Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Ford Australia To Close All Production By 2016  
User currently offlinezkojq From New Zealand, joined Sep 2011, 1137 posts, RR: 1
Posted (1 year 2 months 1 hour ago) and read 2488 times:

Quote:
US car giant Ford Motor will shut all its Australian manufacturing plants by October 2016, after more than 85 years of making vehicles in the country.

Currently, Ford Australia produces the Territory and the Falcon (and all of its various derivatives such as Fairlanes, Utes and FPVs). From 2017, the Falcon nameplate will now be dead. They have already announced that the its replacement will share the same platform as the next generation of Ford Taurus/Ford Mondeo. It seems that the Territory will die also, though they might use the name for another SUV (Kuga, I guess) made elsewhere.   

It is interesting to note that:

Quote:
"Our costs are double that of Europe and nearly four times Ford in Asia,"

I guess this shows the effect of the strong aussie dollar.

It is a very sad day for us Ford Fanboys. Two weeks ago me, dad and some friends took the new Territory offroading at the farm. It is a very, very nice (and able) SUV.

It is 16 years since Ford ended production in New Zealand.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-22634653
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/n...ticle.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10885647
http://www.motoring.com.au/news/2013...ate-dead-territory-undecided-36737


Someone repaint ZK-PBG!
52 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineSAS A340 From Sweden, joined Jul 2000, 775 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (1 year 2 months ago) and read 2461 times:

At the same time,Ford planning to employe 2000 workers in the US..... is this in line what Obama said that he planes to take jobs back to the US??

[Edited 2013-05-22 23:49:28]


It's not what u do,it's how u do it!
User currently onlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39668 posts, RR: 75
Reply 2, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2429 times:

Sorry to read about this.

Quoting SAS A340 (Reply 1):
Ford planning to employe 2000 workers in the US..... is this in line what Obama said that he planes to take jobs back to the US??

Nope.
The Fords made in Australia are sold in Australia and nearby countries. None of the Fords made in Australia are sold in the US. The Territory and the Falcon (and all of its various derivatives such as Fairlanes, Utes and FPVs) are only sold in Australia and possibly New Zealand.
Now if Ford USA was bringing production of the Territory and the Falcon to the US then that would be a different story.
This is a private business decision that Obama has nothing to do with.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineJJJ From Spain, joined May 2006, 1766 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 2370 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 2):
The Fords made in Australia are sold in Australia and nearby countries. None of the Fords made in Australia are sold in the US. The Territory and the Falcon (and all of its various derivatives such as Fairlanes, Utes and FPVs) are only sold in Australia and possibly New Zealand.

They still have to be made somewhere, by some Ford workers.

So, considering Australia's location it will be either the US/Mexico or the Philippines.


User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7083 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2353 times:

Quoting zkojq (Thread starter):
Two weeks ago me, dad and some friends took the new Territory offroading at the farm. It is a very, very nice (and able) SUV.

That was brave of you, my brothers farther in law killed his Territory trying to follow my brothers Defender on a trail a couple of years ago, it really isn't made for any more than crossing a muddy field.

Quoting zkojq (Thread starter):
It is 16 years since Ford ended production in New Zealand.

They assembled, they never produced in NZ, there is a difference.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 2):
The Fords made in Australia are sold in Australia and nearby countries.

By other countries you really only mean NZ, Ford Australia have a poor history exporting to places further afield. The one country which I'm surprised Foird Australia never had much success in is South Africa, Holden sells the Commodore sedan and ute there as the Chevy Lumina. Ford were given a govt grant to engineer a LHD Falcon but decided to spend the money setting up local assembly of the Focus.

I really can't see Holden and Toyota remaining in Australia much longer either. Ford's just the latest casualty in an industry which has kept on shrinking. Gone are British Leyland, Chrysler, Mitsuibishi, Nissan, Renault, VW and now Ford.

[Edited 2013-05-23 04:35:57]

User currently offlineOzair From Australia, joined Jan 2005, 836 posts, RR: 1
Reply 5, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2334 times:

Quoting JJJ (Reply 3):
They still have to be made somewhere, by some Ford workers.

So, considering Australia's location it will be either the US/Mexico or the Philippines.

The Mondeo is imported from Belgium. The Focus used to come from Germany but now comes from Thailand. The Fiesta also comes from Thailand. I'd expect increased production of different vehicles from Thailand or somewhere else in the region with a cheaper cost base.

Quoting zkojq (Thread starter):

It is a very sad day for us Ford Fanboys. Two weeks ago me, dad and some friends took the new Territory offroading at the farm. It is a very, very nice (and able) SUV.

My brother loves his Territory. Will be interesting to see what they replace it with.


User currently offlineJJJ From Spain, joined May 2006, 1766 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2316 times:

Quoting Ozair (Reply 5):
The Mondeo is imported from Belgium. The Focus used to come from Germany but now comes from Thailand. The Fiesta also comes from Thailand. I'd expect increased production of different vehicles from Thailand or somewhere else in the region with a cheaper cost base.

The Belgian factory is closing down, production of the Mondeo shifts to Spain late this year.

As you say, Thailand or somewhere else in Asia is the most likely medium-term scenario.


User currently offlinecptkrell From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3220 posts, RR: 12
Reply 7, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2305 times:

Being retired from the autos for going on 10 years I haven't really stayed "in the loop" that closely and am surprised at the news. But reading the attached articles, I can understand the decision.

