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Pin The Tale On The Donkeys  
User currently offlineGoose From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 1840 posts, RR: 15
Posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 841 times:

Take a look. Great video.....

http://www.brain-terminal.com/video/nyc-2004-03-20/index.html

Some people would like you to think President Bush lied when he talked about Saddam Hussein's weapons. The funny thing is, many of the president's current critics are politicians who made strikingly similar claims about Iraq in the not-too-distant past. When Bill Clinton was in office, his fellow Democrats had much to say about Iraq's weapons of mass destruction. But if you listen to them now, you might conclude that the entire party suffers from collective amnesia. Democrats used to talk tough about Iraq. They did when one of their own was in the White House. And they did when polls showed it was politically helpful to support President Bush. But now, it's campaign season, and they've changed their tune. To find out if the spin was sticking, I impersonated a game show host and quizzed a few protesters about some particularly hawkish quotes from notable Democrats.


"Talk to me, Goose..."
9 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineGoose From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 1840 posts, RR: 15
Reply 1, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 802 times:

Not one comment....?


"Talk to me, Goose..."
User currently offlineTYSGoVols From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 634 posts, RR: 16
Reply 2, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 791 times:

I thought it was great. Quite funny to watch actually.

<>< Garen



Rocky Top You'll Always be home sweet home to me, Good ole' Rocky Top WOOOOO
User currently offlineDc10guy From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 2685 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 781 times:

I can't download QuickTime .... My question is... Did Bush invade Iraq because the democrats wanted him to ??? And then they left him alone to deal with it ??? Or did Bush invade Iraq for their oil ??? That's the question. I think he invaded for control of Iraq's oil. I also feel that Bush is behind the oil supply problems we're having now causing the high gas prices. I also think he plans on the American public spending there "tax cuts" on the high priced gas.


Next time try the old "dirty Sanchez" She'll love it !!!
User currently offlineTYSGoVols From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 634 posts, RR: 16
Reply 4, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 775 times:

If it was for oil why are we not taking advantage of it. I think the proof is in the fact that our oil and gas prices are still so high. IT was NOT about oil. The first Gulf War was about oil and we say what happened to the guy that wanted Kuwaits, he got sent back to Baghdad. Where is the proof it was about oil. The only country that I can remember actually bringing up taking oil from Iraq was the Russian government.

<>< Garen



Rocky Top You'll Always be home sweet home to me, Good ole' Rocky Top WOOOOO
User currently offlineDc10guy From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 2685 posts, RR: 6
Reply 5, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 767 times:

The desired effect is happening right now. Bush don't want low gas prices. High gas prices makes "west Texas crude" oil worth a whole lot more. And that's exactly why he invaded Iraq. Iraq will sell oil only when he wants then too. Keeping oil prices high is more money for Texas .....


Next time try the old "dirty Sanchez" She'll love it !!!
User currently offlineGoose From Canada, joined Aug 2003, 1840 posts, RR: 15
Reply 6, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 764 times:

The desired effect is happening right now. Bush don't want low gas prices. High gas prices makes "west Texas crude" oil worth a whole lot more. And that's exactly why he invaded Iraq. Iraq will sell oil only when he wants then too. Keeping oil prices high is more money for Texas .....

There's that vast right-wing conspiracy again......



"Talk to me, Goose..."
User currently offlineQb001 From Canada, joined Apr 2000, 2053 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 757 times:

This video is a piece of crap, in the sense that it takes citations totally out of context.

First, all US led actions in Iraq under Clinton were mandated by the UN. Then the UN was saying Saddam had WMD and those actions were part of a comprehensive, UN approved plan to contain Saddam. And guess what, it worked very well. The UN inspection program, under Clinton and a UN mandate, worked. Eventually, Saddam got rid of his WMD.

But then came Bush with an obsession. And 9/11. And even when the UN was telling Bush there are no more WMD in Iraq, he kept saying there were. And he tried to convince people there were links between Saddam and Al-Qaida. Colin Powell went in front of the UN with some "proofs", but he didn't convince anyone. Bush decided to invade Iraq, without the UN support, anyway. Bush deliberately chose to "ignore" the UN reports, lying to try and reach his goal: eliminate Saddam.

Bush lied.

Clinton did lie too, but it was related to a story that didn't cost any human lives. Only a cigar, a dress, a jaw cramp (maybe) and few scratched egos.



Never let the facts get in the way of a good theory.
User currently offlineTechRep From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 747 times:

Qb001,

Wrong..

The millions of starving Iraqis that died from starvation under UN sanctions would disagree with you. It was proven Sadaam was hoarding the money delivered from the oil for food program, spending it on such things as new palaces, weapons and hookers. All of this was well known to the Clinton/Bush administration.

