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CT School Shooting  
User currently onlinestlgph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9239 posts, RR: 25
Posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5295 times:

Looking at dozens dead in Newtown, CT this morning from a shooting at an elementary school.

Reporter friends on the ground saying they've counted at least 20 body bags ... CBS news is reporting 27 are dead, including 14 children.

http://www.livestream.com/foxct

http://www.courant.com/

http://www.ctnow.com/


Eternal darkness we all should dread. It's hard to party when you're dead.
209 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineracko From Germany, joined Nov 2001, 4856 posts, RR: 20
Reply 1, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5242 times:

So sad...an elementary school  

I am lost for words.


User currently offlinepvjin From Finland, joined Mar 2012, 1002 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5231 times:

Horrible, just horrible... Kind of reminds me from Breivik, so many young people dead.

World nowadays is just so fucked up...



"A rational army would run away"
User currently offlinePC12Fan From United States of America, joined Jan 2007, 2378 posts, RR: 5
Reply 3, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5232 times:

27 dead - 18 kids. I am stunned and at a loss for words.


Just when I think you've said the stupidest thing ever, you keep talkin'!
User currently offlinehammerb32 From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2004, 132 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5217 times:

Unbelievably sad, thoughts to all the victims familys

User currently offlinesoon7x7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5219 times:

You've gotta wonder what is happening to this country. What drives the anger and rote apathy for human life in these creeps/ cowards. Too much hate and why pick on children at schools. What the hell do children have to do with anything other than they are the offspring of a class of people some one apparently has a problem with. Connecticut is as conservative a state you'll find in the North East as any. Simple people, simply going to school looking forward to the Holidays with excitement. Bam!...they are gone...WTF?...too many anti depressives mixed w power drinks?...something has to give and don't tell me guns have to be regulated...they already are. Idiots that are dangerously wired in the head are too frequently walking amongst us all everyday. Only going to see more of this I'm afraid.

User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7281 posts, RR: 52
Reply 6, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5204 times:

Sigh well this ruined my day


Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently onlinestlgph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9239 posts, RR: 25
Reply 7, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5203 times:

One of my reporter friends texted me telling me it sounds like an entire kindergarten class was wiped out.


Eternal darkness we all should dread. It's hard to party when you're dead.
User currently offlinecasinterest From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4158 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5187 times:

This is unbelievable. I am stunned by it. My sympathy to the victims and thier families. I don't know what answers will come as the shooter is apparently dead.


Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
User currently offlineflyingturtle From Switzerland, joined Oct 2011, 2069 posts, RR: 12
Reply 9, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5136 times:

 

...why?



David



Keeping calm is terrorism against those who want to live in fear.
User currently offlineHoMsaR From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 1109 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5107 times:

I have relatives in Connecticut, though none of them are in elementary school (and the school-age ones are actually at private boarding schools out of state). Still, made my heart jump for a minute there.

Terrible stuff.

And earlier posters are right. There is something seriously wrong with the mentality of people in this country, and unfortunately that will be lost in the debate about gun control. That debate is one that certainly needs to be had (using logic and facts, and removing "emotion" from the debate), but it can't override the simple, serious discussion about WTF is wrong with people?

People are being pushed to the point of snapping and losing all control of their own actions, and something has to be addressed about that.

One thing this country seems horribly incapable of is having serious, honest public discussions about difficult subjects.



I was raised by a cup of coffee.
User currently offlineStarbuk7 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 599 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5014 times:

There is gun control in this country, go down and try to buy a gun and see how much paperwork you have to fill out before you can even leave the store with the gun.

As mentioned it is about peoples mental state, involving personnel responsibility for ones actions which is severely lacking in this country nowadays.

This is a very tragic and sad situation but do not try to take away my "legally" obtained and purchased weapons.


User currently onlinestlgph From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 9239 posts, RR: 25
Reply 12, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 4986 times:

Now reporters at the scene are saying two shooters ... one 20, one 24.


Eternal darkness we all should dread. It's hard to party when you're dead.
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7281 posts, RR: 52
Reply 13, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5054 times:

I hate to make this another gun debate thread, but I guess I can't say "most" without knowing how many, but many gun-owners (including me) knows something needs to be done, even before this situation happened. It's hard to deny we have a gun problem in this nation

Details are fuzzy, is there anything more to this story at the moment? This is terrible



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29705 posts, RR: 59
Reply 14, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5031 times:

Well Said Starbuk7!!!

