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N. Korean Ship Carrying Scud Missiles  
User currently offlineUal747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1277 times:

Seems that things in this upcoming war might get interesting, or rather more dangerous. What to do with N. Korea?

http://www.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/asiapcf/east/12/10/ship.boarding/index.html

UAL747

51 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineWe're Nuts From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5722 posts, RR: 19
Reply 1, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1257 times:

Obviously we have to invade them, just like everyone else.


Dear moderators: No.
User currently offlineSuper Em From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 448 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1256 times:

So Iraq went bust and now our focus shifts to N. Korea. The distractions continue.

User currently offlineUal747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1245 times:

We're nuts, how'd I know you'd post something like that.....lol.

I doubt we are going to invade N Korea, Iraq, yes, but N Korea, no.

UAL747


User currently offlineTwaneedsnohelp From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1238 times:

Why did the Spanish intercept the boat so quickly? If they had let it be and just tracked it - we would have foudn where it was headed?

TNNH


User currently offline777236ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1233 times:

The Spanish heard there were Jews on board TNNH. The EU demanded that the ship be impounded.

 Insane


User currently offlineB757300 From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 4114 posts, RR: 22
Reply 6, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1216 times:

Nah, we won't invade North Korea. We'll just nuke 'em. Laugh out loud


"There is no victory at bargain basement prices."
User currently offlineTWAL1011 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 206 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1215 times:

So Iraq went bust and now our focus shifts to N. Korea. The distractions continue.

So are you implying that the CIA planted those missles on that boat under a direct order from Bush? It's about the only thing that could support that B.S. you just posted.


User currently offlineWe're Nuts From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5722 posts, RR: 19
Reply 8, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 1208 times:

So are you implying that the CIA planted those missles on that boat under a direct order from Bush? It's about the only thing that could support that B.S. you just posted.

You have quite an imagination! I can't possibly see how you came to that conclusion.



Dear moderators: No.
User currently offlineTWAL1011 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 206 posts, RR: 1
Reply 9, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 12 hours ago) and read 1187 times:

Well, I think the implication is quite clear. In order to distract, you need a diversion. No?

User currently offlineAviatsiya From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 1173 times:

Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld last week called North Korea the "single biggest proliferator of ballistic missiles" and said the communist nation is "a danger to the world."

A danger to the world? Or a danger to the American military machine who because of North Korean missile sales is losing business which it thinks only it is entitled to?

President Bush's national security adviser, Condoleezza Rice, earlier this year called North Korea a "merchant for ballistic missile technology" and said Pyongyang was willing to sell the weapons "to just about anybody who will buy."

What international laws prohibit Country A from selling Country B military hardware, if Country B is willing to pay for it?

"The North Koreans have been known to go around with glossy brochures about their ballistic missiles. They're stocking a lot of the world right now," Rice said.

So do American companies. Take a look at the literature available at various arms shows around the world, especially the salon held in Dubai. So whats the point?

On the other hand, it did not appear the Bush administration intends to take punitive action against Yemen, which has been cooperating in the war on terror.

Punitive action for what? Isn't Yemen fully entitled to buy military hardware for its armed forces?

Different people are needed in the White House I think. Or at least journalists with the balls to ask questions such as these is needed.


User currently offlineAlpha 1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 1168 times:

Different people are needed in the White House I think. Or at least journalists with the balls to ask questions such as these is needed..

Or maybe different posters who don't apologize for and kiss the asses of nations like North Korea and Iraq, even when caught red-handed with weapons that are not defensive. Amazing, how fast the usual crowd is on here to dismiss any culpability of North Korea, or even QUESTION why a North Korea "pirate ship" is delivering Scuds to somewhere in the Middle East or Africa.

At least, Aviatsiya, you didn't blame Pan Am for this one.


User currently offlineVafi88 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 3116 posts, RR: 17
Reply 12, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 1160 times:

We talked about this in our Geography class....Well, America says no missiles and stuff, and tries to cut other countries from building/testing/exporting, while America builds/tests/exports them all of the time.....Go figure...


I'd like to elect a president that has a Higher IQ than a retarted ant.
User currently offlineAviatsiya From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 1138 times:

Alpha 1

I do believe that Iraq needs to be disarmed (if he does still have WMD). But face facts, Saddam is no worse today than he was when he was being armed and openly supported by "the West". But I guess his digressions whilst receiving "Western" support were overlooked, as long as those digressions were taking out those evil Iranians.

