Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
A New War On Terror Has Begun, Without The US  
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6592 posts, RR: 9
Posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 4835 times:

I'm surprised no one here is discussing this, maybe the information hasn't reached you yet ?

The war to reclaim northern Mali has started, except instead of the African troops that were supposed to fight it, French troops are doing it, since the various occupying factions were marching on the south without encountering much resistance.

Here is a random link that seems to show a good picture of the situation, but use your usual news source if you prefer : http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2013/01/mali/

I'm going to bed now, feel free to discuss !


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
90 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7694 posts, RR: 21
Reply 1, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 4830 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Aesma (Thread starter):
The war to reclaim northern Mali has started, except instead of the African troops that were supposed to fight it, French troops are doing it, since the various occupying factions were marching on the south without encountering much resistance.

Apparently the UK is sending a couple of C17s to assist. No troops though.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...anes-to-assist-Mali-operation.html



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineseb146 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 11576 posts, RR: 15
Reply 2, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 4819 times:

How much oil is in Mali? That would dictate how involved the United States will get involved. The huge humanitarian fiasco there was in Darfur but no one did anything about it outside George Cloony and Matt Damon. Because there is nothing in it for the United States corporations.


Life in the wall is a drag.
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7694 posts, RR: 21
Reply 3, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 4775 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting seb146 (Reply 2):
How much oil is in Mali? That would dictate how involved the United States will get involved

How much does Afghanistan have? Some, but not a massive amount - and most of their oil business has gone to China anyway. In any event, various news sources currently indicate that the US is indeed considering providing support to the French operation, and I'd be surprised if that doesn't come to fruition.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineeinsteinboricua From Puerto Rico, joined Apr 2010, 3053 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 4772 times:

I wouldn't really say it's a new War on Terror, but more like a new theater. It's still a war against Al Qaeda-linked militias but this new theater is in a former French colony. It's only natural that France be the main driver here.

Quoting Aesma (Thread starter):
The war to reclaim northern Mali has started, except instead of the African troops that were supposed to fight it, French troops are doing it, since the various occupying factions were marching on the south without encountering much resistance.

Wonder how this French intervention will turn the tide? Will the separatists/Islamists be defeated? Or will this be France's Vietnam where a stalemate will occur?



"You haven't seen a tree until you've seen its shadow from the sky."
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7874 posts, RR: 52
Reply 5, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 4745 times:

Quoting Aesma (Thread starter):
Without The US

... ... and ??



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlinePu From Sweden, joined Dec 2011, 697 posts, RR: 13
Reply 6, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 4733 times:

Quoting Aesma (Thread starter):
French troops are doing it,

French troops and French national policy taking the primary and initial stand does great service to both the practical and ideological power France holds in the world. I'm happy to see France aggressively asserting it claim to moral leadership in world affairs.


Pu


User currently offlinePHX787 From Japan, joined Mar 2012, 7396 posts, RR: 17
Reply 7, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 4678 times:

French led the way in Libya and this was under sarkozy. France seems to be the war bird this decade   


次は、渋谷、渋谷。出口は、右側です。電車とホームの間は広く開いておりますので、足元に注意下さい。
User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39834 posts, RR: 74
Reply 8, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 4643 times:

the beleaguered northwest African country whose northern section has been overrun by Islamist guerillas

Oh I'm sure they're just SO misunderstood.  
Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 4):
I wouldn't really say it's a new War on Terror, but more like a new theater. It's still a war against Al Qaeda-linked militias but this new theater is in a former French colony. It's only natural that France be the main driver here.


  
Very true but if the French screw this one up, the US will have to come in an clean up and take the blame.

Quoting Aesma (Thread starter):
A New War On Terror Has Begun, Without The US
Quoting seb146 (Reply 2):
How much oil is in Mali? That would dictate how involved the United States will get involved.


