Sponsor Message:
Non Aviation Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
NY Judge Strikes Down Ban On Same-Sex Marriage  
User currently offlineRJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3521 times:

http://www.newsday.com/news/local/wire/newyork/ny-bc-ny--gaymarriage-ny0204feb04,0,1014259,print.story?coll=ny-region-apnewyork

NEW YORK -- A Manhattan judge declared Friday that the section of state law that forbids same-sex marriage is unconstitutional _ the first ruling of its kind in New York and one that if upheld on appeal would allow gay couples to wed.

State Supreme Court Justice Doris Ling-Cohan ruled that the words "husband," "wife," "groom" and "bride" in relevant sections of the Domestic Relations Law "shall be construed to mean 'spouse,"' and "all personal pronouns ... shall be construed to apply equally to either men or women."

Ling-Cohan ruled on the side of five same-sex couples who were denied marriage licenses. She said the New York City clerk could not deny a license to any couple solely on the ground that the two are of the same sex.

56 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3504 times:

Wow, I've been thinking about this and it's wonderful news. Mayor Bloomberg is running for re-election this year, and I seriously doubt he will appeal the ruling. So in 30 days, gay couples will start marrying in NYC!

If the city doesn't appeal, is there anything that can stop this?

http://www.lambdalegal.org/cgi-bin/iowa/documents/record?record=1634


User currently offlineJake056 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3498 times:

The city will appeal the ruling. trust me. The state legislature will also get in on the act. So I wouldn't go mailing any invites yet.

User currently offlineRJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3491 times:

The city will appeal the ruling. trust me. The state legislature will also get in on the act. So I wouldn't go mailing any invites yet.

A mayor who is pro-gay marriage is going to appeal a ruling allowing gay marriage in an election year? The chances of that happening are low.......


User currently offlineVSLover From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1897 posts, RR: 22
Reply 4, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 3483 times:

i seriously doubt the city would appeal. first off mayor bloomberg has a quite liberal stance towards civil unions and has said it time and time again. second, in an election run-up it would be disastrous for him to even side against gay marriage with the city something like 90% democratic and really probably like 40% gay (kidding).

remember this is a mayor who switched party affiliations simply to be able to run for mayor in the first place and who continually distances himself as best he can from republicans.

but the state legislature...well thats a different story, and governor pataki is the worst thing ever to happen to the state and the city, so there wont be many surprises there.


User currently offlineJake056 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 3465 times:

The city will appeal. There is a world of difference between "marriage" and "civil union". Support for one does not necessarily translate into support for the other.

Mayor Bloomberg is practical politician. He will get around this by saying that while he supports civil unions, the issue of "gay marriage" is one that will have to be decided in NYS (since it is a state issue), by the state legislature, the statewide electorate, or the NYS Court of Appeals--or some combo of the foregoing.

This issue is not one that is to be decided by a lone trial court judge, and he will view it as his duty as mayor to appeal.


User currently offlineSFOMEX From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 3464 times:

Does Gov Pataki have the legal ground to appeal if the Mayor didn't appeal the ruling?

User currently offlineJake056 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 3453 times:

If the city of New York decides not to appeal, NYS through the state attorney general's office could have standing to appeal. That is because the NYS Attorney General has previously issued a formal opinion that it is against the laws and regulations of the state for same sex couples to wed. This is not a city issue, it is a state issue.

Please note that the mayor of New Paltz, N.Y. (who tried to wed same sex couples) recently had criminal charges reinstated against him for failing to carry out his duties in executing the laws of NY. In other words he was purposefully doing that which the State forbids. So he violated his oath of office to uphold the laws of the state.

Thus, I do believe the city will appeal regardless of this being an election year.



User currently offlineRjpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 3399 times:

The city will appeal. There is a world of difference between "marriage" and "civil union". Support for one does not necessarily translate into support for the other

Not really. Many gays couldn't care less about the word "marriage"; equal benefits and rights is what is important.

Mayor Bloomberg is practical politician. He will get around this by saying that while he supports civil unions, the issue of "gay marriage" is one that will have to be decided in NYS (since it is a state issue), by the state legislature, the statewide electorate, or the NYS Court of Appeals--or some combo of the foregoing.

I doubt it. It will create an uproar here in NYC. There are ways for Christian right-wing groups to stop this; Getting Bloomberg to appeal likely isn't one of them. There is absolutely NO upside for Bloomberg to appeal.

Does Gov Pataki have the legal ground to appeal if the Mayor didn't appeal the ruling?