North Korea is a different story.

You say that they have been caught red-handed with missiles which are not defensive.

Please do show me the international law which says that North Korea can not have offensive weapons. Because if there is such a law, what is America, Russia, China, Israel, UK, etc still doing with them? Add all of these countries to the "rogue states" list shall we?

I will now hear some arguments from various people citing old lines such as:

1) North Korea is using the missiles for blackmail
* Well inherently, that is what armed forces are for. You better not attack us because we have Weapon ABC. Or you better do what we say because we can do this to you with Weapon XYZ.

2) North Korea is aiming these weapons and threatening its neighbours in Asia
* Well, Japan, South Korea and American forces in those countries also have even worse weapons (read: nuclear) aimed at North Korea. So whats the big deal

Also, Alpha1, can you please show to me where I have blamed Pan Am for anything?


User currently offlineN202PA From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1562 posts, RR: 3
Reply 14, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 1129 times:

Also, can you please show to me where I have blamed Pan Am for anything?

Username: Aviatsiya
Respect Rating: 52
Posted 2002-12-08 07:48:36 and read 408 times.

How many of you know that Pearl Harbour was caused as a result of actions by none other than Pan American World Airways in the Pacific?


User currently offlineAviatsiya From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 1115 times:

HAHAH....yeah right. If that is what you came up with, you guys need to go back to school and learn the meanings of basic words in the English language.

BLAME

*To hold responsible.
*To find fault with; censure.
*To place responsibility for (something): blamed the crisis on poor planning.

CAUSE

*To be the cause of or reason for; result in.
*To bring about or compel by authority or force: The moderator invoked a rule causing the debate to be ended.

Using these 2 words in a sentence.

The aircraft crash was caused by the wing falling off. The blame for the wing falling off lies with the engineer because he forgot to tighten a screw.

So I ask the question again, please so me where I have blamed Pan Am for anything!!

Maybe I should wait until certain people pass their 3rd grade English class first though?


User currently offlineTbar220 From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7013 posts, RR: 26
Reply 16, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 1100 times:

Aviatsiya,

You're joking right? I'm not reading the above am I? You stuck your foot down your throat nearly to your stomach with that comment in the other thread, and now you're nitpicking on word selection? Goodness, this is definitely a new tactic in the history of the a.net discussion boards.

Oh, and nice insult at the end. Can you debate a little better than that? And yes, I did pass my 3rd grade English class.



NO URLS in signature
User currently offlineZauberfloete From Austria, joined Nov 2000, 302 posts, RR: 0
Reply 17, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 1097 times:

North Korea tried to smuggle medium range missiles to a country or an organization in the middle east.

What comes from the usual anti-us bashers:
"What international laws prohibit Country A from selling Country B military hardware, if Country B is willing to pay for it?"

Wouldn´t you know it? Now North Korea just sold missiles to another country, and the ship transported this legal shipment.
Off course.
And because this sale and shipment was a legal one, they camouflaged it as a cement transport?
If that is legal trade why mask it with wrong papers?

"So do American companies. Take a look at the literature available at various arms shows around the world, especially the salon held in Dubai. So whats the point?" - oh really?
That is the normal way such deals are made?
I tell you what - when a US company sold Blackhawk helicopters to the austrian airforce, the helicopters arrived onboard a freight plane as "S70-Helicopters".
They didn´t arrive as a load of raw iron onboard a ship.

I think that issue shows that Mr. Bush was right in his axis-of-evil speech. And it shows more and more.......and that is it what really hurts some people.


User currently offlineBizJets From France, joined Jun 2005, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 1087 times:

The aircraft crash was caused by the wing falling off. The blame for the wing falling off lies with the engineer because he forgot to tighten a screw.


I don't think the wing isn't the only thing that needs a screw tightning.

Mr. Aviatsiya, with that "unfortunate" comment, you have just been added to my Disrespected Users list.  Smile


User currently offlineAlpha 1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 1077 times:

Aviatsiya, you have lost all credibility now. You posted on the Pearl Harbor post that the whole God damned conflict was the fault of Pan Am, which, in and of itseslf, was one of the lamest, dumbest and outright hysterical things ANYONE has ever typed on here.

But then you have the absolute balls to come on here and say you didn't do so? Grow up, will you? At least take some responsibility for things you type on here. You said that, and now own up to it, will you.

