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Questions About Upcoming German Elections.  
User currently offlineMdsh00 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4124 posts, RR: 8
Posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 994 times:

I read this article on the BBC:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3669974.stm

What is the platform of this far-right party? I'm sure it's nothing like the far-Right in the US but what are some of their policies? Also, what are some of the reasons that eastern Germans are paid less?


"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a big fat white guy who is threatened by change."
49 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineZak From Greenland, joined Sep 2003, 1993 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 978 times:

its quite simple, west germany has given east germany about 70.000 euro per citizen in aid since the reunification, and all that the west got in return was a bunch of people who think capitalism means "working less then in communism while getting the government to pay for everything".
now that they realize that you actually have to work, they decide being unemployed and collecting welfare and whining about the good old days or demanding the reich back is the thing to do. god forbid they actually get off their asses and work.

disclaimer: i am well aware of the fact that there are exceptions to the rule and some east germans do actually work



10=2
User currently offlineGKirk From UK - Scotland, joined Jun 2000, 24914 posts, RR: 56
Reply 2, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 973 times:

Zak, I thought your "country" was the EU. Im surprised you know so much about German politics  Wink/being sarcastic


When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
User currently offlineFlying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4160 posts, RR: 36
Reply 3, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 966 times:

The "far-rights" exist in basically every country wolrd-wide. Most of its members admire the Nazis or at least some ideas they brought up. Mostly it is the attitude "my country is for my people" and "foreigners steal our jobs" - the arguments which have been repeated in history since centrurys in this this or that way. In Germany we have two parties which belong to the far-right wing: the DVU (Deutsche Volks Union) and the NPD (Nationale Partei Deutschland). Both have been in some state parlaments before, however the only think they did was to show their incompetence, nothing else. The same attribute fits to very far-left parties, which are basically the communists or - a bit weaker - the socialists.

Far-right parties are usually voted for when people are thinking that they have been forgotten or think that they are at an disadvantage, which - at least in the opinion of many people living in the eastern part of Germany - is currently the case.

After the reunification many people in the eastern part of Germany lost their jobs - and at the same time benifited from welfare programms to a very large extend. Essentially they had no real need to look for a new job. Now that the German budget is dark-red much needed reforms are on their way, especially the so-called Hartz IV which unites the social welfare and the unemployment welfare into one program but drastically cuts the spended amount, these people see their basis for living being cut - the welfare chequs are still coming in, but not as long before, and by far with less money on it. They are now forced to look for a new job (as a side not: when the Hartz IV reforms were announced suddenly the job market jumped and many more people started looking for jobs), and they are now an easy target for those who say "we bring you jobs by throwing out all foreigners working on your job", "we will restore all the spending programms we had before"...

Well, this "paid less" is a direct result of the reunification. In 1990 the average salaries in East Germany were about 60% that of the West Germans - no way the already rotten industry in the eastern part would be able to cope with a 40% jump in wages. The same applied to the state-owned retirement fund, no way it would be able to pay 100% of the retirement pay to all those "new" members of the fund living in the East. Thus it was seen as the best solution to slowly increase the pay in Eastern Germany to the West German standarts - nowadays it is around 90-100%.

Regards
Flying-Tiger



Flown: A319/320/321,A332/3,A380,AT4,AT7,B732/3/4/5/7/8,B742/4,B762/763,B772,CR2,CR7,ER4,E70,E75,F50/70,M11,L15,S20
User currently offlineLY7E7 From Israel, joined Jun 2004, 2235 posts, RR: 19
Reply 4, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 964 times:

Didn't Schroeder make some steps to outlaw the NPD?


2 things are endless: ignorance and space
User currently offlineFlying-Tiger From Germany, joined Aug 1999, 4160 posts, RR: 36
Reply 5, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 960 times:

They thought about it - but decided against it. It is easier to supervise them as a party. If they would outlaw them basically the NPD would just continue in the underground - and then it would be extremly difficult to follow their activities.

