Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Hillary Has Returned  
User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8483 posts, RR: 9
Posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 2045 times:

With all the fluff in the past about Hillary falling in order to hide from Congress it was interesting watch the old gal stride up to Congress and spend a full day testifying. A few Republicans tried to be nasty - like Rush had written their comments - but mostly those who asked intelligent question received intelligent responses.

My Dork of the Week Award has to go to Rand Paul who, failing to understand that the 1.4 million or so messages are, by tradition, are addressed to the Secretary, would fire the Secretary for not having read a handful he was focused on.

Poor Rand - he wants to be important so bad. Reminds me of mcCain now that he isn't a Committee Chairman.

54 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineseb146 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 11806 posts, RR: 15
Reply 1, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 1976 times:

There has been such a huge stink over four Americans murdered in Lybia. That is tragic. But, nothing has been done about the twenty children who were murdered on American soil. Except "we need more guns to control the gun problem!"

I love how the right-wing Senators are focused on one note when Hillary tries to explain the whole choir to them. The strangest part is: they insist she never claimed any responsibility for anything yet, for the umpteenth time today, she claimed responsibility. Again. But, that will not ever be reported by the right-wing media.



Life in the wall is a drag.
User currently offline2707200X From United States of America, joined Mar 2009, 8813 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 1962 times:

The hearing looked like a political hack job. I don't think any new information was made just a bunch of clowns trying to build their mala fides on national security foreign policy and tired talking points from Fox. I think the winner in this soap opera was Hilary.


"And all I ask is a tall ship and a star to steer her by." John Masefield Sea-Fever
User currently offlineWarRI1 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 9292 posts, RR: 12
Reply 3, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 1938 times:

Quoting 2707200X (Reply 2):
The hearing looked like a political hack job. I don't think any new information was made just a bunch of clowns trying to build their mala fides on national security foreign policy and tired talking points from Fox. I think the winner in this soap opera was Hilary.

It was a hack job by many hacks. Their greatest fear and main concern is of course 2016 and her plans. someone alluded to that and it made her laugh. They are slinging the mud very early. All to no avail.



It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7980 posts, RR: 51
Reply 4, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 1893 times:

I think this Benghazi gate this is BS but I have no problems with them trying to see if there was a scandal... now, I think they have and are going way too far and I smell a skunk, so well see...

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 3):

Welcome back, friend!



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8965 posts, RR: 24
Reply 5, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 1879 times:

Quoting seb146 (Reply 1):
they insist she never claimed any responsibility for anything yet, for the umpteenth time today, she claimed responsibility.

He was making a very valid point. For years we hear from politicians "I accept responsibility", but does not accept any punishment. It is an insulting charade of buck-stops-here bravado politicians who are happy to “show leadership” by admitting to their failures on the condition that they’ll suffer no consequences for them. She knew of the security problems - the late ambassador pleaded personally to her, and she did nothing. Those deaths are on her head, as far as I can tell.

Also insulting was Clinton's angry response to the question of why the Administration pushed a false narrative for two weeks, “What difference does it make?”. Even CBS News' had to admit that the question was legitimate, and her answer was not, saying "It DOES make a difference".

Washington Post agrees:

Quote:
That exchange drives at one of the premier media issues of 2012: Did the press push the administration hard enough and early enough to sort out the explanation for the Benghazi attacks? Certainly the conservative media did, asking for more and more detail and criticizing mainstream outlets for not caring enough about discrepancies in the accounts of Obama administration principals.

No matter your view of the media’s role in Benghazi; no matter your take on whether U.S. Ambassador to the U.N. Susan Rice leveled with the country on the Sept. 16 talk shows; no matter your view of Fox News’s Benghazi campaign, it surely does make a difference whether it was “because of a protest or was it because of guys out for a walk one night who decided they’d go kill some Americans.” It makes a difference to the media, the public, the government, everyone.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...es-a-difference-secretary-clinton/



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinefr8mech From United States of America, joined Sep 2005, 5658 posts, RR: 15
Reply 6, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 1858 times:

I did see it nor hear it. So, I won't comment on the testimony, but I will comment on one post:

Quoting seb146 (Reply 1):
There has been such a huge stink over four Americans murdered in Lybia. That is tragic. But, nothing has been done about the twenty children who were murdered on American soil. Except "we need more guns to control the gun problem!"