I feel sorry for the Ford workers and also the local supplier industry workers and local townspeople, all of whom will be financially affected. Trickle-down negative effects will be felt widely and I hope the best for our Kiwi friends.

I would be surprised if any Australian production will be coming from the U.S. The complexity of designing and manufacturing a dedicated right-hand steering vehicle and integrate it into a left-hand steering assembly plant is quite staggering; one just doesn't swap over the steering wheel to the other side of the car. Of course, current technologies could prove me wrong, but again, I'd be surprised. regards...jack



all best; jack
User currently offlineJJJ From Spain, joined May 2006, 1766 posts, RR: 1
Reply 8, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2294 times:

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 7):
I would be surprised if any Australian production will be coming from the U.S. The complexity of designing and manufacturing a dedicated right-hand steering vehicle and integrate it into a left-hand steering assembly plant is quite staggering; one just doesn't swap over the steering wheel to the other side of the car. Of course, current technologies could prove me wrong, but again, I'd be surprised. regards...jack

All global car companies have been designing their designes to be produced in LHD or RHD versions for quite some time. I guess very specific US models won't, but the bread and butter models are designed from the ground with that in mind.

Just talking about Ford, the flagship Fiesta, Focus, Mondeo and the different vans are built to both RHD and LHD specifications.


User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8785 posts, RR: 24
Reply 9, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2290 times:

Quoting JJJ (Reply 8):
All global car companies have been designing their designes to be produced in LHD or RHD versions for quite some time.

Trust me, US auto designers have as much consideration for foreign markets as they do for the color preferences of Martian cave-dwelling bacteria.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlineCXB77L From Australia, joined Feb 2009, 2595 posts, RR: 5
Reply 10, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2288 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CHAT OPERATOR

Very sad day for Ford Australia. I've loved Falcons ever since I first saw one at the car rental agency several years ago. I've also owned two of them in my 14 years of driving. The Falcon may not be the most refined, the most fuel efficient, nor the best built car in the world, but despite its flaws, I love it. It has character.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 2):
The Territory and the Falcon (and all of its various derivatives such as Fairlanes, Utes and FPVs) are only sold in Australia and possibly New Zealand.

I think the Territory is being considered for export to Thailand, and the Falcon was briefly sold in South Africa in the early 2000s.



Boeing 777 fanboy
User currently offlinemelpax From Australia, joined Apr 2005, 1585 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2253 times:

Not really a suprise, I'm afraid. The Falcon has been selling poorly for years, although it's a fantasic car. Large 6 cylinder cars have been unfashionable for a while now, Ford have been selling more Territorys than Falcons. The Falcon is now basically built to order only, unlike the 80's & 90's when they couldn't pump them out fast enough. Out of the 3 remaining manufacturers here (Ford, Toyota & Holden), only Ford didn't have a large scale export program (Detroit wouldn't let them do LHD Falcons or Territorys). The Territory is being sold in Thailand though. Toyota is doing pretty well, quite a lot of their Camry production from Melbourne ends up in the Mid East, and they're looking to add RAV4 production here as well.

At least Ford will be keeping their Design & Development teams here, so it's not a total pull-out.

Might have to look into getting a new Falcon (XR6 Turbo  devil  ) before production finishes in 2016.

[Edited 2013-05-23 07:07:55]


Essendon - Whatever it takes......
User currently offlinezkojq From New Zealand, joined Sep 2011, 1137 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2241 times:

I've always wondered why Ford Australia didn't seem to put at least as much effort into selling its products overseas as Holden did/does. Holden send a fair number of Commodores to the US branded as Pontiac G8s. And to Arabia, branded as Chevrolets of some kind - there are plenty of them in Dubai. It seems the UAE even has an HSV owner's club. http://bit.ly/16QuLwL

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 4):
That was brave of you, my brothers farther in law killed his Territory trying to follow my brothers Defender on a trail a couple of years ago, it really isn't made for any more than crossing a muddy field.

The Territory did fine. It didn't have an issue with the ~30% incline nor with the large volume of firewood that was filling up the back seat, boot and large trailer on the back. It seems to have an endless amount of torque. Someone else's Nissan Murano did the same several months previous though the CVT struggled and it was hauling less 'payload'.

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 4):
They assembled, they never produced in NZ, there is a difference.

My mistake.

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 7):
I would be surprised if any Australian production will be coming from the U.S. The complexity of designing and manufacturing a dedicated right-hand steering vehicle and integrate it into a left-hand steering assembly plant is quite staggering; one just doesn't swap over the steering wheel to the other side of the car.

   Apart from anything else, tastes are very different. Currently Ford Australia sells none of the North American models in Australia or New Zealand. There are a couple of companies that offer imports and conversions of Mustangs but these are done in very small numbers. If they did try to import some North American models I very much doubt they would be successful - the market on this side of the Pacific is instead oriented towards Europe and Asia.

Quoting JJJ (Reply 6):
As you say, Thailand or somewhere else in Asia is the most likely medium-term scenario.

   Though I believe Australia and New Zealand still get Belgian (soon to be Spanish) Mondeos. Not sure if this will change. Our Fiestas are Thai though. Not sure about the Kugas.

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 10):
The Falcon may not be the most refined, the most fuel efficient, nor the best built car in the world, but despite its flaws, I love it. It has character.

