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Israel To Ignore U.n. Resolution Regarding Wall  
User currently offlineZak From Greenland, joined Sep 2003, 1993 posts, RR: 8
Posted (11 years 6 days ago) and read 2440 times:

israeli officials said the construction of the wall/fence will not cease even though an UN resolution (suprisingly enough not vetoed by the usa) has suggested so.
the resolution is not binding yet israel is surely not improving its overall perception worldwide with these warsaw pact style politics.
i wonder when george w. will launch an invasion against israel for ignoring the u.n. decisionmaking*cough*.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,1280,-3294576,00.html
(english)
http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/0,1518,270747,00.html
(german)


10=2
94 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTs-ior From Tunisia, joined Oct 2001, 3488 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (11 years 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 2421 times:


This is the top of arrogance and false feeling of supremacy.Not surprising,but Sharon and his band are going to hear from the U.N.this time,if not it will be from the Palestinians.These latter have at least the legitime allowance to react.


User currently offlineRacko From Germany, joined Nov 2001, 4857 posts, RR: 20
Reply 2, posted (11 years 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 2418 times:

I simply don't get it. Why don't they just move the fence on their territory, build new beautiful houses for the Settlers in Israel and let the Palestians go to hell (not literally) ? Why do they have to occupy more land with the fence?

User currently offlineTs-ior From Tunisia, joined Oct 2001, 3488 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (11 years 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 2414 times:


Racko,because they are occupiers and they want to hold perfectly this notion,they assume it indeed !!!


User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (11 years 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 2401 times:

I think it's time for sanctions on Israel - economic sanctions rampling up month by month until Israel is treated no different than Libya during the 90s (embargo, no int'l flights, etc. Lifting of those sanctions to be made upon the retirement of Israeli troops and citizens behind 1967 borders. If they want a wall, fine. But on the Green Line.

Charles


User currently offlineJcs17 From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 8065 posts, RR: 39
Reply 5, posted (11 years 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 2376 times:

Disagree. Disagree. Disagree. Palestine must learn that nothing will be gained by suicide bombings and allowing its interim "government" to be run by officials that support terrorism. Building this wall is a very positive step in Middle East relations--because Israel is finally taking a hard line on suicide bombings and telling Palestine, in effect, that if it doesnt stop...we'll push you past the borders. Of course, the UN supports the resolution--it is only one of the most anti-Israel bodies in the world. I mean, its the UN--leftist Europeans, anti-anything but Islam, and third world despots...of course, they wont support Israel. Israel could find a cure for world hunger, and the majority of the UN would still be critical of it.

Ts-ior, its amazing what a predominately unfree media will do to your mind, eh?



America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
User currently offlineDavid b. From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 3148 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (11 years 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2364 times:

I mean, its the UN--leftist Europeans, anti-anything but Islam, and third world despots...of course, they wont support Israel. Israel could find a cure for world hunger, and the majority of the UN would still be critical of it.


Absolute BS. Why is the US part of the UN?? Anti-anything but Islam? The US is anti-anything but Judaism. Am I correct?

BTW: Why doesn't Sharon built the damn fence on the Green Line and not through the west bank??

I think that Sharon is trying to instigate more violence.



[Edited 2003-10-22 15:20:49]


Teenage-know-it-alls should be shot on sight
User currently offlinePacificjourney From New Zealand, joined Jul 2001, 2734 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (11 years 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2364 times:

I agree totally with jcs17. Israel should carry on just as they have been in order to ensure their own security. It has obviously worked so well so far they should just carry on the same way !


" Help, help ... I'm being oppressed ... "
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8726 posts, RR: 43
Reply 8, posted (11 years 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 2341 times:

It really gets disturbing when you compare it to how things were going when Rabin was prime minister.

And Jcs17, thanks for the funny read. I manage to see fun in cynicism of that kind; I suppose you were being cynical?



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineAvi From Israel, joined Sep 2001, 943 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (11 years 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 2342 times:

When it comes to this security fence there is no question of what came first, the chicken or the egg.

This fence is a direct result of the Palestinian terror. Have no mistake, Sharon DIDN’T and DOESN’T want this fence. Hundreds of Israelis were murdered before the government was raped to build it against its will.