Regards
Flying-Tiger



Flown: A319/320/321,A332/3,A380,AT4,AT7,B732/3/4/5/7/8,B742/4,B762/763,B772,CR2,CR7,ER4,E70,E75,F50/70,M11,L15,S20
User currently offlinePelican From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 2531 posts, RR: 8
Reply 6, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 956 times:

Fortunatly Zak proves that stupid people are living everywhere in Germany.

I'm sure it's nothing like the far-Right in the US but what are some of their policies?

I wouldn't be too sure. Actually the NPD is a extremly xenophobic party and they're probably dangerous. They have nothing but xenophobia as their policy.
The DVU is a bunch of stupid bumkins who are financed by a millionaire from Munich who earns his money with Nazi-glorification (literature, but I wouldn't call it so).
Both parties gain profit from the frustration in East-Germany because of the high unemployment rates -between 15% and 40%. They say the unemployment is caused by foreigners who work in Germany and by the Globalization which is responsible that the bad "big capitalist companies" fire German employies and invest in the bad overseas.
Due to cut backs of the welfare system the frustration is even bigger than usual.
Both parties have made an agreement not to compete against each other anymore. Therefore their chances to win seats in an election is now greater than before.

Also, what are some of the reasons that eastern Germans are paid less?

That's quite simple if the supply is much bigger than the demand the prices will drop. -> To many unemployed for too little jobs.

pelican

[Edited 2004-09-19 13:47:42]

User currently offlinePelican From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 2531 posts, RR: 8
Reply 7, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 17 hours ago) and read 948 times:

Didn't Schroeder make some steps to outlaw the NPD?

Yes they did. But the German surpreme court decided to close the proceedings because of mistrial. Too many witnesses worked for the German intelligence service...

pelican


User currently offlineRacko From Germany, joined Nov 2001, 4856 posts, RR: 20
Reply 8, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 933 times:

The ironic point is that there are basically no foreigners in East Germany, yet they are ones voting for the far right...

I'm tired of the permanent whining by the East Germans, capitalism means more freedom but also more responsibility for yourself.

1,5 trillion € since 1990, that's 3/4 of Germany's GDP!



User currently offlineBREmer From Germany, joined May 2004, 551 posts, RR: 16
Reply 9, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 925 times:

I can't wait to see the first polls from the Saxony election. I think the NPD is way worse than the DVU. The DVU is basically another idiot right-wing party with no brains, the NPD actually hosts some of Germany's most dangerous skinhead groups, and some of them are even known for planning attacks on foreign and especially jewish institutions. If they get into the state parliament, they will enjoy the benefits of political immunity.

I understand life isn't easy for some people in East Germany, but if some unemployed idiots decide to protest against our government by giving their vote to a bunch of neonazis, they deserve to be unemployed and poor for the rest of their life! Especially in a country like Germany people should know better. And, after 15 years, sitting around doing nothing and crying like a kid deprived of candy because our very generous welfare is cut is just plain ridiculous.

 Angry


User currently offlineZak From Greenland, joined Sep 2003, 1993 posts, RR: 8
Reply 10, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 922 times:

Zak, I thought your "country" was the EU. Im surprised you know so much about German politics

since i happen to have relocated from madrid to cologne a while ago i happen to be quite up to date on german politics. apart from that, i do not understand why knowledge of a specific countries politics(especially the one you were born in) seems to be an argument against being an eu citizen?

Fortunatly Zak proves that stupid people are living everywhere in Germany.

i agree, even though i have not pointed it out specifically, i think we all agree on that 14 years after the fall of the wall, east germans have spread and are living everywhere in germany  Smile


"I'm tired of the permanent whining by the East Germans, capitalism means more freedom but also more responsibility for yourself."

the responsibility part is what many people in the east seem to have a problem with.



10=2
User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21418 posts, RR: 54
Reply 11, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 913 times:

I might add that there is also a lot of unjustified whining coming from the west, generously overlooking that in fact most eastern germans ("Ossies") do work hard for their money and most unemployed people want to work. Kohl´s 16 years of empty promises and stagnation did a lot of damage to the chances of the east.

