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Best Cars : Facts  
User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3682 posts, RR: 4
Posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 6134 times:

As I can see, it's the new important question in this forum: who makes the best cars ?

I'm sorry for you dears, but the Magazine AUTO PLUS who tested OBJECTIVELY French, Italian, German and Japanese cars (the 4 better countries), gave the most points to French cars.
The criteria were not the top speed, or the look, or the ability to impress your friends - which seems to be the most important in the US - but fuel economy, reliability, comfort, price, efficiency, ...
Tests were made for each different category, France won most of them.

Sorry guys.

PS: Auto plus is owned by a German group and is regularly suspected of favoritism for German cars.

53 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineMarcus From Mexico, joined Apr 2001, 1808 posts, RR: 2
Reply 1, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 6076 times:

French cars won?.......really?.....whatever happened to:

Heaven is having:
A French wife and a German car

Hell is having:
A German wife and a French car



Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
User currently offlineCaptaingomes From Canada, joined Feb 2001, 6413 posts, RR: 55
Reply 2, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 6060 times:

Sobelino, you're going to have a hard time with this one. The Americans on this board will recall how crappy older French cars were, and will assume that current French cars haven't progressed beyond that point. It's the same thing with diesel powered cars, they still think of the old 1980's cars that were diesel powered and automatically assume current diesels are the same.

In any case, I have been in French cars recently, and they have improved a lot. They used to have really flexible bodies, with soft but poorly damped suspensions, but really soft seats to absorb impacts (and make me car sick). But the latest ones I've been in are much nicer cars, even if some of them are nasty to look at.



"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
User currently offlineFlight152 From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 3413 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 6081 times:

ROFLMAO!  Laugh out loud  Laugh out loud  Laugh out loud

Ohhh yes, those Renaults surely have the "the look, or the ability to impress your friends ".  Yeah sure

*Dripping with sarciasm*


User currently offlineN312RC From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 2683 posts, RR: 16
Reply 4, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 3 hours ago) and read 6078 times:

Sorry. I wouldnt take an ugly Renault over a BMW.. nope.


N/A
User currently offlineWn700driver From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6065 times:

If you want to run numbers in terms of everything from build quality to performance & have your criteria for best car be based just on facts, the best car out there that I've yet seen is the Infinity G35 (they have these in America. Does anyone know what it is marketed as in Europe & the UK --haven't been home in a while--). If however, fuel econ & aquistion price are not a concern to you, than that title goes to BMW's M5. That automobile is truly the best car ever, if such a thing can be said to exist, bar none.

User currently offlineGD727 From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 925 posts, RR: 10
Reply 6, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6064 times:

I'm sorry for you dears, but the Magazine AUTO PLUS who tested OBJECTIVELY French, Italian, German and Japanese cars (the 4 better countries) The four BETTER countries?! Hahahahaha! American cars are FAR superior to ANY of these countries' carmakers!

AMERICAN CARS RULE!!!!!  Big thumbs up

-GD727



Mmmm forbidden donut.
User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3682 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6078 times:

Was it this one the ugly Renault ?











User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3682 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6050 times:

You're right, American cars rules the economy of oil companies. They are far from the best.

User currently offlineSilverangel From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6057 times:

GD727,

They already have like 3 forums for American cars. I think this one will be filled with import junkies. By the Way, I've seen a lot of your posts. I am curious, what do you drive?

~~Lori


User currently offlineGD727 From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 925 posts, RR: 10
Reply 10, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 6052 times:

Oh right. American cars suck because they don't get excellant gas mileage. Did it ever occur to you that a car does not have to have good gas mileage to be a good car?

-GD727



Mmmm forbidden donut.
User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 40071 posts, RR: 74
Reply 11, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6025 times:

It isn't very often that I agree with N312RC & GD727 but I just can't imagine a French car coming ahead of Britain, Germany and the U.S.

I still will say the United States makes the best cars & trucks. I think the French DO make some interesting designs and I would gladly buy one over a German car. I am really sick of German cars and there owners. Extreme arrogance and just plain stupid drivers at least here in San Francisco drive those things. I see nothing special or anything that stands out on the bmw & mercedes. especially the newer ones . They (drivers) run the most red lights and drive down the wrong way on a one-way street. It's funny watching how they still cop an attitude when they are busted by the police or have their cars towed for parking in a 'no parking zone'. I swear, they must think the world revolves around them and are exempt from the laws that everyone else has to follow.
At least the British cars evoq some class & prestige with there attention to detail designs. I'll take a Jaguar over a bmw/mercedes in a second!

