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GM Introduces First Diesel Car In USA In 26 Years  
User currently offlinestasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3287 posts, RR: 6
Posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 2607 times:

At the 2013 Chicago Auto Show, General Motors unveiled the newest variant of its Chevrolet compact sedan, the 2014 Cruze Clean Turbo Diesel. This car, which will be available in both the United States and Canada, uses a 148-horsepower turbocharged 2.0-liter diesel 4-cylinder engine and a 6-speed automatic transmission. The company is projecting 42 mpg on the highway (the same EPA rating as the current TDI Jetta) and GM claims that the car will offer best-in-class driving range.

2014 Chevy Cruze Diesel Sedan


The engine is based on the diesel unit Chevrolet currently sells in European-market Cruzes - where about 40 percent of buyers choose the diesel version. According to Chevy, the Cruze's engine has been modified to suit North American driving conditions and to adhere to America’s stricter diesel emissions standards.

Cruze will be the first diesel car offered by General Motors since Chevy sold a diesel version of the Chevette in 1986. The diesel Cruze is expected to be available for purchase in American Chevy dealerships by late spring 2013.

Chevy says the car’s chief competitor in the United States is Volkswagen’s Jetta TDI. Unlike the VW, though, the Cruze’s diesel engine uses urea injection to help control its emissions. This system uses a 4.5-gallon tank of solution, which should be good for 10,000 miles of driving before requiring a refill.

Furthermore, keep in mind that Ford is rumored to be ready to offer a diesel engine in their U,S, Focus model (perhaps the 2.0 liter Duratorq motor sold in European Focus "Econetic" diesel models) and Fiat/Chrysler is also rumored to be offering a diesel powerplant in their new Dart sedan for the 2014 model year - Fiat has a couple of diesel versions of the Alfa Romeo Giulietta (on which the Dart is based) on sale in Europe.

Items specific to the diesel-powered Cruze include additional sound-deadening material behind the dashboard and under the hood. Pricing should start at $26,695 according to GM, which includes the destination charge and a 2-year maintenance plan... which is about the same price of a Jetta TDI with the DSG automatic transmission.

I think that diesel powered cars are poised to make a BIG comeback here in the United States.

Source; http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dl...iesel-car-since-1986#axzz2KFwv2EMm

[Edited 2013-02-07 15:19:39]

[Edited 2013-02-07 15:26:56]

[Edited 2013-02-07 15:37:42]


"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
66 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15839 posts, RR: 27
Reply 1, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 2582 times:

Can't be worse than GM's last attempt at diesel cars in America.


Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8483 posts, RR: 9
Reply 2, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 2532 times:

The success will probably based on the price of fuel in the various states. Fuel needs to be less expensive than petrol of the savings will shrink too far.

My personal preference is natural gas (switchable to petrol). Ive seen that for years in taxis in Sydney & Melbourne. Worked well in the full sized cars, would help car makers meet emission standards and can be less expensive. We also have a huge supply in the ground.


User currently offlineAesma From Reunion, joined Nov 2009, 6961 posts, RR: 12
Reply 3, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 2516 times:

I didn't know that car was sold here, but apparently it is. I see two diesel offerings on the French website :

•1.7 VCDi 131ch Start & Stop
•2.0 VCDi 163ch Start & Stop

So I guess it's the second one, detuned/tuned to lower emissions. There is no urea system here.



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8774 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 2504 times:

So, it gets the same mileage as a Cruze Eco and costs $6000 more. And the fuel costs more. Not what you'd call progress.

It's a cool piece of technology.


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15839 posts, RR: 27
Reply 5, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 2494 times:

Quoting Flighty (Reply 4):
So, it gets the same mileage as a Cruze Eco and costs $6000 more. And the fuel costs more. Not what you'd call progress.

You do get more performance. Well, more accurately, you get less non-performance anyway. BMW's 335d wasn't great on fuel either, but was pretty good from a driving standpoint.

