Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Ram Diesel Used 2500/ 2013 New Diesel?  
User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7437 posts, RR: 62
Posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 4734 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

So I am looking for my first pickup and I want a diesel, personal preference. Needs will include towing RV and trailers.

My only reservations against getting a Dodge vs a Chevy is that I've read about rust issues with the body as well as needing a new transmission sooner. But any truth there?

I've been considering buying a late model 2500 w/ Cummins diesel. I dont think I want to swing upwards of 50K on a new one (but I could after driving the Laramie Longhorn.)

So I went to the dealership this weekend and test rode the 2012 Ram 2500 Laramie Longhorn. OMG, such a great thrill.

Then I started talking to the dealer about how I wished they'd put a diesel in the 1500 and how I've read about rumors online. I loved that I saw with the new 2013, specifically the grill shutters and the air suspension. Come to think of it, what is the Checy competition to the Ram 1500?

Then he dropped the bomb... and he said that it in the coming year, its going to happen.

But, the 1500's diesel will likely be the smaller non-cummins one called the "VM." And having only heard of Cummins, I'm curious to know more about this one.

So a few questions:

1. Are there issues with Ram and rust?

2. What sort of transmissions issues could I expect at 5 or 10 years out? My understanding is that while the Cummins Diesel engine is quite reliable, the transmission used is less reliable.

3. Looks like either a used 2500 or a new 1500. But how reliable is that VM engine?

4. Lastly, the impression I get is that a Ram 2500 Crew gets maybe 15 mpg while the current 1500 Hemi does better. Is that accurate?

If a diesel is put into the 1500, what should be expected in MPG vs a Hemi in the 1500? Should be better in the diesel, right?

5. Also, in speaking with the salesperson, I was asking what the differences were b/w 1500 and 2500. HE remarked about things such as the 1500 suspension being coil-like on a locomotive vs leaf springs on the 2500. Does coil suspension made it ride smoother?

Here is what I've read: Rumors of a Ram diesel have been around for a while, and Allpar was told two years ago that there was definitely work on a Cummins V6 in the Ram 1500 (a V6, not the straight-six Ram currently uses in the 2500 and up). We believe however that the Ram 1500 diesel, which is likely to be coming soon, will use the VM 3.0 instead

and

http://blogs.dieselpowermag.com/6771...014-ton-diesel-ram-1500-spy-photo/

How reliable is that VM engine? Other notes I've read indicate, "The diesel chosen was not the Cummins V6 or V8 models, which are used by Nissan and the U.S. military and were originally to go into various Rams; instead, it appears that Chrysler is choosing to use the VM 3.0 V6 diesel, which counts as an internal Fiat unit. Chrysler has used VM diesels for many years in its European cars, and the 3-liter V6 is a modern unit that can pass both American and European emissions standards."

So, to our friends in Europe, how reliable is that engine?

I don't know how reliable either is above, but look forward to impressions.


Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
32 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6094 posts, RR: 9
Reply 1, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4689 times:

While available in some cars, minivans, SUVs, that V6 is probably not a big seller here, with maybe more sales in big 3 tons trucks. An uncle of mine recently bought a Fiat Ducato based RV and even to move that thing he only took a 130HP straight 4 multijet. I just checked and the V6 is not even offered for it : http://www.fiatcamper.com/product/engines


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8198 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4668 times:

Quoting mirrodie (Thread starter):
Then he dropped the bomb... and he said that it in the coming year, its going to happen.

But, the 1500's diesel will likely be the smaller non-cummins one called the "VM." And having only heard of Cummins, I'm curious to know more about this one.

The reason they do not sell Cummins in the 1500 is it wouldn't offer any performance advantage in a 1500 given the duties of that truck. Also, the 8500# classification may be part of it.

Suggest looking into the 3.6 liter 8 speed combination on the 2013 Ram? Or, is this high altitude towing? A cummins is enough engine to power a school bus. If you are a 1500 buyer, it just seems unusual why you want an extremely heavy, $10,000+ diesel motor. But of course, you should buy what you like.

It's probably safest not to put any creedence in rumors of future diesel products. 99% of these diesel rumors turn out to be lies (oh, the Honda Accord will be diesel, as will the Chevy Malibu, etc). But, Chrysler is just crazy enough you can't rule anything out with them.

[Edited 2012-10-21 16:14:46]

User currently offlinenjxc500 From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 232 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 4652 times:

I have owned three of these 2500 Dodge Cummins trucks.... a 1998, a 2001, and now I have a 2006. I put 125,000 on each of them before I sold them, and I now have 110,000 on my 06. In my opinion these are well built trucks, but make no mistake it's all about the engine. The cummins is what makes this truck what it is, and it's an absolute monster. I'll try to answer some questions for you.

1. I had some rust at the bottom of my doors in my 98, none on either of the others. Seems like it's maybe an older model year problem.

2. I had a sensor go out in my 2001, that's it. These are hard work miles. I towed a bulldozer, and I plow snow.

3. The venture into a new engine is a real head scratcher, I would never buy it in the first model year, personally.

4. I would venture to say that a used cummins will get equal mpg to a gas, but much better when you are towing. Those gas motors can drop under 10 pulling a big load, the cummins won't get that low under normal towing.

I don't know what you would expect out of that 1500 diesel, but it could be impressive, that being said a used cummins will pull a load way WAY better than whatever 150HP engine they put in that.

5. Well the Dodges have always been coil link in the front, so I assume you are talking rear. Yes, coils can improve the ride, but that is why you need to determine what the primary use of the truck will be. You will be giving up a lot of capacity with that coil suspension.

I guess you can tell I love my truck, but both are nice. It depends what you want to do with it. If you want to hook up to a 5th wheel camper, hitch a boat to the back of that and go down the road at 20,000 lbs., you only have one choice.

Good luck.


User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12163 posts, RR: 36
Reply 4, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 4627 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I think if you're gonna be doing a lot of heavy towing you're better off getting the 2500 anyways. The limitation on the 1500 size trucks isn't the engine, it's the frame just isn't built for it.


911, where is your emergency?
User currently offlineRFields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7344 posts, RR: 32
Reply 5, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 4610 times:

I have a 4,200 lb ski boat and trailer combo. I have a 4,862 lb empty weight, 5,600 lb normal tow load with with empty tanks - 30 ft travel trailer (7,400 lb GVRW). (I weigh my trailer at least once a month, and use race car scales to check the weight on each of the four wheels. I constantly strive to eliminate weight from the trailer, and to balance the load on each wheel as evenly as possible.)

I had a Ford F-150 and frankly the truck was often straining to handle the travel trailer. The boat could be a challenge at times. The listed tow capacity for the F-150/ Transmission/ Rear End combo was 6,800 lbs.

Six weeks ago I got a 2012 Ram 2500 Megacab with the 5.7L Hemi. Didn't feel the extra $7,200 for the diesel was worth it. It has a 10,600 lb tow rating. (And I LOVE the Megacab option)

I love how it handles both trailers with no problem.