It´s not all just petulance and stupidity.

Although voting for NPD or DVU (and to a lesser degree the PDS) clearly is stupid!  Nuts


User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13968 posts, RR: 63
Reply 12, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 907 times:

It seems that many East Germans have a problem with the flerxibility demanded in the modern world (Don´t flame me, guys, but I did my apprenticeship in the East at SXF in the old Interflug maintenance facility, now Lufthansa, and I used to live for several years in East Berlin, Lichtenberg in a Plattenbausiedlung,, after the wall came down, so I think I know what I´m talking about).
About one year before we finished our apprenticeships, Lufthansa made public that they wanted to move all 737 D-checks to Shannon, Ireland. The base in SXF would from then on only do c-checks and the number of staff would be drastically reduced (they laid off about 300 people). Of course we didn´t stand a chance of getting employed in Germany, not freshly out of an apprenticeship, with so many much more experienced mechanics on the dole. There were some discussions among us. Five of us (me one of them), all in their late twenties, decided to try our luck and to mover to Ireland, just to get a job (Shannon Aerospace Ltd. was looking for mechanics), but most of the guys rather wanted to go on the dole than moving out of their village and small towns (Königswusterhausen, Zossen... all small places south of Berlin) and away from their friends and family. Did they realise that, without any real working experience, they would never get a job?
There are vacant positions in Bavaria, Northrhine-Westfalia, Baden-Würtemberg, but most unemployed people in the East expect to have thir dream job to appear right in front of their homes.
Another thing is that apparently those Hartz IV reforms are facilitating the discovery of social-welfare cheats. Before dole money and social welfare were handed out by different communal, state and federal adminstrations with little communication between each other, making it very easy to play one against the other. A friend of mine is a judge at a social affairs court in my state Northrhine-Westfalia and he told me that he got fed up of Hartz IV trials. Acc. to him most cases relate to people being caught milking the system, like 20 years unemployed, having a holiday home in Spain and going on vacation 6 times a year. The new rules force unemployyed to declare their property, stating that, if you have property (savings accounts, land, shares) you should use them as well to cover your situation.

Now concerning the NPD, there was a move to get it banned as an organistion acting against the constitution, but there was such a chaos between the different police, intelligence authorities (both state and federal), that the defense could claim that they were acting as agent provocateurs, with one spy reporting about another one.
In public, the NPD states that they support the constitution, incl. democracy, but in private they clearly state that they want to abolish democracy ("too much talk, no acting" sounds familar, doesn´t it?) and to introduce a Führer state. It is not clear though who is supposed to be the Führer. THere are also frictions betweeen the DVU and the Republikaner, both run by right wing (neo fascist) millionaires, each of whom wants to be Hitler´s successor.The "owner" of the Republikaner is a former member of the Waffen-SS.
Fortunately for Germany there is a lot of infighting going on between the different groups. The only Neo-Nazi leader, who had the charisma to unify the groups was a guy called Michael Kühnen, but he was openly gay (like the SA leader Röhm in the 1920s-30s) and died of aids in the early 90s (many older Nazis rejected him as well because he was gay).
Usually, if elected into a communal or state parliament, the right wing parties make fools out of themselves, because their representatives come usuaslly unprepared to parliamentary sessions and their stereotypical answer is to blame everything on foreigners. Also, usually all democratic parties, from Greens and Socialists to the conservative Christian-Democrats, often agree to shun this group.
The problem is the violence of the supporters of such ultraright parties (after an attack ther party leadership openly distances itself from the criminals, else their party would be banned, but they support violent groups in secret, though hard to prove). I talked to some of them, who told me that they admired Hitler´s Germany, "because then Germany was feared and we could do what we liked", clearly speaking of the late 1930s. What a bunch of idiots!
One thing though is that Germany 2004 is different from Germany 1933. Any take over of a Neo-Nazi party in Germany would probably cause a violent reaction (not to speak of foreign intervention). The military are not as united and supportive as back then, with most soldiers and officers suppporting the social democrats, the same applies to the police. And most civilians would not accept a totalitarian Nazi party to rule the country. Expect a civil war like rebellion.

