans who will decide the election.

Also I think it is disgusting that someone went in there and recorded things illegally I assume. And if not against some agreement at least something that is very frowned upon in the political and business world. It is disgusting and who ever did it should not be such a coward and just reveal themselves. Of course they may have legal consequences if they did depending on any agreements at people who attended the event.



"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
User currently offlineflyguy89 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 1926 posts, RR: 20
Reply 19, posted (2 years 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 10369 times:

Quoting cmf (Reply 17):
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
That's rapidly changing with the smallest labor force in 30 years.

Sure, when facts don't matter.

http://www.dlt.ri.gov/lmi/laus/us/usadj.htm

Nice try...

http://www.businessinsider.com/labor...ts-lowest-level-in-31-years-2012-9


User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19727 posts, RR: 58
Reply 20, posted (2 years 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 10366 times:

Quoting 777222LR (Thread starter):
"There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what, there are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent on government, who believe that, that they are victims, who believe that government has the responsibility to care for them. Who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing."

It is obvious to me that Romney and his type claim to love America but have nothing but disdain for Americans.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
Romney says that 47% of the electorate feels that they are "entitled" to whatever the government hands them, when that's really a bad thing. Romney is saying that he feels these people should have their mindset changed, so they become independent Americans. After all, we fought against the British for this very reason- to become free independent people.

No, to believe that a government of the people, by the people, and for the people should provide for the people is not "entitlement." It's "civilization."


User currently offlineseb146 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 11660 posts, RR: 15
Reply 21, posted (2 years 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 10330 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 6):
The modern day Democratic Party is centered on bribing people to vote for them

By promising them jobs and health care. How dare they!

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 20):
to believe that a government of the people, by the people, and for the people should provide for the people is not "entitlement." It's "civilization."

What really irritates me is: the right-wing keeps going on and on about how much they love the Christian religions and how they are the party of God but they hate helping anyone other than the super wealthy. They refuse to feed the hungry or heal the sick or house the homeless. After all, the median income is $250,000 according to.... who? factcheck.org to find out what the real median income is....



Life in the wall is a drag.
User currently offlineqantas077 From Australia, joined Jan 2004, 5856 posts, RR: 39
Reply 22, posted (2 years 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 10318 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
The media will overblow this for about 3 weeks or so and then they'll find something to rip on.

the guys says he doesn't give a toss about nearly 150 million people...seriously, if stupidity had a photo then Mitt would be the poster! There is more to come from his speech too, can't imagine how much worse it could be.



a true friend is someone who sees the pain in your eyes, while everyone else believes the smile on your face.
User currently offlineBN747 From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 5613 posts, RR: 51
Reply 23, posted (2 years 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 10308 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 4):
Quoting BN747 (Reply 2):
47% of the population doesn't mean anything to him???

Misinterpretation- He's saying 47% of the population will vote for people who give them anything want, and he wishes that this country's mindset will be changed.

I know exactly what he was saying..but that's not how it plays in Peoria (if you get that political quip).

My joking about it in the manner I did.. is exactly how it will be broadcast across the airways/internet everywhere you look tomorrow. With his 'I don't worry about those people' statement... it's gonna play like Obama's 'you didn't build that' statement but on steroids multiplied by a factor of 10. Simply because it comes on the heels of his Libya miscue. Add to that the actual video of him saying it.

Here again was a case of Romney and bad choice of phrasing.

Half the country ARE NOT lazy government dependents, you are delusional to even hint that they are. I recently donated some computers to unemployed vets along with teaching some to really use them. While fought Romney goofed off in Paris on Military deferments. The majority of them are in tough situations..and when their nation called on them, they went to a wrong headed war in Vietnam. And the benefits they get today IS INDEED fair trade for what they gave. And they aren't the only ones. Many of today's poor and lower middle classcitizens weren't always in such an unfortunate state. When these financial disasters took hold, the numbers affected were more than just numbers - they were hard working productive contributing Americans as were their kids and now they may be finding a hard road back..but make no mistake for all they've put into the system..the system was designed to help them get back on their feet. I find it absolutely insane how the War Mongers love sending others into battle to attack someone else and risk their lives and then want nothing to do with them when they return maimed physically and mentally. or their families in distress because they didn't return at all. Many of these people are in the 47% he doesn't care about.

When Romney's dad fled the Mexican Revolution, he had nothing, the US Gov't gave them each $250 ($6000) each to get back on their feet again - here in the USA. It was the US Taxpayers that gave him 1.3 Billion 'to save the Salt Lake Olympics'...Romney could have used his 'business skills' to rause money to 'save the Olympics'..but nooooo... Gov't assistance was much much easier! So he needs to hold his tongue when talks about people dependent on Gov't, because if not for thsi gov't he wouldn't be in the position he's been in to take advantage of tax loop holes to stash cash in the Caymans , Bahamas and Switzerland.

BN747

[Edited 2012-09-17 22:29:46]


"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
User currently offlineflyguy89 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 1926 posts, RR: 20
Reply 24, posted (2 years 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 10308 times:

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 20):
No, to believe that a government of the people, by the people, and for the people should provide for the people is not "entitlement." It's "civilization."

Absolutely! From each according to their ability and to each according to their need, right?

Ha! No thanks. You can take that "Entitlement=Civilization" clap trap back to where it belongs alongside communism and national socialism...the rubbish bin of history.

Quoting seb146 (Reply 21):
They refuse to feed the hungry or heal the sick or house the homeless.

Oh right, because those great landmark welfare accomplishments of the Democrats have surely helped do those things...oops, it actually hasn't, we now have more people living below the poverty line than before the "Great Society" reforms of the 60's.


