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Washington Goes Live With Weed Decriminalisation  
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7694 posts, RR: 21
Posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 3020 times:
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Relax Washington, you can poseess up to an ounce without penalty.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-20621210

Good or bad thing? The long-term plan of selling and taxing, and allowing posession of moderate amounts seems pretty sensiblbe to me.

Also, is federal government going to come and ruin the party?


✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
79 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinembmbos From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2597 posts, RR: 1
Reply 1, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 2996 times:

I hope this is the beginning of the end to marijuana prohibition. And I hope the federal government stays out of it and let's Washington proceed with this experiment.

User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8791 posts, RR: 24
Reply 2, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2977 times:

Quoting mbmbos (Reply 1):
I hope this is the beginning of the end to marijuana prohibition. And I hope the federal government stays out of it and let's Washington proceed with this experiment.

I'm just curious about what's going to happen in 5-10 years, when pot-smokers wake up one morning and realize they are mostly stuck at menial, minimum wage jobs, and start telling themselves "it must be discrimination!" and start demanding affirmative action for dopers. Boeing will no longer be able to not hire a structural engineer because the guy is a pothead - how does that make you feel when boarding their jets?

Of course the donut shops will LOVE it. Look at all the business they do with cops, and now you have cops on munchies??? Cool!



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19411 posts, RR: 58
Reply 3, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2976 times:

I am really curious to know why Mr. Obama "clarified" (i.e. changed) his views on marijuana enforcement in the middle of his last term.

I have asked a friend of mine who works for him...and got no answer.

Is it that he saw the Twinkies shortage coming in advance and was afraid that marijuana legalization during a Hostess liquidation would lead to rioting?  

Seriously, it makes no sense. In fact, if there is one single issue that has started to gather broad bipartisan support, it's that the War on Drugs has failed and is a colossal waste of time, money, and resources. Pat Robertson even came out in favor of legalization. Now when Pat Robertson and Barney Frank can agree on an issue, it might just have some merit.


User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8791 posts, RR: 24
Reply 4, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2968 times:

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 3):
I have asked a friend of mine who works for him...and got no answer.

He probably forgot the question.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinembmbos From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2597 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2963 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
I'm just curious about what's going to happen in 5-10 years, when pot-smokers wake up one morning and realize they are mostly stuck at menial, minimum wage jobs, and start telling themselves "it must be discrimination!" and start demanding affirmative action for dopers. Boeing will no longer be able to not hire a structural engineer because the guy is a pothead - how does that make you feel when boarding their jets?

Wow! How many unsubstantiated stereotypes can you cram into one paragraph?

It has long been a myth that pot smokers are losers even though there's plenty of evidence to the contrary. I've worked in the legal industry for over twenty years and I can tell you a substantial number of high achieving, blue chip lawyers (read: partners) imbibe regularly. And of course, the meme that a large portion of the population is parasitic, living off the hard work of the salt-of-the-earth and moral man, has to be interjected.


User currently offlineAaron747 From Japan, joined Aug 2003, 8021 posts, RR: 26
Reply 6, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2963 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
I'm just curious about what's going to happen in 5-10 years, when pot-smokers wake up one morning and realize they are mostly stuck at menial, minimum wage jobs

This is simply not a universal claim for people who use it as a stress reducer, sleep aid, regular enhancement to lovemaking, or anything of the sort.

My dad is in his late 50s, is an senior VP of South Asia/SE Asia marketing for a global software giant, (also runs a data storage consultancy and medical imaging device distribution network throughout Thailand, Malaysia, and Singapore), and uses marijuana almost daily. Many of his friends, the financier in HK, the rare earths sales VP in Australia, and on down the line have lifestyles that mirror his.



If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
User currently offlinelewis From Greece, joined Jul 1999, 3623 posts, RR: 5
Reply 7, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2958 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
I'm just curious about what's going to happen in 5-10 years, when pot-smokers wake up one morning and realize they are mostly stuck at menial, minimum wage jobs, and start telling themselves "it must be discrimination!" and start demanding affirmative action for dopers. Boeing will no longer be able to not hire a structural engineer because the guy is a pothead - how does that make you feel when boarding their jets?

That is such a bad stereotype. First you automatically assume that people who smoke pot are some kind of loser hippies who can barely work at a fast food restaurant flipping burgers. Almost all the people I know who smoke pot are not (they were when they were students maybe), all of them have good jobs, they perform very well at them and are better financially than your average American, you wouldn't be able to tell if you just met them. You also assume that legalization will automatically make everyone want to smoke pot. I got news for you, no matter where you are and whether it is illegal or not, if you want to get your hands on some pot it is as easy as getting chewing gum, just through illegal channels.