  . Agreed. The Holden fanboys are going to be insufferably smug after this announcement.   

Quoting melpax (Reply 11):
The Falcon has been selling poorly for years, although it's a fantasic car. Large 6 cylinder cars have been unfashionable for a while now, Ford have been selling more Territorys than Falcons.

I think the Falcon's problems were two-fold. First the Territory came along, was very good and cannibalized a significant portion of the Falcon's market. Second, the GFC and fuel price rises caused the Mondeo to cannibalize much of the remainder. It is very difficult to justify having the larger, thirstier, heavier Falcon over the Mondeo. My mother drives a Mondeo and I can see why many would find it preferable over the Falcon.

Meanwhile Holden never made a proper SUV (they import the Daewoo engineered and produced Captiva...but its not very good) and didn't bother importing the Opel/Vauxhall Insignia. Thus the Commodore hasn't had its market cannibalized in such the same way that the Falcon did and lives on (well so far).



Someone repaint ZK-PBG!
User currently offlineokie From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 2985 posts, RR: 3
Reply 13, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2231 times:

Quoting zkojq (Reply 12):
I've always wondered why Ford Australia didn't seem to put at least as much effort into selling its products overseas as Holden did/does. Holden send a fair number of Commodores to the US branded as Pontiac G8s. And to Arabia, branded as Chevrolets of some kind - there are plenty of them in Dubai

That has to be one of the major issues is the production rate. Ford only sold 14,000 of the Territory last year. If you use that number against a 200 day manufacturing year that is only 70 units per day.

The GM plant here in OKC ran at 70 units per hour 16 hours a day, 224,000 units per year.

Ford Australia just did not come up with a way to export the cars into other markets. You will see the global companies just shifting to lower wage countries and higher production efficiencies of their physical plants.

Okie


User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15707 posts, RR: 26
Reply 14, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2228 times:

Quoting zkojq (Reply 12):
Holden send a fair number of Commodores to the US branded as Pontiac G8s.

They're coming back, as the SS sedan. It's gonna be great. Just the other day I saw my first Caprice PPV.

Quoting zkojq (Reply 12):
And to Arabia, branded as Chevrolets of some kind

They're badged as Luminas. Way better than any Lumina we ever got.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7083 posts, RR: 3
Reply 15, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2210 times:

Quoting JJJ (Reply 8):
All global car companies have been designing their designes to be produced in LHD or RHD versions for quite some time.

JJJ cptkrell used to be a car designer for GM (I think).

Quoting zkojq (Reply 12):
Agreed. The Holden fanboys are going to be insufferably smug after this announcement.

Only for a short while there is no way Holden will be able to keep the plant running for too much longer. I also bet Toyota will pack up and leave soon to.

Quoting zkojq (Reply 12):
It is very difficult to justify having the larger, thirstier, heavier Falcon over the Mondeo. My mother drives a Mondeo and I can see why many would find it preferable over the Falcon.

Ford did have a solution, the Ecoboost 4 cylinder model was a great car but people wouldn't buy it. Holden has the the Cruze which fills the same market position as the Mondeo, but that hasn't cannibalised Commodore sales. Fords other issue is they dropped the wagon, which was much beloved by many fleet users. I really think the major problem with the Falcon was a lack of interest from Ford US, this car would have found a market in the US as a replacement for the Crown Vic, and they could have used the LWB LTD as a replacement for the Town Car if they hadn't dumped it. Part of the blame also goes to Ford for not engineering the LHD version when they were given the money to do so. Another problem with the Falcon is that it's still based on the AU which was a turn, so in effect I think a lot of buyer still think of it as a polished turd.

Quoting okie (Reply 13):

Ford Australia just did not come up with a way to export the cars into other markets.

That would have needed assistance form Ford HO, I'm sure the Falcon would have found a market in all the locations that GM found for the Commodore, Ford AU shot themselves in the foot by not engineering the LHD version when they had the money to do it. Ford have themselves to blame for the demise of the Falcon.

I'm curious what they are going to replace the Territory with? The Falcon is easy it should be replaced by the Taurus or the Lincoln MKS, since they use the D3 platform making a RHD version should be easy as the platform was engineered by Volvo for both LHD and RHD.


User currently offlinecptkrell From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3220 posts, RR: 12
Reply 16, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 2165 times:

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 15):

Yes, kiwirob; my final several years brfore retirement @ GM was heavily envolved in "packaging" vehicles...that is figuring out where stuff goes with an eye on enabling styling intent and tooling and manufacturing means and methods.

The situation with a RHD vs an LFD requires much unigue black metal from the cowl forward, including the cowl "horsecollar" which is the important structure that supports the steering column, brake master cylinder, clutch linkage structures, etc. Then you have HVAC plenums and blower motor. Forward there is, of course, a unique rack and pinion not to mention their supporting structures and possibly a unique anti sway bar, etc. And, if common sense prevails to let the operator refuel on the driver side of the vehicle that would entail two unique rear quarter panels, unique gas tank and filler tubes, not to mention a unique exhaust system routed away from fuel holding/filling. All of this doesn't address unique electrical and other routings, such as return for fuel fumes, etc. After another beer, I could probably think of a few dozen other things like instrument panel, airbags, etc.

