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Russian Ban On American Adoptions: Your Views  
User currently onlineeinsteinboricua From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2010, 2994 posts, RR: 8
Posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2336 times:

http://worldnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2...aw-banning-american-adoptions?lite

So, this whole process is an eye for an eye thing from Russia. After the US passed a law that would penalize Russians who abuse human rights, Russia is now retaliating with a ban on adoptions from Americans. Namely, this little piece is the drive behind it:

Quote:
...Putin said U.S. authorities routinely let Americans suspected of violence toward Russian adoptees go unpunished — a clear reference to Dima Yakovlev, a Russian toddler for whom the bill is named. The child was adopted by Americans and then died in 2008 after his father left him in a car in broiling heat for hours. The father was found not guilty of involuntary manslaughter.

So, what are your views regarding this?

I think it's rather sad that children are the ones who will be affected by this. Imagine a family just ready to adopt a child and getting a call saying that their process has been cancelled due to the law. Or imagine a child excited at the prospect of going to a family for the first time and learning that he'll have to remain in the orphanage.


"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
41 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently onlinecasinterest From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4475 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2334 times:

The law reaks of ignorance. With the way Russia behaves in current political situations worldwide, I expect nothing less.


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User currently offlinetugger From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 5421 posts, RR: 8
Reply 2, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 2328 times:

Quoting einsteinboricua (Thread starter):
So, what are your views regarding this?

It is just the entrenched Russian leadership doing its nonsensical nationalistic crap. I feel bad for the many Russian children that won't have a chance to find loving parents as quickly, but as far as impact to America it will be almost nonexistent and adoptive parents will just automatically have to look elsewhere.

Now, those families that are currently in the adoption process who will not be able to actually adopt the children they have fallen in love with, I feel very bad for them. And the other sad part is what this act says about relations between the two great nations.

Tugg



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User currently offlinerfields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7607 posts, RR: 32
Reply 3, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2295 times:

My first cousin's son and his wife have adopted two very young children from Russia. They were both approx 1 when identified as his prospective children, and approx 2 when they finally left Russia. They were 'sold' for about $45,000 each in '"official fees" and "compensation" for the orphanage and birth mothers for their birth and care. He and his wife also had to make four trips to Russia for each adoption - required to stay in certain hotels. They say the total cost of the adoptions was about $100,000 each.

The eldest is now 12 - and is unable to speak and is officially autistic. Her condition is caused by heavy metal poisoning of lead from apparently eating paint chips on her crib, and mercury. Though officially she was never exposed to mercury, she has it in her body. She came from a large orphanage with almost 500 children under age three near the Black Sea.

I saw and kind of talked with her at a family Thanksgiving. She is lively, clever, but a bit shy with a lot of people around. There were 58 of us at the farm that day. She really enjoys playing with the other kids.

The second child is now 8 - and appears completely normal. Does well in school, is very outgoing. Puts himself in the middle of all the action. My 8 year old grandson and he became quick friends.

He also came from a baby factory orphanage - but close to Moscow.

Here is one example of how the infants are treated.

When both came to their new parents - they could not urinate or defecate in diapers. They would hold it until their diapers were taken off. They would then immediately void their bowels. In the orphanage, the children were 'changed' on a schedule. If the child messed their clothing (not diapers as we know them) they stayed wet or dirty until the scheduled change time. Even infants quickly learned to hold their excrement functions.

The Russian politicians promoting this new law are just like our US politicians - distorting something unfortunate, but non-typical, into an issue - to push the public away for realizing the politicians really are not doing their real job.


User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7133 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2288 times:

I've often met Americans (mainly gay couples) at the hotel I stay in Moscow in Russia for adoptions, I never realised that adopting from Russia was so popular. Appears to be a stupid new law, the only ones who are screwed over buy it are the kids, looks like the same old story with the Romanian kids who are now very difficult to adopt, if not illegal.

User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7693 posts, RR: 21
Reply 5, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2271 times:
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Two sides to it, of course. Many loving families adopt kids from Russia and give them far better lives than they could have hoped for. Then, there have been cases where it is evident that that the checks to ensure the children are going to an appropriate environment have not been all that they could, and these minority of cases have somewhat inevitably spoilt it for both potential adoptees and adoptors. Ultimately, one of those situations that just could have probably been negotiatied about and sorted out far more sensibly than has been the case here. An outright ban does nobody any favours.


