Vafi88 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 3116 posts, RR: 18 Posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 2351 times:
Today came into Band class with my friend who wanted to talk to me about something...I ask what it was, and he said that he just became a member of some youth group which was christian, and eventhough he had been christian all of his life, he just now finally got into it and tried to get me to come...
Me, being a natural athiest, tried to talk my way out of it politely, because it was my friend who was talking to me, but I couldn't he really wants me to come, but I can't and said that I can't, but this guy just won't give up!
He told me a bunch of stories from the bible and I was willing to listen because I never let a learning experience down, but still had a fact in mind which was that I wasn't going to step a foot inside a church.
I'm thinking of a way of getting out of it POLITELY since it is my friend and not harm him or his religious beliefs...
Bear in mind...THIS IS NOT A RELIGIOUS WAR! DON'T MAKE IT ONE!!!
Just help me out with this one, please!
Any help appreciated, if you're here just to post something stupid....don't, as I don't appreciate stupid sh*t in my time of need, and neither would you!
Thanks for any replies!
I'd like to elect a president that has a Higher IQ than a retarted ant.
Hamfist From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 614 posts, RR: 4 Reply 1, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 8 hours ago) and read 2335 times:
Hey, why not just go with him? Nothing says you have to jump into baptism pool or get sprinkled with anything. I believe in God, however, I haven't set foot inside a church in quite some time. Why couldn't you do just the opposite--not believe in God, but accompany your friend to a church. Some of my best school-days memories come from summer trips and annual events with my church.
If he's your friend, it's certainly not going to hurt to take him up on his invite to attend once or twice. Having done so, it will help your case a lot more if/when you decide to tell him that scene just isn't for you.
On a side note--my best friend and I are each strong supporters of rival colleges. The one day each year that these schools play football is the one day of the year that we agree to go our own ways...hell, we don't even call each other that day. We recognize that's something we'll just never agree on, so we never really involve that in our friendship. It's worked for well over 15 years now.
Hepkat From Austria, joined Aug 2000, 2341 posts, RR: 2 Reply 6, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2291 times:
Why not just be honest? I've found that no matter how complicated or difficult the issue, people appreciate honesty. You don't have to be rude or blunt, just politely and honestly explain how you feel. He's your friend so there's a very high probability that he'll accept your decision.
Vafi88 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 3116 posts, RR: 18 Reply 8, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2284 times:
Well, as some of you said honesty is good, but I've tried that, and tried just arguing a bit with him also, but he's set his mind to making me go to this thing, where I don't want to that much, since I'm really happy being athiest and my life is far from being hell and I'm not a bad person at all...
He also told me a true story that his friend (athiest) got into some legal trouble where he was getting it on in his car and got caught, and was made to take a drug test for which he tested positive, and says he knows that I don't do drugs or act bad, but wants me to believe, and I tried everything, from family problems (what would happen if I was the only christian in our family) and dealing the fact that it would be hard for me to adapt to being christian and also me not believing...
I don't think he's trying to understand me, and I told him that he should also respect my beliefs even if I don't go to church but still am a good person.
Thanks for all of the replies so far!! They're all appreciated dearly.
I'd like to elect a president that has a Higher IQ than a retarted ant.
Cx flyboy From Hong Kong, joined Dec 1999, 6448 posts, RR: 56 Reply 9, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 2286 times:
To go slightly off topic, I never understood the ability of people to convert from one religion to another like they change their haistyles. I also never understood other people's efforts to convert other people. I am not religious myself, and never have been. No-one in my family really is either. However, isn't religion a true personal belief that for example, Jesus existed, or the stories in the bible really happened and that a particular god exists? How do you go from believing that one set of circumstances is true to suddenly and completely believing that it was all lies, and then picking up another set of beliefs then deciding that this new religion was, in fact what really happened?
It's like really believing the facts that point to the dinosaurs dying during a 'big bang' type event, and then suddenly one day with a friend deciding that you will convert, in the process deciding that the catastrophic event never really happened and that the dinosaurs simply died of disease, or lack of food or climate change. Can someone explain to me the rationale of changing religions?
I hope I have not offended anyone here. I truly know little about religion, but this is one thing that has always baffled me. I mean no disrespect and appreciate that everyone is entitled to their own beliefs, but someone please explain!