...but let's beat up on the US anyway.  
I remember you supported US aggression in Libya 2 years ago which has far more oil than Mali.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineflymia From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 7140 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 6 hours ago) and read 4631 times:

Good. Glad someone else is stepping up for a change.


"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
User currently onlineDoona From Sweden, joined Feb 2005, 3769 posts, RR: 13
Reply 10, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 4606 times:

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 4):
Or will this be France's Vietnam where a stalemate will occur?

Er, I think you need to look up on your history there. Vietnam was France's Vietnam before it became the U.S.' Vietnam.

Cheers
Mats



Sure, we're concerned for our lives. Just not as concerned as saving 9 bucks on a roundtrip to Ft. Myers.
User currently offlineGDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 13184 posts, RR: 77
Reply 11, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 4593 times:

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 4):
Wonder how this French intervention will turn the tide? Will the separatists/Islamists be defeated? Or will this be France's Vietnam where a stalemate will occur?

They've done this sort of thing before, in this part of the world too. Not just against Islamists either, in the 1980's Qaddafi was moving into Chad, supporting anti government forces with his troops. Chad has major uranium deposits. The French, with air-strikes and troops helped the Chadian rout the Libyans. In one action, rather like the early SAS missions in the Western Desert in WW2, they drove the Libyans from their base and captured a huge pile of military equipment. It was serious stuff, with Lybian Tupolev bombers being shot down by French air to surface missiles included.

Qaddafi was mightily pissed at being humiliated, so he responded in they only way he knew how. In 1989 a French UTA DC-10 was blown up over Africa by a bomb. You bet the French were in the forefront of the action against him in 2011, maybe that first strike against Gaddafi's' forces besieging Benghazi, before the UK and the US had formally, finally, committed themselves to take action, was not only to prevent a massacre, it was payback too.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 7):
French led the way in Libya and this was under sarkozy. France seems to be the war bird this decade

I refer you to my post above!

Quoting Superfly (Reply 8):
Very true but if the French screw this one up, the US will have to come in an clean up and take the blame

I also refer you to my post above and ask you consider this; France does not have the vast unlimited military resources the US does, therefore when taking action they have to strategize to fit these resources, they cannot go in like the US did in Iraq for instance. They have to work with the local forces - not disband them - they have to devise a clear exit strategy too. They had their 'Vietnam' (after losing Vietnam in 1954), in Algeria in the late 1950's with even worse domestic consequences than the US suffered. This has informed their military planning ever since.

Quoting flymia (Reply 9):

Good. Glad someone else is stepping up for a change.

As well as the above, I would remind you that France has had significant forces in Afghanistan for periods of time, they've provided with their bases in the Horn Of Africa logistic support for the US since 2001,
They provided significant forces in the 1991 Gulf War, the one that under international law was legitimate.
Also were having to deal with Islamist extremism well before the US (or UK for that matter), did. Including storming an AF A310 hijacked by militants in Dec 1994. After a source they had within that group revealed the true intention of the hi-jack, once refuelled the plane would be flown to Paris and crashed on the city. The bad guys learned from their mistakes then. Did the vast US security and defence bureaucracy even register this event? It seems not.

It might be the often hostile, almost knee-jerk attitude to France from many in the US is a result of being ill informed, reliant on lazy stereotypes.
We British are the historic experts at 'not getting on' with the French! But we've been allies since 1904, the US has since 1776 however!


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39834 posts, RR: 74
Reply 12, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 4581 times:

Quoting GDB (Reply 11):
They had their 'Vietnam' (after losing Vietnam in 1954), in Algeria in the late 1950's

They also lost their own country in 1940.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineGDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 13184 posts, RR: 77
Reply 13, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4543 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 12):
They also lost their own country in 1940.

Yes. The reasons why was rooted in what happened on their soil between 1914-18. The horror of the trenches, the scale of the slaughter, not for nothing was the battle of Verdun called 'the meat grinder'.