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User currently onlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21523 posts, RR: 55
Reply 6, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2263 times:

What it boils down to is that Russia is choosing to play politics with orphans. If they want to hit back at the US in some way for what they perceive as a slight, I don't really have a problem with it - that's how the game is played. But don't screw with orphans - that's just disgusting.

-Mir



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User currently offlineD L X From United States of America, joined May 1999, 11211 posts, RR: 52
Reply 7, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2258 times:

Don't get it. There are plenty of kids to adopt in the United States, sitting in the foster system purgatory.


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User currently onlinecasinterest From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4475 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2256 times:

Quoting D L X (Reply 7):
Don't get it. There are plenty of kids to adopt in the United States, sitting in the foster system purgatory.

Too many problems with open adoptions and privacy in the US. Much easier to get a kid from overseas where it is mostly cheaper and without as much risk of the birth parent attempting to reclaim the child. It is a sad state of affairs, but it is the truth of the matter.



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User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7693 posts, RR: 21
Reply 9, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2245 times:
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Quoting D L X (Reply 7):
Don't get it. There are plenty of kids to adopt in the United States, sitting in the foster system purgatory.

Indeed the cynical side of me starts to question whether some of those who try to adopt abroad do so simply because they are not qualified to do so domestically. Is there any basis for such a thought? I ask because I genuinely don't know, yet the thought certainly crosses my mind.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19410 posts, RR: 58
Reply 10, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2241 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 6):

What it boils down to is that Russia is choosing to play politics with orphans. If they want to hit back at the US in some way for what they perceive as a slight, I don't really have a problem with it - that's how the game is played. But don't screw with orphans - that's just disgusting.

Very well-put. You'd think the Russians could have found a better excuse. And also, what does this accomplish? Do they think that American foreign policymakers honestly care about Russian adoption policy?

It certainly sucks for anyone currently invested in the adoption process, but that is a relatively small number. What will happen in the future is that prospective adopters will turn to other options, such as South America, Asia, and India. This policy will do nothing to help foreign relations or foreign policy and it will hurt orphans. It amounts to a tantrum.

Disgusting. And unsurprising.


User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7693 posts, RR: 21
Reply 11, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2226 times:
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Quoting DocLightning (Reply 10):
Very well-put

I think that 'for what they perceive as a slight' is slightly under-playing it. There were indeed a few fairly awful cases, and overreacting to those certainly plays a huge part here. Now, that is not to say that this thing is all ok - it isn't, as I mentioned above, but there's no point pretending it is solely about USA vs Russia - there were/are some issues in some cases.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19410 posts, RR: 58
Reply 12, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2224 times:

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 11):
I think that 'for what they perceive as a slight' is slightly under-playing it. There were indeed a few fairly awful cases, and overreacting to those certainly plays a huge part here. Now, that is not to say that this thing is all ok - it isn't, as I mentioned above, but there's no point pretending it is solely about USA vs Russia - there were/are some issues in some cases.

There are issues but they do not justify basically cutting off orphans and leaving them in Russian orphanages to grow into stunted, crippled automata from lack of any sort of mental stimulation in infancy.

I deal with a few adopted Russian kids in my practice and while some are healthy, some are really damaged by their time in the orphanages.


User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29791 posts, RR: 58
Reply 13, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2214 times:

Itsastupid tit-for-tat over thecrussian murder of an overseas dissident.

I wonder how many Russians know what their orphanages are really like



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7693 posts, RR: 21
Reply 14, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2209 times:
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Quoting DocLightning (Reply 12):
but they do not justify basically cutting off orphans and leaving them in Russian orphanages

Absolutely they don't, and I think I was clear on the fact that I don't come down on any particular side here other than to state what a shame it is that some desperate kids might not be saved a serious hardship.

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 12):
some are really damaged by their time in the orphanages.

I wouldn't doubt that for a milisecond - and I commend your work in the strongest possible terms. I simply think we should view all aspects of this issue.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently onlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21523 posts, RR: 55
Reply 15, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 2190 times:

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 11):
I think that 'for what they perceive as a slight' is slightly under-playing it. There were indeed a few fairly awful cases, and overreacting to those certainly plays a huge part here.