25 DocLightning : Not exactly, but forcing people to starve to death isn't civilized.
26 BMI727 : He's right about that, but he shouldn't be saying it. So is Obama. I think we're past it. Competing has been deemed too hard by too many people, so i
27 FlyPNS1 : Actually, it is a problem. If everyone wanted to me mega-wealthy like Mitt Romney, our entire country would collapse. Few people get wealthy serving
28 BMI727 : So? How is any of that my problem? (For what it's worth, I really don't care about too much other than trying to be mega-wealthy one day) I'm not say
29 seb146 : Because people like Romney ship jobs overseas then blame people like you and me (who have to work at Wal-Mart because we have to feed and house our f
30 FlyPNS1 : When the country collapses, many of the wealthy (like you want to be) will get taken down with it. Bad things happen to wealthy people too. But you'r
31 Post contains images stasisLAX : I think Romney has come to the realization that he truly has very little chance of winning the Presidency on Election Day. Thus, he is no longer filte
32 BMI727 : Government put it there, which is fine. That's one of the things people need the government to do, since we can't all built our own roads. I do gener
33 flyguy89 : Puhleez. Romney turned around Staples, Dunkin Donuts, Home Depot, and Baskin Robins among others, almost 90% of the companies Romney and Bain Capital
34 FlyPNS1 : If the U.S. collapses, we'll take much of the rest of the world with us. Moving to Switzerland won't save you. If Romney is leading by "good margins"
35 PlanesNTrains : For many, that statement would be more accurate with "Obama". For me personally, I think they both have a real heart for their country that is noneth
36 Pellegrine : Romney was unelectable before. Now...he is a joke and a bully and scoundrel to everyday hardworking Americans.
37 PlanesNTrains : I won't guess who will win, but I am surprised at how many "Obama 2998" type of people I know that at least say they aren't voting for him again. I'm
38 Pellegrine : What you said here is why sometimes I get so miffed about fellow voters. Hello! The President doesn't control the economy/jobs/gas prices like a geni
39 BN747 : The disturbing line of thought in what he said .. is 'as if some half the nation have been on gov't assistance forever. Half the country??? Just summ
40 Post contains images TheCommodore : Heard earlier on ABC national news They reckon, he's just lost the election !
41 Post contains links bestwestern : Bloomberg saying the same http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-0...mitt-romney-lost-the-election.html This is an utter disaster for Romney. Romney alrea
42 KiwiRob : Not true Valmat in Finland have been contract manufacturing motorvhicles for decades, the Saab 900 and gen 1 Porsche Boxter are two of the vehicles t
43 Post contains images Aaron747 : Highly debatable - but if you're being truly objective you have to include Obama in there too, as BMI727 said. It's worth noting that Ryan has been a
44 Post contains links bestwestern : In the new york times, conservative pundit David Brooks asks... "when will the incompetence stop? http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/18/op...s-thurston-ho
45 Post contains links and images zkojq : Wow, Romney clearly has no concept of the working poor. I never liked Obama much but his opposition is crazy. So I assume that you are also disgusted
46 windy95 : controversial to some left leaning people... The truth hurt's sometimes...we need more if it injected into our country and politics Way to misquote a
47 casinterest : He never would have made it out of the Republican Primary. Let's see that stat table you have. Going to be especially hard to prove when the Number o
48 wingman : Latest stats show that the Middle Class has shrunk because most of them have moved UP...??? Uuuuh, heeelloooo! McFly...pick up book, read book, ooga b
49 Post contains links pu : Impressive use of facts from a primary source! The most impressive posts stick to the facts. In fairness to CMF, you have repeatedly on various threa
50 flymia : This is politics guys. Everyone going crazy over this is one of two things: Hates Republicans or more simply just wants Obama to win or Does not under
51 casinterest : Rubio will not be a frontrunner. Not from the GOP. They will move back to a centralist like Christie, or they wil go far to the right with Paul Ryan/
52 Post contains images Revelation : Disagree. This is a pivot point, one that obviously is against Romney. The polls last week already showed the tide turning against Romney and this wi
53 Post contains images sabenapilot : This sums it up nicely: Many people have been reduced to guessing what Romney's true feelings are. This video provides an answer: He feels that you're
54 incitatus : I can predict the future well - In 2013 the best-seller book in America is going to be... Going Rogue: An American Life by Mitt Romney
55 Post contains images Rara : Wow, what an epic spinning post.. Say, are you by any chance seeing your candidate's chances going down the drain, and you're trying to stem yourself
56 Post contains images kaitak : I think he is showing his true colours now; the hypcrisy of the man just beggars belief; he probably earned more from his tax attorneys' manipulation
57 D L X : You have your facts wrong. Ryan comes from a VERY wealthy family. His family owned the construction empire Ryan Inc. they built a good chunk of he In
58 seb146 : For years we have been told "give the rich tax breaks and they will create jobs." We were told in the time of Reagan to let the money flow to the top
59 DocLightning : I see... so somehow they should provide these things that cannot be done privately...and do it without money? That is the logical conclusion of your
60 BMI727 : Well, I want to be on my own, I don't want to share whatever prosperity I have, and I don't want to share responsibility for all of the stupid people
61 Post contains images windy95 : Stop watching Obama vidoes... No because anyone who is oofended by this is already voting for the relection of Obama. No and I am happy that he was t
62 KiwiRob : Better move to Russia, China or India those countries are freshly minting new billionaires quicker than the US is.
63 Post contains links windy95 : No he donated his inheritance to charity...Romney’s tax returns show that he donated over $7 million in 2010-2011 alone, over 16% of his income. Ho
64 mt99 : Controversial enough for him to speak late on Monday- did anyone notice that his hair was a bit unkempt?? OH PLEASE! you are happy that he tells the