After that experience they suffered crippling political instability in the following two decades, the military commanders were old, tired, haunted men in 1940, who had staked much of their defence on a huge system of forts, gun emplacements, underground barracks, all to repel any German invasion and to avoid any repetition in the trenches of WW1.
It was a mightily impressive undertaking, this 'Maginot Line'. But it did not extend through Belgium and was outflanked by the Germans surging through a vast wooded area of Belgium, thought to be impassable to tanks.
Still, over 80,000 French soldiers died in 1940, tens of thousands of civilians too.

When you hear of ideas for a perfect defensive systems, of various kinds, an example being the whole 'Star Wars' of the 1980's, or missile defence in various forms, on a strategic level at least, since, it's maybe worth viewing these as potential latter day 'Maginot Lines'.


User currently offlinefrancoflier From France, joined Oct 2001, 3741 posts, RR: 11
Reply 14, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 4507 times:

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 4):
Will the separatists/Islamists be defeated?

They never are, unfortunately. Ideology-based terrorism is like a bad cancer.
It spreads and feed on the violence it generates. The dead become martyrs and push more and more people to join a cause they don't understand. It is no surprise that it happens in places that are poor and with limited education. The best we can hope for is that they will retreat and be weakened enough to not immediately regroup and become violent again.

Temporary remission...

Quoting Doona (Reply 10):
Vietnam was France's Vietnam before it became the U.S.' Vietnam.

We called it Indochina... It was a disaster. Amazingly enough, it seems that 50 years later, our western nations still aren't faring any better in Guerilla-type wars.

And yes, the comments about the US are out of line and completely gratuitous. Whereas France has taken the lead aggressive role on this one due to cultural and political ties with Mali, I am pretty certain the US is or will shortly be involved in this in one way or another.
Our foreign policies seem to have been mostly on the same phase in the last few years.



Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit posting...
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7694 posts, RR: 21
Reply 15, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4488 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting flymia (Reply 9):
Good. Glad someone else is stepping up for a change.

Thanks for insulting our sacrifice,

Signed

Every British soldier, dead and alive.



......for that matter, you might want to look at the spread of nationalities serving in Afghanistan. Please stop propogating the myth that only the US actually contributes any forces to global security.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Reply 16, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4471 times:

Quoting Aesma (Thread starter):
The war to reclaim northern Mali has started

Why are the jihadists in Mali the "bad guys" but the jihadists in Syria are the "good guys"?

 

The "rebels" of Mali are members of the same international organizations as the "rebels" of the Free Syria Army (FSA).

 Wow!



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7694 posts, RR: 21
Reply 17, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 4469 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 16):
Why are the jihadists in Mali the "bad guys" but the jihadists in Syria are the "good guys"?

That's pretty much it at the moment, yes. We'll realise how stupid we were, with all this talk about giving the fighters in Syria arms etc, when in a couple of years we end up with a hardline menace in charge of that country.



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently onlineflyingturtle From Switzerland, joined Oct 2011, 2369 posts, RR: 13
Reply 18, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 4445 times:

Quoting RussianJet (Thread starter):
I'm surprised no one here is discussing this, maybe the information hasn't reached you yet ?

Yes, I missed these news nearly. Despite being an avid reader on the BBC news site, on Zeit.de and other newspaper websites. Time to read up and make up my mind.

I have to have a talk with colleagues who have worked with nomadic tribes in northern Mali to improve their health. I wonder what they think.

Quoting GDB (Reply 13):
It was a mightily impressive undertaking, this 'Maginot Line'. But it did not extend through Belgium and was outflanked by the Germans surging through a vast wooded area of Belgium, thought to be impassable to tanks.
Still, over 80,000 French soldiers died in 1940, tens of thousands of civilians too.

  

The number of French lives lost in WWII is higher than the number of dead Americans. Still, many countries had to bring a tremendous sacrifice to save us from the Nazis and Japanese Empire. (Switerland has about 400 soldiers dead, most of them drowned in exercises. In the end of 1944, we could have relieved the First French Army in the Alsace campaign, or opened a new front along the Swiss-German border to shorten the war.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_...281940%29#French_counter-offensive is a worthy read, IMHO.