The UN, not surprisingly, doesn’t talk about the Palestinian terror. The UN, probably, has no problem with that. Did you ever see a special meeting of the Security Council or the General Assembly after a big Palestinian terror attack? Of course not, they don’t care.

There is a fence around the Gaza strip. None of the more than 100 suicide bombers that entered Israel came from the GS (and it is not because they didn’t try). Only 2 nights ago a suicide bomber was killed on the fence. Maybe this will help you understand why the Palestinians have problems with this fence.

The UN ignores the Palestinian terror and Israel will ignore the UN’s one side decisions (not to mention that the General Assembly decisions are only declaration ones).

Why not to build it on the Green Line? Well, I guess some of you think that terror is a very legitimate way to achieve what you want. I guess some of you think that terrorism deserve a prize. I and nor Israel thinks so.

Since Israel controls both sides of the fence I really can’t see how Israel can occupy more land. Did we cross the Jordan River with this fence?
The Palestinians will have to understand that with terror they will get nothing, they only will lose.




Long live the B747
User currently offlineTodaReisinger From Switzerland, joined Mar 2001, 2807 posts, RR: 1
Reply 10, posted (11 years 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 2340 times:


...even though an UN resolution (suprisingly enough not vetoed by the usa) has suggested so....


Confusion confusion...

The United States have vetoed the Security Council anti-Israel resolution...

The resolution you're mentionning here is the one of the General Assembly; it is a non-binding resolution, as you say it, and no one has the possibility to veto those decisions...




* * * *



I think it's time for sanctions on Israel - economic sanctions rampling up month by month until Israel is treated no different than Libya during the 90s (embargo, no int'l flights, etc. Lifting of those sanctions to be made upon the retirement of Israeli troops and citizens behind 1967 borders. If they want a wall, fine. But on the Green Line.

Charles



Palestinian atrocities against the Israeli population (blowing up hundreds of civilians in busses and restaurants) are closer to the Libyan actions which prompted the embargo (blowing up hundreds of civilians aboard commercial planes).....so what about "sanctions on the Palestinians"...?



But well, according to some, terror must be rewarded.



I bitterly miss the livery that should never have been changed (repetition...)
User currently offlineTodaReisinger From Switzerland, joined Mar 2001, 2807 posts, RR: 1
Reply 11, posted (11 years 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 2334 times:

It really gets disturbing when you compare it to how things were going when Rabin was prime minister.


Things were going wonderfully well when Rabin was PM...

Arafat was receiving more and more territory and weapons and money......and dozens of Israelis were murdered in the streets of Israel by something totally new at the time: suicide bombings.


A really great period......



I bitterly miss the livery that should never have been changed (repetition...)
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8726 posts, RR: 43
Reply 12, posted (11 years 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 2334 times:

Sharon is probably even as bad of a terrorism supporter as some of the people who throw stones at Israeli tanks (that destroy their homes and kill their parents/sons/relatives) and yell "Death for Israel!" or similar things. It's just that he supports state terrorism, while those others support personal terrorism. Why is it such a difference whether you kill twenty people using a battle helicopter or a suicide bomber?


Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8726 posts, RR: 43
Reply 13, posted (11 years 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 2330 times:

Well, today, under the splendid reign of Ariel Sharon, hundreds die in suicide bombings and fundamentalism receives more and more supporters every time some missile explodes in a Palestinian residiential area.

A really great period......



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineJcs17 From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 8065 posts, RR: 39
Reply 14, posted (11 years 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 2316 times:

Sharon is probably even as bad of a terrorism supporter as some of the people who throw stones at Israeli tanks (that destroy their homes and kill their parents/sons/relatives) and yell "Death for Israel!" or similar things.

Name ONE terrorist organization that Ariel Sharon supports. Make no mistake, I think Sharon is a weak-kneed idiot, but one thing he is not is a terrorist.

For the 2000th time on a.net. Here is why Israel is different then Palestine:

Israel targets TERRORISTS in its military campaigns. Palestinian terrorists target CIVILIANS.

I mean, how hard of a concept is this for some of you to grasp? How the hell is launching missles at a terrorist hideout terrorism? If that were the case, America and the Coalition of the Willing is committing atrocities in Afghanistan. I really believe that some of you have issues with Israel that goes beyond their government and have more of an issue with the people.