Newark727, just goes to show how pointless that gin control law is. The same can be said about the wide majority of them on the books.

Git rid of them, allow us to exercise our rights and these things won't happen. Every state that has gone to concealed carry has seen drops in crime....period



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineNewark727 From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 1315 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5024 times:

Quoting Starbuk7 (Reply 22):
As mentioned it is about peoples mental state, involving personnel responsibility for ones actions which is severely lacking in this country nowadays.

And why is that? You can't talk about people not taking responsibility and going nuts without talking about the tools that make such an option attractive, and the general culture that encourages people to aggressively defend the use of such tools regardless of the actual issue (see the spikes in gun sales upon Obama's election despite the repeated lack of any action to restrict such sales.) There is a narrative in this country that the government is mendacious, deceptive, and out to take your freedoms away, and that you must defend yourself against them, with force of arms if necessary. Now mix that with people who have vengeful thoughts, people who perceive enemies where none exist, people who hold a grudge.

Quoting Starbuk7 (Reply 22):
This is a very tragic and sad situation but do not try to take away my "legally" obtained and purchased weapons.

Way to jump to conclusions.


User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10744 posts, RR: 38
Reply 16, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5031 times:

I just found out about this.

This is true horror. Shocking!

Can one person alone kill 25+ others? What if there was a second murderer?

 Wow!  

There are no words for such a horrendous tragedy.

RIP all innocent victims.

  



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineracko From Germany, joined Nov 2001, 4856 posts, RR: 20
Reply 17, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 4982 times:

AP: Shooter is a 20 year old man "with connections to the school", weapon used is a .223 rifle.

User currently offlineNewark727 From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 1315 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 5069 times:

Quoting L-188 (Reply 28):
Git rid of them, allow us to exercise our rights and these things won't happen.

Question: what will happen instead? You have not addressed the issue raised by that random twitter comment you seem to be endorsing, which is: how does this sort of situation resolve differently when the entire public is armed? In fact, a lot of situations will resolve differently when somebody has a gun. We take them away on airplanes for a reason, we used to keep you from carrying them into town back in the Old West days too.

Quote:
Even when I was stationed on Germany back in the nineties it was appalling the lack of freedom your country, the country that gave us Mauser, Luger and Walther has In that regard.

These two facts may be more connected than you think!

[Edited 2012-12-14 10:43:05]

User currently onlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21129 posts, RR: 56
Reply 19, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5069 times:

Quoting L-188 (Reply 28):
Every state that has gone to concealed carry has seen drops in crime....period

If you're willing to accept more homicides, then great. Because those also go up with increased gun ownership.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineracko From Germany, joined Nov 2001, 4856 posts, RR: 20
Reply 20, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5056 times:

Quoting SoJo (Reply 40):
Nice attitude L-188. So, from your post you're on about "YOUR" civil rights. What about the childrens rights? Should they not go to school and feel safe? I'm gobsmacked at your reply.

They could have bought guns and defended themselves like men!


User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7281 posts, RR: 52
Reply 21, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5023 times:

Quoting soon7x7 (Reply 37):
This only strengthens the argument for more individuals to have guns to defend themselves, their children, their property.

Come on, I own 9 guns. How can you say that people having more guns could have stopped this? We know nothing yet. It seems like a shooter locked himself in a classroom and killed everyone in there. Even if the teacher had a gun, he/she would have to be a very quick draw and have an accurate aim to shoot a surprise gunman. What if a teacher next door was armed? Still would result in kids dying, maybe less.

In the best case scenario, kids would have died. We gun owners (assuming you are one) can't automatically dismiss any case without looking at options that restrict guns in the hands of crazies but allow us to hunt, shoot for fun, etc. Up to this shooting, these shooter(s) were probably clean, legal gun owners like you and me (again, assuming you are a gun owner)



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlinejfk69 From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 1389 posts, RR: 1
Reply 22, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5008 times:

If you have children go home today and hug them all a little tighter.

Thoughts and prayers to all affected.