One doesn't "swap out" LHD and RHD without tremendous investment, not to mention assembly line sequences. Just thoughts from past experience. As I said before, maybe newest technologies will enable such, but when I was envolved there simply wasn't a justifiable ROI to carry on with interchangeable designs. Best regards...jack



all best; jack
User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7083 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2141 times:

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 16):
And, if common sense prevails to let the operator refuel on the driver side of the vehicle that would entail two unique rear quarter panels, unique gas tank and filler tubes, not to mention a unique exhaust system routed away from fuel holding/filling.

I've not thought of that, although both our cars have the fillers on different sides. Best thing would be having twin tanks with twin fillers like Jaguar XJ6's and Mini Coopers used to have.


User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15707 posts, RR: 26
Reply 18, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2136 times:

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 17):
I've not thought of that, although both our cars have the fillers on different sides. Best thing would be having twin tanks with twin fillers like Jaguar XJ6's and Mini Coopers used to have.

My preference is for the center filler (some cars hide it under the rear license plate) since you have equal access no matter which way you pull up to the pump.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently onlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39668 posts, RR: 75
Reply 19, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 2125 times:

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 10):
I think the Territory is being considered for export to Thailand,

It won't sell well due to the high car tax here in Thailand. The only Ford that sells well here is the Ranger and Everest truck/SUV.
Trucks & SUVs do not have a high tax here in Thailand like the cars. Since this is still largely a agricultural economy and many farm workers are poor, the trucks are exempt from the high tax.
The cars that are made here still have a 60% tax. Imports the tax is over 200%.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8177 posts, RR: 8
Reply 20, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 2115 times:

Sad to see the jobs lost. Australia will not be short of cars for the folks to buy so the real issue is jobs.

Maybe the Labour Government could have come up with a plan to "motivate" Ford to maintain production - but I think the Lady PM is a little off on her budgeting - like a surplus turning into a $20 Billion deficit.

Quoting zkojq (Reply 12):
The Holden fanboys are going to be insufferably smug after this announcement.

And as soon as they open their mouths the Ford fanboys will start talking about GM's bankruptcy.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 18):
My preference is for the center filler (some cars hide it under the rear license plate) since you have equal access no matter which way you pull up to the pump.

The problem there is that you need a higher clearance for lifting luggage and other heavy stuff into the trunk. Toss in the impact bumpers and you increase the issue even more.


User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7083 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 2100 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 18):

My preference is for the center filler (some cars hide it under the rear license plate) since you have equal access no matter which way you pull up to the pump.

When was the last time a car was built with one of those?

Quoting Superfly (Reply 19):

It won't sell well due to the high car tax here in Thailand.
Quoting Superfly (Reply 19):

Trucks & SUVs do not have a high tax here in Thailand like the cars.

What exactly do you think the Territory is? It's an SUV which under what you have posted wouldn't be highly taxed. and it's sold in Thailand already. http://www.ford.co.th/buying/solutions/schedule-service/territory



User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15707 posts, RR: 26
Reply 22, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 2090 times:

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 21):
When was the last time a car was built with one of those?

My dad's 1996 Roadmaster had it. The Singer 911 has a front mounted equivalent, although it seems to have some cost in terms of cargo space.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlinecptkrell From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3220 posts, RR: 12
Reply 23, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 2010 times:

BMW727 and Ken777: I'm thinking center fillers are no-no today because of rear impact situations. I know the U.S. mfgrs shy away from that design packaging now (wow, remember the '56 or was it '57 Chevy with the fuel filler behind the driver side tailight?)...don't even know if any current U.S. vehicles are designed with rear center fuel fillers.

Jaguar-style twin tanks/fillers would be a no-no also because of cost/mfg complexity, etc. and, really, what would be the point? And, BM727, your Dad's Roadmaster wagon had a center filler probably because of packaging (there I go again with that term) meaning that routing a filler neck assembly from the rear quarter panel would have cost some rear load floor space penalty to either side, or maybe added cost of a unique rear wheelhouse fender inner both poor excuses IMHO. BUT, I was working on Corvettes and Camaros when the 'Master was being designed; that baby wasn't done on MY shift!.   . all best...jack



all best; jack
User currently offlinezkojq From New Zealand, joined Sep 2011, 1137 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 2009 times:

Quoting zkojq (Reply 12):
Holden send a fair number of Commodores to the US branded as Pontiac G8s. And to Arabia, branded as Chevrolets of some kind - there are plenty of them in Dubai.

Forgot to mention: they sent them to the UK also, badged as the Vauxhall VXR.

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 15):
Holden has the the Cruze

Apart from the fact that it is little more than a rebadged Daewoo, the Cruze is smaller. More Focus sized than Mondeo sized. The Epica was Mondeo Sized or thereabouts, though it is generally considered to be vastly inferior.
Mondeo (sedan) = 4.84 meters long
Epica = 4.80 meters long
Cruze = 4.6 meters long

Mondeo = 1505-1636kgs
Epica = 1570kgs
Cruze (US Spec, because Holden.com.au doesn't care to tell me) = ~1400kgs

The Mondeo has some larger engine options also.

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 20):
Maybe the Labour Government could have come up with a plan to "motivate" Ford to maintain production - but I think the Lady PM is a little off on her budgeting - like a surplus turning into a $20 Billion deficit.

