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I'm Tired Of BS Laws!  
User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4368 posts, RR: 6
Posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1442 times:
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After reading posts on a.net etc. I've came to conclusion that the U.S. is behind on some of it's laws, and some make no sense what so ever. I would imagine many of these have been made by religious believers.

*You can serve your country at 18 but can't drink or gamble until 21.
*You can smoke your lungs out at 18, but can't by a lottery ticket until 21 in most states.
* You can drive at 16 and do a cross country solo in a plane across the U.S., but yet again, can't smoke or drink, or sign a contract.
* You can sign a loan agreement for $10 million at 18, but can't buy a $1 lotto ticket in some states because you have to be 21.
* In Iowa, Missouri, South Carolina, and a few other states the legal age of consent is 14 (as long as within 5 years of your partner), but you can't even drive yet (which yes is young, but most kids know all of the risks and do it anyways, and I think that sounds reasonable).
* In Nevada, which really gets on my nerves, if you are under 21 you can't stand within 10 feet of a slot machine, which I find very unreasonable.

What I think is reasonable:
*13 for "Mature" rated video games, instead of 17, which is ridiculously high.
*14 for sex (within 5 years of partner), after completing sex Ed., otherwise 16.
*16 for drivers license.
*16 for alcohol, after completing a course teaching the risks of drinking, otherwise 18.
*16 for smoking after completing a course teaching the risks of smoking, otherwise 18.
*18 for contracts
*18 for gambling

Kids are maturing faster these days, making these laws outdated IMO. Some interesting alcohol statistics:

Alcohol use is 50% at age 14, 75% by 16, 85% by 18, and 90% by age 20, meaning 90% of the population has broken the law by the time they reach legal drinking age.

Now before all of you go rushing to my profile to see how old I am, I'll tell you flat out that I'm 14.

Anybody have any opinions?



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39 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineUnited4EverDEN From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 1429 times:

You can serve your country at 18 but can't drink or gamble until 21

That is probably a good thing. You can drink on military bases though. The gambling thing is good, as people at even 18 don't quite have a sense of value for money.

You can smoke your lungs out at 18, but can't by a lottery ticket until 21 in most states

Hmmm.... Lottery here is 18, I want to see a source on the lottery being 21 in most states.

You can drive at 16 and do a cross country solo in a plane across the U.S., but yet again, can't smoke or drink, or sign a contract.

So, not ANY 16 year old can do a cross country, you have to earn it. If kids were allowed toi drink/smoke, the priorities would be mixed up. School grades would drop and we would have more alcoholics and smokers, since allowing is saying, 'yeah it is ok.'

You can sign a loan agreement for $10 million at 18, but can't buy a $1 lotto ticket in some states because you have to be 21

I cannot think of any 18 year old signing a 10 million dollar loan, let alone one of a few thousand. They have no credit and stats show that more and more kids are going into bankruptcy with credit cards, etc. So, is it bad that it is 21 in some states to buy a lotto ticket?

Alcohol use is 50% at age 14, 75% by 16, 85% by 18, and 90% by age 20, meaning 90% of the population has broken the law by the time they reach legal drinking age.

So you are saying we should change the laws just so kids won't be breaking them. I will say I am strongly opposed to lowering the ages for drinking/smoking/driving/gambling/etc. UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES.


User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1420 times:

You can drink on military bases though

WRONG. Period. Military Base will adopt local law for drinking age, or simply declare legal age is 21.


User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4368 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1412 times:
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BS im tellin ya. If i risk my life fighting a war I'll be damned if I cant have a drink.


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User currently offlineNWA742 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1406 times:

Kids are maturing faster these days






-NWA742


User currently offlineUSAFHummer From United States of America, joined May 2000, 10685 posts, RR: 53
Reply 5, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1389 times:

The lottery age in most states is 18...in fact I don't know of any states offhand that have a lottery whose age is 21...if so, its definitely the minority...

As for non-lottery gambling, that also varies highly by state...in Florida for instance, the age is 18 (at least at the Seminole Hard Rock, though they only have poker tables and slots)

The drinking ages used to be lower, around 18 or so, then about 20-25 years ago or so (maybe more?) the federal government basically blackmailed the states to raise it to 21 or they would cut highway funding

Greg



Chief A.net college football stadium self-pic guru
User currently offlineDLKAPA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1384 times:

Quoting "NWA742":
Kids are maturing faster these days



The fact that the two most mature posts in this thread came from a 14 year old from Iowa and a 17 year old from Denver really do alot to prove your point, don't they NWA742?