Hepkat From Austria, joined Aug 2000, 2341 posts, RR: 2 Reply 10, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 2271 times:
Vaffi88, good friends, in my personal experience, are respectful of my beliefs and choices, even if they do not agree. I can't tell you how to choose your friends, but I do know that you shouldn't have to feel uncomfortable around them or feel guilty because you share different beliefs.
Whenever a "friend" refuses to respect my right to choose, i.e., he/she's more interested that I do things THEIR way, I begin an immediate reevaluation of that friendship.
NormalSpeed From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 13, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 2249 times:
I think Hepkat is absolutely right. Although, I can't quite figure out why this friend of yours is so bent on converting you. I would have given up a long time ago.
It just goes to show that we can't absolutely control other people, although some people sure try (my ex-fiance, for example--dodged a bullet there!). The fact of the matter is that the greater "tunnel-vision" we get, or the more bent we become on making one single thing happen, the more we become blind to the periphery, which often contains the solution to our problems.
And who knows what would happen if your friend just let it drop. Maybe you'd come around. And maybe you wouldn't. I don't understand why he's trying to make your decision his own.
Vafi88 From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 3116 posts, RR: 18 Reply 14, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 2243 times:
I'm really thinking he thinks that if I'm athiest, that I'll become a bad person and do drugs, and be a bad kid in general, but You never know, he has a good heart, and I know that he wants the best for me, and so do I, but I don't think religion is best for me (note: ME)...I guess we'll have to see....
I'd like to elect a president that has a Higher IQ than a retarted ant.
KAL_LM From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 497 posts, RR: 0 Reply 15, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 2239 times:
It sounds a little like your friend has the "Born again" virus. After spending 4 years at a Christian university, I've seen it a million times. Person converts, gets very passionate about his new faith, tries to get everyone around them irregardless of their own beliefs to join him/her and won't relent until you do. They feel so blessed and happy with their new lives that they want eveyone to feel the same thing, regardless of their own belief structure.
There is a couple ways to deal with it. 1. Tell them you're not interested (which you've already done). 2. Go with them to get them off your back (this works, although it may make them believe you are really into it and keep at you). 3. Talk to them, give them time to deal and ask them to respect your beliefs and your right to refuse...or tell him to back off.
If he is any sort of friend, or a reasonably mature person, he should respect your refusal and beliefs. Let him know that you don't neccessarily disagree with what he is saying, but that it isn't for you. Hopefully he will respect what you're saying and drop it. If not, avoidance works well too!
Best of Luck!
is that a light at the end of the tunnel or just a train?
NormalSpeed From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 2238 times:
If there's one thing I've learned from the non-aviation section, it's that there are many athiests that are good people. In fact, I'd say that there are athiests that I would trust over some of the "believers." Trust me, there's some pretty rotten "believers" out there. So I'm personally not concerned about that at all. I'm just wondering why your friend thinks that athiesm is the "express train" as it were to the sordid life. Surely he knows you better!
And remember, I say all this as a vigorous practitioner of religion.
Mirrodie From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 7427 posts, RR: 63 Reply 17, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 2238 times:
Vafi, you are probably right about what he may bethinking. My experience is that the "holy roller" types tend to cast a downward eye on others. Not that I am saying he is doing it, but there is tons of religious hypocrisy abound.
You don;t you just take him to band camp and, opps, wrong situation
Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
Mx5_boy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 18, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2210 times:
Here is my experience in High School with organised religion. I was bought up an atheist and told that *god does not exist* by my mother. However a friend of mine wanted me to attend the ISCF camp and celebrations. (ISCF = Interschool Christian Felowship)
I did join and at first it was all rather daunting as I had *no idea* of the bible or any of it's teachings, so I studies it and attended these christian things. My mother was scathing but that made me more determined to discover what all the fuss about religion was about.
I got a great uplifting experience of the whole thing at first, then felt rather ordinary after a week at this *camp christian* thing. The beliefs and statutes that they tried to empower us with simple were a load of bollocks in my mind eventually. I didn't find god, what I found was a bunch of people pretending to find god. It was quite strange. The whole thing was lost on me as I couldn't bring my intelligent mind to beleive in a supreme being when it just didn't work for me. I beleive in myself and the goodness of others but not the whole god thing.