My RV club has about 50% Dodge trucks, and all but three are diesel. The 2500 is the most popular. There are 12 Ram 2500s from a 97 to two other 2012s. They tow several travel trailers up to 8,500 GVRW, and 5th wheels up to 12,600 GVRW.

I've heard almost no complaints about the Dodge as far as a tow vehicle. I've heard about one Dodge dealer in Dallas folks don't like. I've heard about a quirk with the newer model TPMS - which affected my truck on my first weekend.

I had a problem in that it would not take fuel properly the first time I tried to fill the tank. I thought it might be the vapor recovery pumps/ dispensers we have in Dallas, but a trip into rural Texas showed that wasn't the problem. The dealer quickly found the vent hose from the fuel tank was crimped by the charcoal filter. They replaced that - an hour and 20 minutes from showing up unannounced to driving away fixed.

As far as fuel mileage. I did a lot of research with the various Dodge, Ford and Chevy 2500/250 trucks - about 45 owners. The short answer is that the rear axle ratio and the speed you drive with the trailer impact fuel mileage more than the diesel or gas choice.

A truck like the one I got with the best fuel economy rear end does better on non-towing driving. Under a towing load, you are going to get worse gas mileage.

The Ram 2500 got 17.2 mpg on a 250 mile freeway trip at 68 mph on the cruise control. It got 18.5 mpg on the return with the cruise set to 62 mph.

That is as good as the F-150 with a 4.8.

But when towing - the fuel mileage drops to 11.4 at best and 9.4 at worst. Note - I have not towed with this truck in a long up hill haul - such as Dallas to Amarillo, or against a heavy head wind. I would expect to lose 1 to 1.5 mpg in such conditions. The F-150 ran 10.2 to 8.9 in the same trips as I've driven the Ram 2500. It ran 7.7 on a trip to Amarillo, and 10.2 on the trip back.

If I had a higher ratio rear end - my research among other owners is that I would have lower mileage without the trailer, but a little bit better with the trailer.

My diesel friends do about 10-15% better when towing than gas. Which is offset by the 10-15% higher cost of fuel. However, they have a lot more torque and power when driving in the mountains of New Mexico and Colorado.

Based on my experience I would most strongly recommend against waiting for the 1500 diesel. If you got an axle ratio enough to pull a decent sized trailer, you would be unhappy with the non-towing performance. The 2500 is the way to go.

Also the 2500 is going to weigh about 850-1000 lbs more than the 1500. That will really help you when the wind kicks up while towing.

Look at the weight of the possible trailer purchase. Add 2,500 to 3,000 lbs. That should be your minimum towing capacity for a new truck purchase. As one friend said - buy as much truck as you can afford. Eventually, you will get a trailer that needs the extra capability.

Just my opinion.

I'm heading out tomorrow morning for a 800 mile trip to western Texas.

[Edited 2012-10-21 20:28:21]

User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12163 posts, RR: 36
Reply 6, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 4579 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting RFields5421 (Reply 5):
The Ram 2500 got 17.2 mpg on a 250 mile freeway trip at 68 mph on the cruise control. It got 18.5 mpg on the return with the cruise set to 62 mph.

Wow...wish I got that  
Quoting RFields5421 (Reply 5):
I had a Ford F-150

That's what I have

Quoting RFields5421 (Reply 5):
frankly the truck was often straining to handle the travel trailer

That worries me...although I don't think I'd ever get a 30 footer. The wife thinks a rental camping cabin is camping enough for her  



911, where is your emergency?
User currently offlineGeezer From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 1479 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4512 times:

I'm very short on time here, but I will say this..........

I have a 2000 Ram /Dodge, 3500, six speed manual; (the truck is bright red) ( and is 100%, just like it came off the assembly line.)

For a vehicle that has NEVER been in a garage, the paint damn near looks new. as for rust...........I live in western Indiana; my truck shows NO rust what-so-ever.

As for the transmission...........I LOVE it ! Automatics are great.........(for people who don't know how to use a clutch properly  after something in the vicinity of 2,000,000 miles (and 41 years) driving diesel trucks, 99.9 % of which have had manual transmissions, I consider myself to be pretty "familiar" with clutches and transmissions.

Know this about the 6 cylinder, in-line Cummins in Dodge trucks; (and this is hard, cold facts, NOT my "opinion" ).........
the Cummins engine has 40% FEWER moving parts than either the V-8 Navistar so-called "Powerstroke"; it's not a "bad" engine.........but it's not even in the same league with the Cummins. Need proof of that statement ? Go to Elkhart, Indiana; 80% or all travel trailers are built in and around Elkhart; hell, it's the RV capital of the world ! How do you suppose all pf those travel trailers get from the manufacturer to the dealer who sells them ? They get towed there by 1 ton PU trucks; a LOT of guys start towing trailers with Fords, (because they "like" Fords,,,,yada, yada, yada......till, their "mighty power stroke" "craps out"; there is a BIG industry that has "come about", re-powering Ford 1 tons with a Cummins. In this business, a 500,000 mile Cummins is an "everyday, fact of life"; ( you won't find many 500 K power strokes !) (if any) (ditto for Duramax)

Hey.......in the trailer towing "world", if you don't rack up 150K miles a year on your truck, you're considered to be "lazy" !

(Which is one of the thousand or so reasons I elected to haul new cars for a living, and drive "other people's trucks" ( who had to pay me like $20/hr when THEIR truck "broke")

If you "salivate" over fancy leather seats, and lots of "do-dads", by all means buy yourself a new Ford (or GM) product; (and expect to buy another one in 5 or 6 years) If you just "hate to shift gears"........get an automatic ! (almost ALL women do) If you seriously want to buy a truck that will "LAST"..........better get yourself a Dodge / Ram, (or whatever they call them now)

I bought my Dodge with 60K on the clock ten years ago; (to be my first, last, and ONLY diesel PU truck ); so far, me and the truck are still about even; I'll be 80 in December, and still cranking along like a 50 yr old; the Dodge only has 106,000 on the clock, and since I quit using it for my "daily driver" and bought Miss Arlie her Cube, it's starting to look like the damned truck might just "outlast" me ! 600-700 miles in the last 6 or 7 months ............

That's the "key"........get a great deal on a great low mileage truck; then DON"T try to wear the damned thing out, driving it day in , day out, to go to girl scout meetings, etc. get yourself a Cube to do all the "light lifting" ! It's the PERFECT combination........(for me) ( you may "need" a Lamborghini to keep you "happy"......(I don't)

Back to trucks..........is the Dodge "perfect" ? hell no ! "perfect" isn't out yet ! If I ever meet the "schmuck" who "figured out" all the gear ratios for the six speed, I'd love to ask him one question..........:"were you REALLY trying to build a transmission to win trailer backing-up races ?" If not.......then why in the hell does reverse go about 4 times as fast as it's common sense to back a trailer up ? ( And why only a damned 6 speed ? ) I would be much happier if the thing had a 8 (or 10) speed Road Ranger tranny ! 6 speeds are just great for hauling 2 or 3 old ladies to the grocery store.........but that;'s not what people who buy 1 ton diesel pick up trucks use them for; they buy the damned things to "pull things"........mostly pretty damned heavy things; (and not always on flat roads) Example..........