Jan


User currently offlineLY7E7 From Israel, joined Jun 2004, 2235 posts, RR: 19
Reply 13, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 901 times:

The "owner" of the Republikaner is a former member of the Waffen-SS.


The question is why is he out of jail.

with most soldiers and officers suppporting the social democrats

Is the Bundeswehr staff allowed to openly express their political views?



2 things are endless: ignorance and space
User currently offlineZak From Greenland, joined Sep 2003, 1993 posts, RR: 8
Reply 14, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 896 times:

Is the Bundeswehr staff allowed to openly express their political views?

i think you are not allowed to wear uniform at demonstrations but when in civil clothing and not on duty u can do and say wtf u want



10=2
User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13968 posts, RR: 63
Reply 15, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 896 times:

There have been Bundeswehr officers in full uniform on demonstrations against the NATO basing missiles in Germany in the 1980s. I think they had to face some disciplinary action. One thing is what a soldiers states in his function as a member of the Bundeswehr, another, what he says in private. The doctrine of the Bundeswehr is/was (until the recent move of professionalising) that a soldier is a citizen wearing a uniform, with all of the constitutional rights included (except where is is limited by law, e.g. for security or operational reasons) and he is sworn in on the constitution. I think Zak will be able to give us more information due to his experience in the Bundeswehr.

Jan

Concerning the Republikaner leader having been in the Waffen-SS, apparently he was just a private and not proven involved in war crimes. There have been hundred thousands like him in all branches of the German military inWW2. This on the other hand, didn´t stop him from glorifying the Waffen_ss by writing a book " I WAS THERE".

Jan


User currently offlineLY7E7 From Israel, joined Jun 2004, 2235 posts, RR: 19
Reply 16, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 894 times:

Jan,
I was under impression that the Waffen SS was a small, exclusive branch of the SS. Am I wrong?



2 things are endless: ignorance and space
User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13968 posts, RR: 63
Reply 17, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 885 times:

LY7E7,

Actually not. I did some research into the subject due to family reasons (my mother´s real father was a Waffen-SS officer and, while she was only two years old at the time he got killed in Russia she didn´t really know him, there were many looose ends in what I got told about him, I´m currently trying to sort out). Originaly the Waffen-SS got started because Himmler wanted to have his own armed forces, similar to Göring with his paratroopers and Luftwaffe regiments attached to his Luftwaffe. Back in the 1930s they were very exclusive, maximum recruitment age 21, no criminal history, "aryan check" for 150 years, top physical fitness (not even a filling permitted). But their problem was to find qualified officers and NCOs. The officers prefered to stay with the Wehrmacht (the Waffen-SS was being looked down by Wehrmacht members and was last in getting equipment, also the Wehrmacht didn´t want to have rival organisation come up).
Due to bad tactics during the Russian campaign, the Waffen-SS got the reputation of being daredevils and reckless, but they were also often deliberately put in suicidical posiotions by ther Wehrmacht command and had accordingly very high losses. This forced the Waffen-SS to loosen their recruitment standards about 1942, accepting older people or transfering people from the Allgemeine SS or even the Totenkopfverbände (the concentration camp guards) into the Waffen-SS. Esp. many members of the Totenkopfverbände had a criminal history. My grandfather was both in his late 30s-early 40s and also he had a criminal history (apparently he got nicked for embezzlement or tax fraud back in the 20s, when he worked as a bookkeeper and he used the SS to get respectability in Nazi Germany). Even though there was a decision at the beginning of the war that only the regular military could get draftees and the Waffen-SS only volunteers, later during the war, draftees were often sent to Waffen-SS units. Also, the Hitler Youths, used as a final defense in 1945, became automatically members of the Waffen-SS, which gave them quite a bit of trouble when caught by allies.
Also, don´t forget that after Juli 20th, 1944, Hitler didn´t trust the Wehrmmacht anymore and actually prefered the Waffen-SS, giving them more than their share of draftees and equipment.
This means my grandfather must have been at one time a member of the Allgemeine SS, but I don´t know what he was doing there. He apparently also was involved or at least witnessed war crimes (he was for a while based in Warsaw, but he died long before the uprising), and acc. to my mother, some letters exist or existed (I´ve never seen them), stating that it was something he couldn´t live with (apparently his later posting to Charkov and his resulting death was a suicidical move based on this). I´m still working on getting the loose ends of his biography cleared up, but after war many things, including the pictures of him in uniform (at least looking at them I could have found out which unit he belonged to, helping me to find the right archives), were destroyed by his family after the war.