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 6950 posts, RR: 18
Reply 23, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 5012 times:

I wanna know one thing....where are the in-school guards/police? At public schools in Arizona and in Ohio, both states have security people present, sometimes armed, sometimes police officers. Reportedly NO resistance or security was present. What the hell.


One of the FB admins for PHX Spotters. "Zach the Expat!"
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7281 posts, RR: 52
Reply 24, posted (1 year 4 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 4988 times:

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 44):

I wanna know one thing....where are the in-school guards/police? At public schools in Arizona and in Ohio, both states have security people present, sometimes armed, sometimes police officers. Reportedly NO resistance or security was present. What the hell.

Even if there was, is the police officer supposed to teleport instantly to the location? I don't want to think about it, but it probably doesn't take too long to do what the shooters did...



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
25 Newark727 : But back to my first post. Let's take a look at how everyone responded. The calls for gun control- predictable enough, but specifics are needed- what
26 PHX787 : I mean on site. I guarantee you if someone tried to pull crap like this in Arizona, he would be shot through the head upon arrival.
27 Wolbo : Let's not act surprised here, it's a logical and inevitable consequence of America's obsession with guns. This is simply the prize to pay for that obe
28 flyingturtle : One does not even have armed students or teachers around. In the Empire State Building shooting this year, one gunman was killed by the police, and n
29 jpetekyxmd80 : You think a token security person couldn't be handled very simply by anyone still using a fraction of their brain?
30 Newark727 : I think what soon7x7 was saying, and your response, is actually quite illustrative. I'm not sure he was actually advocating the position he did, rath
31 L-188 : Actually Newsrk727 the people that are calling for guy control are the new that are looking for the QuickFix, and like most qck fixes it doesnt work.
32 iFlyLOTs : In the school district I went to from K-12 I only had a school "resource officer" in high school. I live in a town that's rather wealthy and we have
33 airportugal310 : What? Since when did every school out there need security people, especially an elementary school? That something new?
34 DeltaMD90 : Well, at every public school I attended, there was a single armed cop somewhere, but there are probably 20 entrances to these schools. I'm sure if th
35 racko : Like in Tucson?
36 hammerb32 : Is it really that bad in the US that security guards are needed at an elementary school. Not the time to debate gun control for me, just a time to th
37 Newark727 : Shouting "my civil rights!" and saying that their allowance will make the problem go away is just as quick a fix. In fact, worse, since it isn't real
38 DeltaMD90 : I never saw them as security guards... they were there to handle disciplinary problems with kids (like fights, something involved in every school,) t
39 L-188 : Just out of curiosity, how is supporting a civil right enshrined in the constitution along with the right to free speech a , "quick fix"? IMHO most re
40 srbmod : What about the "CIVIL RIGHTS" of the innocent victims in these SENSELESS MASSACRES"? You cannot have it BOTH WAYS!!!!! The Second Amendment is woeful
41 Newark727 : I can't say at the moment, the only California rule that I'm completely familiar with is the 10-shot limit and I don't know much about New York's. I
42 Newark727 : Well it happened almost as soon as the calls for gun control with even less apparent regard for its long term effects.
43 racko : Shooter apparently killed his parent in New Jersey and then drove to his hometown and shot up the school.
44 Mir : That's something that's a consequence of the mentality that having lots of guns around improves safety. If you're going to operate on that philosophy
45 ALTF4 : I didn't bother reading the pro/anti gun comments. There is something seriously messed up with some people, and guns or no guns, people will do harm -
46 ushermittwoch : No, these people are already in a state beyond help in regard to being sensible. The whole militia movement paired with conservative talk radio / con
47 Newark727 : Nice dodge. If someone is absolutely determined to have a full-auto Kalishnakov with a bayonet and 100-round drum magazine I'm sure there are ways th
48 jpetekyxmd80 : They will tell you not to politicize tragedy. They'll tell you that until you forget.
49 PHX787 : I found his FB page, they released his name. Ryan Lanza. He's from Hoboken NJ, and his mom (RIP) lives in Newtown. The shares of his profile picture j