It's not an overreaction to those few cases - they don't play into it at all. This is about a US law that deals with Russians deemed to be human rights violators. Russia doesn't like it, and wants to hit back. And since, coincidentally, the record of Americans adopting Russian children hasn't been perfect (has the record of any country?), they've chosen to use that as the way through which they will do it.

If Russia really was that interested in the well-being of their orphans, they would address the state of their orphanage system before preventing orphans from being adopted by people from another country. Instead, they're only hurting their own children by doing this, and they should be ashamed of themselves.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7693 posts, RR: 21
Reply 16, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 2184 times:
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Quoting Mir (Reply 15):
It's not an overreaction to those few cases - they don't play into it at all. This is about a US law that deals with Russians deemed to be human rights violators. Russia doesn't like it, and wants to hit back. And since, coincidentally, the record of Americans adopting Russian children hasn't been perfect (has the record of any country?), they've chosen to use that as the way through which they will do it.

It's both. Not sure if you're aware, but some of the earlier cases of neglect got segnificant press interest in Russia.

Quoting Mir (Reply 15):
This is about a US law that deals with Russians deemed to be human rights violators. Russia doesn't like it, and wants to hit back.

No argument that this is a large part of it.

Quoting Mir (Reply 15):
If Russia really was that interested in the well-being of their orphans, they would address the state of their orphanage system before preventing orphans from being adopted by people from another country. Instead, they're only hurting their own children by doing this, and they should be ashamed of themselves.

Ultimately, yes - all of what you say is true.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently onlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21523 posts, RR: 55
Reply 17, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 2180 times:

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 16):
Not sure if you're aware, but some of the earlier cases of neglect got segnificant press interest in Russia.

Dima Yakovlev, the boy for which the law is named, died in July 2008. The trial was over by January 2009. Yet only now is this law going through, coincidentally right after a US law that Russia doesn't like was passed. That strikes me as awfully convenient.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlinerfields5421 From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 7607 posts, RR: 32
Reply 18, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 2162 times:

Quoting D L X (Reply 7):
There are plenty of kids to adopt in the United States, sitting in the foster system purgatory.

Yes, but the preferred adoption is an infant or near infant. Older kids have always been hard to place. Folks want a BABY not a 8 year old.

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 9):
Is there any basis for such a thought?

Mostly No.

The adoption has to meet standards by immigration before the child can be brought to the US. While a few couples, such as gay couples, might not be qualified in certain places in the US, the immigration authorities do look for unqualified parents - criminal pasts, sex offenders, etc - and will deny permission to bring the child into the US.

Of course a few cases slip past the authorities. The same thing happens with adoptions in the US.

------------------------------------

Another factor for foreign adoptions is parents who change their minds. How many cases have we seen in the media each year where a birth parent of a happily adopted child changes their mind and gets the child back after a few years with the adoptive parents.

That really doesn't happen much - but is a HUGE fear factor for people wanting to adopt.

Adopting a child from a foreign country greatly decreases the extremely remote chance of a birth parent trying to reclaim the child in a few years.


User currently offlineD L X From United States of America, joined May 1999, 11211 posts, RR: 52
Reply 19, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 2149 times:

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 18):
Yes, but the preferred adoption is an infant or near infant. Older kids have always been hard to place. Folks want a BABY not a 8 year old.

There are plenty of babies.

They get to foster care because they aren't adopted as babies.



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User currently offlineDerico From Argentina, joined Dec 1999, 4299 posts, RR: 12
Reply 20, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2095 times:

The USA has become just as insanely nationalist, the rest of the world sees it clearly.

For example, not passing a UN treaty to enforce proper facilities for the physically handicapped, curtailing rights of foreign passengers in transit, passing laws left and right than infringe on the sovereignty of other countries, what do Americans expect?

It's all stupid. But no one country has the monopoly on spupidity.



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User currently offlineTheCommodore From Australia, joined Dec 2007, 2742 posts, RR: 8
Reply 21, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2089 times:

Quoting casinterest (Reply 1):
Russia behaves in current political situations worldwide, I expect nothing less.

Yeah right. LOL

Like America is always well behaved ?