Quoting "United4EverDEN":
That is probably a good thing. You can drink on military bases though. The gambling thing is good, as people at even 18 don't quite have a sense of value for money.


Ryan, I disagree. Though it is true I've seen many a kid down here go and run out their credit card within the first month of their freshman year, I've also seen many people under 21 who are very smart with their money. You for example, spend your money on camera supplies from your hard earned wages at a small ice cream shop (when do I get my free TCBY?), rather than on something that you will end up loosing in two months time.

Quoting "Iowaman":
What I think is reasonable:
*13 for "Mature" rated video games, instead of 17, which is ridiculously high.


Agreed. It's this complete fallacy that somehow "dune" caused the Columbine tragedy. I'll be willing to bet all my life savings and future income that they were gonna do it with or without Dune and that the computer game had nothing to do with it. If the kid can't handle it, let the parents decide, not Wal-Mart

Quoting "Iowaman":
*14 for sex (within 5 years of partner), after completing sex Ed., otherwise 16.


Personally I think sex ed is a complete joke. Sure it's teaching you some valuable lessons, but the way I was tought, it was "If you have sex, you're gonna get AIDS and die a horrible lonely death." What needs to be tought instead of abstinence is safe sex.

Quoting "Iowaman":
*16 for drivers license.


Ahh those were the good old days...

Quoting "Iowaman":
*16 for alcohol, after completing a course teaching the risks of drinking, otherwise 18.


This works if you haven't considered the above driving age. You now realize that you are giving 16 year olds the legal privelage to drink and drive? What kind of controls do you have envisioned for when 100,000 sixteen year olds die overnight from drunk driving related accidents?

Quoting "Iowaman":
*16 for smoking after completing a course teaching the risks of smoking, otherwise 18.


I am gonna have to disagree with this one. Make the smoking age 21, or 18 for those in the military (hell if you're getting ready to die, that smoke might feel pretty good). Smoking tobacco is statistically more dangerous than smoking marijuana, in that there have never been any recorded deaths caused by someone's body reacting badly to the Tetrahydracanabannol that is in weed.

Quoting "Iowaman":
*18 for contracts


Again, I have to disagree, I think it should be 16 with an attorneys signature preasent as well that says the person signing the contract understands what he/she is signing, or 18 without attorney's signature

Quoting "Iowaman":
*18 for gambling


When you turn 18, come to Colorado to buy your first powerball ticket, it will likely be the only one you'll ever have a strong desire to purchase (I'm 19 now, I've only bought 2 in my entire life, one was on my 18th bday).

Quoting "United4EverDEN":
So, not ANY 16 year old can do a cross country, you have to earn it. If kids were allowed toi drink/smoke, the priorities would be mixed up. School grades would drop and we would have more alcoholics and smokers, since allowing is saying, 'yeah it is ok.'


The law says it's ok, but the more influential factor than the law (hopefully) is the Parents. They still have a job to do.

Quoting "United4EverDEN":
So you are saying we should change the laws just so kids won't be breaking them. I will say I am strongly opposed to lowering the ages for drinking/smoking/driving/gambling/etc. UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES.


No, he is saying the laws should be adjusted to match the times. For example, Europe's drinking age is 16. I'm sure we've all seen the pictures of our favorite british lady getting drunk on smirnoff, and that's ok, it's legal there. The Euro's are educated much better when it comes to the dangers of Alcohol and driving, and its no surprise that there are so few DUI incidents in Europe when compared to the US.


User currently offlineN317AS From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 1364 times:

You can do any thing you want AS LONG AS YOU DON"T GET CAUGHT!!!  Innocent

User currently offlineSLC1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 1357 times:

I've come to the conclusion that the legal drinking age doesn't make a difference at all (especially over 18), so what's the point of imposing a minor inconvenience for those under 21? I say that the drinking age should be 18, or 19 if you don't want Seniors in High School to have legal access, I think that is reasonable. And yeah, probably not a good idea to have the legal drinking age and legal driving age coincide.

User currently offlineFoxiboy From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2004, 208 posts, RR: 4
Reply 9, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 1343 times:

DALKAPA Sorry but you are wrong i dont know about main land europe but in the UK you have to be 18 to drink legally,17 to drive,age of consent is 16,18 to vote, but most of europe the age for drinking is 18.