I think the real problem is the strong/appreciating Australian dollar. The minerals boom is great for the economy except for the way that it strengthens the Aussie dollar. For Ford buyers this makes imports (Mondeos, Focuses etc) cheaper. For holiday resorts in Queensland this makes it much harder to sell holidays to Australians since Bali, Phuket etc become much cheaper. The budget deficit is another issue and is worthy of its own separate thread.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/busi...alued/story-e6frg94o-1226624120260
http://www.smh.com.au/business/marke...alued-currency-20130215-2eho2.html

Quoting melpax (Reply 11):
Might have to look into getting a new Falcon (XR6 Turbo ) before production finishes in 2016.
Quoting Ken777 (Reply 20):
And as soon as they open their mouths the Ford fanboys will start talking about GM's bankruptcy.

 



Someone repaint ZK-PBG!
User currently offlineKen777 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 8177 posts, RR: 8
Reply 25, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 2020 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 19):
The cars that are made here still have a 60% tax. Imports the tax is over 200%.

That is a big motivator to use public transportation.

Quoting zkojq (Reply 24):
The minerals boom is great for the economy except for the way that it strengthens the Aussie dollar.

The minerals boom has also been pretty rough for young people trying to buy their first home in PER.


User currently onlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15707 posts, RR: 26
Reply 26, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 1973 times:

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 23):
And, BM727, your Dad's Roadmaster wagon had a center filler probably because of packaging (there I go again with that term)

The Roadmaster was a sedan. My mom's 1992 Caprice wagon has a standard side fuel filler, and a lower loading height than the Roadmaster, although loading things into it was never a chore. Taking space on the sides of that wasn't an issue, since they stuck some speakers and the spare (full size) opposite the fuel filler.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlineCXB77L From Australia, joined Feb 2009, 2595 posts, RR: 5
Reply 27, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 1984 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CHAT OPERATOR

Quoting zkojq (Reply 12):
It is very difficult to justify having the larger, thirstier, heavier Falcon over the Mondeo. My mother drives a Mondeo and I can see why many would find it preferable over the Falcon.

If the Mondeo had been launched in Australia a year earlier, I probably would've bought a Mondeo over a Falcon when I was in the market for a car.

Quoting okie (Reply 13):
That has to be one of the major issues is the production rate. Ford only sold 14,000 of the Territory last year. If you use that number against a 200 day manufacturing year that is only 70 units per day.

The GM plant here in OKC ran at 70 units per hour 16 hours a day, 224,000 units per year.

I don't think it's fair to compare the production rates of a relatively small Ford Australia division against the might of GM. For a start, Australia is a much, much smaller market than the US, and therefore it does not justify having such a massive production rate, building cars that will inevitably sit on showroom floors for months before being moved on, if at all. The cost of manufacturing in Australia is also significantly higher, so selling fewer units than were produced is not financially viable.

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 15):
Ford did have a solution, the Ecoboost 4 cylinder model was a great car but people wouldn't buy it.

Unfortunately. I've driven the Falcon Ecoboost, and it is a magnificent car. It feels lighter and more nimble than the 4.0-litre six, and my impression is that it is slightly quicker off the mark too. Road tests by car magazines here have clocked the Ecoboost to be around 0.2 seconds slower from 0-100km/h than the six cylinder. In every conceivable way except aural pleasure, the Falcon Ecoboost is a better car than the Falcon six.

That it failed to catch on is testament to Ford Australia's relative lack of marketing of the Falcon Ecoboost. Yes, there are a number of Ecoboost advertisements in media, but not many actually made the buyers aware that this magnificent Ecoboost engine can also be had on the Falcon. This car should've been targeted at the Toyota Camry, Honda Accord and Mazda6 buyers, not the traditional Falcon buyers with the mindset that "only milk and juice comes in 2 litres".

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 15):
Fords other issue is they dropped the wagon, which was much beloved by many fleet users.

I don't agree. The Falcon wagon wasn't a big seller when it was dropped, neither were the long wheelbase Fairlane and LTD models that it was based on. Without a Fairlane and LTD, there would be no wagon.

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 15):
I really think the major problem with the Falcon was a lack of interest from Ford US, this car would have found a market in the US as a replacement for the Crown Vic, and they could have used the LWB LTD as a replacement for the Town Car if they hadn't dumped it

I'd agree with that.

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 15):
Another problem with the Falcon is that it's still based on the AU which was a turn, so in effect I think a lot of buyer still think of it as a polished turd.

Disagree. The only thing "wrong" with the AU series Falcon was that it had polarising looks. By many accounts, it was a fantastic car to drive, and reliable too.

The current model Falcons are very nice to drive, and handles particularly well for a large sedan.

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 15):
I'm curious what they are going to replace the Territory with?

Perhaps the Explorer?



Boeing 777 fanboy
User currently offlinestasisLAX From United States of America, joined Jul 2007, 3280 posts, RR: 6
Reply 28, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 1970 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 14):
They're badged as Luminas. Way better than any Lumina we ever got.

The American made Luminas from the 1990s were popular (approximately 1 million units sold) but absolutely awful to drive, especially the craptastic Lumina APV mini-van - both of which had NOTHING to do with the Chevy Lumina models sold in Africa and the Middle East (which are Holden Commodore badge-engineered vehicles).

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 27):
Perhaps the Explorer?



That was my first reaction, too. The Explorer is really a taller (and somewhat modified chassis) version of the current North American Ford Taurus, The Explorer is more of a successor of the 2007-2009 Taurus "X" station wagon than anything else, in my opinion.