The Palestinian government has shown an unwillingness to keep its citizens and terrorist groups in line. Therefore, a fence had to be built, like I have said, its the first positive thing IMO (other then launching missles at terrorist hideouts) that Ariel Sharon has done. The problem with Sharon is that the Palestinians know that he doesnt have the guts to retake vast amounts of land following terrorist acts. A hardline government must be put in place in Israel for the attacks to stop.



America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
User currently offlineTbar220 From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7013 posts, RR: 26
Reply 15, posted (11 years 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 2313 times:

The U.N. is the most biased, anti-Israel body in the world. When was the last time they passed a resolution against the Palestinians for carrying out terrorism? When was the last time they passed a resolution for that matter against any Arab nation because they support terrorism?

As far as Israel is concerned, the U.N. is meaningless, and it certainly is. For decades it has been overly critical of Israel and has not had a word of official criticism to those who support terror. How can they pass this censure of Israel without doing the same for Palestinian terror? Because terror wins, and Arafat knows this. That's why he has continually carried it out against Israel.

He massacred 21 people in a Haifa restaurant.
He massacred 19 schoolchildren on a bus in Jerusalem.
He massacred 29 people in a Passover celebration in Netanya.

The list goes on and on, and what does he get in response each time? Criticism of Israel from the U.N. So now you should tell me, why should Israel listen or take seriously what the U.N. says?

This is coming from a world body where Syria of all nations is on the Human Rights commission.



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User currently offlineZak From Greenland, joined Sep 2003, 1993 posts, RR: 8
Reply 16, posted (11 years 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 2309 times:

tbar220:

at least syria doesnt bomb other countries ignoring the un charta etc.
maybe israel needs to do a bit of PR around the world, but to most people it seems that israel is provoking the escalation. after all they attacked syria, they kill innocent civilians in the west bank and gaza strip on a daily basis. you dont go around point fingers at people when you do the same thing. look at the pilots who signed that declaration along with your former national hero spektor, they seemed to have understood that you cant kill civillians yet expect the other site to hold tight. israel might more or less not understanding the cause and effect mechanics or intentionally provoke that to justify a land grab and more attacks on palestine areas.
since the government of israel is clever im sure they understand what the attacks lead to so i go with the second option.
look how most european countries overcame the terror in their countries, they did EXACTLY the opposite. not even spain with still very vivid terror bombs the pais vasco part of the country, because everyone knows NOT everyone there is a terrorist or pro terror, and because they know that answering with terror creates nothing but more terror. the key problem is that israel does not want to go back to the ORIGINAL borders. built your fence round there NO PROBLEM. but israel wants to grab those extra fertile pices of land to make it as hard as possible for any palestine state to exist.
i do see the problem on the israeli side, unless israel doesnt accept a state of palestine and return to the old borders there will be no peace, and after all i think if i would live in palestine i wouldnt see a reason to stop attacks on those who occupy my land. cause as long as israel is occupying palestine territory they are freedom fighters and not terrorists.



10=2
User currently offlineAviationMaster From Switzerland, joined Oct 1999, 2481 posts, RR: 34
Reply 17, posted (11 years 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2297 times:

"but to most people it seems that israel is provoking the escalation."

Not to me. To me Israel only has fought back in selfe defense, I might be wrong but that's how it seems to me.


"cause as long as israel is occupying palestine territory they are freedom fighters and not terrorists."

I don't think you can call the Palestinian terrorists freedom fighters. What difference is there between a so called "freedom fighter" that blows himself up with a terrorist that blows himself up? NONE!