My 22 ft tilt deck trailer weighs 2,500 lbs; the Dodge weighs about 7,500 lbs. That's 5 tons right there, empty; I have hauled a few loads of logs, scrap metal, lumber, and just "this & that" that grossed out at 22 to 24 K; that's 7 tons of actual load, from Cincinnati, to Terre Haute, about 200 fairly "flat" miles"; that's about 7,000 pounds more than the 2000 model year, 24 valve Cummins engine should pull, (with any regularity); with about 2 to 4 K of "goodies" on the engine, doubling the torque, it would become "a piece of cake" ! It IS a piece of cake for a new 2012 Ford, GM. or Dodge; (they have like 2 to 3 times the torque to do it; ( but they still don't have the brakes to stop that kind of weight, day in, day out.) Plus, sheer "power" isn't "everything"......lots of power tends to "wear" all of those 40% of unnecessary moving parts "out", (before their time). If you just "have to have" a diesel pick up truck that can "out-drag" a new Corvette, with enough bucks you can sure get one that can do it...........(but don't expect it to last for a life time, cause it won't.) There's a LOT to know about trucks and pulling things...........after 40 years, I've learned some of it, but if I had 40 more years, I still couldn't learn it all; (no one can, IMHO) (Even though there are a surprising number of people who THINK they "know it all" right now.) ( Don't worry, I won't mention any names ! )

Charley



Stupidity: Doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result; Albert Einstein
User currently onlineKiwiRob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 6625 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 4461 times:

Quoting mirrodie (Thread starter):

So, to our friends in Europe, how reliable is that engine?

I guess it's the same V6 as the one used in the Jeep Grand Cherokee, from what I understand it's a pretty reliable unit. When I was looking at the Grand Cherokee early this year I had a good look around the net for any issues with the diesel, I couldn't find anything, it looks like a solid power plant.


User currently offlineGeezer From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 1479 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 4442 times:

Having more time today, I just now re-read to OP's original post;

About rust............to start with, vehicle rust has a LOT more to do with where you live, how much salt they put on the roads, (and how much effort YOU put in to wash away the salt after driving on salted roads, than it does with the "make" of the truck. They will ALL rust if you get them "salty", and don't wash it off. In this day and age, anyone should have a small pressure washer to wash away salt from under their vehicles. With that said, it's my considered opinion that GM built trucks (with all things being equal), are more prone to rusting "soon er" than either Ford or Dodge trucks.

My 2000 Dodge isn't even undercoated, and still it has no rust; It takes me just a few minutes (in an old rain suit that I keep just for this purpose, to wash out the wheel wells, and the entire underneath.

I have absolutely nothing against 1/2 ton PU trucks; (as long as you use it for a "car" ); but half tons are merely "cars" with a "bed"; if you want to tow ANYTHING heavier than about 2,000 lbs. it's beyond foolish to do it with a half ton; you need a TRUCK; and as there isn't very much difference in price between a 2500 and a 3500, you're miles ahead with a 3500; 8 lug wheels instead of 6 lug; far heavier frame, much heavier brakes, the list just goes on and on;
Many people "assume" that just because they can hook to a trailer and pull the thing a few miles with a half ton, that it's "all they need";

Another thing.........you're "seeking advice"; would you ask a Ford dealer about advice about buying a Chevy ?
What I'm attempting to point out here is.........the "average" PU truck owner really is a very poor place to get advice about a PU truck you need to tow with; the only place to look for that kind of advice, is the people who DO IT, day in, day out, over years and years, to make a living. I have watched many guys buy a new 2500 Chevy, Ford, or Dodge, with the intention of towing travel trailers for a living; (I can guarantee you, no one ever buys a second 3/4 ton to do that with ! )

What inexperienced people fail to realize is, you don't want a truck that is just "barely" capable of performing a specific task; you want one that is "capable" of about twice what you plan to do with it, day in, day out. You think 1 ton trucks "cost a lot" ? Try "breaking down" out in the middle of "no where" with "anything" that is/ was too "light" for what you were using it for; ( you will very quickly see just what "very expensive" is all about ! )

Consider this; tires; one of the things which most often puts you on the "side of the road" when towing, is "rubber"; yet 98 % of 2500 (3/4 ton) truck owners don't even realize is............tires for trucks are designed for the WHEELS they mount on, and 2500 trucks have 6 lug wheels; they don't EVEN MAKE tires for 6 lug wheels that have the "load range" that 8 lug wheels for 3500 (1 ton) trucks use. So.........if you plan to trailer your boat from, say, Florida to Oregon, and you are trying to decide between buying a 3/4 ton or a 1 ton truck to pull it with, ask yourself this; what is my "likelihood" of making it, (with NO tire problems) with a 2500 ? the answer is "maybe" ! with a 1 ton, and a set of decent load range "E" tires, (carrying 75 to 80 psi), the answer is more like "almost certainly" !

This is all coming from a guy who has probably spent more time "broke down" (in other people's trucks), between 1956 and 1997, than MOST people on this web site have spent DRIVING vehicles.

The other big item the OP is "wrestling with"........do I buy a NEW truck, or a "used" truck ?

That's the easiest question of all to give sound advice about !
You say you just won $25 million in the "power ball" lottery ? By all means..........RUN, (don't walk), to the nearest Dodge dealer, and buy the biggest, "loaded-down" 1 ton Ram ever made, then take the thing to a good diesel place and tell them "I WANT 999 lbs. feet of torque, and all ":the horses" you can cram in it ! ( You'll be able to tow a Greyhound bus from Florida to Oregon, at 75 mph all the way ! )

For anyone else, who DIDN"T win the lotto.............spend a BUNCH of time and effort on Auto Trader, (or a few more web sites), and TAKE ADVANTAGE of someone else's "financial difficulties" and save yourself about a third on a late model diesel PU truck. Buying vehicles is a "skill"; (and it's a skill I never excelled at, until rather recently.)

Oddly enough, when I recently sold some real estate and decided to buy a small car for my fiancee' to drive, (and to quit "wearing out" my Dodge dually, diesel 1 ton, running to the grocery store and the hospital ), I "assumed" that I would probably buy a vehicle from a private owner; I very quickly realized that for what I wanted, dealing with a new car dealer offered MANY advantages over farting around with vehicle owners, (none of whom have the slightest idea what their vehicle is "realistically" worth ), so they ALL "want" much more than dealers are able to sell for; ( I was reminded of the old axiom of "want in one hand, and "poop" in the other, and see which one gets full first !)