65 D L X : Scholarships are very nice things.
66 Post contains links and images Revelation : So, it's "blame the messenger" time already? I did, and I also have seen Romney in action for quite a while, and I stand by my claim that this clip s
67 Post contains links BN747 : This is hilarious and sad at the same time..a myth by Romney has some how gelled into truth. Really? You need to ask? S&L bailout Agribusiness su
68 dl021 : Seriously. The guy is talking about people who werent going to vote for him anyway, and he was being honest. The trumped up outrage from the left, wh
69 D L X : This is extremely misleading. George Romney died in 1995, when Mitt was 48. FORTY-EIGHT! On top of that, in 1995, Mitt Romney had already been head o
70 flymia : Politics. He is talking about campaign MONEY, this is politics and campaign stuff he is talking about not the country, not policy but where the money
71 scbriml : While covert recording may be underhand and sneaky, in what way would it be illegal?
72 iFlyLOTs : Even the Fox polls say that Obama is leading by a considerable amount, how is that democratically loaded?
73 Post contains images PHX787 : How pathetic politics are Obama failed to bring us out of the hole, so we gotta vote him out. [checkmark} I was born to a successful family, but they
74 Post contains links flymia : Well first under Florida law it is illegal to record someone without their consent in a place where they reasonably expect privacy. Whether this priv
75 Post contains links tugger : 21.8% and 1.5%, respectively. http://foxnewsinsider.com/2012/04/16...tions-is-he-paying-his-fair-share/ But that is a huge problem of politicos nowad
76 flyguy89 : Because polls only take into account LIKELY voters. No. That is what the money was SUPPOSED to be used for, Fisker took the money and then promptly s
77 2707200X : Now everybody can tell that Romney's campaign is off the train tracks since the RNC convention came off as a disaster, Romney has accused Obama of sym
78 Post contains links D L X : Wait, you JUST suggested before that Ryan was poor when you said he only had his So which is it? PS, The Internet says you're wrong. http://www.nytim
79 DocLightning : No, we are climbing out of the hole. In 2010 the Tea Party-backed GOP got into congress and immediately said that their FIRST priority was making Oba
80 Post contains links and images flyguy89 : $150,000-$300,000 in student loans? Wait, I thought he didn't need any help paying for college with his family's wealth and all? Many people receive
81 Revelation : Indeed, he owns this now, and his best strategy is to put out his ideas on entitlement reform and lead the country into an honest discussion of the i
82 casinterest : It's hard to create jobs when the CEO's are shipping jobs overseas. Our GDP is the highest it hs ever been. Why aren't there more jobs? And why are t
83 Polot : A tax-deferred college savings plan is not the same thing as student loans. They are savings as the name suggests, not loans. He does not owe that mo
84 Revelation : Why do you equate student loans to: ??? They are two different things. No, but he looks hypocritical when he launches plans to cut such programs.
85 D L X : You misread. Not loans. Money. Money for his kids to go to college. No, but YOU should stop claimig he is a self made man when he actually was proppe
86 garnetpalmetto : He's not any more than I am. Or anybody else. They're protected under FERPA, same as everybody else's school records. Should he decide to release the
87 DocLightning : Yes. They were, actually. They had one demand: end the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy. They were willing to compromise on just about anything else. Th
88 tugger : Not at all. It should just be noted that the social net worked and helped and did its job. Social nets are not bad things. Didn't the Republican's la
89 Post contains links flyguy89 : Why are they shipping jobs overseas? Furthermore, what specific Obama policies do you think will reverse that trend? He doesn't want to cut it, find
90 BMI727 : Compromise is a false virtue. You don't take half of what you want when you could have all of what you want and nobody ever sat down at a chess match
91 bhill : BN747.....PRICELESS....had to wipe to coffee off my monitor....!!
92 Post contains links and images johnboy : Something tells me that's the first time you've ever referred to our fine President Barack Obama as "bi-racial".... Meanwhile, back on Planet Earth..
93 tugger : You are so frighteningly off base it is disturbing.... OK wait, I see you are "16-20" and a student, you obviously really don't get it. Whew, for a s
94 Post contains links qantas077 : Another video has surfaced from the same event...turns out the setting was that of Marc Lender who is a private equity big-shot and this time Mitt is
95 pu : Where you end up is largely determined by where you start. . Many Americans feel they've done everything right, made all the right decisions, but they
96 DocLightning : Wow, I hope you remember that next time you're handed a contract. See how far that gets ya before the contract gets offered to someone else. No, they
97 Post contains links windy95 : Distinct Visions: Obama, 1998, Espouses 'Redistribution' http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Governm...Philosophy-Contrasts-With-Romney-s Tell us something w
98 Post contains links and images zkojq : However unless someone records and releases a video/audio-tape we can only speculate as to what controversial things he might have said. Manufacturin
99 Post contains links D L X : It told us more than enough to understand that Ryan did not get where he is by hitting a home run. No, he was standing on third when others batted hi
100 BMI727 : No I compromise on things all the time. I don't like it, but I do it. My point is that compromise is not something you want to do, it's something you
101 Revelation : Some interesting points from one of the many articles on the subject: It just makes Romney look even worse! He's saying "I'll never convince them they
102 Post contains links and images flyguy89 : Like Romney was ever going to get the Palestinian vote They are not largely "determined" by where you start, however where you start can make things
103 Post contains images KPDX : This.. I don't care for either side (republicans or democrats).... but this is so hilarious to me. The glass house complexity all of these hardcore s