David



Keeping calm is terrorism against those who want to live in fear.
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6592 posts, RR: 9
Reply 19, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4416 times:

Quoting einsteinboricua (Reply 4):
I wouldn't really say it's a new War on Terror, but more like a new theater. It's still a war against Al Qaeda-linked militias but this new theater is in a former French colony. It's only natural that France be the main driver here.

It's "natural" yes, however for months politicians and military specialists alike were saying there would be no boots on the ground, only formation and assistance, because our relations with former colonies is a complicated one. It seems the march on the south and a new civilian taken hostage in the region sealed the deal. Having a Malian colleague, when this started he didn't expect or want a French intervention, but now he's glad that it's happening.

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 5):
Quoting Aesma (Thread starter):
Without The US

... ... and ??

Well that's an interesting twist I would think.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 7):
French led the way in Libya and this was under sarkozy. France seems to be the war bird this decade

I'm fine with that if those wars stay in the same ballpark as the Libyan one. I'm sure it will help our military modernize, I just realized yesterday that despite several development programs our current drone fleet is ridiculously small and only suited for surveillance, that has to change.

Quoting francoflier (Reply 14):
Whereas France has taken the lead aggressive role on this one due to cultural and political ties with Mali, I am pretty certain the US is or will shortly be involved in this in one way or another.

Well no direct way at least since apparently the US legally can't. I would be glad if they could lend us some Reapers.

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 16):
Why are the jihadists in Mali the "bad guys" but the jihadists in Syria are the "good guys"?

It's more complicated than that, for both countries. There has been a dispute over northern Mali for a long time, and the nomads that claim that territory are not jihadists. However when they made their move the territory became an instant magnet for jihadists that took over. In Syria, the events started with peaceful protests from unarmed civilians, again not jihadists. Now the war is fought on several fronts and we're not saying the jihadists are good nor helping them.



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Reply 20, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 4381 times:

Quoting Aesma (Reply 19):
I'm fine with that if those wars stay in the same ballpark as the Libyan one. I'm sure it will help our military modernize, I just realized yesterday that despite several development programs our current drone fleet is ridiculously small and only suited for surveillance, that has to change.

I am not OK with any of these interventions. There are hidden motivations behind them.

Quote:
"two foreign companies signed oil and gas exploration deals with the Malian government “that oblige them to invest millions of US dollars in the search of petroleum in the country's vast desert. Both Algeria's national oil company SONATRACH and the Canadian owned Selier Energy say that the vast Taoudeni basin, at Mali's borders with Mauritania and Algeria, shows great potential for major oil and gas discoveries.” (9) In a world hungry for energy resources, who will get control of these reserves? U.S. strategists are fearful of China’s growing influence, adding competition to greed as motives to control the area."

"When they were finally forced out of Africa in 1960, the French left behind desperately poor countries. Today Mali remains the 23rd poorest country on earth, with the 49th lowest life expectancy – barely 53 years. "

"that the U.S. military is already in the country and the presence of known oil reserves under the desert sands of northern Mali."

http://warisacrime.org/content/us-hands-mali

France and USA only true reason for being in Mali...

                 



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6592 posts, RR: 9
Reply 21, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 4331 times:

So you're fine with "jihadists" taking over Africa then ? Make up your mind.


New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineKiwiRob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7251 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 4324 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 8):

Very true but if the French screw this one up, the US will have to come in an clean up and take the blame.

Why would the US get involved, do tell?

Quoting Superfly (Reply 8):
I remember you supported US aggression in Libya 2 years ago which has far more oil than Mali.

It's the other way around it was French and UK aggression supported by the US, the French dropped the most bombs and flew over 35% of the combat missions, there were also British SAS, SBS & SRR troops on the ground co-ordinating the bombing. But of course you will believe what you want and continue your anti Obama crusade.