Because, as an old saw goes:

"Domestic policy can only defeat us; foreign policy can kill us" ~John F. Kennedy

US foreign policy gone wrong can start wars. US foreign policy gone wrong can destabilize nations and regions. US foreign policy gone wrong, in short, kills.

We've made mistakes in foreign policy before and we'll make them again. But, we have to learn from those mistakes. And, let's be very clear on this, if an ambassador was killed, mistakes were made. Question is: has the mistake been made worse by this administration not calling it what it was right from the start?

I'll leave that to the experts.



When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
User currently offlineDeltaMD90 From United States of America, joined Apr 2008, 7980 posts, RR: 51
Reply 7, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 1845 times:

Quoting fr8mech (Reply 6):
"Domestic policy can only defeat us; foreign policy can kill us" ~John F. Kennedy

I do see where you are going and agree that foreign policy is pretty significant, but I think us Americans fail to see the scope of our domestic issues. Without going into one specific problem, we lose tens of thousands each year to violence, alcohol, suicides, etc... much more than even some of our worst wars...



Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
User currently offlineAesma From Reunion, joined Nov 2009, 6956 posts, RR: 12
Reply 8, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 1844 times:

Well did they know from the start ?

Aside from that I was reading about "Freedom of Navigation" operations in Libya under Reagan and others and it looks to me like the kind of thing you do when you want to make enemies and start wars.

Ironically enough the US hasn't yet ratified the treaty it campaigned for decades ago, and Hillary was/is in the process of getting it before Congress.



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineRussianJet From Belgium, joined Jul 2007, 7719 posts, RR: 21
Reply 9, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 1827 times:

Quoting Ken777 (Thread starter):
Dork of the Week Award

Superb. Is there a prize?



✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
User currently offlineAeroWesty From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 20822 posts, RR: 62
Reply 10, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 1810 times:

Quoting Ken777 (Thread starter):
My Dork of the Week Award has to go to Rand Paul

I was mildly amused that the title of Sen. Paul's latest book is ‘Government Bullies’.   



International Homo of Mystery
User currently offlineseb146 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 11806 posts, RR: 15
Reply 11, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 1790 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 5):
Also insulting was Clinton's angry response to the question of why the Administration pushed a false narrative for two weeks

So, it makes no difference that for two weeks, and even up to this very moment, they had bits and pieces of information coming in. So, the right wing went with the first thing that came out of the State Department and ran with it. That is the only thing the right wing will accept. The refuse to accept anything else other than the very first statement to come from the State Department.

That sums it up. They will cling to their false narrative because they think it makes Hillary and Obama and Democrats look bad. But, those of us who read and get our news from other sources.... oh, forget it. Anyone not blindly following the right-wing narrative is anti-American.



Life in the wall is a drag.
User currently offlineNewark727 From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 1368 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 1779 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 5):
Also insulting was Clinton's angry response to the question of why the Administration pushed a false narrative for two weeks, “What difference does it make?”

Frankly, I'd be angry too. Her employees got murdered and all the GOP can do is insinuate that she doesn't care, or that she used that fact to spread lies for some nefarious agenda. Rather than talk about the efforts she's implementing, suggested by the commission that the GOP was pushing so hard for?


User currently offlinedc863 From Denmark, joined Jun 1999, 1558 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 1719 times:

Ah Hillary you moron, there is a difference and you dropped the ball getting 4 Americans murdered. I don't believe a damn thing that comes out of this administration.

User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21875 posts, RR: 55
Reply 14, posted (1 year 11 months 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 1715 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 5):
Also insulting was Clinton's angry response to the question of why the Administration pushed a false narrative for two weeks, “What difference does it make?”.

That's not the question that was asked. The question that was asked was why she didn't make a phone call to find out whether there had been protests for not. Her answer was that she didn't want to interfere with the ongoing process. And she's right about that - the situation was fluid and changing, and any answer they got at the time was likely to be contradicted by other evidence still forthcoming.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 5):
Washington Post agrees:

Erik Wemple is not the Washington Post.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13202 posts, RR: 16
Reply 15, posted (1 year 11 months 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 1681 times:

One of the big mistakes was to have UN Ambassador Rice put out the story of the deaths were the result of a protest. It would have been far better to not have her go on the news shows at all, instead have sent someone else in the Administration who should have said that the President's staff, the CIA and the State Dept. was still investigating what happened, called it an act of terrorism on America that it was. I think the need for instant answers to the public for whey such acts occurred caused the CIA to push a cover story. A few days of delay could have given the time necessary to correctly determine and disclose who and what was behind these attacks.