104 Mir : This actually explains quite nicely why it is that the GOP gets so up in arms about nontaxpayers: they see a lot more of them in their states than th
105 DeltaMD90 : ...and that's why Congress has passed hardly anything the past few years, including many bills the Republicans wanted that had a bit of Democrat in i
106 zckls04 : He's so evil- he wants everybody to have a chance of success! Seriously- that's the least contentious statement I've ever heard. You may argue about
107 Post contains images Mir : That's not really the point - it's very hard to see someone being the leader of the free world they don't think there can be a peaceful resolution to
108 BMI727 : There seems to be a false assumption that doing something is better than nothing, and that isn't the case. Lawmakers should do as much to obstruct me
109 Mir : Depends. If you can get 10 to 1, and trying for 11 to 1 might get you 11 to 1 or might get you nothing at all because you piss off the other party an
110 DocLightning : That would be a credible objection. Except most of the bills that were introduced were originally Republican ideas, INCLUDING "Obamacare," which was
111 BMI727 : That's just part of the calculus that goes into these decisions. Of course if the other party does walk you turn around and tell everyone that they a
112 flyguy89 : I don't remember defining what a self-made man was from the outset, so how could I redefine it? No, that is Frederick Douglass' definition of the sel
113 us330 : I disagree because I honestly don't think that he believes half of what he says (he being Romney). I think he's doing whatever it takes to get electe
114 BMI727 : And all of that has to be figured into the decision making. I'm not talking about the tax deal specifically, just making the point that compromise is
115 IMissPiedmont : Has anyone pointed out that Romney just verbalized his disdain for the populace while Obama keeps his hidden?
116 Post contains images zckls04 : Well obviously it would be great if everybody were rich. However there are finite resources available, and wealth doesn't come from nowhere. At some
117 Post contains images Mir : And then they turn around and tell everyone that they've compromised their own position for you plenty, and it's really you who's being obstinate. Yo
118 BMI727 : Or the country could lower taxes and regulatory barriers to create an environment that is growth friendly. If you continue policies that push busines
119 Post contains images flymia : Honestly these days it seems as though you have to have been poor when you were growing up or you can't be a good politician it is the new "in" thing
120 DeltaMD90 : Well I agree but I think they could have hammered something out in the last few years. Some things you need to take an absolute stand but there is ti
121 zckls04 : The problem is that as we have seen, that doesn't always work. I do agree with you that there are too many stupid regulations stifling business in th
122 CaliAtenza : Actually a vast majority of those 47% of people that Mitt Romney doesnt care about live in Red states..and thats the worse part..these people have bee
123 Post contains images CaliAtenza : no success isnt a bad thing at all, but when you are a condescending jerk like Romney is, it is. And furthermore, i have noticed that MANY rich peopl
124 Mir : In other words, a dictator. That may work in business, but in government there are checks and balances to ensure that you can't get to that position
125 seb146 : We have been told for decades, long before Reagan, that if we work hard and save, we will have a comfortable life. Then, the Reagan era of greed came
126 flyguy89 : That is an absolutely false, incorrect, outdated, medieval view of economics...that was the view of economics in the 15th, 16th, and 17th centuries w
127 BMI727 : Any bluff carries the risk that someone will call it. Such is brinksmanship, but again, compromise means getting less than what you are looking for a
128 Dreadnought : Why is it that people have such a huge problem distinguishing between FEDERAL and STATE programs? The whole idea of Federalism on which the Constitut
129 DeltaMD90 : I don't know why you always pick apart what I say, I tried to word it as neutrally as possible. The President's policies would affect the upper %s (F
130 zckls04 : So you're saying it is possible for everybody to be rich? What exactly is economic growth in this context measuring? Investment returns? Or GDP growt
131 StarAC17 : I really think he would be doing better than Romney at the moment. We know his baggage, we know he is an ass but he is a much more intelligent guy wh
132 cmf : Don't switch data set. Most people are hard working. And you think that fully cover the situation? You mean the greed and shortsightedness. They are
133 BMI727 : Refusing the raise the debt ceiling (which actually did nothing for spending) and causing the Dow Jones to drop something like 5% in a day wasn't a s
134 Mir : There are some places where brinksmanship is stupid because the consequences of failure are so great that they outstrip any benefits that you could g
135 flyguy89 : In theory yes, but individuals are not all the same, they have different aspirations, desires and motivations. Not everyone wants to be rich or start
136 Venus6971 : As far as I am concerned I'm still voting with my wallet. If BHO economic plans were bearing fruit he would be the guy I vote for but its a huge charl
137 Post contains images PHX787 : Guys you're gonna give me cancer here with the amount of idiocy that's spewing forth Um, We're the ones passing the legislation in the house. The dems
138 BMI727 : You did earn it. It might be worthwhile in the future to look at benefits for servicemen, but as far as I'm concerned pulling the rug out from under
139 CaliAtenza : Muslim brotherhood, gangbangers?? Seriously? I feel like I am listening to fox news here. So you really agree with Romney when he says he doesn't giv
140 Post contains images EA CO AS : I can say the same for President Obama. When does the Handicapper General show up to ensure no one has greater physical or mental ability than anyone
141 D L X : Well, since he coined the term AND provided a definition, which happens to be what pretty much EVERYONE Believes is the definition... Maybe you shoul
142 Post contains images flymia : No no no, see in this country and with this media it is ok to say radical statements about republicans that is ok. You can call them things like "rac