Perhaps if there is a future need in Oz for a full-sized replacement for the Falcon (a vehicle which I personally love and feel that Lincoln should have imported to replace the defunct early 2000's Lincoln LS sedans - and the long-wheelbase Fairlane chassis should have been utilized to underpin the 2002-2003 Lincoln Continental concept sedan.....). the American Taurus could fill the void.

But, the global financial meltdown and exchange rates had already done too much damage to Ford Australia. And I will mourn the loss of the Aussie Ford Falcon.



"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
User currently offlineJJJ From Spain, joined May 2006, 1766 posts, RR: 1
Reply 29, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day ago) and read 1959 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 9):
Trust me, US auto designers have as much consideration for foreign markets as they do for the color preferences of Martian cave-dwelling bacteria.

But their overseas operations don't. The Mondeos, Fiestas, Kugas, etc. were all offered in RHD markets like the UK and Ireland from day one.

Nowadays, being able to produce a car in RHD and LHD versions is a basic requisite except for the most niche manufacturers.


User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7083 posts, RR: 3
Reply 30, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 1 day ago) and read 1956 times:

Quoting zkojq (Reply 24):
Forgot to mention: they sent them to the UK also, badged as the Vauxhall VXR.

But only the performance models and then only a couple of hundred per year, if that.

Quoting zkojq (Reply 24):
I think the real problem is the strong/appreciating Australian dollar. The minerals boom is great for the economy except for the way that it strengthens the Aussie dollar. For Ford buyers this makes imports (Mondeos, Focuses etc) cheaper.

Should have also dropped the cost of imported components, since they weren't exporting much, except to NZ where the exchange rate is still in Fords favour.

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 27):
I don't agree. The Falcon wagon wasn't a big seller when it was dropped, neither were the long wheelbase Fairlane and LTD models that it was based on. Without a Fairlane and LTD, there would be no wagon.

The problem with the LWB Fairlane and LTD is that Ford stopped developing it, they were big sellars in there day, yet Ford conceeded the market to Holden's Statesmand and Caprice when they should have improved the LWB models.


User currently onlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39668 posts, RR: 75
Reply 31, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1924 times:

Quoting Ken777 (Reply 25):
That is a big motivator to use public transportation.

What public transport?
I've never seen farmers use subways and I've never seen a subway go to a farm.
The car tax here has nothing to do with public transportation. The limited subway network in Bangkok is very limited and can't keep up with the growth of an already large city.
That's another topic altogether.

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 21):
What exactly do you think the Territory is?

Never seen one before. Is it car-based or truck-based?



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineCXB77L From Australia, joined Feb 2009, 2595 posts, RR: 5
Reply 32, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1918 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
CHAT OPERATOR

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 30):
The problem with the LWB Fairlane and LTD is that Ford stopped developing it, they were big sellars in there day, yet Ford conceeded the market to Holden's Statesmand and Caprice when they should have improved the LWB models.

Holden has also stopped selling the Statesman, and there's no VF update for the Caprice, so it, too, will end soon. The market for LWB models has disappeared.

Quoting Superfly (Reply 31):
Is it car-based or truck-based?

Car (Falcon) based.



Boeing 777 fanboy
User currently offlinezkojq From New Zealand, joined Sep 2011, 1137 posts, RR: 1
Reply 33, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 1918 times:

I guess it was a good idea to let the Mercedes and Nissans into the V8 Supercars this year so that they can iron out development problems before more of the Ford teams adopt them.
http://www.speedcafe.com/2013/05/23/...-johnson-reacts-to-ford-bombshell/
Quoting Ken777 (Reply 25):
The minerals boom has also been pretty rough for young people trying to buy their first home in PER.

Certainly it would be. At least employment prospects and incomes should be good for them.
Quoting Superfly (Reply 31):
Is it car-based or truck-based?

Car. Same platform as the Falcon.



Someone repaint ZK-PBG!
User currently onlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39668 posts, RR: 75
Reply 34, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 1911 times:

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 32):
Car (Falcon) based.

So it will be taxed like a car here in Thailand, not a truck. The tax exemption only applies to trucks and SUVs, not cars and CUVs.
I just took a look at the Ford Thailand website and that Territory will cost you $90,000.00 USD ! ! ! !  Wow!
That's the same price as a used Toyota Century.
Most people here would rather buy a 2nd hand Mercedes for that price.

[Edited 2013-05-24 03:44:45]


Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7083 posts, RR: 3
Reply 35, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 1903 times:

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 32):
and there's no VF update for the Caprice, so it, too, will end soon.

Yes there was, the updated Caprice is the WN, it uses the VF interior and wheels, it's also sold in Korea, China, the Middle East and North America, I think the LWB actually makes up the majority of Commodore export sales.

Quoting zkojq (Reply 33):
I guess it was a good idea to let the Mercedes and Nissans into the V8 Supercars this year so that they can iron out development problems before more of the Ford teams adopt them.

If Nissan can turn a FWD Altima into a RWD V8 Supercar I sea no reason why Ford can't do the same with the Mondeo or whatever they replace the Falcon with. Chrysler are tipped to join in 2014. I suspect Toyota or Honda will follow soon after. V8 Supercars is a good formula, the cars still look like what you can buy, unlike DTM cars and it's also fairly cheap, especially with the car of the future they are now racing.