Charley



Stupidity: Doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result; Albert Einstein
User currently offlineLarshjort From Denmark, joined Dec 2007, 1351 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 4434 times:

Quoting Geezer (Reply 9):


About rust............to start with, vehicle rust has a LOT more to do with where you live, how much salt they put on the roads, (and how much effort YOU put in to wash away the salt after driving on salted roads, than it does with the "make" of the truck. They will ALL rust if you get them "salty", and don't wash it off. In this day and age, anyone should have a small pressure washer to wash away salt from under their vehicles. With that said, it's my considered opinion that GM built trucks (with all things being equal), are more prone to rusting "soon er" than either Ford or Dodge trucks.

My 2000 Dodge isn't even undercoated, and still it has no rust; It takes me just a few minutes (in an old rain suit that I keep just for this purpose, to wash out the wheel wells, and the entire underneath.

How commen is "aftermarket" rust protection such as Dinitrol in the US? In Denmark when selling a used car it will easily raise the value of the car $1000-3000 on cars a few years old. Most new car owners get the car treated when it is new and then again after 4-6 years.
Wikipedia has an article on Waxoyl, but it looks more like advertising. In Denmark we have companies doing nothing but treating cars, Dinitrol, Pava, Tectyl, Suvo etc.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waxoyl

/Lars



139, 306, 319, 320, 321, 332, 34A, AN2, AT4, AT5, AT7, 733, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 146, AR1, BH2, CN1, CR2, DH1, DH3, DH4
User currently offlineokie From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2849 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 4408 times:

Quoting Larshjort (Reply 10):
How commen is "aftermarket" rust protection such as Dinitrol in the US? In Denmark when selling a used car it will easily raise the value of the car $1000-3000 on cars a few years old. Most new car owners get the car treated when it is new and then again after 4-6 years

In the US it is assumed that the rust protection of the vehicle will last the warranty with only standard maintenance. Which in your analogy puts you in the 4-6 year range for the average driver.
There were times in decades past where the manufacturer's did not make any effort to provide proper drainage or provide any rust protection. Now they dip the whole vehicle during manufacturing. Short of extreme conditions, rust generally is not a major issue as collection pockets for moisture show up in the dip process right from the get go as they would hold large quantities of paint.

Okie


User currently offlineGeezer From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 1479 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 4405 times:

Lars..........

I'm not familiar with any of the undercoat treatments you mentioned; I'm not even sure what they use in the U.S. any more. It has always been my experience that ALL "undercoat" treatments are just about as good (or as bad), as the person applying them. It's not a very "exciting" job, spraying nasty "stuff" on the undersurfaces of cars and trucks, and I have observed many vehicles that HAD under treatments, that rusted just as bad, (in some cases even worse), than vehicles that had no under treatment.

I always try to keep the undersurfaces of my truck painted, and as I mentioned before, I get under it regularly with my pressure washer, and try to keep all of the accumulation of dirt, "crud" and salt washed away. Many undercoatings fail to get good adhesion to the metal, and therefore present a perfect place for moisture (and salt) to accumulate and start the rusting process. Keep the metal clean, painted and dry, and you don't have problems with rust !

For a long time, plastic bed liners were very popular in the U.S., as they were "thought" to "protect" the paint on the truck bed; but when you remove one after a few years, you realize that all you have done is given water a place to "lay" without drying up, and in the winter months, the water usually has salt in it............and "goodbye" truck bed ! I always keep a fiberglass cab-high bed cap on my truck, as I ALWAYS have tools, chain saws, and other things in my bed. I never have had anything stolen from my bed, as I'm cautious about where I park, and I've never had any problems with thieves on my property. I keep promising myself I'm going to build a two car "addition" onto my garage, to keep my truck and the car "under roof", but it seems there is ALWAYS something that prevents me from finding the time to build it.

Charley



Stupidity: Doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result; Albert Einstein
User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7437 posts, RR: 62
Reply 13, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 4325 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Flighty (Reply 2):
Also, the 8500# classification may be part of it.

Not sure what you're referring to here. Still in info processing and gathering mode.

Quoting Flighty (Reply 2):
If you are a 1500 buyer, it just seems unusual why you want an extremely heavy, $10,000 diesel motor.

The price difference for the Cummins is a about 7900, same with Duramax and Powerstroke.
But as I think you and others alluded to, I do want to buy a car that will cover my needs, which will likely include RV towing. And I would rather be prepared now and be overpowered than under.

Quoting njxc500 (Reply 3):
The venture into a new engine is a real head scratcher, I would never buy it in the first model year, personally.



Yes, hence my asking. I really don't know yet if this is a new engine or a proven power source yet...

Quoting RFields5421 (Reply 5):
Six weeks ago I got a 2012 Ram 2500 Megacab with the 5.7L Hemi. Didn't feel the extra $7,200 for the diesel was worth it.



Congrats! My buddy just got the a 2010 Hemi 1500 and loves his.

Quoting RFields5421 (Reply 5):
As one friend said - buy as much truck as you can afford. Eventually, you will get a trailer that needs the extra capability.

Pretty much my positioning here. I'm leaning towards a low mileage 2500 Cummins pre-owned and I've got the money and time to sit on the decision.

Quoting Geezer (Reply 7):

I'm very short on time here, but I will say this..........

HOly cow, Charley, for a guy with scant time, that was a MOUTHFUL!

Quoting Geezer (Reply 7):
If you just "hate to shift gears"........get an automatic ! (almost ALL women do) If you seriously want to buy a truck that will "LAST"..........better get yourself a Dodge / Ram, (or whatever they call them now)

Im leaning toward the manual but might go for the auto the few times I let the wife drive it. Then again, would be more fun teaching her manual. Its a damn sexy woman that drives a manual.

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 8):
it looks like a solid power plant.

Thanks so much. What auto did you end up going with?

Quoting Geezer (Reply 9):
when I recently sold some real estate and decided to buy a small car for my fiancee' to drive,

You're turning 80 and engaged? Congrats buddy! You are 79 years young and full of life! You're the ANTI-Geezer! LOL

Quoting Geezer (Reply 9):
(and to quit "wearing out" my Dodge dually, diesel 1 ton, running to the grocery store and the hospital )

I appreciate the notes especially the new vs used. May lean toward pre-owned through the dealer and make it easy. But one question regarding "wearing out" the dually. Are you saying you dont use it all the time and only for long hauls?

Great insight, I appreciate it! I have no rigid timeline to buy, so I can afford to wait out the new PUs.



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8198 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 4290 times:

Quoting Geezer (Reply 7):
That's the "key"........get a great deal on a great low mileage truck; then DON"T try to wear the damned thing out, driving it day in , day out, to go to girl scout meetings, etc. get yourself a Cube to do all the "light lifting" ! It's the PERFECT combination........(for me) ( you may "need" a Lamborghini to keep you "happy"......(I don't)

This is great advice. Just like airlines have a fleet, you do too. Trucks should get as few miles as possible. I have an SUV that gets maybe 1,000 miles a year. Yes, it tows and goes through snowdrifts. But it costs $100 to fill up, so it does not get groceries.

Quoting mirrodie (Reply 13):
Not sure what you're referring to here. Still in info processing and gathering mode.

