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European Integration, Yeah Right  
User currently offlineZweed From Netherlands, joined Apr 2004, 455 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1585 times:

While I still lived in Sweden I was a big believer in all this crap the politicians talk about whats so good about the European Union. The possibilites for any citizen of the union to move and work wherever he wants in the union.
Ok, so far so good.
I could move to the Netherlands. That part worked great. At first I didnt have my own contract for the apartment, my girlfriend is the owner of the apartment. This meant that I could not register as a inhabitant of the Netherlands and after a certain amount of time I would have been more or less illegal.
I got my own contract and I could register. Getting a social security number was no problem.
Getting a job was easier than opening up a bank account.
At the moment I dont have a permanent permit of residence, this means that, despite I am working, I have my own contract for an apartment, I am paying taxes and I am registered as an inhabitant I am still not able to rent a DVD at the videostore and after trying to get a contract at 3 different mobile phone providors I finally got accepted by T-mobile. One of the few companies that seem to have understood what european integration is about.
Everywhere I go and where I am obligated to show my identity my Swedish national identity card is being questionned (is this real, show me your passport etc)
So, I went for a permanent permit of residence. Easier said than done. I have been at the city hall 3 times now. All 3 times they have told me different things on what papers I need from Sweden.

One day, maybe one day I hope I wont be treated like I was one of Saddam Husseins men trying to start his new life in Europe.

67 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineZweed From Netherlands, joined Apr 2004, 455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1569 times:

To our american friend. This is no lets bash europe thread. go somewhere else then.

I jsut wanted to start a discussion about european integration in the union.


User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1561 times:

Many European countries still have the Napoleonic regulations about registering where you live etc etc. For arriving foreigners this can be a real pain. When I moved to AMS, fortunately our company secretary had an excellent relationship with the people down at immigration, and had all my paperwork sorted out really quickly. I still had to go down to the Immigration place and wait with the indigent Armenians, but the process itself was pretty straightforward. I also had to go to the Vreemdelingen Politie to register my presence, but that was just a stamp in my passport.

It was the same story in France - had to go to the Mairie and register, and get my Carte De Sejour. The company sorted it all out, but it was still a pain.


User currently offlineBanco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 53
Reply 3, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1549 times:

There's an issue of culture. Many times I've queried with Italian colleagues why it doesn't bother them that a hotel passes on your wherabouts to the police when you check in. To me, that's a case of "what the hell's it got to do with them", but they're used to it. Makes my blood boil, but bothers them not a whit.


She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3681 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1544 times:

Zweed,

Of course that's not so simple. Rome was not made in 3 days.
The administration have to get used to that sort of situation, that's new.


User currently offlineZweed From Netherlands, joined Apr 2004, 455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1531 times:

Sebolino, you say that all this free move, european integration thing is new??

dont think so


User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1528 times:

I think you're confusing "freedom of movement" with "ease of movement". You are ALLOWED to live in Holland, but nobody promised it would be easy !  Smile

It would be wonderful if there could be some kind of harmonisation in the admin required to register your permanent presence in a given EU country, or else do away with the requirement altogether - but given the current wave of restrictions aimed at illegal immigration, this is highly unlikely.


User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3681 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1527 times:

Depends at which scale you're thinking.

It will remain new until many European citizens use this ability to move and work in another country of the Union. For the moment, it's perhaps not enough used.


User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8706 posts, RR: 43
Reply 8, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1518 times:

And yet, if there was ever to be a harmonised EU immigration and registration system, there would be tremendous uproar from the nationalists in each and every member country. Why? Because the "big bad bureaucratic bastard" called EU is taking away some of the member countries' sovereignty...  Insane


Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineSolnabo From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 852 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1510 times:

Hasn´t that to do with the Schengen deal, Zweed?

Are Sweden members of Sängen? *As u can see I really know much about EU!!!*  Insane

Micke



Airbus SAS - Love them both
User currently offlineBanco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 53
Reply 10, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1510 times:

No need to roll your eyes on that, Aloges. There would be uproar in the UK because we do not have a registration programme. Hardly surprising it would cause upset if the EU were to impose one.



She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8706 posts, RR: 43
Reply 11, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1501 times:

Banco, I didn't aim that at the UK.

And you blokes do have something to (try and) control immigration, don't you?



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineZweed From Netherlands, joined Apr 2004, 455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1494 times:

Yes, Sweden is in Schengen.