Jan


User currently offlineNoUFO From Germany, joined Apr 2001, 7943 posts, RR: 12
Reply 18, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 885 times:

The SS was a small, exclusive group in the beginning but later turned into a far bigger sized branch, although not to the extend the SA did.

German right-wingers made it 14 times into parliaments after state elections (they never gained seats in the Bundestag after a federal election) but always for only 4 years. In the following election they gained between 0.1% and 1% of the votes.

It will be embarassing to see them taking seats in the parliaments, but they don't pose any risk on our democracy.



I support the right to arm bears
User currently offlineZak From Greenland, joined Sep 2003, 1993 posts, RR: 8
Reply 19, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 883 times:

here you go jan  Smile


§15WStG
(quick breakdown in english)

- on duty a soldier is not allowed to act in favour of any political direction. the right to voice his own opinion amongst soldiers is not touched by this

- within military areas during freetime, the right of free speech finds its limits at the comraderie(sp?). the soldier has to act in a way that the service and unity of the unit are not seriously affected. the solider must not advertise political groups, hold speeches, hand out flyers or act as a representative of a political group. respect amongst soldiers must not be endangered.

- the soldier must not wear any type of uniform during political events

- when in command a solider must not influence the political opinion of his troops in any way



10=2
User currently offlineZak From Greenland, joined Sep 2003, 1993 posts, RR: 8
Reply 20, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 879 times:

first preliminary results:


saxony:


CDU 43,2% (conservatives)
SPD 9,6% (social democrats)
Grüne 5,0% (greens)
FDP 5,8% (liberals)
PDS 22,6% (commies)
NPD 9% (gop)


brandenburg:


CDU 19,6% (conservatives)
SPD 32,6% (social democrats)
Grüne 3,4% (greens)
FDP 3,2% (liberals)
PDS 28,3% (commies)
DVU 6,1% (gop)



10=2
User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13968 posts, RR: 63
Reply 21, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 877 times:

This means off base, out of uniform, a soldier has the same rights as any other citizen.

BTW, I think the Bundeswehr is the only army, where a soldier has the DUTY to arrest any superior, who oders him to commit a crime ( this doesn´t mean speeding or parking a vehicle illegaly, but e.g. shooting POWs).

Jan


User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13968 posts, RR: 63
Reply 22, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 875 times:

LY7E7,

Two good books to read about the internal structure of the SS (albeit in German):
Kogon: Der SS Staat

(forgot the name of the author) Der Orden Unter Dem Hakenkreuz

Jan


User currently offlineBREmer From Germany, joined May 2004, 551 posts, RR: 16
Reply 23, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 866 times:

Schroeder's SPD only got .6% more votes than the NPD! That's insane!
So far the SPD would get 12 seats in the Saxon parliament, NPD 11.
At least the Greens have a chance of making it into the parliament in Saxony.

Anyways, a sad day for this country.  Crying


User currently offlineLY7E7 From Israel, joined Jun 2004, 2235 posts, RR: 19
Reply 24, posted (9 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 860 times:

Thanks for the info Jan. My German is aparently not fluent enough to read that book (Aber Ich mache einen kleinen Fortschritt  Smile ), but I'll look for a translation or a similar one.