50 Mir : They don't. That doesn't mean we should make it easier for them to do what they do. See, if we have stricter gun laws, it will be possible to arrest
51 PHX787 : True and this is a small town in a very very affluent neighborhood....no one would expect this here anyway
52 racko : Injured. Not killed. 31,347 people killed by guns in the US in 2009.
53 iowaman : Dear fellow enthusiasts, I ask you kindly to please stay on topic and avoid turning this into a flamewar. I will be cleaning this thread up asap. Heat
54 Aesma : How many are hunting shotguns ? To own a gun in Germany you need a license with many hoops to go through, and like in most other countries there is n
55 flyingturtle : This line of reasoning doesn't solve any problem, too. But the laws were, still are and continue to be the rules which were agreed upon by the whole
56 Maverick623 : Also, it's about 15 miles away from where a man shot his son who was prowling around the man's sister's house next door, and about 20 miles away from
57 zckls04 : Most of the shooters in recent months bought their guns legally. Your argument states that we should get rid of the law against murder- it says nothi
58 SoJo : Because this is about the 'AMERICAN' children who DIED. How many knives do YOU own? I feel sure you must have quite an arsenal to protect yourself. D
59 Maverick623 : False. The laws (for the most part) are the rules which were agreed upon by a majority (occasionally a 2/3 supermajority) of elected representatives.
60 Gatorman96 : The gun is the endgame. These tragedies begin many years back through poor parenting, bullying, mental illness, unemployment, etc. Sure, there are pro
61 Maverick623 : Not even the shooter? Interesting.
62 SoJo : Sorry all. I meant AMENDMENT. Thanx Maverick623.
63 Newark727 : In principle, agreed. In practice, I don't have a problem with stepping on the toes of a few gun advocates if it means saving dozens of lives. In fac
64 Aesma : SoJo, I'm guessing you mean that an amendment is by definition a change to the original constitution. And that of course there is no reason why it cou
65 Giancavia : While I am one of those who would never want to be part of a society where being armed can be achieved so easily.. one must accept there will never be
66 Post contains links and images cmf : Facts do not support your claim. http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012...tified-teenager-critical-condition http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...ol-
67 flyingturtle : I don't see the problem then. Are you living in a democracy? There, the people get the politicians they deserve. Denial isn't helping you. David
68 luv2fly : As much as I would like to see a change to gun control laws it ain't ever going to happen. Sorry the NRA is to strong and powerful and will see to it.
69 PHX787 : I would like to say for housekeeping purposes that my reply which has garnered the most quotes thus far is now Reply 54. Both father and mother report
70 PHX787 : Did you honestly go through the trouble to actually search Arizona just to attack me? Read your report- this was outside the school, one injured, and
71 Mir : I think you'd be surprised. It's not going to take away gang violence in itself, but I very much doubt that gangs could get their hands on nearly as
72 ALTF4 : This.
73 MSPNWA : Just a terribly sad deal. My prayers to the families. Hopefully some good will come out of this to make schools safer. I'm typing this from a college
74 Aesma : Exactly. Around here gangs (well, more like criminal groups, we don't really have gangs) often use hunting rifles or even makeshift weapons. Only rec
75 Maverick623 : Nice try. You claimed that the "whole of society" introduces and passes laws and used that as a justification for your position. Now you say that the
76 Post contains images BHMNONREV : That was my first thought when I heard about this sickening tragedy several hours ago. Didn't save those kids in Scotland any more than it did today
77 zckls04 : Probably true, but I'm not sure how that would work in practice. Perhaps you have to check in with a gun shop every year to show that you have all th
78 casinterest : Apparently the Suspect's mother was a teacher at the school. She was killed as well.
79 Maverick623 : Yes it can. So can meth. Both are Schedule II drugs in the US.
80 AviRaider : Such evil in this world. I cry for all of the mommies and daddies and other loved ones who have been ripped from their precious babies. This whole deb
81 Post contains links Giancavia : http://www.businessinsider.com/the-w...anza-pictured-on-cbs-2012-12?0=law And the media never learn, so busy to be the big shots they can put some inn
82 KiwiRob : You can have gun control up the kazoo (which I agree with) but you'll never stop someone who is determined enough to kill people, kill people. Norway
83 Giancavia : Does anyone else find it creepy that the press are poking microphones into the mouths of tiny little kids and asking what happened and what they saw o