I don't think so. However, certain groups might seek a court order to stop it, etc.

As the article above said, The ruling (which is stayed for 30 days in case the city chooses to appeal) says the New York City clerk may no longer deny marriage licenses to same-sex couples. If the city chooses to appeal the case, it has about a month to file a notice in state appeals court.


User currently offlineEzra From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 475 posts, RR: 2
Reply 9, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 3392 times:

The city should appeal, even if it takes an agnostic view on the issue. Otherwise, the protection afforded by this ruling will be tenuous until a ruling ensues from the NY Court of Appeals.

User currently offlineQANTASforever From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 3381 times:

This is if nothing more a step in the right direction. I applaud State Supreme Court Justice Doris Ling-Cohan on this decision.

QFF


User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 3339 times:

Judge Doris Ling-Cohan just followed The Law. I personally don't agree with her [nor The Law] but I respect her/it.

User currently offlineJetJock22 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3321 times:

I personally find this very troubling, but I guess that makes me a gay hater.

User currently offlineXpat From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 634 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3314 times:

"I personally find this very troubling" WHY?

And let's not bring the Bible and Christianity into it, please.



The only thing we have to fear is the sky falling on our heads. -Asterix
User currently offlineJetJock22 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3310 times:


"WHY?"

Because the girl I was engaged to and was planning on spending the rest of my life with just up and decided on Thanksgiving that she was gay and left me for another woman. Have that happen to ya and it doesn't put that lifestyle too high on your list. I guess I'm just an old school American who believes in a mom and a dad rasing the kids to be morally fit, God fearing people is the right thing to do. I feel bad for the kids who have to go to school today and get made fun of because they have 2 moms or 2 dads. To honestly answer your question, I just flat out find it wrong and if that explanation isn't good enough, I'm sorry, but that's the best you're gonna get. I don't have some in depth, deeply religious or moral speech to give about it, I just think it is wrong. And if that makes me a gay hater in yall's eyes, so be it. It's the way I feel and it's not going to change.


User currently offlineMBMBOS From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2616 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3307 times:

"Because the girl I was engaged to and was planning on spending the rest of my life with just up and decided on Thanksgiving that she was gay and left me for another woman. "

Geez, that's a really lousy thing to have happen. Sorry to hear about it.

"I feel bad for the kids who have to go to school today and get made fun of because they have 2 moms or 2 dads."

So the solution here is to banish gay marriage as opposed to teaching children to accept others no matter what their family situation might be? Interesting choice.

"...and if that explanation isn't good enough, I'm sorry, but that's the best you're gonna get."

Fine, as long as you understand that you refuse to reason for your beliefs and have so far lost this argument.

"And if that makes me a gay hater in yall's eyes, so be it. It's the way I feel and it's not going to change."

Well, at least you realize that you're a bigot. At least that's something.

- MBM


User currently offlineRJpieces From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 3305 times:

Some interesting points raised by the NY papers today.

--State Attorney General Eliot Spitzer said he will not intercede, asserting that the ruling pertained solely to New York City
--Mayor Bloomberg is scheduled to give a speech tonight at the annual dinner of the Human Rights Campaign, a national gay rights group. So the timing can't be worse for him.
--Bloomberg, and former Mayor Rudy Giuliani, both have said they support gay marriage.
--Mayoral candidates have spoken out already. Democratic front-runner Fernando Ferrer, City Council Speaker Gifford Miller, Queens Congressman Anthony Weiner and Manhattan Borough President Virginia Fields all spoke out in favor of the decision--with Miller and Ferrer urging Bloomberg not to fight it.
--One Republican insider speculated Bloomberg would anger more voters by appealing it than by letting it lie.


User currently offlineJetJock22 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3295 times:

"Well, at least you realize that you're a bigot. At least that's somethin"

There seems to be a big double standard here. It is ok for gay rights supporters to say the people that oppose that lifestyle are bigots, gay haters, close minded, whatever, and people seem to be ok with it. Yet when people like me speak out against it and voice our opinions, we are branded as gay haters and bigots and the like. Doesn't calling me a bigot or gay hater put us on the same playing field?


User currently offlineMBMBOS From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2616 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3290 times:

Here's the definition of bigot, JetJock22: "A prejudiced person who is intolerant of any opinions differing from his own."

Do you see yourself in this definition?

I am perfectly comfortable calling you a "bigot" because you have acknowledged that a) that you strongly disapprove of homosexuality and b) you have no intention of discussing the issue reasonably.

