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Microsoft Buys Nokia  
User currently onlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12966 posts, RR: 25
Posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 1759 times:

I thought we had a topic (or sub-topic) on this but can't find it...

What do people think about Microsoft buying Nokia?

On one hand, it shows M$ is extremely serious about wanting to be a part of the mobile revolution.

On the other hand, it shows it has to pay to participate.

It seems to me to be a "small" investment on Microsoft's part, spending $7.2B out of its cash horde of $77B, and in particular using money stranded off-shore.

It also seems to me it won't matter. M$ is too late to the party, and there is so much more momentum in the Apple and Google ecosystems, and not much compelling about the Windows Mobile ecosystem.

Is anyone else nervous about all three software vendors now having their own in-house hardware platforms? I'm thinking this won't spur on innovation.

One thing I liked about Android was that it made it possible to compare hardware with similar software and this seemed to foster more innovation. This of course comes at a cost, a lot of fragmentation. If Android is moving more towards a hardware/software monolith and more restrictions on what software it will run, it won't be as interesting a platform, IMHO.


Inspiration, move me brightly!
15 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineoffloaded From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2009, 905 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1733 times:

So soon when you turn off your Nokia it'll say "updating 1 of 3" and then freeze?

I think Nokia's glory days are gone, and they lost so much ground to competitors eg Crackberry, HTC compared which where they once used to be. Maybe MS can get them back in the game again.



To no one will we sell, or deny, or delay, right or justice - Magna Carta, 1215
User currently offlineseb146 From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 11801 posts, RR: 15
Reply 2, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 1724 times:

Quoting offloaded (Reply 1):
So soon when you turn off your Nokia it'll say "updating 1 of 3" and then freeze?

+1

Someone somewhere thought Nokia/MS is a good idea. Nokia phones run Windows OS. But, I think this will be another Zune. It looks good on paper, but in reality, it will flop.



Life in the wall is a drag.
User currently offlinetugger From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 5787 posts, RR: 10
Reply 3, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 1666 times:

Quoting Revelation (Thread starter):
I thought we had a topic (or sub-topic) on this but can't find it...

There was one, posted by KiwiRob, I was quite annoyed and surprised that it disappeared. I made a post noting the following:

This could be a good move if MS plays it right. There is a huge market now opening in the low cost smartphone market and Nokia can do well there and a "new" OS could work as well.
The key thing to realize is that MS is squeezed between an entrenched "closed" OS ecosystem (iOS) and a free OS (Android). Since the current smartphone markets are already saturated and enmeshed in either iOS or Andriod, Microsoft's real chance is in the low cost smartphone market, but that market is of course heading down the path is of going with free (Android)

MS can't really give away their OS for free and Nokia couldn't sell Windows Phones at low enough price when separate from MS, so now as part of them they can either absorb the cost or they are essentially paying themselves. If they can actually gain traction in the low cost smartphone market, then they will have a chance. Additionally if they can get some integration or crossover with their Xbox games then they will have a market that developers will want to access.

Tugg



I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
User currently onlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12966 posts, RR: 25
Reply 4, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 1643 times:

Quoting tugger (Reply 3):
MS can't really give away their OS for free and Nokia couldn't sell Windows Phones at low enough price when separate from MS, so now as part of them they can either absorb the cost or they are essentially paying themselves. If they can actually gain traction in the low cost smartphone market, then they will have a chance. Additionally if they can get some integration or crossover with their Xbox games then they will have a market that developers will want to access.

Good points. Let's see how it turns out!



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6939 posts, RR: 12
Reply 5, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 1640 times:

But Microsoft is trying the opposite, with an expensive Xbox (100$ more than the PS4 with a less powerful GPU), and sued Google and Android users to raise the cost of Android.

They can't even comprehend the concept of low cost, or free software for that matter (open source).



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlinesrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1625 times:

Microsoft is buying Nokia's mobile phone unit, not the entire company.

To be honest, this was not a big surprise. Google purchased Motorola Mobility for their phones as well as their patent portfolio and this is what Microsoft is doing by acquiring Nokia's mobile phone unit.