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 8, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2958 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
I'm just curious about what's going to happen in 5-10 years, when pot-smokers wake up one morning and realize they are mostly stuck at menial, minimum wage jobs, and start telling themselves "it must be discrimination!" and start demanding affirmative action for dopers.

They might just cash their welfare checks and call their dealer. But let's be fair to it and recognize that most of those people would be mostly useless anyway and being stoned might actually help keep them off the streets. Let's not pretend that everyone who smokes pot is a lazy stoner knocking back Doritos. Plenty of professionals and generally productive members of society use or have used drugs.

There's a lot of truth in the stoner stereotype. But it's utterly ridiculous to think that these people will see their IQ's jump by twenty points and suddenly become capable professionals with healthy work ethics. They'll just be lazy people without drugs. Nor will legalization of marijuana turn our society into one that consists principally of ushaven people playing Call of Duty and eating Funyuns rather than being busy at productive efforts.

Save law enforcement the effort of trying to stop a mostly meaningless and largely unstoppable crime which is for the most part completely malum prohibitum. Now if only we could take care of speeding too.

Frankly, your attitude seems to be straight from the 1950s, to which I can only add that you should make sure the black people are out of town by sundown and beware of homosexuals who may come to prey on you and corrupt you.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
Boeing will no longer be able to not hire a structural engineer because the guy is a pothead - how does that make you feel when boarding their jets?

Wouldn't matter one bit. I'm sure employees of Boeing and pretty much every other company are allowed to drink although being drunk at work is certainly frowned upon. I imagine that they will not take too kindly to having people high at work either.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently onlinevikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 9785 posts, RR: 26
Reply 9, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2888 times:
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Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
Boeing will no longer be able to not hire a structural engineer because the guy is a pothead - how does that make you feel when boarding their jets?

Exactly the same as I feel now, considering that far more people likely smoke weed than you probably think. And with the majority of them, you wouldn't know it to talk to them, work with them, etc.

Frankly, I'd feel worse knowing that any engineer/assembler/whatever can go get sh*t-faced every night, and go to work hungover the next day.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 8):
Frankly, your attitude seems to be straight from the 1950s, to which I can only add that you should make sure the black people are out of town by sundown

Well, isn't it the blacks smoking the weed anyway?



"Two and a Half Men" was filmed in front of a live ostrich.
User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8791 posts, RR: 24
Reply 10, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 2851 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 8):
Wouldn't matter one bit. I'm sure employees of Boeing and pretty much every other company are allowed to drink although being drunk at work is certainly frowned upon. I imagine that they will not take too kindly to having people high at work either.

Maybe, but I do have some experience in a couple of European countries where pot is legal or at least tolerated, and there were an awful lot of people, both in school and in their places of work who were basically buzzed all the time - smoking 5-10 joints per day, starting the first thing in the morning.

I know that there are a lot of studies that say that there are no lasting effects. But I have also personally seen some of these people literally fall apart before my eyes over a period of years - their speech is more slurred than it was a few years ago, their careers go nowhere (or they keep getting fired), and they just don't seem to give a shit. So I take these studies with a grain of salt. I've met my share of alcoholics as well, and they seem to be able to pass unnoticed much easier than the potheads.

That's my personal experience, and take that for whatever it's worth.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7831 posts, RR: 52
Reply 11, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 2851 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
when pot-smokers wake up one morning and realize they are mostly stuck at menial, minimum wage jobs,

I think people like this have a motivation and/or motivation problem rather than a marijuana problem. I know plenty of soft core marijuana users that are normal people. Though I think there have been studies that suggest smoking in your teens does have negative affects.



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently onlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12341 posts, RR: 25
Reply 12, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 2830 times:

I'm in favor of MJ decriminalization mostly due to the hypocrisy around its criminalization at the same time booze is legal by the gallon/case/pallet/truckload/etc and prescription drugs (a big money maker for Big Pharma) are widely abused.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
I'm just curious about what's going to happen in 5-10 years, when pot-smokers wake up one morning and realize they are mostly stuck at menial, minimum wage jobs, and start telling themselves "it must be discrimination!" and start demanding affirmative action for dopers.

How does that differ from boozers or pillheads?