But instead, you try to turn the tables on this and accuse others of creating a double standard. I don't see other people on this forum posturing that they will never change their mind or refusing to even argue a point.

- MBM


User currently offlineJetJock22 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3284 times:

I'm not trying to turn the tables, i was just raising a point. But just because I am not going to change my opinion, does that make me a bigot? I wasn't accusing you of trying to create a double standard, I was simply saying it seems like there is one with society, that's all. If you don't think so, that's fine, I can respect that and I respect your opinion. I don't agree with it, but I respect it.

User currently offlineMBMBOS From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2616 posts, RR: 1
Reply 20, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 3279 times:

"But just because I am not going to change my opinion, does that make me a bigot?"

The combination of disdaining a whole class of people and refusing to be open-minded to discussion is the very definition of bigotry.

There is nothing wrong with remaining true to your principles. Just keep in mind that your principle must always stand up to scrutiny - especially your own personal scrutiny.

Okay, I'm going to play the "age" card here (something I dislike doing). The older I get, the less I perceive the world in black-and-white terms. Now, some people on this forum would accuse me of sliding down the slippery slope of moral relativism. But I think it happens naturally to people who think and grow as they age.

I've just come to the point in my life where I'm not going to waste my time judging others.

I just think it's really important for someone of your age to think about things - to look at issues in a different light, to reconsider, to reevaluate. If your beliefs are built on a solid foundation, then they'll hold up. If not, then you will embrace a truer platform of beliefs.

For what it's worth, keep it in mind.

- MBM


User currently offlinePdpsol From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 1120 posts, RR: 5
Reply 21, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 3252 times:

Guys,

I am attending the HRC gala dinner here in NYC this evening with a big group of friends [it starts ~2hrs]. I had absolutely NO idea Bloomberg had been invited to attend and am now VERY interested in listening to what he has to say.

I will post my reactions to his speech when it get back!!

PS: I am very excited to hear what everyone will say this evening!!

[Edited 2005-02-05 22:41:12]

User currently offlineSFOMEX From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 3248 times:

Talking about values, bigotry and tolerance. What would you say of somebody who supports gay rights and civil unions, yet he/she believes that marriage should be only for a man and a woman?

User currently offlineMBMBOS From United States of America, joined May 2000, 2616 posts, RR: 1
Reply 23, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 3240 times:

"What would you say of somebody who supports gay rights and civil unions, yet he/she believes that marriage should be only for a man and a woman?"

I'd like to hear what you have to say about it.

- MBM


User currently offlineJake056 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 291 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (9 years 10 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3224 times:

Mayor Bloomberg said the city will appeal the ruling. While he supports gay marriage, he believes it is best left decided to higher courts and the people. He does not want the chaos that San Francisco had a few months ago.

Thought this is how it would turn out in NY. Stay tuned.