143 Revelation : I've encouraged a discussion of entitlements, but it's one Romney doesn't want to have, because he knows such a discussion will require him to discus
144 cmf : Why is it that some act as one is government and one is not? Why is it that people who talk about inefficient government insist on keeping it ineffic
145 Dreadnought : To live in such a place you have to buy into it, right? Would you feel the same way if some people were given condos just like the one you paid $300K
146 casinterest : You haven't been to Florida since the bubble collapsed have you ? It is a good lesson on what happens if you have overinflated value based on perciev
147 Revelation : Mitt Romney just labeled you as being irresponsible and having a victim complex. Vets are politically untouchable. Unfortunately we don't see funding
148 windy95 : So now that Motherjones has admitted to selective editing and that it did not have the whole tape which left out some important points in the context
149 casinterest : LMAO. THis coming from the party that made a party convention out of a 7 world soundbyte in a 20 minutes speach by Obama. Good luck with that. Sorry,
150 SmittyOne : I must admit I've come around quite a bit to your line of thinking regarding private equity and the role of government in business... But to be hones
151 us330 : The observation that I will make is that the increased focus on miscues by both candidates reveals the fundamental truth of how this election will tur
152 windy95 : No he did not..Nice try though. Pure fantasy. they have not sold any stock yet. GM asked them to sell it last week but the Fed said no...WE are takin
153 Post contains links windy95 : The tape is in no way harmful to him. Just like the point in his message the people who are outraged by this are already not voting for him. That was
154 casinterest : Not sure where you are going here, Romney has already "Owned" the comments. The selective editing you are worried about occurs after he has made his
155 PPVRA : A condominium you buy into as an OPTION and you have a WAY OUT. What you propose is that people are born into a contract, a slavery contract, and tha
156 Revelation : Only in Washington is a man speaking his mind considered a gaffe or a miscue. Romney's policy plans reek of elitist class warfare, so it's good he's
157 PPVRA : No, it reeks of the vote buying schemes socialists play. It reeks of playing majority rule games, pitting the lower majority on the income scale agai
158 cmf : There are plenty of people who paid less and plenty who have paid more. It all comes down to when you bought and how big apartment. We all have ident
159 Post contains images zckls04 : Fair enough, I'm not going to argue with you on that since it's rather hard to say for certain what that substance may be. My point was only that the
160 BMI727 : India, China, and Brazil have a few billion for you. That is backwards. You are responsible for making sure you have the best possible environment, I
161 johnboy : Bingo. Didn't you know it's only class warfare when the our fine President Barack Obama says something about helping the poor and middle-class. NEVER
162 Post contains images PHX787 : I don't watch Fox News. I get my information from my contacts in the Military. I get my information from the State department websites. I get my info
163 lewis : So that is communism, huh?
164 Post contains images zckls04 : Agreed, not even Fox would say anything so ludicrous. Obama gets his funding from "gang leaders". Really? Which gang leaders are these? Grow up- even
165 flyguy89 : According to the wikipedia article you cited, Benjamin Franklin also had his own definition that pre-dates Douglass...doesn't look like consensus to
166 SmittyOne : Indeed - your ambition is extremely one-dimensional right now but beware that your definition of "bite me in the ass" may change over time. At your a
167 BMI727 : It's not Communism. But it's definitely not charity or liberty either. And, lest we forget, an increase in the tax rates prolonged the Great Depressi
168 Post contains links Revelation : Let's say we do end up taking from the top earners and put it into improving education in general and getting more students through college in partic
169 zckls04 : I might be wrong, but AFAIK the wealth of the lowest brackets were not trending upwards in real terms. I don't think they're any better off now than
170 Post contains links johnboy : http://www.people-press.org/2012/09/...ter-image-and-lead-on-most-issues/ "Romney has gained no ground on Obama in being seen as more credible or more
171 Post contains images EA CO AS : I've watched it several times, and that is precisely what he meant. Only because that's what you want to see. Try watching it with an open mind inste
172 us330 : Hmm--this statement: Compared to this statement: Marx and Engels would beg to differ.
173 cmf : No I am not saying that. I'm saying you are required to live with the terms of the society you're live in. You're rewrite is disgusting. Suggesting s
174 Post contains links Revelation : Feel free to go with that point of view, but from what I can tell, you are in the vast minority. Meanwhile, we read how Romney's mother has pointed o
175 BMI727 : Why should that make me angry, or annoyed, or disappointed? Some people made money. Good for them. If I get paid, I won't think twice. No it isn't. I
176 EA CO AS : Who said you shouldn't? Taxes were meant to pay for common-use infrastructure like roads, the military, etc. I don't get greater benefit of the nucle
177 DocLightning : So someone with a yearly income of $15,000 should have to pay, say, half their income in taxes, while someone with a yearly income of $15M should hav
178 Post contains images Revelation : Ok, I have $1, what's your pay-pal address?
179 D L X : Read it again. It states pretty clearly that the definitions are similar. And completely different from your new one. Dude, this is getting old. Why
180 flyguy89 : Not with high inflation, high unemployment, and fuel shortages. We're already doing that though, and it doesn't address their earning/job prospects b
181 Revelation : It's irrational to point out that the rich are getting richer while Romney has his focus on the poor?
182 DocLightning : So if it's 20%, then the $15K family pays $3K in taxes leaving them with $12K to spend. The $15M family pays $3M in taxes leaving them with $12M to s
183 Post contains links zckls04 : Whoops! I'm being careless. You're quite right- that figure was before tax. The US has the largest OECD income disparity aside from such luminaries a