I am a big fan of diesel-powered engines and I think more cars should come with available diesel engines. I think it should be the only engine available for SUVs.




These Citroën SM looks neat and makes a stronger statement than some cliche bmw.




Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineCaptaingomes From Canada, joined Feb 2001, 6413 posts, RR: 55
Reply 12, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6029 times:

What objective measures do you have that would support the argument that American cars are far superior, other than personal opinion or quarter mile times, or the fact that you claim to have smoked many "rice" cars? Because from objective measures, at least here in North America, the best cars are predominantly Japanese cars, due to their recorded reliability, and how they combine size, features, price, etc all into one package.

For some people, American cars are better suited, for me German cars satisfy me more, but for most, the Japanese trully provide the most logical choices here in North America, and it might very well be that in Europe, the best designed cars for their purposes are French cars.

Sobelino, that Renault isn't too bad (is that the Megane?), but try the Avantissimo. What a nasty thing that is!



"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3682 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6023 times:

Superfly, why are you showing a 30 years old French car ? In case you don't know, they have changed since that time.


CaptainGomes, the car you're talking about is the Avantime. It's ugly indeed. I don't like especially Renault cars, I prefer Peugeot and also VW.

Have a look at this:










 

 






User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3682 posts, RR: 4
Reply 14, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6015 times:

That is the Laguna 2.

User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 40071 posts, RR: 74
Reply 15, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 5999 times:

Sebolino:
I like those 30 year old cars.  Smile
Those new pictures you posted were nice too.

I am sure French cars are better than Russian/Soviet cars.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3682 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days ago) and read 6012 times:

"I am sure French cars are better than Russian/Soviet cars"

I was close to pour my coffee on my knees when I read that.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


User currently offlineLOT767-300ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days ago) and read 6015 times:

Sebolino....

"It isn't very often that I agree with N312RC & GD727 but I just can't imagine a French car coming ahead of Britain, Germany and the U.S."

I agree with the 3 of you and its not often that I agree with Jason on cars......

It makes me laugh that a Peugot, Renault and Citroen make better cars than BMW, Mercedes and Audi........


User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3682 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days ago) and read 6005 times:

Depends on what you call better.
The journalists that rated the cars are professionals.

Mercedes won the category "road cars" (big cars).
If you don't see small cars, Monospace, compact cars as cars, then of course you can't understand the test.


User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3682 posts, RR: 4
Reply 19, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days ago) and read 5994 times:

Oh no !! My mistake. Renault won the category.

Here are the results, I let you judge:

- City cars (small cars) : France with the Renault Clio (121 pts), the Ford fiesta has 120 points
- Compact cars (medium cars) : France with the Peugeot 307.
- Compact monospaces (untranslatable) : Japan with the Toyota Corolla Verso.
- Family cars : Germany (!!) with the Ford Mondeo (Ford is seen as German in Europe).
- Road cars : France with the Renault Vel Satis 3,5 l 245 HP (126 pts). The Mercedes E320 is second with 124 points. Its main problem is the price (52000 Euros vs 47000).
- Monospaces : France with the Peugeot 807.


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 40071 posts, RR: 74
Reply 20, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days ago) and read 5998 times:

I am sure the build quality of the German cars are better, they just look so ordinary.
At least the French cars stand out like a sore thumb in some cases , now if the French can get them to run without problems then there may be some competition.

French cars are just a little better than Russian cars.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3682 posts, RR: 4
Reply 21, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days ago) and read 5992 times:

You're right Superfly on 1 point:

The German cars are better for the details quality and overall quality. But they are too expensive (German salaries).

The second point is .... hmmm .... arguable.


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 40071 posts, RR: 74
Reply 22, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days ago) and read 5987 times:

Sebolino:
I was giving credit to the British for 'detail'.
The German cars are build well but are just waaaaaaaaaaay over-priced and don't look all that impressive.

For European cars, look at the Jaguar Vanden Plas.
Now that is pure elegance and power.  Smokin cool



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3682 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (12 years 5 months 4 days ago) and read 5981 times:

Jaguar makes beautiful cars, that's true. Unfortunately, you don't have many occasions to drive it, as it is always at the repair shop or whatever you call a 'garage'. (that's true).