In IDF a soldier has a duty to oppose an illegal order, but he is not obliged to arrest his superior.

How many seats are there in Sachsen and Brandenburg landtags?



2 things are endless: ignorance and space
25 Mdsh00 : Wow I missed a lot while I was asleep. Thanks for the information. My question to all the Germans. A lot of you were touching on how east Germans expe
26 Racko : The educated ones are moving to the West, the dumb ones stay and become Neo-Nazis or Communists. Not true for all regions, there are a few areas (espe
27 Post contains images Klaus : Racko: The educated ones are moving to the West, the dumb ones stay and become Neo-Nazis or Communists. Fortunately "we" in the west are so much bette
28 777heavy : 1. These results a really sad, bad day for Brandenburg and Saxony! 2. "...East Germans expect a lot and are sometimes lazy..." Wrong, completely wrong
29 Post contains images Aloges : Whew... yeah, us "Wessis" are the hard-working guys who spoon-feed the ungrateful "Ossies". Seriously, it's not as simple as that. Quite a few busines
30 LY7E7 : . How is the new generation that didn't grow up under communism in that regard? They are 13.
31 Pelican : My question to all the Germans. A lot of you were touching on how east Germans expect a lot and are sometimes lazy. One word: prejudices Of course the
32 MD11Engineer : Actually the Bundeswehr raised an alert a few months ago. They are doing educational and intelligence tests on all recruits and discovered lately that
33 StevenUhl777 : Hmmm...interesting topic! Some questions/observations: - I'm surprised that some of the German posters here still refer to 'West Germany' and 'East Ge
34 Zak : - Zak: In your poll results for Saxony (which includes Dresden, right?) and Brandenburg, you put "(gop)" next to the DVU and NPD parties. Are you sugg
35 L410Turbolet : If the federal elections were held today, for Chancellor, what are Schroeder's prospects for reelection at this point? Is it difficult to defeat an in
36 Klaus : That was quite correct. The elections we´re talking about here are state parliament elections; And those are not "synchronized" with the federal elec
37 Pelican : - I'm surprised that some of the German posters here still refer to 'West Germany' and 'East Germany', as if they were still separate nations, 14 year
38 Post contains images NoUFO : Never say never. Of course it will take decades but it is possible. Former Chancellor Helmut Schmidt (Social Democrat, in the US maybe still known as
39 BREmer : - Zak: In your poll results for Saxony (which includes Dresden, right?) and Brandenburg, you put "(gop)" next to the DVU and NPD parties. Are you sugg
40 North County : You wild and crazy Germans- always kidding around: Calling former communists lazy, and Neo Nazis the GOP! Now by Zak logic then the unification of Ge
41 MD11Engineer : I think the biggest problem, we are still digesting, are Helmut Kohl´s election promises of 1990, about "blooming landscapes" in the East.He, needing
42 Mdsh00 : When the GDR ended, many companies were so old and run down that it was completely useless to make any effort to bring them back into business. The co
43 MD11Engineer : Because in regards to consumer products, the west German industry had so many overcapacities, it could have provided everything for the east without b
44 Post contains images L410Turbolet : I think it's a job for political scientists and sociologists do "dissect" the election results and see whether it's mostly just a protest vote or whet
45 Klaus : Early analyses seem to confirm that most votes for DVU and NPD were indeed protest votes and do not indicate a closer ideological association. It won
46 GDB : 'Good Bye Lenin' is a terrific film, highly recommended, even though a black comedy, it highlights the massive change in culture the East Germans went
47 North County : Quick Change - Southern US states post 1865.
48 Zak : I agree, the GOP doesn't come anywhere close to the neo-nazi parties in Germany. DVU and NPD are extremist groups with slogans like 'Work only for Ger
49 NoUFO : Zak, compare the political agenda of the Republicans to that of the NPD or DVU and you will easily spot major differences. If there is a German party
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