184 cmf : Why are you not mentioning governing? You know the thing where they take the wishes of everyone and try to make the best of all different wills. I al
185 BMI727 : The decisions about how, where, and when they provide those services is governing. We have laws to protect people's rights and enforcement for the sa
186 EA CO AS : You're jumping to conclusions; I specifically said same rate, not same amount. Yes. And I don't see what's inherently unfair about that. Why wouldn't
187 cmf : It is called democracy. No, the joke is that you think it is an argument. You have an opt out, move. You have stated that is what will happen several
188 BMI727 : No, that's tyranny of the majority. There is no "wishes of everyone" so any attempt to govern everyone in a way that is satisfactory is doomed to fai
189 cws818 : Idiocy does not cause cancer. However, if it did..... We? Who are you? Are you a member of the Congress? If not, YOU haven't passed a thing. Again, w
190 cws818 : First ever a.net collection plate?
191 BMI727 : You're several zeros and a few commas short.
192 seb146 : Like how he was so impressed with Chinese labor camps? The whole UNEDITED speech can be seen on youtube. What's the problem? Mother Jones simply poin
193 Pellegrine : Ok so your flag and the fact that you've brought my name up says it all. You feel threatened by President Obama. So what's next?
194 cws818 : One would hope so!!!!
195 BMI727 : Exactly what money left your pocket and went into the pocket of a millionaire in tax breaks or corporate welfare? When you let someone keep money tha
196 DocLightning : Then I'm afraid that I will never be able to explain it to you. Healthcare is absolutely necessary. Without it there is a very good chance would not
197 BMI727 : No, I don't and for a very simple reason. If you want the government to cook the meal, you'll have to let the government shop for the groceries. That
198 cws818 : That is not true. Has that happened in Japan, Canada, or the United Kingdom?
199 BMI727 : No, but it introduces unfairness into the system. Why should a health conscious person have to pay for people who eat, drink, or smoke themselves to
200 cws818 : That's called life. As an under 25 year old man, did you choose to be in a higher-risk auto insurance bracket?
201 BMI727 : Nope, but I could find different insurance providers or take a different level of coverage. And of course my rates would change based on accidents or
202 cws818 : And you would still pay a higher premium than a 45 year old woman. No system is perfect and all systems exhibit some degree of inequity. Unless you p
203 cws818 : Please enlighten us: which pieces of legislation, and what potential "miracles"?
204 Post contains images cmf : That is your wish... Why should government be different from private companies in how they select in-house or outsourced? What you advocate is ineffi
205 SmittyOne : I agree with the BMI on this point. If we collectively are footing the bill for people's health care then we collectively should have a say in people
206 Revelation : You are very good at generating logical fallacies. You shoot down government health care by insisting it have all kinds of burdens it need not have,
207 Dreadnought : And the actual, effective rate of taxes collected were essentially no higher than when they were cut in half. Why do you think that was?
208 casinterest : Because the Rich used Swiss Bank accounts , offshore accounts, and tax shelters when the rates were high. Kinda like Romney.
209 Post contains images D L X : Well look. Your position is ridiculous. But if you want to twist the definition of self made man to suit your own purposes and make your idea seem le
210 EA CO AS : That's because there's nothing to explain. Yes, I understand the idea behind the whole "flat taxes are unfair" argument, but it's a horribly flawed o
211 casinterest : Flat taxes are horribly flawed and not in place for a reason. Their is no incentive for politicians on either side to drive the economy, or for folks
212 D L X : If you have a straight flat tax, perhaps. But if you did it intelligently, excepting things like necessary food items and housing, it could be done v
213 Dreadnought : Or a tiered flat tax, which would be a hybrid of a progressive tax structure, but with no loopholes or deductions. I would not mind that. I emphatica
214 casinterest : This becomes progressive though. It would be nice, but not everyone does the same thing or has the same requirments for work or living. If the tax co
215 flipdewaf : The people who make the laws and the legal system. There isn't anything else that the Gov't would need to provide. What do you think is "absolutely n
216 windy95 : Correct. Why do they have to go to the drastic side with this. The "Fair tax" has all the exemptions for the lower class. They would actually pay les
217 casinterest : But then it isn't a flat tax. It becomes progressive.
218 Dreadnought : I have no problem with the idea of progressive tax rates. The problem is that it has become far too progressive in the US. EVERYONE should have to pa
219 windy95 : No it is not progressive..It stays the same for everyone above the poverty level. Your point that it effects the poor is wrong. Below the level made
220 D L X : You can do that now. You can look at the table, calculate your tax, and file a 1040EZ. No, that's a bad idea. You have to encourage people to make th
221 casinterest : I think you should get a deduction for what you pay to Guernsey for taxes, but as long as you are waving the US passport, and all the rights and prot
222 D L X : Why should it?
223 casinterest : because then incentives to do specifc things is taken away. the Tax code is also an incentive code. Housing, private property, and others would be wo
224 Mir : ORLY? Is that why the republican Secretary of State of Ohio limited early voting hours in primarily democratic counties while extending them in prima
225 Post contains links Revelation : Meanwhile, out in the real world: Republicans: Bad gets worse for Romney and: New poll shows Obama leads Romney in key swing states Cue the posts of h
226 Dreadnought : From the IRS website: Form 1040EZ is the simplest form to fill out. You may use Form 1040EZ if you meet all the following conditions: Your filing sta
227 casinterest : Not when I workd for another company. Are they going to retire oversees,? If so , then they should turn in their citizenship. Otherwise Social Securi
228 Post contains images D L X : Solution to that is easy: sales tax instead of income tax. Then just don't charge tax on things we... um... don't want to tax. Boom. You're welcome.
