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Will Blackberry Recover/resume Its Former Glory?  
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9168 posts, RR: 15
Posted (1 year 5 months 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 2140 times:

Blackberry is the true inventor of smart phones and it wasn't doing very well for sometime. Recently with the Blackberry 10 they seem to be doing very well.

Will Blackberry recover and return to its former glory? Will Blackberry 10 bring in a miracle? Where is Blackberry 10 made in? I know they have Q10 and Z10. It is a very good business phone I must say.

Guess they have sold more phones than Apple overall right?

[Edited 2013-03-18 22:32:35]

32 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinesrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 2093 times:

Nope, and this is coming from a dyed in the wool BlackBerry user. The company rested on their laurels for too long and allowed the competition to pass them by and some of that was out of arrogance, as by the time they treated the iPhone and Android as real threats, the damage was already done. They lost a lot of customers in some very important markets like the US (A number of high-profile corporate and government customers have dropped BlackBerry in recent years.) and their share in those markets dipped into single digits. What new phones they brought out were not entirely innovative and some were not quality devices. Things did start looking up when they rolled out the BlackBerry OS7 devices, but the problem was that they have nowhere near the number of apps that are available for the iPhone and Android-powered devices. Companies were not willing to commit resources to what was perceived as a "dying brand" and public perception of BlackBerry as a dinosaur that was soon to be extinct didn't help either.

There were a lot of missteps that allowed competitors to whittle away BlackBerry's share of the market. They rushed products like the PlayBook tablet to market too early and at a price point that was too high (Why should someone buy a PlayBook when they could get an iPad of similar capacity and with a lot more apps for the same price?) and suffered for it. They took a huge $$$ hit as they ended up selling the PlayBook at a deep discount, but managed to sell a decent number of them as a result. A lot of the features promised at launch did not come out until about 10 months later (most of them were supposed to have come out in the Summer of 2011, which got pushed to the Fall of 2011 and finally came out in February of 2012.).


BlackBerry 10, as well as new CEO Thorsten Heins, have done a lot to help reclaim some marketshare, but they will likely solidify themselves as the #3 smartphone company. BlackBerry 10 was launched in late January, with the Z10 going on sale in some countries at that time and selling fairly well, but the Z10 is just now being launched in the US (T-Mobile was the first major carrier in the US to sell it, albeit to their business customers.) and being released to consumers in the next week or so. The fact that there is a nearly 2 month delay between the Z10 being launched and it going on sale with the major carriers in the US shows how far BlackBerry has fallen with US carriers. There are signs though that the Z10 will do decently here, as AT&T purchased a million Z10s and early reports are that early presales are fairly decent.


User currently offlineAirPacific747 From Denmark, joined May 2008, 2386 posts, RR: 21
Reply 2, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 2074 times:

Quoting srbmod (Reply 1):
Nope, and this is coming from a dyed in the wool BlackBerry user. The company rested on their laurels for too long and allowed the competition to pass them by and some of that was out of arrogance

Same story with Nokia. They will have a little market share with Windows Phone, but they will never become the most dominant player again. And I really like Windows Phone, I just don't see it surpassing the iPhone and Android.

Maybe if they also started producing Android phones, they would have a better chance.


User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9168 posts, RR: 15
Reply 3, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 2072 times:

If they come up with something very innovative?

What about Nokia?


User currently offlineNorthStarDC4M From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 3004 posts, RR: 37
Reply 4, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 2030 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CHAT OPERATOR

BlackBerry will never surpass Android or iPhone, but it doesn't have to.
Blackberry can and will keep itself aligned with a specific market.

The problem is there is a specific market for BlackBerry, secure corporate/government mobile service, and while that market exists it is limited. The problem is beyond that it quickly becomes a cost/reliability/simplicity/reliability argument. This is where BlackBerry now has issues as they are becoming an MDM provider from the intranet side, instead of being a unique solution device and server as they were previously. BYOD is becoming the norm in many corporate environments, which now BlackBerry is only one player in many in. This is both an opportunity and a risk as the MDM market is already populated with products, though most not as robust as what BlackBerry is offering.

BB10 has some definate advantages, but not anything amazing... but neither does anyone else. QNX is a great OS, and it's on good hardware, but only time will tell if it's enough.



Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9168 posts, RR: 15
Reply 5, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1984 times:

Where is Blackberry 10 being made? Canada? Hungary?