User currently offlineMadameConcorde From San Marino, joined Feb 2007, 10893 posts, RR: 37
Reply 23, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 4306 times:

Quoting Aesma (Reply 21):
So you're fine with "jihadists" taking over Africa then ? Make up your mind.

It seems you did not read my previous post.

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 16):

Why are the jihadists in Mali the "bad guys" but the jihadists in Syria are the "good guys"?

The "rebels" of Mali are members of the same international organizations as the "rebels" of the Free Syria Army (FSA).

I smell a rat.

  



There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13985 posts, RR: 62
Reply 24, posted (1 year 7 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 4287 times:

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 20):
Quote:
"two foreign companies signed oil and gas exploration deals with the Malian government “that oblige them to invest millions of US dollars in the search of petroleum in the country's vast desert. Both Algeria's national oil company SONATRACH and the Canadian owned Selier Energy say that the vast Taoudeni basin, at Mali's borders with Mauritania and Algeria, shows great potential for major oil and gas discoveries.” (9) In a world hungry for energy resources, who will get control of these reserves? U.S. strategists are fearful of China’s growing influence, adding competition to greed as motives to control the area."

Do you have an idea how expensive it will be to get this oil to the markets? Not just will they have to build up the whole infrastructure, including pipelines through half of the Sahara, they also will have to pay transit fees from the other countries the pipeline to the coast runs through, since Mali is landlocked.
The oil or gas field must be very big to pay for all the expenses and STILL leave a profit.