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
Boeing will no longer be able to not hire a structural engineer because the guy is a pothead - how does that make you feel when boarding their jets?

How do you know they aren't weed smokers already?

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 8):
They might just cash their welfare checks and call their dealer.

There's packies (liquor stores) next to check cashing stores already, so it has nothing to do with MJ.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 10):
I know that there are a lot of studies that say that there are no lasting effects. But I have also personally seen some of these people literally fall apart before my eyes over a period of years - their speech is more slurred than it was a few years ago, their careers go nowhere (or they keep getting fired), and they just don't seem to give a shit.

Absent of a control group, this means squat. The same people could be in the same situation with or without pot, with or without booze, with or without prescription pills, etc.



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently onlineTSS From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 3066 posts, RR: 5
Reply 13, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 2803 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 8):
Frankly, your attitude seems to be straight from the 1950s, to which I can only add that you should make sure the black people are out of town by sundown and beware of homosexuals who may come to prey on you and corrupt you.

Actually, I couldn't decide if he sounded more like Carrie Nation on a soapbox or Professor Harold Hill warning of the trouble to which the playing of pool can lead.

Basically, as almost everyone else in this thread has pointed out, marijuana is widely available despite the best efforts of the DEA, is enjoyed by a broad spectrum of society with no discernible ill effects, and it is high time (no pun intended) that it's use was legalized and it's sale taxed... thus turning a federal budget liability into a source of income for the government.



Able to kill active threads stone dead with a single post!
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 14, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 2775 times:

Quoting TSS (Reply 13):
Basically, as almost everyone else in this thread has pointed out, marijuana is widely available despite the best efforts of the DEA, is enjoyed by a broad spectrum of society with no discernible ill effects

It's just ridiculous to think that productive people will put everything aside to become stoners should marijuana become legal or that a lazy person is that much more useful if they aren't high.

It's not like there aren't still hippies who retired, got jobs, and became mostly normal and productive people.

Quoting TSS (Reply 13):
it is high time (no pun intended) that it's use was legalized and it's sale taxed...

I wouldn't tax it beyond a nominal sales tax on all items. If you want to smoke, it's your business.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8791 posts, RR: 24
Reply 15, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2763 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 14):
It's not like there aren't still hippies who retired, got jobs, and became mostly normal and productive people.

Yeah, but they became Democrats. Evidence enough of brain damage...



Just a joke guys...



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19411 posts, RR: 58
Reply 16, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2752 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 10):
Maybe, but I do have some experience in a couple of European countries where pot is legal or at least tolerated, and there were an awful lot of people, both in school and in their places of work who were basically buzzed all the time - smoking 5-10 joints per day, starting the first thing in the morning.

Yup. Happens. Just like people who are a bit buzzed all the time on booze. They're called alcoholics.

We should ban alcohol.

Oh...wait...that worked about as well as banning pot.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 14):
I wouldn't tax it beyond a nominal sales tax on all items. If you want to smoke, it's your business.

Why not? Sin taxes are a great idea. First of all, anyone not wishing to pay the tax can simply not use cannabis. Second, it's a great source of revenue. Third, it discourages excessive use. I'm a strong proponent of sin taxes. I think they should be used on prostitution, gambling, tobacco, alcohol, etc.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 12):
How do you know they aren't weed smokers already?

They're not. Boeing drug tests everyone from secretary to engineers on a regular basis. But I bet you a few people at Airbus like to smoke a joint every now and then. And I've never felt the least bit uncomfortable getting on an Airbus because someone in France might smoke a bit of hashish (that's what they smoke in Europe).

Quoting TSS (Reply 13):
Basically, as almost everyone else in this thread has pointed out, marijuana is widely available despite the best efforts of the DEA, is enjoyed by a broad spectrum of society with no discernible ill effects, and it is high time (no pun intended) that it's use was legalized and it's sale taxed... thus turning a federal budget liability into a source of income for the government.

I'm a bit of a civil libertarian. I believe that ALL drugs except antibiotics should be legal and available without prescription. Antibiotics can harm others by your use, so they should require a prescription. Otherwise, if you want to pop pills, inject pure heroin with a clean needle, snort cocaine, etc. then 1)You and you alone are responsible for the consequences of your actions while under the influence and 2) It's none of the government's business what you put in your body in your own home.

"But people might drive while high on heroin!" Yeah, they do that on alcohol, too. It won't be any different. Prosecute the hell out of behavior that endangers others, not behavior that only endangers yourself.