229 Dreadnought : They should not be eligible for SS and Medicare if they did not pay into them. As for defense, don't be silly. Like I said, all other modern countrie
230 casinterest : Not all other modern countries overspend on defense quite to the tune of the US, and SS and Medicare, do they get fractions of support, I mean hell t
231 Post contains images zckls04 : I agree that the tax code should be simple enough that you don't have to hire an advisor to do it, but instead of simplifying the tax code to the poi
232 seb146 : Interesting. Tax hikes proposed by Democrats would affect those making over $250,000. A majority of income earners file this tax return. Oh, and, by
233 Dreadnought : You are missing the point. If you can do a simple form (like the 1040EZ) but in doing so you are missing out on the hundreds of possible deductions a
234 Revelation : Seems Romney has decided not to get in front of this issue, and is paying the price for that in the polls. Ok, but that still leaves Romney to use the
235 D L X : Hah! In most cases, you had to hire a tax advisor to help you figure out the credits in order to decide whether you wanted to do the tax-beneficial a
236 Post contains images BMI727 : Seb's the one that goes on and on about how much we are "giving" the wealthy. You do if you want the system to be fair or efficient. It isn't fair fo
237 Post contains links PSA53 : I think Obama's "Redistribution" audio and video tapes is just as shocking.This sends a clear message of Obama's intentions of Robin Hood socialism. H
238 mt99 : Yup back in 1998 ..Guess what? he already got elected once after he said that..So everyone must be OK with that,. Anywho, back to this century - you
239 casinterest : At least he cares about peo[ple. a 14 year old clip is harldly worthy. Let's bring up Bain Business Docs amd romney tax forms to see where he really
240 flipdewaf : No, bust. Discouraging spending certainly isn't the way to help an economy. Fred
241 PSA53 : And how many people knew of this? I found out just last night.How many more didn't know? How much does the media protect Obama? How much did the medi
242 mt99 : Its not my fault that you did not inform yourself properly.. IN any case, you did not respond to my question - i am very interested in your answer:
243 PSA53 : Because in a political campaign you don't say unless that you have real,real prove to back it up.Because it would, and as it is happening, the media
244 PSA53 : Nonsense! People need to be reminded.It might have passed me.But it is important enough that the media is cover it,isn't it? So,don't blow it off.
245 mt99 : So "shocking" is the wrong word then."Stupid" would have fit the bill better? Yes - it indeed passed you by.. However, I knew about it - .. What do y
246 Mir : He said he believes in redistribution to a certain extent. Well, so does Mitt Romney. So I don't really see what they're trying to get at. -Mir
247 PSA53 : In this case the proper better wording is stupid,I agree with you.Yes,it was. The public has a short memory and needs to be reminded.2) To be reminde
248 PSA53 : GOP to prove Obama's intention of people's dependancy on government.
249 casinterest : Go watch your clip, and really try to absorb more than 8 words about what Obama is talking about. His Redistribution was in the Government funds, but
250 mt99 : OK. how often does the public need to be reminded you think? once a week? twice? What would make you happy? And fine. say I buy into you Liberal Medi
251 PSA53 : Thanks,i saw that whole thing which was more inpartial(CNN) then being blasted for giving you a FOX clip.2) Covernment funds mean TAX PAYER money. Bu
252 casinterest : News Flash! Government Funds are tax payer money. you are doing a good job proving my point about the standard GOP attention span. I have more cents
253 PSA53 : Every campaign of anyone running for public office. There is no time bomb. 100% agreed.But that doesn't mean that you or I can't question certain beh
254 mt99 : Whats does that mean? So how do you propose to fix this unfairness?
255 PSA53 : If your running for public office, at any level of government,even for re-election, all past and present behavoir is up for public review. Go to airl
256 mt99 : Including past tax returns?
257 PSA53 : Very good. The answer is yes.And the mdeia has been hounding him for it..But Romeny knows this a Obama tactic to deflect issues,as well.But yes.I'm n
258 SmittyOne : Fred, I've wondered about this...would it be a case of "tomayto / tomahto"?...ie if you take home more money (no income tax) but things you want to b
259 Mir : Saying he believes in redistribution to a certain extent doesn't prove that at all when Romney believes the same thing. -Mir
260 Post contains images cmf : I commented in what you wrote. Obviously redirection is all you got. No it isn't. Nor is it fair that GOP overstate the problem to trash it for the m
261 BMI727 : Seb goes on and on about how much we give the rich, but cannot point to money leaving his pocket and going into theirs. The logical fallacy lies in e
262 cmf : No it isn't. The logical fallacy is in your description. No, that is not why, and your statement is factually incorrect. Wealth for the richest is gr
263 BMI727 : What money is the government taking from your pocket and giving to the 1%? Every time I turn around there's some liberal going off about how nobody e
264 Post contains images cmf : Logical fallacy. Why isn't the 1% paying their fair share of taxes. And lets not forget people below them. You and your friends insist on blocking th
265 Post contains links mt99 : Ask the Forbes 400 The combined net worth of the 2012 class of the 400 richest Americans is $1.7 trillion, up from $1.5 trillion a year ago. The aver
266 BMI727 : That's not an answer. They are. They get the same roads as me. We're protected by the same Army. I don't see how the government is giving them benefi
267 mt99 : No no i do not think that they owe me either. I am glad that they are getting richer! But you are telling me that we need to further reduce their tax
268 EA CO AS : I have two words for you: tough shit. By the left's reasoning, it's "inherently unfair" that the wealthy family has so much more to begin with. This
269 cmf : The answer is in the sentence following what you quoted. No. Remember the condo association analogy about use of shared spaces. Of course there are c
270 Mir : If you want to punish the poor for being poor by taking more of their money, fine. But it's rather curious that you'd complain that the government is