User currently offlineCatholic2006 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 357 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 1329 times:

I like the drinking age thing. First of all, even when I will be able to drink, I am not going to do it because alcohol is stupid and nasty and whatever else. TOO MANY ACCIDENTS WITH TEENAGE DRIVERS (trust me, I'm a teen and I took driver's ed). Serving your country? If you aren't married with children, what is the problem? It's not guaranteed that you will NOT come back home. If you think teens are actually in fact more mature these days, guess again. Look at how many teens are pregnant, overdose, commit suicide, get drunk, go to un-chaperoned parties. It's horrible and it is killing the next generation. Ages are so important because you need to possess maturity to engage in things like gambling, driving, and so on and so forth.

-Chris



Ne vous inquietez pas. Je ne vous hais pas . . . . encore, mais faites attention !
User currently offlineUshermittwoch From Germany, joined Jan 2004, 2964 posts, RR: 16
Reply 11, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1311 times:

Well in Germany it works like this:

Age of consent 14 (if the partner is under 21), 16 and then everyone can take a turn.
 Big grin

Drinking age is 16 for beer, wine etc. (basicially everything under 20% vol., excluding drinks that contain hard liquor (e.g. cans of Vodka Lemon et al.). If you are over 18, then you're free to drink what you want. If your parents/guardian consent, you can drink beer etc. with them in public when you're 14.

Voting is 18 on federal level. Lower levels are 16. You have to be 21 if you want to be elected into an office.

Driving is 18, although scooters ec. an be ridden with 16, a well as the "minicars", thanks to European legislation (a lot of death's waiting to happen)

All in all, it's not perfect, but then again, it's not too bad either.

Problem in the US is that alcohol and sex are being tabooed, making them way more interesting than they are. IF kids would get tought about sex, especially the risk of unnprotected sex, then there would be way less danger with it and teenage pregnancy would go down. Funny how countries with GOOD SEX EDUCATION have way lower rates than the SO RELIGIOUS USA.
Same goes for drinking, if people wouldn't demonize it and parents would make agreements with their children to pick them up and not wanting to kill them for being drunk, then there would be WAY LESS accidents. Of course you will always have the disadvantage of lacking public transport in most areas, but SENSIBLE parenting and handling of these situations will improve the situation. The same goes for adults when they drink!
If the hypocrisy stops, so will a lot of unwanted problems that go along with the stigmatising of booze and boobs (or whatever). Moderations is the way to go, but that is something the US society has to learn in general.  Smile



Where have all the tri-jets gone...
User currently offlineJsnww81 From United States of America, joined Jan 2002, 2017 posts, RR: 15
Reply 12, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 1278 times:

Ushermittwoch hit the nail on the head.

It's because we scandalize everything that we have so many issues with our young people. Kids are told constantly, from the time they're in the cradle, that drinking is BAD and sex is BAD and smoking is BAD and everything is BAD, BAD, BAD, BAD.

So what's a rebellious teen to do? Immediately reach out and embrace everything they've been told is BAD.

In many other parts of the world, teens are told the straight scoop on all of the issues - the pluses and minuses are explained to them in straight talk - and they're left to make their own decisions. Most of them choose to explore some of these vices, and almost all of them have the good sense to do so in moderation.

I find it so ironic that Americans raise such a hue and cry over the smallest issues (think of the Simpsons, where Helen Lovejoy shrieks, "won't somebody please think of the CHILDREN!") Everything we do is done to "protect our most precious resource - our children" and yet year after year our children get worse and worse. Much as some of us may hate to admit it, the European approach toward vice (alcohol, tobacco, sex) is simply smarter. Teach moderation, treat teens as the adults they're becoming, and don't demonize everything. Respect and rationality go a long way - but some Americans just cannot seem to get their heads around either concept.


User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4368 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 1266 times:
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FORUM MODERATOR

Quoting "Iowaman":
*16 for drivers license.


Ahh those were the good old days...


Maybe i'm mistakin, but isn't it 16 in most states? It's 16 in Iowa and Illinois.


Quoting "Iowaman":
*18 for contracts


Again, I have to disagree, I think it should be 16 with an attorneys signature preasent as well that says the person signing the contract understands what he/she is signing, or 18 without attorney's signature


In that case one of your parents could sign.



Quoting "United4EverDEN":
That is probably a good thing. You can drink on military bases though. The gambling thing is good, as people at even 18 don't quite have a sense of value for money.


I have a job making $6 an hour, at the local newspaper, and I don't know the value of money? I save most of my money.



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User currently offlineAirsicknessbag From Germany, joined Aug 2000, 4723 posts, RR: 34
Reply 14, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 1239 times:


>>>Well in Germany [...] Drinking age is [...]