"But the costs to society..." ...of skiing are tremendous. Skiers routinely suffer disability (both temporary and permanent) and death from their "recreational activity." Their careless behavior of throwing themselves down the mountain places an undue burden on the healthcare system. Frankly, it should be banned. And the same goes for bike riding and football and...

"But my kids..." ...are your responsibility. My parents taught me about drugs and alcohol. You do the same with yours.


User currently offlinethegreatRDU From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2310 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 2745 times:

Obama has a chance to stand up and be a leader on this issue...
But of course during the election...there was really no dialogue of substance..

He can come out and least say he respects states' rights or something
There's got be some certainty because no one really knows what the feds will do



Our Returning Champion
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 18, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 2720 times:

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 16):
Sin taxes are a great idea.

No they aren't. Either a given activity infringes on the rights of others in which case it should be regulated or banned, or it doesn't and it's none of the government's or anyone else's business whether or not I choose to do something and how often I do so. The simple truth is that if I'm not encroaching on anyone else's rights the government should not be passing judgement, whether it's jail time or taxes, on what I smoke, eat, drink, drive, etc.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineseb146 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 11533 posts, RR: 15
Reply 19, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2716 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 2):
I'm just curious about what's going to happen in 5-10 years, when pot-smokers wake up one morning and realize they are mostly stuck at menial, minimum wage jobs

Kinda like functioning alcoholics *cough*speakerofthehouse*cough*

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 18):
The simple truth is that if I'm not encroaching on anyone else's rights the government should not be passing judgement, whether it's jail time or taxes, on what I smoke, eat, drink, drive, etc.

The government, like any corporations (which is what the right-wing want the government to function as), finds a way to make money off the people. Taxes. Charge $8 a pack for tobacco cigarettes and have $7 of that go to the government as income. Just like any corporation, right? This, also, takes the criminal element out of it.

I don't smoke MJ. I have tried it and I don't like what it does to me. But, what consenting adults do behind closed doors is none of my business. If adults want to smoke weed, fine. I don't care. If they want to sign state issued contracts, fine. I don't care. These are things the right-wing *SAYS* they are for but, time and again, come out staunchly and squarely against!



Life in the wall is a drag.
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 20, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2713 times:

Quoting seb146 (Reply 19):
which is what the right-wing want the government to function as

That isn't true at all. Maximum efficiency is good, but the goal of government is not to make money. The goal of government is to provide essential services that cannot otherwise be offered through other practical means and do it as cheaply as possible and then attempt to collect enough revenue, in a fair way, to cover it.

Businesses seek to both minimize cost and maximize revenue and offer services based on that goal. The government needs to offer certain services, minimize the cost, and then only collect revenue to support that.

Quoting seb146 (Reply 19):
This, also, takes the criminal element out of it.

No it won't. You think people won't sell bootleg marijuana if the government places abusive taxes on it?



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7831 posts, RR: 52
Reply 21, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2659 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 20):
No it won't. You think people won't sell bootleg marijuana if the government places abusive taxes on it?

I don't think so, we don't see bootleg tobacco (as far as I know.) We see moonshine a bit, and I've got no stats on me, but I'm pretty sure it's more of a fun thing to do/family tradition rather than a way to dodge taxes.

I'm against sin taxes, though, if we need to compromise or raise revenue some how, I think sin taxes would be the first thing I'd like to see enacted (before higher income tax, sales tax, etc.)



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently onlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12341 posts, RR: 25
Reply 22, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2651 times:

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 16):
They're not. Boeing drug tests everyone from secretary to engineers on a regular basis.

I didn't know that.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 16):
"But the costs to society..." ...of skiing are tremendous.

I know, it cost us Sunny Bono.

Quoting thegreatRDU (Reply 17):
Obama has a chance to stand up and be a leader on this issue...

More like a target for the right.

Look how well his comments on same sex marriage went down in North Carolina.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 20):
The goal of government is to provide essential services that cannot otherwise be offered through other practical means and do it as cheaply as possible and then attempt to collect enough revenue, in a fair way, to cover it.

A great argument for the government becoming the "investor of last resort" in alternative energy. It's essential we reduce our defense spending by getting off imported oil as well as reducing our carbon footprint, but private industry just doesn't want to go there.

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 21):
I don't think so, we don't see bootleg tobacco (as far as I know.) We see moonshine a bit, and I've got no stats on me, but I'm pretty sure it's more of a fun thing to do/family tradition rather than a way to dodge taxes.