84 luv2fly : Ratings. I could never do that to anyone, let alone a child.
85 Giancavia : Right and now the media are saying the shooter was not the guy they named but his brother.. As long as they got to break it first who cares about the
86 eaa3 : There are 20 dead children not 18 and 6 adults. A total of 26.
87 Maverick623 : You'd think they'd learn from editing the Zimmerman tapes. Looks like this guy is gonna get a nice payout from a libel suit.
88 Mir : Except that they were. Guns don't start off as illegal. They get manufactured legally and sold legally to a buyer. It's what happens after that that'
89 Newark727 : I hope so. The effects of a misidentification like that are the sort of thing that gets worse in an internet-connected society, because even after th
90 Maverick623 : "Yes, officer, that was a gun I owned. If you check, I reported it stolen 3 months ago." Law rendered invalid.
91 cmf : That you can't stop 100% doesn't mean you shouldn't stop the 70, 80, 90 or whatever percentage you would stop.
92 casinterest : Actually, it appears the press has the right person. His brother was found dead in NJ.
93 Mir : Too bad. Part of being a responsible gun owner is making sure that your guns stay where they're supposed to stay. I'm willing to give people one free
94 HoMsaR : No. Law still valid. This presumes a person would report to the police that their gun was stolen. If someone is engaged in illegal activity (such as
95 Newark727 : Gun control is only part of the problem, and mental illness is only part of the problem. Many mentally ill people possess no inclinations to carry ou
96 Post contains images PHX787 : Now THIS is a bigger issue than the whole gun control thing I can't believe this crap!
97 Revelation : Actually Newtown is pretty liberal. Same ones who are against pregnancy termination and against welfare at the same time. Did you read Mir's post? Is
98 Maverick623 : I though the "blame the victim" mentality was an evil right-wing idea. Meh. What are the odds they'd register the guns in the first place? Raising "e
99 Revelation : So you are saying a judge and jury would not convict someone whose gun was used in a crime after that person reported dozens or hundreds of stolen gu
100 GDB : Firstly, this is so awful, to a degree that after so many similar incidents this one still has the power to shock. To Dunblane in 1996, the killer, T
101 Mir : The victim here is the person (or people) who got shot, not the guy who can't keep his guns in the right place. If they bought it legally, they'd hav
102 Maverick623 : Based on that alone? Not a chance. Really? Last I checked, 100 comes before 102... So theft is now a victimless crime? Excellent. You still need peop
103 Giancavia : Negative they all first reported "Ryan Lanza" and used the wrong twitter and facebook account which meant some other kid with the same name started g
104 CplKlinger : Where is this mystical and mythical "gun registry" of which you speak? I own guns that aren't registered anywhere. I did the 4473 at the store, passe
105 slider : Prayers for the fallen, all the families and for the precious children all permanently impacted by this evil, evil act. This is just such a dark thing
106 tugger : To follow this perfect comment.... There is no reason possible, it is innumerably sad and disgusting. My heart goes out and breaks (seriously, it is
107 zckls04 : I thought about that, but then what if the seller just says it was lost, or stolen by a mystery perp? EDIT- I am late to the party with that one....
108 tugger : I will add that the shooter is not worthy to be counted among the dead and should never be included in such. Tug
109 Mir : The crime is not keeping your firearms secure. The theft itself is a whole other matter, and no that's not a victimless crime. I feel bad for someone
110 vanguard737 : Your words are nothing short of simplistic, repetitive, and your last statement especially, entirely crass and cruel just hours after the murder of t
111 Geezer : At 5:00 PM (EST) the count is: 20 children, 6 adults (including the shooter) Charley
112 fr8mech : Which other rights are you willing to give up in a heartbeat in the interest of protecting the children? You know, I think you're correct; it's time
113 Revelation : Of course not on that alone, but very far from your suggestion of "Law rendered invalid.". He introduced the idea of records being kept for legal gun
114 Newark727 : Just because it happened there, doesn't mean that it happens on the scale and frequency that it does in the United States. And just because he had in
115 Mir : You'd have to set one up. How much current information you could get into it is an issue that would have to be worked out - you're not going to get e
116 Newark727 : There are rights, and there are human lives. There comes a time when the interests of utter devotion to the Second Amendment have to be sublimated to