There is no drinking age in Germany. If your parents allow you, you can drink whatever you want (or they want) at whatever age.
The age limits you correctly quoted above are for consuming PUBLICLY as well as buying.

>>>You have to be 21 if you want to be elected into an office

No, with very few exceptions, 18 is the limit.

These exceptions at state and federal level are:

Hesse state parliament - 21
Federal President - 40
Judge at the Federal Constituational Court - 40 to 68


(Isn't 21 also the limit for heavy motorbikes?)

Daniel Smile


User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5566 posts, RR: 36
Reply 15, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 1230 times:

What I find most ridiculous, in the most US states you can do about anything with 18 but you are not allowed to drink a normal beer or a glass of wine. BTW smoking is more dangerous than drinking beers and wine. Smoking makes faster addict and causes more dangerous diseases than drinking reasonably.

User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4368 posts, RR: 6
Reply 16, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 1217 times:
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Quoting Airsicknessbag (reply 14):
There is no drinking age in Germany. If your parents allow you, you can drink whatever you want (or they want) at whatever age.
The age limits you correctly quoted above are for consuming PUBLICLY as well as buying.



In the U.S. it doesn't matter if your parents let you or not. It's illegal if your under 21. Period.




Quoting ZRH (reply 15):
What I find most ridiculous, in the most US states you can do about anything with 18 but you are not allowed to drink a normal beer or a glass of wine. BTW smoking is more dangerous than drinking beers and wine.


That is very true, and also what I'm getting at.



Quoting USAFHummer (reply 5):
The lottery age in most states is 18...in fact I don't know of any states offhand that have a lottery whose age is 21...if so, its definitely the minority...


Iowa for buying Powerball tickets, or those pulltab machines is 21. I believe there are a few other states like that, but not many.



Quoting United4EverDEN (reply 1):
So you are saying we should change the laws just so kids won't be breaking them. I will say I am strongly opposed to lowering the ages for drinking/smoking/driving/gambling/etc. UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES.



Not necessarily, I actually think if you could drink at any age, it wouldn't be such a big deal to go out and party and stuff. There also would be less rebellion IMO.



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User currently offlineFlymia From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 7124 posts, RR: 9
Reply 17, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1206 times:

You can lower smoking and Drinking ages. Drinking and smoking would go up so much. Deaths. Imagine how many drunk driving accidents there would be as there is not enough. There is already enough underage drinking and drug us we dont need more.
The lotto is 18 in Florida. Come on people the laws are fine. And dont say well in Europe they dont have problems like the US with kids. Which is true but it is just different cultures.



"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
User currently offlineIowaman From United States of America, joined May 2004, 4368 posts, RR: 6
Reply 18, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1203 times:
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Quoting Flymia (reply 17):
Drinking and smoking would go up so much. Deaths. Imagine how many drunk driving accidents there would be as there is not enough.


True, but you could always raise the age and supposedly deaths would go down and DUI would also.

Quoting N317AS (reply 7):
You can do any thing you want AS LONG AS YOU DON"T GET CAUGHT!!!


Exactly, and most people are leaning towards that.



Next flights: WN DSM-LAS-PHX, US PHX-SJD. Return: US SJD-PHX, WN PHX-MDW-DSM
User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13968 posts, RR: 63
Reply 19, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1200 times:

Daniel,

In Germany you can get a driving licence for cars and smaller motorbikes (up to 34 hp) at the age of 18 and a heavy truck / bus or heavy motorbike licence at 21. There is an additional rule: for heavy motorbikes you´ll have to prove that you´ve got two years experience on smaller ones.
The reason is that before this law many people would get their driving licence on small, cheap bikes owned by the driving schools and then buy themselves a huge, high hp racing bike, which in the end they were not able to control due to lack of experience.

Another thing at 21: A blasting and explosives licence to work independently with explosives
You can be an assistant by the age of 18, but since you´ll need several years proven experience (participation in 50 blasting operations) before you are even permitted to go on the necessary licence courses, it doesn´t matter too much.

Jan


User currently offlineSLC1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1194 times:

You know, the statement "You can do anything you want as long as you don't get caught" isn't really even true anymore, for example where I go to school, they don't give a shit if you're drinking underage or even if you're smoking weed as long as you're not hampering with the building's ventilation system. Now I don't smoke weed, but I've seen UW Police clearly see some guys who were and just walk by, they simply don't care. And what are the penalties if you do get caught? A write-up by your RA, maybe a fine? who the hell cares. So why not just make the legal drinking age 19 like Canada, and actually enforce the rule.