There isn't a ton of downside for GM here, since the car is already sold in Europe.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 2):
Ive seen that for years in taxis in Sydney & Melbourne. Worked well in the full sized cars, would help car makers meet emission standards and can be less expensive. We also have a huge supply in the ground.

You'd have to build a ton of infrastructure to deliver it and the tanks take up quite a bit of space, although they do probably weigh less than batteries.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineAesma From Reunion, joined Nov 2009, 6961 posts, RR: 12
Reply 6, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 2484 times:

Natural gas cars are very common in Italy. And LPG is also available.

Quoting Flighty (Reply 4):
So, it gets the same mileage as a Cruze Eco and costs $6000 more. And the fuel costs more. Not what you'd call progress.

I'm sure city mileage will be better for the diesel.



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlinemah4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33289 posts, RR: 71
Reply 7, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2464 times:

Quoting Flighty (Reply 4):
So, it gets the same mileage as a Cruze Eco and costs $6000 more.

For whatever reason, though, GM decided to make the car very well-equipped. It comes with a lot of expensive options like leather, alloy wheels and auto transmission standard, that are optional on lesser models. Those three things alone are probably $2-3k in options. So compared to a compartively equipped model, the difference isn't as large.

There is also this fact: the EPA fuel testing is gas engined-centric; it sucks for testing diesel fuel mileage. The reality is that diesel cars get 15 to 25% better fuel results than the EPA estimates. The Cruze diesel will be no different. Like the Jetta and Golf, real world mileage will probably be 50-55MPG.

Quoting Flighty (Reply 4):
And the fuel costs more.

Diesel and gas prices aren't in constant propotion. Right now diesel fuel costs more; three months from now it may very well cost less.

[Edited 2013-02-07 19:06:26]


a.
User currently offlinemham001 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 3731 posts, RR: 3
Reply 8, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2451 times:

Quoting mah4546 (Reply 7):
Like the Jetta and Golf, real world mileage will probably be 50-55MPG.

Source for this "real-world" number?

Quoting mah4546 (Reply 7):
Diesel and gas prices aren't in constant propotion. Right now diesel fuel costs more; three months from now it may very well cost less.

That has not been the case for many years now. It is generally 10-20% more in my area. It will be interesting to see the effects of greater demand. On the flip side, the trucking industry is beginning to transition towards natural gas.


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 40076 posts, RR: 74
Reply 9, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2439 times:

Good for General Motors and I support this decision.
It's about time.

Quoting Flighty (Reply 4):
So, it gets the same mileage as a Cruze Eco and costs $6000 more.



The diesel will last MUCH longer than this 'Eco' Cruze.
Diesel is an old, reliable and trusted technology and has proven to outlive it's gasoline counterparts.
I don't trust this new 'eco' stuff and I be when the eco cars start to get old, they will be unreliable and very expensive to maintain.

Quoting mah4546 (Reply 7):
Diesel and gas prices aren't in constant propotion. Right now diesel fuel costs more; three months from now it may very well cost less.


  

Quoting mah4546 (Reply 7):
There is also this fact: the EPA fuel testing is gas engined-centric; it sucks for testing diesel fuel mileage. The reality is that diesel cars get 15 to 25% better fuel results than the EPA estimates. The Cruze diesel will be no different. Like the Jetta and Golf, real world mileage will probably be 50-55MPG.



  



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15839 posts, RR: 27
Reply 10, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 2428 times:

Quoting mah4546 (Reply 7):
Diesel and gas prices aren't in constant propotion. Right now diesel fuel costs more; three months from now it may very well cost less.

Just based on how I see the prices move it seems that diesel fluctuates less. I don't often see thirty or forty cent swings in the diesel prices.

The government absolutely needs to fix the taxation of fuel in the US. They could help out a lot by removing the six cent per gallon penalty diesel buyers are saddled with. States (those which do it anyway) should follow suit and equalize taxes.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 9):
The diesel will last MUCH longer than this 'Eco' Cruze.
Diesel is an old, reliable and trusted technology and has proven to outlive it's gasoline counterparts.