I'm enjoying the Moonshiners series on cable tv, and there it's clear that these individuals do it as a full time job to provide income for their families, not as some sort of hobby. The penalties are too stiff to risk taking the chance of being caught if it's just a hobby. The lack of taxes is just one more element that helps make it a viable way to provide for your family.



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlinesoon7x7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2643 times:

Quoting RussianJet (Thread starter):
The long-term plan of selling and taxing, and allowing possession of moderate amounts seems pretty sensible to me.

Taxes...that is all it is about...yet they are now discussing cigarette smokers requiring a license to buy smokes...WTF?...talk about a Bass Ackwards government. Now I know what happened to all those that attended Woodstock...they work in D.C....(District of Cannabis").

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 15):
Yeah, but they became Democrats. Evidence enough of brain damage...

...got a light!


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15719 posts, RR: 26
Reply 24, posted (1 year 7 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 2629 times:

Quoting Revelation (Reply 22):
A great argument for the government becoming the "investor of last resort" in alternative energy.

If it isn't a good investment for any of the dozens of private equity, venture capital, or big energy firms then it probably isn't a good investment for public money.

Quoting Revelation (Reply 22):
It's essential we reduce our defense spending by getting off imported oil as well as reducing our carbon footprint, but private industry just doesn't want to go there.

The industry will go there when the technology gets to the point that they can make money on it. Nobody is hiding super carburetors that will allow 100 MPG cars, it's just worth way too much.