Was Blackberry ever no 1? Guess not.

Can anyone give me the specifications of I phone 5, Blackberry 10, Samsung Galaxy S4 as well as Nokia Lumia 920?


User currently offlinejetblueguy22 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 2783 posts, RR: 4
Reply 6, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1979 times:
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I don't think so, but the Blackberry 10 will determine if they live or survive. Apparently they sold 1 million units to one customer. That is promising, but not enough to put them back wear they were just 5 years ago. If the 10 is as good as many seem to be claiming they can perhaps get some market share back, but they won't be in Android or iPhone territory. I played with my mom's blackberry the other day and it is a shame what they have come to. I love my iPhone, but sometimes a physical keyboard is something I really miss. It's just so much easier to type sometimes. Best of luck to Blackberry, but I'm thinking they should write up the bankruptcy documents now and keep them in the top drawer.
Pat



You push down on that yoke, the houses get bigger, you pull back on the yoke, the houses get bigger- Ken Foltz
User currently offlineNorthStarDC4M From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 3004 posts, RR: 37
Reply 7, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1980 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CHAT OPERATOR

Quoting United Airline (Reply 5):
Can anyone give me the specifications of I phone 5, Blackberry 10, Samsung Galaxy S4 as well as Nokia Lumia 920?
http://www.gsmarena.com/blackberry_z10-5251.php
http://www.gsmarena.com/nokia_lumia_720-5321.php
http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_i9500_galaxy_s4-5125.php
http://www.gsmarena.com/apple_iphone_5-4910.php



Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
User currently offlinemt99 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 6575 posts, RR: 6
Reply 8, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1973 times:
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Quoting United Airline (Reply 5):
Can anyone give me the specifications of I phone 5, Blackberry 10, Samsung Galaxy S4 as well as Nokia Lumia 920?

We are getting to to point where specification are useless... Its a game of content and "experience" now.



Step into my office, baby
User currently offlineAirPacific747 From Denmark, joined May 2008, 2386 posts, RR: 21
Reply 9, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 1946 times:

Quoting mt99 (Reply 8):

We are getting to to point where specification are useless... Its a game of content and "experience" now.

Tell that to Samsung. Their new GS4 features an 8-core processor I believe, and the user interface is the same as on the previous GS3 with only a few minor changes.


User currently offlinemt99 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 6575 posts, RR: 6
Reply 10, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 1940 times:
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Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 9):
Tell that to Samsung. Their new GS4 features an 8-core processor I believe

I am telling that to Samsung. Did you see what Apple stock do after the GS4 reveal?

Anyone can cram more "cores"..

My point is:

Leap from 1MP camera to 5MP or 8MP.: something good that drives sales.
Leap from 14MP camera to 16MP: ehh..

Eventually all "specs" are easily matched by other competitors. There is a diminishing return in the "spec" game.

[Edited 2013-03-19 13:31:56]


Step into my office, baby
User currently offlinesrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 1926 times:

Quoting United Airline (Reply 5):

Where is Blackberry 10 being made? Canada? Hungary?

Canada and Mexico, with the bulk of them being made in Mexico.

Quoting jetblueguy22 (Reply 6):
Apparently they sold 1 million units to one customer.

AT&T, as I mentioned in Reply 1.

Quoting NorthStarDC4M (Reply 4):
The problem is there is a specific market for BlackBerry, secure corporate/government mobile service, and while that market exists it is limited. The problem is beyond that it quickly becomes a cost/reliability/simplicity/reliability argument. This is where BlackBerry now has issues as they are becoming an MDM provider from the intranet side, instead of being a unique solution device and server as they were previously. BYOD is becoming the norm in many corporate environments, which now BlackBerry is only one player in many in. This is both an opportunity and a risk as the MDM market is already populated with products, though most not as robust as what BlackBerry is offering.

I don't fit either market. When I got my first BlackBerry back in 2010, part of the reason why I got it was because my cell provider at the time didn't offer the iPhone and their Android options were not very good devices. The BlackBerry Curve 8530 is an entry-level BlackBerry device and was Virgin Mobile USA's most expensive phone at the time (I paid $300 for it only to see them drop the price to $179 about three months later.). I used that phone for about 18 months before switching to Simple Mobile (A BYOD MVNO that piggybacks on T-Mobile) as I wanted a newer BlackBerry and Virgin Mobile USA was not planning on adding one. I picked up a refurbished T-Mobile Curve 9360 for less than what I had paid for my Curve 8530 about 18 months earlier. I've been quite happy with it, even more than the 8530, which was a bit sluggish after updating the OS.