I'm not sure I buy that. Yes, gas engines are still more complicated, but diesel engines have gotten more complicated and all engines are built better. Like my grandfather's 3000 mile oil changes, this old bit of conventional wisdom might not be true anymore.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlinestasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3287 posts, RR: 6
Reply 11, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2403 times:

Quoting Flighty (Reply 4):
So, it gets the same mileage as a Cruze Eco and costs $6000 more. And the fuel costs more. Not what you'd call progress.

The Cruze is priced within $200 of a DSG-automatic equipped VW Jetta, and the Cruze comes loaded with leather interior and lots of power options. The Diesel Cruze is not a "stripped" model, it's loaded. So it's not exactly apples-to-oranges comparison. Diesel fuel costs are higher in the USA, but the fuel economy of the diesel variant should be much, much better than the gas Eco variant of the Cruze - 50 mpg seems reasonable for highway mileage. This car will really appeal to high mileage drivers that spend a lot of time on the interstate - it should sell reasonably well out here in the West where distances between cities runs in the hundreds of miles and the 270 lbs-feet of torque that the diesel engine produces will be most helpful in climbing steep mountain grades.



"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
User currently offlinesccutler From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 5618 posts, RR: 28
Reply 12, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 2362 times:

Interesting.

I got a Cruze as a rental car recently, and was sort of expecting an updated Cavalier (which would not be terrible, but hardly... Inspiring). The Cruze was much better than I expected, with excellent driving dynamics, good interior comfort and very quiet. It was impressive.

Still have a hard time wrapping my brain around a $26k Cruze, but then again, these $60k trucks my clients are buying amaze me too.

I may never buy a new car again!



...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
User currently offlinefalstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 6179 posts, RR: 29
Reply 13, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2339 times:
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Quoting BMI727 (Reply 1):
Can't be worse than GM's last attempt at diesel cars in America.

That Olds 350 diesel was a TURD!!!! They don't get any bigger. The 4.3 diesel wasn't too bad, but not that many were made.

Quoting Flighty (Reply 4):
So, it gets the same mileage as a Cruze Eco and costs $6000 more. And the fuel costs more. Not what you'd call progress

Since it has more features than the Eco it may appeal to more people. The diesel engine will likely appeal to diesel enthusiasts regardless of price.

Quoting Flighty (Reply 4):
It's a cool piece of technology.

It is nice to a an American diesel powered car sold in the USA.

Quoting mah4546 (Reply 7):

For whatever reason, though, GM decided to make the car very well-equipped. It comes with a lot of expensive options like leather, alloy wheels and auto transmission standard, that are optional on lesser models. Those three things alone are probably $2-3k in options. So compared to a comparatively equipped model, the difference isn't as large.

I have a 2012 Buick Verano that is the fully loaded model, which cost a hair under 30K. I have seen a lot more of the top model Verano than the low level model. So a 26K-30K small car isn't really that far fetched.



My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
User currently offlineKiwiRob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7847 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2336 times:

Quoting stasisLAX (Thread starter):
The engine is based on the diesel unit Chevrolet currently sells in European-market Cruzes - where about 40 percent of buyers choose the diesel version.

They actually sell a petrol powered Cruze in Europe, you could have fooled me because I've never seen one, let alone 60% of them being petrol, that's gotta be wrong.


User currently offlinefalstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 6179 posts, RR: 29
Reply 15, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2327 times:
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Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 14):
They actually sell a petrol powered Cruze in Europe, you could have fooled me because I've never seen one, let alone 60% of them being petrol, that's gotta be wrong.

I wonder if they are actually the Chevy Cruze or also the Vauxhall/Opel cars on the same platform.