User currently offlineZak From Greenland, joined Sep 2003, 1993 posts, RR: 8
Reply 18, posted (11 years 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2288 times:

a terrorist is someone who out of the blue takes people hostage or kills them to enforce something and help his interests. for example you kill people in who are on holiday like on bali just because you are one of the 0.0000001% of the people in your country who disagree with them doing holiday there.
a freedom fighter is someone who fights for his country against an entity that has occupied his own soil. i.e. french resistance in ww2



10=2
User currently offlineAviationMaster From Switzerland, joined Oct 1999, 2481 posts, RR: 34
Reply 19, posted (11 years 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2275 times:

"a terrorist is someone who out of the blue takes people hostage or kills them to enforce something and help his interestsX"

"a freedom fighter is someone who fights for his country against an entity that has occupied his own soil. i.e. french resistance in ww2"

The French resistance NEVER blew themselves up to kill CIVILIANS and until now i have never heared any reports about the French resistance killing CIVILIANS. Also the French resistance fought on their OWN land, in which the Palestinians are crossing over into Israel targeting civilians. To some degree the Palestinians might be freedom fighters, but at the same time they qualify/are terrorists.

"for example you kill people in who are on holiday like on bali just because you are one of the 0.0000001% of the people in your country who disagree with them doing holiday there."

Tourists, the Israeli population or from any other country, all are civilians. Is there really a difference between a tourist getting killed while on vacation or innocent Israelis getting blown up while having dinner in a restaurant?


User currently offlineMarcus From Mexico, joined Apr 2001, 1801 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (11 years 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2273 times:

"Israel To Ignore U.n. Resolution Regarding Wall"

Well that is a surprise!..............the only UN resolution Israel likes is the one that creates the State of Israel.......anything else they mostly seem to ignore.



Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
User currently offlineTbar220 From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7013 posts, RR: 26
Reply 21, posted (11 years 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2270 times:

Syria is a state supporter of terrorism. They support groups like Hamas, Islamic Jihad, and Hizbullah. And if you want to talk about Syria not bombing other countries, how about Syria bombing Israeli population centers in '48, '67, and '73? How about Syria's support of PLO terrorism from southern Lebanon which was aimed at Israeli civilian centers?

People like to look at gross numbers of deaths to determine which side is in the worse. If you do, then about 2000 Palestinians and around 1000 Israeli's are dead because of the recent conflict. But if you look at the numbers of innocent Israeli civilians killed compared to the number of Palestinian civilians killed, the numbers are astonishingly similar. In April 2003, the Boston Globe reported that "18 percent of the nearly 2,000 Palestinians killed by Israeli forces since the uprising began in September 2000 were civilians with no connection to acts of terror." (1) This is about 360 killed while Israel is defending itself from terror. My guess is the total is around or above 400 since this was found. Of the Israeli deaths, 567 have been innocent civilians as of June 23, 2003 (2). The number is probably aroudn or above 600 with the recent rash of suicide bombings.

So why is there such a high Palestinian body count? Included in the 2000 dead are over 100 dead suicide bombers, militants from terrorist groups, Palestinian gunmen, and Palestinians involved in throwing fire bombs, molotov cocktails, and stones at Israeli troops.

Israel is legitimately defending its land from terrorism, and is doing so with restraint as well. The U.N. is an illegitimate body as far as Israel is concerned, with consistent criticism of Israeli policies and no condemnation of Arab terrorism and state sponsored terrorism. Its no wonder Israel feels no need to listen to what the U.N. has to say.

(1) David F. Green, "Fighting by the Book", Boston Globe, April 20, 2003
(2) International Database, IDF Update, June 23, 2003



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User currently offlineMt99 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 6615 posts, RR: 6
Reply 22, posted (11 years 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2268 times:
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Do you think that the implications of this wall will be the same (in the long run) as the Berlin wall?


Step into my office, baby
User currently offlinePacificjourney From New Zealand, joined Jul 2001, 2734 posts, RR: 8
Reply 23, posted (11 years 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2258 times:

Sounds about right Mt99 but this time there will be 2 East Germany's.


" Help, help ... I'm being oppressed ... "
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8726 posts, RR: 43
Reply 24, posted (11 years 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 2256 times:

"Name ONE terrorist organization that Ariel Sharon supports. Make no mistake, I think Sharon is a weak-kneed idiot, but one thing he is not is a terrorist."

I said STATE terrorism. He uses Israel's armed forces to terrorise people.

"For the 2000th time on a.net. Here is why Israel is different then Palestine:

Israel targets TERRORISTS in its military campaigns. Palestinian terrorists target CIVILIANS.

I mean, how hard of a concept is this for some of you to grasp? How the hell is launching missles at a terrorist hideout terrorism?"