User currently offlineGKirk From UK - Scotland, joined Jun 2000, 24932 posts, RR: 56
Reply 13, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1486 times:

"Because the "big bad bureaucratic bastard" called EU is taking away some of the member countries' sovereignty"

Exactly what I was going to say  Smile Zweed, you are no longer Swedish, ut your now European. Same with French people, Belgians, Germans etc. They are now all European and now not French, German or Belgian.
But if thats the way they want to be, so be it



When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1484 times:

Much as it shames and horrifies me to say this, Kirkie - you're a European too ! Europe has astonishingly low standards  Smile

User currently offlineGKirk From UK - Scotland, joined Jun 2000, 24932 posts, RR: 56
Reply 15, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1477 times:

JGPH1A, I dont think of myself as a European though. Firstly Im Scottish, then British, then a citizen of the World.  Big grin


When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
User currently offlineZweed From Netherlands, joined Apr 2004, 455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1474 times:

GKirk, been sleeping in that anglo-dungeon for a long while?
I am swedish, will stay swedish for the rest of my life. My nationality will always be swedish. But I am a part and a member of the European Community. Which means, in case you didnt get that part that we cooperate across the borders and integrate with each other.


User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1466 times:

Kirkie - too bad ! The EU thinks of you as European, so you're stuck with it  Smile
Zer iss no ezcape ! Prepare to be assimilated, resistance is futile.


User currently offlineGKirk From UK - Scotland, joined Jun 2000, 24932 posts, RR: 56
Reply 18, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1462 times:

Ok, so I cant do a thing about it. Just as long as we dont start using the Euro  Big grin


When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
User currently offlineAndreas From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 6104 posts, RR: 31
Reply 19, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1457 times:

Ant vee haff vays to make you fill like European, Kirkie!! I only say: Rubber hose!

Not that we want you Scots anyway, IQ (and football quality) level is by all means low enough, we don't need you to push both levels further down!  Big grin Big grin



I know it's only VfB but I like it!
User currently offlineBanco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 53
Reply 20, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1454 times:

May I just express my admiration and respect to all our European neighbours, for being so kind and honourable as to admit the Scots into the family of peoples that is Europe.

I know some of you had reservations about this, indeed there was understandable opposition to even declaring them human, but we all must make sacrifices.

Mind you, he's right about the sodding Euro.  Big grin Big grin



She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
User currently offlineZweed From Netherlands, joined Apr 2004, 455 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 1448 times:

Dont blame the brits. They live on a Island.


User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 1429 times:

RE: Mind you, he's right about the sodding Euro.

Don't worry, it WILL happen, you mark my words.

We'll get you, my pretties, and your little dog too MwAAHAHAHAHA !!

Seriously, I think the UK will join the Euro eventually - may be a while, but I'm sure they will.


User currently offlineSebolino From France, joined May 2001, 3681 posts, RR: 4
Reply 23, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 1429 times:

They are now all European and now not French, German or Belgian.
But if thats the way they want to be, so be it



I wonder in which kind of newspaper you take your informations ...  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
Perhaps not the most reliable ones.


User currently offlineBanco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 53
Reply 24, posted (9 years 12 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 1410 times:

Seriously, I think the UK will join the Euro eventually - may be a while, but I'm sure they will.

I actually think it's hard to say. Public opinion is implacably opposed and, if anything, hardening. So, there will need to be a fundamental shift there. Can it happen? Absolutely, but not in the near future. So, we're getting into what might happen in the medium or long term. Heaven only knows then. It certainly could happen. Circumstances change.