My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
User currently offlineImperialEagle From United States of America, joined Jan 2006, 2630 posts, RR: 22
Reply 16, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 8 hours ago) and read 2324 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 1):
Can't be worse than GM's last attempt at diesel cars in America.

Hahahaha----isn't that the truth!
However, incredibly, I knew a fellow back in Atlanta years ago who had about a '79 Fleetwood Brougham with a diesel in it. He had a sales territory all over the deep-south and he put over 300k miles on that damned car without any significant trouble. He finally traded it in the mid-80's! Who knew? He said he just changed the oil/filter and fuel filter with regularity.
Quoting BMI727 (Reply 5):
You do get more performance.

Yeah. 148 horses is pretty good for a car that size getting that kind of fuel mileage.



"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough!"
User currently offlineWildcatYXU From Canada, joined May 2006, 2660 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 2298 times:

Quoting falstaff (Reply 15):
I wonder if they are actually the Chevy Cruze or also the Vauxhall/Opel cars on the same platform.

They are (not only the Cruze). And the Cruze is actually cheaper than a comparable Opel.
Here you can see what's offered in my old country. The site is only in Slovak, but all you need to do is click on "Modely"

http://www.chevrolet.sk/

[Edited 2013-02-08 08:36:11]

User currently offlineAesma From Reunion, joined Nov 2009, 6961 posts, RR: 12
Reply 18, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 2295 times:

Quoting falstaff (Reply 15):
I wonder if they are actually the Chevy Cruze or also the Vauxhall/Opel cars on the same platform.

It looks the same. Chevrolet has been trying to be its own brand in Europe for a couple of years. They even sell the Camaro and the Corvette. Also the Volt. I've seen a couple of Camaros and some Sparks and Aveos, but no sedans. Maybe some crossover SUVs but those look all the same to me.



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlinemah4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33289 posts, RR: 71
Reply 19, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 2253 times:

Quoting mham001 (Reply 8):
Quoting mah4546 (Reply 7):
Like the Jetta and Golf, real world mileage will probably be 50-55MPG.

Source for this "real-world" number?

Ask any Jetta diesel owner. Or read a test drive of a Jetta diesel.

Quoting mham001 (Reply 8):
Quoting mah4546 (Reply 7):
Diesel and gas prices aren't in constant propotion. Right now diesel fuel costs more; three months from now it may very well cost less.

That has not been the case for many years now. It is generally 10-20% more in my area. It will be interesting to see the effects of greater demand. On the flip side, the trucking industry is beginning to transition towards natural gas.

It hasn't been the case lately, but it was the case around 2008-09, and it will be the case again. These things are in constant flux.

Quoting falstaff (Reply 13):
I have a 2012 Buick Verano that is the fully loaded model, which cost a hair under 30K. I have seen a lot more of the top model Verano than the low level model. So a 26K-30K small car isn't really that far fetched.

I realize that, I don't think it's expensive for a loaded compact car; I'm just curious as to why GM decided to make this a premium model, instead of offering a more basic model with the diesel like Volkswagen. Diesel buyers tend to be more practical, do not always want all those luxury touches.

Quoting falstaff (Reply 15):
I wonder if they are actually the Chevy Cruze or also the Vauxhall/Opel cars on the same platform.

They are the Chevrolet Cruze, which in reality is the current generation Daewoo Nubira. Opel does not share Chevrolets. Opels are shared with Buick (e.g. the Buick Verano is an Opel Astra).



a.
User currently offlineKiwiRob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7847 posts, RR: 5
Reply 20, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2228 times:

Quoting falstaff (Reply 15):
I wonder if they are actually the Chevy Cruze or also the Vauxhall/Opel cars on the same platform.

Doubt it, Chevy sales and those of Vauxhall Opel are kept very separate, you barely ever see a Chevy in Europe, they just aren't on the average car buyers radar.

Quoting WildcatYXU (Reply 17):
They are (not only the Cruze). And the Cruze is actually cheaper than a comparable Opel.