Oh please, not THAT again. So if Israel is targetting nobody but terrorists, how come that some pilots and even Generals willingly lost their jobs over the idea of attacking "terrorists"? Or was it because they said they didn't want to fight in an illegal war anymore? And what about all the "collateral damage"? It's not forgiven and forgotten with someone just saying "Oops, sorry!" (they don't anyway), but it incites hatred in the entire muslim world.

And who the hell said only killing people can be considered terrorism? There are so many more subtle ways to terrorise people. Sending F-16 over to Beirut to clear up the streets with their sonic booms, denying access to their jobs in Israel to thousands of palestinian workers, invading a different city or town each week, cutting the land of the Palestinians with a wall and thereby ruining the lives of many (how the hell will a Palestinian on the Israelie side of the wall, who isn't allowed to travel to Israel, lead a normal life?) are not ways to terrorise people?

"If that were the case, America and the Coalition of the Willing is committing atrocities in Afghanistan. I really believe that some of you have issues with Israel that goes beyond their government and have more of an issue with the people."

Afghanistan is an entirely different issue. And it's not only the (in)famous "Coalition of the Willing" that's in Afghanistan; I hope you know that. Additionally, I hope you don't suspect me of being anti-Semitic. No, I don't have issues with the people of Israel for I don't even know that people. The only Jewish person I know is someone I like very well. But I do know what Israel's PM is doing, and I do have more than issues with that.

"The Palestinian government has shown an unwillingness to keep its citizens and terrorist groups in line. Therefore, a fence had to be built, like I have said, its the first positive thing IMO (other then launching missles at terrorist hideouts) that Ariel Sharon has done. The problem with Sharon is that the Palestinians know that he doesnt have the guts to retake vast amounts of land following terrorist acts. A hardline government must be put in place in Israel for the attacks to stop."

What would you want that "hardline government" to do? Drive all those nasty Palestinians out of the Westbank and the Gaza Strip? You should know that this would not be the end of anny terrorist attacks, but rather the beginning of a lot more. Sharon is a hardliner, believe it or not. Second, how the hell do you suppose any government to keep "its citizens and terrorist groups in line" if those people are subject to at least weekly attacks by the country many of them already hate anyway? If the government is sabotaged by that same country as much as possible? If that government has to find a way to calm down both muslim fundamentalists and a government like that of Ariel Sharon?

But anyway, I don't expect you, of all people, to understand me. Or an idea like "Don't shoot, but talk."