User currently offlinecptkrell From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3220 posts, RR: 12
Reply 36, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 1881 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 26):

My bad; somehow I was thinking "in reverse". Well, it has been more than a dozen years for me. Best regards...jack



all best; jack
User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13026 posts, RR: 12
Reply 37, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 1874 times:

For many years, Ford sold rebadged Mazdas in Australia/NZ if I recall correctly. I believe until the 1980's or early 1990's, Australia had a large tax on certain imported cars and parts, so making models and parts within Australia were the only way to make money. For many years, Ford, GM and Chrysler used to ship down the dies of body parts from previous generation NA (US and Canadian) models or Canadian made models and parts (due to Commonwealth trade preference) to Australia. In Australia, they long had their own engines. Due to the limited market, the Aussies only made a limited range and like the USA used to do, only one basic body/chassis for a brand (Iike Chevy did until the early 1960's) so made a 'large' RWD car suitable for the bulk of the market.
Another issue too in Australia was the demise of prejudice toward the Japanese brands as WWII era people died off or realize the Japanese were not the enemy they once were.
The reality is that Ford, like many companies, do not want to make cars unique for certain small, matured and highly competitive markets like Australia, it is cheaper to import for reasons of efficiency and costs. Yes it is an end of an era for Ford, but it was going to happen someday.


User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8785 posts, RR: 24
Reply 38, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 1878 times:

Quoting JJJ (Reply 29):
But their overseas operations don't. The Mondeos, Fiestas, Kugas, etc. were all offered in RHD markets like the UK and Ireland from day one.

Sure, the foreign subsidiaries are fine. But American car designers think of The US as their market - that's it.

For example the vast majority of American cars use English words and abbreviations on dashboard switches and lights, rather than the symbols everyone else uses. On my Lincoln, the Oil Pressure guage says "Oil Pressure", instead of displaying


Our cars aren't even suitable for sale in Mexico - just south of the border. And don't say that exported cars are corrected for this - I once bought a new Chevy Tahoe in Switzerland. Sure, the dials were metric, but all the labels were in, you guessed it, English.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7083 posts, RR: 3
Reply 39, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 1866 times:

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 37):
For many years, Ford sold rebadged Mazdas in Australia/NZ if I recall correctly.

The Mazda 626 was the Telstar and the 323 the Lazer, however the later model Lazers recieved ther own unique bodies and were quit different from the 323.

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 37):
For many years, Ford, GM and Chrysler used to ship down the dies of body parts from previous generation NA (US and Canadian) models or Canadian made models and parts (due to Commonwealth trade preference) to Australia.

Ford did this until the 72 XA which was all Aussie, Holdens had until the Commodore were all Aussie deisgned, the Commodore was an Australianised Opel Commodore, later Commodores were based on the Opel Senator until the VE which was all Aussie once again. Chrysler used the based cars off Plymouth and Dodges but with unique styling until 71 when the VH Valiant arrived, all the smaller cars were derived from Euro models then later Mitsuibishi products. The Chrysler Charger R/T E38 was the greatest muscle car built in Australia IMO, followed byt the Falcon GTHO Phase III.


User currently offlineJJJ From Spain, joined May 2006, 1766 posts, RR: 1
Reply 40, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 1862 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 38):
I once bought a new Chevy Tahoe in Switzerland. Sure, the dials were metric, but all the labels were in, you guessed it, English.

Well, the Tahoe is a pretty much US-only model. I guess it was a grey import which you have to adjust some lights, bumpers, etc. but that's it. For sure it isn't offered in Western Europe (Russia and the Gulf countries are a totally different matter)

The Camaro which is for sale officially does has all the proper international symbols and warning lights.


User currently offlinecptkrell From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3220 posts, RR: 12
Reply 41, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 1858 times:

Quoting JJJ (Reply 40):

I'm thinking most newer U.S. vehicles, at least mid-level and surely higher-end models, have an electronically convertible instrument panel. My new Silverado converts from English to metric and back with a button push, wherteas my '05 Chevy work truck does not. The speeedo dials are marked in both mph and kph and nternational symbols are used on my Z71 also. Good features, I think. regards...jack



all best; jack
User currently offlineDreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 8785 posts, RR: 24
Reply 42, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 1856 times:

Quoting JJJ (Reply 40):
I guess it was a grey import which you have to adjust some lights, bumpers, etc. but that's it.

It was a new car sold by a large GM (Opel) dealer. All legally required mods were apparently done at the factory.



Veni Vidi Castratavi Illegitimos
User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7083 posts, RR: 3
Reply 43, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 1850 times:

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 41):
My new Silverado converts from English to metric and back with a button push
Quoting cptkrell (Reply 41):
The speeedo dials are marked in both mph and kph and nternational symbols are used on my Z71 also.

Which would be necessary for sale in Canada.


User currently offlineFlighty From United States of America, joined Apr 2007, 8392 posts, RR: 3
Reply 44, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 1849 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 9):
Trust me, US auto designers have as much consideration for foreign markets as they do for the color preferences of Martian cave-dwelling bacteria.

Primary customer base for several GM and Ford models is China, not the US. What matters is what Mr. and Mrs. Zhang think, not the Jonses.

I think this is why the '14 Jeep Cherokee is so rounded and er, has very small headlamps.


User currently onlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39668 posts, RR: 75
Reply 45, posted (1 year 1 month 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 1847 times:

Quoting Dreadnought (Reply 38):
On my Lincoln, the Oil Pressure guage says "Oil Pressure", instead of displaying

You now own a Lincoln too?
Welcome to the club!   