User currently offlineCaptaingomes From Canada, joined Feb 2001, 6413 posts, RR: 55
Reply 24, posted (12 years 5 months 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 5962 times:

It's one of the quality of German cars. They don't scream out at people and yell "hey look at me!" Unfortunately, some of the owners of those cars, especially the BMW 3 series do that themselves. Too bad, because the car is exceptional.


"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
25 Staffan : So what is best? best value? best quality? best price? best reliability? best looks? The newer French cars have proven to be great value for the money
26 Lubcha132 : peugeots are nice, and damn i love those old Citroens. Renault- some cars are ok.
27 Sophiemaltese : I don't even know which French cars are available here. Also, a lot of cars may be reliable in France but not here because nobody knows how to service
28 KFRG : Yeah, Sebolino, explain to me why Peugeot pulled out of America in 1992? Yeah, superior my ass. Although, I have to give the Peugeot 206 credit in bei
29 RayChuang : Sebolino, I think the French term monospace translates to what we call a van. The best definition of the small monospace vehicle is the Renault Megan
30 Alessandro : I drive daily the Citroën DS (Superfly´s 2nd pic) and its nice. PSA (Peugeot-Citroën) is the 2nd car manufacturer (VW group biggest) in europe and
31 Post contains images Notar520AC : It's also very interesting to look at the American Consumer Reports- very interesting... If I was buying a car my largest issue would be- is it going
32 Sebolino : Peugeot is now the 6th manufacturer I think. Why they don't sell in the US ? Simple: bad reputation and I guess a bit of anti-French sentiment. It wil
33 Alessandro : Thats the same reason US cars sales slump in many parts of the world, bad reputation (high prize, poor quality, expensive parts and high fuel consumpt
34 Sebolino : The reason why American cars are even not available in Europe is mainly their size and their fuel consumption. How can you own a 5+ meters car in Euro
35 KFRG : Seblolino, BS, the Explorer, Jeep Cherokee, Voayager/Caravan, are all available as regular build models in Europe. I have even seen a Chevy Z73 Pickup
36 Racko : You can't really do a test or a review of a car, it's too much personal preference. French cars have improved over the last years, but they still have
37 Post contains images Airsicknessbag : Aaah, the Goddess... French cars were always stylish and very avantgarde - you´re going to love them or hate them, it´s pretty much impossible to be
38 Post contains images EGGD : For flare I'd say Italy, and for Excellent all round ... just great cars i'd say Germany. What the fcuk? some sort of biased test saying that French c
39 Post contains images Racko : That about Italian cars. Their sports cars look great, but they have a horribly unreliable.
40 Alessandro : German cars had their fair share of problems here in Sweden, first the VW Passat had brakes that didn´t work good in damp, slushy,snowy weather and t
41 Post contains images Sebolino : And the winners are ......
42 Post contains images Superfly : Racko: That last car you posted reminded me of the AMC Pacer (1975-1980).
43 Post contains images Skystar : I don't know whether I'd say France makes the best cars, but they do make very good value cars. They have probably been the only country to most consi
44 Post contains images Racko : Skystar, is that thing for real ? Does Renault really sell such an ugly car ? The back looks like they merged two totally different cars ... About in
45 Post contains images Lubcha132 : egads! its worse than the back of the new BMW 7 series! the new 7 isn't that bad except for the back. it looks like they forgot about it until the end
46 Post contains images Skystar : The 7 series is just hopeless, nothing breathtaking, just in my opinion, poorly proportioned, fat, overweight looking walrus like styling The Megane i
47 Post contains images Superfly : I'll give the French some credit for making there cars look different. If I was in Europe I would get one just for the novelty of driveing a European
48 Captaingomes : I-Drive is definitely not wonderful. Now instead of having a function operated by a button, you have to work your way down a menu down a computer scre
49 Sebolino : If you speak in "absolute" quality, of course French cars are not the best. You'll always find a Mercedes or an Audi which is better. But one of the c
50 Racko : 25% is too much for the price imho. In many German tests (not specially cars) you have an overall-winner and a Value-for-your-money winner , so one it
51 Wn700driver : I like the I-drive, but am not impressed with the dashboard on console styling in the 7. That Benz interior looks much nicer.
52 Greg : For those that have an opinion on the i-Drive...you need to actually use it first. I don't think many of you actually have. It's quick and intuitive..
53 Post contains images RayChuang : In regards to the new Renault Megané hatchbacks--they're definitely UGLY. The rear-styling can only be described as the less said the better. And wor
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