Jan


25 cmf : This country lives on stereotypes. Of course this is not limited to US but it is stronger here than just about any other place I have been.
26 PHX787 : Here's the issue with Africa: No one has any clue what's going on. With the exceptions of South Africa and some others, most governments are either di
27 flymia : That aircraft was a french aircraft and it was in France. Who else was suppose to do it. I am not dumb. I know other countries have helped the U.S. I
28 Ken777 : You would find it exceptionally difficult to get the US public to support another intervention. We don't need another 10 year war and the voters woul
29 RussianJet : Then don't make such silly statements. Last time I checked, we took joint action. We may be smaller than the US but the UK has been there ALL the way
30 flyingturtle : I really agree with you here. Africa is still a mystery for many. For too long a time westerners have tried to teach Africa, without ever listening t
31 GDB : There will be Jihadists there, there have been elements of them in the other uprisings too. Most are not, most of the rebels have limited military ex
32 Post contains links and images MadameConcorde : There is much more about this "war on terror" than we are being told. Western countries would not be going to Mali if the place had no natural resourc
33 mercure1 : Its unfortunate France must drag up its ugly past colonial face and go play the gendarmerie in Africa. France could pay a high price for its adventure
34 GDB : France is leading the effort, however there are major Malian forces involved, as well as an increasing number from other African nations. The Malians
35 NoUFO : So far, comments from African countries on the French invervention have been very positive and this even includes those from Algeria. Perhaps this in
36 Post contains links and images MadameConcorde : French military surprised by 'well-trained, well-equipped and well-armed' Mali Islamists - @BBCNews "In addition to creating defenses, the fighters ar
37 MD11Engineer : Remember about ten years ago, when AQIM were cutting the throats of the inhabitants of whole villages, which they accused of supporting the governmen
38 Stabilator : Just fine by me! I hope Barry and Co. don't stick their noses into this nonsense like they did Libya. Other countries are well equipped to combat the
39 MadameConcorde : Marseille is full of Salafists and Wahabis. Don't need to go to Mali. I find France is two-sided. Why go to Mali to fight Salafists and Wahabis when y
40 MD11Engineer : they can´t make it right for you? If you don´t see that a power vacuum in a failed stare (which Northern Mali is since the Tuareg rebellion drove t
41 NoUFO : Say what? And stupid me was thinking Marseille was full of Marseillais. And on what grounds? Are they going to take over control in France?
42 Post contains links MadameConcorde : I hope not. Algeria authorises France to use airspace for Mali raids http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp...92a73fc2ff2f50a8891280af493a87.271 France
43 einsteinboricua : Why? This isn't a NATO sponsored operation and the UNSC hasn't authorized any action on behalf of the UN. Any mess France gets into is their responsi
44 Aesma : The UN didn't need to authorize anything, Mali called us for help. mercure1 : I don't like the "Françafrique" either but if it's that or Chinafrique
45 mham001 : Isn't that in itself a "stereotype"?
46 par13del : Neither does the US, correct me if I'm wrong but they are running trillion dollar debts, billions dollar deficits and massive spending cuts are on th
47 Post contains links NAV20 : Maybe worth mentioning, flymia, that Britain and the Commonwealth were the only people who fought the WW2 Nazis, and later the Japanese, from Day One
48 CPH-R : The RDAF will be dispatching one of its Hercs to Mali as well.
49 GDB : The Danes always step up. Some of the criticism of Hollande seems to me, unfair. This is a mission with risks, it's likely that French boots on the g
50 Aesma : Apparently fighting side by side with the French gave the Malian troops a new vigor and they were quite good. Their soviet gunships also helped.
51 SuperCaravelle : Is it realistic to expect that this conflict will resolve in the short (or medium) term? Mali is vast, the borders are nearly unprotected. What is the
52 Post contains images MD11Engineer : And our minister of foreign affairs weasels out, as usual. Jan
53 Mortyman : Many Americans seem to get a very onesided American view of reality from American media. On largescale operations over many years, the USA is rarely
54 L-188 : Reportedly the US is providing intellegence (can your say drones?) to the French forces along with other undisclosed support.
55 par13del : Simply answer, a very high chance. The big issue usually is how much regional control they are willing to settle for and how much looking the other w
56 Post contains links MD11Engineer : It seems though that due to the geographical conditions in the region (open desert, not high mountains with many gorges, valleys and other hiding plac
57 Ken777 : Unfortunately the terrorists are more than willing to fight wars for 100 years if necessary. The US isn't willing to do that, nor are a lot of other
58 mham001 : Ironically, this war is being fueled by arms whisked away from Libya after we killed him. Just another aftereffect from that blunder.
59 iakobos : When you wake up have a look at the map of Western Africa and especially Mali's neighbours. A success of the "Malian" insurgents would undoubtedly be
60 par13del : Hard to figure out who would put / move a sat into geo orbit with sufficient coverage over Mali, its not like satellites are a dime a dozen with unli