It is a sad situation, however somewhat understandable.



Quoting casinterest (Reply 8):
Much easier to get a kid from overseas where it is mostly cheaper and without as much risk of the birth parent attempting to reclaim the child.

Maybe, but the process is fought with corruption and false health records. Not a chance I would want to take.

Quoting Derico (Reply 20):
For example, not passing a UN treaty to enforce proper facilities for the physically handicapped, curtailing rights of foreign passengers in transit, passing laws left and right than infringe on the sovereignty of other countries, what do Americans expect?

And the US gets pissed at Russia ? Its a crazy world alright.



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User currently offlinemham001 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3572 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 2074 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 15):
If Russia really was that interested in the well-being of their orphans, they would address the state of their orphanage system before preventing orphans from being adopted by people from another country.

it runs deeper than that. They have a huge population of orphans for larger societal reasons. It won't be fixed easily, or any time soon.

Quoting D L X (Reply 19):
They get to foster care because they aren't adopted as babies.

Many, many children enter the foster care system at later stages. I did at 4 and again at 15.

Quoting Derico (Reply 20):
For example, not passing a UN treaty to enforce proper facilities for the physically handicapped, curtailing rights of foreign passengers in transit, passing laws left and right than infringe on the sovereignty of other countries, what do Americans expect?

I'm confused. We should not "infringe" on the sovereignty of others, but we should let others infringe on ours?


User currently offlineD L X From United States of America, joined May 1999, 11211 posts, RR: 52
Reply 23, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days ago) and read 2070 times:

Quoting mham001 (Reply 22):
Many, many children enter the foster care system at later stages. I did at 4 and again at 15.

No doubt, but most don't. Like my sister.



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User currently onlinecasinterest From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4475 posts, RR: 2
Reply 24, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days ago) and read 2059 times:

Quoting TheCommodore (Reply 21):
Yeah right. LOL

Like America is always well behaved ?

My point was about their political manuevering around certain embargo's and other items in direct oppostion to the USA. But you are alluding to other items apparrently.

Quoting TheCommodore (Reply 21):
Maybe, but the process is fought with corruption and false health records. Not a chance I would want to take.

I know plenty of folks that have gone through it, and would do it again. Foreign adoptions are just much more straight forward than US adoptions. It's sad... but true.

Quoting Derico (Reply 20):
For example, not passing a UN treaty to enforce proper facilities for the physically handicapped,

The US already has laws on the books for physically handicapped people. We don't need the UN watered down version.
The passage of it would not change existing laws. It was sad to see John Mccain and Bob Dole so woefully embarrased by the GOP senate . However it doesn't change the fact that the US has had the law the UN version was based on in the books for 2 decades.



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User currently offlinemham001 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3572 posts, RR: 3
Reply 25, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days ago) and read 2092 times:

Quoting D L X (Reply 23):
No doubt, but most don't. Like my sister.

The median age of a child entering foster care in the US is 6.7.


User currently offlineD L X From United States of America, joined May 1999, 11211 posts, RR: 52
Reply 26, posted (1 year 7 months 3 days ago) and read 2081 times:

Quoting mham001 (Reply 25):
The median age of a child entering foster care in the US is 6.7.

That doesn't mean that most people who are not raised by their birth families end up in foster care.

The charge was that there are babies in the United States in need of adoption.



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User currently offlinemham001 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3572 posts, RR: 3
Reply 27, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 2025 times:

Quoting D L X (Reply 26):
That doesn't mean that most people who are not raised by their birth families end up in foster care.


I have no idea where you got anything about that from my posts.

Quoting D L X (Reply 26):
The charge was that there are babies in the United States in need of adoption.

My only point was about your comment that "most" foster kids are or were at one time of infant age while in foster care, and thus, attractive to adopting parents. Most are not.

Most foster kids are not even destined for adoption, 51% are returned home.


User currently offlineDocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 19410 posts, RR: 58
Reply 28, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 2014 times:

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 14):
I wouldn't doubt that for a milisecond - and I commend your work in the strongest possible terms. I simply think we should view all aspects of this issue.

What issue? Russia took this action over an unrelated political slight. The unrelated political slight is not the issue. The handful of absurd cases in which child abusers have been allowed to go free are outrageous and always will be, but they are not unique to the USA. They are nothing more than an excuse.