25 Aerorobnz : Jolly good - it's not the entire country, but it's a start.
26 ConcordeBoy : and decided on Thanksgiving that she was gay and left me for another woman. No... she decided to leave you on Thnxgvg. The b!tch LONNNNNG since knew s
27 Yanksn4 : This ruling once again affirms my believe that the Congress should pass a constitutional amendment that out-laws Homosexual marriage. If the homosexua
28 RJpieces : These judges have too much power and need to be restrained from imposing their beliefs on the country. The exact same statement could be applied to Ci
29 Jasepl : The exact same statement could be applied to Civil Rights for African Americans decades ago. Or to laws banning interracial marriage. That's true. But
30 Falcon84 : These judges have too much power and need to be restrained from imposing their beliefs on the country. Yanksn4, judges only seem to have too much pow
31 KyleLosAngeles : JetJock, if your girlfriend had left you for another guy - would you feel hate for the heterosexual 'lifestyle' ? Think about it. It's understandable
32 Falcon84 : Kyle, excellent point. I think JetJock was predisposed to feel loathing and bigotry for gays to begin with, and this situation only reinforces that di
33 JetJock22 : Predisposed or not, I still don't agree with the lifestyle. Doesn't mean I hate gay people as I have a few friends who are gay. I just don't agree wit
34 QANTASFOREVER : Marriage in the eyes of the state is a legal union involving certain legal rights and responsibilities to each other and to the state. As tax-paying c
35 Falcon84 : I still don't agree with the lifestyle. Neither do I, but I'm not predisposed as you are to deny them of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness u
36 Post contains images Mir : This ruling once again affirms my believe that the Congress should pass a constitutional amendment that out-laws Homosexual marriage. If the homosexua
37 Flybyguy : I agree that judges should not impose their belief systems upon the law. However, I feel they should interpret the law with intelligence. And by havin
38 Mir : I agree that judges should not impose their belief systems upon the law. However, I feel they should interpret the law with intelligence. Agreed. Howe
39 Avek00 : "If gay marriage were to be legalized nationwide right now, I really don't think that any of us would notice a big difference when we woke up. In fact
40 TACAA320 : Confirmed. Mayor Bloomberg, according with CNN Headline News, said that the City of N.Y. is appealing Judge Doris Ling-Cohan decision. Will see what t
41 Xpat : "What would you say of somebody who supports gay rights and civil unions, yet he/she believes that marriage should be only for a man and a woman?" I'd
42 Post contains links and images PacificWestern : For all of those who are so vehemently opposed to gay marriage/unions, the following link should be an inspiration. Better yet, why not travel up to C
43 Post contains links Jaysit : http://www.nytimes.com/2005/02/06/nyregion/06marriage.html Mayor Bloomberg will appeal the decision to the NY Court of Appeals, as he should in order
44 TACAA320 : "The Mayor has also publicly stated that he supports gay marriages." Isn't 2005 an election year?
45 Jaysit : "The Mayor has also publicly stated that he supports gay marriages." Isn't 2005 an election year? Oh, is that why GWB kissed the hairy, droopy behinds
46 Rjpieces : Isn't 2005 an election year? It's New York City. I take great pride in the fact that NYC is the most culturally advanced city in the US and perhaps t
47 Mir : Isn't 2005 an election year? Indeed it is. And the cool thing about New York City is that it is probably going to HELP him to have made that statement
48 SFOMEX : Oh, is that why GWB kissed the hairy, droopy behinds of his evangelical friends to support a constitutionally If the libertarian wing of the GOP succe
49 Jaysit : Jaysit, why do you hate Evangelicals? You seem to hate their beliefs and they seem to hate your lifestyle. I dislike them for the scant respect they h
50 JetJock22 : Why do I deserve to have to listen to the gay people I work with talk about their sex lives and their "escapades" yet I can't listen to a conservative
51 Post contains images Falcon84 : JetJock, by your own admission YOU ARE A GAY HATER! Seriously, I would make a stink about it at work, or I would take it to a lawyer or something. No,
52 SFOMEX : Jaysit: You missed my point. I know what discrimination means and how gays have had to endure it. My point was that you used similar hateful words to
53 Jaysit : Tell me, did you really need to write "hairy, droopy behinds of his evangelical friends" and "his merry band of ugly evangelicals" to express your ide
54 Mir : Why do I deserve to have to listen to the gay people I work with talk about their sex lives and their "escapades" yet I can't listen to a conservative
55 ConcordeBoy : but I can't tell them to stop, because I'd be considered a gay hater. That's bullsh!t and you know it. If people are truly engaging in the action of w
56 Jaysit : Why do I deserve to have to listen to the gay people I work with talk about their sex lives and their "escapades" yet I can't listen to a conservative
Top Of Page
Forum Index

This topic is archived and can not be replied to any more.

Printer friendly format

Similar topics:More similar topics...
Judge Strikes Down Nebraska Ban On Gay Marriage posted Fri May 13 2005 03:48:30 by Travelin man
Judge Strikes Down CA Gay Marriage Ban posted Tue Mar 15 2005 02:01:46 by Mdsh00
Same-sex Marriage Demonstrations In Italy posted Sat Jan 14 2006 18:23:22 by ManuCH
Canada Passes Same Sex Marriage Bill! posted Wed Jul 20 2005 22:40:16 by KLMA330
Same-Sex Marriage OK'd In Spain posted Thu Jun 30 2005 18:28:23 by Johnboy
Canada: Same-sex Marriage Bill Is Passed. posted Wed Jun 29 2005 03:36:40 by Jean Leloup
Same-Sex Marriage In Canada Come Thursday posted Tue Dec 7 2004 23:43:53 by SKYSERVICE_330
Majority Of Canadians Support Same Sex Marriage! posted Thu May 10 2001 19:16:04 by Chrisa330
Same Sex Mountie Marriage posted Sat Jul 1 2006 04:57:21 by Greasespot
Ban Of Health Care For Same Sex Partners Fails. posted Fri Nov 5 2004 20:10:07 by Gigneil