And they sell bugger all of them in Europe, the Chevy brand name is barely one step above Great Wall or Cherry.


User currently offlinefalstaff From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 6179 posts, RR: 29
Reply 21, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 2 hours ago) and read 2204 times:
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Quoting Aesma (Reply 18):
. Chevrolet has been trying to be its own brand in Europe for a couple of years. They even sell the Camaro and the Corvette. Also the Volt. I've seen a couple of Camaros and some Sparks and Aveos, but no sedans

I have seen some Chevy Cruze sedans in the UK.



My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
User currently offlineWildcatYXU From Canada, joined May 2006, 2660 posts, RR: 5
Reply 22, posted (1 year 10 months 3 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 2196 times:

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 20):
And they sell bugger all of them in Europe, the Chevy brand name is barely one step above Great Wall or Cherry.



Well, considering the circumstances it's not a surprise. Those re-badged Daewoos they started to sell under the Chevy brand were nothing to write home about. The sad part is that the comparable real Chevys were actually worse.


User currently offlinemah4546 From Sweden, joined Jan 2001, 33289 posts, RR: 71
Reply 23, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 2170 times:

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 20):
Doubt it, Chevy sales and those of Vauxhall Opel are kept very separate, you barely ever see a Chevy in Europe, they just aren't on the average car buyers radar.

What are you talking about? Chevrolet sold over half a million cars in Europe in 2012. Now it's most popular markets are Eastern - like Russia and the Ukraine - but it still sold about 200,000 vehicles in the Western European markets.



a.
User currently offlinesccutler From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 5618 posts, RR: 28
Reply 24, posted (1 year 10 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 2167 times:

Quoting WildcatYXU (Reply 22):
Well, considering the circumstances it's not a surprise. Those re-badged Daewoos they started to sell under the Chevy brand were nothing to write home about. The sad part is that the comparable real Chevys were actually worse.

You cannot possibly be serious. Daewoos were utter garbage - no comparison.