Certain trucks, as you know, are "HD" meaning Heavy Duty (2500/3500), which I think means >8,500 lbs Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (or GVWR). That used to mean they are totally free from EPA mileage listing requirements, pollution controls, or maybe DOT safety requirements as well. For example, they probably did not need to have ABS or airbags until very recently.

The government considers them "commercial vehicles" since, theoretically, no 130 lbs woman, carrying a purse and and empty cabin and bare bed, would ever drive one to the mall (at which Detroit just nods knowingly). Here is a link that explains part of the regulation:


http://www.eia.gov/oiaf/aeo/otheranalysis/fuel.html

But this is just a legal loophole -- trying to explore for you why the 1500 is not going to offer huge powertrains. Likely because the 1500s have to be included into EPA Fleet CAFE requirements.

Here we see the 2012 Ram models do fit neatly over and under 8500 lbs -- so they are (AFAIK) governed by different laws.

http://www.ramtrucks.com/en/towing_guide/pdf/RAM.1500.Towing.Specs.pdf

http://www.ramtrucks.com/en/towing_g...pdf/RAM.2500.3500.Towing.Specs.pdf

[Edited 2012-10-26 14:10:35]

User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7437 posts, RR: 62
Reply 15, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 4285 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Hey, thanks for the detailed response!

Pretty exciting to soak in al this new info so that I can make a great informed decision about the truck we end up with.

Hopefully we wont need snowplows next week with the hyped up storm they are prepping for!



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlineGeezer From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 1479 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 4277 times:

Quoting mirrodie (Reply 13):
You're turning 80 and engaged? Congrats buddy! You are 79 years young and full of life! You're the ANTI-Geezer! LOL

Hell, we've been engaged for 8 years now..........( I like to know ALL about a woman before I marry her !) The "plan" is to tie the knot on my 80th birthday, which is Dec.23.

More about why the Cummins is the best small truck engine "out there: when Cummins decided to enter the small truck market, unlike GM and Navistar (maker of the "power stroke" in Fords), they didn't just sit down and design a whole new engine from scratch; they took an existing design that had powered over-the-road trucks for years, then "scaled it down" to the power and weight needed for small trucks; that was something over 20 years ago; since that time, they have continued to improve (almost every year), on an already "proven" design.

Back "in the day", the fuel systems of diesel engines were strictly mechanical; those days are LONG GONE ! Now, everything is "electronically" controlled; until about 1998, the Cummins used 12 valves; My 2000 is (i believe) the second year for the 24 valve engine; now think about this...........in 2000, the "stock" engine had about 275 lbs of torque; todays models have more than DOUBLE that, yet the displacement is still the same; ( and fuel mileage is even better ) These improvements have all come about because of electronic fuel control technology.

When someone says he "can't understand" why anyone would want to buy a "heavy diesel engine" in a PU truck, he has clearly demonstrated a complete lack of knowledge about diesel engines.

There is so much difference between diesel engines and gas engines that it would take six books to list all of them.
You can "quibble" about "liking or not liking" diesel engines all you want to, but keep one thing in mind.......the trucking industry ( where I made my living between 1956 and 1997 ), figured out about 1950 that the ONLY way to power over-the-road trucks, was with diesel engines. ( Ever notice that you never see a gas powered Peterbilt on the Interstate ?)
(There are no gas powered Peterbilts !)

The Cummins engine in todays PU trucks is a 300,000 mile engine (before doing a major overhaul ); it will then do another 300,000 !) I know from personal experience, delivering new trucks and vans to the RV industry in and around Elkhart, Indiana, that there are damned few, (like NONE) 300,000 mile power strokes or duramax engines "out there" ! V-type engines seem "sexy" to school kids, but the trucking industry isn't looking for "sexy".......they only want "longevity, and operating performance" !

I spent the last 10 years I worked, researching engines, talking to hundreds of guys who made their living towing RV's as I had planned that long to buy a 1 ton diesel dually as soon as I retired, and then buy a RV to pull with it; sadly, shortly after I retired, my wife of 50 years decided to "change course"; I still got my diesel PU truck, but I never did buy the RV; Now, I'm very pleased it all worked out the way it did.

I have a picture someplace around here that I'll post on my "profile" page; it shows a huge, 8 1/2 ft long, by 5 ft high white oak log, sitting on my 22 ft , 2,500 lb tilt deck trailer, (with about 2 ft of snow on the ground and the log) The big oak log weighed about 6 tons; ( we know that because Pike Lumber's big Caterpiller loader's back end came 3ft off of the ground when they loaded the damned thing on my trailer !) They GAVE me that big log because it was too big to get in their building. After "studying" how I was going to get the thing off of my trailer to saw it up, from January until about June, I ended up setting my saw mill up "on the trailer", and in about 3 days, I turned that baby into over 1,000 bf of white oak lumber, (about 1/3 of which is "quarter sawn"). ( For those unfamiliar with hardwood lumber prices, quarter-sawn white oak goes for $3 or $4 a bf , as rough sawn lumber.) However, having a heavy duty thickness planer, and a molding machine to make crown molding, I don't sell any "rough" boards..........

Without my 1 ton diesel PU truck, that big oak log would have laid right where it fell, and would have no doubt "fed" a hell of a lot of worms by now !

That's why I have a big heavy duty PU truck; a new one like it would set me back about 55 or 60K (which I have better uses for) Trucks are for "working"...........I get around just fine in Miss Alie's "almost new" Cube that I got her for Valentine's day; ( the gas for the Cube costs less than diesel fuel, also )

Charley



Stupidity: Doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result; Albert Einstein
User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7437 posts, RR: 62
Reply 17, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 4257 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Geezer (Reply 16):
they have continued to improve (almost every year), on an already "proven" design.

That is another reason Im partial to diesel. Mike Primamore, one of the photographers I met here a decade ago, once invited me to his diesel repair shop. Their facebook page is Autowurks Diesel if you're interested. It was a great experience learning about the engines and why the are worth it. I wasn't terribly driven to go with Cummins up until I read up on the other ones available.

Quoting Geezer (Reply 16):
..they only want "longevity, and operating performance" !

YES! And that is what I am after. Im driving a 12 year old car now and I tend to keep my cars a while. And my needs are changing so I think its time to plan ahead, you know?


The ONLY factor *might* change my new vs used consideration is if I can pull a favor with an old friend who heads a certain Dodge SRT division. If i can get a new 2500 at a substantial savings, I may splurge



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlineGeezer From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 1479 posts, RR: 2
Reply 18, posted (1 year 5 months 3 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 4238 times:

mirrodi...........

Here's something that very few people think about;

As everyone knows, gasoline is extremely "volatile"; ( a measure of it's ability to combine with oxygen) Example: pour a VERY small quantity of gasoline on a side walk (or other nonporous surface), and throw a lit match in it; (notice I said a very small quantity) Even before the match gets close to the gasoline, "whoof"! Up it goes, BIG fire ! Because gasoline combines with oxygen so readily, it evaporates VERY fast, and give off extremely flammable vapors. And the car you are driving has a whole tank full of this extremely dangerous stuff, right underneath you !