You're getting worse than Neil ever was on here-he'd say something, then a day later, he'd have all kinds of trouble recalling what he said, until it was pointed out to him in plain english. You've really killed your credibility to day, son.


User currently offlineBen From Switzerland, joined Aug 1999, 1391 posts, RR: 50
Reply 20, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1066 times:

Mr. Aviatsiya, with that "unfortunate" comment, you have just been added to my Disrespected Users list


1. Since Mr. Aviatsiya isn't a know-it-all teenage armchair general, Im not convinced that he's going to be worried about a lack of respect from anyone here  Wink/being sarcastic

2. Id love to know how you lot are going to answer Mr Aviatsiya's question above: What international laws prohibit Country A from selling Country B military hardware, if Country B is willing to pay for it? .....and why does the USA see itself as having to 'authorise' every arms deal before it can go ahead?

3. The government of the USA needs to learn some diplomacy skills: Firstly Iran and North Korea were about to normalise relations, everything was looking good and then came the "Axis of Evil Speach"... and now calling them a "Danger to the World"? Years and years of hard work are now down the toilet! for what? One friggin Bushism soundbite! How exactly is that going to make them do what you say? Spread peace and understanding? Help non-proliferation?

It's clear that the USA needs an enemy right now, to keep the arms manufacturers in business and to keep the normal everyday dumb people (who all have votes) under the impression that GW is a 'hero' for flighting all the evil in the world. Good on ya Dubya! Youre my hero too  Insane

The American economy NEEDS an enemy... and now you cant even find a good quality enemy like the Russians were.


User currently offlineManni From South Korea, joined Nov 2001, 4221 posts, RR: 22
Reply 21, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 1060 times:

Ual747 wrote,

'Seems that things in this upcoming war might get interesting'

Upcoming war? What upcoming war? Did I mis something?

777236ER wrote,

'The Spanish heard there were Jews onboard TNNH, the EU demmanded that the ship be impounded'

Hahahaha 777236ER, that's a classic, no more questions asked!

B757300

'Nah, we wont invade N.Korea we just nuke them'

Even if it is meant to be funny, this is a really sad thing to say.



SUPPORT THE LEBANESE CIVILIANS
User currently offlineN202PA From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1562 posts, RR: 3
Reply 22, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 1052 times:

The aircraft crash was caused by the wing falling off. The blame for the wing falling off lies with the engineer because he forgot to tighten a screw.

I don't think that's an accurate comparison to what you wrote. I think a more accurate statement would be the following:

"The drunk driver drove crossed the median and plowed into a school bus full of kids, killing five."

The cause of the deaths would be the drunk driver crossing the median (or, in the case of WWII, the actions that you allege PA took). The blame for the deaths would be placed on the drunk driver (or PA, according to the implication of your statement).


User currently offlineTwaneedsnohelp From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1032 times:

As I read today, legally the US and Spain had every right to board and investigate the boat because it was, as the Spanish put it, a "pirate" vessel in that it had no official flag or formal national affiliation. Anyone could have boarded the boat. So that puts that issue to rest.

Next, I asked why the Spanish intercepted the vessel so far from Yemeni waters. That answer was also provided today. This was undetaken allow the Yemenis to save face. If the US or Spanish intercepted the boat 10-50 miles off the Yemeni coast - it would be a clear slap in the face to Yemen. By intercepting it near Yemen but possibly en route somewhere else, the US gave the Yemenis the chance to deny it.

Why one might ask? Quite simply, Yemen has becoming an important American aly in the War on Terror and while US-Yemeni relations have rocky in the past, the US has no interest in ruining them further. Yemen has long been a safe haven for Islamist terrorists - everyone from Al Qaida to Hamas - the US and aparently the current Yemeni government have an interest in changing this.

So, the US stopped the ship, Yemen first denied it, then after high-level consultations admitted it was their arms, and the US in the interest of maintaining friendly ties between the two, allowed the ship to sail on to Yemen.

The scuds are expected to be used for the Yemeni military - despite their promises to the US this past February (when the US intercepted Scud parts en route to Yemen) they would make no efforts to acquire the missiles or build a Scud missile program.

Interesting developments. Let's hope US military inteligence keeps a close eye on these weapons. I have a fealing Israel will too.