Microsoft may not be done just yet with acquisitions, as they are supposedly interested in BlackBerry (or at least some of their assets). There's been multiple names mentioned as potential acquirers of BlackBerry (even before the for sale sign was hung up recently). Lenovo, Samsung, and Sony have been rumored as possible suitors for BlackBerry. BlackBerry's patent portfolio as well as their non-mobile device subsidiaries (Like QNX and The Astonishing Tribe) would definitely be something Microsoft, Lenovo, Samsung, Sony or even Google or Apple would have some interest in.


User currently offlinetugger From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 5787 posts, RR: 10
Reply 7, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1625 times:

Quoting Aesma (Reply 5):
But Microsoft is trying the opposite, with an expensive Xbox (100$ more than the PS4 with a less powerful GPU), and sued Google and Android users to raise the cost of Android.

They can't even comprehend the concept of low cost, or free software for that matter (open source).

Well, with Xbox they are in a dominant market position, with lots of games and lots of players that developers are hungry to sell to. Also open source is not really an issue here, it doesn't need to be to free, and in fact they don't want it to become free, but they can either absorb the cost or the group Nokia is paying them internally. Their primary benefit will come from getting the OS out their in as many hands as possible, and they won't be blatantly giving it away for free, the cost will be a washed cost.

Regarding lawsuits, all of the companies are suing each other for different things. Motorola was acquired for their patent trove more so than their manufacturing and design capability.

If MS can gain access to the low cost smartphone market and get people comfortable using their OS then as those consumers move up they will be more comfortable with the WP OS and even if they don't move up to a more expensive phone, if their are enough of them developers will go after them.

The question is, can MS do it? I really don't know and tend to have my doubts as they screwed up the Surface launch. They should have given a steep discount for the first two years in order to develop a market but they didn't, they imagined they had the same value proposition as the iPad and were completely wrong.

Tugg



I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
User currently offlineKiwiRob From New Zealand, joined Jun 2005, 7838 posts, RR: 5
Reply 8, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 1600 times:

There are a lot of angry Finns over this deal.

User currently offlinetugger From United States of America, joined Apr 2006, 5787 posts, RR: 10
Reply 9, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 1590 times:

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 8):
There are a lot of angry Finns over this deal.

But a lot of happy Nokia shareholders too!

Did you ever discover what happened to your thread on this?

Tugg



I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
User currently onlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12966 posts, RR: 25
Reply 10, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 1500 times:

I'm still quite confused by what I've read.

They seem to be saying that M$ will somehow transition the millions of people using Nokia feature phones onto a Windows Mobile powered smartphone infused with Xbox features?

Seems to me to be optimistic at best.

The reason the feature phones still sell well is they are cheaper to make, simpler to use and have service plans that cost less. There's a large body of people that are happy with feature phones and aren't going to be buying smart phones.

M$'s biggest asset is their dominance of corporate IT. If they could find ways to provide Windows Mobile features that corporate IT departments find compelling they could have an interesting path to growth. The problem is that they are very late to that game, and corporate IT is all ready supporting 'bring your own device' models which corporations love because many of their employees are providing devices and services that the corporation used to have to pay for.

Also their position in corporate IT is not as dominant as it once was. For instance my employer supports Mac at the same level as Windows PCs, something unthinkable five years ago.

Quoting srbmod (Reply 6):
Google purchased Motorola Mobility for their phones as well as their patent portfolio and this is what Microsoft is doing by acquiring Nokia's mobile phone unit.

True, and I will add that Google had already been making their own phones via contract manufacturers.

Quoting tugger (Reply 7):
Well, with Xbox they are in a dominant market position, with lots of games and lots of players that developers are hungry to sell to.

Right, and the press says something about trying to use that asset to speed adoption of Windows Mobile but they really have very little in common, other than perhaps being the one area within M$ that has success with dealing with consumers rather than IT professionals.

Quoting tugger (Reply 7):
Also open source is not really an issue here, it doesn't need to be to free, and in fact they don't want it to become free, but they can either absorb the cost or the group Nokia is paying them internally.

The real issue is innovation. Open source has attracted a lot of innovators. I don't think Microsoft can draw them. Not too many developers I know are looking for a third ecosystem to support.

Quoting tugger (Reply 7):
Motorola was acquired for their patent trove more so than their manufacturing and design capability.

More so? Not exactly sure. M$ is touting the value of having the phone design and manufacturing in house, and as above, Google was already heading towards becoming a phone manufacturer.