As long as you don't have a wreck, and as long as the gas tank doesn't leak, it just does what it's supposed to do, it makes your car "go"; But what if you DO become involved, and your gas tank gets ruptured ? Many people have perished in fires, caused by gasoline escaping from ruptured fuel tanks, after collisions.........

Now...........take the same very small container, only this time pour a "like" quantity of diesel fuel on the sidewalk; then drop a lit match in it; guess what ? No fire this time ! matter of fact, you can actually stick a lit match INTO an open puddle of diesel fuel, and it will extinguish the flame on the match ! This is all because of the much lower "volatility" of diesel fuel. ( and it's much higher "flash point" than gasoline ) (it combines with oxygen MUCH less readily than gasoline does)

Now.......most people have heard that diesel powered vehicles get better fuel milage than equivalent gasoline powered vehicles; the reason is........a gallon of diesel fuel has about 15% more "latent" energy than a gallon of gasoline does; (and it is MUCH LESS dangerous to store, ( or have a large quantity of ) in your fuel tank.

I'm not necessarily suggesting this is a good reason to run out and buy a car with a diesel engine, but then again, it's IS always nice to know that you have much less worries of "going up" in a huge fire-ball if you happen to become involved in a collision ! ( Now if only I could talk Nissan into marketing a diesel powered Cube ! )


Here's a true story from my 40 years of driving diesel powered trucks;

I had just loaded 12 Corvettes on my car carrier at our terminal in Dayton, Ohio, and departed the terminal, bound for New Jersey. About 10 miles north of downtown Dayton, traveling north on 4 lane RT. 4, I was about an 1/8 of a mile from taking the east bound cutoff ramp onto east bound Interstate 70; (it had just started to barely "sprinkle" rain)

Just as I was approaching my cutoff ramp, there was a car pulled over on the side of the road, with a man and a girl frantically waving their arms at me; they had been hauling a damned mattress on top of their car, ( no doubt tied down with a piece of string ), and the mattress had come off and was laying DIRECTLY in my path as I was just ready to start my turnoff to I-70; It's a very gradual turnoff, which can be easily negotiate at 50 mph, even when it's wet. However, these idiots (who obviously had a VERY inappropriately secured mattress that had come off, and was squarely in my lane ), were trying to get me to make a sudden "swerve" so as to miss their damned mattress ! ( this is where years and years of safe driving experience can definitely "save the day".............if the road had been dry, I could have, (and would have" ), "swerved", and missed the damned mattress; but the road was not "quite" dry, and I realized that a "panic" brake application, (or a sudden "swerve") would have resulted in a huge "pile" of brand new Corvettes scattered about, and me out of a job ! (or worse) So............I "went straight".......and ran directly over the mattress, (while these nincompoops watched with their mouths hanging open ! ) ( I was doing maybe 55 mph as I went "over" the thing.)

I didn't hear a thing........( I even "assumed" that I had cleared the thing ) But what I hadn't considered was......most of our trucks at that time had Detroit diesels; ( which are 2 cycle rather than 4 cycle engines, and have a rather "funny" fuel system; ) each fuel tank (on either side of the tractor) has a "cross-over" line connecting them; it's a one inch dia. hose, and it's supported by a 2"X2" angle iron that is only about 8 or 9 inches above the pavement; unbeknown by me, the mattress had failed to make it all of the way under that cross-over line support, and was now securely "wedged" underneath the angle iron; And I'm merrily trucking east on I-70, at 65 MPH ! It was now just beginning to start getting dark; (kinda "twilight" ).............after maybe 3 or 4 miles east on I-70, I started hearing west-bound truckers on their CB radios, yelling, "holy crap".........look at all of those sparks under that east bound "parking lot" ! ( truck drivers tend to have nick-names for everything, and they refer to car carriers as "portable parking lots" )

I quickly realized what had happened, but for the first few miles, it was rather "humorous" ! As I was intending to stop about 40 or 50 miles east and get a cup of coffee, I'm thinking, "we'll just have fun making lots of sparks till I get to my coffee stop"; suddenly, another car carrier (a Leaseway truck that I had passed a few miles back), had caught up to me, (very fortunately as it turned out), and is now shouting at me........." Hey Ryder........pull over quick, you're on fire"!

What I had failed to take into account, in my short-lived "amusement", making lots of sparks, now that the "stuffing" had worn away from the mattress, and all of the springs were making lots of sparks, (AND lots of HEAT !)

I pulled off onto the breakdown lane, the Leaseway guy pulled off right behind me, and a flat-bed guy pulled off behind the lease way truck; by now, the damned mattress was a fire=ball, right beneath my two 150 gallon fuel tanks ! All three of us had hold of the mattress, trying to pull it out from under my cab, but it was useless; at this point, I'm about to grab my suitcase and my radio, and "abandon ship" ! But the flat bed guy ran back to his truck, quickly pulled around the Leaseway truck and my truck, then backed back up to my truck, jumps out, garbs a chain off of his trailer, hooks it to the frame of the mattress, jumps back in his truck, and proceeds to pull the burning mattress (and fire) out from under my truck ! Now we have this HUGE "bon-fire" on the break-down lane..........no way in hell of putting it out........so I says, "let's get the hell out of here before a "bear" comes along..........and we all made a hasty departure !

(I could see the fire for the next 5 miles in my mirrors !)

Had the truck been a "gas job", I would have RAN instead of trying to deal with the burning mattress; however, it's very likely that if those two fuel tanks had had gasoline in them, they would have almost certainly blown up, WAY before I could have got stopped; (in which case I wouldn't be "around" to tell about this "humorous incident".............

(maybe now you can see why I'm such a big fan of diesel powered trucks ?)

Charley



Stupidity: Doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result; Albert Einstein
User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7437 posts, RR: 62
Reply 19, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 4211 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I didnt get a chance to read your last post, but one thing to add:


Im a guy who will spend more for something that lasts longer. ei. I bought a pair of $400 shoes almost 7 years ago. only had to have them resoled once and have SAVED $$$$ over the last few years rather than buying and tossing out shoes that dont last.


And the shoes look new.

pressed for time here, but just a glimpse of why I believe in diesel



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7437 posts, RR: 62
Reply 20, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4168 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Geezer (Reply 18):
( Now if only I could talk Nissan into marketing a diesel powered Cube ! )

Well maybe not a diesel cube but I understand they are putting a cummins into the Nissan Titan!

Quoting Geezer (Reply 16):
.......( I like to know ALL about a woman before I marry her !) The "plan" is to tie the knot on my 80th birthday, which is Dec.23.

. All the best!


Amazing mattress story! Surrounded by idiot drivers here!



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlineMCOflyer From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 8625 posts, RR: 15
Reply 21, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 4160 times:

I would try and find a good pre-owned one if you can. Stay away from the Fords. The 6.4 and 6.0 powerstroke diesels have had so much problems. Also, I would go with a manual. They get better gas mileage and it is more fun as you are young. Your wife will easily learn how to drive one which can be a challenge on gas engines.