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 41):
I'm thinking most newer U.S. vehicles, at least mid-level and surely higher-end models, have an electronically convertible instrument panel. My new Silverado converts from English to metric and back with a button push, wherteas my '05 Chevy work truck does not.

My 1987 Chrysler Lebaron convertible had a fully digital gauge instrument panel that had a single button to chose between US and metric. The electronic voice alert system as also available in Spanish and French.
Celine Dion was in the commercial for the 1987 Lebaron convertible for the Quebec market and it's all in French.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineaerorobnz From Rwanda, joined Feb 2001, 7143 posts, RR: 13
Reply 46, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 1696 times:

Suits me just fine - I've never been a fan of any of the Aussie cars. Now for Holden to close and we will have a clean sweep...I mean, I am sorry for the job loses, but really it's the quality of product for the money, They're not built like BMWs, but nor are they they bargains they once were.

User currently offlinekiwirob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7083 posts, RR: 3
Reply 47, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 1634 times:

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 46):
Now for Holden to close and we will have a clean sweep...I mean,

Toyota are still manufacturing in Australia.


User currently offlinePHLBOS From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 7507 posts, RR: 24
Reply 48, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 1538 times:

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 23):
I'm thinking center fillers are no-no today because of rear impact situations. I know the U.S. mfgrs shy away from that design packaging now (wow, remember the '56 or was it '57 Chevy with the fuel filler behind the driver side tailight?)

IIRC, it was the '56 Chevy that featured that. The rear deck of the '57 was restyled (with sharper, more defined tailfins) and beared no resemblence to its '55/'56 predecessor.

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 23):
don't even know if any current U.S. vehicles are designed with rear center fuel fillers.

IIRC, the last cars to have those were the fore-mentioned 1996 GM RWD B & C-bodies (Buick Roadmaster sedan, Caprice/Impala SS and Cadillac Fleetwood). I believe that GM's RWD full-sizes offered such since 1965; and the A-body mid-sizes offered similar from 1968 through 1977.



"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
User currently offlineRyanairGuru From Australia, joined Oct 2006, 5167 posts, RR: 4
Reply 49, posted (1 year 1 month 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 1459 times:

Quoting kiwirob (Reply 43):
Which would be necessary for sale in Canada

I think that the Canadian sales have a completely different speedo, same as the cars sold in the UK have different speedos to the rest of Europe.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I remember a lot of cars on the European mainland don't even have MPH marked?

Trying to drive in a metric country with a US/UK speedo is a nightmare! When I was driving a US car in Canada I swear to God that I spent more time peering at the speedo trying to read the tiny km/h numbers than I did looking at the road!


(Dodge Avenger btw, I wish Chrysler would bring those babies down here 

[Edited 2013-05-29 05:40:33]


Worked Hard, Flew Right
User currently offlineKaiGywer From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 12213 posts, RR: 35
Reply 50, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 1168 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW
FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 49):
Trying to drive in a metric country with a US/UK speedo is a nightmare! When I was driving a US car in Canada I swear to God that I spent more time peering at the speedo trying to read the tiny km/h numbers than I did looking at the road!

My 2006 Chevy Impala didn't have mph/kph markings on the speedo. Rather it just had numbers, and you'd hit a button on the menu to decide if you wanted to show mph or kph. I played with it a few times, making the speedometer needle bounce back and forth  



911, where is your emergency?
User currently onlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39668 posts, RR: 75
Reply 51, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 1154 times:

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 49):
Trying to drive in a metric country with a US/UK speedo is a nightmare! When I was driving a US car in Canada I swear to God that I spent more time peering at the speedo trying to read the tiny km/h numbers than I did looking at the road!

That is why I like those digital instrument panel gauges of a lot of cars in the 1980s. Just a push of 1 button and the whole system switches to metric.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlinecptkrell From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3220 posts, RR: 12
Reply 52, posted (1 year 1 month 1 week 6 days 9 hours ago) and read 1122 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 51):

Hey, "Fly; I wish my old Opel would have had a button to switch from left-hand drive and right-hand drive between Germany and England   regards...jack



all best; jack
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Alex Trebek To Retire From Jeopardy In 2016 posted Wed Mar 27 2013 08:46:29 by 1337Delta764
Obama, To Impose Gun Control By Decree Part 2 posted Mon Jan 14 2013 18:23:39 by iowaman
Obama, To Impose Gun Control By Decree posted Wed Dec 26 2012 23:53:10 by AR385
Moscow To Nice In 4 Days By Train - New Service posted Wed Sep 15 2010 09:37:29 by oly720man
Australia To Take Japanese Whalers To Court posted Thu May 27 2010 18:18:51 by Springbok747
End Of An Era. My Many Thanks To You All... posted Tue Feb 23 2010 19:37:42 by mirrodie
Dude Trying To Start All-White Basketball League posted Thu Jan 21 2010 09:26:10 by Falcon84
Corporate Facebook To View All Profiles? posted Fri Dec 18 2009 17:34:31 by AirTran737
Washington DC To Have Gay Marriage By End Of 2009 posted Tue Oct 6 2009 17:52:25 by RJpieces
Man Sells Anti-Obama Merchandise-Forced To Close posted Tue Sep 29 2009 11:01:51 by JBirdAV8r