117 L-188 : I don't know why everybody claims that firearms are hard to get after bans. Most weapons designs are very sinple so that you can used unskilled labor
118 Newark727 : IMO this is perfectly fine. Higher price means fewer people will have restricted guns, which is precisely the objective when you ban something.
119 zckls04 : And they say Americans don't understand irony. Anyway, you say: Is it easier to kill with a gun or a knife? Would the death toll have been as high wi
120 zckls04 : Thus bringing the US in line with practically every other civilized nation. Thus taking the US out of line with practically every other civilized nat
121 2707200X : Words cannot convey this tragedy, how parents of young ones feel, how the parents of the children at the school feel, how the kids at the school feels
122 L-188 : Newsrk727......you missed my point We banned pot, yet it is widely used, made and imported We banned booze, yet it was widely used made and imported W
123 PHX787 : has anyone even touched upon the fact that all the media outlets got the dude's name wrong? All of this. Simply banning an object is not going to prev
124 flyguy89 : Such a horrific tragedy, it almost brought tears to my eyes the thought of an entire kindergarten class murdered...I just can't fathom what would driv
125 Newark727 : Incidentally, Japan has way, way fewer guns than the United States in it. So saying that more bans on guns wouldn't do anything is fairly untrue. Gun
126 zckls04 : This. It's also the case that public opinion supports many such laws which have yet to be enacted, but is generally against a complete ban. To me "gu
127 JakeOrion : Not unless the human race adopts the philosophy of suppressing human emotions, like in the film Equilibrium. Unfortunately, no matter how much legisl
128 Newark727 : I believe this as well, and if it takes place I will abide by its result. But right now, it's impeded by the steadfast and unreasoning opposition to
129 RobertNL070 : According to the BBC, twenty children and six adults have been SHOT DEAD. Why...?
130 Post contains images DeltaMD90 : I agree... I think a happy/ier medium can be reached
131 Rara : Very, very sad. This is the price America pays for liberal gun laws. It's a terrible price, but many are willing to pay it. Look how many people in th
132 stratosphere : Yep Liberals will never figure this out... You can ban guns won't mean a thing..There has been mass gunman in places where it is very restrictive or
133 DeltaMD90 : Come on, you know what they are saying. NO ONE is saying banning guns will stop mass murders, they are saying it would decrease violence. Look at Nor
134 flyguy89 : And I would agree with hesitation. It's all too easy to pass emotionally charged, reactionary but ultimately ineffective legislation-- i.e. the assau
135 zckls04 : I live in San Francisco- you're preaching to the choir.....
136 Post contains images PHX787 : Social upbringing also has a large impact on a society. Japan, again, for exampl, puts an extreme social stigma against straying too far from the nor
137 sbworcs : All I can say is that my sincere condolences go out to all. I cannot imagine what those families are going through, especially at this time of year.
138 flyguy89 : I very much agree. I'm not saying there isn't some common-sense gun legislation that can be passed to address this gun issue to an extent. We've had
139 Post contains images scbriml : That's true. If only all those kids had been armed, this would have never happened. You think it's NORMAL to have armed guards IN A PRIMARY SCHOOL?
140 vanguard737 : Last I knew, any physical object used to cause harm to another is a weapon. By your logic, we should ban bricks, as they can be bludgeoning objects.
141 zckls04 : They're not angry at guns, they're angry at gun violence. But in any case I don't think it's fair to ascribe emotions (or lack thereof) to other peop
142 ltbewr : To me another factor in these mass, terrorist murders is that many of the killers want to make a big splash in the media, going out of this world in g
143 vanguard737 : We don't do anything useful with firearms? I'm not even going to bother digging deeper into that moronic statement...
144 Post contains links flyingturtle : School shootings increased sharply in the 1990ies, but they are an old problem in the U.S.: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_shooting - the Bath S
145 zckls04 : Lot of assumptions here. We really don't know anything about him or his motivations yet. Additionally this is a newsworthy event- we can't stop the p
146 EA CO AS : Yes. They're called School Resource Officers and are part of the city's police force.
147 GDB : There will be inevitable comparisons with Breivik in Norway. Though many US gun enthusiasts have this idea that there is some kind of blanket mass res
148 zckls04 : Easy tiger! To clarify, I meant they do not have a purpose other than to cause, or threaten to cause harm. Bricks are primarily used for building thi