TNNH


User currently offlineSwissgabe From Switzerland, joined Jan 2000, 5266 posts, RR: 33
Reply 24, posted (11 years 11 months 2 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 1023 times:

What is the big story? It was a legal deal and the ship is on his way to Jemen.
End of the story ...



Smooth as silk - Royal Orchid Service /// Suid-Afrikaanse Lugdiens - Springbok
25 Zauberfloete : It was not a legal deal, because a legal deal is not covered by hundreds of sacks of cement. The load was declared as cement, not as "Medium Range Mis
26 Tbar220 : What's the big deal? 1. The ship was unregistered. 2. The cargo was registered as cement. 3. The scuds were hidden in concrete. 4. If this was a legal
27 Swissgabe : CNN: "There is no provision under international law prohibiting Yemen from accepting delivery of missiles from North Korea," White House spokesman Ari
28 Zauberfloete : Anyway you slice it - you don't hide something that is legal with that effort. That Mr. Fleischer said it that way is of no surprise at all, the US di
29 Alpha 1 : Saddam is no worse today than he was when he was being armed and openly supported by "the West" The only nation, Aviatsiya, that has openly armed him
30 Swissgabe : Alpha 1 (and Zauberfloete fyi) Read it again: "There is no provision under international law prohibiting Yemen from accepting delivery of missiles fro
31 Alpha 1 : "There is no provision under international law prohibiting Yemen from accepting delivery of missiles from North Korea," White House spokesman Ari Flei
32 Swissgabe : Alpha 1 I think it is in your nature always to have the last word. I refer to my last sentence. cheers
33 Alpha 1 : That last sentence made no sense whatsoever Swissgabe. None at all, so why should I refer to it? It has no bearing on anything. Cut to the chase, here
34 Post contains images Indianguy : What international laws prohibit Country A from selling Country B military hardware, if Country B is willing to pay for it? None. The MTCR, as it sta
35 Post contains links and images Aviatsiya : Alpha 1, in regards to your retort to my statement. Please read what I wrote again: But face facts, Saddam is no worse today than he was when he was b
36 Krushny : Just to add some perspective, let me tell you how this incident has been seen in the media of one of the protagonists' countries (Spain) . On one han
37 Aviatsiya : Krushny Nowhere on this thread has anyone "bashed" either America or Spain for boarding the ship. So your comment about US-bashers doesn't hold much w
38 Twaneedsnohelp : They do. Numerous posters have questioned what "the big deal was" and why the US was "meddling in the region". Please re-read the thread a little more
39 Ual747 : Inded, Mr. Aviatsiya does so much bashing himself, that he can hardly notice when others do it. Seems really funny. UAL747
40 Post contains images Aviatsiya : TNNH I read every post in detail on this thread after reading Krushny's comment about US-bashing. And in relation to what Krushny wrote about any coun
41 KFRG : The point is that American companies are losing business. The north Koreans and the Russians make the best military hardware and at quite affordable
42 Boeing4ever : The point is that American companies are losing business. The north Koreans and the Russians make the best military hardware and at quite affordable p
43 Post contains images Indianguy : Gee. I know nothing about military technology. B4E: You know everything! Those Scuds are pathetic compared to the Tomohawk cruise missile. Yeah Yeah.
44 KFRG : From the sounds of it, mabye you do as you come off very biased sounding. With that I don't think anyone should take you very seriously.
45 Staffan : "Compare this to the expensive trash that their own companies churn out (like the $2bn a piece “Stealth Bomber” flying junk which is invisible onl
46 Post contains images Boeing4ever : Gee. I know nothing about military technology. B4E: You know everything! Those Scuds are pathetic compared to the Tomohawk cruise missile. Yeah Yeah.
47 Post contains images Indianguy : ABM's latest rounds in July did infact hit their targets. Now, your statement that they only hit targets fired at them, is, well, stupid. The so-call
48 Aviatsiya : Let me ask you all one question. You have been threatened with a missile strike against you, which would you prefer hit your house (with you inside)?
49 Eg777er : Duh..........the reason you hide missile shipments is so your enemies cannot destroy your very expensive recent purchase! Transporting brand new missi
50 Alpha 1 : Duh..........the reason you hide missile shipments is so your enemies cannot destroy your very expensive recent purchase! Duh, Eg777ER, how often are
51 Post contains images Boeing4ever : The last such test was held the day before. It failed. *sigh*. Anyone have a link to a National Missile Defense Program website? Let's all take a look
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