She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
25 Post contains images GKirk : Sebolino, nothing wrong with the Scottish Sun All normal people read the Sun/Mirror papers like that, with the Posh people reading thon big papers lik
26 JGPH1A : RE: with the Posh people reading thon big papers like the Guardian, Financial Times etc. The ones with all those mul-ti-syl-lab-ic words and no boobs.
27 Post contains images Banco : This is where the classic assessment of the British newspapers in Yes, Prime Minister comes in. It was Bernard Woolley who said: "The Times is read by
28 Post contains images GKirk : Read The Sun, you know it makes sense
29 Zweed : With american, and most of the times a.net standards The Guardian would be considered as a Communist-paper
30 Thowman : There is only one use for the Sun, and that is for when you run out of toilet paper.
31 Post contains images Arsenal@LHR : All the continentals dislike the Sun, even a Brit-turned-Frenchie like JGPH1A, wonder why? Evening Standard is the way to do.
32 Post contains images Andreas : Thowman...you don't want to bring the Sun even remotely close to your a$$, there's so much printing ink of the cheapest kind on the paper, it would gi
33 Post contains images Klaus : Arsenal@LHR: All the continentals dislike the Sun, even a Brit-turned-Frenchie like JGPH1A, wonder why? Maybe because it´s a low-brow sewer rag that
34 Arsenal@LHR : Yeah you're right, i'm not a Sun reader, i read the Daily Mirror, a Pro-Europe tabloid, and the Times, which is quite neutral on Europe.
35 Post contains images Banco : Maybe because it´s a low-brow sewer rag that´s an embarrassment even by the modest british standards? Come now, Klaus. Don't sit on the fence, tell
36 Post contains images Klaus : Sorry, but it´s all the excitement I can spare for them at this moment...
37 Catatonic : No american commentry so far, how unlike them, usually this is a fave subject for euro bashing!
38 N6376m : Upon request: The United States of Europe - When I go to Georgia - I don't need to show papers. When I rent a DVD in Texas - I don't need to show that
39 N6376m : While we're at it the EU member states should only get one vote in NATO, the UN and all other international organizations. Time for those supporting E
40 Post contains images Klaus : N6376m, your entry has been counted... I think we´ve got all the usual silly prejudices together. Or are we missing anything? Guys?
41 N6376m : What's prejudiced about what I posted. One country = 1 vote. Who's do you suggest we vote off the security council permanent membership(England or Fra
42 Post contains images Tasha : "By the way 1 and 2 Euro coins are just a bad idea. Every time I'm over there I sound like a chime with all the change in my pocket. Finally how about
43 N6376m : Tasha - a high powered supermodel like you should only have $20's in your wallet. For us common folks 10 coins are a much bigger pain than 10 dollar b
44 Iakobos : Zweed, as far as I remember (1994) the only thing it took me was a 2 minutes visit to the police (vreemdelingen politie) and another 2 minutes visit t
45 MD11Engineer : Banco, Zweed, After having lived in Ireland for several years, I also think that this Napoleonic rule about registering wherever you live (like in Ger
46 Zweed : Interesting reading about Ireland there MD11. thanks.
47 Post contains images Leskova : MD11Engineer, I remember that time in the early 80s... We had just returned from living in the US for just under 3 years, so my parents had to get new
48 Kl911 : In France it's much easier now. I live here for 2.5 years, had my social security number, and I got my unemployment benefit when my last employer went
49 LHMark : Well, it's not like the EU is a recent, hastily-devised idea. The whole thing was concocted in 1947 to bind Germany economically to the rest of Europe
50 Catatonic : What's prejudiced about what I posted. One country = 1 vote. Who's do you suggest we vote off the security council permanent membership(England or Fra
51 Post contains images Banco : He's quite right though. As we saw over Iraq, Britain and France have identical positions on foreign affairs and always vote the same way.
52 N6376m : Guy, I complete agree that the UN security council is absolutely meaningless - however there appears to me to be a very high co-relation between EU fa
53 Post contains images Klaus : N6376m: I think we've also seen how people immediate resort to personal attacks - calling me prejudiced - when they can't defend their position agains
54 N6376m : Klaus - I guess you just make up facts to suit your arguments. What horror stories? What black helicopters do I mention. I did poke fun at the coins b
55 JGPH1A : RE: All the continentals dislike the Sun, even a Brit-turned-Frenchie like JGPH1A, wonder why? Who are you calling continental ? Anyway, I don't just
56 Sebolino : EU integration is a crock of $hit. It's some bureaucrat's attempt to have all you guys give up you national sovereignty and subscribe to a set of rule
57 Post contains images GKirk : Yet the blindness of the continental Europeans shows up again
58 Post contains images Klaus : N6376m: I guess you just make up facts to suit your arguments. What horror stories? What black helicopters do I mention. I did poke fun at the coins b
59 DABZF : I really don't know why moving within EU is somehow difficult? German colleague of mine moved to Finland some 3 years ago and the paper fight he had g
60 MD11Engineer : There was another thing: After having worked with the same employer in Ireland for two years (and having received a regular salary), I applied for a c
61 N6376m : You guys crack me up. Viva EU!
62 Iakobos : LHMark, The foundation of the EC was not in 1947. The year 1948 saw the first steps towards European cooperation, with three important babies: 1 Jan c
63 N6376m : As I said. Rah Rah Rah. The EU is the greatest invention since sliced bread. When are the trans-European id cards coming? Also when are all the indivi
64 Post contains images Klaus : N6376m: As I said. Rah Rah Rah. The EU is the greatest invention since sliced bread. Quick! Get your tin foil hat, or our evil mind control beams will
65 Zweed : N6376m You really dont get it do you? We still have your nations, we will always have your nations. But in Europe we can manage in many fields to do w
66 Post contains images GKirk : "We still have your nations, we will always have your nations" Not for long when Chirac gets his way
67 Zweed : i meant, our nations. of course. I was tired this morning. sorry
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