149 DeltaMD90 : Sigh... I've never fired a gun intending to kill, nor have I purchased one thinking I will kill. In fact, there are many .22s built specifically with
150 flyguy89 : Well yeah...they're an old problem anywhere, and I think we all know that gun violence/gun death can never be eradicated in any country in the world,
151 zckls04 : At no point did I suggest that everybody who owns a gun intends to kill. I am talking on a more philosophical level; the nature of the object itself
152 Post contains links Mortyman : Need I remind you of: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Norway_attacks
153 Aesma : Didn't the Patriot Act already strip anyone suspected of terrorism of all his rights ? In fact I think the 4th amendment is more restrictive than ave
154 flyingturtle : Point taken, there is no direct relationship... what I wanted to point out was that in 1927, scores of children were also killed, despite the lack of
155 PC12Fan : Damnit - guys! Guys! Guys!!!! We have lost what has sparked all of this!! 20 families will not get to hug their babies tonight! 26 families will not g
156 foppishbum : Let's not turn this thread into a debate for gun control. I think it is better to open another thread for it. My condolences to the families and those
157 Post contains images stratosphere :
158 fr8mech : No, at their core, both amendments limit government and empower the people. What makes one more "special" than the other? The usual suspects are sayi
159 Post contains images YVRLTN : Why does anyone need a .223 rifle other than for sport? They should not be sold to the public and no one needs more than a pistol to protect themselv
160 Post contains images jetmech : Many on the pro-gun side do seem to just brush aside the lives lost in such tragedies as part of the price that is paid for "freedom". I often wonder
161 PHX787 : A reoccurring pattern....we need to fix our mental health system! All of these could have been prevented if these kids received the right help....but
162 Post contains images KaiGywer : Agreed. Disagreed. Ammo can be bought cheaper online than local stores, just like anything else. Guns are already pretty limited, in that they have t
163 Post contains images brilondon : Guns are not necessary in a civil society. If you eliminate the right to bare arms, then the guns that are in the society will still be available for
164 PHX787 : The problem is, simply removing the guns from a society will not stop the issues. Criminals always think of a way to get around it. Plus, there's no
165 YVRLTN : But as far as we know this guy was not a criminal until this morning, yet had access to an assault rifle. This the the kind of gun usage which needs
166 Post contains images Mir : You can not eliminate it. You can reduce it. And you should. And when all our murders are being committed by the mafia instead of crazed psychopaths,
167 Post contains images itsjustme : One of the very few posts in this thread that makes sense and shouldn't be deleted for being off topic. The majority of you people who have commented
168 PHX787 : You still realize that it still happens. The Mafia becomes the waypoint for acquiring guns.
169 Post contains images scbriml : Ah, the usual pro-gun bullshit logic failure. What's the primary purpose of a brick? And a gun? I would be one. I never see the point in "offering my
170 Post contains images PHX787 : Well lets look at that from the societal standpoint- we have no base of morality, no ethics, no parental responsibility that is encoded within our so
171 na : There is something fundamentally wrong with your society then. A society that thinks that guns should be part of civilian everyday life cannot be rig
172 brilondon : I am so tired of the American mentality. This is where control is needed with this type of weapon. An assault rifle? A civil society does not need to
173 4engines4lnghll : You both dont understand... Anyone around the world can use a gun and commit mass murder. You have some countries where the people kill because of pov
174 TheCommodore : From what I heard, it was his mothers, he somehow got it from her Where have you been ? This is exactly what's happening and has been for years ! And
175 FlyDeltaJets : The gunman was carrying his brothers ID police identified him as the brother. I don't see a libel suit from this.
176 Superfly : This is just sickening. I am really lost for words about this terrible crime. My condolences to the families who lost loved ones to these cold-blooded
177 Giancavia : Not true, The media were reporting he was the killer hours and hours before the police ever released a name. I hope this Ryan Lanza chap sues the med
178 Mir : People who really want guns illegally will always be able to get them, yes. But having to deal with the mob to get a gun will likely cause some peopl