61 Post contains links Aesma : Well France has had interests in the region forever and we have good satellite capabilities (since the Gulf War when the US fed us false intel). Where
62 GDB : But these guys were fighting FOR Qaddafi, he had a disparate mercenary force in place well before early 2011. Indeed, he's used them before and outsi
63 Post contains links and images MadameConcorde : According to this article: Mali Islamists 60KM from capital! French 'assault' fails Mali: French invaders flee. Mujahideen liberate Koulikoro and are
64 Aesma : Well "French invaders" gives the tone, since most of these Islamists really are invaders. The French army isn't fleeing, it's advancing. It's entirely
65 mham001 : Matters not, with the fall of Qadadafi came the immediate disappearance of his weapons which have now been sold to the Islamists. Who by the way, are
66 Aesma : I could add to the title that it's also a war without the EU, what are your thoughts about that ? MEP Daniel Cohn-Bendit spoke my mind (good consideri
67 TheCol : That's actually a good thing. If the Islamists intend to fight conventionally, then they will be easier for Western forces to defeat. It looks like t
68 Revelation : It's a shame so few people know/understand this. Then again, GWB and the neo-cons had no understanding of Vietnam either. France can still borrow mon
69 AirPacific747 : I agree. flymia's comment was very disrespectful towards all the soldiers doing their job every day now in Afghanistan and before that, also in Iraq,
70 Revelation : Good thing we are all friends then, no? Now, back to Mali...
71 Aesma : But it's true that Burkina Faso, Mauritania, Niger, have quite fragile governments.
72 Post contains links stasisLAX : France is upping their force strength in Mali. Paratroopers, helicopters and two mechanized brigades based in France are being deployed to Mali to fi
73 MadameConcorde : Not so off topic as this is all part of the same scheme. BREAKING France confirms "ongoing operation" at gas facility (French Govt source) My one most
74 Revelation : That's why I said above we're best off seeking energy independence, so we don't need such access. This means alternative energies as well as US-based
75 GDB : They do. They are 'having a go at it'. If by that you mean carrying out the sort of operations militarily that it seems some in the US think they onl
76 Revelation : Seems then the French did learn from their stay in Vietnam. Too bad GWB was too busy in the Texas ANG blowing off assignments to get over there and s
77 Aesma : The exit strategy is a moving target because of the numerous problems Mali has : no government to speak about, no army to speak about, and hostility b
78 GDB : Hollande has said the task is to 'destroy' (his word) the terrorists, maybe some would be captured too he reckoned, stabilising the situation, allowi
79 Revelation : It's been a decade+ that we've been waiting for a local government to rule Afghanistan. The big problem is the one mentioned above: it's darned expen
80 Post contains images MadameConcorde : France has borrowed 180 Billion Euros in 2012. The acted forecast for 2013 is that the State will borrow 200 Billion Euros. These amounts mean that F
81 Post contains images Zkpilot : Not many people realise that Ho Chi Minh asked France for autonomy and independence after WWII and was anti Communist (at least in terms of Chinese a
82 Post contains links RussianJet : The UK is now deploying 330 troops to the area, going far beyond the original support offered in the form of a couple of transport aircraft. http://ww
83 MD11Engineer : During WW2 Ho Chi Minh was cooperating closely with the American OSS, the precedesor of the CIA, in the fight against the Japanese invaders. He first
84 Aesma : The last city of northern Mali still held by jihadists, Kidal, has been liberated by the French. Or rather the jihadists have fled under aerial strike
85 rlwynn : I saw on the news yesterday a Military official from Mali holding a notebook that they found in a bomb making site that the Jahidists has fled from. I
86 Wolbo : There's the problem. The French arrive and the jihadists disappear. But the moment the French leave they reappear and you're back to square one.
87 rlwynn : That is why I think forces should have landed in the north and worked thier way to meet forces in the south to cut off the escape route.[Edited 2013-
88 Powerslide : Ah yes, the source of funding for all terrorist organizations in the world. How much longer 'till their oil runs dry?
89 Post contains links NAV20 : That's the sort of military dilemma that often arises in situations of this sort, rlwynn. The French don't actually have many ground troops there - I
90 Aesma : According to some posts on the military forum paratroopers were dropped north of town for exactly that reason.
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
The War On Terror Cells? Improvement? posted Wed Oct 6 2010 10:42:58 by AGM100
The War On Terror - 1 Step Forward, 2 Steps Back? posted Wed Jan 27 2010 05:24:34 by Yodobashi
Should Nigeria Be The Focus Of The War On Terror? posted Tue Aug 4 2009 19:11:39 by StasisLAX
Saudi-Arabia The Heart Of The 'War On Terror'? posted Mon Jul 16 2007 05:33:02 by NAV20
End The War On Terror posted Mon May 7 2007 16:07:00 by Dsa
War On Terror - The Boardgame posted Mon Sep 18 2006 20:04:12 by 9V
Winning The War On Terror: Fantasy Vs Facts posted Tue Apr 26 2005 16:22:24 by Schoenorama
Thought Provoking Article On The 'War On Terror' posted Thu Dec 5 2002 19:11:54 by GDB
The War On Terror-One Year On posted Wed Sep 4 2002 17:44:29 by GDB
The Great ``War On Terror'' Charade posted Tue Jul 16 2002 13:10:50 by EmiratesLover