KH



Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
User currently offlineGeezer From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 1479 posts, RR: 2
Reply 22, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 4099 times:

Quoting Flighty (Reply 14):
Here we see the 2012 Ram models do fit neatly over and under 8500 lbs -- so they are (AFAIK) governed by different laws.

I don't know what state you live in, but the ONLY "difference" I ever ran into after I bought my 1 ton was, back then, (2002), Ohio had "inspection stations"; you had to run your vehicle inside, and they stuck a big hose on your exhaust, and revved up the engine, and a machine measured how well your "anti-polluntant" "stuff" worked; when I showed up with my diesel, the guy came outside, looked at the little "I.D." plate on the inside edge of the door, and told me............go inside that office and they'll give you a "diesel exemption" certificate; after that, I didn't even have to go for the every other year pollution inspection; about 4 or 5 years later on, Ohio closed all of the inspection stations and scrapped the whole inspection rigamarole.

And NO, 1 Ton P/U trucks are NOT "treated" any differently than cars are, UNLESS you use it for a commercial purpose; ( I'm pretty sure that's the same in all states ). On the other hand, if you tow RV's commercially, you must have a D.O.T. number and go through all of that "BS", plus you are "supposed" to stop at all truck scales. ( Fat chance ! ) after 40 years "practice" "dealing with truck weigh stations, ( or "chicken coops" if you're a trucker), I can guarantee you I could go from Florida to Maine, to Washington state, and back to South Carolina, and NEVER go through a "chicken coop" ! ( and so can 99% of all people towing stuff with 1 ton P/U's )

To "the law", a 1 ton dually is just a "big car"; and if you're pulling your own 40 foot RV trailer to "where ever" for the winter, it's just a "big car" towing a "big RV". Hell, you don't even have to have a CDL license to drive your OWN P'U truck; ( only if you use it commercially )

While we're on the subject of "what you can do" and "what you better NOT do".........here's a "word for the wise"; a lot of guys now-a-days MAKE their OWN diesel fuel; (it's really not THAT hard, just take a small "investment") The problem STARTS when you drive your truck (with your "home made", "non-taxed" diesel fuel ), on public roads ! You may think D.O.T. guys and D.M.V. guys are "pricks", (and I won't even debate that), but I can tell you this............they are very definitely NOT stupid ! They KNOW every "trick" people try to pull ! And the first time one pulls you over and sticks a sample bottle in your fuel tank, and the fuel is the "wrong color".............you have just becomes a TAX CHEAT ! If you think the IRS gets "pissed" when you try to fudge on your taxes, just try "messing around" with ANY state on their road taxes !

I went to a big farm sale over in Illinois a few years back; must have been at least 150 1 ton diesel P/U trucks, all with stock trailers; about 2:00 PM, in comes about a dozen Illinois DMV guys, wrote down every license plate #, then sampled EVERY diesel truck in the lot.............and I was one of only about half a dozen that didn't get a big fine for burning un-taxed fuel ! So if you burn No.2 fuel oil to heat with, and you get the urge to "save on road taxes".............better stay away from anyplace where farmers "hang out" !

Charley



Stupidity: Doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result; Albert Einstein
User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8198 posts, RR: 3
Reply 23, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 4086 times:

Quoting Geezer (Reply 22):
I was one of only about half a dozen that didn't get a big fine for burning un-taxed fuel ! So if you burn No.2 fuel oil to heat with, and you get the urge to "save on road taxes".............better stay away from anyplace where farmers "hang out" !

LOL, well done Mr. Charley. Of course, we can see people drive 1-ton trucks just like a car. It's true. Was only saying Detroit worked the laws so big 1-tons are not governed by auto fuel efficiency standards... nor were the Excursion or Suburban 2500 IIRC. So it's something influencing the manufacturers directly (and what they are willing to sell you), but there is no effect on drivers once they have the vehicles.

Have seen some of these farmer / horse trailer get togethers... impressive stuff to say the least. Going long distance with horses takes planning and a lot of equipment.


User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7437 posts, RR: 62
Reply 24, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 4057 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 21):
I would try and find a good pre-owned one if you can. Stay away from the Fords. The 6.4 and 6.0 powerstroke diesels have had so much problems. Also, I would go with a manual. They get better gas mileage and it is more fun as you are young. Your wife will easily learn how to drive one which can be a challenge on gas engines.

Thanks. Ive pretty much decided it'll be Ram or that Cummins Titan. Not too keen on the 1500 diesel unless it were Cummins.


Ruled out Ford a while ago after consulting with a member on our staff who just went thought the notorious 2003-2006 Powerstroke debacle. And while the Chevys are nice, not convinced of their Duramax longevity.

Quoting Geezer (Reply 22):
a lot of guys now-a-days MAKE their OWN diesel fuel;

Heard about people doing homegrown biodiesel fuel. Its a risk.


Here's another question:

-Which, come to think of it, why not drop the current Cummins 6.7 into the 1500 as opposed to creating a new one. Why re-invent the wheel if the 1500 - 2500/3500 differences are truly in suspension and such?

-regarding suspension, 1500s use all coil suspension vs 25/3500 leaf rear suspension. Lots to consider....



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7437 posts, RR: 62
Reply 25, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 4058 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

I would try and find a good pre-owned one if you can. Stay away from the Fords. The 6.4 and 6.0 powerstroke diesels have had so much problems. Also, I would go with a manual. They get better gas mileage and it is more fun as you are young. Your wife will easily learn how to drive one which can be a challenge on gas engines.

KH


MCO, Diesel manual is easier to drive than gas manual? Wife is already game but please explain



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlinenjxc500 From United States of America, joined Dec 2007, 232 posts, RR: 0
Reply 26, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 4046 times:

Quoting mirrodie (Reply 25):
Diesel manual is easier to drive than gas manual? Wife is already game but please explain

There is a lot of power available at idle with the cummins. If you dump the clutch too fast in a geo metro it dies, if you are too aggressive on the cummins it will actually add power automatically to keep the engine at idle speed. Or if you are teaching to add a bit of throttle prior to letting off the clutch, your wife will just do a burn out.

If you are good with the clutch, you can launch the truck uphill in 3rd gear without using the throttle. They are very forgiving. I learned how to drive a clutch on a tractor, and let me tell you that was interesting. If you dump the clutch too fast on a tractor, you get a wheelie or whiplash. Mine was a wheelie.

You may actually have more trouble teaching her to drive 2nd to 6th without the clutch. Some people have a tough time with that one.


User currently offlineGeezer From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 1479 posts, RR: 2
Reply 27, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 4042 times:

Driving a Ram with a six speed is a piece of cake; even for a "newbie"; a lot of people will tell you to start out in 2nd gear; forget that; (that clutch is a VERY "pricey" piece of machinery to replace) If you treat the thing right, it will last damn near forever.