As to Sec. Clinton's appearance, to me she looked a lot older, tired, still angry for some of these same people or of the same angry thinking men who hounded and impeached her President husband Bill. Too many of these politicians, especially the Republicans, used this hearing to bash the Administration and her for their policies, they failed to really determine what happened in Benghazi and how to prevent such terror acts occurred. Some also wanted to neuter her trying to run for President in 2016 (which I also hope, although a loyal Democrat, she doesn't do for a variety of reasons).

There was in this terror attack, terrible failures of communications to the State Dept., of the military who are to protect our diplomatic facilities, of improving our intellegance in hostile areas. These hearings with Sec. Clinton were worthless to achieve those goals.


User currently offlinewindy95 From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 2755 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (1 year 11 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 1665 times:

Quoting Newark727 (Reply 12):
Frankly, I'd be angry too. Her employees got murdered

Because of her inaction..

Quoting Newark727 (Reply 12):
can do is insinuate that she doesn't care

All she cares about is her image.

Quoting seb146 (Reply 11):
They will cling to their false narrative

Nothing false about it. They failed to act before and during the attack and then lied to cover it up afterwards.



OMG-Obama Must Go
User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8965 posts, RR: 24
Reply 17, posted (1 year 11 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 1660 times:

Quoting seb146 (Reply 11):
So, it makes no difference that for two weeks, and even up to this very moment, they had bits and pieces of information coming in.

They knew AQ-affiliated terrorists were in the area in force months before the attack. Testimony shows that within hours they were pretty certain it was a planned terrorist attack, and withing 24 hours they were completely certain

Quoting seb146 (Reply 11):
So, the right wing went with the first thing that came out of the State Department and ran with it.

They blamed Youtube for nearly 2 whole weeks.

Quoting seb146 (Reply 11):
They will cling to their false narrative because they think it makes Hillary and Obama and Democrats look bad.

They need no help.

Quoting Newark727 (Reply 12):
Frankly, I'd be angry too. Her employees got murdered and all the GOP can do is insinuate that she doesn't care, or that she used that fact to spread lies for some nefarious agenda.

That is incorrect. I think she cares, and I don't think she had a nefarious agenda. I just don't think she is particularly competant, and is handicapped by her worldview, as is Obama. They see the world as they want it to be, not as it is.

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 16):

One of the big mistakes was to have UN Ambassador Rice put out the story of the deaths were the result of a protest.

I'm sure Clinton was asked (bombarded) with interview requests, but decided to duck them all and send out Rice.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinecasinterest From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4795 posts, RR: 3
Reply 18, posted (1 year 11 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 1637 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 18):
They knew AQ-affiliated terrorists were in the area in force months before the attack. Testimony shows that within hours they were pretty certain it was a planned terrorist attack, and withing 24 hours they were completely certain

So again, who cares what was reported to the news media?

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 18):
They blamed Youtube for nearly 2 whole weeks

And why not, if they knew the truth, tipping off the terrorists wasn't in their best interests of finding who did.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 18):
They need no help.

They need help, but they don't recognize it within the Maelstrom of misinformation with the right wing media back slapping and misreporting.



Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8965 posts, RR: 24
Reply 19, posted (1 year 11 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 1631 times:

Quoting casinterest (Reply 19):
So again, who cares what was reported to the news media?
Quoting casinterest (Reply 19):
And why not, if they knew the truth, tipping off the terrorists wasn't in their best interests of finding who did.

Am I mistaken, or does it sound like you have no problem with the government lying to us (only if controlled by Democrats, of course)?

We are not talking about military disinformation here - saying we will invade X when actually we intend to go to Y. There were no sources to protect. Just a potentially very embarrassing situation where, after months of spiking the football and claiming that AQ was defeated and powerless, that they were actually back to where they were in the late 90s - successfully attacking high-profile American targets.



[Edited 2013-01-24 06:51:56]


Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinecasinterest From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4795 posts, RR: 3
Reply 20, posted (1 year 11 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 1615 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 20):
Am I mistaken, or does it sound like you have no problem with the government lying to us (only if controlled by Democrats, of course)?

Nope, I have a problem with a 3rd world entertainment channel masquerading as a right wing news platform, that manufactures outrage where there should be none.