I'm planning on getting a BB10 device in the next few months (Since switching to BlackBerry devices, I've been upgrading about every 18 months.) and I'm still torn on which model to get, especially since BlackBerry will be releasing 6 different BB10 devices this year. I'm liking the Z10, but the Q10 has me interested as well since it looks like a traditional BB device (It is about the size of the current Bolds just with a bigger and better touchscreen.). Since I'm planning on buying it without a contract, I'll be paying a lot more for it (It should be similar in price to what an unlocked/no contract iPhone 5 costs from Apple.). I'd rather pay more for the phone than to be locked into a 2 or 3 three year contract in order to get it for $199.


User currently offlineWestJet747 From Canada, joined Aug 2011, 1830 posts, RR: 10
Reply 12, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 1917 times:

Quoting srbmod (Reply 1):
They rushed products like the PlayBook tablet to market too early and at a price point that was too high

   I would argue that this might have been their biggest blunder, and it continues to haunt them. The newest PlayBook is actually pretty good, but because the original PlayBook left such a sour taste in peoples' mouths, nobody wants to even consider the new and improved iteration.

Quoting NorthStarDC4M (Reply 4):
BYOD is becoming the norm in many corporate environments, which now BlackBerry is only one player in many in. This is both an opportunity and a risk as the MDM market is already populated with products, though most not as robust as what BlackBerry is offering.
Quoting United Airline (Reply 5):
Where is Blackberry 10 being made? Canada? Hungary?

Components for BlackBerrys come from all over the world, with quite a bit coming from China. Assembly/manufacturing is done at facilities in Canada (Waterloo), Mexico, and I think some in Easter Europe.

Quoting United Airline (Reply 5):
Was Blackberry ever no 1? Guess not.

Well they were the only "smartphone" back in the day, so naturally they were #1 because there was nobody to compete with.

Quoting jetblueguy22 (Reply 6):
I played with my mom's blackberry the other day and it is a shame what they have come to.

I'm guessing it wasn't a Z10?

Quoting mt99 (Reply 8):
We are getting to to point where specification are useless... Its a game of content and "experience" now.

   Only die-hard techies look at specs these days. Smartphones (or "superphones" as carriers have started calling them now   ) have become a popularity contest. People only care about what is considered "cool" or currently trendy.

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 9):
Their new GS4 features an 8-core processor I believe

I challenge you to go out on the street right now and find us 10 people who know why an 8-core processor is a good thing. It might take you a while. Even better, ask 10 S4 users why they decided to buy that device, and see how many said it was because of the improved processing.



Flying refined.
User currently offlinesrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 1913 times:

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 12):
I would argue that this might have been their biggest blunder, and it continues to haunt them. The newest PlayBook is actually pretty good, but because the original PlayBook left such a sour taste in peoples' mouths, nobody wants to even consider the new and improved iteration.

Once OS2 got released, it was a much better product, but it was too late to save the PlayBook. I'm kicking myself for not picking up a 64GB version a few months back for $199, as I would have used it simply to load up with movies and TV shows.

The 4G LTE version is still listed as "coming soon" on the US BlackBerry site, but with the BlackBerry Bridge app, who really needs it unless you don't own a BlackBerry phone.

It should be interesting once they update the PlayBook to operate on BB10 since the PlayBook OS is the basis of BB10.


User currently offlinetugger From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 5502 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 1906 times:

Quoting NorthStarDC4M (Reply 4):
BlackBerry will never surpass Android or iPhone, but it doesn't have to.
Blackberry can and will keep itself aligned with a specific market.

The problem is there is a specific market for BlackBerry, secure corporate/government mobile service, and while that market exists it is limited.

I will also be curious to see what happens if rumors of Lenovo buying them come true. I think its heritage (being a Chinese company will be an issue for many corporations and certainly for any government entity. I am not interested in a "China bash" but there is a well known fear/concern about potential issues and having full access to the control chain and servers etc. that everything goes through.

Tugg



I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
User currently offlinesrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 1898 times:

Quoting tugger (Reply 14):
I will also be curious to see what happens if rumors of Lenovo buying them come true. I think its heritage (being a Chinese company will be an issue for many corporations and certainly for any government entity. I am not interested in a "China bash" but there is a well known fear/concern about potential issues and having full access to the control chain and servers etc. that everything goes through.