Take the chance and get educated in the whole thing. If you find god then you find god. But my mother was right when she wished me good luck when the car came to pick us up to go to the big camp thing. She said to me sarcastically "watch out if some of the older guys drop the soap and ask you to pick it up*. I didn't get it at the time but do now. lol
Some good advice though, if there is a god, then if you have read the various religeous texts you don't really need to worship him, if you live your life in a nice manner and don't hurt others your probably guaranteed something good when you die and whatever that is.
No-one knows and that is the problem, the Raelians could be right with the amount of information we have. I don't discount anything, use your conscience and be a good person. We all want to be.
Take care, but if you have an curious mind and will not allow people to brainscrub you then you can hardly beleive in religion. It's preposterous. It makes no sense in a modern world.
So take a look and if it looks like cowshit then it's cowshit. Tell your friend afterward that it's not for me and I appreciate you concern for my soul but I think it's under control.
If he is persistent then drop him as a friend, nothing worse than a god botherer trying to convert you. Ugh!
And remember that most christians DO NOT practice what they preach, they use their religon for hatred and war.
Flyboy36y From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3039 posts, RR: 7 Reply 19, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2182 times:
I am also an atheist. If your friend thinks being an atheist is the reason his friend has leagal troubles then he needs to take a step back and reflect on what god means to him. I used to be relligious and I know what god meant to be before I began questioning his/her existance. God was all loving and all caring. He would not ruin someone's life for not believing in him. A good person is a good person. A bad person is a bad person.
Your friend should respect your beliefs. I understand exactly how awkward it will be for you to go to that group. I've found relligious groups frown on atheists. Let him know that you value his friendship, but remind him that he enjoys your friendship without you trying to convince him that there is no higher being, you would like to enjoy his without him trying to drag you into his fold.
Heavymetal From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 20, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2173 times:
If he is your friend he will respect that you do not believe in god.
Unless...one of the recurring messages he's getting in his newfound enlightenment is NOT to respect that choice.
Many many Christians are content with celebrating their fellowship....just "Us". But as Christianity in America becomes big business and ever more competitive, there is a need to determine a "Them" too......."They" who don't believe like "Us".....and work tirelessly to add new customers to "Us".
You're in dangerous ground. If he doesn't accept your choice and opinion now, it'll only get worse as he gets deeper and deeper into his choice.
Ilyushin96M From United States of America, joined Sep 1999, 2609 posts, RR: 13 Reply 22, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 2157 times:
I can understand someone's excitement about wanting to share their beliefs, but if a person isn't open to hearing them, or simply isn't interested for whatever reason, then it's appropriate to back off and let them be.
I went to church during most of my youth, but honestly never felt my beliefs fit in to the box of religion. A friend of mine considers himself to be a very strong Christian, and once started quoting all sorts of Bible verses to me...I can't remember why, just making a point, I think. Anyway, I finally told him if he didn't quit, I would block him off and not talk to him (this was via the internet) because I felt like he was getting carried away. He apologised, and that was the end of that.
I myself have participated in some really great seminars, and have often told friends about them, wanting them to come check out what's available and see if they are interested in participating. However, I don't press the issue if they say they aren't interested, whether they attend an introductory session or not. It's all about personal choice, and I respect that. Your friend should as well, where you are concerned.
MD-90 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 8475 posts, RR: 13 Reply 23, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2143 times:
I once hounded one of my friends who is Catholic, trying to get her to come back to my (Baptist) church, where she had been before. She doesn't go to church (or mass, I guess) down here herself. Eventually I made her cry, and after just two long AIM conversations I realized that I was just making her feel bad and I wasn't accomplishing anything. She forgave me for it, however. I just didn't want her to go to Hell, because I like her.
MD-90 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 8475 posts, RR: 13 Reply 24, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 2142 times:
You may be a learning experience for him. He may find out that other people find it insulting when you try to push Christianity on them, and say they're not living like they should be. I've painfully learned that before.
25 Hepkat: I just didn't want her to go to Hell, because I like her. Oh Lord, save us from our own ignorance and arrogance!
26 De727ups: Vafi.... You say you won't set foot in a church....I can understand and respect that. What you might want to do is find an activity with your friend t
27 MD-90: Oh Hepkat, save me from your blathering and nonsense! Now, watch how Hepkat's going to delete this but not his own post.....
28 AC320: After what you said you have the audacity to accuse Hepkat of blathering nonsense?
29 Vafi88: My other friend's church van comes to pick us up to eat at a local restaraunt from school at lunch, and I do that, but don't feel like getting into re