Lets just call it Dumb (Clinton) and Dumber (Bush) and be done with it. You have groups here so galvanized for their cause (Dem/Rep), that unequivocal evidence proving this or that would only lead to some right/left wing conspiracy. That’s why I detached myself from such gobbledygook (politics) long ago. I now concentrate on such things as work, family and golf. When election time comes around I vote against all incumbents and assign new crooks to take their place. At least this puts the new crooks into a learning curve, it might take them months to find all the special interest groups who have the money…to line their pockets.

Politics is about leading people around by the nose, lying, cheating and doing what it takes to line ones pockets. Statesmen do what’s right for the greater good of the country, unfortunately it’s been a long time since we seen one of them.

TechRep


User currently offlineTechRep From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (10 years 3 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 741 times:

Crooks coming out of the wood work. Read on please.

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/03/27/1080330984252.html

Credit for this article:
By Roger Franklin
Inside America
March 28, 2004

Almost a year ago, when kitchen workers at the United Nations' headquarters walked off the job in a dispute over holiday pay, the cream of the world's diplomats thronged to the five unattended restaurants there and stole everything that wasn't nailed down.

As one witness marvelled after seeing an envoy make off with a baked turkey under one arm and a framed picture under the other: "They were locusts!"

The next day, however, the incident had not happened - not officially, anyway.

A UN spokesman swore blind that a senior official, concerned that his colleagues might go hungry, had granted permission for staff to help themselves. In other words: no mass theft. As excuses go, it was not bad.

If all pillage was as easy to explain, the UN might not today be facing what is shaping up as the biggest scandal in its history. This time it's not about cutlery and baked hams, but at least $11 billion, depending on who is doing the counting - or rather, the guessing, since the UN has been disinclined to investigate.

Whatever the sum, it vanished from the UN-administered Iraq Oil for Food program, and those at the centre of suspicion are not lowly bureaucrats but a tight cluster of high-up insiders centred on the office, family and inner circle of Secretary-General Kofi Annan himself.

To understand what happened - what might have happened - you have to go back to 1996, when the UN set up a system whereby Iraqi oil could reach the market only if the proceeds went to the "humanitarian relief" of the Iraqi people.

Two years later, at the end of 1998, the UN appointed a Swiss company called Cotecna to run the program, which would supervise the flow of some $100 billion in oil receipts before it was finally shut down last November, when the UN reluctantly surrendered the job to the US-appointed Iraqi Governing Council in Baghdad.

What was Cotecna? For one thing, it was the former employer of Kofi Annan's son, Kojo, who was on the payroll until just before the contracts were awarded.

Cotecna's job involved squaring the income from oil sales against the goods allegedly bought. In the first year alone, Cotecna pocketed $6 million for its services. After that, because the UN is not saying, its share of the bounty is anybody's guess.

When Claudia Rosett, of The Wall Street Journal, began looking into the Oil for Food program, she soon came up with one explanation: many of the suppliers, like the Jordanian manufacturer of school desks listed on contract records, simply did not exist.

As Rosett has noted, Cotecna was responsible for approving "tens of billions worth of supplies inbound to a regime much interested in smuggling, and evidently accustomed to dealing in bribes and kickbacks".

Evidence of probity, however, is as hard to find as those notional school desks from Amman.

The suspicion is that those deals, perhaps the overwhelming majority, were nothing but scams and shams. Remember how opponents of the war kept citing the hundreds of thousands of Iraqi children dying for want of medicines?

Well, Oil for Food was supposed to guarantee that those supplies arrived. Apparently few did.

Again, the UN's stonewalling makes it hard to determine exactly how much was fleeced, but there are some tantalising hints. Before Oil for Food was handed over to Iraq, the UN conducted an urgent, last-minute review of thousands of contracts.

Rosett calls it a "house cleaning", but whatever description is used, some 1500 supplier contracts - one in four - were immediately suspended or banned outright from further participation.

So where did the money go? Into Saddam's pocket is a good guess, with lesser amounts creamed off by the operators of front companies, smugglers and, perhaps, even UN officials.

According to the best estimate of the non-partisan US Government Accounting Office, Oil for Food generated at least $10 billion for Saddam's family, and a further $1 billion to pay the 1000-plus UN bureaucrats who were supposed to be keeping it honest.

Again, the focus is on Kofi Annan, who helped set up Oil for Food in 1997 and installed his close friend and fellow diplomat Benon Sevan as its director. Last week, with Rosett's series igniting a firestorm over the UN, Mr Sevan was not answering his phone. According to a UN spokesman, he is using up accumulated leave before retiring.

For his part, a po-faced Mr Annan now concedes "it is highly possible there has been quite a lot of wrongdoing", and has authorised an internal investigation.

Neither Rosett nor congressional investigators hold much hope it will be more than a whitewash. The UN has other matters it would much prefer to talk about, like a $1.2 billion interest-free loan from Washington to renovate its decaying New York HQ. George Bush has rejected the request, saying the UN could have the money at the standard interest rate charged to American home buyers.

TechRep





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