There were similar concerns when they acquired IBM's PC back in 2005 and it's turned out to be a pretty good deal in the end, as pretty much only the change was to the name.

Lenovo is the #2 smartphone maker in China; however, they only have 10% of the market as there are so many smartphone vendors in China (somewhere in the neighborhood of 100+), which is the largest smartphone market in the world. Lenovo acquiring BlackBerry would benefit both companies as Lenovo is trying to get their smartphones into additional markets and the BlackBerry name is much more known globally in that sector.

At the very least, I see Lenovo and BlackBerry entering into a partnership that sees BB10 licensed to Lenovo for a line of entry-level BB10 devices, as BlackBerry does not intend to manufacture such devices at this time (This is where the current OS7 lineup comes into play.).


User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8220 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 1893 times:

BB's best hope is (unfortunately) Android taking some major hits in the area of security, making it an unwanted IT nightmare.

Otherwise I really don't see BB being that strong in business, medicine or other major fields simply because they are far behind Apple and Samsung in apps available - just like Microsoft.

What BB really needs to focus on is profitability, not market share. Apple gained strength in profitability long before it gained strength in the market.

And while the smartphone is strong these days, how long will it be before consumers learn how much cheaper it is to go with a traditional mobile phone plus something like the iPad mini? That puts a lot of pressure on companies like ATT when they see people buying the cheapest data plan & using WiFi when possible.


User currently offlinetugger From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 5502 posts, RR: 8
Reply 17, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 1887 times:

Quoting srbmod (Reply 15):
There were similar concerns when they acquired IBM's PC back in 2005 and it's turned out to be a pretty good deal in the end, as pretty much only the change was to the name.

I understand and agree, but hardware that can be reviewed and reset and managed completely independently is very different from the pipeline of information, critical, confidential, information that flows through the BB serves and through their devices. that is why some many countries want access to that information and require servers for "their" citizens data to be in their country.

Tugg



I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
User currently offlineAirPacific747 From Denmark, joined May 2008, 2386 posts, RR: 21
Reply 18, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 1868 times:

Quoting mt99 (Reply 10):
I am telling that to Samsung. Did you see what Apple stock do after the GS4 reveal?

Anyone can cram more "cores"..
Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 12):
I challenge you to go out on the street right now and find us 10 people who know why an 8-core processor is a good thing. It might take you a while. Even better, ask 10 S4 users why they decided to buy that device, and see how many said it was because of the improved processing.

Hey I didn't say that I support this strategy by Samsung.. Actually the point was the opposite, hence why I pointed out the lack of innovation in the UI. I was just trying to make a point that Samsung is not so focused on a better UI yet. Only silly things which most people won't need anyway.


User currently offlinejetblueguy22 From United States of America, joined Nov 2007, 2783 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 1854 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
HEAD MODERATOR

Quoting srbmod (Reply 11):
AT&T, as I mentioned in Reply 1.

Whoops I missed it! My apologies.

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 12):
I'm guessing it wasn't a Z10?

No, I believe it was the Bold.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 16):

BB's best hope is (unfortunately) Android taking some major hits in the area of security, making it an unwanted IT nightmare.

The company I used to work for wouldn't even consider buying Android or the iPhone because of the security concerns. Whether or not there was some data behind it, I'm not sure. But I have never heard of either being unsecure. Apparently a bunch of corporations agree, because I know executives with iPhones.
Pat



You push down on that yoke, the houses get bigger, you pull back on the yoke, the houses get bigger- Ken Foltz
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9168 posts, RR: 15
Reply 20, posted (1 year 5 months 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 1833 times:

Will Blackberry go bankrupt or die? Guess not.

Will it survive? I think so. On it's own?


User currently offlineOzGlobal From France, joined Nov 2004, 2716 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (1 year 5 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 1780 times:

Quoting United Airline (Reply 20):
Will Blackberry go bankrupt or die? Guess not.

Will it survive? I think so. On it's own?

Remember Palm? What happened to them? Died through failure to adapt to BB...



When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
User currently offlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12424 posts, RR: 25
Reply 22, posted (1 year 5 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 1768 times:

Quoting United Airline (Thread starter):
Blackberry is the true inventor of smart phones

Smart mobile terminals, perhaps, but lacking so many characteristics that one would attach to the term smart phone that I think it's a huge stretch.