The other issues having to do with the USA's own human rights record (and I do not deny that it is deeply flawed) are not in any way related to the adoption of orphans.


User currently offlinemdsh00 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4124 posts, RR: 8
Reply 29, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 1965 times:

Quoting TheCommodore (Reply 21):
And the US gets pissed at Russia ? Its a crazy world alright.

I think you miss the point that the US as a whole could care less about this. It's only a small percent of American families, but a whole lot of Russian children (and the orphanages) that will lose out. It's another example of Putin doing something inane to get attention.



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User currently offlineblrsea From India, joined May 2005, 1415 posts, RR: 3
Reply 30, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 1950 times:

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 28):
The other issues having to do with the USA's own human rights record (and I do not deny that it is deeply flawed) are not in any way related to the adoption of orphans.

Unfortunately, in internationation relations, there is always a reaction for every action. It may not always be as high profile like this, but something that will really hurt the other party. There wass bound to be some reprucussions for actions like what the US did. I mean you leave leaders from countries like Saudi, Pakistan, China etc where there are real human rights violations going on, but they don't want to target these countries as they have a vested interest in it.

All countries do that, whether it is US, China, EU, Russia etc.


User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7693 posts, RR: 21
Reply 31, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 1909 times:
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Quoting DocLightning (Reply 28):
What issue?

That would be the one under discussion - the introduction of this law and the reasons for it.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineAcheron From Spain, joined Sep 2005, 1596 posts, RR: 2
Reply 32, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1869 times:

As silly as this law is, seeing the US still trying to lecture everybody else on human rights is an amusing and slightly pathetic sight.

Russia should just have sold the S300/S400 system to Iran, move more TBM's into the Kaliningrad Oblast and start stockpiling up on nuclear warheads again. That should be a more effective way to tell the US to shove it.


User currently offlineD L X From United States of America, joined May 1999, 11211 posts, RR: 52
Reply 33, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1847 times:

Quoting mham001 (Reply 27):
My only point was about your comment that "most" foster kids are or were at one time of infant age while in foster care, and thus, attractive to adopting parents. Most are not.

No, I think you misunderstood me. I was not talking about infant children in the foster system. I was talking about children that have not entered the foster system being put up for adoption.

I hope that clarifies.



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User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6530 posts, RR: 9
Reply 34, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1822 times:

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 4):
I've often met Americans (mainly gay couples) at the hotel I stay in Moscow in Russia for adoptions, I never realised that adopting from Russia was so popular.

If gay couples could adopt then that would be an explanation, not many countries allow "their" children to be adopted by gays.

It's being discussed right now in France since a gay marriage law is being put to a vote, and in France there are very few children to adopt apparently, so in practice adoption by gay couples will be difficult since many countries will be off limits for them.



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User currently onlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3006 posts, RR: 27
Reply 35, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1822 times:

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 28):
What issue? Russia took this action over an unrelated political slight.

I don't like arguing about politics whatsoever, and think it's always a mute point since everyone has their steadfast views that they are very reluctant to change regardless of what opinions are presented by other forum members, BUT...

... As a Russian, I oppose the way the law was written and carried out. A lot of kids will suffer because of this. That said, there are many valid pros and cons that were presented while the law was being brainstormed (I followed this very closely over the last few months). In an ideal world, instead of banning all adoptions, I would say there should guidelines that need to be implemented for parent screening. Made more tough and rigorous than they already are.

Another thing to note though - the US is not a saint here either. While this provocation / jab at Russia expedited the drafting, writing and signing of the law, the "Dima Yakovlev Bill" has been in the works LONG before this. This is not direct response.


User currently offlinemham001 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3572 posts, RR: 3
Reply 36, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1800 times:

Quoting Acheron (Reply 32):
Russia should just have sold the S300/S400 system to Iran, move more TBM's into the Kaliningrad Oblast and start stockpiling up on nuclear warheads again. That should be a more effective way to tell the US to shove it.

You forget, for every action is a reaction. Have you forgotten the howls from Moscow when Poland desired a missile defense system on it's soil?