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
25 Artsyman : If I were Israel, I wouldn't stop building the wall either. They have tried endless other ways to protect their citizens, but the bombers still arrive
26 Post contains links Aloges : "The U.N. is an illegitimate body as far as Israel is concerned, with consistent criticism of Israeli policies and no condemnation of Arab terrorism a
27 Galaxy5 : "i wonder when george w. will launch an invasion against israel for ignoring the u.n. decisionmaking*cough*." After they have defied the UN for 10 yea
28 Ryanb741 : Well this is just the last straw. It may seem harsh but I would now urge all Palestinian freedom fighters to attack Israeli settlements WITHIN PALESTI
29 Avi : as long as israel is occupying palestine territory they are freedom fighters and not terrorists. Zak, Do you think that a woman who enters a restauran
30 Csavel : A seperation fence by itself may be a legitimate respnse to terror, but read on. A couple of problems with the idea that putting the wall on the Green
31 Manni : While they are at it, they might aswell continue building it. All the way along the borders of the PA, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt and the Medditera
32 NoUFO : Some people with their uneducated hatered against the UN .... To my knowledge, the UN can neither impose sanctions nor issue resolutions against Pales
33 Cfalk : I'm frankly amazed that many of the usual liberals on this forum have suddenly become rather Nazi-ish. Remember Lebensraum? I totally agree that what
34 Scorpio : Cfalk, I agree with almost everything you said on this topic, except for one thing: I'm frankly amazed that many of the usual liberals on this forum h
35 MD-90 : You know, if attacks like this were occuring and killing as many people in France or the United States or Australia or wherever else as they have in I
36 Tbar220 : MD-90, The proportion of Israeli deaths to its population is astounding if you compare it to the United States. Israelis have lost about 1000 dead to
37 Post contains images David b. : Well this is just the last straw. It may seem harsh but I would now urge all Palestinian freedom fighters to attack Israeli settlements WITHIN PALESTI
38 Indianguy : If the soviet backed section of Germany could do it in another era then Israel can do it today. What matters is getting the support of a superpower an
39 Cfalk : What matters is getting the support of a superpower and that Israel has done. Roy, The U.S. is against the wall, voted for the resolution, and has has
40 Tbar220 : Cfalk, If I remember reading correctly, the U.S. voted no against the resolution. It was one of four who voted no.
41 Cfalk : Oops, my mistake. I thought they had voted for it. Apparently they decided against it because the resolution does not condemn terrorism as well (and I
42 Pacificjourney : Cfalk where do you get that info from ? Many countries have difficulty coming up with a definition of terrorism (France and the USA spring to mind) an
43 TodaReisinger : Israel, you want peace, fine. Pull the settlers back to Israel, and you will find most of world opinion, including the UN, on your side against the Pa
44 Tbar220 : PJ, Funny how you have no problem jumping so quick to criticize Israel but you have a hard time finding what defines terrorism? I'll tell you what ter
45 Cfalk : What do you suggest Israel will do in case the Palestinians still "don't behave"? I'd like to hear your proposals. If Israel continued to be attacked
46 Pacificjourney : My definition of terrorism is of no consequence, yours however "the deliberate use of force against innocent civilians" can be easily applied to Israe
47 Manni : Pretty amuzing that besides the obvious (Israel and the USA) also the Marshall Islands and Micronesia voted in favor of the wall.
48 Cfalk : My definition of terrorism is of no consequence, yours however "the deliberate use of force against innocent civilians" can be easily applied to Israe
49 Donder10 : I too feel that Israel is wrong to build the 'Wall' on its current line-it should be on the Green Line.However,if Israel were also to build a wall on
50 Alessandro : Well the wall in Cyprus works since 1970ies, so why shouldn´t the wall work in Israel as well? I think the big mistake was that it wasn´t built much
51 Pacificjourney : So cfalk the only difference is that Israel doesn't actually aim at civilians - it does kill a lot more of them than the other bunch of wankers - but
52 PHX-LJU : The latest votes at the UN show that the US is virtually alone in its overwhelmingly pro-Sharon stance and that in turn proves that we need a totally
53 Tbar220 : PJ, Yes, it is a HUGE difference. If civilians die in a strike against a Hamas leader, its too bad, but they weren't the direct and intended target. W
54 Pacificjourney : Tbar can you actually believe what you write "If civilians die in a strike against a Hamas leader, its too bad, but they weren't the direct and intend
55 Post contains images Cfalk : Well, you are the resident expert on pathetic arguements here, Roy, so I'll take that as a complement Pacificjourney, Just because the IDF say they we
56 TodaReisinger : BTW how do we know they aren't deliberately targetting civilians ? GREAT question....simple answer; * * * * The UN did come with proposals concerning
57 Pacificjourney : Mr. Toda said BTW how do we know they aren't deliberately targetting civilians ? "GREAT question....simple answer;" Well I'm waiting with baited breat
58 Alpha 1 : This wall, built by Jews, after their history of being fenced in in the Warsaw Ghetto's during World War II by the Nazi's, is sheer-and sad-historical