I have no problem with the government trying to power their things via alternative means. Cover every government office in solar panels, it won't bother me, depending on what it costs. There's already some hybrid military vehicle prototypes running around. They should just keep their nose out of how I and the power company make and use energy.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
25 Revelation : As you said, the goal isn't to make money, it's to reduce pollution, health care costs, defense costs, and so on. How do you get to that point (ever,
26 BMI727 : Energy is something that can quite easily and effectively be provided by private companies, whose goal is to make money. Energy isn't really a govern
27 Dreadnought : I would point out one important exception. The French power grid is a government monopoly under EDF (Electricite de France), and as everyone knows, t
28 bhill : Yup, first getting pot off of Schedule I. Next DOMA.....whoo hoo!! We Washingtonians are a progressive bunch. And sin taxes ARE a great idea. Kinda li
29 DeltaMD90 : Ah, did not know that. Know quite a few people who had moonshiners in their family, they just liked making it. Went to college in Dahlonega, GA, so t
30 Post contains images RussianJet : Small point of order, Doc - there's a good deal of weed floating around Europe too. Predominance of hash varies a fair amount from country to country
31 Dreadnought : Hash was predominant years ago, but pot started to get popular in the 90s, from what I saw.
32 RussianJet : That's broadly true, yes. Europe is of course a more traditional destination for hashish than the US, owing to its relative proximity to source areas
33 DocLightning : No more than they sell bootleg booze or tobacco. Even with huge taxes, the price will be far below what it is currently. Besides, weed isn't "bootleg
34 RussianJet : To an extent, but seriously - far less dominant than it used to be. As I mentioned, mainly due to steady growth in local production. Definitely true
35 lewis : Hash is very popular in Spain, France and Italy. The Netherlands is kind of a mix. From my experience the UK was more of a weed country. Greece is al
36 Post contains images DocLightning : I'm sure you'd know much better than I.
37 AirframeAS : This is why I support strict routine random drug testing at every workplace, regardless of industry. Why not? Taxing marijuana is a great idea. It is
38 BMI727 : No they aren't. It's dumb for the government to decide that it's bad enough to be taxed, but not so bad to be banned. It's your life, smoke what you
39 AirframeAS : Question for you: Do you like beer or other alcohol? Or do you smoke cigarettes?
40 BMI727 : Somewhat. I tend to do enough dumb stuff without drinking. No. However, I don't feel the need to stop people who avidly partake of both.
41 Revelation : Believe it or not, the government is us, and it only rules with the support of the people. The ban is coming down because we the people realize it's
42 AirframeAS : Well, guess what? Beer is taxed, too! Just sayin'......... If beer is taxed by the government, then weed WILL be taxed as well. I agree with everythi
43 seb146 : Health care and food? oh, wait... we have to let people live and die at the mercy of profit.... There will always be *some* criminal element to it. J
44 Dreadnought : Tell me, do you believe that at any point in people's lives they should be responsible for themselves? Or do you want a benevolent state to hold your
45 seb146 : It is this whole post of yours that pisses me off about the whole right-wing. You all think like that. At least, the ones who only surround themselve
46 DeltaMD90 : Couldn't the same argument be used to legalize marijuana? I actually agree with you here, and this didn't really occur to me until a few months ago
47 AirframeAS : That is not exactly true, and you know it. There are so many Americans on welfare that see checks coming in when they are not working, which tells th
48 DeltaMD90 : You're saying the same thing as Seb: majority =/= all, and this acknowledges that:
49 Revelation : Right, but we saw how Mitt and his Boca Raton buddies put the figure at 47%, and proceeded to use that figure to make themselves feel good about all
50 Post contains images AirframeAS : But it is true!!!!! People who are on assistance actually DO NOT WANT to get off their asses and do something productive with their lives as long as
51 Aesma : I'm sure they'd rather have that life than being in jail being the slave of a prison corporation...
52 Dreadnought : You are the one who popped up and said (or at least strongly implied) that the essential services to be provided by government include healthcare and
53 Revelation : Re: OT: it's normal thread drift. One benefit of MJ legalization is the ability to tax it, thus the topic turned to what should and should not be tax
54 AirframeAS : Well, you need to remove the wool from your eyes. Dreadnaught and I just gave an example of each of how this is actually happening in our society tod
55 Revelation : I'm not saying it doesn't happen at all, I'm just saying I feel it isn't the central/core issue some people and/or groups make it out to be. In parti
56 AirframeAS : They need to be taxed higher, I agree. They need to be taxed a fair share. But then again, what is actually "fair share"? Everyone has their own opin
57 Post contains links and images Dreadnought : You can actually be pretty objective about it..
58 Revelation : It'd actually be more objective if the X axis was income percentile and Y was taxes paid percentile, IMHO. And it'd be more objective to include all
59 BMI727 : So I should forget all of the people whining that the government is the wealthy? It should only rule what it needs to rule. If only one man in the en
60 Dreadnought : That information is included, for the 10th and 50th percentiles. Which I have said for years here was probably Bush's biggest ever mistake, economica
61 Revelation : Competitive with who? Seems one well known corporate entity assigns the royalties from its inventions all around the world to that hot bed of innovat
62 Revelation : Right, but how come not for every percentile? The x axis is for time, which is an interesting thing to some degree, but not if you are trying to dete
63 BMI727 : Lower and middle class people cannot want to raise taxes on the rich while holding down their own and then in the next breath complain about all the
64 seb146 : And when we try to be responsible only to be told we have to pay an extra $2000 a month for a pre-existing condition, why is that our fault? Keep in
65 Maverick623 : Prove it. Until then, all of yours and Dreadnought's rants about how lazy people are is nothing more than recycled, made up FOX News bullshit. Actual
66 jet-lagged : Most likely: - another 10 states, more red than blue, will have accepted 'medical' marijuana - another 5 or so states beyond Colorado and Washington,
67 par13del : Yes I'm sure that is true, but tell me, how many of them actually work in the courts on a daily basis, review legal documents, make detail decisions
68 Post contains images Hywel :
69 Post contains images Revelation : Strange how you are all about the Constitution, up to but not including the idea of the representative form of government it describes. Total hypocri
70 Dreadnought : Wow. Coming from the side that makes class warfare the pivital core of their movement, the chutzpah in this statement is unbelievable.
71 BMI727 : It's not us though. The wealthy are the ones paying that bill. There's the reality that money buys things. I raised the point before, but it bears re
72 DeltaMD90 : Most people function just fine with alcohol, do you see your train driver drinking a bunch of vodka before his shift? I can see why some people want
73 Post contains images par13del :
74 Revelation : Despite what conservative outlets tell you, I think you stepped back and looked at it you'd find the GOP is the true class warrior party. Mitt Romney
75 Dreadnought : Aaaaaand, the whole Occupy movement and talk of the 99% vs the 1% isn't? Which came first? I have never stated that I support those policies. For the
76 Revelation : The fact that GOP are class warriors goes back decades if not centuries. Reagan's trickle down economics, Hoover's entire approach that directly lead
77 Dreadnought : I could write a book in response, but I won't bother. How do you fight against decades of misinformation and ignorance of philosophy and history?
78 Revelation : If your book states that class war only applies when the poor rally against the rich, don't bother... Hope and pray that FOX NEWS shuts down?
79 Post contains images Maverick623 : The only difference between the Occutards and the GOP supporters is the percentage of people that they think are freeloaders. The GOP supporters beli
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