Quoting tugger (Reply 7):
If MS can gain access to the low cost smartphone market and get people comfortable using their OS then as those consumers move up they will be more comfortable with the WP OS and even if they don't move up to a more expensive phone, if their are enough of them developers will go after them.

Correct, but Nokia itself has had the same issue for years and has not found a solution, as has Blackberry. It's hard to take a set of customers used to one environment and price point and migrate them to another, especially when there are other mature competing environments for them to migrate to.

Quoting tugger (Reply 7):
The question is, can MS do it? I really don't know and tend to have my doubts as they screwed up the Surface launch. They should have given a steep discount for the first two years in order to develop a market but they didn't, they imagined they had the same value proposition as the iPad and were completely wrong.

It's very hard to make the argument to the corporation that you're going to go out and lose boatloads of money for two years just to get a toe-hold in the market. From what we read it's even harder within M$ where the owners of the cash cow products like Office and Exchange call the shots.

Keep in mind that they're competing in a price sensitive market with people like Apple who have had the suppliers battling for their business for years, or Samsung who is one of those suppliers. No one wants M$ to get their foot into the door.

Add to that the fact that as you say they do not have the same value proposition as does Apple or Andriod devices and they have huge problems.



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlineAesma From France, joined Nov 2009, 6939 posts, RR: 12
Reply 11, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 1479 times:

Quoting srbmod (Reply 6):
To be honest, this was not a big surprise. Google purchased Motorola Mobility for their phones as well as their patent portfolio and this is what Microsoft is doing by acquiring Nokia's mobile phone unit.

Nokia kept its patents though, M$ only got a 10 year license.

Quoting tugger (Reply 7):
Their primary benefit will come from getting the OS out their in as many hands as possible, and they won't be blatantly giving it away for free, the cost will be a washed cost.

Well, I don't see how they can do that better by owning Nokia, as opposed to slashing the price of the OS so that HTC, Samsung and co could offer cheaper Windows smartphones. As with Surface and Windows RT, all M$ has managed to do by manufacturing itself and competing with its partners is piss them off, they're all gone.

Google is making phones but is not trying to be a big player other than with the OS, they don't advertise much and I don't think I've ever seen a Google phone to be honest.



New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
User currently offlineAcheron From Spain, joined Sep 2005, 1723 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 1470 times:

Quoting srbmod (Reply 6):
To be honest, this was not a big surprise. Google purchased Motorola Mobility for their phones as well as their patent portfolio and this is what Microsoft is doing by acquiring Nokia's mobile phone unit.

Except not.

Nokia's parent company gets to keep the patents and M$ will be licensing them for the phones. They effectively turned Nokia into a non-practicing entity free to sue everybody it pleases over patents.


User currently onlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12966 posts, RR: 25
Reply 13, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 1469 times:

Quoting Aesma (Reply 11):
Well, I don't see how they can do that better by owning Nokia, as opposed to slashing the price of the OS so that HTC, Samsung and co could offer cheaper Windows smartphones.

No one else wants to build Windows devices, regardless of the price of the OS.

Most of the reports say that Nokia is losing money in the handset business and M$ had to buy that business to keep the one remaining Windows Mobile product line afloat.



Inspiration, move me brightly!
User currently offlineSAS A340 From Sweden, joined Jul 2000, 788 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 1311 times:

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 8):
There are a lot of angry Finns over this deal.

They compare it to losing against Sweden in hockey ... it hurts apparently 
I honestly feel like I no longer know any owning a Nokia, it's just Apple and Samsung now Days......



It's not what u do,it's how u do it!
User currently onlineRevelation From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 12966 posts, RR: 25
Reply 15, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 1296 times:

Quoting SAS A340 (Reply 14):
I honestly feel like I no longer know any owning a Nokia, it's just Apple and Samsung now Days......

One of the cooler things about the Android ecosystem is if you want to try out the Windows Phone look and feel you can find a bunch of apps to try it out:

http://play.google.com/store/search?...ws%20launcher&c=apps&hl=en

Have read reviews of a few of these and they seem to deliver that Metro look and feel, if that's what you are after.

Someone else will have to talk to the Apple approach to this. I've been told this is one area they do not offer as much customization as does Android.



Inspiration, move me brightly!
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