User currently offlineUSAFHummer From United States of America, joined May 2000, 10685 posts, RR: 53
Reply 21, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1191 times:

" And what are the penalties if you do get caught? A write-up by your RA, maybe a fine?"

Not sure what the policy is for weed here at CU, but with alcohol, its a two strikes policy...first time you get caught, you get jacked $100 and ticketed, and I think you need to do community service...second time, they kick you out of school for a year...used to be three strikes, then all the crap hit the fan here alcohol-wise so to speak....

Greg



Chief A.net college football stadium self-pic guru
User currently offlineSLC1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1183 times:

At CU? Really? That seems a bit incongruous from what I've heard about the school, but yeah, I know RAs and even RDs that blatantly ignore drinking in dorm rooms. And every floor has an over-21 person who supplies alcohol to the rest.

User currently offlineUSAFHummer From United States of America, joined May 2000, 10685 posts, RR: 53
Reply 23, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1166 times:

Well...I don't live in the dorms anymore (CU only has enough dorm space for freshmen, so basically they kind of boot you out after freshman year), but when I did, my RA NEVER showed up...my floor was one year-long party basically, and no one I know of got cited...people passed out in hallways and stuff like that was not uncommon at all...now I live off-campus in my own apartment, but the rules still apply, except its the Boulder police (which has a very s***ty relationship with the students) handing out the tickets instead of the CU Police Department...

Greg



Chief A.net college football stadium self-pic guru
User currently offlineAA61Hvy From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 13977 posts, RR: 57
Reply 24, posted (9 years 5 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1165 times:

Here is a disturbing law. I was at a child abuse help center the other day for one of my psych class, doing some observations. The clinic dealt mostly with sexual abuse. In Ohio, a father can masturbate in front of his daughter legally. But because its done in the privacy of their own house its legal. If the daughter has a friend over and the father does that its illegal.

One may think, well thats a weird law. The kicker is, the only ones that like this law-lack of law are the sickos who whack off in front of their daughters. One of the children I saw yesterday fell victim to that. She was called out by her dad to come down stairs, he was jerking off, and he forced her to watch. Which is legal. She is now in a clinic because her father sexually abused her..She is 7 years old. Ohio needs a reality check with that law-or lack of law.



Go big or go home
25 DLKAPA : Actually in speaking with an officer of the law (my high school resource officer), I found that underage drinking is legal at any age just as long as
26 JpetekYXMD80 : * In Iowa, Missouri, South Carolina, and a few other states the legal age of consent is 14 (as long as within 5 years of your partner), but you can't
27 ANCFlyer : DLKAPA: Actually in speaking with an officer of the law (my high school resource officer), I found that underage drinking is legal at any age just as
28 Tbar220 : AA61, Man, that is pretty disturbing. Can you write to your local representative or get some sort of petition going around? It should seem more import
29 DeskPilot : In Australia, it's 18 for drinking, driving, defence force and voting. Can't remember the specifics on the age of consent, but I think they're somethi
30 EA CO AS : *13 for "Mature" rated video games, instead of 17, which is ridiculously high. Agreed. It's this complete fallacy that somehow "dune" caused the Colum
31 Iowaman : [quote=EA CO AS,reply=30]And for what it's worth, I agree. Mature-rated games should be for age 13 and up - it's ridiculous to assert that kids under
32 EZEIZA : In the US i was asked for ID (I was 24 years old at the time) to buy a lighter. That was kind of pathetic. I am not a US citizen so I can't relate to
33 AA61Hvy : Tbar- I am not a resident of Ohio, I just go to school there. The lady from the clinic told me they are trying real hard to fix it, but to no avail.
34 ShyFlyer : The training that goes into getting a person ready for solo flight is many times better than typical driver's ed. Increase the quality of driver's ed
35 FlyMIA : Iowaman: Deaths and DUI would go down if the government raised the age. No doubt about it. 21 year olds have 15-20 year old friends. So they can get
36 September11 : in near future ... magic age: 21 (for everything)
37 KYIPpilot : Actually in speaking with an officer of the law (my high school resource officer), I found that underage drinking is legal at any age just as long as
38 Aa757first : Are you kidding me? So now your life is worth nothing unless you are married with children? AAndrew
39 Post contains images Ushermittwoch : "In Germany you can get a driving licence for cars and smaller motorbikes (up to 34 hp) at the age of 18 and a heavy truck / bus or heavy motorbike li
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