...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
25 WildcatYXU : OK, I rephrase: The sad part is that the comparable real Chevy was actually worse. When the Daewoo Lacetti was introduced in Europe as the Chevrolet
26 BMI727 : BMW basically did the same thing bringing the 335d to the US. They had more efficient diesels but didn't bring those. GM in Europe is pretty messed u
27 Polot : That's the delicate balance with diesels (in the US). Americans wants the 60 mpg or whatnot that they claim those models get in the EU, but they don'
28 stasisLAX : The 40 percent of European Cruze sales being diesel powered vehicles is quoted directly from Chevrolet's press release yesterday announcing the launc
29 mah4546 : Well, Mercedes has confirmed the E250 and ML250 CDI coming to the States later in 2013; and, still unconfirmed, but BMW is likely bringing the 320d s
30 Aesma : If they include eastern Europe and Russia that would certainly explain it.
31 Geezer : First; If GM is "predicting" 42 MPG, you can be very certain you will never see anything like 46 MPG. much less in the 50s. The engine GM put in what
32 BMI727 : I didn't say diesel would be cheaper. I said that I don't think the "diesel engines are bulletproof and will run on cooking oil" but of wisdom is nec
33 sccutler : I've bought one (1) car new, for myself - 2001 Deville. Great car, fast, amazingly economical, smooth, quiet, comfy. Loved it. Now, I have a Suburban
34 Post contains images Kent350787 : Even in Australia, LPG is almost totallly a taxi fuel, even though both GM (Holden) and Ford have been selling dual fuel and LPG full sized sedans fo
35 IH8BY : In the UK they're still very much a minor brand - though their share is growing. Looking at the UK market alone (figures from UK industry body the SM
36 Post contains images KiwiRob : Really I'd love to know where they are hiding them all, must be rentals or something, maybe people are so ashamed that they actually bought one they
37 mirrodie : Why? Was under the guise they typically fare better on longer trips. I've never seen otherwise. Indeed. Rode one to other day. Can pull a horse trail
38 Superfly : The ONLY problem with this car is the price tag. $26,000 is way too much for a little Chevrolet Cruze. The proper price for this should be about $19,0
39 MAH4546 : Here in LA, diesel today is now cheaper than Premium. So there goes that prediction.
40 KiwiRob : Charlie the engine is designed in Germany, the Germans know a thing or two about making decent diesels, it's actually quite a nice engine I've had an
41 JJJ : Not quite. The engines on the Insignia are still the Fiat-sourced JTDs, but the ones on the chevys are made by Daewoo in Korea and were designed by V
42 KiwiRob : Which is owned by Fiat. Where ever thay come from they are a decent motor.
43 JJJ : They seem to be tuned for economy rather than power/torque. They're noticeably more sluggish at low RPM than a JTD (CDTI in Opel).
44 KiwiRob : It's a budget economy car not a performance car.
45 RayChuang : Here's why we haven't gotten diesel-powered cars in the recent past: the Euro5 emissions certification is weaker than the EPA Tier 2 Bin 5 emissions c
46 mad99 : Another blow to the us auto manufacture if that happens, the only way to prevent it is to keep fuel prices low. I think once people drive these cars
47 Dreadnought : Remember that in the US we are still using around 42 cetane diesel, thanks to the trucking lobby, rather than 52 cetane which you get in Europe. You
48 KiwiRob : But still more efficient than the petrol powered equivalent.
49 Post contains links and images mham001 : You do know that the new tech on the gas engines is largely what has made diesel relevant today? Direct injection, etc. And gas engines today mostly
50 KiwiRob : Nice to see that you admit that diesel is relevant today.
51 RayChuang : People in the USA used to think of diesels with their clattering, smoky exhaust engines with no high-end power. But anyone who's driven a US-market V
52 Flighty : I agree. GM does not get the marketing concepts the Germans have used for years. Sell your bottom of the line at a loss. Get people excited about it.
53 MD-90 : I think my mother averages about 45 mpg in her Jetta TDI wagon (lots of highway commuting miles). It goes up to 47 mpg on the interstate when you're
54 Polot : Where did you get the idea that the Jetta TDI is so much cheaper? It starts at $23,085 + $795 destination charge while the Cruze is $24,885 + $795 de
55 baw2198 : I would be very interested in buying one, however, I see no need to purchase one until that 4.5 gal tank of epa "foo foo" juice is removed. If diesels
56 WildcatYXU : Because it's there to eliminate the NOx emissions, not CO.
57 Kent350787 : You do understand that localised particulate emissions (a significant contributor to smog and a likely carcinogen) are different to CO2 and its globa
58 stasisLAX : Volkswagen has serious problems with the TDI engine's reliability due to its high-pressure fuel pump. Due to the less than optimal quality of North A
59 Flighty : Not what I said at all. Jetta TDI is a premium product and a longtime market leader. GM is to put it VERY mildly not in the same category at all. Thi
60 Post contains images Polot : German cars are known for their engineering. Not their long term reliablity.
61 Superfly : I thought that had more to do with diesel fuel being a lubricant, unlike gasoline which is a solvent. Isn't that one of the same? A well engineered c
62 Flighty : GM cars are well engineered too. Usually. But BMW has high residual values and low lease prices mainly because a 5 year old BMW is still a really goo
63 Post contains images Polot : I didn't say they were known for well engineering. I said they were known for their engineering. They sometimes have a tendency to make things more c
64 mirrodie : [quote=mham001,reply=49][VW may ultimately give diesel the bad name considering their continued abysmyl reliability problems in this country. I was su
65 Superfly : Ah ok, I see what mean. That's the damn truth! I helped a friend work on his 1985 Mercedes 190E and it was one big headache.
66 mad99 : That's what I'm saying. Once people try diesel and see the benefit, the'll switch. I drive a 2009 bmw 320d and will soon be buying a 520d or 525d. Th
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