59 TodaReisinger : This wall, built by Jews, after their history of being fenced in in the Warsaw Ghetto's during World War II by the Nazi's, is sheer-and sad-historical
60 TodaReisinger : PJ...Israel has one of the most powerful army in the world, so that if the IDF's targets were actually civilians.....there would be somewhat more dead
61 Tbar220 : Alpha1, The stunning difference between the Berlin Wall and this wall is that the East Germans weren't using their "ideas" to blow up innocent West Ge
62 Post contains links Tbar220 : PJ, A perfect example of how civilians die in battle, and that Israel does NOT target them deliberately. The battle of Jenin was the perfect example o
63 Alpha 1 : - so that nothing should be done to avoid carnages like the one we witnessed in Haifa? Toda, stop your selective reading: "Conversely, the Palestinian
64 TodaReisinger : Toda, stop your selective reading: "Conversely, the Palestinians have not learned that this continuing violence will solve nothing, will gain them not
65 Zak : "Please, PLEASE read the following article from TIME magazine on the Battle of Jenin, and you will understand the problems that Israeli soldiers face.
66 TodaReisinger : ...shows that you havent really understood the mechanics of getting a peace process on the way. when you have to resort to active military action you
67 Tbar220 : Zak, Would you just read the article? It makes a very valid point. Don't just ignore my post like that. Read the article, and then answer this questio
68 TodaReisinger : If terrorists base their operations out of civilian areas, how does Israel eliminate the terrorists without harming civilians? But TBar....you haven't
69 Tbar220 : The point that the article makes is that war is ugly, and that Palestinian civilians die when the terrorists base their operations out of civilian are
70 Tbar220 : Toda, Honestly, can I just ask Zak the question? I'm trying to make a point here, I DON'T need you answering the question for him in your typically ir
71 Cfalk : The answer is so simple: Israel should make nothing to eliminate the terrorists: OK. If a terrorist shoots you in the butt, you should simply offer th
72 Tbar220 : Cfalk, I think Toda was being very, VERY sarcastic with his comments. I have to go to class, I'll be back in about five hours, but please read my abov
73 Post contains images Cfalk : Uhhh, OK. My sarcasm switch must have been jammed in the OFF position. Sorry Toda Charles
74 TodaReisinger : TBar has understood that my last post was obviously ironic, and I can't imaginr that you haven't... As Clinton's half-assed responses against Al Qaed
75 Cfalk : The "world opinion" and the UN are not sharing these views....and btw it's the first time you're posting such an opinion. And if you're defending such
76 Csavel : I have to return to this dabate, and second Cfalk's comments. That is the crux of the problem, not the wall per se (There's been a Gaza wall for a whi
77 Tbar220 : I think the wall will come down once the PA shows definite progress towards halting terrorism. And I'm not talking about Hamas or Jihad halting terror
78 Cfalk : A quarter of a million settlers in the Sinai weren't a problem when peace was made in Egypt, as the Israeli armed forces uprooted and evacuated them a
79 Tbar220 : Cfalk, Why should they start removing settlers if the Palestinians haven't shown a devotion to stopping terrorism?
80 PHX-LJU : Tbar220 wrote: "Why should they start removing settlers if the Palestinians haven't shown a devotion to stopping terrorism?" Why is Israel using settl
81 Todareisinger : I would like to see them use a bit more care in how they service their targets (e.g. why use a bomb capable of flattening the entire building when per
82 Todareisinger : Which is exactly what the Israelis need to start doing right now to the West Bank settlers. The longer they wait, the more entrenched they will be. No
83 David b. : Absolutely not. The "green line" is nothing more than the former cease-fire line between Israel and Transjordan/Jordan. It has never been a border, an
84 Post contains images Marcus : This might be interesting
85 Todareisinger : Great map, but don't forget to have an eye on the scale.....bottom right... This line ________________ represents 10 km on the map....
86 Donder10 : There is NO REASON to have Israeli civilian settlers in the West Bank. Israeli troops, OK, as long as the terrorists are misbehaving - but the civilia
87 Ts-ior : ...and the latest...Sharon is considering a wall along the Jordanian boundaries to be built within a year,and what next ? I expect him to be the victi
88 David b. : Respect to the Jews,the real ones !!! Not the Zionists like sharon.
89 Cfalk : Obviously,the number of pro-Israel is decreasing is this forum and this is logic i think due to the night and day massacres the Israelis are committin
90 Tbar220 : Do you care to explain your statement? Respect to the Jews, the real ones I'm not going to assume any meaning behind this, I'll let you do the explain
91 Alpha 1 : Obviously,the number of pro-Israel is decreasing is this forum.. Do not put me in that category, Ts-ior. I fully support Israel and their right to exi
92 Alessandro : Ts-ior, so Israel should seaze to exist and Jews should go back to the countries they came from? Expecting to get protection in the Arab world like Tu
93 Tbar220 : Ts-ior, Care to tell me what "massacres" the Israeli's are commiting?
94 Lehpron : I am very interested to see the results of this 'wall' that Israel is constructing; just what land they happen to be putting it on is interesting enou
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