Quoting srbmod (Reply 1):
They lost a lot of customers in some very important markets like the US (A number of high-profile corporate and government customers have dropped BlackBerry in recent years.)

Indeed, and I don't see them coming back.

Quoting srbmod (Reply 1):
the problem was that they have nowhere near the number of apps that are available for the iPhone and Android-powered devices

It's a huge problem as well as the fact that their lateness now makes them the third (or more) platform for developers to target.

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 2):
Same story with Nokia. They will have a little market share with Windows Phone, but they will never become the most dominant player again. And I really like Windows Phone, I just don't see it surpassing the iPhone and Android.

I would avoid the use of 'never'. Unlike BB they have the money of M$ behind them and they have a lot more developer 'mindshare'. Apple has the weakness of being too closed and expensive (where's my MicroSD slot?), Andrioid has the problem of providing too clunky a user experience for many, which IMHO means there still is a window for M$.

Quoting NorthStarDC4M (Reply 4):
Blackberry can and will keep itself aligned with a specific market.

Are you talking about the one that's been walking away from them in droves?

Quoting NorthStarDC4M (Reply 4):
BYOD is becoming the norm in many corporate environments, which now BlackBerry is only one player in many in.

Indeed. Corporations love the idea of off-loading the cost of purchasing devices and in many cases the service plans onto their employees. That genie is out of the bottle.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 16):
BB's best hope is (unfortunately) Android taking some major hits in the area of security, making it an unwanted IT nightmare.

See above. IT will be told to "make it work!". There's just too big a financial imperative for it to turn out any other way for the vast majority of corporations.

While Andriod is relatively new compared to BB and iOS, keep in mind its basic technologies like Linux and Java have had a lot of security hardening, and many of the things Andriod itself has done with those technologies makes it more secure.

Personally I feel better about the security of Android than I do about WinPhone...



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlineUnited Airline From Hong Kong, joined Jan 2001, 9168 posts, RR: 15
Reply 23, posted (1 year 5 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 1707 times:

Palm was popular. Is it still around? What happened to Palm?

User currently offline135mech From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 412 posts, RR: 4
Reply 24, posted (1 year 5 months 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 1706 times:
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Sadly, they don't WANT to catch up!

I have been a fan for 4 of the 5 years I have used them...they have NO customer service and I had to replace my NEW Bold 4 times in 4 months and there is NO help from them! It really sucks too, when you click on their "contact us" link, it tells you to go to their 'forums page" and see if other users have had similar problems and see if that helps. Through the desktop manager I have been able to send them e-mails, but they WILL NOT reply, and even state... "you will not receive a reply, we will just work to fix the problem you mention" and it's true...they DO NOT reply or even attempt to contact their customers.

Now they have the @BlackBerryHelp on twitter, but they refuse to "help" and will not reply or answer that either...

Also, as mentioned above... the available apps/applications are extremely minimal. Even GoogleMaps has to have it's own "blackberry" version just to stay "simple" enough to be used on even last year's Bold.

THEY...are the reason THEY are failing and falling behind so rapidly!!!

Regards,
135Mech

[Edited 2013-03-21 12:27:59]

25 Post contains links Ken777 : I believe BB will have a huge problem getting even a fraction of the app developers to support them. Right now a developer with a bright idea will dev
26 srbmod : Went bankrupt, was bought by HP and folded into the company (some Palm assets are part of an HP subsidiary called Gram). HP recently made a deal to s
27 Post contains images StarAC17 : They actually have quite a bit of cash, IP and assets so that isn't really an issue at the moment. Also the market is reaching a plateau where there
28 United Airline : Does Palm still exist? Do they still make Palm phones?
29 nighthawk : BB10 supports java, and is capable of running Android apps as well, so the task of porting an android app over to the BB10 platform is minimal, and i
30 srbmod : No and no. The last Palm branded devices was the Pre 2 and the Pixi. HP for a time sold the Pre 3 under the HP name and offered the HP Veer (which wa
31 Revelation : Most for-profit companies care about profit, and this means the imperative is to stop paying for so many employee's phones when in most cases the emp
32 United Airline : Heard that Nokia will come up with a Lumia 928. Which one is better? Lumia 928 or I phone 5 or Samsung Galaxy S4 or BlackBerry 10?
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