The one thing a new driver has to get into their head before they start...........when you first start out, you keep your foot completely off of the accelerator until AFTER the clutch is COMPLETELY engaged; stick it in 1st, and just lift your left foot; that's all there is to it; (no accelerator until clutch is "engaged" (all the way out)

Drivers who have always operated automatics tend to have a "mental block" about "where are ALL of those gears" all you have to remember is..........any time you are "in doubt" as to which gear you're in, just remember ONE thing; push (or pull) the stick into neutral........then, "up" is 3rd, and "down" is 4th; when you move the stick either left (or right), you will feel a spring inside the gear box; so against the spring to the left and "up" is 1st, and "down" is 2nd; going to the right, "up" is 5th, down is 6th.

to the right and up, then ALL the way up and to the right is reverse; probably the most common "boo boo" new drivers are inclined to make is going from 4th to 5th, and going past the first spring, and hitting reverse; this only happens when you're thinking about "something" other than driving the truck, (and should be avoided at all cost) (those gears in there aren't rubber, and they ARE prohibitively expensive to replace ! Treat them right, and they'll last forever !

There is only one thing wrong with the "design" of my 2000 Dodge with 6 speed; the gear ratio in reverse; it needs to be about half of "fast" as it is; yeah, after all the years I've been driving (and backing up) trailers, I can back a trailer up in a straight line, just as "fast" and as "far" as anyone can; but only FOOLS try to back trailers up "fast"; when you're backing your big, expensive RV into a parking space in a camp ground, the ONLY way to "impress" bystanders, is to "smoothly" (and carefully) back your trailer into the parking spot, without running over anything, or backing into anything. If you can't "see" where you're going, GET OUT AND LOOK ! ( as many time as is necessary ) The best "backer-upper" in the world can not back a trailer up if it is so dark you can't see where it's going. (So don't even try !) ( The REAL "impressive" thing is........do it for a lot of years with NO "screw ups", and everyone will be "impressed"........

Remember, anytime you're driving your 6 speed and you "forget" where you're at........just tap the stick into neutral; then 1st and 2nd are to the left, 5th and 6th are to the right, and 3rd and 4th are straight "up" and straight "down". ( easy as falling off a log backwards, and not nearly as dangerous !)

Charley

P.S. In retrospect, I should add just one more thing for anyone contemplating buying a 3/4 ton or 1 ton P/U truck with a manual transmission; remember........it's a TRUCK; it was designed to WORK; if you are the "hurry hurry" type, always having a "need" to be first one away from a traffic light, and first one to the next red light..........DO NOT buy a manual; get an automatic !
( or a sports car ) manual transmissions do NOT respond well to people who like to "start out fast"; they simply weren't designed for that purpose.



Stupidity: Doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result; Albert Einstein
User currently offlinerfields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7344 posts, RR: 32
Reply 28, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 4029 times:

Quoting Geezer (Reply 27):
but only FOOLS try to back trailers up "fast"; when you're backing your big, expensive RV into a parking space in a camp ground, the ONLY way to "impress" bystanders, is to "smoothly" (and carefully) back your trailer into the parking spot, without running over anything, or backing into anything.

Those pedestals for the 50/30/20Amp electricity are EXPENSIVE. Knocking one over and shorting out the air conditioners on a dozen $75,000 dollar fifth wheels will not make you any friends in the camp ground, or at your insurance company.

According to the RV forums and various stories I hear - it happens about once a month somewhere in the US.


User currently offlineGeezer From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 1479 posts, RR: 2
Reply 29, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 4025 times:

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 28):
Those pedestals for the 50/30/20Amp electricity are EXPENSIVE. Knocking one over and shorting out the air conditioners on a dozen $75,000 dollar fifth wheels will not make you any friends in the camp ground, or at your insurance company.

Chief.....

Based on some of the driving I have seen people doing in big fancy motorhomes on the Interstates, I'm guessing they probably have quite a few "backing-up incidents" at RV parks !

Probably the biggest "challenge" we faced hauling cars and trucks, was trying to park the things in motel parking lots every night; when you have a 75 ft vehicle, with 5 or 6 feet of new car sticking out over your windshield, and sometimes 6 or 8 feet sticking out the back end of your trailer, trying to negotiate motel parking lots at 2 AM can sometimes become quite a challenge!

I'm reminded of when one of the drivers from my home terminal was backing a load of Firebirds and Camaros into a parking space between two other car carriers in a hotel in Pennsylvania about midnight; the space he was backing into was plenty wide, and everything "seemed" to be going OK, but as his tractor was about side by side with the ones on either side, he said he thought he heard a "crunching " sound; getting out with his flashlight, he walked back to "check"............ and found that his rear bottom Firebird was about halfway into a big steel trash dumpster ! ( It's times like that when you wish you had stuck to driving freight trucks....)

Charley



Stupidity: Doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result; Albert Einstein
User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7437 posts, RR: 62
Reply 30, posted (1 year 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 3983 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Geezer (Reply 27):
Remember, anytime you're driving your 6 speed and you "forget" where you're at........just tap the stick into neutral; then 1st and 2nd are to the left, 5th and 6th are to the right, and 3rd and 4th are straight "up" and straight "down". ( easy as falling off a log backwards, and not nearly as dangerous !)

ALl good considerations! And good advice that came natural when driving my old stick.

Stick just felt natural!



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently offlinemirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7437 posts, RR: 62
Reply 31, posted (1 year 5 months 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3701 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

So now that hte gas crisis seems to be easing in the Northeast, I was bugging my wife about this.

If we only had diesel, there'd be no wait in line!

Yes, some things are worth it!!!!



Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
User currently onlineKiwiRob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 6625 posts, RR: 3
Reply 32, posted (1 year 5 months 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3698 times:

Quoting mirrodie (Reply 20):
Well maybe not a diesel cube but I understand they are putting a cummins into the Nissan Titan!

It'sa not the same Cummins diesel as in the RAM http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2011/05...inder-diesel-for-nissan-titan.html


Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Volkswagen's U.S. Diesel Strategy posted Thu Sep 20 2012 15:32:27 by dcann40
Can Someone Explain Diesel-Electric To Me? posted Wed Oct 20 2010 22:51:51 by DocLightning
Diesel VW Passat Goes 1,527 Miles On One Tank posted Wed Oct 6 2010 01:50:39 by Springbok747
Price Of Diesel In France? posted Wed Aug 18 2010 10:06:56 by Cumulus
Unleaded V Diesel V. Hydrogen posted Fri Jul 30 2010 09:50:43 by mirrodie
The Great New/Used Controversy posted Fri Mar 26 2010 14:42:26 by WildcatYXU
European Diesel Car Sales Strong In U.S. posted Tue Jun 23 2009 18:27:09 by StasisLAX
Jaguar Introduces Twin-Turbo XF Diesel S Sedan posted Mon Dec 29 2008 23:01:23 by StasisLAX
Price Of Diesel Fuel posted Mon Dec 1 2008 12:54:50 by VC10
It's Official: First Porsche Car With A Diesel posted Fri Nov 21 2008 09:33:54 by A342