271 BMI727 : In this context it's less about personal taxes and more about corporate taxes and regulation. The solution, of course, is to make elsewhere here. The
272 Post contains images Aesma : The world I don't know but here it doesn't work that way, donations are a minimal part of campaigns that are largely paid for by the state. Parties a
273 EA CO AS : If this were 70 years ago you might have an argument. However in today's day and age, the real things unions fought for - overtime pay requirements,
274 cmf : Nor do I get more use to common areas even though I pay more than most in maintenance fee, and for the same reason. That only shows how little experi
275 BMI727 : What government have you been dealing with? I've been to enough DMVs and Social Security offices to know better. And even if there are inefficiencies
276 Mir : In general, I want everyone to feel the same pain when it comes to taxation. Since taking a small percentage of a wealthy person's discretionary inco
277 seb146 : I am just reminding everyone about what is going on. So, he said that in 1998. He was elected to the U.S. Senate and Presidency after that. So, there
278 cmf : That is my argument, but you need to go back more than 70 years. I hate to see pay set that way. Doesn't change my point. They are needed to balance
279 seb146 : Sounds kinda like what we have now with Wal-Mart, McDonalds, K-Mart, Home Depot workers. You know the ones: The lazy SOBs who's jobs got shipped to C
280 BMI727 : Except now there are laws that prevent blatant abuses by employers, as there should be. These days unions seem to exist largely to engage in anti-com
281 Post contains images EA CO AS : So we agree you don't have one. Excellent; I knew you'd come around. And yet, that's how unions operate. So you're lazy? Seriously? SERIOUSLY? Who? L
282 Mir : Farm subsidies. The Ex-Im Bank. TARP. Various bailouts. Gasoline subsidies. And the list goes on. -Mir
283 cws818 : I wasn't the one who said that!! Many dictators throughout history have agreed with you.
284 cws818 : Indeed. I'd like an answer to that bit of nonsense as well.
285 BMI727 : I've yet to meet a billionaire farmer. Some are millionaires, but only on paper. That said, farm subsidies should be phased out. That's one thing tha
286 cws818 : Is a dictator supposed to be a good thing?
287 flipdewaf : Proof?... Didn't think so. I think that there would be an initial shock but that it would die down but it would stay lower than it would have done. I
288 flipdewaf : What difference should it make if its a small business, surely according to your ideas then if the small business can't survive then fuck em! Why is
290 flipdewaf : Which Billionaires have you met? This may be the reason why you havent met one who is a farmer. Fred
291 Revelation : Isn't it great living in a world where corporations are people?
292 Post contains images garnetpalmetto : In as much as I dislike the Citizens United ruling, it's regrettable it's come to that. In that Mir points out that farm subsidies are a way that the
293 Mir : The people who run ADM are doing pretty well for themselves. Absolutely. And I actually support keeping the Ex-Im Bank around for that reason. But it
294 seb146 : Way to avoid the point I was making. No-bid contracts for security and transportation. Tax cuts for things like capital gains. Ordinary citizens can
295 zckls04 : If the private enterprises provide an essential public service, what then? There seems to be a continual process in many countries where public servi
296 BMI727 : Competition and profit motive are very powerful. It was raised as a way of redistributing wealth to the rich. Because it was poised to be a meltdown
297 zckls04 : Go to San Bruno and say that....
298 EA CO AS : You were making a point? Funny, it sure didn't look like it to me. I'm saying if you want to assign blame, look in the mirror. Frankly I think assign
299 Mir : Subsidizing a public corporation is still subsidizing the wealthy. Sure. So why is corporate welfare fine but welfare to the common man anathema? Tha
300 BMI727 : It's also subsidizing all of the average people who invest with it. That's not in line with the story the liberals push. As far as I'm concerned it's
301 zckls04 : I agree that assigning blame to the business is as asinine as assigning blame to the consumer; their job after all is to make money. Define "high". I
302 Mir : If they give their money to the company first, yes. I don't automatically get any benefit if ADM does well. I could if I wanted to fork over some cas
303 PSA53 : RELEASED! See other thread.[Edited 2012-09-21 11:38:11]
304 mt99 : Only 1 .. for 1 year..2011.. How about some more?
305 BMI727 : I was told I automatically get benefit if GM does well. A fair bit does. I don't like subsidies at all, but considering that the government will forc
306 Mir : If the government loans GM money and then that money gets repaid to the government plus interest, then the taxpayers do automatically benefit. But th
307 cws818 : I'll repost the question. Fortunately, our government does not ask "will BMI727 personally, individually, and immediately benefit if we do X?" before
308 CaliAtenza : no..i will not "Sit Down and Shut Up". I am not some child that you can address that way. You dont have to be a jerk about it, i dont mind you pointi
309 cws818 : Bingo.
310 Post contains links flymia : I find it amusing that there is a thread over 300 replies long about comments about from a private campaign function and yet no thread about a large p
311 Revelation : I find it predictable that conservatives want to change the topic!
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Mitt Romney Campaign Planes posted Thu Aug 30 2012 23:04:03 by Kiffy
Romney: "No One's Ever Asked To See My Birth Cert" posted Fri Aug 24 2012 10:29:58 by bestwestern
Romney Campaign Data Mining posted Fri Aug 24 2012 07:33:52 by casinterest
Breaking News: Romney To Announce VP posted Fri Aug 10 2012 20:47:40 by randyh3253
Olympics:Romney's Horse Rafalca Take A Dive? posted Tue Aug 7 2012 11:04:37 by mt99
Romney: "Devoid Of Charm, Offensive And A Wazzock" posted Fri Jul 27 2012 07:19:31 by Revelation
The Things That Make Romney Great! posted Wed Jul 18 2012 07:32:36 by D L X
Green Eggs And Romney? posted Thu Jul 12 2012 21:55:51 by Revelation
Disgusting Behavior By A Romney Supporter posted Fri Jul 6 2012 01:14:18 by caliatenza
Romney, The GOP, And "Obamacare" posted Thu Jul 5 2012 16:19:30 by TecumsehSherman