I am also sick and tired of the tin foilded folks that watch this network that have lost all dignity in a quest for politicalization of incidents.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 20):
We are not talking about military disinformation here - saying we will invade X when actually we intend to go to Y. There were no sources to protect. Just a potentially very embarrassing situation where, after months of spiking the football and claiming that AQ was defeated and powerless, that they were actually back to where they were in the late 90s - successfully attacking high-profile American targets.

They are terrorists, and news organizations around the world and politically leanding messaging helps create folks that are ideaologically predisposed to perform ideological actions when they know no better.

By the way your picture is empty.



Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8965 posts, RR: 24
Reply 21, posted (1 year 11 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 1605 times:

Quoting casinterest (Reply 21):
Nope, I have a problem with a 3rd world entertainment channel masquerading as a right wing news platform, that manufactures outrage where there should be none.

So once again, you are saying that you have no problem with the government lying to its people for political purposes. The administration seems to agree with you. Freedom of Information Act requests have been denied and lawsuits filed at a record pace under Obama, in spite of his promise to be "the most transparent administration". FOIA lawsuits are filed to challenge denials of records requests or the use of exemptions of information by federal agencies. The number of FOIA lawsuits filed against the State Department rose by 111 percent in those time periods, from 18 to 38. FOIA lawsuits rose by 60 percent at both the (EPA) and the Department of Veterans Affairs. Additionally, the Department of Justice saw an increase of 50 percent.

http://foiaproject.org/2012/12/20/in...suits-during-obama-administration/

Admit it, If GW Bush had done the same thing, you would be calling for a public lynching on the steps of the Capitol. C'mon, admit it.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinemt99 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 6676 posts, RR: 6
Reply 22, posted (1 year 11 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 1602 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 22):
GW Bush had done the same thing, you would be calling for a public lynching on the steps of the Capitol. C'mon, admit it.

Did you call for GWB for public lynching?

It cuts both ways..



Step into my office, baby
User currently offlineNewark727 From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 1368 posts, RR: 0
Reply 23, posted (1 year 11 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 1600 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 18):
That is incorrect. I think she cares, and I don't think she had a nefarious agenda. I just don't think she is particularly competant, and is handicapped by her worldview, as is Obama. They see the world as they want it to be, not as it is.

So your entire critique of Clinton's actions and testimony boils down to a previously formed opinion?

Quoting windy95 (Reply 17):
Nothing false about it. They failed to act before and during the attack and then lied to cover it up afterwards.

There were several GOP legislators asking about what was and wasn't possible as a response during the attack. Oddly enough none of them got nearly as much traction in the media as the ones who were grandstanding about soft-on-terror narratives.


User currently offlinecasinterest From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 4795 posts, RR: 3
Reply 24, posted (1 year 11 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 1600 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 22):
So once again, you are saying that you have no problem with the government lying to its people for political purposes.

They didn't lie. They didn't have the full picture either.
oops I forgot. you are GOP. You don't believe in evidence.

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 22):
Admit it, If GW Bush had done the same thing, you would be calling for a public lynching on the steps of the Capitol. C'mon, admit it.

No I wouldn't Because
1. Bush was not in the chain of command.
2 I am not a racist that thinks of lynching in conjunction with the president of the United States.
3.. Because unlike the GOP . I love this country no matter who is in charge.
4. I also trust those in Government service that serve through different political leaders to do their jobs to the best of their ability.
5. I don't let anti american organizations like News corp and Fake news ruin my perception of America.



Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
25 Dreadnought : He didn't do the same thing, did he? And I have criticized him for plenty of things. But here we have something so in-your-face blatant, and you guys
26 Dreadnought : Have you been asleep for 5 months? They knew for a fact that the attack had nothing to do with Youtube within 24 hours. All that has been in evidence
27 casinterest : Honestly, Who cares? You are so worried about whether the ATTACK started as a protest of a film, or whether the ATTACK started because someone had a
28 Post contains images D L X : You're beating a dead horse. Or maybe a zombie horse, because it doesn't realize it is dead. These guys have been exposed for making political hay, t
29 Dreadnought : If the Bush Administration had started blaming 9/11 on North Korea, in spite of knowing it was AQ, so that they could increase pressure on NK for wha
30 casinterest : The last use of lynching in the US was for racial purposes outside of the law. So yes I will conpletely attribute it to a racial undertone, because w
31 n229nw : Now that's funny. Because the analogy holds up. Except, for North Korea, substitute Iraq. And here is the difference. This administration said "oops"
32 Dreadnought : You seem to have selective memory. Everyone was convinced that Saddam had WMDs, including Clinton when he was president, the Russians, the French, ev
33 LMP737 : Funny you should bring this up. What GWB did was much worse. Except in that case some of the same GOP senators who seem to be so "outraged" over Beng
34 Post contains links iakobos : I do not know what channel you are watching or frequency you are listening to, but the device is definitely off tune. Good reads before calling the t
35 daviation : Under the circumstances, I think Clinton handled herself very well. The Repubs were foaming at the mouth and the Dems were genuflecting at her knee. T
36 DeltaMD90 : And what is your proof? Just like every other conspiracy theories, it hangs on a lot of circumstantial evidence and far fetched ideas. Oh, and total
37 Geezer : So is YOUR logic ! No he didn't; he is a conservative citizen; conservatives AND citizens neither one condone any kind of "lynchings", public or othe
38 Ken777 : Until, of course, the Second Amendment allows for sales of more guns than we have people in the country. Then we have a situation where personal free
39 Post contains links eatmybologna : I have no proof. But for just a minute, give me the benefit of doubt. Is it possible? Please ask yourself the following? 1) Who appointed Chris Steve
40 seb146 : How? Becuse Hillary didn't/couldn't read every single cable from every single CIA front and every single diplomatic outpost? Or, because the right-wi
41 Post contains links eatmybologna : Of course she could not read all mail. However, Libya was a hot spot that Clinton chose to ignore. Quoted from the article below..."Chris Stevens req
42 DeltaMD90 : When you stack a bunch of "most likely"s together, you get a "not very likely." That is the problem with most conspiracy theories. For example, you h
43 dc863 : Probably because he had nothing to do with the decision making. Hillary and the WH did. She screwed up big time. The fact remains that the Obama admi
44 Newark727 : Only among people who wouldn't have voted for her anyway. I see no particular problem with it. The full quote, which no one is repeating, also mentio
45 Polot : In 2 years nobody will even remember this. Politicians have recovered from a lot worse.
46 Post contains links WarRI1 : http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2...led-in-the-line-of-duty-photos.php Seven Ambassadors lost in the line of duty. These seven men are not the last
47 Post contains images Skyservice_330 : And this has what to do with her role as SecState? Or is it just old school sexism and misogyny showing its ugly head? Her looks have no bearing on h
48 DeltaMD90 : The 2 concerns I see are that we were lied to (which I could also see it being a communication failure, but I could see it as lying. I have no idea wh
49 WarRI1 : Well said, mistakes do happen, people die. It has happened, will happen, and continue to happen no matter who is in power in DC. " to err is human"
50 Geezer : Well, at least she doesn't "look" all that much worse than old Madelene Notsobright. How much do YOU really know about Hilary Clinton ? So now becaus
51 Newark727 : You still haven't established how her looks are relevant to anything, and that's why it's sexism.
52 seb146 : Yes. There are right-wing supporters who look at both sides and make their own decisions to support the right. I have nothing but respect for them, e
53 casinterest : My logic is much clearer than yours, and at least I don't use the quote button to hide stupid statements. Nah, I am based in reality. I still have di
54 johnboy : As I said before, Hillary was very impressive. Hopefully she can kick some Teabagger bootay in 2016.
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
86% Of New Orleans' Population Has Returned posted Wed Oct 24 2007 07:50:09 by MSYtristar
Humor Has Returned To The Forum! posted Wed Apr 2 2003 04:01:41 by TWAL1011
Hillary Clinton Has A Concussion? posted Thu Dec 20 2012 09:16:52 by Superfly
Buffalo Bills: Has The Curse Returned? posted Mon Oct 8 2007 21:00:34 by D L X
Hillary For President - She Has My Support! posted Thu Jun 8 2006 23:37:02 by Dsa
A New War On Terror Has Begun, Without The US posted Sat Jan 12 2013 19:40:11 by Aesma
Sopranos Actor Tony Lip Has Died posted Mon Jan 7 2013 04:31:46 by CaptCufflinks
GEN Norman Schwarzkoph Has Died posted Thu Dec 27 2012 16:31:20 by cptkrell
Which Country Has The Best Coffee?(in Your Opinion posted Mon Dec 24 2012 21:39:21 by Ps762
Has The Price Of An Arugula Gone Down? posted Wed Oct 31 2012 13:43:44 by Superfly