179 Post contains images EA CO AS : How many free passes are you willing to give people for cars stolen from their driveways and used to mow down others in accidents? One? Two? At what
180 Mir : When we start having a problem with cars being used by people other than their registered owners for the explicit purpose of being used to kill peopl
181 na : If the US of A dont get their act together and stop worshipping guns this will go on and on. So next time Alabama, Utah, Georgia? Its unbelievable tha
182 EA CO AS : While the explicit intent to use a vehicle for the sole purpose of killing someone isn't always present, we already have this problem to some degree;
183 Mir : Not by the car. But rather by the guns that the robbers are carrying around. Not intentionally. It's funny how people who try to equate guns to cars
184 Post contains images Maverick623 : So it's okay if people die in large numbers, if it was an "accident"?
185 bmacleod : As a Canadian, we often get poked at for our tight gun laws. There have been a few movies such as Firestorm where Canadian firefighters are singled ou
186 Mir : Of course it's not okay. But accidents are not crimes, and one has to go about preventing them in different ways. -Mir
187 yyz717 : Agree completely with the above comments. What makes me want to puke is Americans who claim that their rights to bear arms is more important than the
188 soon7x7 : What if this ilk did not have school children in his cross hairs but decided to select some home owner at random...lets just say ....you!?...your fam
189 Post contains images EricR : It's a society, and specifically a generation, that has lost their way for many reasons. The sad part is that no form of gun control can prevent this
190 srbmod : The hatemongers from Westboro Baptist "Church" plan on picketing in front of the school according to the Twitter account of Shirley Phelps-Roper (Let'
191 Post contains images Maverick623 : So the lack of freedom somehow increases freedom. Assuming there wasn't a violent overthrow of the government (which would happen), if the 2nd Amendm
192 DeltaMD90 : Well I've got a carry permit so....... I don't see your point. I've not said anything about "banning all guns" in this thread, just some common sense
193 FlyDeltaJets : How can you blame someone for another person's actions. Unless it is proven the actively promoted their car's theft. To say they are irresposible bec
194 alberchico : What the hell did this woman need with a .223 caliber Bushmaster rifle ? If the suspect did not have any access to weapons would the shooting have hap
195 NZ1 : Hi Everyone, Just a friendly reminder to keep this thread on topic. The alternative is that it will need to be locked as per the other thread on gun c
196 na : One question to all who still defend the liberal gun laws in the US: Wouldnt you support a strict anti-gun law that forbids guns in private hands if y
197 scbriml : Just because something is difficult to fix, it doesn't mean you shouldn't try.
198 Post contains images Revelation : And more each day, if we do nothing to change that. Indeed. More guns means more reason to be afraid to do things and in turn not be free to do them.
199 na : Hopefully. Gun laws which are similar to the ones in Germany could suit the US. Hunters and sportsmen can "easily" get a gun but have to lock them aw
200 ltbewr : Since Friday night, I have had to turn off my TV when I might watch the NY City regional and national news programs due to their obsessive coverage of
201 Revelation : The event is sickening and depressing. Yes our media over amplifies that, but as you point out, you have the choice to turn it off. This is a case wh
202 na : Only much stricter laws as to gun ownership can help. There is NO other way out. The more guns, the more opportunitioes, the more murders, simple as
203 EricR : And more each day, if we do nothing to change that . Completely agree, but this won't help resolve the issue today or even in the next several years b
204 Revelation : Indeed, but we have to set a direction, make it clear what our intention is. As the end of the closed thread said, we've had many threads with many g
205 na : The more important that something is done soon. Not just blala, regret and cynical NRA euphemism until in 6, 12 or 18 months the next dozen kids are
206 SpeedBirdA380 : Do we really need such a debate on gun control? I don't usually comment on problems in America as Americans (like any country) don't usually like fore
207 flyingturtle : I still don't get it. Victims are made victims a second time by the NRA proposing teachers and students to be armed just in case a shooter might turn
208 Maverick623 : I was actually insinuating that it would be pretty much impossible. Think of it this way: there's just about as much chance for the US to adopt UK, G
209 iowaman : This thread has yet again veered off topic into a gun control debate even when there was a thread running on gun-control. I think we can also agree th
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