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 35):
Another thing to note though - the US is not a saint here either. While this provocation / jab at Russia expedited the drafting, writing and signing of the law, the "Dima Yakovlev Bill" has been in the works LONG before this. This is not direct response.

We have seen a lot of these laws domestically as well. If it has a name of a person attached, it is generally a knee-jerk reaction by some grandstanding politician. And that's the key to this, a relatively rare event.


User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6530 posts, RR: 9
Reply 37, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 1796 times:

So, Russia is free of domestic violence going unpunished ? I mean, with the well known alcoholism problem, it must be more than common.


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently onlineAeroflot777 From Russia, joined Mar 2004, 3006 posts, RR: 27
Reply 38, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 1788 times:

Quoting mham001 (Reply 36):
If it has a name of a person attached, it is generally a knee-jerk reaction by some grandstanding politician.

In this case, I'm simply saying that outrage regarding what happened to Dima Yakovlev spread quickly around the country when the incident itself occurred. So some sort of action or law was being pondered for quite some time now. But now that the US gave Russia a reason to retaliate, the timing is perfect for the government to take action.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that some form of the Dima Yakovlev Act would have been signed regardless of the Magnitsky Bill in the US. As far as timing though, equivalent retaliation was in play and provided a perfect opportunity here.


User currently offlineD L X From United States of America, joined May 1999, 11211 posts, RR: 52
Reply 39, posted (1 year 7 months 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1758 times:

Quoting casinterest (Reply 8):
Too many problems with open adoptions and privacy in the US. Much easier to get a kid from overseas where it is mostly cheaper and without as much risk of the birth parent attempting to reclaim the child. It is a sad state of affairs, but it is the truth of the matter.

Evidence suggests otherwise.


http://www.adoptivefamilies.com/articles.php?aid=522



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Reply 40, posted (1 year 7 months 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 1695 times:

Russia is in a long term inferiority complex in its feelings towards the West generally and the USA in particular - stemming from the loss of the Cold War - which is used by the government to divert popular attention from the country's REAL problems. Russia is a gangster state with a few ultra rich oligarchs who bribe the government to manufacture emotional "issues" involving foreigners so that no one notices they are as poor as ever while a handful walk off to Switzerland and the UK with national assets.

This is mainly another example of the Russian govt making a big deal of something dastardly the West does, meanwhile Putin and his cronies deposit another billion to a Swiss bank account or buy an English football club.

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 3):
They were 'sold' for about $45,000 each
Quoting D L X (Reply 7):

Don't get it. There are plenty of kids to adopt in the United States, sitting in the foster system purgatory.

It is a disgrace that the selfish desire for a white infant leaves a half million or more fun and eager kids in the limbo of parentless unadoption. So what this story really means is that people who can afford to spend $ 50k-100k on a baby no longer get to satiate their baby-obsession even as thousands of American children go unadopted.




Pu

[Edited 2012-12-28 19:01:04]

User currently offlinefalstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 6075 posts, RR: 29
Reply 41, posted (1 year 7 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1588 times:
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Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 3):
were 'sold' for about $45,000 each in '"official fees" and "compensation" for the orphanage and birth mothers for their birth and care

My parent's old neighbors bought some kids from Kazakhstan. I say bought because they paid $50,000 USD in cash (the place would only accept dollars or Euros and only in cash) for the child. They also were given a list of items they needed to bring from the US for "gifts" to various people within the agency. One of the kids was "normal", but they were given a kid with some sort of learning disability for free.

Quoting D L X (Reply 7):
Don't get it. There are plenty of kids to adopt in the United States, sitting in the foster system purgatory.

The people who adopted the kids in the above comment were denied kids in the USA because they were too old. The man was 51 and his wife was 40. I have a good friend who was adopted and he and his wife wanted to adopt a child. They were not particular about race, but found that they only "qualified" for a white baby even though they didn't care what color they got. They were told that they like to put children in situations where the parents where a different race. On the other hand My mom has a friend who adopted 4 biracial children 24-40 years ago and that nobody wanted biracial children.

Quoting D L X (Reply 19):
They get to foster care because they aren't adopted as babies.

A buddy of mine has adopted his foster child. He and his wife have another right now. The children they have fostered have been infants who were taken from the mother at birth, or very shortly after. However there are plenty of kids who taken away much later.



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